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On September 19 2010 21:07 Klimpen wrote:
Hey guise,
LoL newbie here, am downloading the game as I'm typing this. I'm somewhat familiar with the game type. am ~1600 in HoN, so I know the mechanical basics. I've got a few questions though. Firstly, with the removal of denying - is it better to only go for last hits and keep the lane positioned so you stay under tower cover but the enemy creeps aren't? Or is it better to aggressively push the lane so the creeps are effectively denied by their tower? Or are both viable ways of playing?
Also, I've been having a bit of trouble with ganking - heroes seem to take a much longer time to die than I'm used to in HoN so when I initiate a gank which I think is assured, the enemy hero gets away. Is my perception off? Is there something I'm missing?
I've played two games so far at a mate's, both of them as Ashe where I did reasonably well [20-2 in one, 16-0 in the other, though it was more the other team being terrible than me awesome]. I've been playing her as a semi-carry, ricing whenever possible but ganking if I think there's a 90%+ chance of a kill. Is this the generally accepted way of playing her? I've been skilling her gold ability as a priority as it feels like it improves farm fairly drastically - I'm confident in my ability to last hit at least 50% of a wave, this should rise as I get used to the game more. I've only been taking one level of her snare as it doesn't seem to scale particularly well, 15% should be more than enough for a long while, or?
Also, I've heard people describe certain heroes as their 'main', which I assume means the hero they play most of the time. I generally randomed in HoN, is there a way of being competitive while still playing a varied selection of heroes? I understand with runes and talents it's significantly more difficult. Is there a work around so I can just enter a game and be 'I've never played ____ before, imma try that'?
Thanks for any help in advance, excuse me while I slit my wrists at the prospect of learning 60+ new heroes.
Here's my Ashe guide: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=129727¤tpage=912#18225
Note that I haven't even played a single ranked game yet, and I am doing some things that some people here consider bad, but whatever, it works. Don't follow it blindly, use your brain.
Since you probably aren't level 30 yet, I suggest that you focus on the utility masteries as soon as you hit level 5. The 4 levels before that... defensive probably. Doesn't matter.
Some more annotations regarding Ashe:
She is neither a real carry nor a good single target DPS. If you use my guide, you should play her as a AoE DPS/Utility/Burst champ. Spam Volley on as many good targets as possible while staying out of danger until you see an opening to burst someone down with Ult (if it's up), Volley, Ghostblade Active > autoattack, Volley (should do 1-2k damage to squishy targets).
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JAAAAANNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
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On September 19 2010 22:16 Kaniol wrote:
I can't think of better counterpick to squishy (soft) carries with weak escape mechanisms than Kat/Kass (maybe Nidalee as well).
Poppy!
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Just played with an AD Janna in ranked. We lost. WHEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
AD JANNAAAAAAAA, I'M A CARRRYYYYY
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Just played the saddest game ever, we didn't get even one kill o.o
Ok actually we got 2 kills - when 2 of them fountain dived -.-
As for akali and poppy actually yeah, but i dislike "this" type of assassin - they have way in to kill a carry but no way out (with poppy if you kill them really quickly you just run away and with akali you most probably hope that none of enemies has purple ward/oracle  ). You have a point though 
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Just played two games with Janna in unranked. Clearly I'm doing something wrong - my kills weren't 0, my deaths weren't 0, and my assists were barely in the double digits!
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On September 20 2010 00:57 BlackPaladin wrote:
Just played with an AD Janna in ranked. We lost. WHEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
AD JANNAAAAAAAA, I'M A CARRRYYYYY
Haha you just got trolled.
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On September 19 2010 22:16 Kaniol wrote:
REALLY? I don't think that ANYONE thinks that Kat is useless O.o
Actually I totally do
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On September 20 2010 01:24 Tooplark wrote:
Just played two games with Janna in unranked. Clearly I'm doing something wrong - my kills weren't 0, my deaths weren't 0, and my assists were barely in the double digits!
It's ok to have only 11 assists if your team scored a total of 10 kills.
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On September 19 2010 22:16 Kaniol wrote:Show nested quote +On September 19 2010 20:57 Niton wrote:
(...) heroes people think are useless (Teemo, Cho, Kat)
(...) REALLY? I don't think that ANYONE thinks that Kat is useless O.o Situational doesn't mean useless. If you are facing team of like ashe + kog + corki + anything then enemies simply ask yourself to pick kat. I can't think of better counterpick to squishy (soft) carries with weak escape mechanisms than Kat/Kass (maybe Nidalee as well).
