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Pokemon X and Y [3DS] - Page 24

Forum Index > General Games
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Gnaix
Profile Joined February 2009
United States438 Posts
October 03 2013 15:26 GMT
#461
On October 04 2013 00:21 NeoGeoOdin wrote:
so they just fuck up the balance?

Water/Dark x4 to Fire/Psych
Fire/Psych X4 Grass/Fighting
Grass/Fighting x4 Water/Dark

huh... lol


you do realize you can only use moves with one type. That being said, the only starter with x4 weakness to a type is grass/fighting with a x4 weakness to flying.
one thing that sc2 has over bw is the fact that I can actually manage my hotkeys
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
October 03 2013 15:30 GMT
#462
It's still oddly asymmetric because Dark is immune to Psychic while the other 2 are only resistant.

Though I guess they had to use Dark/Psychic/Fighting because every other possible type triangle overlaps Water/Fire/Grass somehow (e.g. you can't use Rock/Flying/Fighting because Grass > Rock and Flying > Grass).
Moderator
Archas
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
United States6531 Posts
October 03 2013 15:41 GMT
#463
On October 03 2013 12:56 Gnaix wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 03 2013 02:30 Archas wrote:
On October 03 2013 02:25 Seiniyta wrote:
On October 03 2013 02:01 Archas wrote:
Mega Charizard X could actually be REALLY scary. Stealth Rock won't hurt it nearly as much; it gets some good resistances with its Dragon-type; its Fire-type STAB moves let it hurt Fairy-types that are immune to its Dragon moves; its ability Tough Claws further boosts physical moves; it gets a fantastic physical movepool with moves like Flare Blitz, Outrage, Earthquake, Crunch, ThunderPunch, and whatever it gets in X and Y; it has plenty of powerful boosting moves like Dragon Dance and Swords Dance; and if it manages to pull off a Belly Drum, you are almost certainly totally fucked. The only things that could hold it back could be a middling Speed stat and the one-turn setup for Mega evolution.

Based off my own knowledge of Pokemon, I see Mega Charizard X (ChariXard?) as potentially one of the most fearsome physical threats in the new metagame. Like Charizard in previous generations, it will require a lot of support, but if that support is used well, I see very few things that can stop it once it gets rolling. Strong priority users and Choice Scarfers could revenge kill, but I think ChariXard will be more than capable of smashing through at least one Pokemon during its rampage. Maybe something like Jellicent could wall it for some time, with Cursed Body to disable one of its moves, but ThunderPunch or even Shadow Claw will still do a number on it thanks to 2x effectiveness and boosted damage from Tough Claws. Not only that, but Jellicent's Scald will only be of neutral effectiveness, and will no longer burn ChariXard, due to Fire-types being immune to burns in X and Y. Maybe a Fairy type with Flash Fire would be the best choice for taking it on, but ChariXard's coverage moves can still do plenty of damage, and we don't know if there will be something like that in X and Y.

Oh, and God help you if you have to take a boosted Flare Blitz from this thing in the sun.

Actually, regarding Mega evolutions, I don't actually know if they persist upon switching out, or if you have to reactivate the evolution every time you send that Pokemon in. If it's the latter, then ChariXard might not be incredibly viable due to the sheer amount of switching involved in mispredictions. However, even if that's the case, something like a Life Orb ChariXard could still wreak havoc by simply coming in and spamming Flare Blitz until it dies, taking a big chunk of health out of the opponent if not killing something outright. That would still be a lot of setup, though; you'd have to ensure Stealth Rock is off the field, switch in Charizard on something that's afraid of it, Mega evolve, use a boosting move, and THEN start attacking. That's a large window of vulnerability, even if you decide to forgo the boosting move and just go all-out attacking mode.

I predict that ChariXard will possess quite a few exploitable weaknesses and require lots of support and prediction, just like normal Charizard. If it sets up, though, you WILL be punished for it.

I've edited this post like 14 times. I should be working, but Pokemon is too exciting~ :3

MegaEvolutions don't have a setup time. You can mega-evolve Charizard and attack in the same turn.

That's good to know. If the persist-upon-switching thing is true, then Stealth Rock will only be a major issue the first time you switch Charizard in to evolve. I don't really expect ChariXard to live all that long due to potential Outrage-locks, Flare Blitz and Life Orb recoil, and stuff like sandstorm and Spikes, but at least Stealth Rock won't totally neuter it after the first time it comes in. Hell, maybe you could even do a bulky boosting set with Roost, Dragon Dance, Outrage/Dragon Claw, and Flare Blitz to ensure ChariXard can stay in long enough to take a few hits and boost several times. Wish support will also be fantastic. Unfortunately, even though ChariXard has less of a weakness to Stealth Rock, Rapid Spin support might be even more important now that it's affected by (Toxic) Spikes. A little irony there.


