I must have formulated myself badly in the interviews I did not mean to call nestea bad. Or. An idiot watch next col iview. . .
He said he would smash me before the game so that's why I wanted to do something funny. Also sry @MLG I felt very pressured .
@eneKeyHunt @compLexityLive no pressure people twist what I say to what they want tho. I mean no disrespect to nestea
There's a lot of drama around all this naniwa/nestea thing. Looks like naniwa isn't as bad as many people claim he is though. I lost some of my respect for him first but maybe it was just miscommunication. Discuss.
On November 21 2011 01:32 Grend wrote: Just thought I`d repost this here to see if Adam wants to correct stuff that is wrong.
EDIT: Claryfying MLG Statement:
"After extensive investigation, review of the video files and 2011 Pro Circuit rules, we have determined that the replay had no impact on the tournament flow or the match results. Build orders are displayed at the end of a match on the stats screen. So the replay that was viewed would have revealed nothing the match stats page would not have revealed otherwise.
Additionally, to clarify, the Complexity manager was allowed in the booth, accompanied by MLG staff, after the match had started in order to keep the game in motion after a discrepancy with his player that would have impacted the continuation of the game. Moving forward, we will look at rules outlawing any replay views on a tournament PC"
Okay let us try to put this thing to an end. Here is some information I`ve gathered about the whole Nestea vs Naniwa situation. 1. Naniwa calling Nestea an idiot
Naniwa did call Nestea an idiot. But he did it referencing one particular episode. He was referencing the episode where Nestea decided to pull his drones for an attack, but was only feinting and withdrew his drones before reaching Naniwas base. So he did call him an idiot, but there is a strong case for him simply trying to communicate that he thought that particular tactical move was idiotic .
Naniwa apologized for this later: "I must have formulated myself badly in the interviews I did not mean to call nestea bad. Or. An idiot watch next col iview. . " https://twitter.com/#!/CoLNaniwa
2. The first attempt at playing game 3 This is what I`ve gathered: Naniwa needed to go to the toilet after game 2. He asked the admins to go. This is allowed in the rules but the decision is up to the admin. Apparently the admin said no, and the game was started.
But without the admin knowing the stream had in the meantime started showing an ad. So the start of the game was not shown. At some point the game was paused.
Then it was decided that the game would be restarted, and the players would get a chance to go to the toilet before starting the game over.
"Basically in game 3, the map was Shak. The game was begun before the stream was out of commercial which meant they had to stop and re-enter the game again."
Reddit witness account: "I caught in the chat one of the players saying that they needed to use the W.C. before the match started (I don't know which one it was), to which the admin responded "no, we have to start now". Then RedB said "ask your admin" to which the admin in the chat responded "we're going now" and they immediately cut to the ads on the player screens. At that point Artosis and Tasteless are still on the screen, but the match had started. Then Tasteless says something about "NaNiWa says he's going to pause the match.... we have to sort this out" - at which point I realized that it was NaNiWa that had to use the bathroom, and after about a minute of play (which was never put on the screen), paused the match. That's when they cut to the paused game in which there was OVER a minute of play time played. At this point, nobody really did anything, until the admins on stage realized that it was a horrible situation and they had to let him go to the bathroom (I get that they were late to start with... but it seems unreasonable to start a match when one of your players isn't ready because of time issues). That's when they cut away, NaNiWa left the booth (presumably to go to the bathroom). "
2. The replay incident After going to the toilet Naniwa is said to have loaded up the replay of the game that was aborted. (This is known because his screen apparently was shown on a large screen visible to the audience) This is not strictly against MLG rules and he could already see the build order on the game ending screen. An Admin went into his booth and told him to stop. At this point Naniwa had already seen Nestea`s build.
MLG statement "After extensive investigation, review of the video files and 2011 Pro Circuit rules, we have determined that the replay had no impact on the tournament flow or the match results. Build orders are displayed at the end of a match on the stats screen. So the replay that was viewed would have revealed nothing the match stats page would not have revealed otherwise.
Redditt witness: "NaNiWa got back before NesTea (I believe), but in any case, he quickly pulled up the replay from the match before anybody could stop him. As soon as the official on the stage realized, he went into the booth to tell him to stop, but it was too late, NaNiWa had already seen the starting position of NesTea."
3. The second attempt at playing game 3 After quite some time game 3 was remade and they started playing. Naniwa moved a probe across the map (thinking for some reason that the map was cross positions only) and when he got to where he assumed Nestea would be (but was not) he paused the game. Some background here: Earlier MLG events used to have this map be only cross positions. This has later been changed and now adheres to the Blizzard ladder versions rules to positions.
Then this happened: Naniwa reacted strongly and claimed that a admin had said to him that the map was cross positions only. According to Sundance this was not correct:
"He made a mistake then claimed it was the ref.Hhe picked before our admin even went into the booth. Some maps have crosses some do not. He chose one thinking that it was a cross position map when it wasn't. Not a big deal in the end but annoying none the less."
So here we have two different versions of what went down.
