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On February 22 2018 18:04 abuse wrote: It's storytelling. Why would you inform the viewer of it at a random time, thus lessening the impact of the scene? With your stance it honestly would be an asspull no matter when it would be mentioned. It's just absurd. Gleam eyes was not a big part of the story. Dual wielding was. Gleam eyes was a reason to show dual wielding to the user, not the other way around where dual wielding was used to find a way to kill Gleam eyes.
since when is no foreshadowing = retarded?
Any show or story that has a large focus on fights between characters absolutely needs to establish what is possible in that world and what isn't. The rules need to be clear to the viewer. If any character can, at any time, break the rules to their advantage without warning, it breaks any tension and immersion.
That is objectively bad storytelling.
It makes it obvious that the writers can change whatever they feel like it whenever they feel like it. If you want to change the rules halfway through, you need to give some form of explanation, exposition or any other kind of story element that informs the viewer ahead of time what has changed and possibly why. The latter is vital in understanding what other changes in the future can be expected.
You wouldn't inform the viewer at a random time either. There is a difference between giving information to the viewer ahead of time and informing the viewer at random and I feel a bit silly to have to point this out. The only impact a scene like that would have on me is to turn me away from the show straight away as it shows me what I can expect going forward... and I really don't like bad storytelling.
On February 22 2018 18:04 abuse wrote: Jesus.. If these are your standards then you should go and write novels and bring in all the awards for yourself, I wouldn't read your stuff though.
Now this is just petty nonsense. If he were to write an entertaining and objectively well-told novel, why wouldn't you read it? Just because he argued against you on an internet forum? Come on...
no rules were broken though. It's just that at that point the viewer was informed that unique skills exist, and it was expanded upon later. The fact that people see it as rules being broken just means that they do not understand the mechanics of SAO and that's all it is.
In that case the show did a poor job at explaining what the rules are. "The rules weren't broken, you just didn't know what the real rules are up until this point" is no better.
Seriously, does "tell the viewer absolutely everything about the world, and the system and everything at the start of the novel" considered a prerequisite for not being a shit novel? I don't understand you people.
I'm not saying SAO is great, but the novel was not shit or at the very least not as shit as people here paint it. If you want an actual flaw in the story then use the heathcliff x kirito revival doublekill scenario, which was way more deserving of critique than the gleam eyes/unique skills moment.
On February 22 2018 19:04 abuse wrote: Seriously, does "tell the viewer absolutely everything about the world, and the system and everything at the start of the novel" considered a prerequisite for not being a shit novel? I don't understand you people.
I'm not saying SAO is great, but the novel was not shit or at the very least not as shit as people here paint it. If you want an actual flaw in the story then use the heathcliff x kirito revival doublekill scenario, which was way more deserving of critique than the gleam eyes/unique skills moment.
I'm doing what I said should stop by engaging sigh. I'm a hypocrite lol
Generally want to seed information. This doesn't have to be in obvious ways. I'm not sure how much other fiction anyone reads here. Brandon Sanderson is pretty good and creating worlds with magical systems. His books may not be the greatest but they generally all follow their own internal logic. When discrepancies form this creates an interesting dynamic for the reader as they know that said discrepancy should be intentional so there must be some kind of information it relates to. Which makes it a puzzle the reader can try figure out why the discrepancy in internal logic is happening. Steven Erikson is another great fantasy author that seeds a lot of information throughout his stories that you don't really pick up on until you read it a second time.
SAO falls more in line with stories like Naruto, Bleach, OP etc. Stories that have some form of internal logic but at the same time are fine with abandoning that for cool moments. It's not unknown for stories to do this and I think ultimately fine. It's just targeting different people.
My qualms with the story are far more character focused. I do have issues with the world but that's largely because I expected a sci-fi story about people in a computer game world. Instead of the story being more in line with "transported to fantasy land". It's fine. Nothing wrong with it. Merely issue of perception. Now that I think about it my issues with SAO are eerily similar to my issues with Index. Since I enjoy Railgun so much maybe a SAO spinoff would in fact appeal to me. I ranted enough about Index that it's beyond beating a dead horse at this point so I'll leave it.
On February 22 2018 19:04 abuse wrote: Seriously, does "tell the viewer absolutely everything about the world, and the system and everything at the start of the novel" considered a prerequisite for not being a shit novel? I don't understand you people.
You don't "understand us people" because you are jumping from one extreme to the other. There is a life outside of hyperboles, you know.
There is a middle ground between not explaining the rules at all (or breaking them) and giving a wall of exposition at the beginning of every novel, show or movie. A lot of good writers managed to find it.
But you've made it blatantly obvious that you are indeed taking it personal and are not interested in having an honest conversation at this point. So I guess Numy made the most sensible suggestion after all...
how am I being the one who is jumping from extremes? I am literally just asking back the things that some people previously have stated. In this case no mention of unique skills -> asspull -> deus ex machina. and your very own post about rules not being known beforehand.
On February 22 2018 20:06 Nezgar wrote: There is a middle ground between not explaining the rules at all (or breaking them) and giving a wall of exposition at the beginning of every novel, show or movie. A lot of good writers managed to find it.
