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Anime Discussion Thread - Page 1274

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If you come in here looking for "anime recommendations" then please refer to this chart before posting: Anime Recommendations (as of may 2014). We also have an IRC channel called #tladt where we all hang out. The channel is on Rizon, not QuakeNet! Feel free to check it out. TLADT discord is Discord.gg

For currently airing anime, please see Anichart.net
Blasterion
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
China10272 Posts
July 27 2011 17:55 GMT
#25461
On July 28 2011 02:48 Sentenal wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 28 2011 02:44 Blasterion wrote:
On July 28 2011 02:42 Sentenal wrote:
On July 28 2011 02:37 Blasterion wrote:
I don't think there is a Flying BETA so Marauder Hellion Siege Tank I think can kill BETA easy

Maybe vs Zerg, but you gotta remember the size of the BETA. Marauders? You saw the size comparison between humans and Grappler/Destroyer Classes, right? They would be almost completely useless. Hellions are like motor cycles with flame throwers. All they could do would be to burn the tips of BETA toes. Again, useless. Siege tanks would be able to take them down, but then how exactly do you defend the Siege Tanks? What happens if a Heavy Laser decides to out-range them? I really think ground tactics are the wrong way to go vs the BETA, unless you have like a ridiculous number of Thors, Tanks, and Protoss. And even then, it would probably only be a matter of time till they are overran.

Hellions can handle soldier class, but Marauders they can take down Thors, Ultralisk, Colossus with ease not a bad choice

>_> Because gameplay logic is completely valid. Not like gameplay is designed to try and be balanced, or anything. I guess if we are going with gameplay logic, either marines are the size of houses, or things like Battlecruisers are actually incredibly small. Oh yeah, and Protoss Carriers aren't that much bigger than a few Vikings, and can't even handle a few fights. Nah, fuck their logical, realistic strength in terms of the lore. 16 meter tall BETA would easily be stopped in their tracks from a single shot from a Marauder's shotgun.

But Marauder shots are not normal explosive. They are Graviton Explosions, They're pratically mini black holes. that's how concussive shells work. They create gravity wells that slow enemies down
[TLNY]Mahjong Club Thread
KazeHydra
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Japan2788 Posts
July 27 2011 17:58 GMT
#25462
An army of void rays, archons, and immortals may be able to win. Clearly, most of them are massive so void rays and immortals get bonus damage. Furthermore, with immortals' illogical hardened shields, they will only take 10 damage with every hit despite the huge size. They are also biological, so archons do bonus and splash damage. With good micro, archons and immortals will not die and regain their shields to maximum before returning to the battlefield. Another answer would be using many archon toilets on them. Zerg is all about numbers, so they don't really have any good units that would fight them well head on. In this case, it's more of a question of numbers but both are depicted as having an endless swarm of units. Infestors could neural parasite the fort class, or the biggest one around and use it to kill all its allies. Terran can stim and 1a MMM so that's probably the best answer. If all 3 races chose to work together, it's not implausible for them to win.
"Because I know this promise that won’t disappear will turn even a cause of tears into strength. You taught me that if I can believe, there is nothing that cannot come true." - Nana Mizuki (Yakusoku) 17:36 ils kaze got me into nana 17:36 ils by his blog
Sentenal
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
United States12398 Posts
July 27 2011 17:58 GMT
#25463
On July 28 2011 02:55 Blasterion wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 28 2011 02:48 Sentenal wrote:
On July 28 2011 02:44 Blasterion wrote:
On July 28 2011 02:42 Sentenal wrote:
On July 28 2011 02:37 Blasterion wrote:
I don't think there is a Flying BETA so Marauder Hellion Siege Tank I think can kill BETA easy

Maybe vs Zerg, but you gotta remember the size of the BETA. Marauders? You saw the size comparison between humans and Grappler/Destroyer Classes, right? They would be almost completely useless. Hellions are like motor cycles with flame throwers. All they could do would be to burn the tips of BETA toes. Again, useless. Siege tanks would be able to take them down, but then how exactly do you defend the Siege Tanks? What happens if a Heavy Laser decides to out-range them? I really think ground tactics are the wrong way to go vs the BETA, unless you have like a ridiculous number of Thors, Tanks, and Protoss. And even then, it would probably only be a matter of time till they are overran.

