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Gorsameth
Netherlands21334 Posts
On November 25 2013 03:43 Loxley wrote: And you were almost right  7 weeks till they went down. One of the hardest encounters. Hard because you needed 8 fully geared tanks. | ||
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farvacola
United States18818 Posts
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Warri
Germany3208 Posts
On November 25 2013 03:45 Gorsameth wrote: Hard because you needed 8 fully geared tanks. Which you "acquired" by fucking over other guilds btw. | ||
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Mondeezy
United States1938 Posts
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TS-Rupbar
Sweden1089 Posts
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farvacola
United States18818 Posts
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Loxley
Netherlands2480 Posts
On November 25 2013 04:54 Mondeezy wrote: Haven't played WoW since early Cata - what have I missed? Should I start re-leveling/gearing for the expansion, or just wait until its out? Well despite people hating on panda's.. Pandaria is a great continent and from a pure gameplay view MoP was one of the best expansions so far. But if you really can't stand the MoP style, then levelling now would be premature.. you could wait until there is a date before levelling. You probably would get WoD ready in a week. Plus you get an instant level 90 come WoD. | ||
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Brett
Australia3820 Posts
I'll spend more time discussing older expansions because those are the parts of the game that most of you are going to be unfamiliar with. Here are my thoughts, take them or leave them! At level 60 for example, C'thun and Gothik were difficult execution encounters when relevant. C'thun in BWL/AQ40 gear was hard because of the DPS requirements; the fight would easily spiral out of control with people dying and claws staying alive too long, eyes not being stunned/interrupted and so forth. Gothik was difficult because there was a very delicate balance of DPS required between the live and dead sides; even after we'd killed Kel'Thuzad and cleared Naxx enough times to one shot every fight there, we'd still wipe to Gothik because of the execution and balance it required. 4H was an organisational nightmare, you'd need multiple tanks, preferably wars with 4pc tier 3 for the taunt bonus (or the fishing rod from ZG), which meant people playing a lot of alts or lots of recruitment for warriors, then the almost spreadsheet worthy group set ups to ensure safe and appropriate rotations. If you didn't raid Naxx at level 60, or until WotLK's garbage version (and lets face it, it was the least played raid in WoW's history which is why they brought it back, and means probably all but one of you never did) then you should probably hold your tongue about how it stacks up to everything since. At level 70 fights like Gruul in leveling/old raid gear were hard from a numbers perspective, the DPS checks were somewhat tight, and you'd be lucky to have the HP to avoid shatter deaths if you got an unlucky bump or had a raid with people who sucked. Kaelthas on the other hand was a brilliant fight for all reasons: tough DPS checks, multiple fight mechanics, the need for situational awareness and so forth. Pre-neutering Muru is widely regarded by long time raiders as one of the hardest bosses Blizzard ever created with tight DPS and healing req's, multiple adds, that fucking pulsing interrupt and the capacity for certain mistakes to be raid wiping. Level 80 had multiple fights in Ulduar, particularly Yogg0, and then LK himself. At 85 you had difficult fights like Rag, and Spine. Around all of these bosses, from level 60 until now, you had raids full of bosses/content cleared by competent guilds in very quick time (time being relevant only to the period at which the content was raided; top guilds these days will raid very long hours to stay competitive in a world of first week kills, whereas back in Vanilla and BC most kills would take a week or more on each encounter because people only played at night and raided 4 or 5 days). For the most part, Blizzard has succeeded in developing only a select few brilliant encounters per tier, with the rest being largely unmemorable. It's rather pointless comparing the difficulty of raiding AQ40 and Naxx at level 60 to Firelands at 85 and Mogu'shan Vaults at 90. Yes Firelands and MSV are generally more complex and difficult, but relatively speaking they are both very easy for the most part, with a few standout encounters. WoD will no doubt produce raids with very similar results. | ||
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Disengaged
United States6994 Posts
On November 25 2013 10:54 Brett wrote: At 90 you had difficult fights like Rag, and Spine. Those were fights during Cata at 85. | ||
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Brett
Australia3820 Posts
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farvacola
United States18818 Posts
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Duka08
3391 Posts
As an aside, one of my absolute greatest regrets is not finding the time or energy to raid 60 Naxx. It came at one of the worst possible times in my personal life and I could only watch in excitement, and remorse... | ||
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Vindicare605
United States16032 Posts
