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2011-2012 football (soccer) thread - Page 53

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TranceStorm
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
1616 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-29 02:40:05
August 29 2011 02:38 GMT
#1041
On August 29 2011 11:00 Sgany wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 29 2011 10:55 alkow wrote:
On August 29 2011 10:53 Sgany wrote:
On August 29 2011 10:50 alkow wrote:
On August 29 2011 10:39 Sgany wrote:
On August 29 2011 10:27 alkow wrote:
On August 29 2011 10:18 Sgany wrote:
And people call La Liga a two horse race our top 4 teams do not decimate each other......


news flash, arsenal and tottenham won't be in the top four this season. at least the difference between second and third will be less than 20 points.


The only reason there is a 20 point gap between the first 2 in La Liga and the rest is because La Liga currently has the best team in history in the form of Barcelona and the 3rd best Madrid squad ever....English teams are just bad..


really? so how do you explain england's better league coefficient? if the other teams are that good, shouldn't they do well in europe as well?

the reason barca and madrid are leaps and bound better than the rest of their league is largely due to individual television rights.


England do terrible in europe outside Manchester United of lately, Spain is constantly winning UCL, and Europa League and always finishing high.


england do terrible in europe besides united? now i know you're full of shit.


Compare in the last ten years Spanish UCL performance to English.... In the last 5years Barcelona have had more UCL wins than the entire PremierLeague have had in 12 years.

Sure, Barcelona have had more UCL wins, but that doesn't mean that england do terrible in Europe. They usually get all four of their qualified teams into the knockout stages and usually get a majority of them into the Ro8 or above. Remember that Real Madrid couldn't get beyond the Ro16 for almost an entire decade before last year.

A brief look at England's performance in the UCL in the past few years:
2011: United (Finals), Chelsea (Quarters), Tottenham (Quarters), Arsenal (Ro16).
2010: United (Quarters), Arsenal (Quarters), Chelsea (Ro16), Liverpool (Group Stages).
2009: United (Finals), Arsenal (Semis), Chelsea (Semis), Liverpool (Quarters).
2008: United (Champions), Chelsea (Finals), Liverpool (Semis), Arsenal (Quarters).

Granted, English teams had a 'bad' year in 2010, but to say that English teams are just bad is not fair at all. Madrid and Barcelona may have stronger teams than the top teams in the Premier League, but I would say that the Premier League teams are right behind them in terms of strength this season.
RaQIl
Profile Joined August 2011
Macedonia25 Posts
August 29 2011 02:47 GMT
#1042
Even Manchester United would finish 3rd in La Liga and that is the reality right now.

Last year United played 0-1 and 1-1 with Valencia CF. In the final lost to Barcelona convincingly.

I'd say that EPL 1-6 and LFP 3-8 are quite equal in skill.

alkow
Profile Joined December 2010
United States192 Posts
August 29 2011 03:30 GMT
#1043
On August 29 2011 11:47 RaQIl wrote:
Even Manchester United would finish 3rd in La Liga and that is the reality right now.

Last year United played 0-1 and 1-1 with Valencia CF. In the final lost to Barcelona convincingly.

I'd say that EPL 1-6 and LFP 3-8 are quite equal in skill.



Yeah, remember that the 1-1 with Valencia was the last group stage game when they already were qualified for the knockout round and a draw would secure first place in the group.

Also remember that in the ro16 Schalke beat Valencia 4-2 on aggregate and United beat Schalke 6-1 on aggregate. See, I call pull out results too!

The top English teams would finish 3-8 in La Liga.
Rebs
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
Pakistan10726 Posts
August 29 2011 05:00 GMT
#1044
On August 29 2011 11:47 RaQIl wrote:
Even Manchester United would finish 3rd in La Liga and that is the reality right now.

Last year United played 0-1 and 1-1 with Valencia CF. In the final lost to Barcelona convincingly.