Honestly i have mixed feelings about queue dodging, on one hand it is kinda annoying (though it rarely happens 3+ times in a row so it's not that bad) but sometimes i see my friend logging in just when i'm in the pre-game lobby and asking for game, of course i'm gonna q dodge immediatelly. Also i have shitty motherboard and get BSODs/game crashes out of nowhere 
zzzzzz.
People have this misconception of Nidalee being an assassin type team-fighter. You don't teamfight with Nidalee.
She's a excellent pusher that exerts crazy amount of map-control (Hey WW, i see you're doing your red. Brt in 5 secs, just need to hop through baron and I'm there.
Well, AP nid at least, dunno about redtooth's tank nid.
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On September 20 2010 02:00 HazMat wrote:Show nested quote +On September 19 2010 22:16 Kaniol wrote:On September 19 2010 20:57 Niton wrote:
(...) heroes people think are useless (Teemo, Cho, Kat)
(...) REALLY? I don't think that ANYONE thinks that Kat is useless O.o Situational doesn't mean useless. If you are facing team of like ashe + kog + corki + anything then enemies simply ask yourself to pick kat. I can't think of better counterpick to squishy (soft) carries with weak escape mechanisms than Kat/Kass (maybe Nidalee as well).
Honestly i have mixed feelings about queue dodging, on one hand it is kinda annoying (though it rarely happens 3+ times in a row so it's not that bad) but sometimes i see my friend logging in just when i'm in the pre-game lobby and asking for game, of course i'm gonna q dodge immediatelly. Also i have shitty motherboard and get BSODs/game crashes out of nowhere zzzzzz. People have this misconception of Nidalee being an assassin type team-fighter. You don't teamfight with Nidalee. She's a excellent pusher that exerts crazy amount of map-control (Hey WW, i see you're doing your red. Brt in 5 secs, just need to hop through baron and I'm there. Well, AP nid at least, dunno about redtooth's tank nid.
really
all i do is spam e and q as ap nid
then when they're low i go cat form to make sure i ks everyone
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On September 19 2010 22:28 spinesheath wrote:Show nested quote +On September 19 2010 21:07 Klimpen wrote:
Hey guise,
LoL newbie here, am downloading the game as I'm typing this. I'm somewhat familiar with the game type. am ~1600 in HoN, so I know the mechanical basics. I've got a few questions though. Firstly, with the removal of denying - is it better to only go for last hits and keep the lane positioned so you stay under tower cover but the enemy creeps aren't? Or is it better to aggressively push the lane so the creeps are effectively denied by their tower? Or are both viable ways of playing?
Also, I've been having a bit of trouble with ganking - heroes seem to take a much longer time to die than I'm used to in HoN so when I initiate a gank which I think is assured, the enemy hero gets away. Is my perception off? Is there something I'm missing?
I've played two games so far at a mate's, both of them as Ashe where I did reasonably well [20-2 in one, 16-0 in the other, though it was more the other team being terrible than me awesome]. I've been playing her as a semi-carry, ricing whenever possible but ganking if I think there's a 90%+ chance of a kill. Is this the generally accepted way of playing her? I've been skilling her gold ability as a priority as it feels like it improves farm fairly drastically - I'm confident in my ability to last hit at least 50% of a wave, this should rise as I get used to the game more. I've only been taking one level of her snare as it doesn't seem to scale particularly well, 15% should be more than enough for a long while, or?
Also, I've heard people describe certain heroes as their 'main', which I assume means the hero they play most of the time. I generally randomed in HoN, is there a way of being competitive while still playing a varied selection of heroes? I understand with runes and talents it's significantly more difficult. Is there a work around so I can just enter a game and be 'I've never played ____ before, imma try that'?
Thanks for any help in advance, excuse me while I slit my wrists at the prospect of learning 60+ new heroes. Here's my Ashe guide: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=129727¤tpage=912#18225Note that I haven't even played a single ranked game yet, and I am doing some things that some people here consider bad, but whatever, it works. Don't follow it blindly, use your brain. Since you probably aren't level 30 yet, I suggest that you focus on the utility masteries as soon as you hit level 5. The 4 levels before that... defensive probably. Doesn't matter. Some more annotations regarding Ashe: She is neither a real carry nor a good single target DPS. If you use my guide, you should play her as a AoE DPS/Utility/Burst champ. Spam Volley on as many good targets as possible while staying out of danger until you see an opening to burst someone down with Ult (if it's up), Volley, Ghostblade Active > autoattack, Volley (should do 1-2k damage to squishy targets).
