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Xinder
United States2269 Posts
On November 09 2011 06:14 Flameberger wrote: Have a wedding taking up all of my 11th, and a party on the 12th before I get home. Fuuuuuuu Know what you should do? You should browse TL on your phone and then we can all post how kick ass this game is just so you get all frustrated at the wedding. :D All in good fun of course. <3 | ||
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Hikari
1914 Posts
On November 09 2011 05:43 pzea469 wrote: I want to play. But I swore an oath to myself that I would finish The Witcher(first one) before even touching it. If you start now and skip the optional quests you can be done by the 11th. Its not bad of a game... I don't see how you cannot be motivated enough... | ||
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Whole
United States6046 Posts
On November 09 2011 06:20 Xinder wrote: Know what you should do? You should browse TL on your phone and then we can all post how kick ass this game is just so you get all frustrated at the wedding. :D All in good fun of course. <3 Why could we post about how awesome the game is when we could be using that time to play. lol | ||
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CursOr
United States6335 Posts
Each game, to me, has gotten more simplified. Less dynamic and more simple in terms of skills, stats, weakness/strengths, bonuses etc. I've already stated a lot of this in this thread, but just to set my base. I've been okay with it it so far, because the graphics always get better, I think the quests get a little better, and the music and story line also get a bit more complex. But this one really bothers me, and if anyone can comment on it I would appreciate it. No Attributes. No Strength, Intelligence, Agility, etc. Howard is always talking about making the classic RPG. And you remove fundamental attributes that have been in every RPG since DnD? Really? Talk about removing a whole Level of dynamics from the game. This really bothers me. That being said, I haven't played the game yet, and am only reading stuff that outlines how the game works so I can better understand it when I start to play. To me, it feels like they are removing a whole layer of the game. The Attributes were the main modifiers for your skills, your skills were your main modifiers to in game activities, and then your in game activities seemed governed both by both the individual Skills you had developed, but also by the physical and mental attributes that your character had natrualy and that were enhanced by using the skills. Just having no Strength also makes racial selection less meaningful. I mean really, how much are they going to dumb this down? I thought Oblivion felt pretty hollow compared to Morrowind, but IMO the biggest step down in Dynamics was from Daggerfall to Morrowind... which also came with the biggest upswing in graphics, quests, and NPC behavior. Just when I thought it couldn't get any worse, Oblivion now looks like a pretty complicated game with Orcs having high Strength and Endurance and Elves having high Willpower and Intelligence... and modifying those is just one CHOICE to affecting skill advancement. Less choice here. I was going to be big on Alchemy, looking forward to it, but without Fortify Strength or Willpower, without attributes there for Diseases to damage and Vamparism to enhance (such as speed)... what. the. hell. Can anyone speak on this who has played the game? Especially from the Viewpoint of whether Alchemy is worth my time as opposed to another crafting skill? TYVM | ||
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Xinder
United States2269 Posts
On November 09 2011 06:30 Whole wrote: Why could we post about how awesome the game is when we could be using that time to play. lol That's what dual monitors are for! Post during load screens! :D | ||
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ThaZenith
Canada3116 Posts
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ArYeS
Slovenia268 Posts
On November 09 2011 06:44 ThaZenith wrote: The physical version is only activated by steam, but doesn't require it, right? They can't lock me out of my physical version, can they? >.> As far as I know if you get your account banned (for any reason not limited to Skyrim) or Steam servers get nuked by <enter_random_comunist_country_with_nukes_here>. You won't be able to play Skyrim and you are left with nothing. For better understanding: It REQUIRES steam to play, not only to activate! | ||
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Logo
United States7542 Posts
On November 09 2011 06:32 cursor wrote: I've played TES since Arena. Another one of those guys flashing his creds. Each game, to me, has gotten more simplified. Less dynamic and more simple in terms of skills, stats, weakness/strengths, bonuses etc. I've already stated a lot of this in this thread, but just to set my base. I've been okay with it it so far, because the graphics always get better, I think the quests get a little better, and the music and story line also get a bit more complex. But this one really bothers me, and if anyone can comment on it I would appreciate it. No Attributes. No Strength, Intelligence, Agility, etc. Howard is always talking about making the classic RPG. And you remove fundamental attributes that have been in every RPG since DnD? Really? Talk about removing a whole Level of dynamics from the game. This really bothers me. That being said, I haven't played the game yet, and am only reading stuff that outlines how the game works so I can better understand it when I start to play. To me, it feels like they are removing a whole layer of the game. The Attributes were the main modifiers for your skills, your skills were your main modifiers to in game activities, and then your in game activities seemed governed both by both the individual Skills you had developed, but also by the physical and mental attributes that your character had natrualy and that were enhanced by using the skills. Just having no Strength also makes racial selection less meaningful. I mean really, how much are they going to dumb this down? I thought Oblivion felt pretty hollow compared to Morrowind, but IMO the biggest step down in Dynamics was from Daggerfall to Morrowind... which also came with the biggest upswing in