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SPOILER WARNING If you only watch the show, this thread will spoil you of future events in HBO's Game of Thrones. Thread contains discussion of all books of the series A Song of Ice and FireClick Here for the spoiler-free thread. |
It's interesting to consider the lineages of major houses. Many of them are or will be in a succession crisis very soon:
Starks, since Bran is crippled and Arya clearly has no intention of breeding ever, we have:
Poll: Trough whom will the Stark line continue?Rickon (20) 71% Sansa (4) 14% Jon (it's complicated but its an option) (4) 14% Starks go extinct (0) 0% 28 total votes Your vote: Trough whom will the Stark line continue? (Vote): Sansa
(Vote): Rickon
(Vote): Jon (it's complicated but its an option)
(Vote): Starks go extinct
Lannisters, i am quite sure the rest of Cercei's prophecy will hold true so, she and her 2 children gonna die soon, that leaves afaik only (at least known characters):
Poll: Trough whom will the Lannister line continue?Jaime (11) 46% Tyrion (10) 42% the Lannisters go extinct (3) 13% Lancel (0) 0% 24 total votes Your vote: Trough whom will the Lannister line continue? (Vote): Tyrion
(Vote): Jaime
(Vote): Lancel
(Vote): the Lannisters go extinct
The Arynns
Poll: Trough whom will the Arynn line continue?The Arynn line goes extinct (15) 65% Henry the Heir (6) 26% Robert (sweetrobin) (2) 9% 23 total votes Your vote: Trough whom will the Arynn line continue? (Vote): Robert (sweetrobin)
(Vote): Henry the Heir
(Vote): The Arynn line goes extinct
The Baratheons, im quite sure Sannis's line will end but ill include it anyways
Poll: Trough whom will the Baratheon line continue?Gendry (11) 55% Stannis's daughter (5) 25% Edric Storm (2) 10% The Baratheon line goes extinct (2) 10% Stannis will have a son (0) 0% Maya Stone or some other random bastard (0) 0% 20 total votes Your vote: Trough whom will the Baratheon line continue? (Vote): Stannis's daughter
(Vote): Stannis will have a son
(Vote): Edric Storm
(Vote): Gendry
(Vote): Maya Stone or some other random bastard
(Vote): The Baratheon line goes extinct
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I'm pretty sure that none of those people are gonna have any children during the course of the books so hopefully GRRM will have the time to write some stuff set after the ending of asoiaf when he's finished with the last two books.
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On June 29 2012 23:24 Attican wrote:
I'm pretty sure that none of those people are gonna have any children during the course of the books so hopefully GRRM will have the time to write some stuff set after the ending of asoiaf when he's finished with the last two books.
well not in the books, but who will be able (meaning not dead or unable to breed and if a bastard he needs legitimization) to continue the line at the point the books end.
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On June 29 2012 23:29 Geo.Rion wrote:Show nested quote +On June 29 2012 23:24 Attican wrote:
I'm pretty sure that none of those people are gonna have any children during the course of the books so hopefully GRRM will have the time to write some stuff set after the ending of asoiaf when he's finished with the last two books. well not in the books, but who will be able (meaning not dead or unable to breed and if a bastard he needs legitimization) to continue the line at the point the books end.
Tough to say really, I feel like Jaime will die, and unless Tyrion finds Tysha he probably won't have any legitimate children so the Lannister line is probably gonna go to some offshoot of the main Lannister family. The primary Arryn line is almost certainly going to die out. Sansa and Rickon will survive I think so either of them could have children, not too sure about Arya, even if she survives I don't know if she'd have children. The Baratheon line will continue, but it'll be through Edric or Gendry so it won't be legitimate either way.
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Lannister line is doomed.
