|
On September 20 2010 03:18 spinesheath wrote:
Ashe:
R>W>Q>E with 1 level in E between 2 and 4.
A second level in E before you have to is extremely situational. I can't imagine a situation where I would want it.
You need that slow to get kills, help allies get kills, get away safely, help allies to get away safely. 5% more doesn't seem like much, but if you get an additional point in E and get killed or lose a kill because of it, it will cost you way more than you could ever get with the extra gold. It's also +5% more AoE slow via Volley, and for an AoE slow that isn't too shabby at all.
First of all i'm no pro or anything but i can safely say that the range you get on e with levels can also be useful. Its so good for scouting jungle when someone is missing, it saved my life plenty of time, where i would not have been able to make money during that dead time. I usually put my first point in e as i doubt anything will happen until at least level 2, where i get slowing arrow. So i get a lil extra money from last hitting.
Most people see it only for the gold, the scouting is the best part of that ability.
|
sometimes youll see good players get E as their first still
makes sense, since with laning phase you should be last-hitting anyway, and the bird is good for scouting potential jungle fights
|
On September 20 2010 03:51 socal50 wrote:
sometimes youll see good players get E as their first still
makes sense, since with laning phase you should be last-hitting anyway, and the bird is good for scouting potential jungle fights
and volley can snare 5 people at once in a lvl 1 fight o.O
|
On September 20 2010 03:53 HazMat wrote:Show nested quote +On September 20 2010 03:51 socal50 wrote:
sometimes youll see good players get E as their first still
makes sense, since with laning phase you should be last-hitting anyway, and the bird is good for scouting potential jungle fights
and volley can snare 5 people at once in a lvl 1 fight o.O
Volley won't snare until level 2 when you have frost shots.
|
|
|
On September 19 2010 20:27 BluzMan wrote:
Lol i so love solo queue.
Pick Xin at start, go to drink some water.
Who are all these people running for a drink of water as soon as champ select starts? It's always like "I got onto champ screen, picked x, went for a drink of water, and when I came back WAS SHOCKED TO SUDDENLY FIND teemo/mundo/jax/eve team!"
|
Early jungle ganks always have 5 people packed tightly into a brush - Volley for 5x damage.
|
Zzz, it never hits all 5, but yeah... no hawkshot first. What's the point of knowing where the enemy team is if your team can't beat them as a result of you taking a useless fighting skill?
|
On September 20 2010 04:28 spinesheath wrote:
Early jungle ganks always have 5 people packed tightly into a brush - Volley for 5x damage.
except people don't run into a bush like this:
x
x \
x -----> bush >volley
x /
x
they run in like this
xx
xxx ----->bush >volley
so you're gonna hit like 2 of them max but w/e
|
As ashe, I ALLWAYS take E at level 2 or 1.
That shit saved my life so many times, and gives huge amounts of map control since its basically a free uber clairvoyance (with limmited range though, it reveals more still)
Not to mention it's 1 or 2 free wards.
|
I never encountered a situation where I would have gotten anything out of E before level 4. By that time you should still be sitting next to your tower and lasthit. No way a level 2/3 gank could kill you there unless you do something stupid. That's obviously for solo mid, sidelanes are different and usually bad for Ashe. Depends on a lot of factors there.
Of course you're not Volleying those gankers as they wait silently in the brush. You have 20 seconds cooldown on level 1, gotta aim more carefully. Sure 5 is unlikely, but 2 squishies and someone else should be doable in many cases.
|
Guardian Angel: Is it worth it anymore? Just checking my Nasus build here and I see that I can get Banshees, or Aegis + Negatron/HoG for basically the same cost. Any of which feels like a better deal than getting <25% of my life back once every five minutes.
|
On September 20 2010 04:52 spinesheath wrote:
I never encountered a situation where I would have gotten anything out of E before level 4. By that time you should still be sitting next to your tower and lasthit. No way a level 2/3 gank could kill you there unless you do something stupid. That's obviously for solo mid, sidelanes are different and usually bad for Ashe. Depends on a lot of factors there.
Of course you're not Volleying those gankers as they wait silently in the brush. You have 20 seconds cooldown on level 1, gotta aim more carefully. Sure 5 is unlikely, but 2 squishies and someone else should be doable in many cases.
Better be helping that jungler ~ and in any case the money is allways good, even though I normally do as you say (going WQWE then R>W>Q>E).
Think of it like this: if you have a passive lane (or a lane where you wont be harassed much), getting E is something you can do to enhance your mid late game by alot - the difference isnt that significant but it's there.
Oh and manamune on Corki is so unbelieveably strong, it solves all his mana problems for the rest of the game and gives him a free BF blade.
