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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up! NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious. Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action. |
On February 24 2017 02:38 Gorsameth wrote:For what its worth I don't think Trump has to be present for this. The guy is not a soldier and will not have anything to contribute, nor was it of the impact like for example to attack on Bin Laden. Why would the President have to be watching on every single commando action?
To give orders to get out of there if things go real bad instead of waiting for it to up the chain of command which could easily cause confusion and the fact that he has to give the go ahead. Never mind if Bannon and crew were in the room with no experience. Hence Obama was in the Situation Room during the Osama raid and the fact that he gave the go ahead.
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Previous White Houses have avoided the optics that the president was not paying attention to what was going on in the situation room during a dangerous military action. Or at least had directed people to keep him updated and cleared the time of the raid itself to make sure he was available to make any decisions that might be required.
They were in the office for a week, so I bet they did not think about it. But it is something the White House press corp. will report on.
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The encounter being described is not akin to "every single commando action," it was an executive directive-driven special operations mission that required presidential approval prior to commencement. Presidents typically stand by while an operation pursuant to their special authority is going on, which is why folks are honing in on this scenario so much. The unusually high casualty rate, particularly for an executive special op, is also worth noting.
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On February 24 2017 02:41 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2017 02:38 Gorsameth wrote:On February 24 2017 02:34 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
<Snip for length> For what its worth I don't think Trump has to be present for this. The guy is not a soldier and will not have anything to contribute, nor was it of the impact like for example to attack on Bin Laden. Why would the President have to be watching on every single commando action? To give orders to get out of there if things go real bad instead of waiting for it to up the chain of command which could easily cause confusion and the fact that he has to give the go ahead. Never mind if Bannon and crew were in the room with no experience. Hence Obama was in the Situation Room during the Osama raid and the fact that he gave the go ahead.
A general who has actual experience can make the call to pull out. Trump doesn't need to make that call any more then Obama would have to because neither is able to judge the situation. All they would do is defer to the opinion of whatever General they trust.
Just because the President is Commander in Chief does not mean he has to personally authorize everything.
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I am not 100% sure of the chain of command, but I think either the President or Chief of Staff would need to give the order abort. And I am not sure even the Chief of Staff could do it.
On February 24 2017 02:45 Gorsameth wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2017 02:41 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:On February 24 2017 02:38 Gorsameth wrote:On February 24 2017 02:34 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
<Snip for length> For what its worth I don't think Trump has to be present for this. The guy is not a soldier and will not have anything to contribute, nor was it of the impact like for example to attack on Bin Laden. Why would the President have to be watching on every single commando action? To give orders to get out of there if things go real bad instead of waiting for it to up the chain of command which could easily cause confusion and the fact that he has to give the go ahead. Never mind if Bannon and crew were in the room with no experience. Hence Obama was in the Situation Room during the Osama raid and the fact that he gave the go ahead. A general who has actual experience can make the call to pull out. Trump doesn't need to make that call any more then Obama would have to because neither is able to judge the situation. All they would do is defer to the opinion of whatever General they trust. Just because the President is Commander in Chief does not mean he has to personally authorize everything.
That is 100% on a case by case, operation by operation basis. Who was authorized to abort that mission is not public information yet.
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I'll have to wait and see to find out more about the exact chain of command rules and read up on the background of the order to go in before figuring out a specific position.
I don't think trump has anything useful to add by being in the situation room, or that his judgment of when to pull out would be any better than the on-hand generals and military staff. I'd just as well leave it to them.
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CPAC organizer denounces ‘alt-right’ as ‘left-wing fascist group’
One of the first speeches at this year’s Conservative Political Action Conference challenged the media to stop referring to the “alt-right,” a small, far-right movement that seeks a whites-only state and that strongly backed Donald Trump for president, as conservative.
“There is a sinister organization that is trying to warp its way into our ranks,” said Dan Schneider, the executive director of the American Conservative Union, which runs CPAC. “We must not be deceived by [a] hateful, left-wing fascist group.”
Over a few confusing minutes, Schneider argued that the “alt-right,” a term coined then popularized by the National Policy Institute’s Richard Spencer, was philosophically left-wing because it departed from his definition of conservatism, in which “the individual” is sovereign.
“They hate the Constitution. They hate free markets. They hate pluralism,” Schneider said. “Fascists tend to want big government control.”
