EPT10-1-9
9-0-8
Whoooooo so much fun setting things on fire.
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Haemonculus
United States6980 Posts
10-1-9 9-0-8 Whoooooo so much fun setting things on fire. | ||
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Mogwai
United States13274 Posts
And since my old Pantheon guide is out of date, I'm just gonna make a new one... Mogwai's Updated Pantheon Guide Just don't bother. Play Garen or something. Ghost/Ignite. Ghost is currently all around better than Flash for chasing/escaping, and is pretty much necessary on a Melee to be able to stick to a target in team fights. Ignite is your way of ensuring that you stay ahead of everyone on burst early. You can swap ignite out for cleanse, but I've settled to the point where I'm convinced ignite is better, albeit by a small margin. Masteries 0/21/9 is my staple. You do a lot of harassment early, so getting full blown defensive mastery and hardiness mitigates the creep aggro quite a bit. In general, defensive masteries are stronger early game and as a character that relies on a strong early game, Pantheon is well suited to taking all the defensive tree has to offer. Putting the remaining 9 in utility is an easy choice, as perseverance, improved ghost, awareness and a point in meditation trumps what the offensive tree has to offer (essentially 2% crit, 3% CDR and 2 flat armor pen). There's no wiggle room for this if you're going mid, however, on side lanes, you can get away with 21/9/0 or 21/0/9 and going balls to the walls on your offensive output. Runes Marks: Armor Pen Seals: Dodge OR Mana Regen/Level (only on side lanes and only if you go 21/0/9) Glyphs: Mana Regen/Level Quints: Flat HP OR Flat Damage (only on side lanes with a 21 in offensive setup) Again, if you're mid, you gotta do dodge + flat HP, but on side lanes you can go for an abusive, all out offensive build if that's your cup of tea. I almost exclusively play mid these days and stick to my same mid pre-game setup for the most part, but I have tried out some abusive early offensive output strategies on side lanes to a relatively high level of success. Items You have 3 choices for openings: Fort Elixir + 5 HP Pots Boots + 3 HP Pots Long Sword + 1 HP Pot (side lane only) With the fort elixir nerf, I find myself going boots most often, but fort elixir is still really good and necessary in certain matchups (most notably Kat, Panth, and Nidalee). When evaluating it though, remember that you're essentially flushing 300 gold down the drain for your early advantage, so you must leverage it into kills or exp/gold denial to have it be worthwhile. If you open fort elixir, don't drink it until level 3 when you have your full combo ready and only drink it as you're jumping with W to setup a brutal E, you need to milk as much duration out of it as you can. On side lanes, go Long Sword to maximize your burst without wasting 300 gold on fort elixir, especially if you're with a support hero (<3 Janna). If you suspect a difficult lane to burst kill, open boots for more pots so you have some staying power. Your target from here is: boots1 SotO Brutalizer I typically find myself getting there by going boots -> 3 long swords -> SotO + brutalizer. The earlier the SotO the better, but I find myself at level 6 being between 1230 (enough for 3 long swords) and 1369 (enough for SotO), so you just take what you can get and then ult somewhere for kills and finish the SotO and Brutalizer when you can. You finish by finishing merc treads, picking up a BF Sword item or two and getting a banshee's veil if necessary to protect your heartseeker, with Last Whisper/Stark's occassionally mixed in for extra sustained damage/backdooring speed. Typically, I go long sword + vamp scepter, then finish merc treads, then get Black Cleaver or Bloodthirster, then get the other, occasional deviating for BC + Stark's or BT + LW. I don't get veil much still... it's just so important to keep your AD up with the game to one shot squishies, but when you need to get Veil, you go scepter, treads, finish BT, then Veil. If I end up with 5 items and somehow manage to get 1350 on top of what I need to keep my red elixir pump going, I'll also finish ghostblade from my brutalizer, but I do not prioritize this. It is worth nothing that when you get to ghostblade, IE is really good to have, so if you're getting overfarmed, skip the BC and go for IE to setup a stronger late game. Skills q,w,e,e,e,r,e,w,e,w,w,w,r,q,q,r,q,q, don't ever deviate except to get W at level 1 to win a weird level 1 jungle fight. Keeping r at level 1 until you max aegis is important so that it stays at 150 mana so that you can cast it from lane and arrive with enough mana to combo W -> E upon landing. Gameplay Just play him. Read the next section so you get how heartseeker works, then just play hundreds of games and when you run into trouble, ask