Gonna throw my new corki build which works wonders so far ~
Saphire crystal / meki + 2 pot opening
at 1500 gold recall to get manamune, if you die before get boots, a ward for dragon / their golem and 1 potion of each kind
zerker boots (if you get hit by a slow youre not getting away without teammate support anyways, maybe on SUPER cc heavy teams i'd get merc instead, but right now the AS works for me.
brutalizer
(pump red pots from here on when needed)
ghostblade
banshees -> cleaver -> BT -> sell manamune and make another BT (should have no mana problems at this stage of the game, and corki scales WONDERFULLY with AD, you wont even believe it)
Off to bed, tear my build to shreds ! =)
|
Why is this game matching me up against you guys 
|
Wow... didn't know olaf was that good. I just out dpsed a MF after I couldn't connect to the game for 15 mins, the MF was 10-3-7 before I killed her, I was only level 16, and I wasn't fed.
|
On September 20 2010 04:52 spinesheath wrote:
I never encountered a situation where I would have gotten anything out of E before level 4. By that time you should still be sitting next to your tower and lasthit. No way a level 2/3 gank could kill you there unless you do something stupid. That's obviously for solo mid, sidelanes are different and usually bad for Ashe. Depends on a lot of factors there.
Of course you're not Volleying those gankers as they wait silently in the brush. You have 20 seconds cooldown on level 1, gotta aim more carefully. Sure 5 is unlikely, but 2 squishies and someone else should be doable in many cases.
ive never played ashe, so i dont have a whole lot to say about that, but i guarantee you that i can kill you as jungle shaco when you're lvl 2 or 3 depending whether you solo'd top or mid. Same could be said of panth, but im not as familiar with the timing.
edit: also, i dont see anything wrong with waiting until you actually NEED to level something up, if nothing is happening and you go straight to lane, is there anything wrong with leveling e first? Volley and frost shot wont do a whole lot in lane at lvl 1, so i see no reason to level it until you have to.
|
On September 20 2010 05:21 Misder wrote:
Wow... didn't know olaf was that good. I just out dpsed a MF after I couldn't connect to the game for 15 mins, the MF was 10-3-7 before I killed her, I was only level 16, and I wasn't fed.
Mf can beat most champions 1v1 but the damage reduction from olaf's ult wrecks any champion that gets most of their damage from auto attacks so he can naturally tank MF to death unless she has a lot of lifesteal and crit and you dont.
|
On September 20 2010 05:07 myopia wrote:
Guardian Angel: Is it worth it anymore? Just checking my Nasus build here and I see that I can get Banshees, or Aegis + Negatron/HoG for basically the same cost. Any of which feels like a better deal than getting <25% of my life back once every five minutes.
I always found that GA is more of an item for non-tanks. I mean, everyone focuses the squishies first, and then it is a length battle between tanks. GA brings the squishy back while the tanks hit the assassin. And since we're talking about low-HP champs, the nerf didn't do much.
I never liked it for tanks because it makes people focus you even less.
For "tough" champs it really depends on the situation I guess.
On September 20 2010 05:49 barbsq wrote:Show nested quote +On September 20 2010 04:52 spinesheath wrote:
I never encountered a situation where I would have gotten anything out of E before level 4. By that time you should still be sitting next to your tower and lasthit. No way a level 2/3 gank could kill you there unless you do something stupid. That's obviously for solo mid, sidelanes are different and usually bad for Ashe. Depends on a lot of factors there.
Of course you're not Volleying those gankers as they wait silently in the brush. You have 20 seconds cooldown on level 1, gotta aim more carefully. Sure 5 is unlikely, but 2 squishies and someone else should be doable in many cases. ive never played ashe, so i dont have a whole lot to say about that, but i guarantee you that i can kill you as jungle shaco when you're lvl 2 or 3 depending whether you solo'd top or mid. Same could be said of panth, but im not as familiar with the timing. edit: also, i dont see anything wrong with waiting until you actually NEED to level something up, if nothing is happening and you go straight to lane, is there anything wrong with leveling e first? Volley and frost shot wont do a whole lot in lane at lvl 1, so i see no reason to level it until you have to.
If I solo top then I have a much harder time trying to survive early ganks because the tower is so far from the creeps unless the enemy pushes the lane, and Ashe is terribly slow.
If things go bad, Shaco can be really hard to stop even in mid. But since I am expecting an early gank, Hawkshot wouldn't help much. Especially because I only have a 50% chance to scout the side you'll come from, and the timing has to be right as well. If I don't see you with my Hawkshot I can't feel safe because you might have taken the long route and come from the other side. I really don't see what I would get from that.
If I have Volley + Slow instead, I can Volley as soon as you show up and slow the enemy mid or force him away, so that I don't have to take damage from 2 enemies.
Since Ashe can't dominate a lane against most champs, getting Volley early can help with lasthitting either by forcing the enemy off or by lasthitting with Volley. Getting 1 more minion kill > 1 extra gold for up to 15-20 minion kills.
|
O.o last hitting with volley is gonna push the lane like a motherfucker, so if you're using it to push enemies away, that will do the opposite of help since you're letting them zone you harder. honestly, the stronger ashe's that i see tend to not ever use volley until midgame unless they're going for the kill
|
On September 20 2010 05:17 shadowryu wrote:Why is this game matching me up against you guys
lol, wait I feel like I remember playing against you earlier today.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
