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US Politics Mega-thread - Page 5738

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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.

In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up!

NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious.
Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action.
Randomaccount#77123
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States5003 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-10-22 16:41:06
October 22 2016 16:39 GMT
#114741
--- Nuked ---
las91
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
United States5080 Posts
October 22 2016 16:49 GMT
#114742
On October 23 2016 01:39 Barrin wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 23 2016 01:30 oBlade wrote:
On October 23 2016 01:21 Nevuk wrote:
On October 23 2016 01:17 oBlade wrote:
On October 22 2016 20:28 Biff The Understudy wrote:
On October 22 2016 12:44 oBlade wrote:
He did quite well, if you go by all the people laughing. Only lost the crowd for the about 3 minutes when he was going for the jugular. Hillary didn't have the same kind of highs, whether because she had to go after or whatever reason. But nobody was thrown under any bus, it's a friendly fun dinner.

He did quite well? He got fucking booed, it made the headlines in the whole world.

Hey, here is an exercise for you : see if you can spot the difference:

I don't want it getting out of this room but my opponent is an impressive fellow in many ways. Political opponents can have a little trouble seeing the best in each other. But I have had a few glimpses of this man at his best. And I admire his great skill, energy, and determination.

It's not for nothing that he has inspired so many folks in his own party and beyond. Senator Obama talks about making history and he has made quite a bit of it already. There was a time when the mere invitation of an African-American citizen to dine at the White House was taken as an outrage and an insult in many corridors.

and

Hillary is so corrupt she got kicked off the Watergate Commission. How corrupt do you have to be to get kicked off the Watergate Commission? Pretty corrupt

He also got laughs, applause, whistles, and cheers. You're caught in a vortex. It's a lighthearted dinner, not everything is the latest chapter in "lol Drumpf BTFO."
your heart just isn't in this anymore

Must be too busy with my brain.

BTFO!

Lol, seriously though... you guys so concerned about this dinner have lost your right to pretend it's more about policy than character. (I have too, for the record.)

+ Show Spoiler +
...man you guys must think I'm secretly a Trump supporter given most of what I say in this thread. But really, sometimes I can't tell if it's liberals or conservatives who base more of their decisions on feelings.


It's people. People base their decisions on feelings. Don't think that's necessarily a political leaning thing
In Inca we trust
Randomaccount#77123
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States5003 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-10-22 16:54:56
October 22 2016 16:52 GMT
#114743
--- Nuked ---
las91
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
United States5080 Posts
October 22 2016 16:53 GMT
#114744
On October 23 2016 01:52 Barrin wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 23 2016 01:49 las91 wrote:
On October 23 2016 01:39 Barrin wrote:
On October 23 2016 01:30 oBlade wrote:
On October 23 2016 01:21 Nevuk wrote:
On October 23 2016 01:17 oBlade wrote:
On October 22 2016 20:28 Biff The Understudy wrote:
On October 22 2016 12:44 oBlade wrote:
He did quite well, if you go by all the people laughing. Only lost the crowd for the about 3 minutes when he was going for the jugular. Hillary didn't have the same kind of highs, whether because she had to go after or whatever reason. But nobody was thrown under any bus, it's a friendly fun dinner.

He did quite well? He got fucking booed, it made the headlines in the whole world.

Hey, here is an exercise for you : see if you can spot the difference:

I don't want it getting out of this room but my opponent is an impressive fellow in many ways. Political opponents can have a little trouble seeing the best in each other. But I have had a few glimpses of this man at his best. And I admire his great skill, energy, and determination.

It's not for nothing that he has inspired so many folks in his own party and beyond. Senator Obama talks about making history and he has made quite a bit of it already. There was a time when the mere invitation of an African-American citizen to dine at the White House was taken as an outrage and an insult in many corridors.

and

Hillary is so corrupt she got kicked off the Watergate Commission. How corrupt do you have to be to get kicked off the Watergate Commission? Pretty corrupt

He also got laughs, applause, whistles, and cheers. You're caught in a vortex. It's a lighthearted dinner, not everything is the latest chapter in "lol Drumpf BTFO."
your heart just isn't in this anymore

Must be too busy with my brain.

