|
On September 25 2014 23:31 Plansix wrote:
Man, Merlini continues to be the guy to listen to when it come to patch notes and level headed impressions. His break down was really on point and I like how he didn’t go through each change. His analysis of the map changes were really interesting, especially about the Radiant offlane being easier to gank(I didn’t even think of that). I also like how he just moved over stuff that he couldn’t really assess without seeing it in game, like the XP and Gold changes with only a comment “the comeback is real”.
I wish more people would do it like he did, rather than rush to put something up on youtube without even thinking about the changes.
Half the point of new patch notes is to freak out and overreact, imo. For any of the more complicated changes noone is gonna know exactly how it will play out, but it's fun to theorycraft / see people theorycraft what the hell the fallout will be.
I'm still on the fence on the gold/exp changes though. If it works like I think it does, it'll only take one game of some doofus deciding that he hates our whole team and intentionally feeding two or three kills to throw most of our advantage.
And even if you're losing, such a high emphasis is put on pickoffs... I dunno. I'm anxious to see what it'll do to the game, but I'm afraid I won't like it that much.
|
The math puts a lot of weight on the victim's net worth, their level and the number heroes involved. I think it would become an issue of a team was head, but had none support to kept dying to the same solo carry over and over, but we will have to see.
I feel that people are also forgetting that every time it happens the math changes dynamically with each kill and the number of heroes involved. So the amount of gold that could change hands in a big fight is hard to tell.
But if its bad, it will be changed quickly. And people didn't like the one sided games that were so prevalent in IT, so this might mitigate that a little. But I don't think we are going to see teams for 30K down coming back with a single team fight. And even then, most of the fights we see when the teams are down that much are comically one sided.
|
I hope this doesn't turn into 4 protect 1 80 min farm fest with 10 kills.
Watch in a couple of months people are going to beg for the deathball meta back
|
On September 26 2014 00:09 ref4 wrote:
I hope this doesn't turn into 4 protect 1 80 min farm fest with 10 kills.
Watch in a couple of months people are going to beg for the deathball meta back
the deathball meta will come back on its own, like it does every single time
|
On September 25 2014 23:31 Plansix wrote:
Man, Merlini continues to be the guy to listen to when it come to patch notes and level headed impressions. His break down was really on point and I like how he didn’t go through each change. His analysis of the map changes were really interesting, especially about the Radiant offlane being easier to gank(I didn’t even think of that). I also like how he just moved over stuff that he couldn’t really assess without seeing it in game, like the XP and Gold changes with only a comment “the comeback is real”.
I wish more people would do it like he did, rather than rush to put something up on youtube without even thinking about the changes.
I agree with this, I enjoyed his analysis also very much. As a competitive player he has a bit of a different apporch point as a 3,9k scrub, for me lycan wasn't in that kind of a nerf, after it was really hard already to jungle him and getting roshan was already hard and now it will be basicly impossible to sneak a rosh coz everyone has vision and he's stronger. Towers are harder to kill and give less gold and more glyphs, I think there wasn't an (additional) nerf necessary..
I like the cm buffs, my favorite support, and I am looking forward to the new item, will be fun to buy it and dive towers now with all the new escape routs
|
Northern Ireland22208 Posts
|
All buffs to CM are awesome. The change in the way the damage is applied to her snare makes it do a little more damage to creeps, which means better farming. And she is one of my favorite heroes because she can get so much done out of sight of the enemy, always bringing the fear.
|
Meat hook damage pierces bkb now? Oh well.
|
Wow I didn't think about what that does to neuts LOL
Literally 1k dmg to neuts now, you barely need to auto the big ones
|
On September 25 2014 23:55 Fleetfeet wrote:Show nested quote +On September 25 2014 23:31 Plansix wrote:
Man, Merlini continues to be the guy to listen to when it come to patch notes and level headed impressions. His break down was really on point and I like how he didn’t go through each change. His analysis of the map changes were really interesting, especially about the Radiant offlane being easier to gank(I didn’t even think of that). I also like how he just moved over stuff that he couldn’t really assess without seeing it in game, like the XP and Gold changes with only a comment “the comeback is real”.