[...]
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/powerpost/wp/2017/02/23/cpac-organizer-denounces-alt-right-as-left-wing-fascist-group/
We should ban Americans from using 'left' and 'right' to describe political ideology
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At least it's something we can blame the French for.
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Hear! Hear! I second this motion.
That is how this works, right?
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On February 24 2017 01:51 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2017 01:35 Danglars wrote:On February 24 2017 00:48 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:A purported cyber hack of the daughter of political consultant Paul Manafort suggests that he was the victim of a blackmail attempt while he was serving as Donald Trump’s presidential campaign chairman last summer.
The undated communications, which are allegedly from the iPhone of Manafort’s daughter, include a text that appears to come from a Ukrainian parliamentarian named Serhiy Leshchenko, seeking to reach her father, in which he claims to have politically damaging information about both Manafort and Trump.
Attached to the text is a note to Paul Manafort referring to “bulletproof” evidence related to Manafort’s financial arrangement with Ukraine’s former president, the pro-Russian strongman Viktor Yanukovych, as well as an alleged 2012 meeting between Trump and a close Yanukovych associate named Serhiy Tulub.
“Considering all the facts and evidence that are in my possession, and before possible decision whether to pass this to [the National Anti-Corruption Bureau of Ukraine] or FBI I would like to get your opinion on this and maybe your way to work things out that will persuade me to do otherwise,” reads the note. It is signed “Sergii” — an alternative transliteration of Leshchenko’s given name — and it urges Manafort to respond to an email address that reporters have used to reach Leshchenko.
In the text to Manafort’s daughter to which the note was attached, the sender writes from a different address, “I need to get in touch with Paul i need to share some important information with him regarding ukraine investigation.” The sender adds “as soon as he comes back to me i will pass you documents,” but also warns: “if I don’t get any reply from you iam gonaa pass it on to the fbi and ukrainian authorities inducing media.”
Leshchenko disavowed the texts in question, telling POLITICO on Tuesday “I've never written any emails or messages to … Manafort or his family. I don't know their contact details.” He added he said “I have nothing to do with” the email address from which the texts were sent.
And in a Facebook post, he wrote that the “correspondence with Manafort's daughter is obviously fake.”
A purported cyber hack of the daughter of political consultant Paul Manafort suggests that he was the victim of a blackmail attempt while he was serving as Donald Trump’s presidential campaign chairman last summer.
The undated communications, which are allegedly from the iPhone of Manafort’s daughter, include a text that appears to come from a Ukrainian parliamentarian named Serhiy Leshchenko, seeking to reach her father, in which he claims to have politically damaging information about both Manafort and Trump.
Attached to the text is a note to Paul Manafort referring to “bulletproof” evidence related to Manafort’s financial arrangement with Ukraine’s former president, the pro-Russian strongman Viktor Yanukovych, as well as an alleged 2012 meeting between Trump and a close Yanukovych associate named Serhiy Tulub.
“Considering all the facts and evidence that are in my possession, and before possible decision whether to pass this to [the National Anti-Corruption Bureau of Ukraine] or FBI I would like to get your opinion on this and maybe your way to work things out that will persuade me to do otherwise,” reads the note. It is signed “Sergii” — an alternative transliteration of Leshchenko’s given name — and it urges Manafort to respond to an email address that reporters have used to reach Leshchenko.
In the text to Manafort’s daughter to which the note was attached, the sender writes from a different address, “I need to get in touch with Paul i need to share some important information with him regarding ukraine investigation.” The sender adds “as soon as he comes back to me i will pass you documents,” but also warns: “if I don’t get any reply from you iam gonaa pass it on to the fbi and ukrainian authorities inducing media.”
Leshchenko disavowed the texts in question, telling POLITICO on Tuesday “I've never written any emails or messages to … Manafort or his family. I don't know their contact details.” He added he said “I have nothing to do with” the email address from which the texts were sent.
And in a Facebook post, he wrote that the “correspondence with Manafort's daughter is obviously fake.”
The White House did not respond to a question about whether Trump had met with Tulub, a hunting buddy of Yanukovych’s who had served as part of government when Yanukovych was prime minister. But a White House official questioned the chronology supporting the claim, explaining that Trump had not worked with Manafort before the 2016 campaign.