BTFO!

Lol, seriously though... you guys so concerned about this dinner have lost your right to pretend it's more about policy than character. (I have too, for the record.)

+ Show Spoiler +
...man you guys must think I'm secretly a Trump supporter given most of what I say in this thread. But really, sometimes I can't tell if it's liberals or conservatives who base more of their decisions on feelings.


It's people. People base their decisions on feelings. Don't think that's necessarily a political leaning thing

Not all decisions are based entirely on feelings. It's more about degree and amount. I dare say there are people who base most of their decisions on logic rather than feelings.


Yea didn't mean every person, should have been more clear. I would think those that base their decisions more on feelings are more likely to be vocal about it though, but maybe that's just my own perception
In Inca we trust
DarkPlasmaBall
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States44260 Posts
October 22 2016 17:15 GMT
#114745
On October 23 2016 01:13 Barrin wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 23 2016 00:49 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:
On October 22 2016 22:11 a_flayer wrote:
On October 22 2016 20:39 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:
On October 22 2016 18:47 JinDesu wrote:
The cringiest stuff was when they already started lightly booing his joke, then he says he doesn't know if they are angry at her or what, then he proceeds to tell a bunch of catholics that she probably hates catholics and get a full solid booing.


Especially considering how many times Trump has flat-out lied about the importance of the Bible and religion in his life. I'm not religious but I'd facepalm every time he tried pandering to the religious right. He's an awful hypocrite.


I dearly hope that most American presidents lied about their belief in superstitions.


I wish, but unlikely.

What makes you say that?


Organized religion- or at least faith and spirituality- has been an integral part of American culture, historically. Granted, now we're overall less religious than in the past, but we still have plenty of political leaders "deferring" to God's Will in so many ways. Although Obama isn't a religious nutjob, GWB sure was, and many previous presidents had cited the Bible as their moral authority. Heck, even in 2016, one of our two major political parties consistently makes God-related arguments to try and hinder social progress. Ted Cruz and Marco Rubio can't lie *that* convincingly.

I hope that in the future, religion plays a smaller and smaller role in the presidency, and I think that will happen especially since neither Sanders nor Trump is particularly religious yet they had plenty of success in this election, but even after 9/11 (during all the Islamophobia that exists even today) there have been several surveys showing that people would rather have a Muslim than an Atheist in the White House.
"There is nothing more satisfying than looking at a crowd of people and helping them get what I love." ~Day[9] Daily #100
Nyxisto
Profile Joined August 2010
Germany6287 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-10-22 17:20:11
October 22 2016 17:19 GMT
#114746
Trump's base is more religious and cultish than most cults. It's the "devoutness" that's the problem with religion in politics, not the believe in Jesus. Liberation theologians are more atheist than the Trump base
JW_DTLA
Profile Joined December 2015
242 Posts
October 22 2016 17:44 GMT
#114747
Hey look, Trump promising to use the powers of the state within 100 days of his election to settle grudges. He claims all of his accusers are liars who did it to hurt his campaign. Serious question for the conservatives here, do you believe Trump when he claims all 10 are liars? Do you accept Trump's assertions here?



Dan HH
Profile Joined July 2012
Romania9118 Posts
October 22 2016 18:16 GMT
#114748
WIN/Gallup International polled people from 45 countries 'If you were to vote in the American election for president, who would you vote for'?. Russia is the only country were Trump was ahead, China was the only other country where Hillary was ahead by less than 20 points.

+ Show Spoiler [ top & bottom 10] +
[image loading]


Full results here www.wingia.com (PDF)
Nyxisto
Profile Joined August 2010
Germany6287 Posts
October 22 2016 18:18 GMT
#114749
Well China and Russia stand the most to gain if Trump is president, so that makes sense. The notion that Obama was unpopular abroad and that Trump will polish America's image is ridiculous anyway.
Dan HH
Profile Joined July 2012
Romania9118 Posts
October 22 2016 19:16 GMT
#114750
AT&T Reaches Deal to Buy Time Warner for More Than $80 Billion

AT&T Inc. has reached an agreement to buy Time Warner Inc. for between $105 and $110 a share, with a deal likely to be announced as soon as Saturday evening, according to people familiar with the plans.

