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On January 19 2017 13:10 Sn0_Man wrote:Chris released a development manifesto in response to the complaints https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1821427tl;dr: "We knew everybody would complain about these exact things. We will be different. Because i say so." not really very reassuring imo
More than that, he suggests that they just wouldn't have bothered with doing performance improvements if it wasn't for the xbox 1 version...then again we are talking about a company that left desync in for years, so I guess that could actually be true.
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That might genuinely be the time to quit PoE, feels good having spent money for that.
We had a fun run my friends.
The manifest is telling us we should be thankful for the console plans because otherwise we wouldn't have gotten the improvements we got. Also note how 2015 was the year at which end Ascendancy was released - for me personally the point at which balance went completely out the window.
We haven't modified the game content on the PC version due to any console decisions.
Sure. Man, this feels bad.
=(
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Yeah, Ascendancy gave us massive power creep and even more massive balance problems. *cough* Scion *cough*
I've been playing since early 2013 and personally liked most of the changes to the game, like how most T1 uniques became more affordable over time. I just wish there will be a massive passive tree update or something similar, it's been quite a while since that happened. Also GGG not nerfing poison/ignite/bleed double dipping for a whole year or so remains a mystery to me.
I for now trust Chris (interview here) if he says PC patches and updates won't be delayed because of the Xbox version. I hope the Xbox version will be different enough, so that they don't need to add all new skills on it as well. Else there are going to be some limitations by default...
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On January 20 2017 00:02 HolydaKing wrote:Yeah, Ascendancy gave us massive power creep and even more massive balance problems. *cough* Scion *cough* I've been playing since early 2013 and personally liked most of the changes to the game, like how most T1 uniques became more affordable over time. I just wish there will be a massive passive tree update or something similar, it's been quite a while since that happened. Also GGG not nerfing poison/ignite/bleed double dipping for a whole year or so remains a mystery to me. I for now trust Chris ( interview here) if he says PC patches and updates won't be delayed because of the Xbox version. I hope the Xbox version will be different enough, so that they don't need to add all new skills on it as well. Else there are going to be some limitations by default...
Since there is no chance for Xbone version to have access to trading PC version has, they will need to adjust drop rates accordingly. Maybe people that enjoy SSF and don't want to spend 2000h farming stuff to get rare uniques will need to get that version of the game to have fun.
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On January 20 2017 00:07 -Archangel- wrote:Show nested quote +On January 20 2017 00:02 HolydaKing wrote:Yeah, Ascendancy gave us massive power creep and even more massive balance problems. *cough* Scion *cough* I've been playing since early 2013 and personally liked most of the changes to the game, like how most T1 uniques became more affordable over time. I just wish there will be a massive passive tree update or something similar, it's been quite a while since that happened. Also GGG not nerfing poison/ignite/bleed double dipping for a whole year or so remains a mystery to me. I for now trust Chris ( interview here) if he says PC patches and updates won't be delayed because of the Xbox version. I hope the Xbox version will be different enough, so that they don't need to add all new skills on it as well. Else there are going to be some limitations by default... Since there is no chance for Xbone version to have access to trading PC version has, they will need to adjust drop rates accordingly. Maybe people that enjoy SSF and don't want to spend 2000h farming stuff to get rare uniques will need to get that version of the game to have fun.
They could add an AH for it too, couldn't they?
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I think people are too vitriolic and jumping to way too many conclusions
to be clear i hate the announcement and am not optimistic about it at all, but i think it's safe to say most of us don't have a very good idea of a lot of specifics that people are jumping to conclusions on (such as trading).
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yeah, i'd withhold judgement for now at least... GGG has made a damn good game and has a very good track record so far... no need to start saying that this is waterloo quite yet at any rate.
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On January 20 2017 00:08 HolydaKing wrote:Show nested quote +On January 20 2017 00:07 -Archangel- wrote:On January 20 2017 00:02 HolydaKing wrote:Yeah, Ascendancy gave us massive power creep and even more massive balance problems. *cough* Scion *cough* I've been playing since early 2013 and personally liked most of the changes to the game, like how most T1 uniques became more affordable over time. I just wish there will be a massive passive tree update or something similar, it's been quite a while since that happened. Also GGG not nerfing poison/ignite/bleed double dipping for a whole year or so remains a mystery to me. I for now trust Chris ( interview here) if he says PC patches and updates won't be delayed because of the Xbox version. I hope the Xbox version will be different enough, so that they don't need to add all new skills on it as well. Else there are going to be some limitations by default... Since there is no chance for Xbone version to have access to trading PC version has, they will need to adjust drop rates accordingly. Maybe people that enjoy SSF and don't want to spend 2000h farming stuff to get rare uniques will need to get that version of the game to have fun. They could add an AH for it too, couldn't they?
