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[Hero] Bounty Hunter

Forum Index > Dota 2 Strategy
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Alleria-
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
90 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-02-05 15:21:34
December 19 2012 06:54 GMT
#1
[image loading]

Bounty Hunter

When the hunted tell tales of Gondar the Bounty Hunter, none are sure of which are true. In whispered tones they say he was abandoned as a kit, learning his skill in tracking as a matter of simple survival. Others hear he was an orphan of war, taken in by the great Soruq the Hunter to learn the master's skill with a blade as they plumbed the dark forests for big game. Still others believe he was a lowly street urchin raised among a guild of cutpurses and thieves, trained in the arts of stealth and misdirection. Around campfires in the wild countryside his quarry speaks the rumors of Gondar's work, growing ever more fearful: they say it was he who tracked down the tyrant King Goff years after the mad regent went into hiding, delivering his head and scepter as proof. That it was he who infiltrated the rebel camps at Highseat, finally bringing the legendary thief White Cape to be judged for his crimes. And that it was he who ended the career of Soruq the Hunter, condemned as a criminal for killing the Prince's prized hellkite. The tales of Gondar's incredible skill stretch on, with each daring feat more unbelievable than the last, each target more elusive. For the right price, the hunted know, anyone can be found. For the right price, even the mightiest may find fear in the shadows.

For abilities, stats, and other information, visit this hero's Liquipedia page here: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/dota2/Bounty_Hunter



Guides
Avoid Tranquils and Vanguard, but aside from that is still relevant. + Show Spoiler [Alleria-‘s Bounty Hunter Guide] +
CONTENTS
I. Introduction to the Guide
II. Skill Build and Concept
III. Item Builds for the Off-Lane
IV. What to Do and What Not to Do on the Off-Lane
V. Reading the Flow of the Game
VI. Follow-up Item Builds for Mid/Late Game
VII. Author’s Remarks



I. INTRODUCTION TO THE GUIDE

This guide isn’t about a special build, nor is it going to reveal to you anything you don’t know about what a Bounty Hunter is capable of. I hope this guide will be able to help those who have difficulties in attempting to off-lane Bounty Hunter and the direction of the hero should take after the laning phase. This guide is about doing the little things efficiently whilst utilising the hero to its maximum potential.

Bounty Hunter is one of the most played heroes in DotA 2, and it’s one of the very few heroes that can potentially win the off-lane and with that, the entire game itself. This guide will attempt to renew your understanding of Bounty Hunter and its abilities, while at the same time showing you the concept of the off-lane and how it fits Bounty Hunter as a hero perfectly.

To kick things off, here’s some facts about Bounty Hunter:

Pros
- Shadow Walk is a good escape mechanism
- Track vision, Track bonus gold, Track bonus movement speed
- Has great synergy with a lot of heroes in the current metagame

Cons
- Low HP and mana pool
- Relatively item-dependent hero
- Track armor reduction is being removed in the next patch


II. SKILL BUILD AND CONCEPT

When playing on the off-lane, the most important thing is getting your skill build right. It doesn’t matter if you have a ton of the right items, or a ton of levels for that matter, but if your skill build isn’t what it should be you are going to run into trouble. The three general problems with playing on the off-lane are lack of experience points, lack of gold and having to constantly read your opponents’ heroes.

The lack of experience points would stem from there being at least two heroes and sometimes three on the safe lane going up against you. This limits your ability to fully gain experience points as you may be forced back into a position where you won’t be in range to get experience points (denies come into play too). However, don’t fret too much. The beauty of Bounty Hunter is that you do not need that many levels in the early phase. As long as you’re keeping in touch with your opponent’s support heroes for the first 10 minutes of the game, you’re doing fine. But generally, you’ll find yourself ahead unless you die a couple of times while laning (which shouldn’t happen).

Against a tri-lane, it’s best to make use of Jinada (for tower creeping or last hits against neutrals if there is a pull) as you probably won’t have enough levels anyway to utilise Shuriken Toss; but that doesn’t mean you should neglect it.

Levels 1-7
[image loading] [image loading] [image loading] [image loading] [image loading] [image loading] [image loading]

Levels 8-9
[image loading] [image loading]
[image loading] [image loading]

In essence, you’ll normally be on the off-lane until the 10 minute mark or a bit longer than that depending on how the game goes. The skill build above works relatively well against a tri-lane and when you’re not leveling quickly. One of the reasons for the above skill build is that if you’re not leveling quickly, you’re probably not gaining much gold either, so you won’t get a quick Bottle and mana isn’t an expendable resource that you can simply spend on. You only need to skill Shadow Walk until Level 2, and then max out your other skills before maxing Shadow Walk. The reason for this is that at Level 1, Shadow Walk has a duration which syncs directly with your cooldown and it often reveals your position to your enemy when you cast Shadow Walk again.

One of the reasons I would recommend Jinada over Shuriken Toss is the fact that you can stand toe-to-toe against the opponents’ safe lane carry hero should the supports leave the lane. You might struggle against Luna and Tiny, but almost all other heroes would be fine to lane against as you are able to constantly deal 200 damage (even more with Phase Boots) every time Jinada is on cooldown.

