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On July 05 2010 18:14 shawster wrote:Show nested quote +On July 05 2010 17:35 Ota Solgryn wrote:On July 05 2010 17:00 shawster wrote:
i agree with ryzer
pantheon is such crazy lane presence atm and heimer is stupid unless you have a way to counter him. the funnything is both of these heroes have HUGE weaknesses, squishy panth/heimer w/o turrets is death.
i'd buff panth squishy and remove some early dmg, then i'd remove those stupid grenades doing damage and find something else.
tryhard isn't a dumb term, it's the first word that pops out of your head when you see allistar/soraka/janna on the other team Yes, tryhard is an extremely dumb word, because of what it implies. I agree that those teams can be annoying, but it is really part of the game and can easily be defeated, it is just hard to punish and a small mistake on your team means you have lost. Should tryhard also be used by zerg players who looses to mech terran. Because mech terran is "easier" to do and harder to beat? Or 2base carrier for protoss? i don't think you understand what try hard means try harding is like picking protoss vs terran if protoss was 2:1 winner due to complications that are not skill related. certain heroes are better then others, but i decide to play master yi instead of soraka because he's more fun. soraka is still 50x better then yi. try hards make prearranged teams with the goal of winning in a game where your hidden match making rating isn't even displayed. i'm not going to beat soraka/allistar/janna if i solo que, ever. everyone tries hard in ranked games, but these are games where there isn't even a big reward for winning. losing to someone who uses mech because it's easier isn't try hard, losing to someone abusing a build order which is an auto win build order is try hard. it's like using akuma in a street fighter tournament (he isn't banned in japanese tournaments, just frowned upon using because he's overpowered)
You say it yourself. You pick master Yi to have fun. But then you have decided to do that. You have picked a hero you don't master and have thereby deliberately put yourself at an disadvantage to begin with. If you then lose, don't blame the team comp and say "bla bla you are tryhards". You played to have fun, they played to win, then accept it and don't try to berate them their win. It was your choise.
Most good players play to win. For some that means picking a team composition they can play well with, and maybe that is a heal/push team. If you can't beat them, then thats your fault and your team. But people should really stop using tryhard as an excuse to losing.
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Russian Federation4235 Posts
On July 05 2010 15:22 SnK-Arcbound wrote:
Well all the people bitching that pantheon would be worthless are.... wrong. At level 3 you either hump the tower or he'll kill you.
Yesterday I went Gangplank with Heimer vs a Panth/Olaf lane. Gosh they were so friggin useless. They just cannot do shit but attack creeps and watch me get kills in the other lane with my ult.
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there is no tryhard, only dohard.
+ Show Spoiler +
anyway, I'm new to LoL I have like 10 wins, I really like Morgana. Is AP Morgana viable for... competition? Any general tips with her? What items should I go? I generally like, buy uhh either an item headed towards a +AP staff and some mana pots or...that's pretty much what I do these days I think actually. Eventually I get the boots of +5movespeed when you're ooc. I basically just spam her AoE and try to farm mobs for a while (I get Smite+Teleport for mass gold and minimal time away from mobs), and I basically go WQWQWR (max out aoe before her nuke).
Also can someone tell me like.. her AoE reduces magic resistance or something in stacks, if the person has 0 magic resistance to begin with, does it go negative and give some bonus when you cast her Q?
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Russian Federation4235 Posts
On July 05 2010 14:29 Southlight wrote:
I said fuck it and started maining Kass and I've been steamrolling since, yeah :p I guess it was simply time to stop being in denial and admit that he's not as bad as I thought even a month ago and that I'm pretty good with him.
I've mained Kass for a while now (should be about 40-50 games) and he definitely ain't bad, just underdesigned. His passive is the most useless skill in the game and his killrates are deceptive. In fact, Kassadin is made for mop-up and killstealing so he is pretty much guaranteed to have kills in any game that involves mid-late enemy kills at all. But that is deceiving, the fact that you accumulate all the kills on your team doesn't really mean you're winning. Besides, I'm level 16 atm and people at this level rarely know how to lane. He is too easy to shut down by a competent laner, needs a thorough lane partner selection and it's really easy to fuck up stacking Soulstealer in the later game.