I'd say that EPL 1-6 and LFP 3-8 are quite equal in skill.




umm no I prefer the spanish league aswell but there is probably a significant gulf between the british 1-6 and 3-8 maybe theres an overlap somewhere but the bilbao's and Sevilla's are significantly lower than maybe a Man City, Liverpool (the way they both look at the moment especially) ..
UdderChaos
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
United Kingdom707 Posts
August 29 2011 10:51 GMT
#1045
On August 29 2011 11:47 RaQIl wrote:
Even Manchester United would finish 3rd in La Liga and that is the reality right now.

Last year United played 0-1 and 1-1 with Valencia CF. In the final lost to Barcelona convincingly.

I'd say that EPL 1-6 and LFP 3-8 are quite equal in skill.


Don't use silly logic like that. It's like saying arsenal beat barca and manu u just beat arsenal 8-2, therefore man u are better than barca.
Nunquam iens addo vos sursum
Mandalor
Profile Blog Joined February 2003
Germany2362 Posts
August 29 2011 11:30 GMT
#1046
It's pretty obvious that La Liga is a 2 team league. Teams like Valencia and Sevilla aren't necessarily bad, but saying they're better than the top teams in England is just plain stupid.
Anyone not biased can see this.
Stimp
Profile Joined November 2010
South Africa780 Posts
August 29 2011 12:06 GMT
#1047
we should take the top teams from each league and make them play each other in a sort of knockout competition. The best teams in this competition (we will limit it to european leagues to keep the numbers down) will rise to the top. We can then compare how each leagues teams do in this competition.

O wait.

On a side note. Eufa rank EPL number 1 and La Liga 2. TAKE THAT. Our mid table teams who will probably never play your mid table teams are better.
Don't count your apples before they've... grown
Sgany
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
United Kingdom790 Posts
August 29 2011 12:33 GMT
#1048
On August 29 2011 21:06 Stimp wrote:
we should take the top teams from each league and make them play each other in a sort of knockout competition. The best teams in this competition (we will limit it to european leagues to keep the numbers down) will rise to the top. We can then compare how each leagues teams do in this competition.

O wait.

On a side note. Eufa rank EPL number 1 and La Liga 2. TAKE THAT. Our mid table teams who will probably never play your mid table teams are better.


Our mid table teams win Europa League.......
NaDa <3, MMA <3, Bisu <3,
Stimp
Profile Joined November 2010
South Africa780 Posts
August 29 2011 13:01 GMT
#1049
tbf england teams never really try...
Don't count your apples before they've... grown
Signet
Profile Joined March 2007
United States1718 Posts
August 29 2011 15:40 GMT
#1050
Whether La Liga or Premier League is better is also getting a bit off topic in discussing whether or not the "English teams are just bad", unless La Liga represents the bare minimum cutoff for what a decent league looks like. Is anyone going to seriously argue that EPL this year, or over the last 5 years, has been worse than 3 or 4 other domestic leagues?
kazansky
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Germany931 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-29 15:54:14
August 29 2011 15:47 GMT
#1051
http://www.zonalmarking.net/2010/05/17/league-comparison-by-points/

Interesting short article a while ago on average points in the three big euro leagues back then, look at the gap.
I support the thesis of a 2 team league in spain, look at how Sevilla played against Hannover, an at best mid tier german team. I mean played, not only scored. Any other team than the top two in Spain are not per se scary.
"Mathematicians don't understand mathematics, they get used to it." - Prof. Kredler || "That was more one-sided that a mobius strip." - Tasteless
RvB
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
Netherlands6324 Posts
August 29 2011 16:03 GMT
#1052
Spain is most definetly a good league with 2 amazing teams being way ahead of the competition but honestly it's unfair to compare it with the Premier League.
In the Premier league all turnovers together are as big as 2.5 billion euro!
With the German league and the Spanish league both ending at around 1.66 billion as 2nd.

