EPTWould this man have been able to share his nut ball opinions openly?
[Old] The massacre in Norway - Page 99
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Keep your off topic discussions out of this thread and show some damn respect! | ||
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DannyJ
United States5110 Posts
Would this man have been able to share his nut ball opinions openly? | ||
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raser
Norway301 Posts
On July 25 2011 05:44 DannyJ wrote: What exactly is the attitude in Norway toward "hate speech." Would this man have been able to share his nut ball opinions openly? yes, its called freedom of speech | ||
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DannyJ
United States5110 Posts
Sadly, many European nations have limitations on how "free" the speech can be. | ||
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TOloseGT
United States1145 Posts
On July 25 2011 05:44 DannyJ wrote: What exactly is the attitude in Norway toward "hate speech." Would this man have been able to share his nut ball opinions openly? It's not much different from any extremist conservative. | ||
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Dystisis
Norway713 Posts
On July 25 2011 05:44 DannyJ wrote: What exactly is the attitude in Norway toward "hate speech." Would this man have been able to share his nut ball opinions openly? Given that his opinions are just a tad more extreme than that of the fairly popular party FRP, yes. There are people with radical opinions on televised discussions, for example. Outright advocacy of racism such as "those people are inferior to us" would not be welcome. But mild forms of nationalism and opposition to immigrants is seen quite often. Which I think is also the case in the US. What is different in Scandinavian countries is that you also see the other end of the spectrum, the communists who advocate that society can function better without a capitalist wage-system, and the social democrats who are in favor of a relatively strong state regulating capitalism. So discussion is a lot more limited in the US than in many European countries. | ||
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Deadlyfish
Denmark1980 Posts
On July 25 2011 05:46 DannyJ wrote: Sadly, many European nations have limitations on how "free" the speech can be. Which countries? | ||
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Drowsy
United States4876 Posts
On July 24 2011 19:18 chocopaw wrote: Thanks. "A Knights Templar does not fear death, he desires it." "... for we will soon dine in the kingdoms of heaven." Sounds familiar. That's an ironic part of this story. He opposes Islam because he believes it (perhaps rightfully, I don't know), as an ideology which cannot coexist with others and will actively perpetrate violence against "infidels" and attempt to convert everyone. Yet the ideology he has crafted is no different right from its inception. His actions make him just like the radical Islamic suicide bombers and terrorists he so vehemently opposes. | ||
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HellRoxYa
Sweden1614 Posts
Ours, for one. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hate_speech#Sweden | ||
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Gnax
Sweden490 Posts
On July 25 2011 05:33 RaiderRob wrote: I almost started reading his manifesto but I realized I would be playing into the killer's hands. It's not about wether his idea's are right or wrong, it's about his methods. He killed 93 people, including shooting children praying for their life at close range as a marketing stunt to get people to read it. I do not want any part of this plan and I don't want other ideologists get the idea that if you want people to read your works killing as many children as possible is a good idea. I read most of it and I wouldn't worry about the document being dangerous for people to read. If anything I think any potential terrorists reading that will put the idea to rest when they realize how much hard work, determination and sacrifice is needed to go through with such an act. I doubt there are any other people out there who has the potential to do what he did. Not only do you need to be a psychopath, but also be intelligent, determined, patient etc. to such extremes that it's just ridiculous. There's not many people in the world who has such a determination to change the world as he has. And none of those are as evil as him. You could make a venn diagram of everything that is required to do this operation and I personally don't think there is anybody in the world other than ABB that falls into that intersection. But you never know. This is just my conclusions after reading his manifesto. | ||
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Brainsurgeon
Sweden359 Posts
"The german tourist Marcel Gleffe was one of the first to throw himself into a boat and went from the camping site out to the island. He saved 30 lives, writes the Guardian. -You're not afraid in a situation like this, you just do what is necessary. I can hear the difference between fireworks and a gun, I knew what was going on, that it was serious, he says to the Guardian." | ||
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Ghad
Norway2551 Posts