4. The "Coach" incident Apparently to calm the situation down and to make Naniwa ready to continue playing, MLG staff allowed the Player Manager (Not Coach) of Complexity gaming, Scott Ford to enter Naniwa`s booth. He was there to relay what MLG had decided. No regame and that it was his fault I can only assume. Then after a while the game was restarted.
MLG Statement about the incident: "Additionally, to clarify, the Complexity manager was allowed in the booth, accompanied by MLG staff, after the match had started in order to keep the game in motion after a discrepancy with his player that would have impacted the continuation of the game."
Reddit Eye witness: "I could see the lead admin guy ask and look at all of the other officials on the stage, to which people were shaking their heads, as if everyone was agreeing that nobody told him this. At that point, the official went back in the booth to break the bad news to NaNiWa. NaNiWa was PISSED, visually repeating "NO, NO, NO!". It was apparent that he felt cheated, which I believe that he actually was. If he was told cross spawns, and it wasn't, that could seriously mess up your entire game, and in my opinion, the game should have been replayed."
5. Naniwa being punished by MLG. MLG have two different rulesets that applies to these kind of situations. You have the event rules, and the conduct rules.
Naniwa did break the pause game rules. He paused the game without asking the referee. This gets you a WARNING. A WARNING is largely inconsequential. It only matters if you get more warnings and may lose you the game you are playing. They do not stay with the player throughout the event.
"Each subsequent Warning that a Player receives will result in a Forfeit of the Game"
Slasher at first said that Naniwa got a technical foul from his quotes. He later withdrew that statement. https://twitter.com/#!/SLASHER
At this point Naniwa has not gotten a technical foul but should at least by the rules have gotten a warning, that does not really matter for later matches. He may get a technical foul for calling MLG a joke tournament and for the thumbs down ceremony. It is worth noting that many other ceremonies and statements of similiar character has gone unpunished at earlier MLG events and in this one.
#2 The first attempt at playing game 3
The game was mistakenly started by the casters while the admin was still in the booth talking to players. Nestea was taken off guard, had to rush back to get his keyboard (etc) ready. It was a false start one could say and the commissioner decided to restart so both players had a fair and even start.
3. The second attempt at playing game 3
Naniwa misunderstood the admin (complete miscommunication that I personally attribute to the language barrier). The game was paused as Naniwa refused to play.
4. The "Coach" incident
I personally went to the crowd and got Scott and escorted him to the booth. Why? Naniwa was about to be DQ'd for refusing to play due to the miscommunication. I stood there as Scott told him he had to play.
5.
Naniwa did receive a technical for various infractions.
Explanation about why he isn't cheating and about what happened:
So I was sitting in the front row of the main stage while this whole thing went down. Let me try to give some context. BEFORE the ordeal with the map happened, another ordeal happened. I caught in the chat one of the players saying that they needed to use the W.C. before the match started (I don't know which one it was), to which the admin responded "no, we have to start now". Then RedB said "ask your admin" to which the admin in the chat responded "we're going now" and they immediately cut to the ads on the player screens. At that point Artosis and Tasteless are still on the screen, but the match had started. Then Tasteless says something about "NaNiWa says he's going to pause the match.... we have to sort this out" - at which point I realized that it was NaNiWa that had to use the bathroom, and after about a minute of play (which was never put on the screen), paused the match. That's when they cut to the paused game in which there was OVER a minute of play time played. At this point, nobody really did anything, until the admins on stage realized that it was a horrible situation and they had to let him go to the bathroom (I get that they were late to start with... but it seems unreasonable to start a match when one of your players isn't ready because of time issues). That's when they cut away, NaNiWa left the booth (presumably to go to the bathroom). NesTea looks pretty pissed at this point (as pissed as you can imagine NesTea looking). The coach comes over to the booth and tells him he can go to the bathroom, and he's like but dude I'm already settled (I could tell because of his body language), and then finally agrees to go anyway. They both get back and they decide to restart the match. EXCEPT. NaNiWa got back before NesTea (I believe), but in any case, he quickly pulled up the replay from the match before anybody could stop him. As soon as the official on the stage realized, he went into the booth to tell him to stop, but it was too late, NaNiWa had already seen the starting position of NesTea. This went largely unnoticed. So they restart the match, and as soon as NaNiWa's scouting probe gets to the cross base and sees nothing there, he paused the game and said "?" "wrong map?". At this point one of the admins approaches the booth, but then he posts "admin told me cross only\", which was, in my opinion, very smart on his part, so that the audience knew what was going on and they couldn't just shut him up. At this point he talks to the admin, and the admin immediately looks defeated. The admin then walks over and talks to a couple of other people. This is when Sundance arrived, and joined the conversation. The admins then talked to all of the other officials on the stage, presumably asking if anyone had told NaNiWa that the map should be cross positions. This is where the story diverges. I think that one of two things happened. (1) Somebody actually told him this but nobody would cop up to it. In NaNiWa's mind, seeing the spawn in the replay reaffirmed the "fact" that the official had told him earlier. (2) Nobody actually told him this, but since he saw the replay, he assumed it would be cross position again and was pissed when he realized his cheese wouldn't be as effective. I could see the lead admin guy ask and look at all