EPT[wow] Warlords of Draenor - Page 575
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Cyro
United Kingdom20326 Posts
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Drazerk
United Kingdom31255 Posts
On September 02 2015 00:01 Cyro wrote: Hm i heard almost nothing about those Highmaul / HFC have a none instanced zone where you can go kill rare elites for pets / toys etc. Apparently a few new areas in Taanan as well | ||
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FinestHour
United States18466 Posts
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Cyro
United Kingdom20326 Posts
It feels a bit odd getting 15g per quest when i remember ~10g per quest as early as TBC. Back then, 5000g was way harder to earn than 50k now*, so it feels like gold inflated by at least an order of magnitude and quest rewards are pretty much the same *You can easily see this in crafted items by comparing difficulty to craft and going price. Stuff going for 80-100k shortly after 6.2 and ~30k now while a TBC epic was about 1k or so quite deep into the expansion - and not because they were that easy to make or useless, 1k was just a lot of money I just got a 618 epic from quest reward + upgrade, it's my BiS stats. Stat weight calculator says it's worth 210 agility (including the agility on it). My current second tier heroic socketed gloves with bad stats is worth 550 agility, which is ~2.62x more. Just for an example of gear scaling, tier sets and legendary activations aside - raw stats. At this point if they wanted a third tier they'd need an aura debuff reducing things like crit chance since we're at 50% crit ----- The 6 hour maintainence just lasted under 1 hour LOL i was expecting less than 6hr since the US one took ~1 hr, 50 min iirc - but 53 minutes is funny You can't actually fly from shadowmoon to ashran at least from some angles because you'll die to fatigue, you have to fly from shadowmoon to tanaan to ashran in a bit of a triangle which is fairly annoying. It looks like the fatigue zones are fairly lenient on the map but it's not representative at all and you have to hug the tanaan shore to make it go away Also, the challenge mode daily quest was supposed to be reworked about 2.5 months ago to give better gear, 680 i think? That was in the patch notes, but instead they outright removed the quest from the game, it's no longer available alliance side. This is still not fixed and i have not heard any word about it, am i alone here wondering wtf happened? I wanna use it to have some fun and gear alts! :D --------- 5 timewalker badges per boss, 10 from last boss. Mount costs 5000. Funnily enough, i'm actually more motivated to get it because that price is ridiculous (timewalker is available just under a quarter of the time now, so a lot more than before.. have fun waiting 3.5 weeks for it to come back up if you have 4900/5000, though) Yeah, i did 2 random dungeons. Got 70 badges. There's a once-per-timewalker-event quest that gives 500 and the vendors in shattrath/dalaran only spawn during their respective timewalker event, so that means there'll be a window from 4 to almost 5 weeks after 6.2.2 hit to buy the dragonhawk for the first time. You'd get 1000 from doing any timewalkers in that time, so have to farm 4000. So about 10 dungeons per day for 12 days on the specific days that the timewalkers are up for unless you want to wait 3 months for it  I'l probably not do that just because it's dungeons that i've already ran 20+ times each. An achievement giving a cool mount for 100 WOD mythic dungeons would have been cooler | ||
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Noocta
France12578 Posts
Holy shit lol I guess they got a lot of complaints of people wiping for 2h in LFR on that guy | ||
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Cyro
United Kingdom20326 Posts
When that's the design goal of the instance, what choice is there other than to nerf into obscurity and remove any meaningful rewards? LFR could be an easier-than-normal mode, tweaked to remove mechanics and make stuff easier. It could be training wheels for raid content. That's not what it is or what it was designed to be - it's a mode where anyone can do anything and still get all of the boss kills - therefore there is no place for difficulty and wipes. And that warrior - why would he ever get better at anything? Does he even know that he's doing anything wrong? LFR is the hardest content that he does, being a step above the now low-tuned storymode singleplayer questing experience. Why would he improve in 2 weeks, 6 months or 5 years? I just can't imagine staying the player that i was 10 years ago and with the current incentive systems in the game, i would not have been able to have fun improving - so it pains me to see other people in the same situation who maybe would have enjoyed the game more, seen some more longevity and had their perspective and skill changed dramatically over time not being able to get anything remotely similar to that experience any more. I don't agree with that approach to content at all but it doesn't seem like anyone wants a different system, especially @ blizzard. | ||
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Gorsameth
Netherlands22180 Posts
Whether or not you agree with Blizzards approach (and your ofc free to disagree) the design intent is obvious and the nerfs were bound to happen. | ||
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Gorsameth
Netherlands22180 Posts