about it in this thread and I'll help you get over it. I could write all day, but the truth of the matter is you just gotta play him and learn all the intricacies on your own. The Heartseeker Bug, How it Works and How to Abuse it Heartseeker's interaction with base damage is working completely as intended. This means that if you invest nothing in the way of items, runes or masteries into improving your attack damage, your heartseeker will do the expected amount of damage. However, bonus damage (when you hover over your Attack Damage it shows "(<base damage in white font> + <bonus damage in green font> ) " ) completely ignores the % scaling from your current level of heartseeker and applies to all hits at 100%. The implications of this can be quite brutal with some focus early, so let's talk about how you can abuse the shit out of this bug. At level 3, if you have no items and no investment in your pre-game setup devoted to AD, your heartseeker will deal: 6 + 18% of your AD (59 * .18 ~ 11) per hit, doubled to champions. that's 17, doubled is 34, times 5 hits = 170 damage total to champions... ok, nothing really special. Now let's see what happens when we throw a longsword, flat AD quints, offensive masteries, and a level 2 Janna Shield into the equation... the base damage per hit stays at 34, but now we tack on a bonus of 10 (LS) + 6 (Quints) + 3 (Brute Force) + 23 (l2 Eye of the Storm) = 42 damage per hit let that sink in a second... that more than doubles the damage output of your heartseeker. you jump from 170 damage to 380. remember, this is at level 3 that we're talking about. You'll accidentally have enough armor pen to go through everything they have between runes and masteries. You'll also hit for ~35 with aegis (since no magic pen), 141 with spear shot, 125 with ignite, and you'll crit for about 215 when they get to 15% health. Oh, and this is all before havoc adds 5% to everything. so if you're laning with Janna, and you know one of your opponents doesn't have cleanse, at level 3, you're looking at a pretty reliable burst of 35 + 380 + 141 + 125 + 215 = 896. <_< >_> !!!!!!!! This is the essence of why Pantheon is playable right now. That exact scenario might not come up, but as you start getting SotO stacks with your brutalizer, your burst starts getting absolutely silly. regardless of your heartseeker level, you add 5 points to your heartseeker for each 1 point of damage you gain. That's 50 damage per longsword, 25 per SotO stack, 250 per BF Sword. This is why my build is so balls to the wall on getting damage, because abusing this shit is the only thing keep Pantheon from being just another terrible melee DPS. So there you go, go nuts, and don't make any goddamn 300 jokes when you're playing cause they stopped being funny 3 months ago, if they ever were. | ||
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Mogwai
United States13274 Posts
On June 15 2010 04:16 Southlight wrote: Nothing wrong with being good at one hero :p Just make sure you're good, lol. yea, don't be like that 700+ wins with Jax guy that sucked, lol. I can't imagine playing so much Pantheon if I weren't such a fucking monster with him :p On June 15 2010 04:26 Haemonculus wrote: Damn I am owning up a storm with Kayle these days. OP much? 10-1-9 9-0-8 Whoooooo so much fun setting things on fire. nice, how do you build your Kayle? I've been seeing OKish new Kayles, but I'm yet to see one really fuck shit up so I'm assuming I'm not seeing well refined builds. | ||
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WaveofShadow
Canada31495 Posts
yea nasus is pretty epic, ive carried some horrible teams before. I'm fairly new to the game (started last week) and I've been playing Nasus pretty exclusively as well. I just can't seem to match his ability to walk into 2 other champions and kill them both with anyone else. (Went 10/1/6 in a TT game last night--got greedy after taking out an inhibitor >.<) Who would you suggest buying next after I've saved up some more IP? I was thinking Veigar just 'cause he looks pretty cool. Is there any real reason to pick one hero above another other than you just enjoy how they sound/look? Should I wait until I can free trial some more heroes? | ||
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Mogwai
United States13274 Posts
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radmax86
United States437 Posts
