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Personal attacks in this thread will draw a temp ban. |
On May 29 2012 02:43 RUS RO DAH!!! wrote:
Seriously guys, at some point we have to stop with the excuses. The list of players Idra has "no shame" of losing to keeps getting longer and longer. Off the top of my head, according to his fans it's okay for Idra to lose to: Thorzain, Catz, Demuslim, Morrow, Dream, Select, Socke, Bigs, STX, Alicia, Hero..... I mean sure there are notable names, but if you get to the point where like 20 people, of which half are mediocre foreigners are expected to beat you then you've seriously moved down the totem pole. A year ago Idra was expected to lose to MVP, Nestea, MKP now Idra is expected to lose to Demuslim, Morrow, Thorzain. See the massive drop in expectation?
Ok so we should say, as fans of Idra, that Idra sucks and bash him for losing? I don't see a point to your post and I think your posting in the wrong place.
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On May 29 2012 03:17 takingbackoj wrote:Show nested quote +On May 29 2012 02:43 RUS RO DAH!!! wrote:
Seriously guys, at some point we have to stop with the excuses. The list of players Idra has "no shame" of losing to keeps getting longer and longer. Off the top of my head, according to his fans it's okay for Idra to lose to: Thorzain, Catz, Demuslim, Morrow, Dream, Select, Socke, Bigs, STX, Alicia, Hero..... I mean sure there are notable names, but if you get to the point where like 20 people, of which half are mediocre foreigners are expected to beat you then you've seriously moved down the totem pole. A year ago Idra was expected to lose to MVP, Nestea, MKP now Idra is expected to lose to Demuslim, Morrow, Thorzain. See the massive drop in expectation? Ok so we should say, as fans of Idra, that Idra sucks and bash him for losing? I don't see a point to your post and I think your posting in the wrong place.
You could be realistic and still show support. You could for example say "OMG Idra's been playing so terribly, but hopefully he'll do better in the future." Thats better than blaming the map, lag, tournament, cheese, he doesn't care, opponent whenever he loses. It's like some Idra fans go through all this mental gymnastic to avoid the simple fact that Idra isn't good anymore. He used to be, but not anymore. And maybe he'll be back to his old form or maybe he won't. Those are realities that mentally healthy fans should accept.
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On May 29 2012 03:59 RUS RO DAH!!! wrote:Show nested quote +On May 29 2012 03:17 takingbackoj wrote:On May 29 2012 02:43 RUS RO DAH!!! wrote:
Seriously guys, at some point we have to stop with the excuses. The list of players Idra has "no shame" of losing to keeps getting longer and longer. Off the top of my head, according to his fans it's okay for Idra to lose to: Thorzain, Catz, Demuslim, Morrow, Dream, Select, Socke, Bigs, STX, Alicia, Hero..... I mean sure there are notable names, but if you get to the point where like 20 people, of which half are mediocre foreigners are expected to beat you then you've seriously moved down the totem pole. A year ago Idra was expected to lose to MVP, Nestea, MKP now Idra is expected to lose to Demuslim, Morrow, Thorzain. See the massive drop in expectation? Ok so we should say, as fans of Idra, that Idra sucks and bash him for losing? I don't see a point to your post and I think your posting in the wrong place. You could be realistic and still show support. You could for example say "OMG Idra's been playing so terribly, but hopefully he'll do better in the future." Thats better than blaming the map, lag, tournament, cheese, he doesn't care, opponent whenever he loses. It's like some Idra fans go through all this mental gymnastic to avoid the simple fact that Idra isn't good anymore. He used to be, but not anymore. And maybe he'll be back to his old form or maybe he won't. Those are realities that mentally healthy fans should accept.
Just to answer your first post; no one is saying it is OK to lose to the players you listed, most are saying that there's no SHAME in losing to most of them, which is a different thing. Of course it's not ok to lose and none are even saying that afaik. It was not even expected to lose to Catz, STX, Bigs or Select, so I dunno why you mention those. I don't see your problem with all this...