The boards of the two companies are meeting on Saturday to approve the transaction, the people said. The deal is half cash and half stock, according to one of the people.

The acquisition is valued at more than $80 billion and pushes the carrier deeper into the traditional entertainment business at a time of stalled wireless growth. For Time Warner, the deal represents a victory for Chief Executive Jeff Bewkes, 64, who took some heat from investors for rebuffing a takeover bid two years ago from 21st Century Fox at $85 a share. (21st Century Fox and Wall Street Journal-owner News Corp share common ownership.)

The pairing brings together AT&T’s millions of wireless and pay-television subscribers with Time Warner’s deep media lineup including networks such as CNN, TNT, the prized HBO channel and Warner Bros. film and TV studio.

A merger of the companies would be the most ambitious marriage of content and distribution in the media and telecom industries since Comcast Corp.’s purchase of NBCUniversal and would create a behemoth to rival that cable giant. A rigorous regulatory review is expected and the acquisition of Time Warner likely wouldn’t close until late 2017, people close to the process said.

Regulators have indicated misgivings about the prior Comcast-NBCU deal—in particular, whether obligations placed on Comcast were tough enough and enforceable—so it is unclear if they will be willing to bless another such merger. At the very least, former regulatory officials say there could be significant conditions placed on the combination.

The transaction would be far and away the biggest media deal of recent years. Time Warner had a market capitalization of $68 billion before The Wall Street Journal reported on the advanced talks Friday, while AT&T’s was $233 billion.

On Friday, Time Warner shares closed at $89.48, up 8%.

AT&T has been shifting its sights to media and video in recent years, diving deeper into television after its nearly $50 billion deal to acquire satellite television provider DirecTV last year. That made AT&T, which traces its roots to the old ‘Ma Bell, the country’s biggest pay television provider as well as its second-largest wireless operator.

Time Warner “is the last scaled content play that’s acquirable,” said Michael Nathanson, an analyst at MoffettNathanson, noting that the rest of the major media companies are either so valuable they would be difficult to acquire, like Walt Disney Co., or family controlled, like 21st Century Fox, CBS and Viacom. “HBO, Turner and Warner Bros. are really good assets for a future of nonlinear consumption.”


http://www.wsj.com/articles/at-t-reaches-deal-to-buy-time-warner-for-more-than-80-billion-1477157084
Logo
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States7542 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-10-22 19:34:44
October 22 2016 19:33 GMT
#114751
Man this is the transcript of the speech that's being put forth by Trump and Reddit. http://vesselnews.io/gettysburg-address-first-100-days-trump-administration/

Is this not the same Gettysburg speech everyone is talking about where he says he will sue his harassees and all sorts of other things we've come to expect?

Have his speeches been getting this sort of summary all along?

Not that the summary makes it any better. His policies are terrifying.
Logo
zlefin
Profile Blog Joined October 2012
United States7689 Posts
October 22 2016 19:37 GMT
#114752
On October 23 2016 04:33 Logo wrote:
Man this is the transcript of the speech that's being put forth by Trump and Reddit. http://vesselnews.io/gettysburg-address-first-100-days-trump-administration/

Is this not the same Gettysburg speech everyone is talking about where he says he will sue his harassees and all sorts of other things we've come to expect?

Have his speeches been getting this sort of summary all along?

Not that the summary makes it any better. His policies are terrifying.

dunno, I didn't watch it; from a quick read-through compared to what I've heard about it, i'm guessing that was the script, and he did some of it, but also went off-script some.
But i'm not really sure at all.
Great read: http://shorensteincenter.org/news-coverage-2016-general-election/ great book on democracy: http://press.princeton.edu/titles/10671.html zlefin is grumpier due to long term illness. Ignoring some users.
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
October 22 2016 19:52 GMT
#114753
A former Arkansas senator, a leading local food champion and a beermaker turned governor are among the top contenders to be the next U.S. Secretary of Agriculture should Hillary Clinton win on Nov. 8, POLITICO has learned.

