Well, if they're female, you know what.
Ukraine Crisis - Page 293
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							Dagobert
							
							
						 
						Netherlands1858 Posts
						 Well, if they're female, you know what. | ||
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							oo_Wonderful_oo
							
							
						 
						The land of freedom23126 Posts
						 On March 14 2014 06:35 m4ini wrote: What about this case? What is your thought about the fact that they try to silence opposition (yet again) with "dirty" measures? I find it mostly ridiculous that they're so "paranoid on public" about it. Big amount of population support them anyway, so i have no idea why do they fear it. I could probably even support them, if they didn't have their ridiculous youth organisations who're dumb as hell and they're really brainwashed. Dunno how did they do it, but still. Even though i worked in Navalny's headquarters on last elections, opposition was really cute when it appeared first, in 2011 especially, they were saying some new stuff which students, youth and some part of middle-class could support. But after few 80-100k meetings, opposition really fell hard, not only because they have few guys who were ministers in 90s and almost made Russia be in shambles one more time but they were saying same stuff from meeting to meeting without basically doing anything except it. If Yanukovich didn't use weapons, Ukranian Euromaidan could be completely same. Some kind of post-30 November Euromaidan happened on 6th May 2012, when there was big meeting in centre of Moscow (100k or something close to it), leaders of opposition were saying same stuff and after it rightwings screamed "Let's destroy Kremlin" and tried to provoke cops. After it chaos occured, half of rightwings are still sitting in jail and there are almost no big meetings since then because to be completely fair, middle-class which is main part of population in Moscow doesn't want country in shambles again, so we're kinda ok with current situation with some exceptions. This law about government being able to block some sites was one of those exceptions. Thank God, at least we could appeal to it and help owners and media. I really dislike it as i mentioned before but it works weird right now. Some providers can block, some can't and even if they can, you can still use/watch everything from this site just by simply using other browser's turbo function. You don't even need to use proxies. Basically, what is going to silence opposition (at least, there is my prediction) is new law about bitcoins's ban and anonymous money transfers, because every meeting is sponsored by people who want to come/just want meeting to be good and people can be scared to use it because they want to hide their name. Also there will be some limits to using virtual money (like Webmoney) to 1000 rubles (something like 30$ per day), so if you want to buy something from foreign countries, you need to move moneys for plastic bank cards and pay with it. On March 14 2014 06:38 Nyxisto wrote: So the authorities just ban something if they feel like it, and then the owner of the site has to go to court and argue whether that was justified or not? And if the government is nice they unblock your site if you delete what they don't like? Sorry man but that sounds really fucked up. Why is there so little uproar about that kind of stuff? Ye, it's fucked but if i learned something from my exams and life in total - if you failed and you can appeal to it, then you're in good shape. There was a lot of uproar about it when law came in first (Even Russian segment of Wikipedia did blackout for one day just in protest), but after it, basically that law was blocking only some real shit in runet which noone uses anyway. It blocked once bunch of pages in VK which were unbanned after it, some stuff on Lurk and sometimes they're banning some media pages just to unlock it 1-2 hours later so everyone thinks that it's just technical difficulties. They did ban EJ i guess? Guys from there are working on other media anyway, so it won't hurt. Almost noone reads Garry Kasparov as well, he is in absolute anti-Russia position since 2012, it's not even our opposition level and Navalny's livejournal is banned because he's under home arrest for a week already and he can't use internet (his wife and some volunteers are helping him with twitter and livejournal but apparently he really can't do it at all). I highly expect all those resources to come back asap. It's just politics of governments - 2 steps ahead, 1 step behind. On March 14 2014 06:47 xDaunt wrote: The sad truth is that the lasting damage from centuries of servitude to the state can't be undone in a couple generations. What's abundantly clear to me from reading the comments of Russian posters is that they really don't know how wrong the environment that they're in is. In fairness to them, I wouldn't expect them to take a foreigner's word for it. It's just something that they're going to have to figure out on their own. Sorry, dude, if we're looking as absolute mutton-retards in your eyes. When you want to change something, you're searching for better item/stuff/girlfriend/etc. You want it to be not only better than previous one but fill the disadvantages which previous item/stuff/girlfriend/etc had. Sadly, there is no substitution for current governance. Not because they're bad, they're decent in domestic and foreign things but just simply because they're ruling for 19 years already. (Even though Eltsin was way worse than Putin and even Medvedev lol). But to sub them, you need something better. Only candidate for last few years is Navalny but he got discredited hard when he was sentenced to jail few weeks before Moscow's major elections but day later PROSECUTOR forced his release from it and subbing 5-years jail sentence for probation. After it Navalny proceeded to get 27% with our help which is considered huge success but still, people supported our previous major who wasn't bad either, Moscow is looking like really cute city. There is still long road ahead but it's something. On March 14 2014 06:49 Cheerio wrote: There is information that Crimean school graduates will be accepted to top Russian universities without exams or tests, but through interviews. Yes, it's true. On March 14 2014 07:07 Gorsameth wrote: Because Russia is cultivating an atmosphere where anyone not Russian or Russian affiliated is an enemy? I'm not sure what did you mean but there are huge whines here for a long time that being Russian in Russia means that you're fucked because government hugely support illegals because it means money, we donate shitloads of money for Northern Caucasus and just simple stuff that 90% of conflicts/murders/rapes and other stuff in Moscow at least are done by illegal migrants/guys from Northern Caucasus/legal migrants from Middle Asia, who have passports but can't say word on Russian without making a mistake. Sorry for my English btw, i know that it's not ideal. | ||
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							oo_Wonderful_oo
							
