|
On September 09 2017 04:30 Kaolla wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2017 04:05 Charoisaur wrote:On September 09 2017 03:59 nanaoei wrote:On September 09 2017 02:26 Saechiis wrote:
I read his statement and I'm mostly confused. Him harassing her and her rejecting him was their concept for the broadcast? Really? This borders Japanese gameshow levels of detachment from reality. He's putting so much weight on his insider knowledge of the situation rather than the reality he's presenting to his viewers.
If you stage yourself to look like a scumbag does it really make sense to be offended when people see a scumbag?
Can we just take a second here to find the logic in that, Seapologist? Even in the case that he DID stage this whole thing and everyone was in on it. Is it still not morally reprehensible to make the 99,9% that are not in on it believe that it is real? Or is it ok to make viewers believe anything you want them to believe and never be responsible for the consequences?
The argument that BJs aren't responsible for the reality they present is ridiculous. The argument that everyone should have telepathically inferred that the scene was staged is ridiculous. Sea is possibly not guilty of assault and sexual harassment but he's definitely guilty of making people think he is. Acting like a victim when people go off the information you give them yourself is ridiculous and he would've done his image a big favor by admitting he was stupid and drunk and responsible for the following shitshow despite it all alledgedly being a hoax. what's happening is he comes public with an explanation if it goes poorly (which it did) but lets it slide if it goes smoothly. as for journalists writing articles about it, they're within the same line of thinking as Sea when he does something as a publicity stunt for more viewers and more money. media outrages are exactly a form of making money for these websites. it may not have been a poor concept, but he was a bad actor and he won't try it again for a very long time. that's what i take away from it as a fan. The journalists are damaging another person, Sea is not. For what, reporting what they see? If it truly happened as Sea said, it would be a major fuckup by him, not the press. What the fuck did Sea expect (if the story is true), that it'd just be nice to get some new viewers? It'd be pretty fucked up and I personally don't believe his version of the story (even if the girl would corroborate it now). I also don't think it's nearly as bad as the battery and sexual assault accusations and the whole hang him mentality going around here however . Am repeating myself here though, so should stop replying to this topic.
For taking 3 out-of-context gifs to tell a narrative that they think will gather a lot of interest and ruining Sea's reputation in the process.
|
On September 09 2017 04:05 Charoisaur wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2017 03:59 nanaoei wrote:On September 09 2017 02:26 Saechiis wrote:
I read his statement and I'm mostly confused. Him harassing her and her rejecting him was their concept for the broadcast? Really? This borders Japanese gameshow levels of detachment from reality. He's putting so much weight on his insider knowledge of the situation rather than the reality he's presenting to his viewers.
If you stage yourself to look like a scumbag does it really make sense to be offended when people see a scumbag?
Can we just take a second here to find the logic in that, Seapologist? Even in the case that he DID stage this whole thing and everyone was in on it. Is it still not morally reprehensible to make the 99,9% that are not in on it believe that it is real? Or is it ok to make viewers believe anything you want them to believe and never be responsible for the consequences?
The argument that BJs aren't responsible for the reality they present is ridiculous. The argument that everyone should have telepathically inferred that the scene was staged is ridiculous. Sea is possibly not guilty of assault and sexual harassment but he's definitely guilty of making people think he is. Acting like a victim when people go off the information you give them yourself is ridiculous and he would've done his image a big favor by admitting he was stupid and drunk and responsible for the following shitshow despite it all alledgedly being a hoax. what's happening is he comes public with an explanation if it goes poorly (which it did) but lets it slide if it goes smoothly. as for journalists writing articles about it, they're within the same line of thinking as Sea when he does something as a publicity stunt for more viewers and more money. media outrages are exactly a form of making money for these websites. it may not have been a poor concept, but he was a bad actor and he won't try it again for a very long time. that's what i take away from it as a fan. The journalists are damaging another person, Sea is not.
Sea damaged himself with that.