On July 25 2011 05:44 DannyJ wrote: What exactly is the attitude in Norway toward "hate speech." Would this man have been able to share his nut ball opinions openly? There are some paragraphs against hate speech, in the law. Mostly free speech of course. But we do not have a main stream channel with a rightist look like Fox News, and it would be pretty difficult for people like this murderer to get his meanings published in main stream media. | ||
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Gnax
Sweden490 Posts
On July 25 2011 05:56 Drowsy wrote: That's an ironic part of this story. He opposes Islam because he believes it (perhaps rightfully, I don't know), as an ideology which cannot coexist with others and will actively perpetrate violence against "infidels" and attempt to convert everyone. Yet the ideology he has crafted is no different right from its inception. His actions make him just like the radical Islamic suicide bombers and terrorists he so vehemently opposes. Actually that is not quite true. He wrote in his manifesto that he has nothing against living together with Jews, Buddhists, Atheists etc. He is only hateful against Islam. Islam wants everyone to turn to their religion. So there's a difference in the ideology. But if we're talking about his actions compared to islamic suicide bombers, then it's the same thing. | ||
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Shikyo
Finland33997 Posts
Meh I've been reading this alot but this seems really crazy. It's as if this man believes that when he explains everything in the court people will just start following his ideals... However, I have a feeling he's going to get a few followers if he can hold the speech well. He also wrote that it'd be an indirect victory if they introduced death penalty just because of him. It's such an inhuman idea to think that all those murdered people were just a marketing stunt for this guy and his ideals... | ||
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Sovern
United States312 Posts
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Undrass
Norway381 Posts
On July 25 2011 06:13 Sovern wrote: I don't understand how people could honestly believe that this guy deserves to live and only get 20+ years in prison. The guy shouldn't even be breathing right now in my opinion. The government needs to show that actions have repercussions and that criminals have something to truly fear when they kill someone versus just getting 20 or so years in prison. you mean that someone mad enough to slaughter children is going to be scared from fear of death? I find that hard to believe. | ||
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Thorakh
Netherlands1788 Posts
On July 25 2011 06:13 Sovern wrote: And that would be letting go all of our values. No person should be treated differently. That's exactly what he wants, changing the system to a more harsh one.I don't understand how people could honestly believe that this guy deserves to live and only get 20+ years in prison. The guy shouldn't even be breathing right now in my opinion. The government needs to show that actions have repercussions and that criminals have something to truly fear when they kill someone versus just getting 20 or so years in prison. I want to see this man be horribly tortured for what he has done, but I don't want it to happen as it's not the right thing to do. Revenge is not justice. An eye for an eye will make the world go blind. | ||
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Sovern
United States312 Posts
What if that was your family that was killed? Do you think that you would be fine with letting the guy sit in a prison for a mere 20 years where he will be fed 3 meals daily and live in decent living conditions? | ||
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DannyJ
United States5110 Posts
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Thorakh
Netherlands1788 Posts
On July 25 2011 06:22 Sovern wrote: He will never be let lose. You're delusional if you think so.I never said that, what it would do is put fear into the minds of future potential criminals. They should torture the guy and embarrass him in my opinion, it would really make people think twice about their actions. Letting people get away with murder is absolutely insane. 20 odd years in a prison where he will be supported and letting him go home free is practically getting away with murder. What if that was your family that was killed? Do you think that you would be fine with letting the guy sit in a prison for a mere 20 years where he will be fed 3 meals daily and live in decent living conditions? | ||
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Sovern
United States312 Posts
On July 25 2011 06:25 Thorakh wrote: He will never be let lose. You're delusional if you think so. ^^You obviously wouldn't know what it feels like but if that was my family the man wouldn't be breathing right now. To think that all of those innocent kids just got their life taken away, the only chance of living they will ever have by some maniac who doesn't regret it is sickening. They're all 6 feet under while this guy is getting fed 3 meals a day and mostly likely only a 20 measly years in prison. This might make other people want to join his cause and join him in his own prison. Crazier things have happened before. He should of been killed right on the spot. I'm not delusional, obviously you don't know much about Norway's laws. 20 something odd years is the max prison sentence. User was temp banned for this post. | ||
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