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On May 29 2012 04:03 Aocowns wrote:Show nested quote +On May 29 2012 03:59 RUS RO DAH!!! wrote:On May 29 2012 03:17 takingbackoj wrote:On May 29 2012 02:43 RUS RO DAH!!! wrote:
Seriously guys, at some point we have to stop with the excuses. The list of players Idra has "no shame" of losing to keeps getting longer and longer. Off the top of my head, according to his fans it's okay for Idra to lose to: Thorzain, Catz, Demuslim, Morrow, Dream, Select, Socke, Bigs, STX, Alicia, Hero..... I mean sure there are notable names, but if you get to the point where like 20 people, of which half are mediocre foreigners are expected to beat you then you've seriously moved down the totem pole. A year ago Idra was expected to lose to MVP, Nestea, MKP now Idra is expected to lose to Demuslim, Morrow, Thorzain. See the massive drop in expectation? Ok so we should say, as fans of Idra, that Idra sucks and bash him for losing? I don't see a point to your post and I think your posting in the wrong place. You could be realistic and still show support. You could for example say "OMG Idra's been playing so terribly, but hopefully he'll do better in the future." Thats better than blaming the map, lag, tournament, cheese, he doesn't care, opponent whenever he loses. It's like some Idra fans go through all this mental gymnastic to avoid the simple fact that Idra isn't good anymore. He used to be, but not anymore. And maybe he'll be back to his old form or maybe he won't. Those are realities that mentally healthy fans should accept. Just to answer your first post; no one is saying it is OK to lose to the players you listed, most are saying that there's no SHAME in losing to most of them, which is a different thing. Of course it's not ok to lose and none are even saying that afaik. It was not even expected to lose to Catz, STX, Bigs or Select, so I dunno why you mention those. I don't see your problem with all this...
OK, if that's the case then I misread or misunderstood. Sorry.
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what were the games with catz like? were they down to lucky zvz or idra just got outplayed?
idra is really slumping hard now even worse than last year  (((((
i hope anaheim is going to be his breakout tournament
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On May 29 2012 04:31 AgentChaos wrote:what were the games with catz like? were they down to lucky zvz or idra just got outplayed? idra is really slumping hard now even worse than last year ((((( i hope anaheim is going to be his breakout tournament
first game idra got pretty far ahead early on, but decided to go ling infestor and tech to hive and catz killed him with roaches.
second game idra went hatch first and lost to a 9 pool drone all in
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On May 29 2012 04:31 AgentChaos wrote:what were the games with catz like? were they down to lucky zvz or idra just got outplayed? idra is really slumping hard now even worse than last year ((((( i hope anaheim is going to be his breakout tournament
Fist game Idra went ling infestor after a lead in the early game, and then he decided to get an ultra cavern at the 12:40 min mark or so, so Catz just killed him. It was an absolute garbage game, and I refuse to think Idra took it seriously. Second game was 15 hatch vs 10 pool so build order win.
Anaheim will not be his break out tournament. He will not turn around so abruptly in a matter of weeks, so I'd say hope he is back to full strength and drive by the end of summer
EDIT: Praying that I am wrong, of course
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Maybe he lost those games vs catz on purpose for the purpose of not attending NASL. He really needs a break or more practice to have a more stable mindset.
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On May 29 2012 06:51 Ricemarine wrote:
Maybe he lost those games vs catz on purpose for the purpose of not attending NASL. He really needs a break or more practice to have a more stable mindset.
Don't know if he would forfeit as he loves the competition, but I agree that he is attending too many events and might be trying to trim down the amount he is attending. I guess that's why he hasn't been announced for DH Summer yet. :/
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On May 29 2012 06:51 Ricemarine wrote:
Maybe he lost those games vs catz on purpose for the purpose of not attending NASL. He really needs a break or more practice to have a more stable mindset.
Yeah, clearly after going 3-19 for May he decided to lose a couple more games rather than just forfeit or similar, and make it 3-21.
Because the 18 game losing streak wasn't bad enough, he decided to throw games against Catz.
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On May 29 2012 06:51 Ricemarine wrote:
Maybe he lost those games vs catz on purpose for the purpose of not attending NASL. He really needs a break or more practice to have a more stable mindset.
Really man, are you that delusional?
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Why is IdrA so set on ling infestor? I personally never play that style as in ZvZ ling/bane into a few mutas for harass and then a transition into roach/infestor seems pretty safe, and in ZvT I still have a 65+% w/l using ling/bane/muta. Though it does seems like against better players you really cannot engage a terran without infestors because just stimming the marines and running them back while the tanks decimate the banes pretty much nullifies any ling/bane/muta defense.