An alternative skill build that works for Bounty Hunter is trying to make use of Shuriken Toss (only if your team is capable of pushing early towers and is capable of finding ganks in the early stages).

Levels 1-7
[image loading] [image loading] [image loading] [image loading] [image loading] [image loading] [image loading]

Levels 8-9
[image loading] [image loading]
[image loading] [image loading]

The reason why I wouldn’t recommend this build is that you would be over-reliant on Shuriken Toss; whether to lane or in battle. You will have relatively very low base damage and you would be more of a spell-caster rather than a damage dealer. Many people underestimate the slow you inflict on the opponent’s hero with Jinada but it actually is really useful, so if you are going with this build Level 1 Jinada is necessary.

However, the upside of this build is that if you have nukers in your team and your team’s lineup is based on early aggression, this build is the best you could do because Shuriken Toss allows you to kill off enemy heroes quickly before reinforcements arrive or before he/she can cast a spell without getting close to the said hero.

Levels 1-7
[image loading] [image loading] [image loading] [image loading] [image loading] [image loading] [image loading]

If you're being forced off your lane and/or if you encounter heavy pressure from wards or enemy supports, the above build might suit you better. When you encounter a situation like this, taking Level 2 Shadow Walk allows you to roam about the map (as it is not beneficial to stay in the lane) without being revealed due to the cooldown that Level 2 Shadow Walk provides (use Shadow Walk in the fog while you're still invisible to prevent your opponents from catching sight of you). This allows you to catch out potentially heroes that are jungling (like Naix or Prophet) or set up a gank on mid lane. I will not go too much into detail about this as this guide mainly focuses on the off-lane.

I’ll be mainly focusing on the first skill build from here forth, because I feel that it works better in general. The second skill build leaves you very vulnerable, particularly in the mid-game when spells become less of a factor and you don’t have enough damage from the lower levels of Jinada. Hence, you’ll often find yourself unable to contribute to team fights as much as you would want to. Alternatively, you could mix in Jinada with Shuriken Toss (taking at least Level 2 Shuriken Toss) in your skill build if you feel that it is right because I sometimes do that too if I feel that I need a little of both based on how the game is going (however, this is a pretty subjective call so I won’t go into any more detail about it).


III. ITEM BUILDS FOR THE OFF-LANE

You start with 603 gold, so make sure you get the right items because on the off-lane the slightest miscalculation could spell your doom.

Starting Items
[image loading] [image loading] [image loading] [image loading] [image loading]

You now have spent 499 gold and have 104 gold left to spare (builds you up to quicker Boots of Speed, a very important item when playing on the off-lane). A Healing Salve might be useful but if you play the hero right, you shouldn’t really need it (situational). However, if your opponent has a spell-based lineup, I would recommend getting it. If you’re playing pubs, it’s generally better to sacrifice one Iron Branch in favor of an Observer Ward to block pulls from the enemy side.

Core Items
[image loading] [image loading] [image loading] [image loading] [image loading]

Phase Boots is the best item designed for Bounty Hunter. An item that provides bonus movement speed, no pathing block, and damage! Some people opt for Power Treads instead, but as a hero that relies on getting Jinada strikes and chasing, Phase Boots will do you more good than harm from the early to the late game. Tranquil Boots is another viable option if you're pressed really badly in your lane. I haven't experimented with this much as I feel that if you're pressed badly, you should try and avoid getting hit/staying in range of spells. However, with the regen it provides and the bonus armor and movement speed it is a viable option if you're looking to hold the lane for as long as you can. The only downside of Tranquil Boots is that it does not grant you the bonus damage you benefit from having Phase Boots. Note: Don't be confused by the images. You should only get either Phase Boots or Tranquil Boots and not both!

Bottle is relatively optional, but I would highly recommend you getting one. It helps Bounty Hunter replenish just enough mana to stay in-lane and it’s great to pick up runes for ganking (at the same time replenishes your HP and mana through the charges). Bracer is good for Bounty Hunter as it helps reduce the slots taken up by Iron Branch, gives you additional HP and builds you up to getting Drum of Endurance.

Some people tend to skip Drum of Endurance in the build for Bounty Hunter (I admit that I might have done so on a couple of occasions too), but it is an extremely useful item to have. The bonus attack speed and movement speed from Swiftness aura syncs well with Bounty Hunter’s needs and Endurance does a lot for your team in team fights where you need to chase and with Track, pretty much gives your team a distinct advantage in hunting down enemy heroes. If you do skip Drum of Endurance in your item build, I would recommend replacing the Bracer with a Wraith Band for stats (bonus HP, mana and damage) purposes.


IV. WHAT TO DO AND WHAT NOT TO DO ON THE OFF-LANE

This is probably the most essential part of playing Bounty Hunter on the off-lane. I will again reiterate the three problems you will encounter on the off-lane: lack of experience points, lack of gold and having to constantly read your opponents’ heroes.

Why does Bounty Hunter suit the off-lane so well? It’s because of these three problems. The lack of experience points is not detrimental to Bounty Hunter as a hero in the team because Bounty Hunter is not a carry hero and neither is it a hero that depends on high levels for its skills to be effective. And by that I mean Track. As long as you have Shadow Walk, you should not suffer too heavily on the off-lane and not give away unnecessary deaths to your opponents.

