EPTIm on good act 1 gear (spent last 2 days farming for them, crafting as well, bought an Ammy from AH). Im truding thru act 2, solo, as Barb. It is difficult, and sometimes i met mob that feel impossible, but it can still progress, albeit slowly. now if i had good act 2 gear, i should be fine, i think. (Sand Wasps are still annoying as heck though)
Balance disussion (Inferno) - Page 14
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ffreakk
Singapore2155 Posts
Im on good act 1 gear (spent last 2 days farming for them, crafting as well, bought an Ammy from AH). Im truding thru act 2, solo, as Barb. It is difficult, and sometimes i met mob that feel impossible, but it can still progress, albeit slowly. now if i had good act 2 gear, i should be fine, i think. (Sand Wasps are still annoying as heck though) | ||
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HolydaKing
21254 Posts
On May 23 2012 22:41 zeru wrote: There's a bug which allows you to skip everything in act2 and kill belial right away. These hotfixes without patchnotes arent really fair to hardcore players though, so many must've lost their chars to it, feel a bit bad for them. when did the hidden hotfix happen anyway (on europe) i remember dying about 14 hours ago because my smokescreen was on CD on my hardcore character.  oh well hardcore seems to be a terribly challenging feat anyway as of right now. given people can't really beat everything on inferno even with lots of act 4 farm and the AH which let's you get good items retardly easy. | ||
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antelope591
Canada820 Posts
On May 23 2012 22:38 Heh_ wrote: Inferno is definitely tedious; how many ways are there of increasing the difficulty level other than raising the hp and damage of mobs, and giving new abilities? Unless each of the difficulty levels are completely redesigned so they're "different" instead of being "more difficult, ie. 16 acts instead of 4 acts and 4 difficulty settings, that's about the best you can get. If you have novel ideas for increasing the difficulty level, it'll be interesting to hear them. Btw if you watch Psy's channel, he solo-cleared the Act I to III bosses with a barbarian. No idea how he cleared the intermediate parts with all those imba mobs (he didn't upload these on youtube), but it's possible. From the video timestamps, he progressed from Act II to III pretty quickly. Well bosses are a joke and pretty undertuned so just clearing bosses doesnt really mean much. Its the random elite packs that are the problem lol. | ||
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Treehead
999 Posts
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antelope591
Canada820 Posts
On May 23 2012 20:13 eluv wrote: I just find this hard to believe. Considering the affix pool, the item pool, and the ranges on each affix, it seems really unlikely that there are say Barbs out there with every piece a perfectly rolled +str +int +all res +vit +%life rare, let alone a legendary. Maybe you feel like requiring those kinds of stats is too much, but you have to understand that when these items enter the economy, it's very unlikely they're going to leave it, so the number of them around is only going to increase with time. If there were really enough of them dropping in the first week to gear up even a single character, I guess I'd be surprised. P.S. When you insult me for listing the wrong "perfect" affixes, I really couldn't care less - it's an example and it's obviously clear what I mean. Its good to talk about perfect legendaries that make any other items obsolete but do these items even exist in D3? It seems more likely based on the evidence so far that blizz simply screwed up the itemization in this game. With so many players on 1 server there should be at least one legendary with perfect or near perfect rolls but none of the ones seen so far have been better than the best rare or even best blues in their category. When a grandfather drops even with a crappy roll there should be no doubt that its amongst the best 2 handers you'll get. But for some reason blizz went back to classic diablo 2's system where rares dominated instead of expanding the one already in place. Imo legendary and set items should have all their stats increased by about 20% of where they're at then we might be where we need to be. | ||
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MoonfireSpam
United Kingdom1153 Posts
