• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 03:13
CEST 09:13
KST 16:13
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
ByuL, and the Limitations of Standard Play1Team Liquid Map Contest #22: Results and Winners7Code S Season 2 (2026): RO4 and Finals Preview12TL.net Map Contest #22 - Voting & Ladder Map Selection7Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO8 Preview8
Community News
[TLMC] Summer 2026 Ladder Map Rotation05.0.16 patch for SC2 goes live (8 worker start)76ZeroSpace at Steam NextFest - Last free demo34Weekly Cups (June 8-14): Clem and Solar double, PTR tested0RSL: S6 Finals played at BlizzCon 202611
StarCraft 2
General
Is the larve respawn broken? 5.0.16 patch for SC2 goes live (8 worker start) Daily SC2 Player Grid - feedback wanted The Death of Cheese: From a Professional Cheeser Mizenhauer's Douyu Cup Preview
Tourneys
Maestros of The Game 2 announcement and schedule ! Douyu Cup 2026: $20,000 Legends Event (June 26-28) RSL Revival: Season 6 - Qualifiers and Main Event INu's Battles#17 <BO.9> Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
New Map Maker - Looking for Advice - Love or Hate Work In Progress Melee Maps [D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 531 Experimental Artillery Mutation # 530 One For All Mutation # 529 Opportunities Unleashed
Brood War
General
ASL 22 Proposed Map Pool Best thing happen to StarCraft since Remastered? Fact based Zerg Upgrade Tier List BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Quality of life changes in BW that you will like ?
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL21] Grand Finals The Casual Games of the Week Thread [BSL22] GosuLeague Casts - Tue & Thu 22:00 CEST
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Creating a full chart of Zerg builds Relatively freeroll strategies Why doesn't anyone use restoration?
Other Games
General Games
ZeroSpace at Steam NextFest - Last free demo Nintendo Switch Thread Path of Exile Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Beyond All Reason
Dota 2
Looking for a Dota Mentor Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread The Games Industry And ATVI Canadian Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread
Fan Clubs
The HerO Fan Club! The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! Series you have seen recently... [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books [TV/BOOK] *SPOILERS* Game of Thrones Discussion
Sports
McBoner: A hockey love story 2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Cricket [SPORT]
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread Facing Challenges in Mobile App Development
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Listen To The Coaches!
TrAiDoS
An Exploration of th…
waywardstrategy
I'm an arrogant trash talke…
FlaShFTW
Gauntlet SC2: A Retrospectiv…
Ctone23
ramps on octagon
StaticNine
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 11674 users

Map of the Swarm - Page 5

Forum Index > Final Edits
Post a Reply
Prev 1 2 3 4 5 6 Next All
whatusername
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
Canada1181 Posts
May 16 2009 14:49 GMT
#81
I find it really ironic how in that poll everoyne thought it was going to be the most exciting map of PL
im gay
Mista_Masta
Profile Joined January 2009
Netherlands557 Posts
May 16 2009 19:40 GMT
#82
Very nice write-up. I'm really hoping for improvements to the balance of Battle Royal, since the concept of the map is great =)
ero
Profile Joined April 2009
United States66 Posts
May 17 2009 02:04 GMT
#83
Thanks for the excellent write-up.

So if the air-to-air overlord distance on BR is about 1:30 what is it on a more standard map like Destination?
konadora *
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
Singapore66363 Posts
May 17 2009 03:01 GMT
#84
On May 17 2009 11:04 ero wrote:
Thanks for the excellent write-up.

So if the air-to-air overlord distance on BR is about 1:30 what is it on a more standard map like Destination?

I'm guessing around 2:30, haven't tested it.
POGGERS
writer22816
Profile Blog Joined September 2008
United States5775 Posts
May 17 2009 03:55 GMT
#85
Great article but I found a minor typo under the BaBy vs ZerO game

On May 14 2009 08:51 konadora wrote:
As for Baby, despite ZerO being so prepared with hydralisks, spore colonies and overlords stationed everywhere, he had no choice but to continue producing wraiths, for it was too much waste of resources to start switching tech, and switching tech at that point of time would mean vulnerability to mutalisks. In the end, Baby finally switches to bionic, but by that point of time, it was already too late, for RorO had already gotten lurkers and a critical mass of mutalisks.