The lack of gold also complements Bounty Hunter well, because Bounty Hunter is a hero that doesn’t rely on the big items to be effective. A simple Phase Boots, Bottle and Drum of Endurance (even without this) can last you through the early phase right up till the 20 minute mark. Another reason why this factor works in favour of Bounty Hunter is that you will practically begin helping out in team fights/tower fights around the 10-15 minute mark. This allows you to score some Track kills if your team does well, and from there you should be able to get some additional income.

Reading opponents’ heroes takes a lot of practise and it isn’t something you can work on overnight. If you’re an inexperienced player, you would generally fare poorly on the off-lane. You’d probably die a couple of times, complain about not having farm, and be extremely under-leveled below your opponents’ support heroes. As I mentioned above, for Bounty Hunter, these are not major problems but you have to know the limitations of each problem when you encounter them. Reading what your opponents’ support heroes are doing is important as you need to know if you’re getting ganked or if they have left the lane to gank elsewhere. Of course having Observer Wards would be useful, but if they have Sentry Wards up, you need to know how to move around the lane and not be caught in a vulnerable position.

Also, reading your opponents’ carry hero’s farm is vital. You need to be the judge of how much he/she is farming relative to your team’s carry hero (if you have one). From there, you need to set the tempo of the game for your team and start directing the flow in which the game should go. Again, this isn’t something you can do overnight but something that you need constant practise to achieve. Patience is key to mastering these concepts, but it can be done.

Okay, now to the point:

What to Do

- Try to stay within experience range of creeps (doesn’t matter if they get denied) by making use of the trees/fog/terrain
- Identify pulls (if any) so that you know when it’s safe to take a creep or two or move into experience range
- Constantly check to see if there are any Sentry Wards/Dust of Appearance up on the heroes you’re facing
- Block opponents’ neutral spawn by utilising Shadow Walk to prevent pulls and allow the creeps to push towards your tower (be wary for wards and Shadow Walk cooldown)
- Harass the opponent carry hero when the supports are not in the lane with Jinada (this is much more effective than you might think)
- Try to constantly Track an enemy hero for vision and movement speed bonus (if possible, target the support heroes to identify their position)
- When you have Track up, try to keep a TP scroll to help out in fights elsewhere


What Not to Do

- Rely on Shadow Walk to last hit or gain experience points (this will instigate your opponents to commit to Sentry Wards/Dust of Appearance to kill you)
- Over-extend when taking last hits more often than not (this will probably get you caught out of position once every ten times and that alone is enough to set your team back)
- Extreme tower hugging (only resort to this if your opponent has Sentry Wards and a very aggressive lane, but even so you should do other things like spotting for rune spawns)
- Be greedy (learn to accept that you have to fall back at times, it’s better to be safe than sorry; you can always make up for lost gold later with Track kills)
- Chasing down and attacking enemy supports during pulls made against you (unless you are sure of the kill or have assistance from Sun Strike, Thundergod’s Wrath, etc)


A lot of this are just the basic ideas of how you should play on the off-lane with Bounty Hunter (you can consider them conjectures if you want), and in practise a lot of this might not be so black and white. Experience and game sense plays a big factor when you play on the off-lane, especially the latter. The only way to work on this is to play more games, and keep the assumption on the back of your head that your opponent is looking to kill you if you present to them even the slightest of chances.

Note: Also, always be wary of the possibility that your opponents may dive your tower to attempt a kill on you when their creep wave is pushing the tower at a strong rate (about 7/8 creeps or more).


V. READING THE FLOW OF THE GAME

This is another important part when it comes to playing Bounty Hunter on the off-lane. This part involves two things, namely knowing when to stay in the lane and knowing when to leave the lane. As an off-lane hero, you will find that staying in the lane for too long would prove to be detrimental to you and your team. Hence, your immediate reaction is either to call for help or to roam to the middle lane trying to achieve something. However, without core items (Phase Boots or Bottle) you will not be able to get much done. This is why it is essential that you do not give away kills as you will lose gold and at the same time slow down your item progression.

If your team is winning the other lanes convincingly, it’s best that you stick to your lane and hold it out. It doesn’t matter if you’re not doing well, but you’re drawing the opponents’ supports to you and building space for your team to take the lead. As long as you do not give away kills, you’re doing your job right and the onus is upon your team to get their lanes right too. However, even if your team doesn’t do well in the laning phase, do not panic. Bounty Hunter is a hero that allows your team to catch back up and draw level with your opponents if you just win one big battle.

If your opponents are playing a very aggressive push strategy, you should try to participate in defending your towers as often as you can (this means TP-ing to help). Normally in a game with Bounty Hunter, if your opponents try really hard to get a tower, they will find a hero or two dying in that process. With Track kills on those heroes, you’re basically making up for the gold lost from the tower falling. One thing to note in these engagements is never poke at your opponents with Jinada + Shadow Walk, and never attack when Shadow Walk is on cooldown (situational depending on the tide of the battle).

If your team is the one applying a lot of aggression, it is good to participate in tower fights as well. Getting a couple of Track kills for your team is added bonus for the tower kills that you potentially can take from the early pushes.

