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On December 04 2012 01:00 SpikeStarcraft wrote:
Its a bit confusing that he can abandon the dark passenger that easily. After all those years... it only took someone to say: hey, it might be just a feeling? ^^
Wasnt his need to kill even physical making him stressed out and losing control? Thats just gone now? haha
It still does. But instead of treating it like another being controlling him, he accepted that it was in fact him.
And because he realizes that he doesnt really have to kill he feels responsibility now. Doesnt the code protect his conscience by saying you kill for a greater cause?
It's still killing, even if they deserve it. And Dexter's not a sociopath, so taking responsibility wasn't that easy.
Then he lets someone live that fits the code and kills someone because he really wanted to. He abandoned the dark passenger not the code. wtf! He feels guilt for killing people according to the code but if he just wants to kill someone its totally fine?
After that little speech he gave to the fireman (heh), Dexter got that look on his face, because he realized that he might as well have been talking to himself. He ended up feeling bad for the guy and left.
If his dad thought it was curable, why not cure it when he was a kid and only killing animals. Way easier than teaching him how to kill humans without getting caught. There must've been another option to teach him how to deal with his feelings. I call BS on his dad thinking it was curable.
Its a good thing Dexter changes but there are some major flaws in this logic and dexters character just took a big leap forward compared to really small steps over the last how many seasons.. 7!
His dad didn't think it was curable, which is why he taught him how to kill without being caught. But he also didn't think that he was "possessed".
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On December 04 2012 05:41 yeint wrote:Show nested quote +On December 03 2012 15:48 Gryffindor_us wrote:
I'm not sure how I feel about the latest episode.
We've lived with the dark passenger for 7 years, and now he never existed? And the whole "Hannah and Dexter are emotionally incompatible" spiel took a major dive.
Buy the ticket, take the ride. Of course he never existed. I'm shocked that people actually think the dark passenger is some sort of metaphysical entity. It was just Dexter personifying his compulsion to kill, like any addict refusing to take responsibility for his actions.
I'm not actually asserting that I thought there was a spirit that inhabited Dexter called "the dark passenger." I suppose I should rephrase. I'm surprised at the rapidity at which they disposed with the internal scapegoat Dexter used for 7 years. I'm disappointed that there was really not much lead up to it, and that it occurred at a moment when Dexter was talking to a victim of little consequence. Not to mention for such a stubborn creature he accepted the new idea without any resistance. It would be one thing for Dexter to realize that for years he has scapegoated his murderous rampage on the "dark passenger" while killing someone important, not a quickly introduced and neutralized "phantom." And why the hell did the hallucinated Harry that Dexter manifests not ask the question about the dark passenger before? Oh right, because Hannah wasn't around yet.
Dexter wrangling with a personification of his choice is more fun to me than him making a choice  .
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On December 04 2012 06:00 Gryffindor_us wrote:Show nested quote +On December 04 2012 05:41 yeint wrote:On December 03 2012 15:48 Gryffindor_us wrote:
I'm not sure how I feel about the latest episode.
We've lived with the dark passenger for 7 years, and now he never existed? And the whole "Hannah and Dexter are emotionally incompatible" spiel took a major dive.
Buy the ticket, take the ride. Of course he never existed. I'm shocked that people actually think the dark passenger is some sort of metaphysical entity. It was just Dexter personifying his compulsion to kill, like any addict refusing to take responsibility for his actions. I'm not actually asserting that I thought there was a spirit that inhabited Dexter called "the dark passenger." I suppose I should rephrase. I'm surprised at the rapidity at which they disposed with the internal scapegoat Dexter used for 7 years. I'm disappointed that there was really not much lead up to it, and that it occurred at a moment when Dexter was talking to a victim of little consequence. Not to mention for such a stubborn creature he accepted the new idea without any resistance. It would be one thing for Dexter to realize that for years he has scapegoated his murderous rampage on the "dark passenger" while killing someone important, not a quickly introduced and neutralized "phantom." And why the hell did the hallucinated Harry that Dexter manifests not ask the question about the dark passenger before? Oh right, because Hannah wasn't around yet. Dexter wrangling with a personification of his choice is more fun to me than him making a choice .
But the thing is he's been on this journey for years. I didn't see the realization come out of the blue. He was looking for answers in religion (Brother Mac), he was looking for it in other serial killers (Trinity).
Harry isn't hallucinated either, he's basically Dexter's inner voice (one of them). He's not a delusion like Gellar was for Travis Marshall. He started talking about the dark passenger because Dexter was thinking about that.
I view this entire series as a journey of Dexter's self-discovery. A key point to his "redemption" is coming to terms with two truths - he's not a killer because of a "Dark Passenger" that's separate from him, and more importantly, he's not a good guy solely because of a Code that's external to him. He doesn't kill innocents because HE is, in his own way, a moral person.
Hannah's father didn't fit the code - but he was utter scum who threatened the safety of people Dexter cares for. What Dexter seemed to realize is that he himself can be the arbiter, instead of the code. That he himself can be the killer, and take responsibility for it.