8/4/12 never forget, never forgive.
littlechava
Profile Blog Joined March 2004
United States7221 Posts
May 17 2009 04:26 GMT
#86
+ Show Spoiler +
Light nets the first non Zerg win! ZerO must feel silly
Entusman #12
konadora *
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
Singapore66363 Posts
May 17 2009 04:36 GMT
#87
On May 17 2009 13:26 littlechava wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
Light nets the first non Zerg win! ZerO must feel silly

+ Show Spoiler +
I'm so writing a follow-up article.
POGGERS
GHOSTCLAW
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
United States17042 Posts
May 17 2009 19:00 GMT
#88
On May 16 2009 14:31 littlechava wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 15 2009 10:29 GHOSTCLAW wrote:
On May 15 2009 08:14 RoieTRS wrote:
On May 15 2009 07:38 konadora wrote:
On May 15 2009 05:24 GHOSTCLAW wrote:
On May 15 2009 03:10 Elyvilon wrote:
On May 15 2009 01:37 GHOSTCLAW wrote:
nice read. Good analysis as well. I really hope that they replace the map before the end of this season...ZvZ's are getting tiring (as is watching jd and lux win every single game on the map -_-


Fun fact: Lux has not won a game on this map.

Amazing article Konadora, thanks! That said, I don't think that we'll see a non-zerg victory on this map. I don't think there's some amazing strategy that just hasn't been seen yet, though I really hope so, since Battle Royal has some really cool concepts.


oh really? -_-;; Sorry. I kind of assumed that he had because his zvz is pretty good. Now that I think about it more, I guess yarnc has been winning on that map iirc.

Lol still confused with the twins huh...

I actually do that too sometimes. Just because everyone says their twins, it makes a weird connection between them.


One of them should play a different race. They look similar as well. It's tough sometimes if you can't read the names, or the team names on the top. >.> Then you just end up guessing, especially in mirrors (although if you watch enough games, you can start learning korean names! there's only...26 characters...I think...)

and just if anyone wants to answer it >.> Why isn't this map P>Z>T>P balanced? I've asked it in every thread that's been made about battle royal, and haven't gotten a good answer yet...To reiterate the arguments that I've made in the previous 2 threads on the subject, I would think that you could get the easy two bases like on gods garden, and then your third is even further away zerg. It's an open map once you break out, but P gets to stay on 2 bases for basically the whole game, and the fact that the other bases are open should make a timing attack pretty viable (and make getting the third for P tough as well, but I don't think that the games would last that long). I also think that a 9/9 proxy in the middle would allow protoss to get the initiative, and if it dosen't do damage then protoss can take out the zerg assims, and leave the middle as a possible (although kind of dumb imo) double gas third.

I may be missing something here, but when I first really looked at the map I figured it'd be an impossible PvZ map simply because FE would be so vulnerable to lings, and 2 gate would be easily defended by zerg. If toss puts cannons at their small choke and kills the assims, zerg can get a decent sized speedling army early and crack the neutral buildings before the p can afford to lay down cannons to defend their nat+main. If you choose to try cannoning farther back the lings are free to harass either your nat or your main - whichever is least defended. If you 2 gate near your assims you can't really apply pressure with early zeals since it's so easy for zerg to kill their own assims. If you 1 gate tech you can probably defend your small choke early game, but zerg will scout everything you do, and respond accordingly. I just don't see how P has a chance without some ridiculous build like the one in Tempest vs RorO.


Since all of them are options, I would think that P would still have a chance. Zerg needs to 9 pool or overpool because of the risk of the 2 gate, which means that if you one gate tech and expand after your first sair (basically reacting accordingly to what zerg does with your first sair scout) you can deny the overlord scouting, take away that particular zerg advantage, and play a normalish pvz from there.
PhotographerLiquipedia. Drop me a pm if you've got questions/need help.
littlechava
Profile Blog Joined March 2004
United States7221 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-05-17 19:44:46
May 17 2009 19:43 GMT
#89
On May 18 2009 04:00 GHOSTCLAW wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 16 2009 14:31 littlechava wrote:
On May 15 2009 10:29 GHOSTCLAW wrote:
On May 15 2009 08:14 RoieTRS wrote:
On May 15 2009 07:38 konadora wrote:
On May 15 2009 05:24 GHOSTCLAW wrote:
On May 15 2009 03:10 Elyvilon wrote:
On May 15 2009 01:37 GHOSTCLAW wrote:
nice read. Good analysis as well. I really hope that they replace the map before the end of this season...ZvZ's are getting tiring (as is watching jd and lux win every single game on the map -_-


Fun fact: Lux has not won a game on this map.