It is important to realise that Bounty Hunter is as much a team hero as it is an individual hero. Yes, you may score kills on your own but in team fights, it’s a hero than can excel brilliantly and scales well into the late game. Some rules of thumb when you approach the mid-game:

- Do not roam around aimlessly following opponents’ heroes
- Do not get greedy by constantly hunting heroes who are jungling (may work once or twice at the start but be wary of detection after that)
- Do not steal the safe lane farm from your carry (unless you’re the carry for the team)
- Identify potential areas that your opponent might have warded (so that you know when you can use Shadow Walk to benefit you)
- Try to Track any hero that comes close to you/your lane and always Track heroes during fights to get Track kills
- Check for rune spawns if possible; and be careful of wards at the river
- Always participate in fights! This is probably the most important part since Bounty Hunter contributes and benefits heavily from battles


VI. FOLLOW-UP ITEM BUILDS FOR MID-LATE GAME

Core Items
[image loading] [image loading] [image loading] [image loading]

The above is what I deem as the core items for Bounty Hunter (on the fence on Monkey King Bar). If you’ve ever played a game with Bounty Hunter, you’d realise that damage output and survivability are essential in the mid-late game.

Getting the Black King Bar is situational as you might not be the focus fire of your opponents but it is vital to get it even after you have gone for Desolator first. However, I would recommend it as your first item unless you have an extremely good start to the game where a Desolator could help you two/three shots-kill an enemy hero. Otherwise, always BKB first as it gives you good team fight survivability and aids you in dealing damage throughout the fight.

Desolator is good for a couple of things as it gives you really good damage and at the same time lowers the enemy’s armor. With Jinada and Track, this is a great item as it allows you to deal massive amounts of damage during team fights as you can chase down heroes quickly and get many hits in.

Monkey King Bar is a good late game item for Bounty Hunter because of the damage output it offers. It works well against heroes like Luna or Void who have evasion in the late game (Luna with Butterfly).

As many posters in the guide have suggested, Abyssal Blade is a viable core item for Bounty Hunter. I have not had much experience with it, but the +100 damage and 2 second stun (even against Magic Immune targets) really does pack a strong punch against any hero whether carry or support. It is possible to get this before Desolator if you're having a really good early to mid game, as the item is split into a Skull Basher and a Sacred Relic. The 2 second stun from the item allows you to shut down your opponents' main carry during fights and this is crucial against heroes like Void or Sven.

Situational Items
[image loading] [image loading] [image loading] [image loading] [image loading]

You should and only get Vladmir’s Offering after you’ve got your core items up. It’s good to support your team’s melee carry and Vladmir's aura grants bonus damage and armor. So only get it if your team can benefit from this during team fights (normally when your team is the more aggressive team).

HoT is essential if you’re going to be the one leading the frontline of your team in battles. It’s always good to get it after you get Desolator so that you still have enough damage output during battles. However, I wouldn’t recommend getting this if you find yourself and your team severely under-farmed heading into the mid-late game transition (if that is the case, a Vanguard will suffice).

Only get BoT (by selling off Phase Boots) when you have enough for buy-back and run out of item slots for TP scroll.

Lastly, Daedalus might be a decent item choice when your team does not have much damage output in the late game. I would normally get it (though I didn't realise it) when my team does not have much burst damage come late game against heroes that are pretty hard to kill.


VII. AUTHOR'S REMARKS

I do not have the biggest experience in playing DotA 2 at a competitive level but I watch a lot of it and I have participated in my fair share of competitive DotA during the WarCraft III days. I have spent 8 years playing this game, and have experienced the times of VP, MYM and SK during the .48b era and then the China dominance that followed, up till now. I wasn’t a competitive player back then but I played competitively for 3 years and achieved average results (one semifinal and a lot of quarterfinal/3rd round exits) in local LAN competitions in a place where there were teams like Kingsurf, DNA-SK, Cybertime, Zenith, AEON.sg, and many more that was competing for top honours.

Play safe, play smart, and play right. Know your role in the team, and know your team’s capabilities. Do not rush into doing anything you shouldn’t be doing and do not attempt to over-commit to get kills. One final point to note is that Smoke of Deceit plays a big factor in winning/losing games, so make sure you utilise it well with your team because Bounty Hunter and Track allows for a lot of opportunities to execute perfect Smoke ganks. Take the above mentioned advices lightly as they do not represent exactly how you should play a hero on the off-lane. These are just meant for Bounty Hunter and what I feel is best for the hero. Do not engrave the guidance above into your head, but just spare a thought for it may come to help you when you play the hero on the off-lane.

My personal record with Bounty Hunter isn't too impressive as I started off without knowing the basics to playing on the off-lane. But now that I am better at it, I wish to share my knowledge and my understanding of this hero and its fitting role as an off-lane hero.

[image loading] [image loading]
"For the right price, anything."

Changelog:
19/12 - Guide published
21/12 - Updated item builds, skill build and some additional explanations
22/12 - Proposed update (better explanation with screenshots)


No longer works but is nice for nostalgia’s sake. Kupon3ss's Guide to Shadowblade Bounty Hunter

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Laserist
Profile Joined September 2011
Turkey4269 Posts
December 19 2012 09:44 GMT
#2
A very good guide, I should say. If you omit terms like jinada, track wtc.. it suddenly turns out to be a wonderful overall dota guide.

