EPTHopefully this drives people back to gear-level appropriate content, to start working towards the stats required for later Inferno, I know I'll be having fun!
Balance disussion (Inferno) - Page 13
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eluv
United States1251 Posts
Hopefully this drives people back to gear-level appropriate content, to start working towards the stats required for later Inferno, I know I'll be having fun! | ||
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superstartran
United States4013 Posts
On May 23 2012 19:55 Amui wrote: Basically this. My friend is a barb doing the later parts of hell, and I'm helping to gear fund and he STILL has trouble(no he's not a bad gamer, barb's are actually that bad). I haven't been using the exploit as a monk, and basically my rotation to survive inferno is run in, 2 secs later serenity, 4 secs later pop blinding flash, then use the 1.5s fear from heal, and then hope to god that MoH+BoP spam keeps me alive til CD's come back up(using the CD thing atm because my build is built around CCing while killing really, really slowly). Now with 4 of my skills used up for defense purposes, my only dps comes from sweeping wind(60% weapon damage aoe), and autos, which also don't do that much. Also for uniques the only option is res zerging, with ridiculously low dps. TLDR; monks suck for dps purposes if they want to live(also act 2+inferno you do not attack mobs without all cooldowns up and spirit accumulated or you die. Instantly.) Wizards you might have to swap a lot of skills for CC rather than pewpew, but you'll probably still be okay relative to monk/barb post patch. FA was quite frankly stupid because going into a game with a 5k hp wizard and tanking bosses better than a 57k hp monk really shouldn't happen. WD I don't know enough about to judge. DH has both range, extremely high mobility, good survivability through dex stacking, and best of all, weaps cost nothing compared to what good 1h cost for other classes. When all 5 classes can't actually tank mobs, your class stands out as being the best one at kiting. FA wasn't stupid; you sacrificed complete survivability outside of bossfights to excel in said boss fights. On May 23 2012 19:59 eluv wrote: I hope most of the people out there understand this outcome is for the best. The fact that a few builds were reliably soloing Inferno less than a week post-release was obviously an oversight - you were never supposed to be able to do that in the gear we have available. People may feel like they have "godly" stats, but until we start seeing people in multiple perfectly rolled legendaries, I really don't think we can claim anything about what should and shouldn't be possible. Hopefully this drives people back to gear-level appropriate content, to start working towards the stats required for later Inferno, I know I'll be having fun! Some of us have absolutely ridiculous gear on our characters, as in close to top end gear and we still get destroyed in Inferno. Please, stop saying bullshit like this if you've never played Inferno past Act 2. Inferno in Act 2 got really dumb; Inferno Act3/4 just simply demonstrated Blizzard's laziness. It is pretty clear that they didn't do shit in terms of play testing, because it would have been blatantly obvious that melee classes are completely gimped even with 70%+ resists + 54k+ HP, DR out of the ass, etc. etc. Inferno isn't even hard; it's designed to be tedious. | ||
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Lagcraft
United States146 Posts
On May 23 2012 12:30 NotSorry wrote: No, I played pure dex amazons for 10+ years (zero vit) and could still take a hit or two from any mob in the game. The only real one shot in the game was bugged viper poison. D2 was about many mobs hitting you quickly to kill you rather than 1 mob hitting you once. Yeah but this all comes down to my first point: you needed good gear. No one has the kind of quality of gg gear people did in Diablo 2 yet. And I don't count dodging as being able to take a hit on a glass cannon. | ||
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antelope591
Canada820 Posts
On May 23 2012 14:40 m00nchile wrote: And you know what gigantic defense and resists are after a week of playing? I played D2 for about a month before I could say I had a good character, and that was in an established economy. The gear people have now is nothing compared to what dedicated players will have a month or two down the road. The problem is that the gear doesn't seem to exist that allows meele or any class for that matter to survive past act 2 without certain broken abilities, some of which have already been hotfixed. You have thousands of people farming act 1 inferno right now but the best upgrades I can get on the AH are not exactly substantial. I have 50k hp and 300 resists to everything....yea its not exactly top class but its enough to easily farm contect up to A2 inferno. Problem is I'm getting 1 shot by NORMAL mobs in Act 2. To survive against any sort of elite mob past act 2 you realistically need like 100k hp and 5-600 resits right now....the gear to get you up to that level simply doesn't exist in the game up to act 2 inferno, not even close. So the only way to progress is to team up with a ranged and endllessly kite mobs to death -_-. I certanly wouldn't mind the difficulty if the gear actually EXISTED that allowed you to progress. | ||
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Exempt.