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On June 29 2012 23:49 Attican wrote:Show nested quote +On June 29 2012 23:29 Geo.Rion wrote:On June 29 2012 23:24 Attican wrote:
I'm pretty sure that none of those people are gonna have any children during the course of the books so hopefully GRRM will have the time to write some stuff set after the ending of asoiaf when he's finished with the last two books. well not in the books, but who will be able (meaning not dead or unable to breed and if a bastard he needs legitimization) to continue the line at the point the books end. Tough to say really, I feel like Jaime will die, and unless Tyrion finds Tysha he probably won't have any legitimate children so the Lannister line is probably gonna go to some offshoot of the main Lannister family. The primary Arryn line is almost certainly going to die out. Sansa and Rickon will survive I think so either of them could have children, not too sure about Arya, even if she survives I don't know if she'd have children. The Baratheon line will continue, but it'll be through Edric or Gendry so it won't be legitimate either way.
bastards can be made legitimate, if they arent the Baratheon name dies (even though the bloodline continues)
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Starks, since Bran is crippled and Arya clearly has no intention of breeding ever, we have:
That's very bad reasoning. No 11 year old has any definite intent for its future life.
Especially Arya who managed to trick them faceless servants into thinking that she's not asking for revenge while she is.
Also, from quotes in the book she might be no prize worthy beauty but she will be pretty at least.
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On June 29 2012 23:59 Steveling wrote:Show nested quote +Starks, since Bran is crippled and Arya clearly has no intention of breeding ever, we have: That's very bad reasoning. No 11 year old has any definite intent for its future life. Especially Arya who managed to trick them faceless servants into thinking that she's not asking for revenge while she is. Also, from quotes in the book she might be no prize worthy beauty but she will be pretty at least.
this eleven year old killed a number of people, and joined the most elite assassin temple of the world, whose members afaik arent involved in procreation. It's silly to say She's 11, she might have a change of heart when she hits 15, her destiny is fairly clearly going in another direction than being a mother. I'd lay it 100-1 she won have kids (and i cant edit the polls, so sry)
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Are the Henry the heir option and the Arryn line extinct option the same? Since Harrold is of House Hardyng.
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On June 29 2012 23:59 Steveling wrote:Show nested quote +Starks, since Bran is crippled and Arya clearly has no intention of breeding ever, we have: That's very bad reasoning. No 11 year old has any definite intent for its future life. Especially Arya who managed to trick them faceless servants into thinking that she's not asking for revenge while she is. Also, from quotes in the book she might be no prize worthy beauty but she will be pretty at least.
Huh? There are no truly beautiful 11 year old girls as far as I'm aware.....
But it was mentioned quite clearly that she looks very much like Ned's sister did at her age, and we all know she ended up hot enough to get rhaegar's attention.......
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On June 29 2012 23:55 Geo.Rion wrote:Show nested quote +On June 29 2012 23:49 Attican wrote:On June 29 2012 23:29 Geo.Rion wrote:On June 29 2012 23:24 Attican wrote:
I'm pretty sure that none of those people are gonna have any children during the course of the books so hopefully GRRM will have the time to write some stuff set after the ending of asoiaf when he's finished with the last two books. well not in the books, but who will be able (meaning not dead or unable to breed and if a bastard he needs legitimization) to continue the line at the point the books end. Tough to say really, I feel like Jaime will die, and unless Tyrion finds Tysha he probably won't have any legitimate children so the Lannister line is probably gonna go to some offshoot of the main Lannister family. The primary Arryn line is almost certainly going to die out. Sansa and Rickon will survive I think so either of them could have children, not too sure about Arya, even if she survives I don't know if she'd have children. The Baratheon line will continue, but it'll be through Edric or Gendry so it won't be legitimate either way. bastards can be made legitimate, if they arent the Baratheon name dies (even though the bloodline continues)
I highly doubt anyone would want to legitimize Gendry or Edric or any other of Robert's bastards though. It would just further fuck up the situation in the Seven Kingdoms.