If anyone thinks he didnt do anything wrong, our cultures are really different. Maybe it's not that bad but he deserves the ban.
|
On September 09 2017 04:34 Charoisaur wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2017 04:30 Kaolla wrote:On September 09 2017 04:05 Charoisaur wrote:On September 09 2017 03:59 nanaoei wrote:On September 09 2017 02:26 Saechiis wrote:
I read his statement and I'm mostly confused. Him harassing her and her rejecting him was their concept for the broadcast? Really? This borders Japanese gameshow levels of detachment from reality. He's putting so much weight on his insider knowledge of the situation rather than the reality he's presenting to his viewers.
If you stage yourself to look like a scumbag does it really make sense to be offended when people see a scumbag?
Can we just take a second here to find the logic in that, Seapologist? Even in the case that he DID stage this whole thing and everyone was in on it. Is it still not morally reprehensible to make the 99,9% that are not in on it believe that it is real? Or is it ok to make viewers believe anything you want them to believe and never be responsible for the consequences?
The argument that BJs aren't responsible for the reality they present is ridiculous. The argument that everyone should have telepathically inferred that the scene was staged is ridiculous. Sea is possibly not guilty of assault and sexual harassment but he's definitely guilty of making people think he is. Acting like a victim when people go off the information you give them yourself is ridiculous and he would've done his image a big favor by admitting he was stupid and drunk and responsible for the following shitshow despite it all alledgedly being a hoax. what's happening is he comes public with an explanation if it goes poorly (which it did) but lets it slide if it goes smoothly. as for journalists writing articles about it, they're within the same line of thinking as Sea when he does something as a publicity stunt for more viewers and more money. media outrages are exactly a form of making money for these websites. it may not have been a poor concept, but he was a bad actor and he won't try it again for a very long time. that's what i take away from it as a fan. The journalists are damaging another person, Sea is not. For what, reporting what they see? If it truly happened as Sea said, it would be a major fuckup by him, not the press. What the fuck did Sea expect (if the story is true), that it'd just be nice to get some new viewers? It'd be pretty fucked up and I personally don't believe his version of the story (even if the girl would corroborate it now). I also don't think it's nearly as bad as the battery and sexual assault accusations and the whole hang him mentality going around here however . Am repeating myself here though, so should stop replying to this topic. For taking 3 out-of-context gifs to tell a narrative that they think will gather a lot of interest and ruining Sea's reputation in the process.
You're going to quite the lengths to ignore any of Sea's responsibility to uphold his own character. Drama always goes beyond the scope of reality but that doesn't imply Sea's utter innocence. It only implies that in the context of public streaming mistakes make bigger waves.
|
On September 09 2017 04:34 Charoisaur wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2017 04:30 Kaolla wrote:On September 09 2017 04:05 Charoisaur wrote:On September 09 2017 03:59 nanaoei wrote:On September 09 2017 02:26 Saechiis wrote:
I read his statement and I'm mostly confused. Him harassing her and her rejecting him was their concept for the broadcast? Really? This borders Japanese gameshow levels of detachment from reality. He's putting so much weight on his insider knowledge of the situation rather than the reality he's presenting to his viewers.
If you stage yourself to look like a scumbag does it really make sense to be offended when people see a scumbag?
Can we just take a second here to find the logic in that, Seapologist? Even in the case that he DID stage this whole thing and everyone was in on it. Is it still not morally reprehensible to make the 99,9% that are not in on it believe that it is real? Or is it ok to make viewers believe anything you want them to believe and never be responsible for the consequences?
The argument that BJs aren't responsible for the reality they present is ridiculous. The argument that everyone should have telepathically inferred that the scene was staged is ridiculous. Sea is possibly not guilty of assault and sexual harassment but he's definitely guilty of making people think he is. Acting like a victim when people go off the information you give them yourself is ridiculous and he would've done his image a big favor by admitting he was stupid and drunk and responsible for the following shitshow despite it all alledgedly being a hoax. what's happening is he comes public with an explanation if it goes poorly (which it did) but lets it slide if it goes smoothly. as for journalists writing articles about it, they're within the same line of thinking as Sea when he does something as a publicity stunt for more viewers and more money. media outrages are exactly a form of making money for these websites. it may not have been a poor concept, but he was a bad actor and he won't try it again for a very long time. that's what i take away from it as a fan. The journalists are damaging another person, Sea is not. For what, reporting what they see? If it truly happened as Sea said, it would be a major fuckup by him, not the press. What the fuck did Sea expect (if the story is true), that it'd just be nice to get some new viewers? It'd be pretty fucked up and I personally don't believe his version of the story (even if the girl would corroborate it now). I also don't think it's nearly as bad as the battery and sexual assault accusations and the whole hang him mentality going around here however . Am repeating myself here though, so should stop replying to this topic. For taking 3 out-of-context gifs to tell a narrative that they think will gather a lot of interest and ruining Sea's reputation in the process.