In a Tuesday interview, Manafort denied brokering a 2012 meeting between Trump and Tulub, also pointing out that he wasn’t working for Trump at the time.
However, Manafort did confirm the authenticity of the texts hacked from his daughter’s phone. And he added that, before the texts were sent to his daughter, he had received similar texts to his own phone number from the same address appearing to be affiliated with Leshchenko.
He said he did not respond directly to any of the texts, and instead passed them along to his lawyer. He declined to provide the texts to POLITICO. Source Purported cyber attacks on Manafort's family now. I want incredible Russia-connection stories made great again damnit ... golden showers to spite Obama were far more glorious. Right now it's just like a bad movie script that never got made into a film. Maybe drunk Putin texts Ivanka some salacious goodies; I'm sure that can be arranged (and everybody deny it afterwards just like now). Manafort confirmed they were real? Maybe he could be lying, but that would be weird.
One-way message from a Ukrainian legislator to the daughter of a former campaign manager of Trump, possibly spoofed sender. Is Politico even trying anymore? Like I said earlier, let's make Russia intrigue great again because if you're National Enquirer, at least have a romance angle.
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On February 24 2017 03:03 Danglars wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2017 01:51 Plansix wrote:On February 24 2017 01:35 Danglars wrote:On February 24 2017 00:48 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:A purported cyber hack of the daughter of political consultant Paul Manafort suggests that he was the victim of a blackmail attempt while he was serving as Donald Trump’s presidential campaign chairman last summer.
The undated communications, which are allegedly from the iPhone of Manafort’s daughter, include a text that appears to come from a Ukrainian parliamentarian named Serhiy Leshchenko, seeking to reach her father, in which he claims to have politically damaging information about both Manafort and Trump.
Attached to the text is a note to Paul Manafort referring to “bulletproof” evidence related to Manafort’s financial arrangement with Ukraine’s former president, the pro-Russian strongman Viktor Yanukovych, as well as an alleged 2012 meeting between Trump and a close Yanukovych associate named Serhiy Tulub.
“Considering all the facts and evidence that are in my possession, and before possible decision whether to pass this to [the National Anti-Corruption Bureau of Ukraine] or FBI I would like to get your opinion on this and maybe your way to work things out that will persuade me to do otherwise,” reads the note. It is signed “Sergii” — an alternative transliteration of Leshchenko’s given name — and it urges Manafort to respond to an email address that reporters have used to reach Leshchenko.
In the text to Manafort’s daughter to which the note was attached, the sender writes from a different address, “I need to get in touch with Paul i need to share some important information with him regarding ukraine investigation.” The sender adds “as soon as he comes back to me i will pass you documents,” but also warns: “if I don’t get any reply from you iam gonaa pass it on to the fbi and ukrainian authorities inducing media.”
Leshchenko disavowed the texts in question, telling POLITICO on Tuesday “I've never written any emails or messages to … Manafort or his family. I don't know their contact details.” He added he said “I have nothing to do with” the email address from which the texts were sent.
And in a Facebook post, he wrote that the “correspondence with Manafort's daughter is obviously fake.”
A purported cyber hack of the daughter of political consultant Paul Manafort suggests that he was the victim of a blackmail attempt while he was serving as Donald Trump’s presidential campaign chairman last summer.
The undated communications, which are allegedly from the iPhone of Manafort’s daughter, include a text that appears to come from a Ukrainian parliamentarian named Serhiy Leshchenko, seeking to reach her father, in which he claims to have politically damaging information about both Manafort and Trump.
Attached to the text is a note to Paul Manafort referring to “bulletproof” evidence related to Manafort’s financial arrangement with Ukraine’s former president, the pro-Russian strongman Viktor Yanukovych, as well as an alleged 2012 meeting between Trump and a close Yanukovych associate named Serhiy Tulub.
“Considering all the facts and evidence that are in my possession, and before possible decision whether to pass this to [the National Anti-Corruption Bureau of Ukraine] or FBI I would like to get your opinion on this and maybe your way to work things out that will persuade me to do otherwise,” reads the note. It is signed “Sergii” — an alternative transliteration of Leshchenko’s given name — and it urges Manafort to respond to an email address that reporters have used to reach Leshchenko.