One point is about shuriken toss. It is known that most mana/point efficient level of ST is level two. There is no point to invest it more than two until you max your other skills. My suggestion would be level up ST to lvl 2 in your skill build at level 7 and keep it level 2 in the second build.

Another thing is, your first build aims to survive against a trilane or a very hard lane to get xp/gold by any means. But you suggest to leave shadow walk level 1 until maxing jinada. This looks like a luxury for a hard lane. I suggest you to take another level of SW because(as you already mentioned) it allows you to be perma invis as far as your mana pool permits. Perma invis also good to fool the opponents to trick the lane presence.

Also BH players always have to look at the opponents' inventory to understand if there is any reveal material there. Especially supports. Also roaming the nearby jungle to detect dust/ward ganks are essential too.

“Are you with the Cartel? Because you’re definitely an Angel.”
evilfatsh1t
Profile Joined October 2010
Australia8614 Posts
December 19 2012 10:10 GMT
#3
wow thats a lot of bounty hunter games
dont understand how you could play the same hero so many times in a row
Alleria-
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
90 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-19 10:22:06
December 19 2012 10:18 GMT
#4
On December 19 2012 18:44 Laserist wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
A very good guide, I should say. If you omit terms like jinada, track wtc.. it suddenly turns out to be a wonderful overall dota guide.

One point is about shuriken toss. It is known that most mana/point efficient level of ST is level two. There is no point to invest it more than two until you max your other skills. My suggestion would be level up ST to lvl 2 in your skill build at level 7 and keep it level 2 in the second build.

Another thing is, your first build aims to survive against a trilane or a very hard lane to get xp/gold by any means. But you suggest to leave shadow walk level 1 until maxing jinada. This looks like a luxury for a hard lane. I suggest you to take another level of SW because(as you already mentioned) it allows you to be perma invis as far as your mana pool permits. Perma invis also good to fool the opponents to trick the lane presence.

Also BH players always have to look at the opponents' inventory to understand if there is any reveal material there. Especially supports. Also roaming the nearby jungle to detect dust/ward ganks are essential too.


Thanks for the feedback. Yeah, I agree with your first point. At Level 1, Shuriken Toss is a bit of a weak spell and is only useful for cancelling channeling abilities. That's why I also mentioned I mix in a little of both into my game as well occasionally. But I don't generally utilise it until I leave the lane to start defending/pushing towers, and that's usually when the hero hits Level 7-8.

I generally wouldn't advise on staying invisible constantly unless you actually do it right from the start. I find that the problem with taking Level 2 Shadow Walk early on (Levels 2-5) is that you suffer from the long Jinada cooldown and because you're not leveling quickly and/or opponents have detection, it doesn't really matter if you take Level 1 or Level 2. I guess in competitive games, this would be more viable.

I'll try to fit those two points in later. Thanks. (:


On December 19 2012 19:10 evilfatsh1t wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
wow thats a lot of bounty hunter games
dont understand how you could play the same hero so many times in a row

Haha. I didn't play all those games consecutively. I just filtered my recent games to just show my Bounty Hunter games.

wherebugsgo
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Japan10647 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-19 10:23:47
December 19 2012 10:22 GMT
#5
I think the daedalus is a waste of an item, tbh.

You can get damage while getting utility too. Daedalus/crystalys only gives you damage on the first hit, the crit is not possible (because of jinada). So instead, why not get basher into abyssal?

It gives more damage on the first hit, and it gives you utility in the form of a small amount of health and the stun chance. Daedalus is particularly less useful on BH because he generally doesn't build attack speed items. Once you have enough gold to build daedalus, an abyssal gives you far more utility for only about 1k gold more. You can put a 2 second stun on a magic immune target and your entire team can hit them at will.

I especially like AdmiralBulldog's standard BH build for this. He basically builds the same items every game, but in differing orders depending on how he does and what's necessary. I.E. he'll sometimes go for the BKB before a basher or vice versa. (also he builds deso more sparingly, I think)
Alleria-
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
90 Posts
December 19 2012 10:51 GMT
#6
On December 19 2012 19:22 wherebugsgo wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
I think the daedalus is a waste of an item, tbh.

You can get damage while getting utility too. Daedalus/crystalys only gives you damage on the first hit, the crit is not possible (because of jinada). So instead, why not get basher into abyssal?

It gives more damage on the first hit, and it gives you utility in the form of a small amount of health and the stun chance. Daedalus is particularly less useful on BH because he generally doesn't build attack speed items. Once you have enough gold to build daedalus, an abyssal gives you far more utility for only about 1k gold more. You can put a 2 second stun on a magic immune target and your entire team can hit them at will.

I especially like AdmiralBulldog's standard BH build for this. He basically builds the same items every game, but in differing orders depending on how he does and what's necessary. I.E. he'll sometimes go for the BKB before a basher or vice versa. (also he builds deso more sparingly, I think)

Could you elaborate more on the critical being not possible? I'm pretty sure I've hit two or three crits in a row that weren't Jinada hits. And with BKB + Phase Boots + Track, you should be able to get in a couple of hits in with ease. I agree that BH doesn't go for attack speed items, but with armor reduction from Desolator, I find the damage output from Daedalus to be quite good.