There are five names at the top of an evolving list that the transition is mulling for agriculture secretary — one of the lower-profile Cabinet posts despite its crucial role in the food supply. The list includes Blanche Lincoln, a former Arkansas senator; Kathleen Merrigan, the former deputy secretary of agriculture; John Hickenlooper, the current governor of Colorado; Karen Ross, the current agriculture secretary of California; and Steve Beshear, the former governor of Kentucky.

Sources who have been briefed on the transition team's deliberations cautioned that the list of candidates most seriously under consideration remains fluid two and a half weeks out from the election. If Clinton wins the presidency, the dynamics for selecting the nominee for agriculture secretary are also likely to change significantly based on the makeup of more sought-after cabinet nominations, since Clinton has pledged that half of her cabinet would be women.

For now, three of the top five contenders are women — Ross, Lincoln and Merrigan — and all have long track records in agriculture.

Many in agriculture are giving the early edge to Ross, who, as the head of California's Department of Food and Agriculture, oversees the largest farming state in the country with deep experience in tough issues for agriculture, ranging from labor to trade and water availability and quality.

“I’d have to give Karen Ross the best chance of getting it,” said one agriculture policy insider after reviewing the list.

Ross is a “deeply knowledgeable and competent administrator who would know how to do the job on the first day,” said a food policy observer, adding that “few people would be as prepared to do the job.”

To be sure, Ross checks a lot of boxes for a lot of key interest groups, from conventional to organic agriculture as well as environmental groups. Plus, many say it’s time for a Californian, or at least a non-Midwesterner to lead the department.

The last time that happened was from 2001 until 2005 when Ann Veneman served as President George W. Bush’s first agriculture secretary. Veneman is also from California.

Ross also has the advantage of being close with current Agriculture Secretary Tom Vilsack, the longest serving member of Obama’s cabinet, who also happens to be Clinton’s top adviser on agriculture issues and will undoubtedly be a critical voice in selecting the nominee.


Source
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
DarkPlasmaBall
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States44260 Posts
October 22 2016 19:58 GMT
#114754
The most interesting part of Trump's Gettysburg speech was when he admitted that America would pay for "The Wall (TM)" and then he'd get Mexico to eventually reimburse us. lol.
"There is nothing more satisfying than looking at a crowd of people and helping them get what I love." ~Day[9] Daily #100
Yoav
Profile Joined March 2011
United States1874 Posts
October 22 2016 20:37 GMT
#114755
On October 23 2016 02:15 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:
Heck, even in 2016, one of our two major political parties consistently makes God-related arguments to try and hinder social progress.


And the other major political party consistently makes God-related arguments to try to help social progress... just less so the white people in that party.

And even that's an oversimplification. Religious opinion around the country is actually more complicated than our standard partisan boundaries. Sure, religious people are more likely to be conservative on abortion, and (though it's changing rapidly) gay marriage, but they are also generally pro-immigrant and pro-refugee, strongly in favor of sentencing and prison reform, and believe that poor people and minorities are generally getting the short end of the stick. And the pro-life stance is more across the board than acknowledged for a lot of people: anti-war and anti-capital punishment are very common views.
DarkPlasmaBall
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States44260 Posts
October 22 2016 20:44 GMT
#114756
On October 23 2016 05:37 Yoav wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 23 2016 02:15 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:
Heck, even in 2016, one of our two major political parties consistently makes God-related arguments to try and hinder social progress.


And the other major political party consistently makes God-related arguments to try to help social progress... just less so the white people in that party.