							
						 
						The land of freedom23126 Posts
						 Also USA rejected Ukraine's request about getting weapons and other military support + some scouting information. However, Ukraine will get some food help and some economic help in the future. | ||
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							ImperialFist
							
							
						 
						790 Posts
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							Gorsameth
							
							
						 
						Netherlands21939 Posts
						 On March 14 2014 08:12 ImperialFist wrote: Crimea should be given independence ASAP. A majority of the Crimeans wants it. The partitioning of Ukraine is legit, its either that or retarded warfare. There is no confirmation of that. Nor will there be after the referendum because there is no No option. | ||
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							Deleted User 137586
							
							
						 
						7859 Posts
						 The United States circulated a draft resolution to the U.N. Security Council on Thursday that would declare Sunday's planned referendum on independence for Ukraine's Crimea region illegal, but Russia has vowed to veto it, council diplomats said. Diplomats said the one-page resolution would urge countries not to recognize the results of the vote in pro-Russian Crimea, whose parliament has already voted to join Russia. ... But Russia, one of the five permanent veto-wielding members of the Security Council, made clear that it opposed the draft, so a decision was made to postpone the vote until Saturday at the latest to allow time for further negotiations. "Russia announced they will kill it," a senior Western diplomat told Reuters. ... Several Western diplomats said their hope was that China, which has joined Russia in vetoing three council resolutions on Syria since 2011, would distance itself this time from Moscow and abstain. "That will show Russia it's isolated, that the majority of the council, including China, do not stand with it on Ukraine," a diplomat said. China has an aversion to separatism because of its own issues involving Tibet, Taiwan and other regions. It has voiced support for Ukraine's sovereignty and territorial integrity during Security Council sessions on the crisis, although diplomats said it was not entirely certain Beijing would break from Russia on Ukraine. Source. | ||
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							zlefin
							
							
						 
						United States7689 Posts
						 On March 14 2014 08:12 ImperialFist wrote: Crimea should be given independence ASAP. A majority of the Crimeans wants it. The partitioning of Ukraine is legit, its either that or retarded warfare. Perhaps if Russia hadn't been a prick about this, that could have happened peacefully, instead of this nonsense. | ||
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							oneofthem
							
							
						 
						Cayman Islands24199 Posts
						 On March 14 2014 08:12 ImperialFist wrote: Crimea should be given independence ASAP. A majority of the Crimeans wants it. The partitioning of Ukraine is legit, its either that or retarded warfare. is that you putin. nice username bro | ||
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							kukarachaa
							