I've rarely tried some of the "newer" items (like Veil of Discord, Abyssal Blade, Rod of Atos to name a few) being the classic WarCraft III DotA player that I was. Although it's very costly, but I think the +100 damage and the 2 second stun is too hard to neglect. I'll try to incorporate Abyssal Blade into the guide. Thanks for the feedback. Heh. I'll probably start experimenting with it too! (:
Mykill
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
Canada3402 Posts
December 19 2012 11:11 GMT
#7
On December 19 2012 19:51 Alleria- wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 19 2012 19:22 wherebugsgo wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
I think the daedalus is a waste of an item, tbh.

You can get damage while getting utility too. Daedalus/crystalys only gives you damage on the first hit, the crit is not possible (because of jinada). So instead, why not get basher into abyssal?

It gives more damage on the first hit, and it gives you utility in the form of a small amount of health and the stun chance. Daedalus is particularly less useful on BH because he generally doesn't build attack speed items. Once you have enough gold to build daedalus, an abyssal gives you far more utility for only about 1k gold more. You can put a 2 second stun on a magic immune target and your entire team can hit them at will.

I especially like AdmiralBulldog's standard BH build for this. He basically builds the same items every game, but in differing orders depending on how he does and what's necessary. I.E. he'll sometimes go for the BKB before a basher or vice versa. (also he builds deso more sparingly, I think)

Could you elaborate more on the critical being not possible? I'm pretty sure I've hit two or three crits in a row that weren't Jinada hits. And with BKB + Phase Boots + Track, you should be able to get in a couple of hits in with ease. I agree that BH doesn't go for attack speed items, but with armor reduction from Desolator, I find the damage output from Daedalus to be quite good.

I've rarely tried some of the "newer" items (like Veil of Discord, Abyssal Blade, Rod of Atos to name a few) being the classic WarCraft III DotA player that I was. Although it's very costly, but I think the +100 damage and the 2 second stun is too hard to neglect. I'll try to incorporate Abyssal Blade into the guide. Thanks for the feedback. Heh. I'll probably start experimenting with it too! (:


your first hit which is a crit will be from jinada not deadalus and then for 5 seconds you may get lucky but you don't really have high attack speed so really it's not as useful as getting basher +health and then moving into abyssal if you're winning a lot. +stun.
[~~The Impossible Leads To Invention~~] CJ Entusman #52 The problem with internet quotations is that they are hard to verify -Abraham Lincoln c.1863
kaykaykay
Profile Joined July 2012
Singapore637 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-19 13:45:44
December 19 2012 11:48 GMT
#8
Really good guide, I like how you've covered the dos and don'ts. however I feel tranquil boots is also a valid option especially if you're getting suppressed badly in the laning stage.

"Play safe, play smart, and play right. Know your role in the team, and know your team’s capabilities."
Couldn't have been said better.
Starve the ego, feed the soul.
zaikantos
Profile Joined July 2011
Netherlands43 Posts
December 19 2012 17:29 GMT
#9
Great guide.

I agree with tranquil boots when you had a very bad lane and have a mid that needs/wants bottle.
No.
madestro
Profile Joined October 2010
Costa Rica108 Posts
December 19 2012 17:35 GMT
#10
Thanks so much for this guide. Bounty hunter is truly one of my favorite heroes in my short Dota "career" and I love to play him in the off lane. Start roaming as soon as I get track and give the lane to another farmer or pressure that lane to disrupt the enemies main carry.

It does take a ton of skill (which I still don't have) to play an off laner, let alone one with a so-so escape mechanism (sure shadow walk is great but is no windrun or surge). I shall follow all you advices in my road to becoming the best BH I can.

On December 19 2012 20:48 kaykaykay wrote:
Really good guide, I like how you've covered the dos and don'ts. however I feel tranquil boots is also a valid option especially if you're getting suppressed badly in the laning stage.

"Play safe, play smart, and play right. Know your role in the team, and know your team’s capabilities."
Couldn't have been said better.


Yeah tranquils are a really valid choice but only if you are doing poorly in your lane, like one or 2 deaths and sentries everywhere. The thing is phase gives you dmg and chasing ability, things that are really really needed for the first ganks. Tranquils I found better when I am behind since I can juke around and use them when escaping.
Ideally phase + drums + bottle is the BH gankers dream for early game but when I am behind in farm or xp I like to go Urn + Tranquils (unless some other ganker in my team has a urn of course) so I can catch up via ganks, teamfights and track gold and get the regular Drums and Phase.
Sometimes when you are behind you also end up being more of a utility hero so I end up with Vlads, Drums, Tranquils, Urn and maybe a "luxury" BKB lol and that really helps out when you have 2 or more melee heroes in your team like a Magnus, Sven, Naix lineup for example.
"The Swarm will consume all." - Queen of Blades
DucK-
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Singapore11446 Posts
December 19 2012 17:43 GMT
#11
I really dislike the current competitive build that most use, that is to max Toss first. I think it's a poor choice of skill build, but it's probably because they don't rely on Jinada attacks too much. They prefer the range 'nuke' from Toss. But it certainly is a bad build for pubs.