As a character archetype, he is a textbook vigilante superhero. A Batman without the no killing rule. A more sociable Punisher with more self-control. And I think it's interesting to see one coming to terms with the fact that ultimately, a vigilante is always endowing himself with the ability to arbitrate justice. And finding satisfaction in his "work" doesn't necessarily diminish the outcomes.
If the John McClanes and Rambos in our popular culture are allowed to crack jokes as they righteously mete out revenge towards Actually Bad People, then why can't Dexter Morgan? Just because his MO is, stylistically, Silence of the Lambs creepy, the outcomes are the same - dead bad people, safer good people. We're all okay with this when the syringe and plastic wrap are replaced with dual-wielded slow motion Uzis. What does that say about us?
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Ok guys what the hell? He left the arsonist alive, to be arrested, so that this Jensen (?) guy can testify: oh i was captured, wrapped in plastic on a table and almost killed by a guy with a knife? Sure, that will definietely help with La Guerta
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On December 04 2012 08:44 karpotoss wrote:
Ok guys what the hell? He left the arsonist alive, to be arrested, so that this Jensen (?) guy can testify: oh i was captured, wrapped in plastic on a table and almost killed by a guy with a knife? Sure, that will definietely help with La Guerta
Yeah I thought of that too he saw his face didn't he?
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On December 04 2012 08:44 karpotoss wrote:
Ok guys what the hell? He left the arsonist alive, to be arrested, so that this Jensen (?) guy can testify: oh i was captured, wrapped in plastic on a table and almost killed by a guy with a knife? Sure, that will definietely help with La Guerta
Maybe Dexter used one of these right before releasing him:
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/ZGWpn.jpg)
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On December 04 2012 09:00 Zealotdriver wrote:Show nested quote +On December 04 2012 08:44 karpotoss wrote:
Ok guys what the hell? He left the arsonist alive, to be arrested, so that this Jensen (?) guy can testify: oh i was captured, wrapped in plastic on a table and almost killed by a guy with a knife? Sure, that will definietely help with La Guerta Maybe Dexter used one of these right before releasing him:
Sounds plausible.
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On December 04 2012 08:53 Maxie wrote:Show nested quote +On December 04 2012 08:44 karpotoss wrote:
Ok guys what the hell? He left the arsonist alive, to be arrested, so that this Jensen (?) guy can testify: oh i was captured, wrapped in plastic on a table and almost killed by a guy with a knife? Sure, that will definietely help with La Guerta Yeah I thought of that too he saw his face didn't he?
The arsonist literally said "who is this, I can't see your face". Even if he did talk, I doubt it will make any difference. People trusting Dexter will put it down to kerosine fume induced hallucinations or something (or at the very least not connect it to Dexter), and LaGuerta is already pretty sure about Dexter being the BHB. Maybe it will make LaGuerta suspicious of Debrah if Debrah is too obvious at trying to sweep "a strange man wrapped me in plastic and pointed a knife at me" under the rug.
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On December 04 2012 06:30 yeint wrote:Show nested quote +On December 04 2012 06:00 Gryffindor_us wrote:On December 04 2012 05:41 yeint wrote:On December 03 2012 15:48 Gryffindor_us wrote:
I'm not sure how I feel about the latest episode.
We've lived with the dark passenger for 7 years, and now he never existed? And the whole "Hannah and Dexter are emotionally incompatible" spiel took a major dive.
Buy the ticket, take the ride. Of course he never existed. I'm shocked that people actually think the dark passenger is some sort of metaphysical entity. It was just Dexter personifying his compulsion to kill, like any addict refusing to take responsibility for his actions. I'm not actually asserting that I thought there was a spirit that inhabited Dexter called "the dark passenger." I suppose I should rephrase. I'm surprised at the rapidity at which they disposed with the internal scapegoat Dexter used for 7 years. I'm disappointed that there was really not much lead up to it, and that it occurred at a moment when Dexter was talking to a victim of little consequence. Not to mention for such a stubborn creature he accepted the new idea without any resistance. It would be one thing for Dexter to realize that for years he has scapegoated his murderous rampage on the "dark passenger" while killing someone important, not a quickly introduced and neutralized "phantom." And why the hell did the hallucinated Harry that Dexter manifests not ask the question about the dark passenger before? Oh right, because Hannah wasn't around yet. Dexter wrangling with a personification of his choice is more fun to me than him making a choice . + Show Spoiler +But the thing is he's been on this journey for years. I didn't see the realization come out of the blue. He was looking for answers in religion (Brother Mac), he was looking for it in other serial killers (Trinity).
Harry isn't hallucinated either, he's basically Dexter's inner voice (one of them). He's not a delusion like Gellar was for Travis Marshall. He started talking about the dark passenger because Dexter was thinking about that.
I view this entire series as a journey of Dexter's self-discovery. A key point to his "redemption" is coming to terms with two truths - he's not a killer because of a "Dark Passenger" that's separate from him, and more importantly, he's not a good guy solely because of a Code that's external to him. He doesn't kill innocents because HE is, in his own way, a moral person.