On September 02 2015 18:43 Cyro wrote: LFR is the mode where anyone, literally anyone can queue. Even that warrior using that intellect/spirit trinket and doing 4-digit DPS in i660 gear - and you can't kick him. Nobody can, because he's been kicked too many times recently so the game won't allow it. When that's the design goal of the instance, what choice is there other than to nerf into obscurity and remove any meaningful rewards? LFR could be an easier-than-normal mode, tweaked to remove mechanics and make stuff easier. It could be training wheels for raid content. That's not what it is or what it was designed to be - it's a mode where anyone can do anything and still get all of the boss kills - therefore there is no place for difficulty and wipes. And that warrior - why would he ever get better at anything? Does he even know that he's doing anything wrong? LFR is the hardest content that he does, being a step above the now low-tuned storymode singleplayer questing experience. Why would he improve in 2 weeks, 6 months or 5 years? I just can't imagine staying the player that i was 10 years ago and with the current incentive systems in the game, i would not have been able to have fun improving - so it pains me to see other people in the same situation who maybe would have enjoyed the game more, seen some more longevity and had their perspective and skill changed dramatically over time not being able to get anything remotely similar to that experience any more. I don't agree with that approach to content at all but it doesn't seem like anyone wants a different system, especially @ blizzard. What system is there tho to help them improve within the game? If LFR was more difficult he would be useless, get kicked and then what? He doesn't know what he did wrong, He cant even see why he was kicked unless he runs a 3e party mod to see the raids dps. He is imo more likely to just stop playing then to go look for ways to improve. A large part of the casual players will never look for guides on the internet or install a whole bunch of addons to help him. Ofc this late in the product cycle it is less of an incentive for Blizzard but from the beginning a proper introduction that explains mechanics to new players is something that WoW has probably sourly missed. Something like a default ingame dps/healing/dmg taken meter that lets someone see "hey I'm always last. I wonder what I am doing wrong" and an ingame link to a simple guide where they can see basic rotations ect. | ||
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Cyro
United Kingdom20326 Posts
What system is there tho to help them improve within the game? If LFR was more difficult he would be useless, get kicked LFR is the mode of progression now. You quest, go LFR, go more LFR and then go more LFR. Questing is way easier than ever before and there's no 5-man involvement of any difficulty on the progression path. It's too much to ask someone to go from the easiest questing that WoW has ever had to a raid of any difficulty level in one step - yet there is no easier group content to teach mechanics and LFR, seeing the hordes of people who don't have the knowledge and practice to do better, is just a mode that removes everything that requires previous knowledge rather than attempting to teach it to them. and an ingame link to a simple guide where they can see basic rotations ect. When i open my spellbook, it tells me to use chimaera shot on cooldown, use kill shot when stuff is at low HP and alternate aimed shot and steady shot otherwise. That's already in the game, it's just not taught very well and it's not neccesary to do any content in the game at the level of difficulty presented by modern questing and LFR, even in a simplistic form. WoW suffers IMO, on top of that, from having steadily increased in difficulty over the last 10 years. I could probably teach my parents to play Vanilla WoW but WOD normal archimonde would be beyond hopeless. There just isn't an effective way for the large % of unskilled players to learn skills while having fun so the solution is to ignore the problem and make everything unfailable for those people, even the ones who want to improve but might not neccesarily know how. Wildstar has taken some shots at teaching mechanics and skills through dungeons (especially 1-2 tutorial style ones), though i didn't try them out myself as they were added quite a while after launch | ||
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Gorsameth
Netherlands22180 Posts
Our MT was arms until Nefarion because "It gave more threat". As the player base has matured the difficulty has creeped up. Leaving new players behind struggling. | ||
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Cyro
United Kingdom20326 Posts
In that way, questing actually went way better for you if you could learn to play your class better or team up - 5-man's did too - by simply reaching level 30-40 you were well on your way to doing raids, and that's not true any more | ||
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deth2munkies
United States4051 Posts
Hell, I was playing Dark Pact without DoT timers and still doing better DPS than all the other Warlocks in my guild (until they eventually completely outgeared me because I could only make 2/3 raid nights a week and was always behind on DKP). | ||
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Acrofales
Spain18248 Posts