I agree on Laserist in that you should get Toss to level 2 first. I usually go WW Jinada Jinada Toss Toss Track -> max Jinada -> level 2 WW -> max Toss -> max WW. Ideally, I want to delay level 1 WW as long as possible. With pull camps blocked, you're relatively safe near the tower without WW. Still, chances are you will need to skill WW by 4. Be flexible and not skill anything until you see your lane.

Items wise, I personally think Daed is a waste of gold. You will probably not have that many high tier items anyway. 3 big items would be a luxury, and BKB/Heart/Deso/MKB/AC/Basher would all be more useful than Daed. Even if you have full item set, it still needs to compete with BF/Manta/Vlad etc.

Your guide in general is spot on. BH can and should function as a hero without much farm. Most important thing of BH is Track. Never 'forget' to cast track in a kill. Track is just too good. It pains me to see BH players farming creeps all day, when heroes probably give much more gold.
Emnjay808
Profile Blog Joined September 2011
United States10655 Posts
December 19 2012 19:12 GMT
#12
Would you consider Orb of Venom to be a useful item, even if you're playing suicide role? Ive seen Trixi use it in recent games and it looks like it works really well. I just want more input on the matter.
Skol
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
December 19 2012 20:07 GMT
#13
On December 20 2012 02:43 DucK- wrote:
I really dislike the current competitive build that most use, that is to max Toss first. I think it's a poor choice of skill build, but it's probably because they don't rely on Jinada attacks too much. They prefer the range 'nuke' from Toss. But it certainly is a bad build for pubs.

I agree on Laserist in that you should get Toss to level 2 first. I usually go WW Jinada Jinada Toss Toss Track -> max Jinada -> level 2 WW -> max Toss -> max WW. Ideally, I want to delay level 1 WW as long as possible. With pull camps blocked, you're relatively safe near the tower without WW. Still, chances are you will need to skill WW by 4. Be flexible and not skill anything until you see your lane.

Items wise, I personally think Daed is a waste of gold. You will probably not have that many high tier items anyway. 3 big items would be a luxury, and BKB/Heart/Deso/MKB/AC/Basher would all be more useful than Daed. Even if you have full item set, it still needs to compete with BF/Manta/Vlad etc.

Your guide in general is spot on. BH can and should function as a hero without much farm. Most important thing of BH is Track. Never 'forget' to cast track in a kill. Track is just too good. It pains me to see BH players farming creeps all day, when heroes probably give much more gold.

Shuriken max is more or less required in competitive games because of how much better competitive teams are at suppressing a hard laner's development. It's not all that unexpected in some cases to see a hard laner suppressed down to level 2 or 3 in the first 7 minutes. At that point, planning around BH being able to actually even USE Jinada is basically suicide. Until you start racking up a lot of free gold from track kills in teamfights, you're basically a caster that spams track and Shuriken from max range, which is why Shuriken max is the build of choice in those situations.

In pub games players are generally poor at controlling the lane and will push the lane across very quickly. Level 6 and Boots+Bottle by 6 minutes is fairly normal, and in that case your development is smooth enough that you can probably afford to get Jinada earlier if you play smart in fights. Shuriken max is still a good option if you're behind, though.
Moderator
Alleria-
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
90 Posts
December 20 2012 00:56 GMT
#14
On December 19 2012 20:48 kaykaykay wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
Really good guide, I like how you've covered the dos and don'ts. however I feel tranquil boots is also a valid option especially if you're getting suppressed badly in the laning stage.

"Play safe, play smart, and play right. Know your role in the team, and know your team’s capabilities."
Couldn't have been said better.
On December 20 2012 02:29 zaikantos wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
Great guide.

I agree with tranquil boots when you had a very bad lane and have a mid that needs/wants bottle.
On December 20 2012 02:35 madestro wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
Thanks so much for this guide. Bounty hunter is truly one of my favorite heroes in my short Dota "career" and I love to play him in the off lane. Start roaming as soon as I get track and give the lane to another farmer or pressure that lane to disrupt the enemies main carry.

It does take a ton of skill (which I still don't have) to play an off laner, let alone one with a so-so escape mechanism (sure shadow walk is great but is no windrun or surge). I shall follow all you advices in my road to becoming the best BH I can.

On December 19 2012 20:48 kaykaykay wrote:
Really good guide, I like how you've covered the dos and don'ts. however I feel tranquil boots is also a valid option especially if you're getting suppressed badly in the laning stage.

"Play safe, play smart, and play right. Know your role in the team, and know your team’s capabilities."
Couldn't have been said better.


Yeah tranquils are a really valid choice but only if you are doing poorly in your lane, like one or 2 deaths and sentries everywhere. The thing is phase gives you dmg and chasing ability, things that are really really needed for the first ganks. Tranquils I found better when I am behind since I can juke around and use them when escaping.
Ideally phase + drums + bottle is the BH gankers dream for early game but when I am behind in farm or xp I like to go Urn + Tranquils (unless some other ganker in my team has a urn of course) so I can catch up via ganks, teamfights and track gold and get the regular Drums and Phase.
Sometimes when you are behind you also end up being more of a utility hero so I end up with Vlads, Drums, Tranquils, Urn and maybe a "luxury" BKB lol and that really helps out when you have 2 or more melee heroes in your team like a Magnus, Sven, Naix lineup for example.

