EPTMagic: The Gathering - Page 489
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caelym
United States6429 Posts
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MCMcEmcee
United States1609 Posts
French EDH top 8 going on right now. Legacy also happening today. | ||
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slyboogie
United States3423 Posts
On November 02 2013 14:47 Risen wrote: Oh man those Cockatrice rage quits. "Who plays elspeth in aggro?" This is sligh my dude. Doesn't get much more efficient than that :D Love her, but still might move to ajani. But hot damn having that five loyalty should she land is amazing. Edit: So I lose to infect. Badly. Burn the Impure!!! Unless you're issue is Crusader. | ||
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Audemed
United States893 Posts
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The Great Taste
389 Posts
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caelym
United States6429 Posts
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Cel.erity
United States4890 Posts
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Thieving Magpie
United States6752 Posts
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slOosh
3291 Posts
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Cel.erity
United States4890 Posts
On November 05 2013 04:26 slOosh wrote: So across the board disagree with these guys or is it specific advise that's ok for M14 (which is a slower block maybe?), but not recommended for Theros? The points he make are correct about the advantages and disadvantages of playing vs drawing, but the problem is, the decision is always dependent on the matchup rather than your individual deck. In the matchups where playing first is better, it gives you a huge edge, while in slower matchups where drawing is correct, the extra card means less and less over time and it's more likely to just come down to card quality. So it's like you're making a choice to take a 51/49 edge most of the time vs a 40/60 disadvantage some of the time. As far as specific formats go, M14 is probably the best recent example of drawing first being a good idea. Theros is a mixed bag, the best sealed pools are either really defensive or really aggressive, but since the defensive decks are so mana inefficient they can't really afford to draw except vs each other. It's unclear whether Ben's advice is about choosing to draw blind in game 1, but I never would, except in (original) Ravnica or Masques sealed. Games 2 and 3 it can often (or even usually) be correct to draw, but you need to know what your opponent's plan is. | ||
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Judicator
United States7270 Posts
If match up actually warrants me losing tempo for the extra card, then I draw obviously. Limited design is more about mana fixing such as some parts of Alara block and whether the small aggressive creatures are actually there and aren't being outclassed by cards like a Wall of Frost (shout outs to M10). | ||
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Shotcoder
United States2316 Posts
On November 05 2013 03:15 Cel.erity wrote: Don't ever draw in limited unless you know your opponent's deck. It's always either going to be marginally correct, or vastly incorrect. I disagree with this, slower formats often reward that extra card. Alara block and such where mana fixing was also relevant also rewarded the extra card more often than not. | ||
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Thereisnosaurus
Australia1822 Posts
Creatures 4 hopeful eidolon 4 favoured hoplite 4 battlewise hoplite 2 fiendslayer paladin 2 daxos of meletis Spells: 4 ordeal of thassa 4 ethereal armor 4 murder investigation 2 detention sphere 4 hidden strings 4 gods willing 4 mizzium skin Lands: 4 hallowed fountain 2 azorius guildgate 8 plains 6 island Side: 2 detention sphere (midrange/devotion) 2 fiendslayer paladin (r/b/w decks) 2 phalanx leader (midrange/aggro) 2 artisan of forms (midrange) 4 dispel (control) 3 triton tactics (aggro) Idea is get a dude out and all in on him, using cheap stuff to 1 for 1 block removal attempts and timewalk them. If they tap out, resolve another dude and get him rolling or hit a hidden strings. Against verdict decks you hold guys back, otherwise you play them out while always leaving up mana for whatever protection you have in hand. - keep murder investigation in hand till one of your guys gets really big, then play it out and start building up another while he keeps on pressure and gives you a target for ordeals etc. - make sure you mull aggressively when you know the matchup. Some hands are right for some matchups. Against control you want dudes and defensive tricks, against mono red the same. Against midrange and devotion you want a power hand- a hero, a defensive trick and a bunch of enchants. - When you don't know the matchup, dudes and defensive tricks is the way to go. Play safe and punish them for acting while tapped out to resolve your stuff. It's often good to start with an eidolon in your first match opening hand over a hero since the eidolon, especially with an ethereal armor second turn, will give you a life buffer to set up your game better while you figure out the opponent's deck. | ||