of the other officials on the stage, to which people were shaking their heads, as if everyone was agreeing that nobody told him this. At that point, the official went back in the booth to break the bad news to NaNiWa. NaNiWa was PISSED, visually repeating "NO, NO, NO!". It was apparent that he felt cheated, which I believe that he actually was. If he was told cross spawns, and it wasn't, that could seriously mess up your entire game, and in my opinion, the game should have been replayed. After the official left, he typed the rest of the text, "joke tournament" and "give me a minute to rethink". Here is why I think that option (1) is more likely. The officials allowed NaNiWa's coach INTO THE PLAYER BOOTH with 1:47 on the clock and the game paused. The coach talked to NaNiWa for a minute or two before he left and shut the door. Then a few minutes later, gameplay resumed. Why would the officials let the coach in to re-strategize IN THE MIDDLE OF A MATCH if they didn't believe they were at fault? This entire time, NesTea is sitting in his booth, looking defeated. At this point, it's over half an hour since the first attempt at this game had started, and he must not be in his proper mindset. I feel really bad for both players, and for MLG. I feel bad for NesTea because he was put through this horrible ordeal, and the disruption in the normal flow likely contributed to the loss. I feel bad for NaNiWa, because I feel that he was told one thing about the spawns, and that he knew that MLG knew that they were wrong, and played anyway (regardless of the outcome.) And I feel bad for MLG because they were put into a tight spot... But they honestly could have avoided this two-fold. (1) Let him go to the bathroom when he requested before the countdown timer, and (2) if they felt that they were at fault (which I think is undeniable by the allowing the coach into the booth during the game), then they should have replayed the match. Just my $.02
Seriously, people need to chill out, of most things that players say (especially when in a pressure situation) I would say 90% of it is said either reactivly (not thought out in any way) or just trying to have fun with the crowd (think of MC.) Just my 2 cents.
I don't see what the big deal was...Nani was just trying to make a rivalry, and he beat nestea fair and square. He is just teasing, Nani probably has extremely high regard for NesTea. But press is press, and what makes good stream watching is better for them.
Naniwa did not break any rules besides pausing without asking. That horrible thread on reddit is an extremly biased opinion from one dude. If MLG isn't taking action I don't see why you should.
So I was sitting in the front row of the main stage while this whole thing went down. Let me try to give some context.
BEFORE the ordeal with the map happened, another ordeal happened. I caught in the chat one of the players saying that they needed to use the W.C. before the match started (I don't know which one it was), to which the admin responded "no, we have to start now". Then RedB said "ask your admin" to which the admin in the chat responded "we're going now" and they immediately cut to the ads on the player screens.
At that point Artosis and Tasteless are still on the screen, but the match had started. Then Tasteless says something about "NaNiWa says he's going to pause the match.... we have to sort this out" - at which point I realized that it was NaNiWa that had to use the bathroom, and after about a minute of play (which was never put on the screen), paused the match. That's when they cut to the paused game in which there was OVER a minute of play time played. At this point, nobody really did anything, until the admins on stage realized that it was a horrible situation and they had to let him go to the bathroom (I get that they were late to start with... but it seems unreasonable to start a match when one of your players isn't ready because of time issues). That's when they cut away, NaNiWa left the booth (presumably to go to the bathroom). NesTea looks pretty pissed at this point (as pissed as you can imagine NesTea looking). The coach comes over to the booth and tells him he can go to the bathroom, and he's like but dude I'm already settled (I could tell because of his body language), and then finally agrees to go anyway.
They both get back and they decide to restart the match.
EXCEPT.
NaNiWa got back before NesTea (I believe), but in any case, he quickly pulled up the replay from the match before anybody could stop him. As soon as the official on the stage realized, he went into the booth to tell him to stop, but it was too late, NaNiWa had already seen the starting position of NesTea. This went largely unnoticed.
So they restart the match, and as soon as NaNiWa's scouting probe gets to the cross base and sees nothing there, he paused the game and said "?" "wrong map?". At this point one of the admins approaches the booth, but then he posts "admin told me cross only\", which was, in my opinion, very smart on his part, so that the audience knew what was going on and they couldn't just shut him up.
At this point he talks to the admin, and the admin immediately looks defeated. The admin then walks over and talks to a couple of other people. This is when Sundance arrived, and joined the conversation. The admins then talked to all of the other officials on the stage, presumably asking if anyone had told NaNiWa that the map should be cross positions.
This is where the story diverges. I think that one of two things happened.
(1) Somebody actually told him this but nobody would cop up to it. In NaNiWa's mind, seeing the spawn in the replay reaffirmed the "fact" that the official had told him earlier. (2) Nobody actually told him this, but since he saw the replay, he assumed it would be cross position again and was pissed when he realized his cheese wouldn't be as effective.
I could see the lead admin guy ask and look at all of the other officials on the stage, to which people were shaking their heads, as if everyone was agreeing that nobody told him this. At that point, the official went back in the booth to break the bad news to NaNiWa. NaNiWa was PISSED, visually repeating "NO, NO, NO!". It was apparent that he felt cheated, which I believe that he actually was. If he was told cross spawns, and it wasn't, that could seriously mess up your entire game, and in my opinion, the game should have been replayed.