Hellions can handle soldier class, but Marauders they can take down Thors, Ultralisk, Colossus with ease not a bad choice

>_> Because gameplay logic is completely valid. Not like gameplay is designed to try and be balanced, or anything. I guess if we are going with gameplay logic, either marines are the size of houses, or things like Battlecruisers are actually incredibly small. Oh yeah, and Protoss Carriers aren't that much bigger than a few Vikings, and can't even handle a few fights. Nah, fuck their logical, realistic strength in terms of the lore. 16 meter tall BETA would easily be stopped in their tracks from a single shot from a Marauder's shotgun.

But Marauder shots are not normal explosive. They are Graviton Explosions, They're pratically mini black holes. that's how concussive shells work. They create gravity wells that slow enemies down

They create a gravity well that can slow a 16 meter beast running at 170km/h, with a shell that is probably only a few centimeters in length. Terran has the power to destroy the universe, they must be sandbagging when they get demolished constantly by smaller Zerg.
"Apparently, Sentenal is a paragon of friendship and tolerance. " - Ech0ne
Blasterion
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
China10272 Posts
July 27 2011 17:59 GMT
#25464
On July 28 2011 02:58 Sentenal wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 28 2011 02:55 Blasterion wrote:
On July 28 2011 02:48 Sentenal wrote:
On July 28 2011 02:44 Blasterion wrote:
On July 28 2011 02:42 Sentenal wrote:
On July 28 2011 02:37 Blasterion wrote:
I don't think there is a Flying BETA so Marauder Hellion Siege Tank I think can kill BETA easy

Maybe vs Zerg, but you gotta remember the size of the BETA. Marauders? You saw the size comparison between humans and Grappler/Destroyer Classes, right? They would be almost completely useless. Hellions are like motor cycles with flame throwers. All they could do would be to burn the tips of BETA toes. Again, useless. Siege tanks would be able to take them down, but then how exactly do you defend the Siege Tanks? What happens if a Heavy Laser decides to out-range them? I really think ground tactics are the wrong way to go vs the BETA, unless you have like a ridiculous number of Thors, Tanks, and Protoss. And even then, it would probably only be a matter of time till they are overran.

Hellions can handle soldier class, but Marauders they can take down Thors, Ultralisk, Colossus with ease not a bad choice

>_> Because gameplay logic is completely valid. Not like gameplay is designed to try and be balanced, or anything. I guess if we are going with gameplay logic, either marines are the size of houses, or things like Battlecruisers are actually incredibly small. Oh yeah, and Protoss Carriers aren't that much bigger than a few Vikings, and can't even handle a few fights. Nah, fuck their logical, realistic strength in terms of the lore. 16 meter tall BETA would easily be stopped in their tracks from a single shot from a Marauder's shotgun.

But Marauder shots are not normal explosive. They are Graviton Explosions, They're pratically mini black holes. that's how concussive shells work. They create gravity wells that slow enemies down

They create a gravity well that can slow a 16 meter beast running at 170km/h, with a shell that is probably only a few centimeters in length. Terran has the power to destroy the universe, they must be sandbagging when they get demolished constantly by smaller Zerg.

Because Zergs can Fly
[TLNY]Mahjong Club Thread
KazeHydra
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Japan2788 Posts
July 27 2011 18:00 GMT
#25465
On July 28 2011 02:58 Sentenal wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 28 2011 02:55 Blasterion wrote:
On July 28 2011 02:48 Sentenal wrote:
On July 28 2011 02:44 Blasterion wrote:
On July 28 2011 02:42 Sentenal wrote:
On July 28 2011 02:37 Blasterion wrote:
I don't think there is a Flying BETA so Marauder Hellion Siege Tank I think can kill BETA easy

Maybe vs Zerg, but you gotta remember the size of the BETA. Marauders? You saw the size comparison between humans and Grappler/Destroyer Classes, right? They would be almost completely useless. Hellions are like motor cycles with flame throwers. All they could do would be to burn the tips of BETA toes. Again, useless. Siege tanks would be able to take them down, but then how exactly do you defend the Siege Tanks? What happens if a Heavy Laser decides to out-range them? I really think ground tactics are the wrong way to go vs the BETA, unless you have like a ridiculous number of Thors, Tanks, and Protoss. And even then, it would probably only be a matter of time till they are overran.

Hellions can handle soldier class, but Marauders they can take down Thors, Ultralisk, Colossus with ease not a bad choice

>_> Because gameplay logic is completely valid. Not like gameplay is designed to try and be balanced, or anything. I guess if we are going with gameplay logic, either marines are the size of houses, or things like Battlecruisers are actually incredibly small. Oh yeah, and Protoss Carriers aren't that much bigger than a few Vikings, and can't even handle a few fights. Nah, fuck their logical, realistic strength in terms of the lore. 16 meter tall BETA would easily be stopped in their tracks from a single shot from a Marauder's shotgun.