Look at the difference and honestly the premier league is way overblown with Chelsea and Manchester City. Chelsea already received 800 million from their owner and City is already at 600 million it's ridiculous to be honest...
Holgerius
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Sweden16951 Posts
August 29 2011 16:09 GMT
#1053
I find it sad how Serie A isn't even involved in such discussions anymore.
I believe in the almighty Grötslev! -- I am never serious and you should never believe a thing I say. Including the previous sentence.
Stimp
Profile Joined November 2010
South Africa780 Posts
August 29 2011 16:17 GMT
#1054
On August 30 2011 01:03 RvB wrote:
Spain is most definetly a good league with 2 amazing teams being way ahead of the competition but honestly it's unfair to compare it with the Premier League.
In the Premier league all turnovers together are as big as 2.5 billion euro!
With the German league and the Spanish league both ending at around 1.66 billion as 2nd.

Look at the difference and honestly the premier league is way overblown with Chelsea and Manchester City. Chelsea already received 800 million from their owner and City is already at 600 million it's ridiculous to be honest...


As if Barcelona and Madrid don't spend money...
Don't count your apples before they've... grown
RvB
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
Netherlands6324 Posts
August 29 2011 16:19 GMT
#1055
On August 30 2011 01:17 Stimp wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 30 2011 01:03 RvB wrote:
Spain is most definetly a good league with 2 amazing teams being way ahead of the competition but honestly it's unfair to compare it with the Premier League.
In the Premier league all turnovers together are as big as 2.5 billion euro!
With the German league and the Spanish league both ending at around 1.66 billion as 2nd.

Look at the difference and honestly the premier league is way overblown with Chelsea and Manchester City. Chelsea already received 800 million from their owner and City is already at 600 million it's ridiculous to be honest...


As if Barcelona and Madrid don't spend money...


Because that's what I said right?

Real actually has a operative profit and yes Spain has quite some debt problems 2 but they don't have private owners blowing it up as in England.
kazansky
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Germany931 Posts
August 29 2011 16:21 GMT
#1056
On August 30 2011 01:09 Holgerius wrote:
I find it sad how Serie A isn't even involved in such discussions anymore.

Well, ever been to a stadium in Italy recently? It's a shame, football is dying over there, corruption and money ruling, fascists have scared away any normal fans, the football itself is cynical as hell, and the stadiums remind of south america.
If they don't make a some political statement and try to clean up, this development will only continue.
"Mathematicians don't understand mathematics, they get used to it." - Prof. Kredler || "That was more one-sided that a mobius strip." - Tasteless
kazansky
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Germany931 Posts
August 29 2011 16:22 GMT
#1057
On August 30 2011 01:19 RvB wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 30 2011 01:17 Stimp wrote:
On August 30 2011 01:03 RvB wrote:
Spain is most definetly a good league with 2 amazing teams being way ahead of the competition but honestly it's unfair to compare it with the Premier League.
In the Premier league all turnovers together are as big as 2.5 billion euro!
With the German league and the Spanish league both ending at around 1.66 billion as 2nd.

Look at the difference and honestly the premier league is way overblown with Chelsea and Manchester City. Chelsea already received 800 million from their owner and City is already at 600 million it's ridiculous to be honest...


As if Barcelona and Madrid don't spend money...


Because that's what I said right?

Real actually has a operative profit and yes Spain has quite some debt problems 2 but they don't have private owners blowing it up as in England.


Malaga?
"Mathematicians don't understand mathematics, they get used to it." - Prof. Kredler || "That was more one-sided that a mobius strip." - Tasteless
TonyL2
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
England1953 Posts
August 29 2011 16:32 GMT
#1058
Sure England was the first main country when billionaires started to buy clubs. But it's happening in way more places now and will continue to. Especially if they see that City who almost got relegated before Thaksin took over, have got to where they are
haitike
Profile Joined June 2009
Spain2744 Posts
August 29 2011 18:58 GMT
#1059
Well, Real Madrid and F.C.Barcelona are unbuyable anyway, they are assosiations instead of companys.
Telebear
Profile Joined February 2011
United Kingdom107 Posts
August 29 2011 19:45 GMT
#1060
On August 29 2011 10:39 Sgany wrote:
best team in history in the form of Barcelona


well this isnt true at all

best team in the world? currently yes by a mile but best ever is a massive leap
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