Are they adding AH? Even if they do for 3.0 (which I don't believe they will) it will still be a lite version as they have always been against a full AH. So PoE trading a bit improved but only with controllers?! Xbone players would go berserk even more than we do.
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On January 20 2017 00:02 HolydaKing wrote:Yeah, Ascendancy gave us massive power creep and even more massive balance problems. *cough* Scion *cough* I've been playing since early 2013 and personally liked most of the changes to the game, like how most T1 uniques became more affordable over time. I just wish there will be a massive passive tree update or something similar, it's been quite a while since that happened. Also GGG not nerfing poison/ignite/bleed double dipping for a whole year or so remains a mystery to me. I for now trust Chris ( interview here) if he says PC patches and updates won't be delayed because of the Xbox version. I hope the Xbox version will be different enough, so that they don't need to add all new skills on it as well. Else there are going to be some limitations by default...
Your design decisions are going to be influenced when you're developing for different platforms regardless of your good intentions. Even if they're on different build cycles they'll still be limited unless GGG decides to develop two completely different branches of the game where one is PC and one is console. I'd suspect that would kill their market in one of the platforms as one branch will be deemed superior and the other will suffer because of it. If both are on the same branch then you're inevitably limited by hardware.
On January 20 2017 00:35 -Archangel- wrote:Show nested quote +On January 20 2017 00:08 HolydaKing wrote:On January 20 2017 00:07 -Archangel- wrote:On January 20 2017 00:02 HolydaKing wrote:Yeah, Ascendancy gave us massive power creep and even more massive balance problems. *cough* Scion *cough* I've been playing since early 2013 and personally liked most of the changes to the game, like how most T1 uniques became more affordable over time. I just wish there will be a massive passive tree update or something similar, it's been quite a while since that happened. Also GGG not nerfing poison/ignite/bleed double dipping for a whole year or so remains a mystery to me. I for now trust Chris ( interview here) if he says PC patches and updates won't be delayed because of the Xbox version. I hope the Xbox version will be different enough, so that they don't need to add all new skills on it as well. Else there are going to be some limitations by default... Since there is no chance for Xbone version to have access to trading PC version has, they will need to adjust drop rates accordingly. Maybe people that enjoy SSF and don't want to spend 2000h farming stuff to get rare uniques will need to get that version of the game to have fun. They could add an AH for it too, couldn't they? Are they adding AH? Even if they do for 3.0 (which I don't believe they will) it will still be a lite version as they have always been against a full AH. So PoE trading a bit improved but only with controllers?! Xbone players would go berserk even more than we do.
They don't even need an auction house. Automated trading would do a lot for the in game market and assist with some of the price fixing bullshit that goes on currently. GGG already has a lot of the systems in place to support such a thing.
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I mean, we wont even see 3.0 until June ?? cause there's a league between Breach and 3.0. So gotta live with quack game balance for quite awhile before we'll see what they're gonna do with the game.
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This also explains the really strange changes to BV and trigger spells. BV, for example, was probably never right at 50 stacks but the change to it's current iteration is a bit strange. Hitting 20x per second isn't a big issue when you can't abuse that for infinite flask charges and the current version feels very clunky at low stacks (run by barrels, they dont explode... wtf???). CoC every 500ms? etc...
But i guess consoles can't handle that at all
My current character crashes instances if I want it to so i'm certain that it will bring xb1 to it's knees with trivial ease but it's probably not meta enough for ggg to care.
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With animate weapon it's also trivial to crash instances in Breach. At 120ish weapons there already is a slight risk, but at around 150 weapons it almost always happens for me.
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I think it's safe to say that we'll never see another breach league 
actually i hate breach as a mechanic it's awful but the fact that the design space will be taken away still makes me sad
wonder if the funny 1week flashback events will keep showing up on PC when they probably couldn't run them on xb1
also wonder if flasks are going to be even more op because they will end up even slightly balanced with 4 in mind instead of 5 (this might have something to do with how flasks are currently balanced tbh)
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On January 20 2017 02:09 Sn0_Man wrote:
This also explains the really strange changes to BV and trigger spells. BV, for example, was probably never right at 50 stacks but the change to it's current iteration is a bit strange. Hitting 20x per second isn't a big issue when you can't abuse that for infinite flask charges and the current version feels very clunky at low stacks (run by barrels, they dont explode... wtf???). CoC every 500ms? etc...