Hannah's father didn't fit the code - but he was utter scum who threatened the safety of people Dexter cares for. What Dexter seemed to realize is that he himself can be the arbiter, instead of the code. That he himself can be the killer, and take responsibility for it.
As a character archetype, he is a textbook vigilante superhero. A Batman without the no killing rule. A more sociable Punisher with more self-control. And I think it's interesting to see one coming to terms with the fact that ultimately, a vigilante is always endowing himself with the ability to arbitrate justice. And finding satisfaction in his "work" doesn't necessarily diminish the outcomes.
If the John McClanes and Rambos in our popular culture are allowed to crack jokes as they righteously mete out revenge towards Actually Bad People, then why can't Dexter Morgan? Just because his MO is, stylistically, Silence of the Lambs creepy, the outcomes are the same - dead bad people, safer good people. We're all okay with this when the syringe and plastic wrap are replaced with dual-wielded slow motion Uzis. What does that say about us? Very nice summary here, I really agree with everything you've said. I realized too when Dex had his moment of zen when he was about to stab the ghost arsonist that the core is about Dexter's personal transformation. It's definitely been more of a journey since he is always looking for answers externally since he is incapable of generating them from within. He's already killed an innocent person so you can condemn him as 'bad' long ago for violating his code. His realization didn't seem sudden to me at all. It ties into his Hannah realization well. You pose an interesting question as to why the violence is interpreted differently when it is performed in different ways.
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Dexter has come a long way since the 1st season, his character has evolved (after watching season 1-7 in 2 weeks) i can say that he's changed (however for the better?)
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On December 04 2012 02:36 GeneralStan wrote:
I love Hannah as a character. She's got a garden and she poisons people with flowers from her garden. She's like a real life Poison Ivy.
Agreed and well said! I hope she'll stay.
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On December 01 2012 05:14 Zinnwaldite wrote:
Some fries motherfucker..
Hahahahahaha.... Thank you for that.
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Michael C Hall does menacing and insane so very well.
Loving this season. So many twists, and so much character development. Not just in Dexter, but in Debra, and even Quinn. Excited to see where this whole thing with La Guerta goes.
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On December 05 2012 00:36 LimitSEA wrote:
Michael C Hall does menacing and insane so very well.
Loving this season. So many twists, and so much character development. Not just in Dexter, but in Debra, and even Quinn. Excited to see where this whole thing with La Guerta goes.
La Guerta is probably on a highway to her death if you ask me.
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Go away Hannah, you need to die! I don't care if you're played by Yvonne somethin something...shoo!
Really really dislike her...
If the next season features her, I'm out! .____.
This episode just seemed like a stalemate, nothing important happend, dexter evolved a lil bit..but that's not new. The preview makes me super excited though!
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is yvonne's dad a scammer everywhere she goes? lol
(referring to yvonne's dad on chuck)
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On December 05 2012 04:48 Neeh wrote:
Go away Hannah, you need to die! I don't care if you're played by Yvonne somethin something...shoo!
Really really dislike her...
If the next season features her, I'm out! .____.
This episode just seemed like a stalemate, nothing important happend, dexter evolved a lil bit..but that's not new. The preview makes me super excited though!
I'd agree, but LaGuerta and Matthews are just that much closer to finding out who Dexter is for certain.
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Terrible episode. The change in character of the father was far too abrupt. You'd think if he was smart enough to act kind for several days, he could control his anger and still weasel his way into his daughter's finances (or at least not be dumb enough to ask for $20,000 straight up).
Furthermore, Dexter is getting way too sloppy. So he follows the fire inspector to a war memorial... And is foolish enough to get caught snooping around his car. He's also making many wrong predictions as to who is guilty and who is innocent (another example is when he murdered that photographer when it was the assistant who killed the models).
Give me that Russian slapper over Hannah Botox-face anyday.
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Hey i made a Dexter fantasy proleague group!
Dexter Morgans's Dinner Group
feel free to join
HannahMckay's LoveMonkeys got this though
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On December 05 2012 10:54 Miami Metro wrote:
Terrible episode. The change in character of the father was far too abrupt. You'd think if he was smart enough to act kind for several days, he could control his anger and still weasel his way into his daughter's finances (or at least not be dumb enough to ask for $20,000 straight up).
Furthermore, Dexter is getting way too sloppy. So he follows the fire inspector to a war memorial... And is foolish enough to get caught snooping around his car. He's also making many wrong predictions as to who is guilty and who is innocent (another example is when he murdered that photographer when it was the assistant who killed the models).
Give me that Russian slapper over Hannah Botox-face anyday.
Well, her father did get her to give him the $20k. But Dexter shut him down before she could hand in the money.
That scene where the fire guy caught him and just acted really friendly was pretty dumb, I agree.
The whole point of him murdering Hannah's father was to show us that he is "accepting" the fact that the Dark Passenger is just a feeling, not like he thought it was. It's not about "predicting who is or isn't guilty".
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EPT