But Marauder shots are not normal explosive. They are Graviton Explosions, They're pratically mini black holes. that's how concussive shells work. They create gravity wells that slow enemies down

They create a gravity well that can slow a 16 meter beast running at 170km/h, with a shell that is probably only a few centimeters in length. Terran has the power to destroy the universe, they must be sandbagging when they get demolished constantly by smaller Zerg.

Marauder slow does not work on massive units in the game; it won't work on the larger BETA classes.
"Because I know this promise that won’t disappear will turn even a cause of tears into strength. You taught me that if I can believe, there is nothing that cannot come true." - Nana Mizuki (Yakusoku) 17:36 ils kaze got me into nana 17:36 ils by his blog
Blasterion
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
China10272 Posts
July 27 2011 18:07 GMT
#25466
On July 28 2011 03:00 KazeHydra wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 28 2011 02:58 Sentenal wrote:
On July 28 2011 02:55 Blasterion wrote:
On July 28 2011 02:48 Sentenal wrote:
On July 28 2011 02:44 Blasterion wrote:
On July 28 2011 02:42 Sentenal wrote:
On July 28 2011 02:37 Blasterion wrote:
I don't think there is a Flying BETA so Marauder Hellion Siege Tank I think can kill BETA easy

Maybe vs Zerg, but you gotta remember the size of the BETA. Marauders? You saw the size comparison between humans and Grappler/Destroyer Classes, right? They would be almost completely useless. Hellions are like motor cycles with flame throwers. All they could do would be to burn the tips of BETA toes. Again, useless. Siege tanks would be able to take them down, but then how exactly do you defend the Siege Tanks? What happens if a Heavy Laser decides to out-range them? I really think ground tactics are the wrong way to go vs the BETA, unless you have like a ridiculous number of Thors, Tanks, and Protoss. And even then, it would probably only be a matter of time till they are overran.

Hellions can handle soldier class, but Marauders they can take down Thors, Ultralisk, Colossus with ease not a bad choice

>_> Because gameplay logic is completely valid. Not like gameplay is designed to try and be balanced, or anything. I guess if we are going with gameplay logic, either marines are the size of houses, or things like Battlecruisers are actually incredibly small. Oh yeah, and Protoss Carriers aren't that much bigger than a few Vikings, and can't even handle a few fights. Nah, fuck their logical, realistic strength in terms of the lore. 16 meter tall BETA would easily be stopped in their tracks from a single shot from a Marauder's shotgun.

But Marauder shots are not normal explosive. They are Graviton Explosions, They're pratically mini black holes. that's how concussive shells work. They create gravity wells that slow enemies down

They create a gravity well that can slow a 16 meter beast running at 170km/h, with a shell that is probably only a few centimeters in length. Terran has the power to destroy the universe, they must be sandbagging when they get demolished constantly by smaller Zerg.

Marauder slow does not work on massive units in the game; it won't work on the larger BETA classes.

They still are great anti armor units though =P
[TLNY]Mahjong Club Thread
Runbunny
Profile Joined May 2010
36 Posts
July 27 2011 18:12 GMT
#25467
Mutalisks can fly in space using their wings... need I say more?
Z3kk
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
4099 Posts
July 27 2011 18:20 GMT
#25468
Wait, why was this discussion drawn up again?
Failure is not falling down over and over again. Failure is refusing to get back up.
Sentenal
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
United States12398 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-27 18:20:52
July 27 2011 18:20 GMT
#25469
On July 28 2011 03:00 KazeHydra wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 28 2011 02:58 Sentenal wrote:
On July 28 2011 02:55 Blasterion wrote:
On July 28 2011 02:48 Sentenal wrote:
On July 28 2011 02:44 Blasterion wrote:
On July 28 2011 02:42 Sentenal wrote:
On July 28 2011 02:37 Blasterion wrote:
I don't think there is a Flying BETA so Marauder Hellion Siege Tank I think can kill BETA easy

Maybe vs Zerg, but you gotta remember the size of the BETA. Marauders? You saw the size comparison between humans and Grappler/Destroyer Classes, right? They would be almost completely useless. Hellions are like motor cycles with flame throwers. All they could do would be to burn the tips of BETA toes. Again, useless. Siege tanks would be able to take them down, but then how exactly do you defend the Siege Tanks? What happens if a Heavy Laser decides to out-range them? I really think ground tactics are the wrong way to go vs the BETA, unless you have like a ridiculous number of Thors, Tanks, and Protoss. And even then, it would probably only be a matter of time till they are overran.