In late game, if he is not fed, he has zero to none teamfight utility. I still expect Riot to do something about his W in the nearest future, it just doesn't work (as well as the AS buff from his innate, no, melee Kassadin doesn't exist). It can't be used to harass in lane, it is useless in late game (gosh I drain 100% mana in 20 hits, but wtf, most people could kill me in 10) and it doesn't work on minions like manadrain spells used to in DotA/HoN. They also need to rework his recommended items list and his page because, once again, AS Kassadin doesn't exist, it's a rather stupid myth.
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On July 05 2010 19:00 Vei wrote:there is no tryhard, only dohard. + Show Spoiler +anyway, I'm new to LoL I have like 10 wins, I really like Morgana. Is AP Morgana viable for... competition? Any general tips with her? What items should I go? I generally like, buy uhh either an item headed towards a +AP staff and some mana pots or...that's pretty much what I do these days I think actually. Eventually I get the boots of +5movespeed when you're ooc. I basically just spam her AoE and try to farm mobs for a while (I get Smite+Teleport for mass gold and minimal time away from mobs), and I basically go WQWQWR (max out aoe before her nuke). Also can someone tell me like.. her AoE reduces magic resistance or something in stacks, if the person has 0 magic resistance to begin with, does it go negative and give some bonus when you cast her Q?
Soul shroud and frozen heart. With 1 or two doran's ring thrown in there whenever you feel you need more HP or mana regen,
Zhonya if you have money after that. Not a huge fan of rod of ages on morgana, because all four of her skills have WAY too much utility not to be spammed, so 40% CDR is your goal.
No smite, no teleport. Farming is easy enough with morgana, but you don't really need to make that your priority (I would suggest getting that giant's belt as early as possible though).
I suggest ignite and ghost. Ignite makes her that much more scary and no one saves that cleanse for ignite against her anyways. Ghost is just good on morgana.
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On July 05 2010 17:47 Redlol wrote:
It's a good point, almost every Pantheon is reliant on snowballing by the time they're level 10-12. One good gank can mean a lot, but I disagree with your reasoning - at least when Sion/DPS or Alistar/DPS manage to get you they have some help, Pantheon is more than capable of doing it by himself.
Edit: How's your jungle Rammus build go? I really enjoy playing Rammus, but I've only really ever done it once. I've jungled as Amumu a couple of times though and assume it's probably pretty similar?
Pantheon can't really do it by himself because they cleanse out of his stun, his HSS gets silenced, etc. It's only if there's a really low-hp hero that he can do it himself, but so can TF, and might I add, TF can do it better because his ult doesn't take ages to channel. If you sit around and be greedy and give Pantheon a chance to ult onto your tower, then yeah, he'll kill you and get away, but if you play slightly less greedy and simply deny Panth a chance to kill you, he'll be pretty sad, and frustrated. And when it comes to side-lane ganks, well, I'm not gonna lie, as Kassadin I find it a bit easier to kill crap with TF because he doesn't whiff his ult as much :p
My jungle Rammus went ok but I decided that tanking isn't affecting games enough, fast enough. He jungles faster than Amumu up to level 4-5, which is when you can get some sick ganks off, but he definitely drops off when it comes to killing golem/lizard as time passes (short of using his ult), and he struggles vs dragon. It's those early ganks that really can change games (ie. my ganks to help xpecial vs Panth) but yeah. If I'm better than the other players, then I'd rather just go on the offensive and take them down, as opposed to playing passive in jungle and hoping my teammates don't fail.
On July 05 2010 19:00 BluzMan wrote:Show nested quote +On July 05 2010 14:29 Southlight wrote:
I said fuck it and started maining Kass and I've been steamrolling since, yeah :p I guess it was simply time to stop being in denial and admit that he's not as bad as I thought even a month ago and that I'm pretty good with him. I've mained Kass for a while now (should be about 40-50 games) and he definitely ain't bad, just underdesigned. His passive is the most useless skill in the game and his killrates are deceptive. In fact, Kassadin is made for mop-up and killstealing so he is pretty much guaranteed to have kills in any game that involves mid-late enemy kills at all. But that is deceiving, the fact that you accumulate all the kills on your team doesn't really mean you're winning. Besides, I'm level 16 atm and people at this level rarely know how to lane. He is too easy to shut down by a competent laner, needs a thorough lane partner selection and it's really easy to fuck up stacking Soulstealer in the later game. In late game, if he is not fed, he has zero to none teamfight utility. I still expect Riot to do something about his W in the nearest future, it just doesn't work (as well as the AS buff from his innate, no, melee Kassadin doesn't exist). It can't be used to harass in lane, it is useless in late game (gosh I drain 100% mana in 20 hits, but wtf, most people could kill me in 10) and it doesn't work on minions like manadrain spells used to in DotA/HoN. They also need to rework his recommended items list and his page because, once again, AS Kassadin doesn't exist, it's a rather stupid myth.