You're overlooking a very important fact, which is that charizard won't be having an item. Sure it's attack will probably be raised both by the mega-evolution as well as it's ability, but even then, it'll likely be outsped by most choice-scarfers or out damaged by most choice-banders. Notice that normal-charizard base attack stat is only 84, and I highly doubt its x mega will raise it above 100. Notice you're also only allowed 1 mega-pokemon per team, where currently there many more pokemon that look much more viable including the obvious mewtwo, garchomp, blaziken, lucario, but perhaps even less popular but imo equally devasting mawile (intimidate then huge-power is no joke, considering that even if it's attack remains the same, with the huge power boost it has higher than that of deoxys-a fully invested).

Rofl, turns out I don't understand much about Mega evolutions then! :D Yeah, not having an item will be a huge problem for ChariXard, but I think Dragon Dance can get around that to a certain extent by raising its Speed and Attack, both of which are rather unimpressive on normal Charizard. Depending on how much of a boost Tough Claws gives physical contact moves, it's possible that ChariXard's inability to hold a Choice item or Life Orb can be somewhat mitigated as well. Also, I disagree with your sentiment that ChariXard's base Attack won't be higher than 100; if Charizard gets two Mega evolutions that specialize in hitting hard on the physical and special spectra, it doesn't seem too unlikely for each to have a pretty high attacking stat.

Other Mega evolutions will undoubtedly be scary and can certainly merit a teamslot over ChariXard in many cases, but I think ChariXard has a potentially unique niche in its STAB attacks providing almost perfect neutral coverage (Heatran being the only Pokemon we know of who resists both) and innate physical-attacking prowess. A single Dragon Dance could be all it needs to hit extremely hard and shore up its middling Speed. Not that boosting moves are easy to pull off, but ChariXard's typing definitely makes it easier to do than with its Fire/Flying cousin. Like I said before, I predict ChariXard will require some pretty substantial support to work (just like normal Charizard), but the payoffs will be enormous.

This is all speculation, of course; without knowing the BST for the Mega evolutions, or the new moves in X and Y (especially any new priority moves), it's hard to present a definitive case for any of the Mega evolutions. This is just based off of my (admittedly lacking, as you've seen ) experience and knowledge.

On October 04 2013 00:21 NeoGeoOdin wrote:
so they just fuck up the balance?

Water/Dark x4 to Fire/Psych
Fire/Psych X4 Grass/Fighting
Grass/Fighting x4 Water/Dark

huh... lol

I don't think it's all that silly, since many people have noted in the past that just as Fire beats Grass beats Water, you can also do Psychic>Fighting>Dark.

Rival battles could be a little scary though, especially in Nuzlocke runs.
The room is ripe with the stench of bitches!
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
October 03 2013 15:52 GMT
#464
I don't think Mega Charizard X's base Attack stat will be that high. It wouldn't surprise me if most of the boost is expected to come off it's ability, seeing as it's one no other Pokemon has yet.

If this is the case, NOT getting Tough Claws on non-contact physical moves (Earthquake obviously being the most notable one) could be a big hit to what he can do with his coverage moves.
Moderator
MoonBear
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Straight outta Johto18973 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-10-03 23:41:49
October 03 2013 23:41 GMT
#465
So Mega Gengar, Aerodactyl, Abomasnow all confirmed.

And the cutest Dragon you've ever known.
ModeratorA dream. Do you have one that has cursed you like that? Or maybe... a wish?
Dismay
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States1180 Posts
October 03 2013 23:47 GMT
#466
On October 04 2013 08:41 MoonBear wrote:
So Mega Gengar, Aerodactyl, Abomasnow all confirmed.

And the cutest Dragon you've ever known.


Mega Gengar will be my best bro.
In every age, in every place, the deeds of men remain the same.
MooMooMugi
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States10531 Posts
October 04 2013 00:49 GMT
#467
Loving the concept of mega evolutions, makes the original pokemon truly look badass
|LoL & SC2 IGN both my username| Just livin' the baylife| Hearthstone ID: MooMooMugi#1544| Dank Memer since 2011
GTR
Profile Blog Joined September 2004
51451 Posts
October 04 2013 00:52 GMT
#468
I'll be trying out X & Y tomorrow at the EB Expo. I'll give a brief report of the game once I get everything written up.
Commentator
Purind
Profile Blog Joined April 2004
Canada3562 Posts
October 04 2013 01:58 GMT
#469
On October 04 2013 00:21 NeoGeoOdin wrote:
so they just fuck up the balance?