On June 15 2010 03:43 redtooth wrote: lol i love the way kat somehow made it into that list wtf? btw ezpz do you understand how ban/draft picking works? it's not a global ban that span across all games. the captains/teams choose which characters to ban during which games. btw for those who don't know, the system is 1-2-2-1 bans and 1-2-2-2-2-1 picks with alternating teams starting with the first pick that being said, fuck janna. ban her first in all games. I don't think anyone wants a hero draft, and bans can work any way we want. That system you mentioned is a holdover from dota and is exclusive pick which might not work to well in TL games where people are only competent with a few heroes. Global bans on new heroes and imba heroes were very common in scrims and such. On June 15 2010 04:06 redtooth wrote: and rad you had the most tryhard comp last tourney so shush. it was literally a "babysit radjacob" team. Our comp was fairly strong, though I'd argue all the teams we played were fairly balanced and tryhard. In theory mine was a babysit trist/fiddle team, but that rarely ever happened :\ | ||
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Southlight
United States11768 Posts
On June 15 2010 04:35 Mogwai wrote: So there you go, go nuts, and don't make any goddamn 300 jokes when you're playing cause they stopped being funny 3 months ago, if they ever were. Pantheon working as intended is called Tryndamere. | ||
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rredtooth
5460 Posts
On June 15 2010 04:47 radmax86 wrote: haha yeah i was just messing with you. we all hate tryhard teams. but yours was pretty frustrating. i still remember it pretty clearly: old shen (supertank), old janna (supersupport), zilean (magic+support), fiddle (magic+CC), trist (dps carry).I don't think anyone wants a hero draft, and bans can work any way we want. That system you mentioned is a holdover from dota and is exclusive pick which might not work to well in TL games where people are only competent with a few heroes. Global bans on new heroes and imba heroes were very common in scrims and such. Our comp was fairly strong, though I'd argue all the teams we played were fairly balanced and tryhard. In theory mine was a babysit trist/fiddle team, but that rarely ever happened :\ i only stated the old ban-draft pick mode since i was under the impression that was what they were going to implement in season 1. i mean i can't imagine RIOT implementing a global ban for ranked games (LOL "YOU ARE NOT ALLOWED TO PLAY JANNA/EZREAL"). also, saying "TL players can only play few heroes" is not a good argument against exclusive draft. it just means that captains have to pick better and players have to be better. that's all there is to it. i feel like the more strategy that's involved, the more fun the games will become. | ||
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rredtooth
5460 Posts
On June 15 2010 04:35 Mogwai wrote: pantheon's ultimate should be remade. it should be like a WW ultimate except a huge well pops up from underground and panth kicks his victim into it to deal massive damage.So there you go, go nuts, and don't make any goddamn 300 jokes when you're playing cause they stopped being funny 3 months ago, if they ever were. | ||
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Southlight
United States11768 Posts
On June 15 2010 04:59 redtooth wrote:i mean i can't imagine RIOT implementing a global ban for ranked games (LOL "YOU ARE NOT ALLOWED TO PLAY JANNA/EZREAL"). Actually they mentioned that they were looking at using a M:tG style of phasing heroes in and out (to make balancing easier in the long run), and that if there were to be a broken hero they'd be comfortable deactivating the hero until it's fixed or balanced. | ||
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Brees
Marshall Islands3404 Posts
On June 15 2010 04:42 WaveofShadow wrote: I'm fairly new to the game (started last week) and I've been playing Nasus pretty exclusively as well. I just can't seem to match his ability to walk into 2 other champions and kill them both with anyone else. (Went 10/1/6 in a TT game last night--got greedy after taking out an inhibitor >.<) Who would you suggest buying next after I've saved up some more IP? I was thinking Veigar just 'cause he looks pretty cool. Is there any real reason to pick one hero above another other than you just enjoy how they sound/look? Should I wait until I can free trial some more heroes? if you like the playstyle of nasus, I would recommend trying Olaf and mordekaiser. They both can do what you described and they also scale very well into lategame, as does nasus(although nasus is probably the best at this since everyone continues to get higher hp and he only farms Q even more) jax to a lesser extent is another champ you might want to try, he requires more finesse though | ||
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Southlight
United States11768 Posts
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Brees
Marshall Islands3404 Posts
On June 15 2010 05:05 Southlight wrote: Mordekaiser may be good on TT but he's absolutely dreadful on SR. opposite from what i've seen. he is absolute garbage on TT and can be effective on SR since its easy to farm 200+ with him in a short time | ||
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rredtooth
5460 Posts