I wish more people would do it like he did, rather than rush to put something up on youtube without even thinking about the changes.
Half the point of new patch notes is to freak out and overreact, imo. For any of the more complicated changes noone is gonna know exactly how it will play out, but it's fun to theorycraft / see people theorycraft what the hell the fallout will be. I'm still on the fence on the gold/exp changes though. If it works like I think it does, it'll only take one game of some doofus deciding that he hates our whole team and intentionally feeding two or three kills to throw most of our advantage. And even if you're losing, such a high emphasis is put on pickoffs... I dunno. I'm anxious to see what it'll do to the game, but I'm afraid I won't like it that much.
The problem is that the "comeback" mechanic swings the balance more in favor of 5man teamfight over farming. Advantage is only being measured by net worth and level, here. That's not the only kind of advantage. A team can gain a sudden advantage thanks to a specific level or item pickup that isn't cleanly measured on a linear chart. Hell, they can even gain an advantage simply due to good positioning or a lucky Smoke. None of these are accounted for in the formula, meaning that winning a teamfight will give more gold than it really ought to. I'm sure we've all had these experiences of the dumb 5man ult strat winning several unlikely teamfights from way behind in a row and only sometimes managing to translate that into a win. Now it's going to be inevitable for the 5man to regain all their lost ground.
The worst interaction of the new mechanic is with heroes that have basically unstoppable pickoff potential: Doom and Void. A hero can absolutely wreck the laning phase, get into the midgame with a huge advantage... and will still be killed by the pair, because Doom and Chrono are really, really strong spells. Duel, for what it's worth, has much of the same pickoff quality. Black Hole is absurdly strong, but has a significantly longer cooldown. This is going to be problematic in pro games as much as pubs. I imagine teams will attempt some kind of 4 protect 1 strat with basically invulnerable heroes like Morphling, but that will quickly devolve into yet another fucking 5man meta where everyone stays close to the carry because getting caught out gives the other team too much.
Anyone remember that TI3 game where Burning got 12slotted on LD because his team was too scared to push high ground? Get ready for more of it. When one bad fight can swing the game totally around, it's just gonna get harder to break the best-defended position of the game. And now you have one less minute on your free respawn, to boot.
I really hope the gold change doesn't go through.
|
Today's NerfNow is hilarious lol
|
On September 26 2014 00:50 Sn0_Man wrote:
Wow I didn't think about what that does to neuts LOL
Literally 1k dmg to neuts now, you barely need to auto the big ones
Yeah, it was the first thing I thought of since Creeps don't have magic resistance. Its a big buff to her farming out of lane. With the bounty rune as well, CM is looking like a solid for my pub support games. Making that cash money.
On September 26 2014 00:59 Sn0_Man wrote:
Today's NerfNow is hilarious lol
Yesterdays was pretty funny too. But the Chen army will be stronk.
|
I mean you do need an aghs, but the way he contrasts the ench vs chen changes... lol.
|
Northern Ireland22208 Posts
On September 26 2014 00:50 Sn0_Man wrote:
Wow I didn't think about what that does to neuts LOL
Literally 1k dmg to neuts now, you barely need to auto the big ones
yeah holy shit
|
On September 26 2014 00:54 Acritter wrote:Show nested quote +On September 25 2014 23:55 Fleetfeet wrote:On September 25 2014 23:31 Plansix wrote:
Man, Merlini continues to be the guy to listen to when it come to patch notes and level headed impressions. His break down was really on point and I like how he didn’t go through each change. His analysis of the map changes were really interesting, especially about the Radiant offlane being easier to gank(I didn’t even think of that). I also like how he just moved over stuff that he couldn’t really assess without seeing it in game, like the XP and Gold changes with only a comment “the comeback is real”.
I wish more people would do it like he did, rather than rush to put something up on youtube without even thinking about the changes.