You really think pro-choice and gay marriage proponents invoke God as much as pro-life and traditional marriage advocates?
"There is nothing more satisfying than looking at a crowd of people and helping them get what I love." ~Day[9] Daily #100
a_flayer
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Netherlands2826 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-10-22 20:58:52
October 22 2016 20:46 GMT
#114757
On October 23 2016 04:33 Logo wrote:
Man this is the transcript of the speech that's being put forth by Trump and Reddit. http://vesselnews.io/gettysburg-address-first-100-days-trump-administration/

Is this not the same Gettysburg speech everyone is talking about where he says he will sue his harassees and all sorts of other things we've come to expect?

Have his speeches been getting this sort of summary all along?

Not that the summary makes it any better. His policies are terrifying.


I'd say that's about true. Very often people zoom in on one specific part of the speech and repeat it endlessly.


Reading through the whole thing of his policies, there are only like 4 or 5 parts that really turn me off. I don't have a solid of a grasp to consider some of the others, but there's also a few that seem to hit the right spot regarding term limits and lobbyists. Not sure if it would have the desired effect, but it might be beneficial to the governing process. Add some reversing of citizens united and you could have a decent hotfix to the system. Maybe another way to reduce corporate influence...

Maybe people can discuss these issues?

Trump says:
“Therefore, on the first day of my term of office, my administration will immediately pursue the following six measures to clean up the corruption and special interest collusion in Washington, DC:

FIRST, propose a Constitutional Amendment to impose term limits on all members of Congress;
SECOND, a hiring freeze on all federal employees to reduce federal workforce through attrition (exempting military, public safety, and public health);
THIRD, a requirement that for every new federal regulation, two existing regulations must be eliminated;
FOURTH, a 5 year-ban on White House and Congressional officials becoming lobbyists after they leave government service;
FIFTH, a lifetime ban on White House officials lobbying on behalf of a foreign government;
SIXTH, a complete ban on foreign lobbyists raising money for American elections
When you came along so righteous with a new national hate, so convincing is the ardor of war and of men, it's harder to breathe than to believe you're a friend. The wars at home, the wars abroad, all soaked in blood and lies and fraud.
Howie_Dewitt
Profile Joined March 2014
United States1416 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-10-22 21:02:08
October 22 2016 21:01 GMT
#114758
On October 23 2016 05:46 a_flayer wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 23 2016 04:33 Logo wrote:
Man this is the transcript of the speech that's being put forth by Trump and Reddit. http://vesselnews.io/gettysburg-address-first-100-days-trump-administration/

Is this not the same Gettysburg speech everyone is talking about where he says he will sue his harassees and all sorts of other things we've come to expect?

Have his speeches been getting this sort of summary all along?

Not that the summary makes it any better. His policies are terrifying.

Maybe people can discuss these issues?

Show nested quote +
Trump says:
“Therefore, on the first day of my term of office, my administration will immediately pursue the following six measures to clean up the corruption and special interest collusion in Washington, DC:

FIRST, propose a Constitutional Amendment to impose term limits on all members of Congress;
SECOND, a hiring freeze on all federal employees to reduce federal workforce through attrition (exempting military, public safety, and public health);
THIRD, a requirement that for every new federal regulation, two existing regulations must be eliminated;
FOURTH, a 5 year-ban on White House and Congressional officials becoming lobbyists after they leave government service;
FIFTH, a lifetime ban on White House officials lobbying on behalf of a foreign government;
SIXTH, a complete ban on foreign lobbyists raising money for American elections

The third one is so arbitrary and dumb, how did something like this get into a presidential speech?
The bolded ones are better, but still weird.
Sisyphus had a good gig going, the disappointment was predictable. | Visions of the Country (1978) is for when you're lost.
Gorsameth
Profile Joined April 2010
Netherlands21664 Posts
October 22 2016 21:03 GMT
#114759
On October 23 2016 05:46 a_flayer wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 23 2016 04:33 Logo wrote:
Man this is the transcript of the speech that's being put forth by Trump and Reddit. http://vesselnews.io/gettysburg-address-first-100-days-trump-administration/

Is this not the same Gettysburg speech everyone is talking about where he says he will sue his harassees and all sorts of other things we've come to expect?