Most annoying ones so far are: Butchers 90 deg arc, full screen ranged knives ~0.5 sec windup, similar start animation to hook. (hits my DH for 37-40k). The act 4 guy with blink attack - Unavoidable. Fucking soul rippers with almost any elite mods. Demons with charge (e.g. Opressors, Corrupted angels, thralls) - Maybe it's lag, but often clipped and killed by instant attack after. Running perpendicular to charge path with ~20% movespeed. Often hit from something off screen. Fast sand wasps - as melee Grr, more fustrating than fun. I guess the difference is kinda like VS new game + on Arkham City, where every one shot / close to instant death situation can actually be avoided by playing well. Of if I am doing something completely wrong then please teach me. | ||
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LaNague
Germany9118 Posts
On May 23 2012 23:41 MoonfireSpam wrote: I think there are too many "one shots kills attacks" that can only seem to be avoided by Wizard 35% damage cap or invincibility. It leaves you with a feeling of rage rather than "shit I should do better". Most annoying ones so far are: Butchers 90 deg arc, full screen ranged knives ~0.5 sec windup, similar start animation to hook. (hits my DH for 37-40k). The act 4 guy with blink attack - Unavoidable. Any ranged attack VS melee - Diablos fireball for example. Fucking soul rippers with almost any elite mods. Demons with charge (e.g. Opressors, Corrupted angels, thralls) - Maybe it's lag, but often clipped and killed by instant attack after. Running perpendicular to charge path with ~20% movespeed. Often hit from something off screen. Fast sand wasps - as melee Grr, more fustrating than fun. I guess the difference is kinda like VS new game + on Arkham City, where every one shot / close to instant death situation can actually be avoided by playing well. you can hear the butchers attack before it comes, he has a specific roar. you cant avoid opressor 1 shots, number 1 DH nemesis (now wizard too) | ||
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Shikyo
Finland33997 Posts
On May 23 2012 23:41 MoonfireSpam wrote: I think there are too many "one shots kills attacks" that can only seem to be avoided by Wizard 35% damage cap or invincibility. It leaves you with a feeling of rage rather than "shit I should do better". Most annoying ones so far are: Butchers 90 deg arc, full screen ranged knives ~0.5 sec windup, similar start animation to hook. (hits my DH for 37-40k). The act 4 guy with blink attack - Unavoidable. Fucking soul rippers with almost any elite mods. Demons with charge (e.g. Opressors, Corrupted angels, thralls) - Maybe it's lag, but often clipped and killed by instant attack after. Running perpendicular to charge path with ~20% movespeed. Often hit from something off screen. Fast sand wasps - as melee Grr, more fustrating than fun. I guess the difference is kinda like VS new game + on Arkham City, where every one shot / close to instant death situation can actually be avoided by playing well. Of if I am doing something completely wrong then please teach me. That Rakanoth attack you can avoid with an instant invulnerability skill when you see him raise his swords pointing down instead of up, you have almost a second. | ||
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MoonfireSpam
United Kingdom1153 Posts
On May 23 2012 23:51 Shikyo wrote: That Rakanoth attack you can avoid with an instant invulnerability skill when you see him raise his swords pointing down instead of up, you have almost a second. Did you read the first line? I said these things require invuln skills to not die. Might be part of game design though, and if it is, I think it's kinda shitty.. Also did notice the the Butcher raises different arms for different skills, but still needs SS to avoid. | ||
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ZAiNs
United Kingdom6525 Posts
On May 23 2012 23:59 MoonfireSpam wrote: Did you read the first line? I said these things require invuln skills to not die. Might be part of game design though, and if it is, I think it's kinda shitty.. Also did notice the the Butcher raises different arms for different skills, but still needs SS to avoid. What about Diamond Skin? | ||
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speilhur
Germany18 Posts
On May 23 2012 23:41 MoonfireSpam wrote: Butchers 90 deg arc, full screen ranged knives ~0.5 sec windup, similar start animation to hook. (hits my DH for 37-40k). The act 4 guy with blink attack - Unavoidable. I survive that attack with my DH in MF gear. hits for about 20k i think. do u have any armor/resistance whatsoever? | ||
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nuclear_nub
65 Posts
Thank you, finally someone understands that a RNG system with a massive pool of mods can't produce the cream of the crop items in just a week, the people who say they already have the best items must think they're playing Final Fantasy (ie, I'm at endgame, so I must have best items). I'm glad somebody gets it. Community: Diablo 3 is too casual! /cry Blizz: Arright, we'll make a super-ultra hard mode after Hell. Community: I can't steamroll super-ultra hard mode after farming for three days! /cry Blizz: /facepalm | ||