Amazing article Konadora, thanks! That said, I don't think that we'll see a non-zerg victory on this map. I don't think there's some amazing strategy that just hasn't been seen yet, though I really hope so, since Battle Royal has some really cool concepts.


oh really? -_-;; Sorry. I kind of assumed that he had because his zvz is pretty good. Now that I think about it more, I guess yarnc has been winning on that map iirc.

Lol still confused with the twins huh...

I actually do that too sometimes. Just because everyone says their twins, it makes a weird connection between them.


One of them should play a different race. They look similar as well. It's tough sometimes if you can't read the names, or the team names on the top. >.> Then you just end up guessing, especially in mirrors (although if you watch enough games, you can start learning korean names! there's only...26 characters...I think...)

and just if anyone wants to answer it >.> Why isn't this map P>Z>T>P balanced? I've asked it in every thread that's been made about battle royal, and haven't gotten a good answer yet...To reiterate the arguments that I've made in the previous 2 threads on the subject, I would think that you could get the easy two bases like on gods garden, and then your third is even further away zerg. It's an open map once you break out, but P gets to stay on 2 bases for basically the whole game, and the fact that the other bases are open should make a timing attack pretty viable (and make getting the third for P tough as well, but I don't think that the games would last that long). I also think that a 9/9 proxy in the middle would allow protoss to get the initiative, and if it dosen't do damage then protoss can take out the zerg assims, and leave the middle as a possible (although kind of dumb imo) double gas third.

I may be missing something here, but when I first really looked at the map I figured it'd be an impossible PvZ map simply because FE would be so vulnerable to lings, and 2 gate would be easily defended by zerg. If toss puts cannons at their small choke and kills the assims, zerg can get a decent sized speedling army early and crack the neutral buildings before the p can afford to lay down cannons to defend their nat+main. If you choose to try cannoning farther back the lings are free to harass either your nat or your main - whichever is least defended. If you 2 gate near your assims you can't really apply pressure with early zeals since it's so easy for zerg to kill their own assims. If you 1 gate tech you can probably defend your small choke early game, but zerg will scout everything you do, and respond accordingly. I just don't see how P has a chance without some ridiculous build like the one in Tempest vs RorO.


Since all of them are options, I would think that P would still have a chance. Zerg needs to 9 pool or overpool because of the risk of the 2 gate, which means that if you one gate tech and expand after your first sair (basically reacting accordingly to what zerg does with your first sair scout) you can deny the overlord scouting, take away that particular zerg advantage, and play a normalish pvz from there.

There's a reason 1 gate tech isn't used as much anymore - it's because Zergs can defend it easily. Zerg will see the early sairs, so they won't kill many overlords, if any. Zerg can control the Protoss' assims, so the P won't be able to be aggressive early. I think the P would be starting the game at a disadvantage which will only get bigger as time goes on because the Z will have map control.
Entusman #12
mrlie3
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
Canada350 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-05-18 00:01:54
May 18 2009 00:00 GMT
#90
I think Light won the last game cuz Zero foolishly went for hydras when Light went for bionics....
Crimson @ Clan CORE | ESFI World Translator
ReketSomething
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
United States6012 Posts
May 18 2009 00:29 GMT
#91
I actually like Battle Royal...I guess I like small so... =/
Jaedong :3
alt.tday
Profile Joined April 2009
United States180 Posts
May 18 2009 02:04 GMT
#92
I wonder what would happen if Bisu were sent out on this map right now
♠Spades ♣Clubs ♥Hearts ♦Diamonds ★★★★★
Harem
Profile Joined November 2007
United States11393 Posts
May 18 2009 03:13 GMT
#93
On May 18 2009 11:04 alt.tday wrote:
I wonder what would happen if Bisu were sent out on this map right now