							
						 
						United States284 Posts
						 This is a video of from Donetsk, its brutal to watch. Judging the from the crowd yelling and so on, a group of people came to Donetsk to show support for the new government. They were met by a large pro-Russian crowd. Throwing bricks, spraying pepper spray, throwing fireworks. Crowd was chanting Russia, Berkut, and on your knees ( this refers to the videos of berkut officers forced to kneel and apologize to Maidan protesters ). Police were basically barely doing just enough so no one gets killed, but didn't offer too much protection. People in crowd were constantly yelling to make sure noone hurts the police. | ||
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							Gorsameth
							
							
						 
						Netherlands21939 Posts
						 On March 14 2014 08:47 kukarachaa wrote: Warning there are some very graphic stuff in this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=iNqcwSwnybU This is a video of from Donetsk, its brutal to watch. Judging the from the crowd yelling and so on, a group of people came to Donetsk to show support for the new government. They were met by a large pro-Russian crowd. Throwing bricks, spraying pepper spray, throwing fireworks. Crowd was chanting Russia, Berkut, and on your knees ( this refers to the videos of berkut officers forced to kneel and apologize to Maidan protesters ). Police were basically barely doing just enough so no one gets killed, but didn't offer too much protection. People in crowd were constantly yelling to make sure noone hurts the police. Except we already know 2 people died during this. | ||
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							kukarachaa
							
							
						 
						United States284 Posts
						 On March 14 2014 08:51 Gorsameth wrote: Except we already know 2 people died during this. Didn't know that, that's terrible. Bunch of animals. Apparently the story behind this clash. International observers were visiting the town that day, and the newly appointed governor decided he wants to show them anti-Russian protest and got 1000 people, pro russian side found out and 10,000 came to support Russia. Not sure how much truth there is to that. | ||
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							semantics
							
							
						 
						10040 Posts
						 On March 14 2014 08:25 zlefin wrote: Perhaps if Russia hadn't been a prick about this, that could have happened peacefully, instead of this nonsense. That is really where Russia's whole idea about people in Crimea being subjugated by extremists in western Ukraine falls apart. There was no known call for help before Russia started their occupation of Crimea. Which gives a strong sense that it's all just a flimsy excuse for Russia to invade Crimea, seemed further backed up by controlling of media going in and out of Crimea and the aggression towards journalist trying to find out more. | ||
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							Gorsameth
							
							
						 
						Netherlands21939 Posts
						 On March 14 2014 09:25 semantics wrote: That is really where Russia's whole idea about people in Crimea being subjugated by extremists in western Ukraine falls apart. There was no known call for help before Russia started their occupation of Crimea. Which gives a strong sense that it's all just a flimsy excuse for Russia to invade Crimea, seemed further backed up by controlling of media going in and out of Crimea and the aggression towards journalist trying to find out more. Is there even anyone in the west who thinks this is anything else but what you said? | ||
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							Deleted User 183001
							
							
						 
						2939 Posts
						 On March 14 2014 07:18 oneofthem wrote: are you not the least bit suspicious about bias lol. real? Of course there will be bias. There's always at least some degree of bias in any situation like this, and there certainly will be in this one, just like what I mentioned about people getting internships/jobs for little to no effort (thanks to a backer with lots of professional ties). But it's not at all surprising. I don't know how things work in Ukraine, but in the United States, when you get interviewed, you're going to be checked for and asked about all your relevant education, skills, experience, etc. In terms of education, applications are almost always done for obvious reasons (it would be impossible to interview tens of thousands of applicants per university), and there's many considerations that go into university acceptance besides standardized exams, such as high school grades, extracurricular activities, legacy or other connections, race/gender, finances, etc. The point is there's a ton of things one can be reviewed on outside a standardized test score. Of course, many countries just go off a standardized exam (see ROK iirc). Maybe Ukraine is this way too? Which would explain why you don't know about other metrics. But this isn't a how to get into university thread, so I'll leave it at that. | ||
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							Deleted User 137586
							