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On June 29 2012 22:11 aloT wrote:
The problem with Dany is that she is not a strong enough character to hold her own as the protagonist for an entire continent, and neither are her supporting cast. The reason why Jon Snow and his story is much more liked, despite being like Dany seperated from the politics of Westeros is that the character interactions and events that happen feel meaningful, foreboding and crucial to the story. We don't care what happens to a random slave city on the otherside of the World, it is geographically and culturally too detached from all the characters we love in Westeros to be immersive for the readers. I can see the Greyjoy fleet or the Second Sons/Tyrion pulling Dany back into the fray and uniting with the Golden Company, but then what was with all the mess and politics that is left behind? GRR has written so much about that crappy land that he has to somehow force himself to tie up the actual people with Westeros somehow. I don't see it happening smoothly
Maybe you should, as Mereen can clearly be connected to Iraq. It is pretty obvious Martin took some of the stuff going on in Iraq at the time to fill in some of the things happening in Mereen. I would guess USA and somewhat UK readers would care what happens there :D
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On June 29 2012 23:49 Attican wrote:Show nested quote +On June 29 2012 23:29 Geo.Rion wrote:On June 29 2012 23:24 Attican wrote:
I'm pretty sure that none of those people are gonna have any children during the course of the books so hopefully GRRM will have the time to write some stuff set after the ending of asoiaf when he's finished with the last two books. well not in the books, but who will be able (meaning not dead or unable to breed and if a bastard he needs legitimization) to continue the line at the point the books end. Tough to say really, I feel like Jaime will die, and unless Tyrion finds Tysha he probably won't have any legitimate children so the Lannister line is probably gonna go to some offshoot of the main Lannister family. The primary Arryn line is almost certainly going to die out. Sansa and Rickon will survive I think so either of them could have children, not too sure about Arya, even if she survives I don't know if she'd have children. The Baratheon line will continue, but it'll be through Edric or Gendry so it won't be legitimate either way.
Why does Tyrion need Tysha do have legitimate children?
He is married to Sansa still. And if that marriage gets abolished due to them not having had sex he can marry anyone still and have children. He just needs to be on a winning side when all the wars are done :D
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The Starks have plenty of options to continue the line. Sansa could continue the blood, but seeing as how shes a she, the family name would die with her if she was the heir. I'm pretty sure Rickon will be the one to continue it. Maybe Jon is an option, seeing as how one of Robb's last acts was to legitimize him as a Stark, but there is the whole thing with the Nights Watch that is the problem there. But who knows how the aftermath of the books will leave him.
The Lannisters have options, as I'm sure there are still those with the name. Kevan has other sons, right? Martyn Lannister is alive, and Tyrek Lannister is MIA. Even if Jaime and Tyrion die, there are options.
Its the Baratheons and Arryns who are in danger of dying out. I'm pretty sure the Arryns are gone. The Baratheons... One of Robert's bastards would have to be legitimized, but I don't see any of the current monarchs or future monarchs doing so.
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On June 30 2012 00:17 Sentenal wrote:
The Starks have plenty of options to continue the line. Sansa could continue the blood, but seeing as how shes a she, the family name would die with her if she was the heir. I'm pretty sure Rickon will be the one to continue it. Maybe Jon is an option, seeing as how one of Robb's last acts was to legitimize him as a Stark, but there is the whole thing with the Nights Watch that is the problem there. But who knows how the aftermath of the books will leave him.
The Lannisters have options, as I'm sure there are still those with the name. Kevan has other sons, right? Martyn Lannister is alive, and Tyrek Lannister is MIA. Even if Jaime and Tyrion die, there are options.
Its the Baratheons and Arryns who are in danger of dying out. I'm pretty sure the Arryns are gone. The Baratheons... One of Robert's bastards would have to be legitimized, but I don't see any of the current monarchs or future monarchs doing so.