Water/Dark x4 to Fire/Psych
Fire/Psych X4 Grass/Fighting
Grass/Fighting x4 Water/Dark

huh... lol


Would you rather have the Gen 4 balance? Infernape, Fire+Fighting. Fire > Grass, Fighting > Steel

The double weakness is a total non-issue. Water does x2 to Fire/Psychic. Dark does x2 to Fire/Psychic. There's no x4. Same with the other attacks. It's only 2x super effective

And watch, they're gonna give the Fire type Thunderbolt to deal with water types. It just looks like something that would carry Thunderbolt as a coverage move
Trucy Wright is hot
Arceus
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
Vietnam8333 Posts
October 04 2013 02:06 GMT
#470
looool dat key pokemon http://instagram.com/p/fBoYkIqYVX/
imagine it evolves to something like this
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]
julianto
Profile Joined December 2010
2292 Posts
October 04 2013 04:50 GMT
#471
I've always wanted pokemon to introduce dual-type moves. Right now you use one move, say fire. It does 2x to grass and 4x to grass/ice.

I've wanted Fire Punch to be fire/fighting type. It would do 8x to grass/ice types. This would also allow fighting pokemon with elemental punches to have a 1.5x STAB bonus for their fire/ice/thunder punches. This would also allow fire/fighting pokemon to have a 2.25x STAB for fire punch.

Since it's weird that fire/fighting would be uneffective against ghost types, perhaps instead dual types moves can be divided into two separated attacks (like double-kick). First, the fighting-type physical attack. Second, the fire-type special attack. 40 damage each (maybe 50 since physical/special separation nerfs the attack).

I just think dual type moves would refresh the series and the gameplay.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Sitinte
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States499 Posts
October 04 2013 06:44 GMT
#472
^There are dual type moves. There was a leaked picture of Hawlucha with a Fighting/Flying move either yesterday or the day before.

Or at the very least, there are moves that reverse the current mechanics of the type-effectiveness system. Amaura's Ice type move being super effective on Water types is the main example.
Pandemona *
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
Charlie Sheens House51485 Posts
October 04 2013 07:54 GMT
#473
Mega Gengar ? :O GG thats my 6th pokemon for my group
ModeratorTeam Liquid Football Thread Guru! - Chelsea FC ♥
SheaR619
Profile Joined October 2010
United States2399 Posts
October 05 2013 23:26 GMT
#474
For people who is buying the new Pokemon game, be prepare to know that you can NOT transfer until December 27 and that is when the Pokemon Bank will open. You are also given only 1 MONTH free trial to do the transfer before you are unable to do so without paying a yearly fee if you want to keep using Pokemon Bank. If you are like me who want to transfer over ASAP, you are probably going to be rather bummed. So you better accomplish what you want to during that first month

http://www.pokemonxy.com/en-us/strategy/pokemon_bank_faq/
I may not be the best, but i will be some day...
VayneAuthority
Profile Joined October 2012
United States8983 Posts
October 05 2013 23:30 GMT
#475
I haven't paid for a pokemon game since like sapphire/ruby. I just keep selling the old ones to buy the new ones since their resale value is so high due to nobody trading them in. So unfortunately I have nothing to bank but it's worth it I guess
I come in for the scraps
Requizen
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States33802 Posts
October 05 2013 23:39 GMT
#476
You just sell your faithful companions and friends? You monster...
It's your boy Guzma!
ZenithM
Profile Joined February 2011
France15952 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-10-06 00:16:30
October 05 2013 23:49 GMT
#477
Shit, I'm tempted to just buy a 3DS just to play this game. Is the game good?
Edit: don't answer if you only mean to make fun of me ;D, I already apologized 2 messages below.
Requizen
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States33802 Posts
October 05 2013 23:52 GMT
#478
You mean the game that comes out in a week aside from leaked copies?

Yeah I've been having a lot of fun playing it.
It's your boy Guzma!
ZenithM
Profile Joined February 2011
France15952 Posts
October 05 2013 23:55 GMT
#479
Haha sorry that was silly.
julianto
Profile Joined December 2010
2292 Posts
October 05 2013 23:56 GMT
#480
On October 06 2013 08:49 ZenithM wrote:
Shit, I'm tempted to just buy a 3DS just to play this game. Is the game good?

Yes I have not played it and I can confirmed that it is good.

I trust online reviews.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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