Hellions can handle soldier class, but Marauders they can take down Thors, Ultralisk, Colossus with ease not a bad choice

>_> Because gameplay logic is completely valid. Not like gameplay is designed to try and be balanced, or anything. I guess if we are going with gameplay logic, either marines are the size of houses, or things like Battlecruisers are actually incredibly small. Oh yeah, and Protoss Carriers aren't that much bigger than a few Vikings, and can't even handle a few fights. Nah, fuck their logical, realistic strength in terms of the lore. 16 meter tall BETA would easily be stopped in their tracks from a single shot from a Marauder's shotgun.

But Marauder shots are not normal explosive. They are Graviton Explosions, They're pratically mini black holes. that's how concussive shells work. They create gravity wells that slow enemies down

They create a gravity well that can slow a 16 meter beast running at 170km/h, with a shell that is probably only a few centimeters in length. Terran has the power to destroy the universe, they must be sandbagging when they get demolished constantly by smaller Zerg.

Marauder slow does not work on massive units in the game; it won't work on the larger BETA classes.

Alright then, I guess Marauders really would be useless. And with Hellions, they would be useless too vs Grappler/Destroyer classes, since burning their toes wouldn't mean too much when all they have to do is step on them, and destroy an entire group of Hellions.

On July 28 2011 02:58 KazeHydra wrote:
An army of void rays, archons, and immortals may be able to win. Clearly, most of them are massive so void rays and immortals get bonus damage. Furthermore, with immortals' illogical hardened shields, they will only take 10 damage with every hit despite the huge size. They are also biological, so archons do bonus and splash damage. With good micro, archons and immortals will not die and regain their shields to maximum before returning to the battlefield. Another answer would be using many archon toilets on them. Zerg is all about numbers, so they don't really have any good units that would fight them well head on. In this case, it's more of a question of numbers but both are depicted as having an endless swarm of units. Infestors could neural parasite the fort class, or the biggest one around and use it to kill all its allies. Terran can stim and 1a MMM so that's probably the best answer. If all 3 races chose to work together, it's not implausible for them to win.

How big are Void Rays supposed to be, and have any idea what their "range" is supposed to be? If they can outrange Heavy Laser classes, or at least have their shields hold out long enough against them, they might be viable, but otherwise they might go the same way as other non-huge Capitol Ships vs the BETA.

Again, I don't think its viable to use gameplay concepts like "Immotals only take 10 damage from 16 meter tall cows with heads made out of diamond slamming into them at 170km/h". I think the problem is that lore wise, there aren't THAT many Protoss still alive. The Protoss were running out of Dragoons after Aiur left, and decided to upgrade them into Immortals. So we know for a fact that they aren't numerous. Same with Archons, and probably even rarer. The BETA number hundreds of thousands in a single Hive. The Protoss would probably be surrounded and overwhelmed.

Marines would also be useless. I mean, they are people with machine guns, and lore wise Marines aren't much good vs a pack of Ultralisk.

All 3 race working together like its the last mission of the Protoss Campaign could work I guess, maybe :p. I still think Capitol Ships and Orbital Bombardment are the way to go.

On July 28 2011 03:20 Z3kk wrote:
Wait, why was this discussion drawn up again?

Look at me, I don't read the topic
"Apparently, Sentenal is a paragon of friendship and tolerance. " - Ech0ne
KazeHydra
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Japan2788 Posts
July 27 2011 18:21 GMT
#25470
On July 28 2011 03:07 Blasterion wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 28 2011 03:00 KazeHydra wrote:
On July 28 2011 02:58 Sentenal wrote:
On July 28 2011 02:55 Blasterion wrote:
On July 28 2011 02:48 Sentenal wrote:
On July 28 2011 02:44 Blasterion wrote:
On July 28 2011 02:42 Sentenal wrote:
On July 28 2011 02:37 Blasterion wrote:
I don't think there is a Flying BETA so Marauder Hellion Siege Tank I think can kill BETA easy

Maybe vs Zerg, but you gotta remember the size of the BETA. Marauders? You saw the size comparison between humans and Grappler/Destroyer Classes, right? They would be almost completely useless. Hellions are like motor cycles with flame throwers. All they could do would be to burn the tips of BETA toes. Again, useless. Siege tanks would be able to take them down, but then how exactly do you defend the Siege Tanks? What happens if a Heavy Laser decides to out-range them? I really think ground tactics are the wrong way to go vs the BETA, unless you have like a ridiculous number of Thors, Tanks, and Protoss. And even then, it would probably only be a matter of time till they are overran.