graphics, quests, and NPC behavior. Just when I thought it couldn't get any worse, Oblivion now looks like a pretty complicated game with Orcs having high Strength and Endurance and Elves having high Willpower and Intelligence... and modifying those is just one CHOICE to affecting skill advancement. Less choice here. I was going to be big on Alchemy, looking forward to it, but without Fortify Strength or Willpower, without attributes there for Diseases to damage and Vamparism to enhance (such as speed)... what. the. hell. Can anyone speak on this who has played the game? Especially from the Viewpoint of whether Alchemy is worth my time as opposed to another crafting skill? TYVM Well the idea is that Stamina/Magicka/Hitpoints cover a lot of the customization you'd do in stats (someone with more Sta or Magicka will be able to dish out more damage than someone who can take damage because they've invested in Hitpoints). STR/INT/Etc. are often pretty bullshit anyways, especially in Morrowind/Oblivion where you had to game the system to raise stats. They're super annoying to plan out and predict before hand (just how much str do you need compared to end?) and you make tons of small meaningless decisions with the stats. Instead we get perks (1/level so it's every time you level up) that will have just as profound of a difference on your capabilities, but in a way that's more tangible and easier to plan out. Yeah you miss a bit of the cross skill influence, but it's really not removing all that much overall. The homogeneous races are a bit regrettable, but also somewhat liberating in that there's not one 'best' race for a given playstyle based only on boring stats. Overall the idea of the system is a big improvement over previous iterations and the only drawback is that it doesn't always seem like there are enough skills/perks to allow for characters to become as unique as you might want. | ||
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ThaZenith
Canada3116 Posts
On November 09 2011 06:46 ArYeS wrote: As far as I know if you get your account banned (for any reason not limited to Skyrim) or Steam servers get nuked by <enter_random_comunist_country_with_nukes_here>. You won't be able to play Skyrim and you are left with nothing. All right, thanks. Will probably just download from steam then, save myself a trip to the store. If I lose it I'm sure there will be a million torrents anyway. | ||
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DystopiaX
United States16236 Posts
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ThaZenith
Canada3116 Posts
On November 09 2011 06:48 Logo wrote: but also somewhat liberating in that there's not one 'best' race for a given playstyle based only on boring stats. I actually like this. If I want a super-mage orc, I'll prefer it if it isn't gimped based on the name of the race. Edit: sorry meant to edit into my last post. | ||
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Blanke
Canada180 Posts
On November 09 2011 06:32 cursor wrote: I've played TES since Arena. Another one of those guys flashing his creds. Each game, to me, has gotten more simplified. Less dynamic and more simple in terms of skills, stats, weakness/strengths, bonuses etc. I've already stated a lot of this in this thread, but just to set my base. I've been okay with it it so far, because the graphics always get better, I think the quests get a little better, and the music and story line also get a bit more complex. But this one really bothers me, and if anyone can comment on it I would appreciate it. No Attributes. No Strength, Intelligence, Agility, etc. Howard is always talking about making the classic RPG. And you remove fundamental attributes that have been in every RPG since DnD? Really? Talk about removing a whole Level of dynamics from the game. This really bothers me. That being said, I haven't played the game yet, and am only reading stuff that outlines how the game works so I can better understand it when I start to play. To me, it feels like they are removing a whole layer of the game. The Attributes were the main modifiers for your skills, your skills were your main modifiers to in game activities, and then your in game activities seemed governed both by both the individual Skills you had developed, but also by the physical and mental attributes that your character had natrualy and that were enhanced by using the skills. Just having no Strength also makes racial selection less meaningful. I mean really, how much are they going to dumb this down? I thought Oblivion felt pretty hollow compared to Morrowind, but IMO the biggest step down in Dynamics was from Daggerfall to Morrowind... which also came with the biggest upswing in graphics, quests, and NPC behavior. Just when I thought it couldn't get any worse, Oblivion now looks like a pretty complicated game with Orcs having high Strength and Endurance and Elves having high Willpower and Intelligence... and modifying those is just one CHOICE to affecting skill advancement. Less choice here. I was going to be big on Alchemy, looking forward to it, but without Fortify Strength or Willpower, without attributes there for Diseases to damage and Vamparism to enhance (such as speed)... what. the. hell. Can anyone speak on this who has played the game? Especially from the Viewpoint of whether Alchemy is worth my time as opposed to another crafting skill? TYVM I wouldn't be overly concerned about the simplicity of the game if you're buying it on PC. Should the attribute and skill system turn out to be as "dumbed down" as you fear, modders will be more than eager to fix this by offering their own spin on Skyrim. Heck, they've probably drawn out plans for mods already. That's what I love most about Bethesda games: community input that's rivaled only by Valve and Blizzard. (At least in the SC2 and WC3 scene, anyhow.) | ||
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OblivionMage
Canada377 Posts