Thanks. Although Tranquil Boots in general is a good item, I just feel that it doesn't match well with Bounty Hunter. When you're limited in your farm, you should get the most efficient items possible, and I feel that Phase Boots would be best in that scenario. If you're relying on Tranquil Boots instead of Tango to stay in the lane, you're probably being too ambitious in trying to get creeps or opponents have really good spell casters (in which you should drop back more than risk being killed). Even if mid lane has a Bottle, the item is still good for Bounty Hunter because you essentially use the Bottle to recoup mana (after fights), not HP.

On December 20 2012 02:43 DucK- wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
I really dislike the current competitive build that most use, that is to max Toss first. I think it's a poor choice of skill build, but it's probably because they don't rely on Jinada attacks too much. They prefer the range 'nuke' from Toss. But it certainly is a bad build for pubs.

I agree on Laserist in that you should get Toss to level 2 first. I usually go WW Jinada Jinada Toss Toss Track -> max Jinada -> level 2 WW -> max Toss -> max WW. Ideally, I want to delay level 1 WW as long as possible. With pull camps blocked, you're relatively safe near the tower without WW. Still, chances are you will need to skill WW by 4. Be flexible and not skill anything until you see your lane.

Items wise, I personally think Daed is a waste of gold. You will probably not have that many high tier items anyway. 3 big items would be a luxury, and BKB/Heart/Deso/MKB/AC/Basher would all be more useful than Daed. Even if you have full item set, it still needs to compete with BF/Manta/Vlad etc.

Your guide in general is spot on. BH can and should function as a hero without much farm. Most important thing of BH is Track. Never 'forget' to cast track in a kill. Track is just too good. It pains me to see BH players farming creeps all day, when heroes probably give much more gold.

Well, the good thing about getting Shadow Walk first is that it allows you to scout out your enemy jungle to see if there are any heroes waiting to pick you off at Level 1 and also block the 0:30 neutral spawn to prevent pulls. Yeah, maybe I'll have to rewrite the item choice on getting Daedalus. I realise most of the times I get Daedalus is when my team needs burst damage since I'm basically the damage dealer during fights (games with Pudge/Warlock solo mid or three spell casters taking the safe lane).

On December 20 2012 04:12 Emnjay808 wrote:
Would you consider Orb of Venom to be a useful item, even if you're playing suicide role? Ive seen Trixi use it in recent games and it looks like it works really well. I just want more input on the matter.

I wouldn't consider this a suicide role for Bounty Hunter since the role fits the hero so well. Anyway, I don't think it would be a good investment unless you have a really good start (like getting a kill or your team takes down a tower in the opening 5 minutes forcing the opponents' supports to be absent from your lane). Maybe it would work as a utility item in the mid-game (for additional slow) but as people mentioned, when BKB itself at times is hard to come by that 275 gold could be better spent.

Ottoxlol
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
735 Posts
December 20 2012 01:44 GMT
#15
this isnt windrunner...
aintz
Profile Joined August 2010
Canada5624 Posts
December 20 2012 02:45 GMT
#16
drums + bottle is generally a waste of gold. also you should mention to new bh players they need to check other heroes inventory constantly. and suiciding for a track kill is almost always worth it.
coriamon
Profile Joined August 2011
244 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-20 02:52:11
December 20 2012 02:50 GMT
#17
On December 20 2012 10:44 Ottoxlol wrote:
this isnt windrunner...

Alleria is the person who made the guide's username. The guide is on Gondar the Bounty Hunter.

I noticed that you mention vladmir's offering to be built after your core items. Is there ever a time where one would consider getting vlads after phase boots as most pros are doing nowadays?
aintz
Profile Joined August 2010
Canada5624 Posts
December 20 2012 02:57 GMT
#18
On December 20 2012 11:50 coriamon wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 20 2012 10:44 Ottoxlol wrote:
this isnt windrunner...

Alleria is the person who made the guide's username. The guide is on Gondar the Bounty Hunter.

I noticed that you mention vladmir's offering to be built after your core items. Is there ever a time where one would consider getting vlads after phase boots as most pros are doing nowadays?


noobs also copy pros by buying bottle and doesnt use it properly. and what pros are we talking about here thats getting vlads after phase.
Ottoxlol
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
735 Posts
December 20 2012 03:04 GMT
#19
On December 20 2012 11:50 coriamon wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 20 2012 10:44 Ottoxlol wrote:
this isnt windrunner...

Alleria is the person who made the guide's username. The guide is on Gondar the Bounty Hunter.

I noticed that you mention vladmir's offering to be built after your core items. Is there ever a time where one would consider getting vlads after phase boots as most pros are doing nowadays?


that was the joke o_O
Laserist
Profile Joined September 2011
Turkey4269 Posts
December 20 2012 12:50 GMT
#20
Vlad is always bad early since it contributes most of the time as percentage. You need raw dmg/attack speed to use it in full potential. Just don't get it early or leave it to the 3rd or 4th position. I just suggest to buy it to lycan and ursa early, because of roshan and effective jungling.
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