After the official left, he typed the rest of the text, "joke tournament" and "give me a minute to rethink".
Here is why I think that option (1) is more likely.
The officials allowed NaNiWa's coach INTO THE PLAYER BOOTH with 1:47 on the clock and the game paused. The coach talked to NaNiWa for a minute or two before he left and shut the door. Then a few minutes later, gameplay resumed. Why would the officials let the coach in to re-strategize IN THE MIDDLE OF A MATCH if they didn't believe they were at fault?
This entire time, NesTea is sitting in his booth, looking defeated. At this point, it's over half an hour since the first attempt at this game had started, and he must not be in his proper mindset.
I feel really bad for both players, and for MLG. I feel bad for NesTea because he was put through this horrible ordeal, and the disruption in the normal flow likely contributed to the loss. I feel bad for NaNiWa, because I feel that he was told one thing about the spawns, and that he knew that MLG knew that they were wrong, and played anyway (regardless of the outcome.) And I feel bad for MLG because they were put into a tight spot... But they honestly could have avoided this two-fold. (1) Let him go to the bathroom when he requested before the countdown timer, and (2) if they felt that they were at fault (which I think is undeniable by the allowing the coach into the booth during the game), then they should have replayed the match.
Edit:Thanks! Edit2:guess I was wrong but I did lose some faith here, I mean, going to the bathroom in the middle of the match? really? Think of such things before entering, schools have strict policies about stuff like this, why not MLG?
Dunno if I've seen all the interviews, but what he said kind of made sense. Nestea is being treated as the best zerg in the world, and Naniwa disagrees and thinks there are better Korean zergs. Did he actually call Nestea bad? Didn't he just say Nestea ain't that good?
On November 20 2011 23:43 Ballack wrote: Dunno if I've seen all the interviews, but what he said kind of made sense. Nestea is being treated as the best zerg in the world, and Naniwa disagrees and thinks there are better Korean zergs. Did he actually call Nestea bad? Didn't he just say Nestea ain't that good?
He said there are better ZvPers out there and that it was idiotic of him to pull drones in game 3 of their series in the Global invitational. That's IT.
On November 20 2011 23:43 Ballack wrote: Dunno if I've seen all the interviews, but what he said kind of made sense. Nestea is being treated as the best zerg in the world, and Naniwa disagrees and thinks there are better Korean zergs. Did he actually call Nestea bad? Didn't he just say Nestea ain't that good?
He said that there are better ZvPers than NesTea, and no he didn't call him bad just that there are better _ZvPers_......
@eneKeyHunt @compLexityLive no pressure people twist what I say to what they want tho. I mean no disrespect to nestea
There's a lot of drama around all this naniwa/nestea thing. Looks like naniwa isn't as bad as many people claim he is though. I lost some of my respect for him first but maybe it was just miscommunication. Discuss.
I don't believe this for one second. If he truly thought it was a miscommunication why didn't he clarify before the match to Nestea, who was already insulted? Why did he stack it with a BM thumbs down? Again, doesn't fly.
All of these claims about Naniwa viewing a replay are simply allegations by an unidentified Anonymous third party, complete rumors. Until someone has actual evidence of him doing it, it's bullshit. Naniwa deserved all the wins he got.
I don't understand what he did wrong. Are people mad because he looked at the spawn location from the previous game (which wasn't the same as game 2 anyways), or what is it exactly?
I must have formulated myself badly in the interviews I did not mean to call nestea bad. Or. An idiot watch next col iview. . .
He said he would smash me before the game so that's why I wanted to do something funny. Also sry @MLG I felt very pressured .
@eneKeyHunt @compLexityLive no pressure people twist what I say to what they want tho. I mean no disrespect to nestea
There's a lot of drama around all this naniwa/nestea thing. Looks like naniwa isn't as bad as many people claim he is though. I lost some of my respect for him first but maybe it was just miscommunication. Discuss.
I don't believe this for one second. If he truly thought it was a miscommunication why didn't he clarify before the match to Nestea, who was already insulted? Why did he stack it with a BM thumbs down? Again, doesn't fly.
He does explain why he thumbs down NesTea in his tweets.
I must have formulated myself badly in the interviews I did not mean to call nestea bad. Or. An idiot watch next col iview. . .
He said he would smash me before the game so that's why I wanted to do something funny. Also sry @MLG I felt very pressured .
@eneKeyHunt @compLexityLive no pressure people twist what I say to what they want tho. I mean no disrespect to nestea
There's a lot of drama around all this naniwa/nestea thing. Looks like naniwa isn't as bad as many people claim he is though. I lost some of my respect for him first but maybe it was just miscommunication. Discuss.
I don't believe this for one second. If he truly thought it was a miscommunication why didn't he clarify before the match to Nestea, who was already insulted? Why did he stack it with a BM thumbs down? Again, doesn't fly.
He does explain why he thumbs down NesTea in his tweets.
Why didn't he clarify before the match? I find it very convenient he's attempting to explain himself AFTER the clan got involved. I think he's just backtracking/damage control.