On June 15 2010 05:02 Southlight wrote: is that so? i believe you but it'd be nice if you could link me to the source. i don't really keep up with the official forums since i find that i don't really learn anything from them.Actually they mentioned that they were looking at using a M:tG style of phasing heroes in and out (to make balancing easier in the long run), and that if there were to be a broken hero they'd be comfortable deactivating the hero until it's fixed or balanced. also brees: mordekaiser scales well lategame? zzz wtf? edit: mordekaiser is okay on TT since what he does well (not die) is that much more important. good comps/teams will just ignore him and keep coming out of fights with 2 kills and 0 deaths though. cleanse was extremely common too so it just makes him even more useless. i always thought him and mundo were the most overrated characters on TT. | ||
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Southlight
United States11768 Posts
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WaveofShadow
Canada31495 Posts
if you like the playstyle of nasus, I would recommend trying Olaf and mordekaiser. They both can do what you described and they also scale very well into lategame, as does nasus(although nasus is probably the best at this since everyone continues to get higher hp and he only farms Q even more) jax to a lesser extent is another champ you might want to try, he requires more finesse though Appreciate the advice, but I was thinking of picking a different style of character as my second pick. (Although the only game I played against an Olaf he completely destroyed me 1v1 every time.) I'm probably going to go with a nuke/caster of some sort. I tried Morganna this week but I was sorta on the fence with her. She's slow as balls but the root is nice and she farms easily. Just thinking about some characters I played against recently... I played a TF once--he went like 17-0 and completely 1v3d us. Not sure I'd want to try him though. Umm...some caster who looked like a lich? Forget his name >.< sorry I'm a n00b still. He was alright but I was 2-3 levels above him the whole game as I usually take the solo lane so he wasn't much of a factor. Edit: Ah I see now why you suggested those...I do enjoy the tank/DPS aspect of Nasus but I like to vary my characters. WOuldn't want every character of mine to be good at the exact same thing.  | ||
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Mogwai
United States13274 Posts
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Mogwai
United States13274 Posts
On June 15 2010 05:10 redtooth wrote: is that so? i believe you but it'd be nice if you could link me to the source. i don't really keep up with the official forums since i find that i don't really learn anything from them. also brees: mordekaiser scales well lategame? zzz wtf? edit: mordekaiser is okay on TT since what he does well (not die) is that much more important. good comps/teams will just ignore him and keep coming out of fights with 2 kills and 0 deaths though. cleanse was extremely common too so it just makes him even more useless. i always thought him and mundo were the most overrated characters on TT. somewhere in this article: http://pc.gamespy.com/pc/league-of-legends-clash-of-fates/1094538p1.html GameSpy: Once the season wraps, what's on your mind for the future? I know you've said that you would be limiting champion selection a bit in future seasons, in order to mix things up a bit; is that still the plan? Tom Cadwell: We're not entirely sure how we want to approach that at this point. What we will be looking to do is add additional and dramatically different game modes. We've talked about these in the past, and we've started some initial development on them. Those are going to be maps with completely different objective sets, and I think putting a competitive structure on those will be really exciting for us. I'm not sure what strategy we'll pursue with champion limits and that sort of thing yet -- we'll have to play it by ear when we get there. | ||
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Brees
Marshall Islands3404 Posts
On June 15 2010 05:12 Mogwai wrote: Mord's weird on SR. He doesn't really fit any role, but he can still be somewhat effective. He's a bad tank because he doesn't have any CC, but he somehow cobbles enough damage together to make himself useful in teamfights. I used to think he was complete trash, but recently I've begun to think he hovers around the mid tiers, sorta like singed. well thats the problem. there are so many bad singed and mordekaiser that build them pure tank that they look bad. you will cry the day you see a morde with magic pen/rylai's/sunfires same with singed really minus the sunfires | ||
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FlameSworD
United States414 Posts
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