On September 02 2015 19:24 Gorsameth wrote: What system is there tho to help them improve within the game? If LFR was more difficult he would be useless, get kicked and then what? He doesn't know what he did wrong, He cant even see why he was kicked unless he runs a 3e party mod to see the raids dps. He is imo more likely to just stop playing then to go look for ways to improve. A large part of the casual players will never look for guides on the internet or install a whole bunch of addons to help him. Ofc this late in the product cycle it is less of an incentive for Blizzard but from the beginning a proper introduction that explains mechanics to new players is something that WoW has probably sourly missed. Something like a default ingame dps/healing/dmg taken meter that lets someone see "hey I'm always last. I wonder what I am doing wrong" and an ingame link to a simple guide where they can see basic rotations ect. And that's why forcing people to be in a guild to run this kind of content was good, despite the fact that a smaller percent of the people will experience all content. If there was any one thing a guild was excellent at, it was improving its members' play. People who didn't perform got benched. Whether that was due to standing in the fire, wearing the wrong gear, having a shitty spec or simply not being good at your rotation. We had some casuals in the guild who were there for the social aspect, but everybody else was dead serious about their chance to raid, and I know full well that when the night's raid formation time came, everybody who wasn't first pick was anxious to see whether someone would be missing and they would be given another chance to prove themselves. At the same time, raid leaders weren't a bunch of ignorant assholes, and if you did something wrong, you were given chances to improve. Our warlock channel was always abuzz with theorycraft discussions about how to eke out an extra 5 dps. The merits of Affliction vs. Destruction vs. Hybrid (I think there were about 10 seconds during Wrath when Demonology was viable too), what stat was best, and how to gem, when it was best to pop trinkets, etc. etc. etc. and that channel was not exclusive to raiders, so all warlocks in the guild could, and did, ask questions on how to play their class. | ||
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Acrofales
Spain18248 Posts
On September 03 2015 00:03 deth2munkies wrote: Warriors were abysmal in Vanilla until you got good gear and started one shotting people. That and they were the only tanks, but tanks sucked at anything that wasn't tanking bosses. Hell, I was playing Dark Pact without DoT timers and still doing better DPS than all the other Warlocks in my guild (until they eventually completely outgeared me because I could only make 2/3 raid nights a week and was always behind on DKP). I think it took me til level 40 or so to realize that if I just used Life Tap and Drain Life while my succubus tanked at max range, I could vendor all food and drink forever. I think my leveling sped up about 10fold at that point. | ||
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Cyro
United Kingdom20326 Posts
2) Show empathy. Chances are the players are engaging because your game is important to them. Their idea or suggestion may be ridiculous. It might ruin the game. That doesn't matter. You still need to put yourself in their shoes and understand *why* they are saying what they are saying. This can be as simple as acknowledging that the player is upset. Being upset is a totally valid way for them to feel! Players are often better at detecting problems than they are at suggesting solutions. Try and understand the problems they are trying to solve. But at the same time, don't dismiss or belittle their suggestions, even if they aren't feasible. Why did everyone hate this guy? | ||
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Gorsameth
Netherlands22180 Posts
To add some context. Its a qoute from Ghostcrawler. People hated him because he was the face of Blizzard. He was responsible for everything bad and nothing good. He ruined their game and destroyed their childhood. And now that he is no longer part of Blizzard people react much more normal to his comments despite him still being (mostly) the same person. | ||
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Cyro
United Kingdom20326 Posts
Players are often better at detecting problems than they are at suggesting solutions Overall it feels like the response to problems in WOD was too little far too late - though i wonder how much of that fault is caused by the fact that they locked in the design for the final content patch in the same month that they released the expansion. That seems to be the scariest thing with 1.5 yearly cycle expansions and working several years ahead of the curve (they've probably already started work on the expansion after legion) - there's an extremely limited feedback period and then it's there for 1.5 years. They have this bigger than ever "we'll design it and hope to god that it works" thing going on - asking what people will want in 2 years rather than in 6 months | ||
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FinestHour
United States18466 Posts
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Alabasern
United States4005 Posts
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Acrofales
Spain18248 Posts
On September 10 2015 09:09 Alabasern wrote: How terrible would it be to complete the entire legendary ring quest only to misclick and choose the wrong reward.... There´s this thing called support tickets. While they rebuke you and tell you you can only do that three times per account (or something), you can have your item restored to you, or an alternative quest item given. | ||
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