This claim of cheating is retarded. The OP doesn't realize that build orders can be seen on the score screen anyway so there would be no particular advantage to watching the replay.
i actually have no problem if Naniwa did say those words to be honest. I mean everyone consider NesTea and MVP to be gods of sc2 but Naniwa smashes them both times, totally deserved to say it now then
On November 20 2011 23:49 Childplay wrote: well, i dont get the big deal of knowing the spawning positions, you dont get to see what your opponent is doing that early anyways
If you send your scouting probe out at a specific time you will see lings coming your way if you spawn cross on Shakuras. This can give you significant information before you even reach the opponents base. If you don't know whether it's cross-spawns, you can miss the lings. The admins told Naniwa that the map was cross-only, so he adapted his play and scouting to it.
On November 20 2011 23:40 Kira__ wrote: no response to the cheat accusations?
Obiously cheating, but also MLGs fault for letting the situation happen. And it might not be the deciding factor.
It's not obviously cheating.. He went to the bathroom after being refused to go before the games started, viewing the replay gave him nothing that he didn't know from the score screen (and isn't against the rules), an MLG admin told him it was cross only therefore the pause and the confusion. I see nothing wrong. The "BM" thumbs down is seriously not anything you can even discuss.. Players do this all the time and it's fun and laughs, why is it different now?
Even if Naniwa called Nestea bad, who really cares? Naniwa has proved he can put his money where his mouth is, and people should stop bitching. Nestea is the best zerg in the world, or meant to be, Nani beat him and called him bad, who cares? If you're "offended" you need to get out into the real world more, where it's not pink bunnies 24/7
Starting position is obviously not the only thing NaNiWa is seeing in that replay. He's watching NesTeas starting build order, completely unbeknown to NesTea! Considering he doesn't have any issues pulling up the replay, who even knows what he's doing while he's "going to the bathroom?" He could easily be talking to someone who's already been watching NesTea play for the first minute+ of the game.
The fact that he pulled up the replay is horrid, I mean, why would he do this ? he saw the entire buildorder and didn't let Nestea know and has/could have gotten away with it.
I know you can look at the score screen but maybe he clicked it away or something, this isn't something you usually plan upfront.
On November 20 2011 23:56 Valashu wrote: This is the part that makes me wonder:
Starting position is obviously not the only thing NaNiWa is seeing in that replay. He's watching NesTeas starting build order, completely unbeknown to NesTea! Considering he doesn't have any issues pulling up the replay, who even knows what he's doing while he's "going to the bathroom?" He could easily be talking to someone who's already been watching NesTea play for the first minute+ of the game.
The fact that he pulled up the replay is horrid, I mean, why would he do this ? he saw the entire buildorder and didn't let Nestea know and has/could have gotten away with it.
The build order and the first minute is viewable without opening any replay, Nestea saw Nani's too.. Battle.net feature. Maybe he wanted to calm down a bit who knows, he did nothing wrong either way.
On November 20 2011 23:56 Valashu wrote: This is the part that makes me wonder:
Starting position is obviously not the only thing NaNiWa is seeing in that replay. He's watching NesTeas starting build order, completely unbeknown to NesTea! Considering he doesn't have any issues pulling up the replay, who even knows what he's doing while he's "going to the bathroom?" He could easily be talking to someone who's already been watching NesTea play for the first minute+ of the game.
The fact that he pulled up the replay is horrid, I mean, why would he do this ? he saw the entire buildorder and didn't let Nestea know and has/could have gotten away with it.
You can watch the build order without watching the replay in the score screen
All this drama is really going on my nerves-_-
If there is really a problem it's not to us to decide if it should be punished or not, it's to MLG staff
I must have formulated myself badly in the interviews I did not mean to call nestea bad. Or. An idiot watch next col iview. . .
He said he would smash me before the game so that's why I wanted to do something funny. Also sry @MLG I felt very pressured .
@eneKeyHunt @compLexityLive no pressure people twist what I say to what they want tho. I mean no disrespect to nestea
There's a lot of drama around all this naniwa/nestea thing. Looks like naniwa isn't as bad as many people claim he is though. I lost some of my respect for him first but maybe it was just miscommunication. Discuss.
I don't believe this for one second. If he truly thought it was a miscommunication why didn't he clarify before the match to Nestea, who was already insulted? Why did he stack it with a BM thumbs down? Again, doesn't fly.
Is it so terrible to say that he thinks other koreans are better ? Have you even watched the interview ? Watch Firebat heros cermony vs savior back in the days and youll see what it was like then. If thumbs down is too offensive Im not sure where were heading lol..
On November 20 2011 23:56 Valashu wrote: This is the part that makes me wonder:
Starting position is obviously not the only thing NaNiWa is seeing in that replay. He's watching NesTeas starting build order, completely unbeknown to NesTea! Considering he doesn't have any issues pulling up the replay, who even knows what he's doing while he's "going to the bathroom?" He could easily be talking to someone who's already been watching NesTea play for the first minute+ of the game.
The fact that he pulled up the replay is horrid, I mean, why would he do this ? he saw the entire buildorder and didn't let Nestea know and has/could have gotten away with it.
I know you can look at the score screen but maybe he clicked it away or something, this isn't something you usually plan upfront.