Let me just add something in here. The difficulty of WoW raiding in the past was primarily logistical. Wanted to down Huru'Han? You needed an entire raid of 40 people completely decked out in nature resist gear that you could only acquire from the Green Dragon World bosses or by farming the AH or Muraudon. Wanted to down 4 Horse Men? You couldn't unless you had 8 tanks in Dreadnaught Armor. Wanted to down Ragnaros in Classic? Farm up Fire Resist gear, farm up Fire Protection Potions and make sure all of your melee DPS had a back up set of weapons. These are the kinds of things that existed in Classic and BC (along with Attunements) that kept players from even beginning to seriously attempt boss encounters. Of course bosses were going to be harder to kill when to even challenge them in the first place it required weeks or often months of preparation of a raid group. Now? It's all execution. The amount of difference that gear or group make up makes now compared to the old days is minimal. I've been playing this game for 9 years. I loved raiding in Classic, I still love raiding in MoP. The game hasn't gotten easier, the difficulty has simply changed. Most of the raiders that "Succeded" in the old expansions wouldn't cut it in today's raids and vice versa. That's the reality. | ||
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Water.782
United States6 Posts
What realm we playing on | ||
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Qaatar
1409 Posts
On November 25 2013 14:32 Vindicare605 wrote: I've been playing this game for 9 years. I loved raiding in Classic, I still love raiding in MoP. The game hasn't gotten easier, the difficulty has simply changed. Most of the raiders that "Succeded" in the old expansions wouldn't cut it in today's raids and vice versa. This is the point that I've been trying to hammer across over and over again. Yes, arbitrary gear checks, certain logistical problems, and to a minor extent more advanced mods, easier and faster gearing, and PTR testing (very insignificant, but still saves a few hours for top guilds, as I've posted previously) are all factors as to why raids *seem* easier post-TBC to some people. However, the biggest difference from my observations throughout these years is that the general skill level and comfort that people have with the game have increased significantly. People have just gotten much better at the game overall, and it's as simple as that. In my hardcore days back in TBC (I was in a world top 100 guild during Tier 4 and Tier 5 content, then in a decently well-progressing guild for T6 and Sunwell), I was the best rogue and one of the best tanks in my guilds, and compared to now, where I'm just a casual player who occasionally steps foot in some flex and normal raids, I was terrible. The people I played with also weren't that good, even compared to some randoms in flex that I play with nowadays. At least to me, the difference is so massive that it cannot be overstated. Even just watching some twitch streams and youtube videos, I can also tell the difference. This is even more apparent in PvP, but that's another story. Edit: by "vice-versa", I'm assuming you mean that the top raiders of today (maybe not the 7 year vets, but the rest) probably wouldn't stand for some of the bullshit in the past like the gear checks? | ||
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Vindicare605
United States16032 Posts
On November 25 2013 15:13 Qaatar wrote: Edit: by "vice-versa", I'm assuming you mean that the top raiders of today (maybe not the 7 year vets, but the rest) probably wouldn't stand for some of the bullshit in the past like the gear checks? Correct. | ||
Jibba
United States22883 Posts
On November 25 2013 14:32 Vindicare605 wrote: Most of the raiders that "Succeded" in the old expansions wouldn't cut it in today's raids and vice versa. It's a very different environment, so I wouldn't go that far. Based on the knowledge and experience we had then, we'd be terrible by today's standards. Like very game (including BW), today's average players are significantly better than the best players of the past. But I'm not sure there's any standout talent that WoW requires that couldn't be picked up quickly, with the right information available and right amount of effort. I mean, I've jumped into raiding during every expansion besides WotLK and had no problem rising to the top. I'm sure both groups would adapt easily enough. Today's raids are definitely put together significantly better. The main reason I have fond nostalgia for Naxx40 is that it was the first raid Blizzard really delivered on all the way through. BWL was semi-okay, but AQ40 was a huge pile of untested shit and MC wasn't much better. Today, they seem to be able to do that much more consistently. I still hate the pandas theme though. | ||
Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51449 Posts
Real IDs from TeamLiquid! Play With Us, Just Fill In The Information Example; Pandemona - Panda#2710 - Europe - Horde Europe List + Show Spoiler + Team Liquid Username - BattleTag - Server - Faction Pandemona - Panda#2710 - Europe - Horde - [Twisting Nether] Akatama - Sphinx#2651 - Europe - Horde - [Draenor] FFW_Rude - FFW#2606 - Europe - Alliance - [Rashgaroth[FR]] Siggen - Siggen#2894 - Europe - Horde - [The Maelstrom] Wintex - Wintex#2278 - Europe - Alliance Horde - [Twilight's Hammer / Defias Brotherhood] Baituri - Baituri#2727 - Europe - Horde - [Draenor] North America List + Show Spoiler + Team Liquid Username - BattleTag - Server - Faction farvacola - Tren#1762 - Alliance - NA (Akama) softee - softee#1275 - Alliance - NA [Kil'Jaeden] Stancel - Stancel#6869 Alliance - NA [Caelestrasz] Digmouse - digmouse#1608 Alliance - NA [Aerie Peak] Bluelightz - Matth34#1980 Alliance - NA [Nagrand] psyq - Mitchoi#6843 Horde - NA - (Area 52) nikj -lovemuffinz#1108 Horde - NA (Ner'Zhul) Bashnek - Bash#6746 Horde - NA [Blackrock] Qaatar - Qaatar#1840 Horde - NA [Illidan] | ||
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FFW_Rude
France10201 Posts
On November 24 2013 03:24 TheFish7 wrote: Trying to decide which mmo to play, somehow WoW still winning after so many years even with its horrendous community ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/H7TfiUV.jpg) I'm sorry but what is ESO ? | ||
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51449 Posts
http://elderscrollsonline.com/en-uk/ Elders Scrolls Online  | ||
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