Hellions can handle soldier class, but Marauders they can take down Thors, Ultralisk, Colossus with ease not a bad choice

>_> Because gameplay logic is completely valid. Not like gameplay is designed to try and be balanced, or anything. I guess if we are going with gameplay logic, either marines are the size of houses, or things like Battlecruisers are actually incredibly small. Oh yeah, and Protoss Carriers aren't that much bigger than a few Vikings, and can't even handle a few fights. Nah, fuck their logical, realistic strength in terms of the lore. 16 meter tall BETA would easily be stopped in their tracks from a single shot from a Marauder's shotgun.

But Marauder shots are not normal explosive. They are Graviton Explosions, They're pratically mini black holes. that's how concussive shells work. They create gravity wells that slow enemies down

They create a gravity well that can slow a 16 meter beast running at 170km/h, with a shell that is probably only a few centimeters in length. Terran has the power to destroy the universe, they must be sandbagging when they get demolished constantly by smaller Zerg.

Marauder slow does not work on massive units in the game; it won't work on the larger BETA classes.

They still are great anti armor units though =P

Of course, but it's an hp and numbers issue. For example, even in game, ~10 ultralisks, combined with massive numbers of lings and banelings are impossible to deal with without tanks. Even with tanks, almost all of the infantry is killed in such a battle.
"Because I know this promise that won’t disappear will turn even a cause of tears into strength. You taught me that if I can believe, there is nothing that cannot come true." - Nana Mizuki (Yakusoku) 17:36 ils kaze got me into nana 17:36 ils by his blog
Thratur
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
Canada917 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-27 18:31:45
July 27 2011 18:28 GMT
#25471
If we go lore-wise, battlecruisers and carriers can just bombard/destroy the whole planet from far in space. Of course, it would be at the cost of all facilities...

So I believe Zergs have the best shot against them. Do you know how these guys are organized, and if they would be able to react to the swarm? Zergs would have more than enough time to assimilate their DNA and create the perfect counter, usually a virus of some sort that infect their whole population, causing them to turn over to zerg. Zerglings are fit to fight marines and other small units, so they would just adapt and hatch bigger, more effective stuff.

Also, what happens if your hull is a mirror against these lasers? Just thinking, might not be useful at all.
Sentenal
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
United States12398 Posts
July 27 2011 18:38 GMT
#25472
On July 28 2011 03:28 Thratur wrote:
If we go lore-wise, battlecruisers and carriers can just bombard/destroy the whole planet from far in space. Of course, it would be at the cost of all facilities...

So I believe Zergs have the best shot against them. Do you know how these guys are organized? Zergs would have more than enough time to assimilate their DNA and create the perfect counter, usually a virus of some sort than infect their whole population, causing them to turn over to zerg. Zerglings are fit to fight marines and other small units, so they would just adapt and hatch bigger, more effective stuff.

Also, what happens if your hull is a mirror against these lasers? Just thinking, might not be useful at all.

Are organized? What exactly do you mean? On Earth at least, there is one Central Hive. And from that central hive, others are seeded/created/spread. They are enormous, underground hives. The BETA are actually rather stupid when it comes to tactics, or its speculated that they don't care about such things vs the Humans. Therefore, they were very vulnerable to simple tricks and traps and stuff. However, once a strategy is used, after a few weeks, every single BETA on the planet would have learned that strategy and knew to not fall for it again. Basically, the BETA encounter something new, and they instantly report said new thing back to the Central Hive. The Central Hive figures out counter-measures, and a few weeks later (I don't remember the exact time), the Central Hive instantly informs every single Hive under it, and the BETA instantly adapt to whatever new thing they encountered. But then again, even small changes to the tactics can confuse them, but the process is repeated.

They are carbon based, and they seem to adapt to their environments as well. Like for example, when the BETA first invaded, Laser classes didn't appear for several weeks. In that time, air power (jets, bombing runs, etc) were very effective against them. But then the laser species came out, and ended the age of Flight. Its technically unknown if the Laser Species were just chilling out in their Hives for a few weeks, or if they were developed to respond to the Humanity's air power. IDK how trying to infect the BETA would turn out.