							
						 
						7859 Posts
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							Geisterkarle
							
							
						 
						Germany3257 Posts
						 http://blogs.wsj.com/brussels/2014/02/28/why-germanys-ukraine-reform-refrain-sounds-familiar/ basically it's what I always predicted: This whole mess with possible civil war and trouble, will probably end in another "economic mess" where tens of thousands of people will lose their jobs, Ukraine property will be ransacked by international entrepreneurs and the land will be left in shambles and people are back on the street! For reference: Just look at Greece and how "well" they are doing, now the IWF got hold of them and reformed them to their bones! | ||
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							Deleted User 137586
							
							
						 
						7859 Posts
						 Remarks by Ambassador Samantha Power, U.S. Permanent Representative to the United Nations, At a Security Council Meeting on Ukraine, March 13, 2014 Thank you, Mr. President, thank you Under-Secretary-General Feltman, and thank you Mr. Prime Minister, for your timely briefing. This meeting comes at a time when every day we are seeing an ever-more stark contrast between the conduct of the authorities in Kiev and the conduct of the authorities in Moscow. Let me consider each in turn. + Show Spoiler + Ukraine’s government is placing a priority on internal reconciliation, plans for free and fair elections, and political inclusivity. It proposed the creation of a task force to consider the possibility of enhanced autonomy for Crimea within Ukraine. Ukrainian leaders have made clear the future they wish for their people – a future of pluralism, prosperity and dignity, a future free of corruption and cronyism, a future in which the Ukrainian people do not have to choose between east and west. The government of Ukraine has been unwavering in its pledge to honor all of its international agreements, including those covering Russian military bases. Ukraine has also shown remarkable restraint over the last few weeks with respect to the use of its armed forces. As evidenced today by the statement of Prime Minister Yatsenyuk, Ukraine’s voice throughout this crisis has been one of reason, support for the rule of law, and restraint in the face of provocation. It was voted in nearly unanimously by the Rada, and has since enjoyed broad support across the political spectrum, including from former President Yanukovych’s former party. The government also includes representatives from across the country -- east and west, north and south. Ukraine’s leadership is properly focused on the needs of its people. Yesterday, in Washington, the prime minister met with President Obama and other leaders of my government, and also with top officials of the International Monetary Fund. The prime minister’s goal is to stabilize his country’s finances, curb corruption, and lay the groundwork for progress under a new government to be elected peacefully, freely and fairly by all the people of Ukraine on May 25th. These elections, which are just over two months away, will give any citizen who has a different vision for Ukraine the chance to be heard. It will give those who wish to shape Ukraine’s future the chance to be elected. Ukraine’s efforts to stabilize its economy and the coming elections merit the wholehearted support of every member of this Council and of the broader international community. In Moscow, we see a different kind of leadership. Russia has pursued a course of military action from the outset. At the very start of the crisis, Russia massed its forces along Ukraine’s border for “military exercises” while supporting efforts inside Crimea to take control of Ukrainian border posts, surround Ukrainian military facilities, seize control of public facilities, and replace Ukrainian media with Russian stations. President Putin asked for and received authorization from the Federation Council to use military force in Crimea, and today there are reportedly more than 20,000 troops in the region. Although Moscow justified its actions in the name of protecting ethnic Russians, Russian troops have repeatedly obstructed international monitors and mediators and denied them access, even though their task is to ensure that the rights of minorities are not violated. This is not the behavior of people who believe that they have truth and law on their side. The self-anointed Crimean leaders set a referendum date with full backing from Russia. That date was to be May 25th. Then they reset the date for March 16th, allowing less than two weeks to prepare for and carry out a vote. Two weeks – on an issue of monumental importance, risking grave destabilizing consequences, in defiance of the Ukrainian Constitution and in defiance of international law. The referendum ballot that will be put to voters contains no option to vote for the status quo. Ballots with nothing checked will reportedly be ruled invalid. As the vote approaches this weekend, the Russian military intervention continues, and we learned this morning of new military operations by Russian troops involving artillery batteries, assault