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NotSorry
United States6722 Posts
On May 24 2012 00:24 nuclear_nub wrote: I'm glad somebody gets it. Community: Diablo 3 is too casual! /cry Blizz: Arright, we'll make a super-ultra hard mode after Hell. Community: I can't steamroll super-ultra hard mode after farming for three days! /cry Blizz: /facepalm I'm sadden some people still don't get it, the pool of mods is tiny and capped, so without a magic hot fix there isn't going to be new super items you guys keep thinking there is. I'll break it down for you. An item can get a number 1-10(just an example, didn't slots have different amounts of mods, many of which overlap doing the same thing), it can get 6 of these numbers (the 6 picked is a random number as the cap changes from each item slot), if each of them in a 10 we call it a perfect these are the max stats possible in the game, in less than a week several items with 6x 9-10s have already been found and an improvement from a mostly 9-10s to a pure 10s is tiny, like literally less than 200dmg/1000hp which will change nothing when your 50k hp character dies in 1-2hits. | ||
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Noocta
France12578 Posts
On May 24 2012 00:24 nuclear_nub wrote: I'm glad somebody gets it. Community: Diablo 3 is too casual! /cry Blizz: Arright, we'll make a super-ultra hard mode after Hell. Community: I can't steamroll super-ultra hard mode after farming for three days! /cry Blizz: /facepalm No item is gonna allow a Melee to do a Waller Arcane Plague Vortex elite pack. NOTHING. And there's a lot of pack with stupid combo. | ||
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superstartran
United States4013 Posts
On May 23 2012 21:20 Kickboxer wrote: Man people who claim they have godly gear at this point in time really make me laugh. I'd wager to say that an absolutely perfect rare or legendary hasn't even dropped yet and you guys are rocking full slots of them. Sure you are. Oh look, right above my post is a barb who can tank stuff in inferno. I guess understanding the game and then planning a really good char pays off more than raging on forums  When you're rocking some of the best magic/rares on the U.S. server and still getting murdered in Act 3/4 come talk to me. The game is designed in a idiotic way. Only ranged characters have a chance, specifically the DH. Inferno difficulty is LAZY game design; Path of Exile's last difficulty is a very good measure of NON lazy game design; the mobs are hard, but generally you can kill everything within a reasonable amount of time with reasonable gear if you took time out to farm. I've poured literally over 100+ hours already into the game in D3 and I can tell you from first hand experience (along with many other various people who have also put in 100+ hours) that Inferno difficulty was just the balance team being lazy and upping it up about 4x in terms of numbers and not looking at how it would affect certain things like Arcane which will blow through any character even with 700-800 resists. Fact of the matter is I know you're bullshitting me unless you're in Act 2, because even the most geared out of the ass Barbs from teams like Method, etc. etc. can't even tank shit in late Act 2+. Period. You're fucking lying if you are able to solo Acts 3/4 within reasonable amounts of time without tons of skipping, tons of repairs from deaths, along with plenty of enraged mobs to boot. | ||
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Sandster
United States4054 Posts
On May 24 2012 00:35 Noocta wrote: No item is gonna allow a Melee to do a Waller Arcane Plague Vortex elite pack. NOTHING. And there's a lot of pack with stupid combo. Similarly, nothing is going to let ranged to Waller Vortex Teleport Extra Fast, especially if it's a melee mob. You can kite for a full minute and then 1 unlucky wall/teleport will kill you. | ||
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TestSubject893
United States774 Posts
On May 24 2012 00:28 NotSorry wrote: I'm sadden some people still don't get it, the pool of mods is tiny and capped, so without a magic hot fix there isn't going to be new super items you guys keep thinking there is. I'll break it down for you. An item can get a number 1-10(just an example, didn't slots have different amounts of mods, many of which overlap doing the same thing), it can get 6 of these numbers (the 6 picked is a random number as the cap changes from each item slot), if each of them in a 10 we call it a perfect these are the max stats possible in the game, in less than a week several items with 6x 9-10s have already been found and an improvement from a mostly 9-10s to a pure 10s is tiny, like literally less than 200dmg/1000hp which will change nothing when your 50k hp character dies in 1-2hits. Even in your example, where you only want your values to be in the top 10% of their range, that's a 1/1,000,000 rare drops that will get it (0.1^6). On top of that you don't consider that you have to roll the best affix as well, not just the best value. If we put these odds at even 20% per affix (I think its less), you'll see that less than 1 in every 15,000,000,000 items fits your criteria. I find it hard to believe that over 100 billion inferno rares have dropped per person who claims to be perfectly geared. | ||