Those 3 out-of-context gifs were exactly what Sea was streaming and I have no doubt they looked at the stream. If Sea was pretending to hit the girl (unlikely imo) then he got exactly what he deserved. It's just beyond stupid to stage such a thing and expect everyone to be cool with it and that it'll generate good publicity. The press is in no way to blame for it. And that is even when you do believe Sea's version of the story.
|
The real question is what the ban is actually for. If it's for breaking the ToS of Afreeca, sure, fine by me. Does ASL have such a rule?
If it's because of outrage over something that is potentially blown way out of proportion then that's a whole different story.
|
On September 09 2017 04:38 FranzF1 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2017 04:05 Charoisaur wrote:On September 09 2017 03:59 nanaoei wrote:On September 09 2017 02:26 Saechiis wrote:
I read his statement and I'm mostly confused. Him harassing her and her rejecting him was their concept for the broadcast? Really? This borders Japanese gameshow levels of detachment from reality. He's putting so much weight on his insider knowledge of the situation rather than the reality he's presenting to his viewers.
If you stage yourself to look like a scumbag does it really make sense to be offended when people see a scumbag?
Can we just take a second here to find the logic in that, Seapologist? Even in the case that he DID stage this whole thing and everyone was in on it. Is it still not morally reprehensible to make the 99,9% that are not in on it believe that it is real? Or is it ok to make viewers believe anything you want them to believe and never be responsible for the consequences?
The argument that BJs aren't responsible for the reality they present is ridiculous. The argument that everyone should have telepathically inferred that the scene was staged is ridiculous. Sea is possibly not guilty of assault and sexual harassment but he's definitely guilty of making people think he is. Acting like a victim when people go off the information you give them yourself is ridiculous and he would've done his image a big favor by admitting he was stupid and drunk and responsible for the following shitshow despite it all alledgedly being a hoax. what's happening is he comes public with an explanation if it goes poorly (which it did) but lets it slide if it goes smoothly. as for journalists writing articles about it, they're within the same line of thinking as Sea when he does something as a publicity stunt for more viewers and more money. media outrages are exactly a form of making money for these websites. it may not have been a poor concept, but he was a bad actor and he won't try it again for a very long time. that's what i take away from it as a fan. The journalists are damaging another person, Sea is not. Sea damaged himself with that. If anyone thinks he didnt do anything wrong, our cultures are really different. Maybe it's not that bad but he deserves the ban.
Nobody thinks Sea did nothing wrong. Not even Sea himself thinks that.
I'm not saying that I did nothing wrong. I did drink a lot, and I did many questionable things on stream that made my viewers feel uncomfortable. However, unlike what the article states, I did not sexually harass or physically assult someone.
|
On September 09 2017 05:03 r.Evo wrote:
The real question is what the ban is actually for. If it's for breaking the ToS of Afreeca, sure, fine by me. Does ASL have such a rule?
If it's because of outrage over something that is potentially blown way out of proportion then that's a whole different story.
ASL is the Afreeca Star League, sponsored by the platform he's streaming on. It's a measure they know will make him think twice before putting their platform in a bad light again.
|
He's saying he scripted out his stream with a bunch of people? Who does that? This guy is an idiot, even if he is telling the truth (which he isn't)
|
well that was pretty messed up... the first punch he threw looked like he actually tried to hurt her a little bit. i dont think ive ever been that drunk to ever act out in such a way lol, ban was justified imo...
|
Yum dun goofed.