Nope, in the North it can continue trough the female line, there s a tale when the Lord of Winderfell only had a daughter and she was kidnapped by the wildling king, they had a son, and he became the new Lord of Winterfell (later killing his father, without knowing). And at another point someone else explains that in the North daughters come before uncles in the succession line, so that would indicate the same thing.
On June 30 2012 00:06 ShadeR wrote:
Are the Henry the heir option and the Arryn line extinct option the same? Since Harrold is of House Hardyng.
Hmm, maybe, though for some reason i thought he'd be willing to take the name Arynn, i think this was a common practice in the middle ages
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On June 30 2012 00:21 Geo.Rion wrote:Show nested quote +On June 30 2012 00:17 Sentenal wrote:
The Starks have plenty of options to continue the line. Sansa could continue the blood, but seeing as how shes a she, the family name would die with her if she was the heir. I'm pretty sure Rickon will be the one to continue it. Maybe Jon is an option, seeing as how one of Robb's last acts was to legitimize him as a Stark, but there is the whole thing with the Nights Watch that is the problem there. But who knows how the aftermath of the books will leave him.
The Lannisters have options, as I'm sure there are still those with the name. Kevan has other sons, right? Martyn Lannister is alive, and Tyrek Lannister is MIA. Even if Jaime and Tyrion die, there are options.
Its the Baratheons and Arryns who are in danger of dying out. I'm pretty sure the Arryns are gone. The Baratheons... One of Robert's bastards would have to be legitimized, but I don't see any of the current monarchs or future monarchs doing so. Nope, in the North it can continue trough the female line, there s a tale when the Lord of Winderfell only had a daughter and she was kidnapped by the wildling king, they had a son, and he became the new Lord of Winterfell (later killing his father, without knowing). And at another point someone else explains that in the North daughters come before uncles in the succession line, so that would indicate the same thing. Show nested quote +On June 30 2012 00:06 ShadeR wrote:
Are the Henry the heir option and the Arryn line extinct option the same? Since Harrold is of House Hardyng. Hmm, maybe, though for some reason i thought he'd be willing to take the name Arynn, i think this was a common practice in the middle ages
That was the tale from a Wildling, right? I don't know if its trustworthy.
But are you telling me that if Robert really did marry Lyanna, then Robert would have became "Robert Stark"?
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On June 30 2012 00:29 Sentenal wrote:Show nested quote +On June 30 2012 00:21 Geo.Rion wrote:On June 30 2012 00:17 Sentenal wrote:
The Starks have plenty of options to continue the line. Sansa could continue the blood, but seeing as how shes a she, the family name would die with her if she was the heir. I'm pretty sure Rickon will be the one to continue it. Maybe Jon is an option, seeing as how one of Robb's last acts was to legitimize him as a Stark, but there is the whole thing with the Nights Watch that is the problem there. But who knows how the aftermath of the books will leave him.
The Lannisters have options, as I'm sure there are still those with the name. Kevan has other sons, right? Martyn Lannister is alive, and Tyrek Lannister is MIA. Even if Jaime and Tyrion die, there are options.
Its the Baratheons and Arryns who are in danger of dying out. I'm pretty sure the Arryns are gone. The Baratheons... One of Robert's bastards would have to be legitimized, but I don't see any of the current monarchs or future monarchs doing so. Nope, in the North it can continue trough the female line, there s a tale when the Lord of Winderfell only had a daughter and she was kidnapped by the wildling king, they had a son, and he became the new Lord of Winterfell (later killing his father, without knowing). And at another point someone else explains that in the North daughters come before uncles in the succession line, so that would indicate the same thing. On June 30 2012 00:06 ShadeR wrote:
Are the Henry the heir option and the Arryn line extinct option the same? Since Harrold is of House Hardyng. Hmm, maybe, though for some reason i thought he'd be willing to take the name Arynn, i think this was a common practice in the middle ages That was the tale from a Wildling, right? I don't know if its trustworthy. But are you telling me that if Robert really did marry Lyanna, then Robert would have became "Robert Stark"?