The trick with mirrors would be getting it to not melt, lol.
"Apparently, Sentenal is a paragon of friendship and tolerance. " - Ech0ne
Z3kk
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
4099 Posts
July 27 2011 18:38 GMT
#25473
No I just meant that this discussion randomly out of nowhere...never mind.
Failure is not falling down over and over again. Failure is refusing to get back up.
KazeHydra
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Japan2788 Posts
July 27 2011 18:38 GMT
#25474
On July 28 2011 03:20 Sentenal wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 28 2011 02:58 KazeHydra wrote:
An army of void rays, archons, and immortals may be able to win. Clearly, most of them are massive so void rays and immortals get bonus damage. Furthermore, with immortals' illogical hardened shields, they will only take 10 damage with every hit despite the huge size. They are also biological, so archons do bonus and splash damage. With good micro, archons and immortals will not die and regain their shields to maximum before returning to the battlefield. Another answer would be using many archon toilets on them. Zerg is all about numbers, so they don't really have any good units that would fight them well head on. In this case, it's more of a question of numbers but both are depicted as having an endless swarm of units. Infestors could neural parasite the fort class, or the biggest one around and use it to kill all its allies. Terran can stim and 1a MMM so that's probably the best answer. If all 3 races chose to work together, it's not implausible for them to win.

How big are Void Rays supposed to be, and have any idea what their "range" is supposed to be? If they can outrange Heavy Laser classes, or at least have their shields hold out long enough against them, they might be viable, but otherwise they might go the same way as other non-huge Capitol Ships vs the BETA.

Again, I don't think its viable to use gameplay concepts like "Immotals only take 10 damage from 16 meter tall cows with heads made out of diamond slamming into them at 170km/h". I think the problem is that lore wise, there aren't THAT many Protoss still alive. The Protoss were running out of Dragoons after Aiur left, and decided to upgrade them into Immortals. So we know for a fact that they aren't numerous. Same with Archons, and probably even rarer. The BETA number hundreds of thousands in a single Hive. The Protoss would probably be surrounded and overwhelmed.

Marines would also be useless. I mean, they are people with machine guns, and lore wise Marines aren't much good vs a pack of Ultralisk.

All 3 race working together like its the last mission of the Protoss Campaign could work I guess, maybe :p. I still think Capitol Ships and Orbital Bombardment are the way to go.

Hmm I'm not sure how big void rays are but it's true their "range" is not that big. But it's too hard to tell really because it's all structured around the game. Siege tanks in game actually have a WAY smaller range than real life, so I have no idea what the "real" range of a void ray would be. They can fly as high as carriers and bcs yet hit things on the ground (again, gameplay logic), so it could be pretty long I guess. I suppose when you have so many different kinds of units on the battlefield, you will also have to take into account strategy such as distracting the enemy, using some other bait, taking out x unit first, etc, otherwise it just becomes a x unit counters y unit that counters z unit argument.

Using lore is just as bad as using gameplay logic I think. There's too few protoss left, so they would not be able to do anything. Humans are stupid and divided; they'll probably want to try to capture BETA and use them to fight the zerg only to die stupidly. The Zerg have lost their overmind and have no one to lead them, so they would easily be eliminated. Unless you're satisfied with the conclusion: no, the Starcraft universe would easily die due to having fought each other for far too long.
"Because I know this promise that won’t disappear will turn even a cause of tears into strength. You taught me that if I can believe, there is nothing that cannot come true." - Nana Mizuki (Yakusoku) 17:36 ils kaze got me into nana 17:36 ils by his blog
Sentenal
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
United States12398 Posts
July 27 2011 18:46 GMT
#25475
On July 28 2011 03:38 KazeHydra wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 28 2011 03:20 Sentenal wrote:
On July 28 2011 02:58 KazeHydra wrote:
An army of void rays, archons, and immortals may be able to win. Clearly, most of them are massive so void rays and immortals get bonus damage. Furthermore, with immortals' illogical hardened shields, they will only take 10 damage with every hit despite the huge size. They are also biological, so archons do bonus and splash damage. With good micro, archons and immortals will not die and regain their shields to maximum before returning to the battlefield. Another answer would be using many archon toilets on them. Zerg is all about numbers, so they don't really have any good units that would fight them well head on. In this case, it's more of a question of numbers but both are depicted as having an endless swarm of units. Infestors could neural parasite the fort class, or the biggest one around and use it to kill all its allies. Terran can stim and 1a MMM so that's probably the best answer. If all 3 races chose to work together, it's not implausible for them to win.

How big are Void Rays supposed to be, and have any idea what their "range" is supposed to be? If they can outrange Heavy Laser classes, or at least have their shields hold out long enough against them, they might be viable, but otherwise they might go the same way as other non-huge Capitol Ships vs the BETA.

Again, I don't think its viable to use gameplay concepts like "Immotals only take 10 damage from 16 meter tall cows with heads made out of diamond slamming into them at 170km/h". I think the problem is that lore wise, there aren't THAT many Protoss still alive. The Protoss were running out of Dragoons after Aiur left, and decided to upgrade them into Immortals. So we know for a fact that they aren't numerous. Same with Archons, and probably even rarer. The BETA number hundreds of thousands in a single Hive. The Protoss would probably be surrounded and overwhelmed.