That's the thing being out there under the public's eye and maintaining an image, can't go overboard too much or you'll be torn to shreds. But he should've already known that.
|
On September 09 2017 05:30 ThisIsJimmy wrote:
He's saying he scripted out his stream with a bunch of people? Who does that?
This is really common in streaming.
|
I know from very start that he was fooling around. Asshole journalists made all of you believe he's sexual harasser and assaulter. I think it could be even better for Sea if that girl BJ made a statement that they were fooling around and nothing serious happened. RIP Sea's 1st remastered ASL before he hits 30 (korean age).
|
On September 08 2017 13:08 CHEONSOYUN wrote:Show nested quote +Translator Note (T/N): I'm not here to claim any side, I'm just translating.
Hi, I'm Sea.
I'm not good at writing long posts so I'm not sure if it'll turn out well, but I ask you to please read on.
I did not harass nor assult the other BJ during the stream. People are taking the specific moments from the broadcast and making me look like I assulted and/or sexually harassed her but that is not the case.
I am close friends with her (the female BJ), and we streamed many times together. The concept of the broadcast, when we streamed, was that I would try to touch her (T/N: word was "skinship", imo aka flirting, but with slight physical contact. Not to be confused with just touching her overly.), she would punch me in response, and that would continue. That was the concept. The said video that's floating around the internet was part of the concept, and it was nothing sexual. In fact, after the article was posted, my friend (the female BJ) messaged me saying that she was worried for me and asked if there's anything she could do to help out.
For the part where I looked like I was "assulting" her, I hit her in the elbow two times, and she threw ice cold water at my face, everyone laughed, and the atmosphere was pretty good.
I'm not saying that I did nothing wrong. I did drink a lot, and I did many questionable things on stream that made my viewers feel uncomfortable. However, unlike what the article states, I did not sexually harass or physically assult someone.
My reputation has been really tainted due to this incident, and my family is also having a very hard time due to this.
Today, I met a lawyer and decided to sue the journalists who wrote and posted the article online. I am also planning to sue those who are writing very hateful speech against me online, after I gather some evidence.
There's also some misunderstanding on my Afreeca ban:
I was banned 3 days for throwing up on stream, and 3 days for assulting another BJ on stream. Thus, it came out to be a 1 week ban.
What I think is very unfair, however, is the fact that I was disqualified from ASL Season 4 due to the 1 week ban.
I don't think it was right for me to receive the 3 day ban for fooling around with the regular broadcast concept, hitting the female BJ on the elbow, then considering it as an assult against another BJ. (T/N: He's not claiming that he "hit" her in a sense that he assulted her, but rather it was part of him flirting around/fooling around with her)
I can't understand this at all, and I feel its very unfair that I am forced to give up my ASL spot, possibly my last ASL before I turn 30.
Please do not insult me based on the malicious articles (T/N more like witchhunt) and posts that only contain assumptions and no facts.
Last but not least, if you see any comments or posts heavily insulting me online, trying to defame me for this particular incident, please email me at <redacted>. (T/N: due to some... not so great conversations happening on TL and other stuff, I'm removing the email on purpose)
Thank you.
Somehow if this proves true, it feels worse than what was originally posted. It highlights a greater issue with society and it shows that these ideas and themes were planned when he was sober and not a "spur of the moment" when drunk.
I mean, that's really fucked up.
+ Show Spoiler +And I guess I'll stop there or he'll probably sue me
|
On September 09 2017 05:58 Eywa- wrote:Show nested quote +On September 08 2017 13:08 CHEONSOYUN wrote:Translator Note (T/N): I'm not here to claim any side, I'm just translating.
Hi, I'm Sea.
I'm not good at writing long posts so I'm not sure if it'll turn out well, but I ask you to please read on.
I did not harass nor assult the other BJ during the stream. People are taking the specific moments from the broadcast and making me look like I assulted and/or sexually harassed her but that is not the case.