In the text to Manafort’s daughter to which the note was attached, the sender writes from a different address, “I need to get in touch with Paul i need to share some important information with him regarding ukraine investigation.” The sender adds “as soon as he comes back to me i will pass you documents,” but also warns: “if I don’t get any reply from you iam gonaa pass it on to the fbi and ukrainian authorities inducing media.”
Leshchenko disavowed the texts in question, telling POLITICO on Tuesday “I've never written any emails or messages to … Manafort or his family. I don't know their contact details.” He added he said “I have nothing to do with” the email address from which the texts were sent.
And in a Facebook post, he wrote that the “correspondence with Manafort's daughter is obviously fake.”
The White House did not respond to a question about whether Trump had met with Tulub, a hunting buddy of Yanukovych’s who had served as part of government when Yanukovych was prime minister. But a White House official questioned the chronology supporting the claim, explaining that Trump had not worked with Manafort before the 2016 campaign.
In a Tuesday interview, Manafort denied brokering a 2012 meeting between Trump and Tulub, also pointing out that he wasn’t working for Trump at the time.
However, Manafort did confirm the authenticity of the texts hacked from his daughter’s phone. And he added that, before the texts were sent to his daughter, he had received similar texts to his own phone number from the same address appearing to be affiliated with Leshchenko.
He said he did not respond directly to any of the texts, and instead passed them along to his lawyer. He declined to provide the texts to POLITICO. Source Purported cyber attacks on Manafort's family now. I want incredible Russia-connection stories made great again damnit ... golden showers to spite Obama were far more glorious. Right now it's just like a bad movie script that never got made into a film. Maybe drunk Putin texts Ivanka some salacious goodies; I'm sure that can be arranged (and everybody deny it afterwards just like now). Manafort confirmed they were real? Maybe he could be lying, but that would be weird. One-way message from a Ukrainian legislator to the daughter of a former campaign manager of Trump, possibly spoofed sender. Is Politico even trying anymore? Like I said earlier, let's make Russia intrigue great again because if you're National Enquirer, at least have a romance angle.
Like me, you are entitled to believe whatever news source you want. If you are going to argue that everything is fake/poorly vetted, then feel free to do so. Not much more to discuss at that point.
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On February 24 2017 02:51 Plansix wrote:
Hear! Hear! I second this motion.
That is how this works, right?
whoa, what are we, a bunch of savages? This motion wasn't even introduced properly, let's not get ahead of ourselves.
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On February 24 2017 03:06 Tachion wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2017 02:51 Plansix wrote:
Hear! Hear! I second this motion.
That is how this works, right? whoa, what are we, a bunch of savages? This motion wasn't even introduced properly, let's not get ahead of ourselves.
Typical establishment argument, wanting to stifle progress by citing procedure. This forum will not be held back by your arbitrary rules.
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On February 24 2017 03:03 Danglars wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2017 01:51 Plansix wrote:On February 24 2017 01:35 Danglars wrote:On February 24 2017 00:48 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:A purported cyber hack of the daughter of political consultant Paul Manafort suggests that he was the victim of a blackmail attempt while he was serving as Donald Trump’s presidential campaign chairman last summer.
The undated communications, which are allegedly from the iPhone of Manafort’s daughter, include a text that appears to come from a Ukrainian parliamentarian named Serhiy Leshchenko, seeking to reach her father, in which he claims to have politically damaging information about both Manafort and Trump.
Attached to the text is a note to Paul Manafort referring to “bulletproof” evidence related to Manafort’s financial arrangement with Ukraine’s former president, the pro-Russian strongman Viktor Yanukovych, as well as an alleged 2012 meeting between Trump and a close Yanukovych associate named Serhiy Tulub.
“Considering all the facts and evidence that are in my possession, and before possible decision whether to pass this to [the National Anti-Corruption Bureau of Ukraine] or FBI I would like to get your opinion on this and maybe your way to work things out that will persuade me to do otherwise,” reads the note. It is signed “Sergii” — an alternative transliteration of Leshchenko’s given name — and it urges Manafort to respond to an email address that reporters have used to reach Leshchenko.
In the text to Manafort’s daughter to which the note was attached, the sender writes from a different address, “I need to get in touch with Paul i need to share some important information with him regarding ukraine investigation.” The sender adds “as soon as he comes back to me i will pass you documents,” but also warns: “if I don’t get any reply from you iam gonaa pass it on to the fbi and ukrainian authorities inducing media.”