United States470 Posts
Getting one shot if you don't split reflex some silly effect never has meant immense skill, i'll go without the call of duty factor blizzard. | ||
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eluv
United States1251 Posts
Some of us have absolutely ridiculous gear on our characters, as in close to top end gear and we still get destroyed in Inferno. I just find this hard to believe. Considering the affix pool, the item pool, and the ranges on each affix, it seems really unlikely that there are say Barbs out there with every piece a perfectly rolled +str +int +all res +vit +%life rare, let alone a legendary. Maybe you feel like requiring those kinds of stats is too much, but you have to understand that when these items enter the economy, it's very unlikely they're going to leave it, so the number of them around is only going to increase with time. If there were really enough of them dropping in the first week to gear up even a single character, I guess I'd be surprised. P.S. When you insult me for listing the wrong "perfect" affixes, I really couldn't care less - it's an example and it's obviously clear what I mean. | ||
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Tobberoth
Sweden6375 Posts
On May 23 2012 20:13 eluv wrote: I just find this hard to believe. Considering the affix pool, the item pool, and the ranges on each affix, it seems really unlikely that there are say Barbs out there with every piece a perfectly rolled +str +int +all res +vit +%life rare, let alone a legendary. Maybe you feel like requiring those kinds of stats is too much, but you have to understand that when these items enter the economy, it's very unlikely they're going to leave it, so the number of them around is only going to increase with time. If there were really enough of them dropping in the first week to gear up even a single character, I guess I'd be surprised. P.S. When you insult me for listing the wrong "perfect" affixes, I really couldn't care less - it's an example and it's obviously clear what I mean. You're pretty much saying that Act 4 inferno gear shouldn't be enough to get though Act 2 inferno, you need PERFECT act 4 inferno gear? Then how are you supposed to beat act 3 and act 4? There is a massive obvious problem with the tuning of inferno, you seriously can't blame a few missing vit points on gear for that. A good act 4 inferno drop and a "perfect" act 4 inferno drop do not give the amount of difference in stats you seem to be thinking. | ||
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Caphe
Vietnam10817 Posts
 First, over tune inferno that make it feel like impossible. But left out some untested build that make Wizard beat it easily. So other classes are all pissed Second, patch the Wizard, so now everyone is pissed  Seriously, who tested this game at Blizzard? Did they even beat Inferno themselves with every class before release the game? D3 would be at a much better position now if Wizard didn't solo Inferno so early. So everyone is happy farming act 1 and make the game Inferno legit hard. | ||
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maartendq
Belgium3115 Posts
On May 23 2012 19:46 rezoacken wrote: I don't really know about other class. I use the critical mass Diamond skin spam thingy coupled with teleport... it allows me to teleport somewhat like in D2 rushing for the exit. I did act 3 inferno in around 2hours using this abuse. Right now I just want to kill inferno and be done with it... I'm sooooo disapointed by this difficulty, it's absolutly not fun to me. I either abuse or boringly kite/spam abilities out of the screen. That's just poor design. I had a blast playing nightmare and hell and inferno act 1 but act 2 and 3 are garbage. It really feel untested and just balanced with a spreadsheet. They actually did balance it with a spreadsheet: they took the numbers their testers could handle, and doubled them without much thought. Players asked a ridiculously difficult setting, they got one. | ||
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tangwhat
New Zealand446 Posts
On May 23 2012 20:13 eluv wrote: I just find this hard to believe. Considering the affix pool, the item pool, and the ranges on each affix, it seems really unlikely that there are say Barbs out there with every piece a perfectly rolled +str +int +all res +vit +%life rare, let alone a legendary. Maybe you feel like requiring those kinds of stats is too much, but you have to understand that when these items enter the economy, it's very unlikely they're going to leave it, so the number of them around is only going to increase with time. If there were really enough of them dropping in the first week to gear up even a single character, I guess I'd be surprised. P.S. When you insult me for listing the wrong "perfect" affixes, I really couldn't care less - it's an example and it's obviously clear what I mean. You talk about legendaries as if they're any good in diablo 3. Players asked a ridiculously difficult setting, they got one. Blizzard mistook difficult for tedious. | ||