helicopters, and at least 10,000 additional soldiers near the Ukrainian border. The proposed March 16 referendum on the status of Crimea is everything that the scheduled May 25th election is not. If the May 25th election offers an opportunity under the law for all Ukrainians to participate in charting their shared future, Sunday’s referendum in Crimea is hastily-planned, unjustified, and divisive. Ukraine’s constitution requires that any change to its territory can only be achieved through a national referendum. Because the government has not authorized such a measure, the proposed balloting on March 16th would violate Ukraine's sovereignty. Any referendum on Crimea must be conducted within the bounds of Ukrainian law. Accordingly, the United States joins with others in calling for the suspension of this ill-conceived initiative, which cannot be recognized as legitimate, especially when carried out against the backdrop of a foreign military incursion. We also call on the Russian Federation to refrain from further actions in support of this dangerous undertaking. Mr. President, the only true solution to the current crisis is through diplomacy. My government strongly supports direct talks between the Russian Federation and the Government of Ukraine, to be conducted – if necessary – with appropriate help from the international community. Secretary Kerry will meet Foreign Minister Lavrov tomorrow in the hopes of finding a way off this path of confrontation. Given the risk of conflict, none of us can afford to leave any stone unturned – but Russia has to want a diplomatic solution. The diplomatic path remains both viable and desirable because the way forward is clear. Russian forces must return to their bases and Russia must honor its agreements with Ukraine. All countries must respect Ukraine’s sovereignty and territorial integrity and seek to resolve disputes through peaceful means. Every country must fulfill its obligations under the UN Charter, and its commitments under the 1994 Budapest Memorandum and the Helsinki Final Act. Ukraine and the Russian Federation must abide fully by their bilateral agreements, including the 1997 Treaty of Friendship, Cooperation, and Partnership, and the 1997 basing agreement. These steps, each in accordance with prior agreements -- each consistent with international law, each in keeping with the best interests of the people of Ukraine – are all that is needed to end this crisis in a way that respects the rights and interests of everyone involved. In accordance with these principles, the United States is proposing a resolution for Council consideration that would endorse a peaceful solution to the Ukraine crisis based on international law and the Council’s mandate to act when necessary to ensure global security and peace. In closing, Mr. President, I would like to reiterate my government’s belief that to resolve this crisis, what is needed now is for a climate of restraint to replace confrontation; openness to replace obstructionism; and peaceful dialogue to replace coercion. This is the moment to show that laws matter, rules matter, territorial integrity matters. If we don't come together, if we don’t send a clear signal of our shared commitments, we will live with the consequences in Crimea, and well beyond. We will look back on this moment and wish we had come together with a unified voice before the consequences became dire and innocent lives were lost. Anyone have more transcripts? *** Remember how I said that Russia tends to accuse other countries of whatever they themselves are doing wrong? Well, in the wake of Russia turning off all independent media: | ||
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							hypercube
							
							
						 
						Hungary2735 Posts
						 On March 14 2014 16:15 Geisterkarle wrote: For reference: Just look at Greece and how "well" they are doing, now the IWF got hold of them and reformed them to their bones! Blaming IMF is like blaming loansharks. Sure, they're a nasty piece of work but the problem was having to ask for their 'help' in the first place. | ||
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							xM(Z
							
							
						 
						Romania5295 Posts
						 On March 14 2014 16:24 Ghanburighan wrote: Remember how I said that Russia tends to accuse other countries of whatever they themselves are doing wrong? Well, in the wake of Russia turning off all independent media: https://twitter.com/maxseddon/status/444380488258842624 so were they?; not allowed in/kicked out from the press conference | ||
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							Deleted User 137586
							
							
						 
						7859 Posts
						 On March 14 2014 18:23 xM(Z wrote: so were they?; not allowed in/kicked out from the press conference No-one seems to know: The Russian foreign ministry did not provide the names of journalists unable to join Wednesday's event. The White House was not immediately available for comment. Source. My prediction, it's all a ruse, like it always is when Russia is trying to create a red herring to cover up its own violations. | ||
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