Leshchenko disavowed the texts in question, telling POLITICO on Tuesday “I've never written any emails or messages to … Manafort or his family. I don't know their contact details.” He added he said “I have nothing to do with” the email address from which the texts were sent.
And in a Facebook post, he wrote that the “correspondence with Manafort's daughter is obviously fake.”
A purported cyber hack of the daughter of political consultant Paul Manafort suggests that he was the victim of a blackmail attempt while he was serving as Donald Trump’s presidential campaign chairman last summer.
The undated communications, which are allegedly from the iPhone of Manafort’s daughter, include a text that appears to come from a Ukrainian parliamentarian named Serhiy Leshchenko, seeking to reach her father, in which he claims to have politically damaging information about both Manafort and Trump.
Attached to the text is a note to Paul Manafort referring to “bulletproof” evidence related to Manafort’s financial arrangement with Ukraine’s former president, the pro-Russian strongman Viktor Yanukovych, as well as an alleged 2012 meeting between Trump and a close Yanukovych associate named Serhiy Tulub.
“Considering all the facts and evidence that are in my possession, and before possible decision whether to pass this to [the National Anti-Corruption Bureau of Ukraine] or FBI I would like to get your opinion on this and maybe your way to work things out that will persuade me to do otherwise,” reads the note. It is signed “Sergii” — an alternative transliteration of Leshchenko’s given name — and it urges Manafort to respond to an email address that reporters have used to reach Leshchenko.
In the text to Manafort’s daughter to which the note was attached, the sender writes from a different address, “I need to get in touch with Paul i need to share some important information with him regarding ukraine investigation.” The sender adds “as soon as he comes back to me i will pass you documents,” but also warns: “if I don’t get any reply from you iam gonaa pass it on to the fbi and ukrainian authorities inducing media.”
Leshchenko disavowed the texts in question, telling POLITICO on Tuesday “I've never written any emails or messages to … Manafort or his family. I don't know their contact details.” He added he said “I have nothing to do with” the email address from which the texts were sent.
And in a Facebook post, he wrote that the “correspondence with Manafort's daughter is obviously fake.”
The White House did not respond to a question about whether Trump had met with Tulub, a hunting buddy of Yanukovych’s who had served as part of government when Yanukovych was prime minister. But a White House official questioned the chronology supporting the claim, explaining that Trump had not worked with Manafort before the 2016 campaign.
In a Tuesday interview, Manafort denied brokering a 2012 meeting between Trump and Tulub, also pointing out that he wasn’t working for Trump at the time.
However, Manafort did confirm the authenticity of the texts hacked from his daughter’s phone. And he added that, before the texts were sent to his daughter, he had received similar texts to his own phone number from the same address appearing to be affiliated with Leshchenko.
He said he did not respond directly to any of the texts, and instead passed them along to his lawyer. He declined to provide the texts to POLITICO. Source Purported cyber attacks on Manafort's family now. I want incredible Russia-connection stories made great again damnit ... golden showers to spite Obama were far more glorious. Right now it's just like a bad movie script that never got made into a film. Maybe drunk Putin texts Ivanka some salacious goodies; I'm sure that can be arranged (and everybody deny it afterwards just like now). Manafort confirmed they were real? Maybe he could be lying, but that would be weird. One-way message from a Ukrainian legislator to the daughter of a former campaign manager of Trump, possibly spoofed sender. Is Politico even trying anymore? Like I said earlier, let's make Russia intrigue great again because if you're National Enquirer, at least have a romance angle.
That's fine, just don't cast this as something "everybody" is denying. Thus far there's no factual errors in the story whatsoever and the only denial is from Leshchenko, and the story even says it's just an account linked with his phone and not necessarily the man himself. Politico even did due diligence and didn't publish before getting a comment from Manafort (if they hadn't or had published it despite him denying it the story would be utter trash I think).
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On February 24 2017 02:35 LegalLord wrote:
Mind you, having shitty ties to the former leader of the Ukraine (not exactly pro-Russian, more like "money-grubbing opportunist who makes some deals with Russia and others with Europe") is much different than being directly tied to Russia.
Wouldn't mind some deep, compromising relationships with Russia though. It would make the next four years more spicy. Preferably it will come out a little later though so we can milk leaking for all it's worth.
And you wonder why people say you're a troll.