Half the point of new patch notes is to freak out and overreact, imo. For any of the more complicated changes noone is gonna know exactly how it will play out, but it's fun to theorycraft / see people theorycraft what the hell the fallout will be. I'm still on the fence on the gold/exp changes though. If it works like I think it does, it'll only take one game of some doofus deciding that he hates our whole team and intentionally feeding two or three kills to throw most of our advantage. And even if you're losing, such a high emphasis is put on pickoffs... I dunno. I'm anxious to see what it'll do to the game, but I'm afraid I won't like it that much. The problem is that the "comeback" mechanic swings the balance more in favor of 5man teamfight over farming. Advantage is only being measured by net worth and level, here. That's not the only kind of advantage. A team can gain a sudden advantage thanks to a specific level or item pickup that isn't cleanly measured on a linear chart. Hell, they can even gain an advantage simply due to good positioning or a lucky Smoke. None of these are accounted for in the formula, meaning that winning a teamfight will give more gold than it really ought to. I'm sure we've all had these experiences of the dumb 5man ult strat winning several unlikely teamfights from way behind in a row and only sometimes managing to translate that into a win. Now it's going to be inevitable for the 5man to regain all their lost ground. The worst interaction of the new mechanic is with heroes that have basically unstoppable pickoff potential: Doom and Void. A hero can absolutely wreck the laning phase, get into the midgame with a huge advantage... and will still be killed by the pair, because Doom and Chrono are really, really strong spells. Duel, for what it's worth, has much of the same pickoff quality. Black Hole is absurdly strong, but has a significantly longer cooldown. This is going to be problematic in pro games as much as pubs. I imagine teams will attempt some kind of 4 protect 1 strat with basically invulnerable heroes like Morphling, but that will quickly devolve into yet another fucking 5man meta where everyone stays close to the carry because getting caught out gives the other team too much. Anyone remember that TI3 game where Burning got 12slotted on LD because his team was too scared to push high ground? Get ready for more of it. When one bad fight can swing the game totally around, it's just gonna get harder to break the best-defended position of the game. And now you have one less minute on your free respawn, to boot. I really hope the gold change doesn't go through.
Holy shit can we stop with this idiotic crap already. We have no idea how it will work out. 0. No one here has played a game of this or seen a pro game of it. Meanwhile on the other side they have a full fucking team of balance testers that have worked on this.
In simpler terms. We have no way of knowing what will actually happen. Stop assuming you do because all everyone is throwing around are ridiculous scenarios that have almost 0 basis in reality.
It has probably been adjusted 100+ times already. And if it needs still further adjustment it will get it. But stop pretending like you understand the change when you haven't even played a game with it yet.
|
I just can't wait for till the first game where Puppy finally gets the Dino/demon/dragon army he has always dreamed of. All with fat buffs and auras.
Edit: LoL - LeLoup has been angered. I just took to ingoring those pots, but yeah, they are pretty dumb. Dota be complex, folks. If people like Merlini aren't freaking out and don't claim to know what is going to happen, I don't think we can.
|
They have a fucking team of balance testers but after 1 month of a patch, the game turns out to be played with 20 heroes max 
On September 26 2014 01:06 Plansix wrote:
I just can't wait for till the first game where Puppy finally gets the Dino/demon/dragon army he has always dreamed of. All with fat buffs and auras.
Ancients don't have any auras 
|
Hellbears and Wildwings are 1-shot, the rest have 1100 hp so likely around 3 attacks OR 1 crystal nova of any level.
Basically that means u get to hit the smaller ones and/or go stack other camps while the creep dies. Super relevant imo. CM actually HAS to abuse this now, but thats fine.
|
On September 26 2014 01:07 Laserist wrote:They have a fucking team of balance testers but after 1 month of a patch, the game turns out to be played with 20 heroes max
Wats ur issue dude?
20 heroes max?
LMAO
go count how many heroes were used at TI4, well over a month into that patch. LITERALLY 80+
|
The most powerful part of that with CM is that she is "off map" when she is doing this, which means she could be AFK farming or setting up a gank on whatever lane. It was one of the things that made her so good in the past. And with the new ways to set up off lane ganks, I am excited to play CM.
And I know ancients don't have auras, but nero book, vlads and everything else does. I am just dreaming of the most messed up, late game chen I can think of.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