You realise this can be seen from the score screen as well ? Or are you just out to flame Naniwa like the rest of them ?
To OP: can you PLEASE put the correct information in the OP. Post the link of the second post I made in this thread + the fact that the buildorder can be seen from the score screen. That would solve so many problems and slow the momentum of all the trolls running around.
Wow...Now thats some serious meta gaming going on there Who knows what actually happened. But if according to that thread, he got to watch the replay, and see Nestea going hatch first, so he knew he could cannon, and giving him an edge early game, thats HUGEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
Quote from the Reddit thread "Edit 2: NaNiWa had nothing built before they paused again at 1:49. NesTea still didn't have a pool at this point either (he went hatch first.) Immediately after the break NaNiWa proceeds to cannon rush, and takes an early game advantage. Can someone else who was there confirm what happened during the delay?"
Joking of course, some of you guys love drama and overreacting too much. Naniwa didn't cheat by looking at a replay, doesn't matter if its a disqualified game or not, weather it gave him an edge or not, doesn't matter. Nani would have cannon rushed based on the scouting info anyway. If anything the "drama" hurt him because his cannon was way later.
He beat Nestea in a fair standard length game. Give credit where credit is due. MVP and Nestea TWICE? Thats really impressive.
And about the thumbs down thing... How can you call that BM? He was clearly doing it because Nestea was cocky before the game. He deserved it I would have done the same. It had zero malice, and the worst thing is you guys think its ok for IdrA to FLIP OFF other players? What the fuck sort out your double standards.
Nani fighting, take the whole thing home (Gonna get smashed by HuK )
So let's see if I have missed anything.. 1, Nestea wins over Nani in Blizzcon 2, Naniwa wins in Global invitational over Nestea 3, Nestea Says he's gonna beat Naniwa the MLG-game 4, Naniwa says that MVP was harder to beat then Nestea and that Nesteas ZvP isnt as good as others 5, Naniwa wins game 1, loses game 2 6, Game 3 has trouble, Naniwa thinks that they play on an other Shakaurast then they do, wants a break to go to the bathroom, comes back and they keep playing it 7, Internet explodes and accuses Naniwa of cheating?
Oh dear. Well, apparently (according to Reddit), Sundance is looking into it.
I really don't think it was a big deal and people have generally not liked Naniwa in the past so when he does something like this people just find a way to bash on him and such. Hmm if its true that Naniwa's coach went into the booth to talk to him then yeah I would consider that cheating, but watching the replay and such is not cheating. It's at their disposal so if one player uses it and the other doesn't then its that players fault.
Oh dear. Well, apparently (according to Reddit), Sundance is looking into it.
I really don't think it was a big deal and people have generally not liked Naniwa in the past so when he does something like this people just find a way to bash on him and such. Hmm if its true that Naniwa's coach went into the booth to talk to him then yeah I would consider that cheating, but watching the replay and such is not cheating. It's at their disposal so if one player uses it and the other doesn't then its that players fault.
The coach was in there to inform him what Sundance had decided to do lol, Sundance himself joined the coach in the booth like a minute later.
6, Game 3 has trouble, Naniwa thinks that they play on an other Shakaurast then they do, wants a break to go to the bathroom, comes back and they keep playing it 7, Internet explodes and accuses Naniwa of cheating?
I am pretty sure that I have missed something..
6.5 Nani looks at the replay of the game he left to use the bathroom. People think that its cheating because he can see Nestea's opening.
Also I think that the casters hyped the rivalry/Nani being BM... too much, i dont know if they actually saw the interview or not, cause they didnt seem to have much information about what Naniwa said.
@eneKeyHunt @compLexityLive no pressure people twist what I say to what they want tho. I mean no disrespect to nestea
There's a lot of drama around all this naniwa/nestea thing. Looks like naniwa isn't as bad as many people claim he is though. I lost some of my respect for him first but maybe it was just miscommunication. Discuss.
i dont like how the internet has made apologizing so easy.. takes 30 seconds for him to absolve himself from some pretty childish behaviour, and judging by the time it took for it to get up on twitter i wouldnt be suprised if complexity more or less made him do it. if hes sorry that he has been misunderstood and meant no disrespect to nestea id rather read about a tweet that he told nestea so.
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
Dear god, more drama. What naniwa did could indeed be qualified as cheating. Once a game starts, you should not be allowed to exit your booth AND people shouldnt be allowed to enter the booth. It was partly MLG's fault for not letting naniwa go to the bathroom before the game, but who knows what naniwa truly did when he was "going to the bathroom"? He could have been talking to his team mates or whatever, asking them what NesTeas build order is. If that wasn't enough to convince you hes cheating (leaving the booth in the middle of a game) then maybe when his coach entered. His coach entered, again, in the middle of the game. He could have said anything to Naniwa, like if NesTea was going hatch first or what the spawns were or whatever. Yeah I dont know, naniwa is kind of a sketchy character and, IMO, a bit dickish.
Oh dear. Well, apparently (according to Reddit), Sundance is looking into it.