But i guess consoles can't handle that at all
My current character crashes instances if I want it to so i'm certain that it will bring xb1 to it's knees with trivial ease but it's probably not meta enough for ggg to care.
Agreed, this puts a shitload of decisions in 2016 in a completely different perspective.
I'd love to not be pessimistic but what Blitz said above pretty much sums it up. This can't not make the game in general more tailored to console gamers, it's literally impossible.
Most likely it already went in that direction without it being blatantly obvious.
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People complain way too much about GGG. Like you're all personally betrayed every time they turn out to be a business and not your best friend where everything they do with their unlimited power and resources is to make your life better.
You literally set your standards for what is acceptable as better than what you see and then act like spoiled children because those standards aren't reached. They fixed desync by rewriting a huge portion of the netcode, something they can't even really advertise? Oh, well that just proves it was possible for desync to be fixed so actually it makes GGG worse for not doing it for so long!
Performance improvements? Oh, well Breaches are in the game so the performance is garbage! Yeah, because everyone runs around saying how fucking cool Normal Twilight Strand pack density is? Universally people who can run Breaches even moderately okay love Breaches. Even streamers that complain about performance non-stop. Normal zone? Stony-faced silence. Some crazy Beyond Breach that they chug a little on? As long as the performance is okay it's a highlight.
Your current character crashes instances and yet the CoC/etc changes can only be about Xbox client performance, right? It couldn't be that these things that strain server performance to the point of breaking are being toned down so that they don't strain server performance to the point of breaking. Yeah, I'm sure it's lost on nobody at GGG that it will also help low powered client and party performance, but that's not the primary goal. Yeah, I wish there was a solution that allowed CoC to be like the good ol' days, but what is it? Spend more money on more servers?
Fix desync. Fix trading. Fix guilds. More content. Better performance. Do everything. More. More. More. Do it with your magical unlimited supply and scale of production. Oh, but if you do we will forget we ever asked for it and got it or act like getting it was the bare minimum and we should've had earlier and better and more.
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Yeah the way they implement solution to stuff like CoC nerf, SRS rework, BV rework feels kinda weird but with this announcement feels obvious in perspective. I would have not mind at all if they made the CoC gem does 50% less damage, and heavily nerf its interaction with Surgeon flask & pathfinder instead of killing its proc rate, but since XB1 was a hardware made 8 years ago that would just not fly.
Edit: ^I played the game since 2.0 so there was a lot of good development (e.g. desync fixed) along with bad development along the way(trade system ??, balancing ??). Now they have another ambitious business side project that will eat up a ton of resource so excuse us to be pessimistic and expect the main game development to be affected negatively ??
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On January 20 2017 02:45 Lachrymose wrote:
Fix desync. Fix trading. Fix guilds. More content. Better performance. Do everything. More. More. More. Do it with your magical unlimited supply and scale of production. Oh, but if you do we will forget we ever asked for it and got it or act like getting it was the bare minimum and we should've had earlier and better and more.
no we want less less less (xbox)
but seriously I don't think it's unreasonable to share our desires, how else would ggg know what the community prioritizes? We want better trade. Stash tab trade is already a huge upgrade, and i'm thankful, but I still want better trade. Guilds are a great feature, but still really underexplored IMO. I think they could use some love. I want GGG to know that. It's not ungrateful or bitchy to comment on the state of guilds occasionally.
Everybody wants things better. If we don't share with GGG what we want better, then ggg are going to implement xb1 or some shit instead of something useful.
Sure the reddit circlejerk may have gone too far but it's still valid to have doubts and complaints.
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They don't get credit for fixing desync because desync should never have existed in the first place, fixing it was the bare minimum, they can't advertise it because it's saying "hey, after 3 years of taking your money we are now as good as literally every other game in existance".
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On January 20 2017 02:28 Sn0_Man wrote:I think it's safe to say that we'll never see another breach league actually i hate breach as a mechanic it's awful but the fact that the design space will be taken away still makes me sad wonder if the funny 1week flashback events will keep showing up on PC when they probably couldn't run them on xb1 also wonder if flasks are going to be even more op because they will end up even slightly balanced with 4 in mind instead of 5 (this might have something to do with how flasks are currently balanced tbh)
I think Breach was overkill anyway, but it was fun. Given it's a completely different server with probably other drop rates, it's completely possible that there will be another similar league. It's not like they can't make it spawn less monsters on the Xbox One server.
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EPT