Have his speeches been getting this sort of summary all along?

Not that the summary makes it any better. His policies are terrifying.


I'd say that's about true. Very often people zoom in on one specific part of the speech and repeat it endlessly.


Reading through the whole thing of his policies, there are only like 4 or 5 parts that really turn me off. I don't have a solid of a grasp to consider some of the others, but there's also a few that seem to hit the right spot regarding term limits and lobbyists. Not sure if it would have the desired effect, but it might be beneficial to the governing process. Add some reversing of citizens united and you could have a decent hotfix to the system. Maybe another way to reduce corporate influence...

Maybe people can discuss these issues?

Show nested quote +
Trump says:
“Therefore, on the first day of my term of office, my administration will immediately pursue the following six measures to clean up the corruption and special interest collusion in Washington, DC:

FIRST, propose a Constitutional Amendment to impose term limits on all members of Congress;
SECOND, a hiring freeze on all federal employees to reduce federal workforce through attrition (exempting military, public safety, and public health);
THIRD, a requirement that for every new federal regulation, two existing regulations must be eliminated;
FOURTH, a 5 year-ban on White House and Congressional officials becoming lobbyists after they leave government service;
FIFTH, a lifetime ban on White House officials lobbying on behalf of a foreign government;
SIXTH, a complete ban on foreign lobbyists raising money for American elections

1) has to be approved by congress. HAHA
2) Is stupid beyond means. step 1 is to change things so that less jobs are needed to do federal work. Step 1 is not to create a shortage because less people need to do the same work as before. Cart before the horse.
3) Here is new regulation X, it also includes regulation A and B rolled into it. The law is now less clear. gg. Taking an wrecking ball to the house because you dont like the color of the door. Better to just repaint the door.
4+5) I guess these are fine? Tho the irony is strong considering how big the Russian connection to Trump is.
6) Now the filthy foreigner gives the money to Jonny American who then donates to crooked politician. And all you have done is make things less transparent.

There solutions a 2 year old would think of. All they do is deal with the effect instead of looking at the cause.
It ignores such insignificant forces as time, entropy, and death
a_flayer
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Netherlands2826 Posts
October 22 2016 21:07 GMT
#114760
On October 23 2016 06:01 Howie_Dewitt wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 23 2016 05:46 a_flayer wrote:
On October 23 2016 04:33 Logo wrote:
Man this is the transcript of the speech that's being put forth by Trump and Reddit. http://vesselnews.io/gettysburg-address-first-100-days-trump-administration/

Is this not the same Gettysburg speech everyone is talking about where he says he will sue his harassees and all sorts of other things we've come to expect?

Have his speeches been getting this sort of summary all along?

Not that the summary makes it any better. His policies are terrifying.

Maybe people can discuss these issues?

Trump says:
“Therefore, on the first day of my term of office, my administration will immediately pursue the following six measures to clean up the corruption and special interest collusion in Washington, DC:

FIRST, propose a Constitutional Amendment to impose term limits on all members of Congress;
SECOND, a hiring freeze on all federal employees to reduce federal workforce through attrition (exempting military, public safety, and public health);
THIRD, a requirement that for every new federal regulation, two existing regulations must be eliminated;
FOURTH, a 5 year-ban on White House and Congressional officials becoming lobbyists after they leave government service;
FIFTH, a lifetime ban on White House officials lobbying on behalf of a foreign government;
SIXTH, a complete ban on foreign lobbyists raising money for American elections

The third one is so arbitrary and dumb, how did something like this get into a presidential speech?
The bolded ones are better, but still weird.


Well, I do agree with what it tries to do to some extent. It is frustrating that there are so many regulations, no matter what they might be worth in the end. If a rule like this forces the government somehow to find a way to simplify the situation, that could be beneficial. But obviously the way it is put here is a bit in the absurd.
When you came along so righteous with a new national hate, so convincing is the ardor of war and of men, it's harder to breathe than to believe you're a friend. The wars at home, the wars abroad, all soaked in blood and lies and fraud.
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