To answer some of the questions he didnt touch on. Just keep in mind i havent played HoN but i did play dota, so ill try to answer from that regard. Also some of the advice i may give you isnt all that good, keep in mind im only around 1450~1550 and a lot of better people than me post in this thread.
1)is it better to only go for last hits and keep the lane positioned so you stay under tower cover but the enemy creeps aren't? Or is it better to aggressively push the lane so the creeps are effectively denied by their tower? Or are both viable ways of playing?
From what I can tell it depends on lane comp and what lane you are in. Factor in who is your lane partner, who the other team is, and how easy is it for you to get ganked IE do they have a jungler shaco twitch or ganky mid champion. In a more general sense i would say it is almost never "push the lane so the creeps are effectively denied by tower". Some few exceptions ive seen are if you have say a zil, morde, ken, sivir etc as your lane mate. I play a little of ashe, and i will say i almost always stick to the last hit mentality no matter where i am. The less i auto attack creeps the more my crit goes up and i try to use it on an enemy champ b4 i have to last hit again.
2)Also, I've been having a bit of trouble with ganking - heroes seem to take a much longer time to die than I'm used to in HoN so when I initiate a gank which I think is assured, the enemy hero gets away. Is my perception off? Is there something I'm missing?
First off, does HoN have summoner skills? These make it much more forgiving during gank time. If the person your trying to gank takes cleanse i would suggest not even going for it unless they are already low. The bush in side lanes also makes it easier to avoid ganks as you need sight in order to auto attack.
3) I've only been taking one level of her snare as it doesn't seem to scale particularly well, 15% should be more than enough for a long while, or?
I guess its all about personal preference? I go WQWEWR R>W>E>Q. Ive never really noticed the increased points in q help me get any more or less gank kills. I run flash ghost so i never have a problem chasing or running away. Again mostly personal preference, but i bet some people might answer this one better.
4) Is there a work around so I can just enter a game and be 'I've never played ____ before, imma try that'?
Im going to assume since you just started playing that ur lvl5-10 and your ravaging your low elo placement. IMHO you can do two things w/ your ip b4 lvl 30. You can either buy a lot of champs or save up for your first rune page. If you save up for your first rune page, you will have about 5-7 champs that you own and a full tier 3 rune page @ lvl 30. If you spend all on champs though and fill your book w/ tier 1's then you could easily have 30-40 champs by the time you reach level 30. The free champs also change every week, so you could always alternate once the new free champs are released.
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On September 19 2010 23:16 Kultcher wrote:Show nested quote +On September 19 2010 22:16 Kaniol wrote:
I can't think of better counterpick to squishy (soft) carries with weak escape mechanisms than Kat/Kass (maybe Nidalee as well). Poppy!
Xin Zhao!
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How much better are Tier 3 runes and how important is having a cookie cutter rune page to winning at level 30?
I just started playing pretty much, but I'm around level 16 now or so and I'm up to 10k IP I think or so...I used to play in a DotA league a few years back so I've got the mechanics of the game pretty well, but I play in the solo Q so ^_^ Luck with allies/opponents rather than actual skill or game sense actually matters...
My thoughts were saving all my IP so at level 20 I could fill out a rune page and out of the 10 free heroes I can generally find one that I can play reasonably well so there's not much point in buying them anyways. I have all the cheap IP champions not that I really like any of em so ^_^ However, if runes aren't that useful then I'll just buy a bunch of fun heroes to have fun with.
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On September 20 2010 02:49 Blitzkrieg0 wrote:
How much better are Tier 3 runes and how important is having a cookie cutter rune page to winning at level 30?
slightly, but enough to justify the cost; not at all. don't let the idea of not having a full rune page keep you from competing
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Just have level one runepages before you can buy the tier 3, they are cheap and does well for their cost.
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There's no competition anyway. Almost every game I play is decided in the first 5 minutes of the game when somebody rage quits. Winning 4v5 is neigh impossible ^_^ Even if I farm a carry I can't win 1v5 with only three meat shields who don't know how to play.
Now to choose if I want to buy Vlad or MF first ^_^
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On September 19 2010 21:21 Yiruru wrote:
5) Utah died in every team fight
I died like a boss but I did the damage I needed to do every time
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Ashe:
R>W>Q>E with 1 level in E between 2 and 4.
A second level in E before you have to is extremely situational. I can't imagine a situation where I would want it.
You need that slow to get kills, help allies get kills, get away safely, help allies to get away safely. 5% more doesn't seem like much, but if you get an additional point in E and get killed or lose a kill because of it, it will cost you way more than you could ever get with the extra gold. It's also +5% more AoE slow via Volley, and for an AoE slow that isn't too shabby at all.
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EPT