Again - no rules were broken, and plenty of rules were explained. Don't blame me for shortcomings that you people see yourselves, while I'm arguing the exact opposite. Are you saying SAO has not explained any rules at all about the world or anything? Cause honestly that's what it sounds like to me from people arguing your side of the story. And that's not me who's jumping to extremes. I am the one who's saying that the middle ground is good enough here.
On February 22 2018 20:06 Nezgar wrote: But you've made it blatantly obvious that you are indeed taking it personal and are not interested in having an honest conversation at this point. So I guess Numy made the most sensible suggestion after all...
lol, don't patronize me. I am having an honest conversation at this point you can see it as you want, but don't make assumptions about me and what I take or not take personal or anything of the sort. People not agreeing with your point of view does not equal not having "an honest conversation"
On February 22 2018 19:04 abuse wrote: Seriously, does "tell the viewer absolutely everything about the world, and the system and everything at the start of the novel" considered a prerequisite for not being a shit novel? I don't understand you people.
I'm not saying SAO is great, but the novel was not shit or at the very least not as shit as people here paint it. If you want an actual flaw in the story then use the heathcliff x kirito revival doublekill scenario, which was way more deserving of critique than the gleam eyes/unique skills moment.
I'm doing what I said should stop by engaging sigh. I'm a hypocrite lol
Generally want to seed information. This doesn't have to be in obvious ways. I'm not sure how much other fiction anyone reads here. Brandon Sanderson is pretty good and creating worlds with magical systems. His books may not be the greatest but they generally all follow their own internal logic. When discrepancies form this creates an interesting dynamic for the reader as they know that said discrepancy should be intentional so there must be some kind of information it relates to. Which makes it a puzzle the reader can try figure out why the discrepancy in internal logic is happening. Steven Erikson is another great fantasy author that seeds a lot of information throughout his stories that you don't really pick up on until you read it a second time.
SAO falls more in line with stories like Naruto, Bleach, OP etc. Stories that have some form of internal logic but at the same time are fine with abandoning that for cool moments. It's not unknown for stories to do this and I think ultimately fine. It's just targeting different people.
My qualms with the story are far more character focused. I do have issues with the world but that's largely because I expected a sci-fi story about people in a computer game world. Instead of the story being more in line with "transported to fantasy land". It's fine. Nothing wrong with it. Merely issue of perception. Now that I think about it my issues with SAO are eerily similar to my issues with Index. Since I enjoy Railgun so much maybe a SAO spinoff would in fact appeal to me. I ranted enough about Index that it's beyond beating a dead horse at this point so I'll leave it.
Yo, don't group One Piece in there with those other things. One Piece is the king of foreshadowing. They'll mention or show something at one point, and then like 300 chapters later said thing will come back up as relevant, and it isn't even silly retroactive foreshadowing like what some shows do!
On February 22 2018 20:14 abuse wrote: how am I being the one who is jumping from extremes? I am literally just asking back the things that some people previously have stated. In this case no mention of unique skills -> asspull -> deus ex machina. and your very own post about rules not being known beforehand.
On February 22 2018 20:06 Nezgar wrote: There is a middle ground between not explaining the rules at all (or breaking them) and giving a wall of exposition at the beginning of every novel, show or movie. A lot of good writers managed to find it.
Again - no rules were broken, and plenty of rules were explained. Don't blame me for shortcomings that you people see yourselves, while I'm arguing the exact opposite. Are you saying SAO has not explained any rules at all about the world or anything? Cause honestly that's what it sounds like to me from people arguing your side of the story. And that's not me who's jumping to extremes. I am the one who's saying that the middle ground is good enough here.
On February 22 2018 20:06 Nezgar wrote: But you've made it blatantly obvious that you are indeed taking it personal and are not interested in having an honest conversation at this point. So I guess Numy made the most sensible suggestion after all...
lol, don't patronize me. I am having an honest conversation at this point you can see it as you want, but don't make assumptions about me and what I take or not take personal or anything of the sort. People not agreeing with your point of view does not equal not having "an honest conversation"
Dual Swords was literally never mentioned, hinted at, or even implied that it was possible. Its not on the viewer to assume that literally everything they don't know about a work of fiction to be possible. Part of establishing a setting and world-building is setting rules. And when you come out from literally nowhere and say "oh btw the Hero can also do X", and said thing is also extremely powerful, thats an asspull. Thats bad writing. Granted, its not as bad writing as Kirito running around ALO and dongerslapping everyone just because hes MMO Jesus, or Mother's Rosario crafting an entire story with a bunch of poorly constructed caricatures in an attempt to try and make the viewer sad, but its bad writing. The first arc of SAO does have a few good parts about it, but writing and world building most definitely is not one of them, and thats especially grievous when SAO starts out with a big long "world building" intro, trying to make Aincrad seem more well thought out and storied than it actually is.
As far as I remember, there were no proper rules presented to the reader about what weapons could be used, and no information about "classes" whatsoever. So why are you so shocked to see dual wielding being possible? Why no shock about Kain's group being the only ones with a Katana?