On November 09 2011 06:32 cursor wrote: I've played TES since Arena. Another one of those guys flashing his creds. Each game, to me, has gotten more simplified. Less dynamic and more simple in terms of skills, stats, weakness/strengths, bonuses etc. I've already stated a lot of this in this thread, but just to set my base. I've been okay with it it so far, because the graphics always get better, I think the quests get a little better, and the music and story line also get a bit more complex. But this one really bothers me, and if anyone can comment on it I would appreciate it. No Attributes. No Strength, Intelligence, Agility, etc. Howard is always talking about making the classic RPG. And you remove fundamental attributes that have been in every RPG since DnD? Really? Talk about removing a whole Level of dynamics from the game. This really bothers me. That being said, I haven't played the game yet, and am only reading stuff that outlines how the game works so I can better understand it when I start to play. To me, it feels like they are removing a whole layer of the game. The Attributes were the main modifiers for your skills, your skills were your main modifiers to in game activities, and then your in game activities seemed governed both by both the individual Skills you had developed, but also by the physical and mental attributes that your character had natrualy and that were enhanced by using the skills. Just having no Strength also makes racial selection less meaningful. I mean really, how much are they going to dumb this down? I thought Oblivion felt pretty hollow compared to Morrowind, but IMO the biggest step down in Dynamics was from Daggerfall to Morrowind... which also came with the biggest upswing in graphics, quests, and NPC behavior. Just when I thought it couldn't get any worse, Oblivion now looks like a pretty complicated game with Orcs having high Strength and Endurance and Elves having high Willpower and Intelligence... and modifying those is just one CHOICE to affecting skill advancement. Less choice here. I was going to be big on Alchemy, looking forward to it, but without Fortify Strength or Willpower, without attributes there for Diseases to damage and Vamparism to enhance (such as speed)... what. the. hell. Can anyone speak on this who has played the game? Especially from the Viewpoint of whether Alchemy is worth my time as opposed to another crafting skill? TYVM There are no attributes in Skyrim? Woah... I didn't know about that. Feats do add customization ('perks' in Skyrim), but it's a different sort of customization than attributes provide. The loss of attributes is the loss of the most basic system of character definition. That's pretty awful, if you ask me. | ||
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Logo
United States7542 Posts
On November 09 2011 06:55 ThaZenith wrote: I actually like this. If I want a super-mage orc, I'll prefer it if it isn't gimped based on the name of the race. Edit: sorry meant to edit into my last post. Yeah me too, I wish there was a bit more difference in the races rather than a token ability (more stuff like water breathing and Khajit claws), but I do like that I can actually choose my race now rather than being 'encouraged' into one. Hopefully there's some xenophobia like in Morrowind. Feats do add customization ('perks' in Skyrim), but it's a different sort of customization than attributes provide. The loss of attributes is the loss of the most basic system of character definition. More like the loss of screwing up your character. If they do it right characters with high STA can dump that STA for uber damage in ways characters with high HP can't do (same with magic vs HP). Really when it comes down to it people generally end up choosing either: Glass Cannon, Balanced, or Tank for their stat allocations. There wasn't much more than than a false choice to begin with. Especially since the optimal way to do it in Morrowind/Oblivion meant you got 5x for 3 stats everytime you leveled and you had everything anyways. Honestly for all the outcry about it I think most people won't even really notice it as a difference compared to Oblivion. Sure some games do stats well, but Oblivion/Morrowind didn't and this change is just a natural progression from that. | ||
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ArtZ
49 Posts
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Daikas
United States118 Posts
I also enjoy that race selection is balanced, I shouldn't have to choose a Breton to get the best mage experience when aesthetically I like Dunmer better. Sooo excited for the game, must finish all my work beforehand so I can play after midnight release! Edit: If stats gains each level weren't based off of skill level ups (+2 vs +5 Str) and were just choices, with different and weapons/armor that boosted attributes, that'd be pretty nice. | ||
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DystopiaX
United States16236 Posts
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Logo
United States7542 Posts
On November 09 2011 07:14 ArtZ wrote: Anyone know if there will be digital purchase avaialble at launch? You can already pre-order (and I think pre-load) it on Steam. I like the idea of seeing stats for my character. What I didn't like about Morrowind and Oblivion was that you had to play the game a certain way to maximize those stats.. it's just annoying to have to think that in depth when I just want to play and have fun. So, I guess it makes sense to simplify that aspect of the game even though I know there must be a lot of people that feed off of min/maxing in games. yeah I mean really I'm hoping perks are varied enough to create a similar effect. Really my only worry is that you can max out enough of the perks so you don't feel unique within your build (as in all warriors with 2 handers end up basically the same). Still if you have perks that can increase your armor rating 100% for 5 points vs those that increase your damage 100% with 2 handed weapons then that's 2 pretty distinct things you can spec around and seems like it has much more of a tangible impact than having 100 strength vs 80. | ||
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ElanMT
Netherlands87 Posts
On November 09 2011 07:18 Logo wrote: You can already pre-order (and I think pre-load) it on Steam. No pre-load yet. | ||
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Mindcrime
United States6899 Posts
On November 09 2011 06:32 cursor wrote: No Attributes. No Strength, Intelligence, Agility, etc. Howard is always talking about making the classic RPG. And you remove fundamental attributes that have been in every RPG since DnD? but they haven't been in every RPG since D&D | ||
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