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Gravesong
United States96 Posts
On November 05 2013 18:27 Thereisnosaurus wrote: I've been refining a U/W heroes build and would be interested on your takes Craig Wescoe recent posted a heroic based Azorius deck with some similar ideas. Link is here: http://magic.tcgplayer.com/db/article.asp?ID=11485 I think a major problem with the list you posted is the amount of spells versus creatures. But I like the idea a lot and wanted to put together a heroic deck as well. I think the idea of using ciphered Hidden Strings to trigger on a double striker really cool. | ||
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MCMcEmcee
United States1609 Posts
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deth2munkies
United States4051 Posts
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Narcind
Sweden2489 Posts
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/VHNacFx.png) You have just got to love cockatrice sometimes | ||
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Thereisnosaurus
Australia1822 Posts
Craig Wescoe recent posted a heroic based Azorius deck with some similar ideas. Link is here: http://magic.tcgplayer.com/db/article.asp?ID=11485 I think a major problem with the list you posted is the amount of spells versus creatures. But I like the idea a lot and wanted to put together a heroic deck as well. I think the idea of using ciphered Hidden Strings to trigger on a double striker really cool. I've tried testing versions of the deck that were playing a lot more dudes, but I find they're unable to compete with the more traditional aggro/midrange decks. If you don't reliably have tricks to mess with removal, your other tricks get you blown out by it. When you look at the big decks of the format right now- mono black, mono red and esper- you're never going to keep a meaningful creature around unless you directly mess with their removal package- there's not much of it, but if you don't parry it it will get rid of your meaningful creatures none-the less. I also love the idea of the double striker hidden strings plan- but honestly I'd be inclined to play fencing ace over the hero. Whenever you play a threat like that you want to keep one mana open for a gods willing or similar to stop them just answering it pronto. If you get to untap with it in play, you can then ethereal armor/ordeal it and put it out of combat reach while holding up your answer to their removal still. The difference between doing that at 3 mana as opposed to 4 mana is huge in the deck given how few lands I'm running. From playing the deck a bunch, I've found the key question the deck needs to answer is "how do I keep my main threat in play". If you can keep one guy alive, even only one, the very act of keeping him alive is probably going to do enough to turn him into an unanswerable threat. I weep tears of joy when people play a T4 desecration demon and then they're like 'sac?' with a note of pleading in their voice as they stare across the table at an 8/8 lifelinker that they've tried to remove twice and failed. The deck can build such an insane tempo lead from just using 1 mana counters to all the premium removal in the format that desperation sets in quickly and you can take advantage of it. Of course, if your opponent draws a hand of 4 removal and 3 lands, you've got problems, but with devotion so prevalent in the format, people tend to be running permanent heavy and only having 5-8 removal pieces in their decks, if you can dodge that you're set. | ||
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caelym
United States6429 Posts
Land (24) 1x Fetid Heath 3x Godless Shrine 4x Marsh Flats 4x Plains 4x Swamp 3x Tectonic Edge 1x Temple of Silence 4x Verdant Catacombs Sorcery (9) 2x Inquisition of Kozilek 3x Lingering Souls 4x Thoughtseize Instant (4) 4x Path to Exile Creature (14) 4x Dark Confidant 4x Deathrite Shaman 1x Hero of Bladehold 1x Mirran Crusader 4x Stoneforge Mystic Artifact (3) 1x Batterskull 1x Sword of Fire and Ice 1x Umezawa's Jitte Planeswalker (4) 1x Elspeth, Knight-Errant 3x Liliana of the Veil Enchantment (2) 2x Oblivion Ring Sideboard (15) 2x Dismember 2x Duress 1x Liliana of the Veil 1x Lingering Souls 2x Oblivion Ring 3x Rest in Peace 1x Sword of Light and Shadow 3x Thalia, Guardian of Thraben | ||
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Judicator
United States7270 Posts
Except I don't think Pox is actually viable right now? Not sure. | ||
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