You're making it sound as if it was said time and time again that wielding 2 weapons is forbidden, and only sword+shield is possible in the world, so when it is revealed that this skill exists, you feel misled or something.
I'd understand the reaction if someone suddenly started being a cleric and healing people or becoming a wizard or something, but this.. not really, no.
Its more than when Dual Swords gets revealed, its a huge OP power that allows Kirito to start beating down floor bosses by himself. Volume 1 doesn't give any significance to Klein's katana stuff other than "hey this guy has a katana, thats neat". Its minor to the point that no one cares, as its practically cosmetic. Its way different than the apparent game-changer-power-up that is Dual Swords
On February 22 2018 19:40 Numy wrote: Now that I think about it my issues with SAO are eerily similar to my issues with Index. Since I enjoy Railgun so much maybe a SAO spinoff would in fact appeal to me. I ranted enough about Index that it's beyond beating a dead horse at this point so I'll leave it.
We all love Railgun, but there's no Railgun in SAO. Who would be the one to carry that show? Asuna? So we get to see the story from her pov instead of Kirito's? We had the aids-arc for that and I personally didn't even hate it. Didn't think it was much worse or better than the rest but everyone else apparently hates it so don't think that works.
Railgun is awesome because misaka is awesome and because they (almost completly) scrapped Touman. Mmmmh, maybe they could pull that off for the early stuff after all. You know, before Asuna became Kirito's waifu. Just follow her doing stuff without any aids involvement. I could watch that. But it wouldn't work for the later stuff once she got waifu'd imoimo
Not sure if anyone is watching Gakuen Babysitters but the latest episode had me laughing with Kirin and Inomata. Probably one of the better airing anime this season.
On February 23 2018 00:31 Sentenal wrote: Its more than when Dual Swords gets revealed, its a huge OP power that allows Kirito to start beating down floor bosses by himself. Volume 1 doesn't give any significance to Klein's katana stuff other than "hey this guy has a katana, thats neat". Its minor to the point that no one cares, as its practically cosmetic. Its way different than the apparent game-changer-power-up that is Dual Swords
Pretty much. Nowhere in the anime (never read the LN) is there any revelation in regards to unique skills, more so for Kirito's dual wielding case. I mean, if the dual wielding just made him a bit stronger, sure, that'd be reasonable but the amount of power that it granted him is unreal. Add on the fact that there was never any mention of it made and it likes it came out of thin air.
9:00am The Ancient Magus' Bride 1:48pm ACCA: 13-Territory Inspection Dept. 6:37pm Miss Kobayashi's Dragon Maid 11:43pm KonoSuba: God's Blessing on This Wonderful World! Season 2 3:38am GAMERS! 8:27am Recovery of an MMO Junkie 12:22pm TSUKIGAKIREI 5:17pm Kemono Friends *All times PST and estimates
I read SOA, and enjoyed the anime and sinon ass online, but at least I recognise that the criticisims of SAO are legit. Dual sword is an asspull. Alfhiem is a poorly disguised mary sue story. Gun gale online is more of the same.
On February 23 2018 05:55 Grettin wrote: Twitch and Crunchyroll are doing anime marathon again. Geo-blocked though, so unless you're from US, you have to use VPN.
9:00am The Ancient Magus' Bride 1:48pm ACCA: 13-Territory Inspection Dept. 6:37pm Miss Kobayashi's Dragon Maid 11:43pm KonoSuba: God's Blessing on This Wonderful World! Season 2 3:38am GAMERS! 8:27am Recovery of an MMO Junkie 12:22pm TSUKIGAKIREI 5:17pm Kemono Friends *All times PST and estimates
DarlingXX had a beach episode today. We had some fanservice here and there but honestly, I'll have to say the normal episodes probably had more tits & ass than this episode. A bit of a letdown on that aspect.
And Ichigo keeps getting bullied, from ep1 the ship was dead and each and every episode they feel the need to hammer that down. No, she won't be getting what she wants. It's almost hilarious at this point: + Show Spoiler +
Toad - Today at 12:09 AM LOL this scene I'm at right now the burn "huh? This star? [called] Ichigo? It's the 15th star of the Orion constellation and supposedly so dark it's hard to see with the naked eye" or something along those lines riiiiiip NeoIllusions - Today at 12:11 AM God damn “No, MC does not notice you” Hue Toad - Today at 12:11 AM "I gues you really can't see it" as a follow up NeoIllusions - Today at 12:11 AM Just rolls over Toad - Today at 12:11 AM I have never seen a deader ship in my life forget marika in nisekoi and whatnot this is just brutal
I guess that explains why the 3D looked so good. They hired an actual 3D CGI company which works in that line of work professionally outside of anime and not an anime 3D CGI company who are all shit (besides orange). But some nice more in detail infos on who's behind what and while he doesn't really go much into detail about why the animation on those looks so damn amazing he's mentioning a couple things that I mentioned last time as well. Like the shots with the rotating cameras, the neverending galore of changing backgrounds and just in general stuff you don't see longer than for a couple frames until something else gets in the shot.
EPT
![[image loading]](https://i.imgur.com/yy08AWU.jpg)