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I've always wondered this and I might as well ask now:
What is preventing Idra from literally copying a player who is currently successful (i.e. Stephano zvp) and trying to learn their build/style?
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On May 29 2012 07:19 bennyboy9201 wrote:
I've always wondered this and I might as well ask now:
What is preventing Idra from literally copying a player who is currently successful (i.e. Stephano zvp) and trying to learn their build/style?
He doesn't have experience of every twist and turn and small reaction that someone like Stephano who has used their build litterally almost everygame theyve played zvp does. Its not all about folowing a 20 step build order.
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On May 29 2012 07:19 bennyboy9201 wrote:
I've always wondered this and I might as well ask now:
What is preventing Idra from literally copying a player who is currently successful (i.e. Stephano zvp) and trying to learn their build/style?
He does copy Stephano ZvT style and sometimes does the mass roaches in ZvP but at his level being successful with that style is more than just hitting the R button.
IdrA doesn't get to be as safe as Stephano in the early game and his decision making when it actually come to the fight at the protoss third is not as good. Just like pretty much every other zerg.
He is currently trying to find a style he is comfortable playing, meanly the ling-bling style that Dimaga uses.
Zerg is the worst race to "copy" someone since what you make is mostly dependent of what your opponent is doing (except of course the few early game all-in which timing you can learn to a tee).
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I really think Idra should switch races. Go Protoss, the race where you dictate the action and rely heavily on builds/timings! Seems perfect instead of reacting (poorly) to situations you're forced into as zerg.
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On May 29 2012 07:35 Gentso wrote:
I really think Idra should switch races. Go Protoss, the race where you dictate the action and rely heavily on builds/timings! Seems perfect instead of reacting (poorly) to situations you're forced into as zerg.
Idra has been a top dog with Zerg in different meta games, and just because he's having a hard time again does not mean all hope is out. People should realize that. Remember the early seasons of GSL? He was top3 Zerg in the world, then he fell off almost as hard as now, and at that point he didn't even have that much reason to, tbh. He came back and won ASUS ROG and IEM Guangzhou, and killed it at Orlando. Now he's having a tough time, he doesn't like the metagame, and he's just not feeling the competition. Just wait, the metagame will change, and he will change and someday something is gonna click, and he's back in the game. Wait and see
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On May 29 2012 07:30 Diavlo wrote:Show nested quote +On May 29 2012 07:19 bennyboy9201 wrote:
I've always wondered this and I might as well ask now:
What is preventing Idra from literally copying a player who is currently successful (i.e. Stephano zvp) and trying to learn their build/style? He does copy Stephano ZvT style and sometimes does the mass roaches in ZvP but at his level being successful with that style is more than just hitting the R button. IdrA doesn't get to be as safe as Stephano in the early game and his decision making when it actually come to the fight at the protoss third is not as good. Just like pretty much every other zerg. He is currently trying to find a style he is comfortable playing, meanly the ling-bling style that Dimaga uses. Zerg is the worst race to "copy" someone since what you make is mostly dependent of what your opponent is doing (except of course the few early game all-in which timing you can learn to a tee).
This is well said. He's also stated that he doesn't entirely like the way other zergs are playing, and he's trying to figure out something that works for him. His lower success rate while using styles that are supposed to work in the current meta-game isn't so much about IdrA being incompetent (he still has some of the best mechanics of any player out there), but rather that he is trying to make small variations that feel right to him. Right now, it's obviously not working. His results are certainly lacking. He'll eventually figure out something that works. I'm sure of it.
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On May 29 2012 07:35 Gentso wrote:
I really think Idra should switch races. Go Protoss, the race where you dictate the action and rely heavily on builds/timings! Seems perfect instead of reacting (poorly) to situations you're forced into as zerg.
IdrA would probably be a pretty bad zerg. His strength is macro, not control and trickery.
But i do think he would make a good terran, in the style of Bomber, little micro but monster macro.
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i think we have long established that "artosis is an asshole" but as IdrA said a race switch isnt feasible because even these super tip top bw pros are taking multiple months to become even half decent at sc2, and he who usually isnt the most adaptible will take more time
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EPT