Marines would also be useless. I mean, they are people with machine guns, and lore wise Marines aren't much good vs a pack of Ultralisk.

All 3 race working together like its the last mission of the Protoss Campaign could work I guess, maybe :p. I still think Capitol Ships and Orbital Bombardment are the way to go.

Hmm I'm not sure how big void rays are but it's true their "range" is not that big. But it's too hard to tell really because it's all structured around the game. Siege tanks in game actually have a WAY smaller range than real life, so I have no idea what the "real" range of a void ray would be. They can fly as high as carriers and bcs yet hit things on the ground (again, gameplay logic), so it could be pretty long I guess. I suppose when you have so many different kinds of units on the battlefield, you will also have to take into account strategy such as distracting the enemy, using some other bait, taking out x unit first, etc, otherwise it just becomes a x unit counters y unit that counters z unit argument.

Using lore is just as bad as using gameplay logic I think. There's too few protoss left, so they would not be able to do anything. Humans are stupid and divided; they'll probably want to try to capture BETA and use them to fight the zerg only to die stupidly. The Zerg have lost their overmind and have no one to lead them, so they would easily be eliminated. Unless you're satisfied with the conclusion: no, the Starcraft universe would easily die due to having fought each other for far too long.

Well, lets say this is Pre-SC1 Starcraft Universe, or the leaders in SC2 aren't stupid. Either way, Terran and Protoss Fleets are probably safe, since the BETA have never shown any flying unit, and they travel space by flinging giant rocks to other planets. If their space fleets could intercept the rocks they throw, they can prevent the BETA from spreading to other planets, and orbital bombard planets where they are already at. The Protoss BEFORE the war with the Zerg would probably be in the best position by far to combat the BETA, but IDK if Terran technology/weaponry at the time would be enough (outside nukes and orbital bombardment).

Btw, you have any idea if Protoss or Zerg are silicon-based life? Or are they carbon?
"Apparently, Sentenal is a paragon of friendship and tolerance. " - Ech0ne
Thratur
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
Canada917 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-27 18:52:47
July 27 2011 18:49 GMT
#25476
On July 28 2011 03:38 Sentenal wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 28 2011 03:28 Thratur wrote:
If we go lore-wise, battlecruisers and carriers can just bombard/destroy the whole planet from far in space. Of course, it would be at the cost of all facilities...

So I believe Zergs have the best shot against them. Do you know how these guys are organized? Zergs would have more than enough time to assimilate their DNA and create the perfect counter, usually a virus of some sort than infect their whole population, causing them to turn over to zerg. Zerglings are fit to fight marines and other small units, so they would just adapt and hatch bigger, more effective stuff.

Also, what happens if your hull is a mirror against these lasers? Just thinking, might not be useful at all.

Are organized? What exactly do you mean? On Earth at least, there is one Central Hive. And from that central hive, others are seeded/created/spread. They are enormous, underground hives. The BETA are actually rather stupid when it comes to tactics, or its speculated that they don't care about such things vs the Humans. Therefore, they were very vulnerable to simple tricks and traps and stuff. However, once a strategy is used, after a few weeks, every single BETA on the planet would have learned that strategy and knew to not fall for it again. Basically, the BETA encounter something new, and they instantly report said new thing back to the Central Hive. The Central Hive figures out counter-measures, and a few weeks later (I don't remember the exact time), the Central Hive instantly informs every single Hive under it, and the BETA instantly adapt to whatever new thing they encountered. But then again, even small changes to the tactics can confuse them, but the process is repeated.

They are carbon based, and they seem to adapt to their environments as well. Like for example, when the BETA first invaded, Laser classes didn't appear for several weeks. In that time, air power (jets, bombing runs, etc) were very effective against them. But then the laser species came out, and ended the age of Flight. Its technically unknown if the Laser Species were just chilling out in their Hives for a few weeks, or if they were developed to respond to the Humanity's air power. IDK how trying to infect the BETA would turn out.

The trick with mirrors would be getting it to not melt, lol.