I am close friends with her (the female BJ), and we streamed many times together. The concept of the broadcast, when we streamed, was that I would try to touch her (T/N: word was "skinship", imo aka flirting, but with slight physical contact. Not to be confused with just touching her overly.), she would punch me in response, and that would continue. That was the concept. The said video that's floating around the internet was part of the concept, and it was nothing sexual. In fact, after the article was posted, my friend (the female BJ) messaged me saying that she was worried for me and asked if there's anything she could do to help out.
For the part where I looked like I was "assulting" her, I hit her in the elbow two times, and she threw ice cold water at my face, everyone laughed, and the atmosphere was pretty good.
I'm not saying that I did nothing wrong. I did drink a lot, and I did many questionable things on stream that made my viewers feel uncomfortable. However, unlike what the article states, I did not sexually harass or physically assult someone.
My reputation has been really tainted due to this incident, and my family is also having a very hard time due to this.
Today, I met a lawyer and decided to sue the journalists who wrote and posted the article online. I am also planning to sue those who are writing very hateful speech against me online, after I gather some evidence.
There's also some misunderstanding on my Afreeca ban:
I was banned 3 days for throwing up on stream, and 3 days for assulting another BJ on stream. Thus, it came out to be a 1 week ban.
What I think is very unfair, however, is the fact that I was disqualified from ASL Season 4 due to the 1 week ban.
I don't think it was right for me to receive the 3 day ban for fooling around with the regular broadcast concept, hitting the female BJ on the elbow, then considering it as an assult against another BJ. (T/N: He's not claiming that he "hit" her in a sense that he assulted her, but rather it was part of him flirting around/fooling around with her)
I can't understand this at all, and I feel its very unfair that I am forced to give up my ASL spot, possibly my last ASL before I turn 30.
Please do not insult me based on the malicious articles (T/N more like witchhunt) and posts that only contain assumptions and no facts.
Last but not least, if you see any comments or posts heavily insulting me online, trying to defame me for this particular incident, please email me at <redacted>. (T/N: due to some... not so great conversations happening on TL and other stuff, I'm removing the email on purpose)
Thank you. Somehow if this proves true, it feels worse than what was originally posted. It highlights a greater issue with society and it shows that these ideas and themes were planned when he was sober and not a "spur of the moment" when drunk. I mean, that's really fucked up. + Show Spoiler +And I guess I'll stop there or he'll probably sue me
Do explain what this "greater issue with society" is that is highlighted by a poorly executed comedy attempt?
|
strong autism on this guy. he should rather stick to playing Brood War rather than trying to be a celebrity. sucks for him tho that he lost his ASL spot, he's a solid player.
User was warned for this post
|
On September 09 2017 05:27 Saechiis wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2017 05:03 r.Evo wrote:
The real question is what the ban is actually for. If it's for breaking the ToS of Afreeca, sure, fine by me. Does ASL have such a rule?
If it's because of outrage over something that is potentially blown way out of proportion then that's a whole different story. ASL is the Afreeca Star League, sponsored by the platform he's streaming on. It's a measure they know will make him think twice before putting their platform in a bad light again.
That's not the point I'm trying to make, the point is whether ASL has rules that specifically say "If you get a ban on Afreeca you're out" or whether this is a specific reaction to this specific event. If it's the latter and in parts caused by the outrage the initial article sparked then that's an issue.
|
Uhh...... wow. I was expecting to read what happened, and it just leads with Sea's apology. Kinda white-washing the entire event and removing any agency from the victim.
Edit: Sea claims this was consensual, I guess. I see the story now, it was hidden under an expando thing.
|
|
|
Teamliquid, I have a question. Does Killer honestly have any chance of doing well in the first group? I feel like he just barely returned to the pro-scene.
On another note, I sympathize a great deal for Sea. I hope his reputation hasn't been tarnished in the long-term and that he doesn't horse around with his female friends in the future.
Shalashaska_123
|
This may be coming from me being too used to western PR, but I seriously would have expected Sea to put more emphasis on alcohol being a problem and to say that he would commit to some kind of rehab program.
Can't say I'm personally happy with Korean culture's friendliness with alcohol abuse, I would have expected to see some progress in the 10 years I've been following the scene.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