I don't understand why people still think Kassadin needs money. Look at the game I posted a few pages back. I was getting almost no kills, and it didn't bother me. Maybe I play Kassadin differently from people, but I often find myself playing the initiator (most accessible snare in the game, while being able to do it and escape), and his very spammable nukes along with their utility (silence + aoe snare) are quite handy. He transitions very smoothly from lane control (if able) hero to ganker and nuker to a spectacular support/nuker, and as the game goes on (particularly against siege teams, or if my team has no tank) I just build him as tankassadin and roll with that.
Obviously upgrading his W would be handy, but I have a hard time seeing myself taking the W anyways (because his two nukes are invaluable), and I fear getting a stronger W would make him liable to having his nuking power nerfed. He's "fine" as is, IMO. His innate passive is also quite nice. Yeah, the AS doesn't matter, but 15% reduction from abilities is INCREDIBLY useful, if not borderline OP. If they were to take out the AS buff I wouldn't care, because the survivability from abilities is fabulous. It's not like most heroes will be able to land multiple autoattacks on you anyways (short of Trist).
I also am fine with playing lane very passively. I don't need money, I just need to survive, and level. If I'm denied exp so be it, although it's usually pretty hard denying Kassadin exp (cuz he's got quite a bite). Again, I'm puzzled at people saying you need money and kills with Kassadin. He's very much not a snowball champion, but he's a champion that can gib you and then keep taking advantage of weaknesses. And in teamfights, you just build him tanky as the game goes on (I routinely do stuff like make HoG and Aegis) and play him as a pincering tank (teleport to the other side of their team and force their carry to point in the wrong direction, especially useful against Twitch who has to make a decision of whether to turn and hit you or just eat your damage).
By the way I'm playing with high-elo people, or at least people perceived to have high elo, so I'm pretty comfortable saying that, at least with low-queue (single, double or triple) he's more than fine.
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Thank you for the Morgana tips. I'm only lvl7 right now, so no Ignite, but I'll try it out whenever it unlocks. I tried Ghost one time and I probably just didn't use it well but I felt like it was completely useless that game. But yeah that was probably bad use/expecting it to get me out of stuns or whatever.
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Still struggling to make anivia more useful than Annie. Ugh. I know the potential is there because she hits WAY harder than annie with her basic spells and her wall is uncleansable.
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Have you had experience with Anivia's wall not blocking off pathing like it seems like it should? When I used her there were a lot of times where I was like .. how did that not block, but yeah maybe it just takes a pixel to walk between it and a turret or somethinggg I don't even know.
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I usually place it so that it nudges a person in the direction I want (into my flash frost). It rarely blocks a path off completely, and for the most part it takes less than a second to walk around at all levels (except at chokepoints).
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On July 05 2010 19:00 Vei wrote:there is no tryhard, only dohard. + Show Spoiler +anyway, I'm new to LoL I have like 10 wins, I really like Morgana. Is AP Morgana viable for... competition? Any general tips with her? What items should I go? I generally like, buy uhh either an item headed towards a +AP staff and some mana pots or...that's pretty much what I do these days I think actually. Eventually I get the boots of +5movespeed when you're ooc. I basically just spam her AoE and try to farm mobs for a while (I get Smite+Teleport for mass gold and minimal time away from mobs), and I basically go WQWQWR (max out aoe before her nuke). Also can someone tell me like.. her AoE reduces magic resistance or something in stacks, if the person has 0 magic resistance to begin with, does it go negative and give some bonus when you cast her Q?
Lately, the way I have been playing Morgana is by combining tanking and ap items. I generally go: RoA, Boots, Mejaia's, Mercury Threads, Guardian Angel and either Zhonya's or Frozen Heart.
With a GA I can generally initiate a team fight with my ult and not lose my GA, since I am so tanky (my rune page mostly consists of magic res and armor). It works generally well, also I get flash and ignite because I realised that early game my opponents would always escape with but a few hp points left.
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On July 05 2010 20:11 Vei wrote:
Have you had experience with Anivia's wall not blocking off pathing like it seems like it should? When I used her there were a lot of times where I was like .. how did that not block, but yeah maybe it just takes a pixel to walk between it and a turret or somethinggg I don't even know.