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superstartran
United States4013 Posts
On May 24 2012 00:56 TestSubject893 wrote: Even in your example, where you only want your values to be in the top 10% of their range, that's a 1/1,000,000 rare drops that will get it (0.1^6). On top of that you don't consider that you have to roll the best affix as well, not just the best value. If we put these odds at even 20% per affix (I think its less), you'll see that less than 1 in every 15,000,000,000 items fits your criteria. I find it hard to believe that over 100 billion inferno rares have dropped per person who claims to be perfectly geared. It's not about being perfectly geared; it's about being reasonably geared in the 7-9 range where you should be able to handle Inferno with some skill as a melee/non FA Wizard/etc. Alot of us have farmed the Act 2 chest, the Act 4 boss for strong magics/occasional decent Legendaries, etc. and we still struggle with our survivability. Not to mention any of the rares we encounter when running through Act 4 to Diablo at the Silver Spire. Within that 7-9 range you SHOULD be able to reasonably do Inferno without massive difficulty, and yet we are still dying left and right without utilizing a "cheese" build. The game is POORLY designed at Inferno. It's clearly obvious no one even played past Act 1 because if they did, they would have understood that it's pretty obvious that the game's difficulty was ramped up in a way that players cannot possibly deal with unless they are extremely overfarmed or utilizing mechanics that basically break the game. Whoever was their balancing/play testing team should be fired, because it's clearly obvious that Inferno is simply impossible to solo as a melee class, and it's already near impossible for a Wizard/WD. Only the DH has any reasonable chance of doing it, and the DH relies completely on luck of spawns/evasion half the time. | ||
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zachMEISTER
United States625 Posts
That said, I feel as though there are a lot of aspects of this game that they've just kinda left scattered. Everything feels up in the air, and nothing is as we expect/expected. Barbs die easy, Wizards tank bosses? WD summons are pointless past 'x' difficulty? Heals dont scale? ALSO, YOU MUST USE ONE POTION, AND ONE POTION ONLY. The game preventing me from using a potion 15 seconds after the last time is stupid. Especially when I could probably die, be resurrected, die, and be resurrected twice before my potion cooldown is done. Cooldowns on potions? Fuck that, I loved spamming my entire belt full of potions to narrowly avoid death. | ||
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Assault_1
Canada1950 Posts
On May 24 2012 01:00 superstartran wrote: It's not about being perfectly geared; it's about being reasonably geared in the 7-9 range where you should be able to handle Inferno with some skill as a melee/non FA Wizard/etc. Alot of us have farmed the Act 2 chest, the Act 4 boss for strong magics/occasional decent Legendaries, etc. and we still struggle with our survivability. Not to mention any of the rares we encounter when running through Act 4 to Diablo at the Silver Spire. Within that 7-9 range you SHOULD be able to reasonably do Inferno without massive difficulty, and yet we are still dying left and right without utilizing a "cheese" build. The game is POORLY designed at Inferno. It's clearly obvious no one even played past Act 1 because if they did, they would have understood that it's pretty obvious that the game's difficulty was ramped up in a way that players cannot possibly deal with unless they are extremely overfarmed or utilizing mechanics that basically break the game. Whoever was their balancing/play testing team should be fired, because it's clearly obvious that Inferno is simply impossible to solo as a melee class, and it's already near impossible for a Wizard/WD. Only the DH has any reasonable chance of doing it, and the DH relies completely on luck of spawns/evasion half the time. alot of people seem to think wizard > demon hunter, why u think dh is best? | ||
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