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On May 31 2012 04:32 Telcontar wrote:
Indoc theory has been proven false. Bioware's statements on them standing by the ending is proof. All the clues & hints are either coincidental or down to people reading too much into things. And I doubt they will use any of it since all they're doing is 'clarifying & explaining' the current shitfest.
How do Bioware's statements invalidate it? It doesn't. The Extended Cut DLC will be mostly about showing the effects of the outcome of Shepard's decision on the rest of the galaxy, your team mates, the war assets, etc. The fact that the ending remains the same disproved nothing about the indoctrination theory at all, and those videos saying that they do (yes I've seen them), clearly have a different interpretation as to what the indoctrination theory is, and what its effects are, as to me, and other people.
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Lalalaland34502 Posts
The reason I don't believe the indoctrination theory is the simple fact that the proposed theory isn't a real ending. You get indoctrinated or not, then what? That solves all the confusion about 'wtf is going on', but you still get no closure. There is still no final ending, no conclusion to the game. What happens to the war? What happens to your crew? No one knows. Did Bioware really end the trilogy on this cliffhanger where the ending to the entire series (the war) is completely cut off?
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On May 31 2012 04:32 Telcontar wrote:
Indoc theory has been proven false. Bioware's statements on them standing by the ending is proof. All the clues & hints are either coincidental or down to people reading too much into things. And I doubt they will use any of it since all they're doing is 'clarifying & explaining' the current shitfest.
Just go through all of Bioware's statements released after the whole furore started and you'll see.
It's really a testament to how bad the ending is that people are so desperate as to come up with such outlandish theories.
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After playing d3 mass effect 3 storyline is not so terrible anymore :D
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Lalalaland34502 Posts
On May 31 2012 06:04 -Archangel- wrote:
After playing d3 mass effect 3 storyline is not so terrible anymore :D
I disagree. If D3's ending was like ME3 then everything would've led to the fight with diablo, then the blacksmith's wife comes back as the mastermind behind everything. She gives you the choice whether to become a demon, kill the demons, or send them back to hell, but any of those choices would kill you. Then heaven would glow random colours and 'The End' would appear.
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Mass Effect 3 has a fantastic storyline with a terrible ending. Diablo 3's storyline is just terrible.
Anyway, having been able to chew on the ME3 over the past couple months, it still bugs me that Bioware managed to attach such a shitty ending to an otherwise wonderful piece of art. Usually I have gone back and replayed the ME games multiple times, but with ME3, I have only played it once and don't really want to play the story again because of the ending.
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On May 31 2012 05:25 Firebolt145 wrote:
The reason I don't believe the indoctrination theory is the simple fact that the proposed theory isn't a real ending. You get indoctrinated or not, then what? That solves all the confusion about 'wtf is going on', but you still get no closure. There is still no final ending, no conclusion to the game. What happens to the war? What happens to your crew? No one knows. Did Bioware really end the trilogy on this cliffhanger where the ending to the entire series (the war) is completely cut off?
Yes, the cut off is disappointing, and this will hopefully be rectified with the extended cut DLC, but I don't get what you mean that the indoctrination theory isn't a real ending? Even though you're indoctrinated, you're still making the choices, and you ultimately still decide whether or not to destroy the Reapers - it's just that the choices are muddled in your head. You can interpret it the way you want to anyway.
It's not outlandish, it's just left open to interpretation - exactly what Bioware stated they wanted (during the post-launch PAX conference I believe)
The game is obviously tailored mostly in favour of playing a Paragon (at least, as regards the most important choices - Paragon choices are always way more beneficial than Renegade choices), and at the end of the game, it is as though you are being pushed to take the control or the synthesis ending - the destroy ending is discouraged by the Catalyst - it is presented as being the Renegade - evil choice, red light and all, but isn't that exactly what the Reapers would want? To not be destroyed? The destroy ending is the only one through which Shepard can actually survive, provided you meet the highest war assets threshold (as far as I know, not accessible to the game unless you play multiplayer or the iPad game.) I don't know, it looks pretty deceitful to me.