I really don't think it was a big deal and people have generally not liked Naniwa in the past so when he does something like this people just find a way to bash on him and such. Hmm if its true that Naniwa's coach went into the booth to talk to him then yeah I would consider that cheating, but watching the replay and such is not cheating. It's at their disposal so if one player uses it and the other doesn't then its that players fault.
The coach was in there to inform him what Sundance had decided to do lol, Sundance himself joined the coach in the booth like a minute later.
Oh well then thats fine. No one should be making a deal about it then.
6, Game 3 has trouble, Naniwa thinks that they play on an other Shakaurast then they do, wants a break to go to the bathroom, comes back and they keep playing it 7, Internet explodes and accuses Naniwa of cheating?
I am pretty sure that I have missed something..
6.5 Nani looks at the replay of the game he left to use the bathroom. People think that its cheating because he can see Nestea's opening.
This is alleged by some random kid on reddit, there is no evidence of this, and the people at MLG are investigating it.
Presumably: 2. No verbal abuse of Referees and other tournament officials. Verbal abuse of a Referee or other tournament official includes, but is not limited to, the use of vulgar language directed at a Referee or other tournament official, the use of insulting words or gestures directed at a Referee or other tournament official, and excessive argument with a Referee or other tournament official resulting in the delay of a Match.
Basically, the ONLY questionable point here is whether or not an admin really did tell Naniwa that the map was cross positions only, or if he just assumed it based on his replay. Presumably, Naniwa and/or Sundance will clarify that soon.
Obviously, though, this whole set of games did not at all go smoothly. Unfortunate for everyone involved, honestly,
Oh please, If you think Naniwa apologised on his own accord, you are seriously wrong. This is just blatant PR by Team Complexity to try and make everyone forget about it. The fact is, it did happen, MLG are looking into it, and I have faith in them to make the right decision. It's getting to the point where the players feel like they can do what they want because of the lack of repercussions.
Really petty controversy. Amazing games by Nani, keep rocking hard. Win over MVP, Nestea, and Nestea? Are you kidding me? TL, you should be going apeshit.
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
2. That wasn't during a match. The rule means when the game is in progress, like if someone in the audience was putting game information on a sign etc.
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
6, Game 3 has trouble, Naniwa thinks that they play on an other Shakaurast then they do, wants a break to go to the bathroom, comes back and they keep playing it 7, Internet explodes and accuses Naniwa of cheating?
I am pretty sure that I have missed something..
6.5 Nani looks at the replay of the game he left to use the bathroom. People think that its cheating because he can see Nestea's opening.
6.25 Nani sees the NesTea's opening from the score screen...
6, Game 3 has trouble, Naniwa thinks that they play on an other Shakaurast then they do, wants a break to go to the bathroom, comes back and they keep playing it 7, Internet explodes and accuses Naniwa of cheating?
I am pretty sure that I have missed something..
6.5 Nani looks at the replay of the game he left to use the bathroom. People think that its cheating because he can see Nestea's opening.
This is alleged by some random kid on reddit, there is no evidence of this, and the people at MLG are investigating it.
I know i don't think he was cheating i was just telling him what all the drama was about
It's a lot more then just one incident that caused the huge uproar on the behavior of Naniwa. His personality is what people are attacking, if it was MC or huk doing the thumbs down, it would be entertainment because we KNOW that MC and Huk are actually really good mannered. Naniwa on the other hand was hated on ladder for his BM in the early days. He also seems like a person that would prefer sticking to himself, so these types of people aren't very well liked. The thumbs down and idiot comments were blown out of proportion, but this might give him time or awareness to fix up his attitude towards others.
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
2. Match was paused.
5. Thumbs down is excessive taunting or celebration? LOL Have you seen any of MC's celebrations?
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
So then MCs celebration with the costume should be considered taunting because if I just lost to someone and they went on stage and did that celebration I would be pissed. The guy was happy, get over it. I would be happy too if Nestea said he would beat me then I proved him wrong.
6, Game 3 has trouble, Naniwa thinks that they play on an other Shakaurast then they do, wants a break to go to the bathroom, comes back and they keep playing it 7, Internet explodes and accuses Naniwa of cheating?
I am pretty sure that I have missed something..
6.5 Nani looks at the replay of the game he left to use the bathroom. People think that its cheating because he can see Nestea's opening.
This is alleged by some random kid on reddit, there is no evidence of this, and the people at MLG are investigating it.
I know i don't think he was cheating i was just telling him what all the drama was about
That's a huge story for a "random kid" to just make up out of the blue. There is obvious truth to it.
Oh dear. Well, apparently (according to Reddit), Sundance is looking into it.
I really don't think it was a big deal and people have generally not liked Naniwa in the past so when he does something like this people just find a way to bash on him and such. Hmm if its true that Naniwa's coach went into the booth to talk to him then yeah I would consider that cheating, but watching the replay and such is not cheating. It's at their disposal so if one player uses it and the other doesn't then its that players fault.
From what I leanred, it wasn't the coach (col doesn't even have a coach from what I know) but the manager or something like that who was sent by MLG for some reasons (Nani didn't ask for him apparently) and there was a referee with them.
But nothing of this come from 100% reliable source, but it looks right.
