On May 12 2011 08:13 blackone wrote: Skillcap is such a stupid word to use. The "skill cap" in WoW for example is reached by a raid that is able to kill every boss on their very first try. Nobody is or was ever even close to that. BroodWar pros keep getting better, because there is no point where skill is capped, there is always room for improvement in almost every game.
I don't think anyone is trying to argue that the skill cap of WoW or BW is reached, or even reachable. But the comparison between theoretical skill caps is what this thread is about.
On May 12 2011 08:25 shawster wrote: skill is very vague. the skillcap can never be reached in a game that is player vs player because there is always a way to win. there is always a way to one up an opponent if the game is meant to be balanced.
i think you should rename this mechanical/technical skill cap, not skillcap.
Well you could argue the skillcap in noughts and crosses is incredibly low. That's still player vs player and "balanced".
On May 12 2011 08:25 shawster wrote: skill is very vague. the skillcap can never be reached in a game that is player vs player because there is always a way to win. there is always a way to one up an opponent if the game is meant to be balanced.
i think you should rename this mechanical/technical skill cap, not skillcap.
Well you could argue the skillcap in noughts and crosses is incredibly low. That's still player vs player and "balanced".
nope. X has more ways and opportunities of winning.
On May 12 2011 08:25 shawster wrote: skill is very vague. the skillcap can never be reached in a game that is player vs player because there is always a way to win. there is always a way to one up an opponent if the game is meant to be balanced.
i think you should rename this mechanical/technical skill cap, not skillcap.
Well you could argue the skillcap in noughts and crosses is incredibly low. That's still player vs player and "balanced".
LOL that's tic tac toe right? I've never heard it called that before
On May 12 2011 07:44 synapse wrote: I'd say the most mechanically demanding game would be GunZ.
Playing this game since 2005, I would agree with this statement. Fast high level K style is very demanding mechanically and takes years of practise to perfect. Actually it has wrecked my fingers, hands and shoulders to the point where I can't press keys anymore.
If we're talking about mechanics then it would have to be a shooter game or maybe a fighting game. Reflex and timing is almost everything in those games.
Im a SC2 scrub and havent played BW so not gonna comment on it. Worms Armageddon/world party is also up there, I used to play it for years online you wouldnt believe how insane those games are and what you can do in it haha.
Broodwar hands down in every category, not just mechanichal beacuse the way I figure it, strategic skill, and all the other categorys in BW are deepened by the high mechanichal skill demand. I'm really tired while writing this so if it doesn't make sense, just ignore it
Fighter: Marvel vs Capcom 2 MMO: EvE Online everything: SC: Broodwar (far above everything else)
WoW is a joke, how can people say it has a 'high' skill cap. The hardest part of being in a super elite raiding guild is finding one and scheduling, doesn't take a high skill cap to be the first on server to down content etc, you are kidding yourself if you think so. The Arena has been a joke for almost 2 years now, the reason their seems to be a high skill cap there is because.. well.. people who like high skill cap games are not playing WoW.
On May 12 2011 08:25 shawster wrote: skill is very vague. the skillcap can never be reached in a game that is player vs player because there is always a way to win. there is always a way to one up an opponent if the game is meant to be balanced.
i think you should rename this mechanical/technical skill cap, not skillcap.
Well you could argue the skillcap in noughts and crosses is incredibly low. That's still player vs player and "balanced".
nope. X has more ways and opportunities of winning.
On the other hand if either player has half a brain cell neither has any chance of winning. But I'm not going to try argue any more about what constitutes skill or balance.
Brood War, Quakeworld/CPM and vq3 for multiplayer skill ceiling (I would say 1.6 lags a bit behind even vq3 regarding skill limit). In terms of learning curve a couple of roguelikes and Dwarf Fortress spring to mind as being ruthlessly tough for beginners.
On May 12 2011 08:41 Pufftrees wrote: Fighter: Marvel vs Capcom 2 MMO: EvE Online everything: SC: Broodwar (far above everything else)
WoW is a joke, how can people say it has a 'high' skill cap. The hardest part of being in a super elite raiding guild is finding one and scheduling, doesn't take a high skill cap to be the first on server to down content etc, you are kidding yourself if you think so. The Arena has been a joke for almost 2 years now, the reason their seems to be a high skill cap there is because.. well.. people who like high skill cap games are not playing WoW.
I believe that ADoM has higher skill cap than WoW.
Fighter: SSBM Really technically demanding, just to have basic mobility it requires some technically demanding stuff. Than add in having to actually fight, mindgames, combos, etc. it was really hard.
On May 12 2011 09:24 dave333 wrote: Fighter: SSBM Really technically demanding, just to have basic mobility it requires some technically demanding stuff. Than add in having to actually fight, mindgames, combos, etc. it was really hard.
BW for obvious reasons.
COD!!! (lolol)
Have to agree, as a former low-level pro player that would dominate casuals 1v3 and win local tournaments/have a fairly good knowledge of the metagame etc. I would go to large competitions, meet a big name in the qualifiers or ro64 and get 4stocked repeatedly. It would be at a point where I would be lucky to get them past 40%.
Melee has quite a quick learning curve, but the skill ceiling is virtually limitless.
On May 12 2011 09:24 dave333 wrote: Fighter: SSBM Really technically demanding, just to have basic mobility it requires some technically demanding stuff. Than add in having to actually fight, mindgames, combos, etc. it was really hard.
BW for obvious reasons.
COD!!! (lolol)
Have to agree, as a former low-level pro player that would dominate casuals 1v3 and win local tournaments/have a fairly good knowledge of the metagame etc. I would go to large competitions, meet a big name in the qualifiers or ro64 and get 4stocked repeatedly. It would be at a point where I would be lucky to get them past 40%.
Melee has quite a quick learning curve, but the skill ceiling is virtually limitless.
Oh god I forgot about Smash Bros. Yeaaaah that game is so heartbreaking, you practice and practice and think that you are in good shape, then you always meet someone who just rapes you so bad and makes you look like it's your first time playing the game.
You just want to crawl into a corner get into fetal position and cry.
EPT