I'd like to talk more, but I have an exam tomorrow 
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On May 31 2012 06:18 xDaunt wrote:
Mass Effect 3 has a fantastic storyline with a terrible ending. Diablo 3's storyline is just terrible.
Anyway, having been able to chew on the ME3 over the past couple months, it still bugs me that Bioware managed to attach such a shitty ending to an otherwise wonderful piece of art. Usually I have gone back and replayed the ME games multiple times, but with ME3, I have only played it once and don't really want to play the story again because of the ending.
Honestly the best part of ME3 storyline was everything NOT involving the reapers. The conflict between different civilizations and trying to solve them all was easily the best part. I found most of the stuff involving reapers had far too many cases of things being really convenient (blueprint on Mars just after invasion starts, Blueprint is perfect and easy, Citadel is moved to Earth), and just plain weird.
I mean, the entire basis of going to other races is to get their support to retake Earth....but why? Retaking Earth would accomplish nothing at all in terms of the overall war, and is said to be practically suicide. At the time, they had no idea the citadel was the crucible and that it would be at Earth waiting for them, so really there was no reason they should have all been gathering to begin with.
Worst part is the could have fixed so many of the bad parts of the reaper story SO EASILY. Mention the blueprint found on Mars in the second game, say that you need to gather all the other races because they expect that once the citadel is complete the reapers will try and destroy it before it can be used so you need to protect it.
Makes me upset thinking about all the wasted potential. Could have been so great.
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United States4471 Posts
On May 31 2012 06:31 killa_robot wrote:Show nested quote +On May 31 2012 06:18 xDaunt wrote:
Mass Effect 3 has a fantastic storyline with a terrible ending. Diablo 3's storyline is just terrible.
Anyway, having been able to chew on the ME3 over the past couple months, it still bugs me that Bioware managed to attach such a shitty ending to an otherwise wonderful piece of art. Usually I have gone back and replayed the ME games multiple times, but with ME3, I have only played it once and don't really want to play the story again because of the ending. Honestly the best part of ME3 storyline was everything NOT involving the reapers. The conflict between different civilizations and trying to solve them all was easily the best part. I found most of the stuff involving reapers had far too many cases of things being really convenient (blueprint on Mars just after invasion starts, Blueprint is perfect and easy, Citadel is moved to Earth), and just plain weird. I mean, the entire basis of going to other races is to get their support to retake Earth....but why? Retaking Earth would accomplish nothing at all in terms of the overall war, and is said to be practically suicide. At the time, they had no idea the citadel was the crucible and that it would be at Earth waiting for them, so really there was no reason they should have all been gathering to begin with. Worst part is the could have fixed so many of the bad parts of the reaper story SO EASILY. Mention the blueprint found on Mars in the second game, say that you need to gather all the other races because they expect that once the citadel is complete the reapers will try and destroy it before it can be used so you need to protect it. Makes me upset thinking about all the wasted potential. Could have been so great.
Agree that the best part was the interaction between the various races and the resolution of centuries (millenia?) old conflicts to form a united front against the Reapers. I wish that they had gotten a little more in-depth with the Turian, Asari and Salarian homeworlds/societies, but they did a great job in general.
Agree that the timing of the discovery of the blueprint for the Crucible was a bit too convenient, but it could be argued that it was discovered almost too late to use it. Also, no one really knew of the Reaper threat until recently, so no one knew to look for a weapon to stop them. As a result, I don't know if it was really all that convenient. Convenient would have been discovering it in time to use it right when the Reapers arrived, before they had invaded and killed/destroyed so much.
