On April 11 2013 21:22 nitram wrote: Margery is probably going to do to Joffrey what Cersei did to Robert Baratheon. Cersei probably sees Sansa as the woman she once was and Margery as the woman she became when she got into politics. Thats why Cersei probably likes Sansa and is afraid of Margery.
Cersei doesn't like Sansa. Sansa was just easy to control. At first she charmed her because Sansa was naive, and after the shit went down with Ned she's kept her as a docile hostage. Sansa is nothing more than a pawn to her. Margery on the other hand is neither naive nor is she stuck as a hostage.
I don't think she is just a pawn to Cersei. The relationship is complex, she hates Sansa on the one hand because of her dislike of the Starks, but on the other hand she defiantly sees herself in Sansa and almost feels sorry for her, almost. Cersei is bitter about her experience as queen and is spiteful in the way she doesn't want Sansa to be spared her experience either because she was given no option, so why should Sansa? But she does see herself in Sansa and through that defiantly has other feelings than hate for her, sympathy exists on some level.
It seems to me like this grandma and Margery knows what they are doing. They asked Sansa what kind of man Jeoffrey was in order to determine a best course of action. Her respons when Sansa says that he is a monster is just "Well that's disappointing", nothing more. I think they know how to play Jeoffrey and even moreso I think Cersei sees and knows that, which is why she has such a hostile attitude towards Margery.
I'd love to learn more of the grandmother though, I've seen some comments reffering to her as a "Queen of Thorns" which along with her ability to manipulate and calmly analyze a situation makes me think there is something more to her.
On April 11 2013 22:29 Okee wrote: It seems to me like this grandma and Margery knows what they are doing. They asked Sansa what kind of man Jeoffrey was in order to determine a best course of action. Her respons when Sansa says that he is a monster is just "Well that's disappointing", nothing more. I think they know how to play Jeoffrey and even moreso I think Cersei sees and knows that, which is why she has such a hostile attitude towards Margery.
I'd love to learn more of the grandmother though, I've seen some comments reffering to her as a "Queen of Thorns" which along with her ability to manipulate and calmly analyze a situation makes me think there is something more to her.
I agree, I thought that scene with the three of them was really cool. It made their storyline go from one I didn't care that much about, to one that i'm really excited to see how it goes. They definitely know what they're doing/getting in to. Can't wait for sunday!
On April 12 2013 04:49 turdburgler wrote: how did theon end up captured? i dont remember that happening.
It happened off-screen. Theon's men basically took Robb's offer to deliver Theon and take the free walk out of Winterfell (if you remember, Robb mentioned this offer when he commanded his men to go back to Winterfell). However, we still don't know how Winterfell was burned, correct??
On April 11 2013 22:29 Okee wrote: It seems to me like this grandma and Margery knows what they are doing. They asked Sansa what kind of man Jeoffrey was in order to determine a best course of action. Her respons when Sansa says that he is a monster is just "Well that's disappointing", nothing more. I think they know how to play Jeoffrey and even moreso I think Cersei sees and knows that, which is why she has such a hostile attitude towards Margery.
I'd love to learn more of the grandmother though, I've seen some comments reffering to her as a "Queen of Thorns" which along with her ability to manipulate and calmly analyze a situation makes me think there is something more to her.
She's called the Queen of Thorns because she's the matriarch of the Tyrells whose symbol is a rose (like lannister=lion and stark=wolf) and while roses are pretty it's wise to remember that they also have thorns .
On April 12 2013 04:49 turdburgler wrote: how did theon end up captured? i dont remember that happening.
It happened off-screen. Theon's men basically took Robb's offer to deliver Theon and take the free walk out of Winterfell (if you remember, Robb mentioned this offer when he commanded his men to go back to Winterfell). However, we still don't know how Winterfell was burned, correct??
I thought that Theon's Iron Islanders knocked Theon out and abandoned him then set Winterfell on fire and then fled before Robb's men came.
On April 12 2013 04:49 turdburgler wrote: how did theon end up captured? i dont remember that happening.
It happened off-screen. Theon's men basically took Robb's offer to deliver Theon and take the free walk out of Winterfell (if you remember, Robb mentioned this offer when he commanded his men to go back to Winterfell). However, we still don't know how Winterfell was burned, correct??
I thought that Theon's Iron Islanders knocked Theon out and abandoned him then set Winterfell on fire and then fled before Robb's men came.
They were already there and had surrounded Winterfell.
On April 12 2013 04:49 turdburgler wrote: how did theon end up captured? i dont remember that happening.
It happened off-screen. Theon's men basically took Robb's offer to deliver Theon and take the free walk out of Winterfell (if you remember, Robb mentioned this offer when he commanded his men to go back to Winterfell). However, we still don't know how Winterfell was burned, correct??