Also, weren't the ties to the pro-Russian puppet government in Ukraine? So how is that "not exactly pro-Russian"?
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Boehner was speaking at a health care conference in Orlando, according to Politico.
"Republicans never ever agree on health care," he said.
Boehner was a reliable voice for “repeal and replace” for years. In 2010, he wrote, “Republicans are fighting to repeal it so we can start over with common-sense reforms that get health-care reform right.”
In 2013, House Republicans under his leadership shut down the federal government for the first time since 1996 with the aim of gutting the law.
"House Republicans still desire to delay or defund or disband Obamacare and we're going to stick to this effort,” House Rules Committee Chairman Pete Sessions (R-TX) said at the time.
Boehner kept the mantra going until he left Congress. In 2014, he told a group of constituents, “The answer is repeal and replace.” A year later, still without an agreed-upon replacement plan, he said “Committees are continuing to work on that and I'm sure we're gonna see one soon.”
Around the same time, TPM’s Sahil Kapur compiled a list of 20 times GOP leaders promised their own Obamacare replacement plans.
Boehner on Thursday was not optimistic that repeal and replace would occur. Instead, congressional Republicans are “going to fix Obamacare – I shouldn’t call it repeal and replace, because it’s not going to happen," he said.
He concluded, according to Politico: “Most of the framework of the Affordable Care Act … that’s going to be there.”
Source
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On February 24 2017 03:43 ChristianS wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2017 02:35 LegalLord wrote:
Mind you, having shitty ties to the former leader of the Ukraine (not exactly pro-Russian, more like "money-grubbing opportunist who makes some deals with Russia and others with Europe") is much different than being directly tied to Russia.
Wouldn't mind some deep, compromising relationships with Russia though. It would make the next four years more spicy. Preferably it will come out a little later though so we can milk leaking for all it's worth. And you wonder why people say you're a troll. Also, weren't the ties to the pro-Russian puppet government in Ukraine? So how is that "not exactly pro-Russian"?
I don't get it. He states the answer to your question directly in his first sentence. what does the Ukranine make him a troll?
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On February 24 2017 03:43 ChristianS wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2017 02:35 LegalLord wrote:
Mind you, having shitty ties to the former leader of the Ukraine (not exactly pro-Russian, more like "money-grubbing opportunist who makes some deals with Russia and others with Europe") is much different than being directly tied to Russia.
Wouldn't mind some deep, compromising relationships with Russia though. It would make the next four years more spicy. Preferably it will come out a little later though so we can milk leaking for all it's worth. And you wonder why people say you're a troll. Also, weren't the ties to the pro-Russian puppet government in Ukraine? So how is that "not exactly pro-Russian"?
He wasn't exactly pro-Russian, at all. He was pro-Russian-money.
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On February 24 2017 03:43 ChristianS wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2017 02:35 LegalLord wrote:
Mind you, having shitty ties to the former leader of the Ukraine (not exactly pro-Russian, more like "money-grubbing opportunist who makes some deals with Russia and others with Europe") is much different than being directly tied to Russia.
Wouldn't mind some deep, compromising relationships with Russia though. It would make the next four years more spicy. Preferably it will come out a little later though so we can milk leaking for all it's worth. And you wonder why people say you're a troll. Also, weren't the ties to the pro-Russian puppet government in Ukraine? So how is that "not exactly pro-Russian"?
People that are pro-putin and pro-russian government wear signs and say “we are for the overthrow and disruption of the democratic process” when you meet them. They also have bears for pets.
Its like Red Alert 2, but with better accents.
On February 24 2017 03:50 LegalLord wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2017 03:43 ChristianS wrote:On February 24 2017 02:35 LegalLord wrote:
Mind you, having shitty ties to the former leader of the Ukraine (not exactly pro-Russian, more like "money-grubbing opportunist who makes some deals with Russia and others with Europe") is much different than being directly tied to Russia.
Wouldn't mind some deep, compromising relationships with Russia though. It would make the next four years more spicy. Preferably it will come out a little later though so we can milk leaking for all it's worth. And you wonder why people say you're a troll. Also, weren't the ties to the pro-Russian puppet government in Ukraine? So how is that "not exactly pro-Russian"? He wasn't exactly pro-Russian, at all. He was pro-Russian-money.
No one claimed he was pro-putin/Russia because of the cooking or great healthcare plan.
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EPT