Definetly not, since Ned was alive and able to carry the name, but yeah even if he wasnt, another great house wont renounce from their name. Smaller houses though.... idk, i should do some research on it, i had it in my mind this way.
But if daughters come before uncles (i think Alice Karstark explains this), that would mean that for example Winterfell could go to a *insertdanomhouse* when there are other Starks around. Which doesnt make sense either.
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On June 30 2012 00:14 -Archangel- wrote:Show nested quote +On June 29 2012 23:49 Attican wrote:On June 29 2012 23:29 Geo.Rion wrote:On June 29 2012 23:24 Attican wrote:
I'm pretty sure that none of those people are gonna have any children during the course of the books so hopefully GRRM will have the time to write some stuff set after the ending of asoiaf when he's finished with the last two books. well not in the books, but who will be able (meaning not dead or unable to breed and if a bastard he needs legitimization) to continue the line at the point the books end. Tough to say really, I feel like Jaime will die, and unless Tyrion finds Tysha he probably won't have any legitimate children so the Lannister line is probably gonna go to some offshoot of the main Lannister family. The primary Arryn line is almost certainly going to die out. Sansa and Rickon will survive I think so either of them could have children, not too sure about Arya, even if she survives I don't know if she'd have children. The Baratheon line will continue, but it'll be through Edric or Gendry so it won't be legitimate either way. Why does Tyrion need Tysha do have legitimate children? He is married to Sansa still. And if that marriage gets abolished due to them not having had sex he can marry anyone still and have children. He just needs to be on a winning side when all the wars are done :D
He hasn't gotten over Tysha and I feel like he probably never will unless something drastic happens to him. I don't think he would give enough of a shit to try to have a normal life and marriage with anyone other than Tysha, especially after his attempt at that with Sansa.
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I really don't think Gendry is ever going to be anywhere near as important as some ideas keep thinking he will be. He was a tool for the black of hair thing that ended up sticking around with the nights watch caravan and then had a brief appearance to ruffle Brienne. He seems overused already and nearly has to be on the narrative chopping block of extraneous characters to simply fade out of the story. And remember, nobody even knows he is Robert's bastard in the first place.
The main/official Baratheon line is done. Shireen isn't going to live to adulthood and if she did probably would never have children of her own and nobody is about to legitimize Robert's surviving bastards.
The main Lannister line is looking quite bad but both Tyrion and Jaime have some chance. Otherwise they are still fine via cousins.
Starks should have both Rickon and Sansa, or at least Rickon. Bran isn't entirely out of game either, though I agree Arya more or less is. It is mostly on Rickon. Sansa seems likely to end up with <male victor figure> at the end having children who would be categorized under that line.
Arryns are more surely done than the Baratheons. Henry isn't an Arryn. It is all on deadboyshaking sweet robin.
Targaryens belong on that poll. They seem to be just behind the "surely screwed" lines as highly likely to be done despite the potential for multiple of their blood line among the "victors" at the end. If Dany stays barren, if Faegon is F, if Jon isn't a T, or if the person in question dies anyway or just doesn't end up in a position to have kids (Jon issue mostly) they are out.
Greyjoys are hardly safe either. Edit2: In fact, Greyjoys are in a ton of trouble. Who honestly sees Victarion or Euron surviving? Victarion probably won't survive the battle of Mereen despite being set to win the naval battle for Dany. If he survives the battle then what? We find out how much he is Moqorro's puppet? He tries to take Dany and gamblers everywhere lament how Drogon and Barristan kill him so quickly they couldn't place bets on which of them would be the one do it? Euron...ha. That leaves Asha...who is somewhere in the vicinity of as safe as Stannis.
edit:
Where is the everyone dies option? What if that original title for the last book was referring to four legged wolves because the others win?
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Essentially most of the members of the great houses are fucked (though only figuratively).
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EPT