We still dont know why Winterfell burned. All we know so far is: Bolton was ordered by Rob to take back Winterfell with 500 of his men. Rob gave the message that if anyone surrenders they were to return back home safely, except Theon. Theon gives a speech to his mean before battle, gets knocked out by his own men. Then next scene they show Winterfell burning and the Stark kids walking away.
Something tells me the story boarding for this did not go as intended. Instead of being intrigued and wondering what will happen next. I am just left confused and cant help but wonder if they just failed to execute this side of the story well.
On April 12 2013 05:04 Emnjay808 wrote: Something tells me the story boarding for this did not go as intended. Instead of being intrigued and wondering what will happen next. I am just left confused and cant help but wonder if they just failed to execute this side of the story well.
I'm obviously not going to spoil anything, but I can say that there's a perfectly reasonable explanation for what happened and I'm pretty sure that if you were to rewatch all of season 2 looking for hints about the answer you could probably find them, it's just that they are incredible subtle and the show has to cut a lot of background explanations and character descriptions that would probably make the whole Winterfeel affair seem a little less random.
On April 12 2013 04:49 turdburgler wrote: how did theon end up captured? i dont remember that happening.
It happened off-screen. Theon's men basically took Robb's offer to deliver Theon and take the free walk out of Winterfell (if you remember, Robb mentioned this offer when he commanded his men to go back to Winterfell). However, we still don't know how Winterfell was burned, correct??
We still dont know why Winterfell burned. All we know so far is: Bolton was ordered by Rob to take back Winterfell with 500 of his men. Rob gave the message that if anyone surrenders they were to return back home safely, except Theon. Theon gives a speech to his mean before battle, gets knocked out by his own men. Then next scene they show Winterfell burning and the Stark kids walking away.
Something tells me the story boarding for this did not go as intended. Instead of being intrigued and wondering what will happen next. I am just left confused and cant help but wonder if they just failed to execute this side of the story well.
Yeah it was done badly in season 2 and I am sure that they are aware of it (see scene in most recent episode where Gendry teases Arya about not killing Tywin).
I think I have figured out how they have adapted this storyline and they seem to have set it up and explain everything in a satisfying way.
On April 12 2013 04:49 turdburgler wrote: how did theon end up captured? i dont remember that happening.
It happened off-screen. Theon's men basically took Robb's offer to deliver Theon and take the free walk out of Winterfell (if you remember, Robb mentioned this offer when he commanded his men to go back to Winterfell). However, we still don't know how Winterfell was burned, correct??
We still dont know why Winterfell burned. All we know so far is: Bolton was ordered by Rob to take back Winterfell with 500 of his men. Rob gave the message that if anyone surrenders they were to return back home safely, except Theon. Theon gives a speech to his mean before battle, gets knocked out by his own men. Then next scene they show Winterfell burning and the Stark kids walking away.
Something tells me the story boarding for this did not go as intended. Instead of being intrigued and wondering what will happen next. I am just left confused and cant help but wonder if they just failed to execute this side of the story well.
I think you are meant to be confused, look at theons opening lines, where am i and who are you shows confusion, putting you in theons shoes.
+1 on the thanks count. Giving that band first album a listen right now, I really like Cello and they aren't lacking in the talent and taste departments.
On April 12 2013 04:49 turdburgler wrote: how did theon end up captured? i dont remember that happening.
It happened off-screen. Theon's men basically took Robb's offer to deliver Theon and take the free walk out of Winterfell (if you remember, Robb mentioned this offer when he commanded his men to go back to Winterfell). However, we still don't know how Winterfell was burned, correct??
We still dont know why Winterfell burned. All we know so far is: Bolton was ordered by Rob to take back Winterfell with 500 of his men. Rob gave the message that if anyone surrenders they were to return back home safely, except Theon. Theon gives a speech to his mean before battle, gets knocked out by his own men. Then next scene they show Winterfell burning and the Stark kids walking away.
Something tells me the story boarding for this did not go as intended. Instead of being intrigued and wondering what will happen next. I am just left confused and cant help but wonder if they just failed to execute this side of the story well.
I am more curious as to why it happened then what will happen next. To me it has to be Bolton's men who burned it, you know they are at Winterfell because Theon kept complaining about the dude blowing the horn, and it seems far to silly that the Ironborn burn it before surrendering. Why would you accept their surrender if they just burned down what you are supposed to reclaim.
I really hope that now Jaime and Brienne have been captured by some of Bolton's men we get an answer. I want to know why it happened.
Just watched the episode again. Man, some of those scenes... So good. When Jamie grabs hold of that sword for the first time, I have no idea how that man managed to act that out so well. It was very subtle, but perfect.
Also, after watching it again, a lot of the seemingly disjointed parts/storylines were much clearer. I love how the more you watch this show, the more you pick up. So worth it.
On April 10 2013 23:51 fLyiNgDroNe wrote: btw did they first introduce the wargs? i don't remember from prevous episodes them talking about them, and now boom! very nice turn of events for the injured kid.
It was a while ago. Bran was inside his dogs head as early as Season 1 I believe.
EPT
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