Interesting. In a fight between two races that adapt to their opponent, I think I would give the advantage to the one that adapts the fastest. Sadly, it's hard to tell how fast Zerg adapts, and they mostly do so by absorbing the enemy's DNA... I think I would still give them the advantage because of their usual biological/parasitical warfare, which is what they always do. The base Zerg parasite is very hard to get rid of... Any planet infected by Zergs eventually becomes all Zerg unless you manage to purify it by fire like the Protoss do so that there are no living thing remaining at all in the area.
Sentenal
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
United States12398 Posts
July 27 2011 18:58 GMT
#25477
On July 28 2011 03:49 Thratur wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 28 2011 03:38 Sentenal wrote:
On July 28 2011 03:28 Thratur wrote:
If we go lore-wise, battlecruisers and carriers can just bombard/destroy the whole planet from far in space. Of course, it would be at the cost of all facilities...

So I believe Zergs have the best shot against them. Do you know how these guys are organized? Zergs would have more than enough time to assimilate their DNA and create the perfect counter, usually a virus of some sort than infect their whole population, causing them to turn over to zerg. Zerglings are fit to fight marines and other small units, so they would just adapt and hatch bigger, more effective stuff.

Also, what happens if your hull is a mirror against these lasers? Just thinking, might not be useful at all.

Are organized? What exactly do you mean? On Earth at least, there is one Central Hive. And from that central hive, others are seeded/created/spread. They are enormous, underground hives. The BETA are actually rather stupid when it comes to tactics, or its speculated that they don't care about such things vs the Humans. Therefore, they were very vulnerable to simple tricks and traps and stuff. However, once a strategy is used, after a few weeks, every single BETA on the planet would have learned that strategy and knew to not fall for it again. Basically, the BETA encounter something new, and they instantly report said new thing back to the Central Hive. The Central Hive figures out counter-measures, and a few weeks later (I don't remember the exact time), the Central Hive instantly informs every single Hive under it, and the BETA instantly adapt to whatever new thing they encountered. But then again, even small changes to the tactics can confuse them, but the process is repeated.

They are carbon based, and they seem to adapt to their environments as well. Like for example, when the BETA first invaded, Laser classes didn't appear for several weeks. In that time, air power (jets, bombing runs, etc) were very effective against them. But then the laser species came out, and ended the age of Flight. Its technically unknown if the Laser Species were just chilling out in their Hives for a few weeks, or if they were developed to respond to the Humanity's air power. IDK how trying to infect the BETA would turn out.

The trick with mirrors would be getting it to not melt, lol.


Interesting. In a fight between two races that adapt to their opponent, I think I would give the advantage to the one that adapts the fastest. Sadly, it's hard to tell how fast Zerg adapts, and they mostly do so by absorbing the enemy's DNA... I think I would still give them the advantage because of their usual biological/parasitical warfare, which is what they always do. The base Zerg parasite is very hard to get rid of... Any planet infected by Zergs eventually becomes all Zerg unless you manage to purify it by fire like the Protoss do so that there are no living thing remaining at all in the area.

Unfortunately there isn't really enough info presented about Zerg infestation to know for sure. Like for example, Kerrigan and the Overmind were never successful in infesting ANY Protoss, even after conquering many Protoss worlds. But someone was still able to create Hybrids, somehow.
"Apparently, Sentenal is a paragon of friendship and tolerance. " - Ech0ne
rabidch
Profile Joined January 2010
United States20289 Posts
July 27 2011 18:58 GMT
#25478
On July 28 2011 03:38 Z3kk wrote:
No I just meant that this discussion randomly out of nowhere...never mind.

This is what happens when you have mecha fans speculating universe crossovers.

+ Show Spoiler +
PURE NONSENSE
LiquidDota StaffOnly a true king can play the King.
Z3kk
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
4099 Posts
July 27 2011 19:00 GMT
#25479
On July 28 2011 03:58 rabidch wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 28 2011 03:38 Z3kk wrote:
No I just meant that this discussion randomly out of nowhere...never mind.

This is what happens when you have mecha fans speculating universe crossovers.

+ Show Spoiler +
PURE NONSENSE


ahaha ^^ insanity!
Failure is not falling down over and over again. Failure is refusing to get back up.
KazeHydra
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Japan2788 Posts
July 27 2011 19:02 GMT
#25480
Okay, so I was reading up on a little Starcraft lore, and then I read: Protoss are 3 meters tall. Well now I have no idea how all the other units size up to the BETA. Also, zerg can absorb the traits of anything they kill, so once they get the genetic code of a BETA, they'll be able to assimilate them and evolve. However, if the BETA can do this too, then that gets really convoluted.
"Because I know this promise that won’t disappear will turn even a cause of tears into strength. You taught me that if I can believe, there is nothing that cannot come true." - Nana Mizuki (Yakusoku) 17:36 ils kaze got me into nana 17:36 ils by his blog
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