He'd baww as usual.
Moderator。◕‿◕。
indecision
Profile Blog Joined November 2004
Germany818 Posts
May 22 2009 22:42 GMT
#94
amazing article.
fast ball player
Profile Joined December 2008
206 Posts
May 23 2009 00:28 GMT
#95
one thing you didnt mention in the long list of FBH's mistakes against savior was horrible micro against sunks/mutas at the end with his golies. hes attacking sunks, mutas fly in, he stops attacking the sunks when theyre halfway dead to focus on mutas. sunks do 20 explosive and gols are heavy units. possibly the worst micro ive ever seen on a pro game. i think kingdom's zealots that got stuck actually were controlled better than those gols.
Live free or die
malathion
Profile Joined March 2009
United States362 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-05-24 17:07:19
May 24 2009 17:06 GMT
#96
On May 23 2009 09:28 fast ball player wrote:
one thing you didnt mention in the long list of FBH's mistakes against savior was horrible micro against sunks/mutas at the end with his golies. hes attacking sunks, mutas fly in, he stops attacking the sunks when theyre halfway dead to focus on mutas. sunks do 20 explosive and gols are heavy units. possibly the worst micro ive ever seen on a pro game. i think kingdom's zealots that got stuck actually were controlled better than those gols.

Game was over at that point no matter what FBH did.
tomatriedes
Profile Blog Joined January 2007
New Zealand5356 Posts
June 08 2009 01:28 GMT
#97
It's funny how geometry isn't mentioned:


Race Stats (non-mirrors):
TvZ: 12-3 (80%) [ Games ]
ZvP: 0-1 (0%) [ Games ]
PvT: 5-8 (38.5%) [ Games ]

Mirrors: 47 TvT | 4 ZvZ | 0 PvP

Is it OK for a map to be imbalanced as long as it favors terrans?
Avidkeystamper
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
United States8556 Posts
June 18 2009 04:30 GMT
#98
No, there are no such things as terran-favored maps, those are just "maps".
Jaedong
Ioannis
Profile Blog Joined February 2005
Greece62 Posts
June 18 2009 07:24 GMT
#99
terran = most imba race, there are many terran favored maps (Lost temple) and others,

and sorry to break it to you Battle Royal ZvT is 7-2
:)
FaTe)SoL
Profile Joined March 2009
Canada110 Posts
June 30 2009 23:38 GMT
#100
Hummm... Ghosts can fit through broken choke right? We might be seeing some boxer nuke rushes XD

Also: Lifting seems like a pretty viable way to negate the neutral buildings
The problem with America is stupidity. I'm not saying there should be a capital punishment for stupidity but, why don't we just take the safety labels off of everything and let the problem solve itself?
Prev 1 2 3 4 5 6 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Douyu Cup 2020
06:00
2026 - Day 4
Scarlett vs NeebLIVE!
TY vs Oliveira
Ryung 796
RotterdaM577
WardiTV524
IndyStarCraft 96
CranKy Ducklings89
CranKy Ducklings SOOP16
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Ryung 796
WinterStarcraft787
RotterdaM 577
ViBE177
IndyStarCraft 96
StarCraft: Brood War
Leta 168
Mong 97
Purpose 9
NotJumperer 6
Dota 2
NeuroSwarm135
League of Legends
JimRising 696
Counter-Strike
m0e_tv592
Super Smash Bros
Mew2King132
Other Games
summit1g10072
Happy302
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick1096
BasetradeTV233
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 11 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Jankos1672
Upcoming Events
BSL22 NKC (BSL vs China)
6h 47m
Mihu vs TBD
Online Event
7h 47m
RSL Revival
18h 47m
WardiTV Weekly
1d 3h
RSL Revival
2 days
RSL Revival
2 days
Bombastic Starleague
2 days
Kung Fu Cup
3 days
OSC
3 days
CrankTV Team League
4 days
[ Show More ]
Bombastic Starleague
4 days
Replay Cast
4 days
The PondCast
5 days
HomeStory Cup
5 days
Replay Cast
5 days
HomeStory Cup
6 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

CSL Season 21: Qualifier 1
Maestros of the Game 2
Heroes Pulsing #2

Ongoing

IPSL Spring 2026
Acropolis #4
CSCL: Masked Kings S4
YSL S3
BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSL Season 21: Qualifier 2
SCTL 2026 Spring
Douyu Cup 2026
Murky Cup 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
IEM Rio 2026

Upcoming

CSL 2026 Summer (S21)
ASL Season 22:Wild Card Qualifier
CSLAN 4
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Revival: Season 6
CranK Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
HSC XXIX
BCC 2026
Light Tournament 2026
Eternal Conflict S2 Finale
Eternal Conflict S2 E1
Heroes Pulsing #3
FISSURE Playground #5
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.