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Shikyo
Finland33997 Posts
On May 23 2012 20:16 Tobberoth wrote: You're pretty much saying that Act 4 inferno gear shouldn't be enough to get though Act 2 inferno, you need PERFECT act 4 inferno gear? Then how are you supposed to beat act 3 and act 4? There is a massive obvious problem with the tuning of inferno, you seriously can't blame a few missing vit points on gear for that. A good act 4 inferno drop and a "perfect" act 4 inferno drop do not give the amount of difference in stats you seem to be thinking. Perfect act 2 gear might be enough as well, or you can just buy act 4 gear that others are farming. In MMORPGs as well it's not rare that even if max lvl is 80 the best lvl 40 equip you get from lvl 80 bosses etc. | ||
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tangwhat
New Zealand446 Posts
On May 23 2012 20:23 Shikyo wrote: Perfect act 2 gear might be enough as well, or you can just buy act 4 gear that others are farming. In MMORPGs as well it's not rare that even if max lvl is 80 the best lvl 40 equip you get from lvl 80 bosses etc. Just because other poorly designed games have something doesn't mean it's acceptable for it to remain the status quo. | ||
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Caphe
Vietnam10817 Posts
On May 23 2012 20:23 Shikyo wrote: Perfect act 2 gear might be enough as well, or you can just buy act 4 gear that others are farming. In MMORPGs as well it's not rare that even if max lvl is 80 the best lvl 40 equip you get from lvl 80 bosses etc. Nah, why would you need ACT 4 gears that are farmed right now just because they abuse something that Blizzard left it there at release. A good Inferno setting would be, damn damn hard, but doable if people put effort into farming. Also you can't let one class beat the game much much faster than other classes. As I said above, the testing of D3 sucks. It is a great game, I love it but can't say I am satisfied with the game right now. | ||
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sparC
Germany162 Posts
if you get past ~450 all resi - act 2 becomes a walk in the park. ~700-800 for act 3 and 1k+ for act 4 while sitting at around 9k armor. if you still die, you're doing it wrong. edit: also try to get your hands on some dex w/o losing resi. | ||
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BrauL
Canada197 Posts
i have: 600 phys resist, 300+ for everything else, 6k armor, 45k hp and almost 10k damage with shield/sword .. nothing super crazy but its pretty good i think, its really all about the skills you choose right now i'm using ignore pain with iron hide, revenge with provocation, furious charge with dreadnaught, overpower with revel, warcry with invigorate(?), frenzy with vanguard, and for passives i'm using tough as nails, superstition and inspiring presence. | ||
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Kickboxer
Slovenia1308 Posts
Oh look, right above my post is a barb who can tank stuff in inferno. I guess understanding the game and then planning a really good char pays off more than raging on forums | ||
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m00nchile
Slovenia240 Posts
On May 23 2012 15:02 mawno wrote: Unlike D2, monster lvl is much more relevant than player lvl. The fact that you even bring up legendary items into the discussion show how little you know about D3 itemization. The best items have probably not been dropped yet, and if they have, they wont get sold before the RMAH is up. Thank you, finally someone understands that a RNG system with a massive pool of mods can't produce the cream of the crop items in just a week, the people who say they already have the best items must think they're playing Final Fantasy (ie, I'm at endgame, so I must have best items). | ||
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Dfgj
Singapore5922 Posts
On May 23 2012 17:59 Tobberoth wrote: Blizzard has already nerfed Force Armor, it stops working if your HP is too low now, making 0 vit builds get oneshotted by everything. It's still a broken mechanic because there's still no need for armor/resist/whatever, force armor outdoes everything. It's just a matter of finding the lowest possible health and it's still the best damage reduction. | ||
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Heh_
Singapore2712 Posts
Btw if you watch Psy's channel, he solo-cleared the Act I to III bosses with a barbarian. No idea how he cleared the intermediate parts with all those imba mobs (he didn't upload these on youtube), but it's possible. From the video timestamps, he progressed from Act II to III pretty quickly. | ||
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zeru
8156 Posts
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