As for the ease of its assembly, it did take a huge amount of resources to build and that doesn't even include the incorporation of the Catalyst. It took some time before the Crucible could be built, and a lot of time and effort to even figure out what the Catalyst was. Even after all of that, no one was really sure what the Crucible was going to do up until the last moments of the game. On one hand, it's a bit convenient that they were capable of building the Crucible in terms of materials and and technology, but it wasn't like they knew what they were doing or what they were working with even as they were going all-in and relying on it as their only salvation against the Reapers. Huge gamble born out of desperation and no other viable options for stopping the Reapers.
With regards to retaking Earth, that's mostly Shepard wanting to save humanity and his homeworld. All throughout the game, there was a constant theme of the other races having to be convinced to risk their forces to save Earth. It is only through a lot of work and building of trust that Shepard was able to convince the various races to team up with humanity to take back Earth. It was my impression that the other races agreed to do so because they ultimately came to believe in Shepard as the only hope for the universe, especially since Shepard was the only one who done them some great service (i.e. save their planet, save their race, save their leader(s), etc.).
Earth was not initially supposed to be a great final battle, but it was supposed to be the beginning of the races beating back the Reapers one system at a time. Earth was chosen as the first place because Shepard was the leader and driving force behind the alliance. I'm not sure about this, but it also seems that Earth was the planet that was being hit the hardest and was receiving the most attention from the Reapers at the time. The Reapers were being fed information by Cerberus the whole time, so they knew that all of the races were uniting to take back Earth. It makes sense then that they would concentrate the bulk of their forces there to take on the united army and wipe them out (which they would've if the Crucible had not been used). Once the Reapers found out that Shepard knew what the Catalyst was and how to use it, they brought the Catalyst to Earth since that was where they were strongest and could protect it the best. Makes sense to me.
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Time to see if they can fix the cataclysmic ending -_-
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It really seems like they're just polishing their turd of an ending :/
I'll play it and give it a fair chance, but my hopes are honestly quite low at this point.
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Hrm.... it seems like there's no play through section at all. This makes the indoctrination theory difficult to true since if the ending was induced hallucination, you would need to fight further to win the day no matter what choice was made. I really hope my mind is blown by the dlc or else they let a perfect fine method to save face fly right by.
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I really didn't hugely mind the ending itself, I just wanted to see more of my actions reflected in the final battle/after the battle rather than having the exact same ending for every single person.
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On June 23 2012 06:35 YoureFired wrote:
I really didn't hugely mind the ending itself, I just wanted to see more of my actions reflected in the final battle/after the battle rather than having the exact same ending for every single person.
I sort of agree, but I expected all of that to begin with. I still think Starchild, the Crucible, and the entire concept of the ending to be horribly flawed and terribly handled, despite understanding what Bioware was TRYING to do. Having these scenes to expand on my actual choices is just something that should have been there to begin with, and will probably move the ending from "unacceptably terrible" to "mediocrely terrible" in my eyes.
Like, I can accept what Bioware wanted to do with the ending if they had just done it right to begin with and showed how our choices affected things and showed what happened to my crew, in detail, and showed how the galaxy ended up, but they combined a terrible concept with the crucible/starchild with a complete lack of execution in leaving out all explanation that it made for a double whammy of awfulness.
They're doing half of the battle, which is nice I guess, but I doubt it will ever undo the horrible feeling of frustration and lack of satisfaction I felt when finishing the game the first time.
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Seriously, they're releasing the DLC the fucking same day I'm going on vacation? >.>
Oh well, guess I'll have something to look forward to when I come home besides GSL and whatknot.
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I hope I don't read any of these comments by the time I finish this game. I don't want the FANTASTIC ending to be spoiled for me.
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will the extended cut be available at 0:00 today?
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United Kingdom16710 Posts
I don't expect the EC to fix anything. They've probably tweaked it so that you can be reunited with your love interest, and patched some of the glaring plot holes. That'll be it. They'll be hoping that and the elapsed time will be enough to appease the mob. Whatever the case, it doesn't matter to me. Bioware's already dead to me.
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EPT