If you cast it too close to a champion, they can squeeze past the wall. Otherwise, you can ghost right through it anyways.
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On July 05 2010 20:41 cosiant wrote:Show nested quote +On July 05 2010 19:00 Vei wrote:there is no tryhard, only dohard. + Show Spoiler +anyway, I'm new to LoL I have like 10 wins, I really like Morgana. Is AP Morgana viable for... competition? Any general tips with her? What items should I go? I generally like, buy uhh either an item headed towards a +AP staff and some mana pots or...that's pretty much what I do these days I think actually. Eventually I get the boots of +5movespeed when you're ooc. I basically just spam her AoE and try to farm mobs for a while (I get Smite+Teleport for mass gold and minimal time away from mobs), and I basically go WQWQWR (max out aoe before her nuke). Also can someone tell me like.. her AoE reduces magic resistance or something in stacks, if the person has 0 magic resistance to begin with, does it go negative and give some bonus when you cast her Q? Lately, the way I have been playing Morgana is by combining tanking and ap items. I generally go: RoA, Boots, Mejaia's, Mercury Threads, Guardian Angel and either Zhonya's or Frozen Heart. With a GA I can generally initiate a team fight with my ult and not lose my GA, since I am so tanky (my rune page mostly consists of magic res and armor). It works generally well, also I get flash and ignite because I realised that early game my opponents would always escape with but a few hp points left.
banshee =>GAngel => GG
if(status != 'gg')
do Vring => ward =>ward
edit: actualy these day when i play caster, my 1st trip home will be boots, wards + potions. cant play without wards anymore, wards are just too imba and need to be nerf
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Is Chogoth worth buying? i really like him and all and im like 17-4 overall with him, but he's kinda..expensive
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On July 05 2010 21:15 arb wrote:
Is Chogoth worth buying? i really like him and all and im like 17-4 overall with him, but he's kinda..expensive
page 1, first post, free Cho's skin => free cho! IT IS FREE
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On July 05 2010 21:18 NB wrote:Show nested quote +On July 05 2010 21:15 arb wrote:
Is Chogoth worth buying? i really like him and all and im like 17-4 overall with him, but he's kinda..expensive page 1, first post, free Cho's skin => free cho! IT IS FREE
ha i thought that was just TL event stuff so i skipped to guides etc, very very nice
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I think anivia's even better than heimer at sieging towers. Take golem, place ult under their tower. Creeps don't even get past the stairs.
I'm really liking her ability to push, which is MUCH better than annie. This is pretty huge.
Current build is: faerie charm and 6 health potions (for mega-aggressive mid-play). Upgrade to tears and buy boots first trip back. Void staff, archangels, and banshee/GA/Zhonya yadayadayada.
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Some possible upcoming Veigar changes and stuff:
"
* Dark Matter AP coefficient increased to 1.0 from 0.8.
* Primordial Burst damage adjusted to 250/375/500 from 200/350/500.
* Both coefficients on Primordial Burst are likely to go up to 1.0.
The nerf to Dark Matter's AP coefficient was a mistake and impacted his gameplay in unintended ways outside of the simple damage loss.
Decreasing the damage dealt by Primordial Burst was intentional, although we may have gone too far. When we originally designed Veigar, we didn't have Deathfire's Grasp in the game and it's synergy on Veigar is remarkable. The new changes reflect a belief that it can make up for some of the damage lost to non-casters. And while some might question designing a character around a specific item, it's not terribly uncommon for other champions to depend on them as well (such as Innervating Locket on Udyr, or Rylai's on AP Katarina).
Regarding his passive, it feels really strong when combined with masteries and runes. If it seems weak, try testing it's interaction with those.
And lastly, I acknowledge it's a bit strange that you have to level up Baleful Strike to get the full AP bonus. That said, did it not feel a bit weird that killing someone with Dark Matter or killing someone with a lich bane auto-attack was somehow worse than killing someone with Baleful Strike or Primordial Burst? Maximizing the old implementation led to situations where your focus was not on enemy movement and survival. "
EDIT: Tryhard's a term I'd use to describe something extremely boring and extremely effective, like in DotA in 6.64 it was really tryhard to pick 3 carries, farm for 50 minutes, then win.
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my view of tryhard team is to get everybody to play their mains...
i think mastery of character > imbaness of character.
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EPT