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
On November 21 2011 00:05 Apolex wrote: It's a lot more then just one incident that caused the huge uproar on the behavior of Naniwa. His personality is what people are attacking, if it was MC or huk doing the thumbs down, it would be entertainment because we KNOW that MC and Huk are actually really good mannered. Naniwa on the other hand was hated on ladder for his BM in the early days. He also seems like a person that would prefer sticking to himself, so these types of people aren't very well liked. The thumbs down and idiot comments were blown out of proportion, but this might give him time or awareness to fix up his attitude towards others.
Next time Idra leaves a game and watches the replay afterwards I'll scream cheater from the top of my lungs because he has a crappy personality. You are being silly.
Presumably: 2. No verbal abuse of Referees and other tournament officials. Verbal abuse of a Referee or other tournament official includes, but is not limited to, the use of vulgar language directed at a Referee or other tournament official, the use of insulting words or gestures directed at a Referee or other tournament official, and excessive argument with a Referee or other tournament official resulting in the delay of a Match.
Basically, the ONLY questionable point here is whether or not an admin really did tell Naniwa that the map was cross positions only, or if he just assumed it based on his replay. Presumably, Naniwa and/or Sundance will clarify that soon.
Obviously, though, this whole set of games did not at all go smoothly. Unfortunate for everyone involved, honestly,
I think Nani got confused, Shakuras has always been no close spawns but cross spawns can mean either actual cross map (a la Antiga) or just no close spawns. When he paused the game I instantly knew that's probably why. Some MLG official probably stated cross spawns, but every Sc2 player, let alone progamer knows that's the case on Shakuras so Nani thought MLG had modified the map like it did to Antiga.
You understand guys that all of this situation is a misunderstanding (a quiproquo in my language) between all parts (mlg's admins, naniwa, nestea and crowd) ?
People made naniwa's interview look as a big bm while it's only awkwardness and out of context. And then it keeps taking more and more importance for something wortheless. For exemple a tiny thumbdown is considered here as the biggest bm while it's only a usual ceremony.
Little issues are exaggerated because people love drama :-/
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
Yes, in an col interview, later apologized as you can see in his tweets
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
i loled
no.2 is viable but MLG themselves did not prevent this from happening.
no.5, wow i have no idea how many more bad ass celebration than the thumbs up were in sc2 scene previously.
IF FBH plays sc2 this game, he would have been ban constantly.
even if Naniwa did cheated on game 3, i don't suppose he also cheated against MVP and NesTea at global invitational eh?
On November 21 2011 00:05 Apolex wrote: It's a lot more then just one incident that caused the huge uproar on the behavior of Naniwa. His personality is what people are attacking, if it was MC or huk doing the thumbs down, it would be entertainment because we KNOW that MC and Huk are actually really good mannered. Naniwa on the other hand was hated on ladder for his BM in the early days. He also seems like a person that would prefer sticking to himself, so these types of people aren't very well liked. The thumbs down and idiot comments were blown out of proportion, but this might give him time or awareness to fix up his attitude towards others.
Next time Idra leaves a game and watches the replay afterwards I'll scream cheater from the top of my lungs because he has a crappy personality. You are being silly.
Yes. I think a big part of the drama is that Nani doesn't have as big of a fanbase as other "BM-ers"- IdrA and some of MC's ceremonies (although with MC it's definitely more light-hearted). If a more popular player did it the crowd would go nuts and everyone would love it, but since Nani is respected more for his play and not for his personality people are calling him an asshole, which is ridiculous. It's a thumbs down, if he did that to me I wouldn't even be offended.
edit- also, he beat "zerg god" Nestea, which gets all the nestea fans pissed too. If Nani hadn't done anything there would be a buttload of balance whine instead of Nani hate.
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
He did not, people who say that haven't actually watched the interview! He called Nestea's decision to pull drones in game 3 a really bad move ("idiot move") and said there are better ZvPers out there. That's IT!
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
Yes, in an col interview, later apologized as you can see in his tweets
6, Game 3 has trouble, Naniwa thinks that they play on an other Shakaurast then they do, wants a break to go to the bathroom, comes back and they keep playing it 7, Internet explodes and accuses Naniwa of cheating?
I am pretty sure that I have missed something..
6.5 Nani looks at the replay of the game he left to use the bathroom. People think that its cheating because he can see Nestea's opening.
This is alleged by some random kid on reddit, there is no evidence of this, and the people at MLG are investigating it.
I know i don't think he was cheating i was just telling him what all the drama was about
That's a huge story for a "random kid" to just make up out of the blue. There is obvious truth to it.
Doesn't really matter weather he watched the rep or not though. At the end of the day he beat Nestea by being better.
Plus Nani has talked about his attitude and BM back in the day and what was going on in his life. He admits it was bad and he seems to have really improved based on interviews and his behaviour at tournaments. He has one of the most competitive attitudes of the whole scene, and he also gets extremely stressed under pressure (See TSL final) and he tends to speak out of turn when he's stressed. I understand this, and thus when he says stuff in the kind of situation he's in I understand what he's going through and don't judge too harsh.
Lets not try crucify someone when they've just achieved something great, you're looking worse than he does...
Seriously? You do a forge expand on shakuras, every time period. When you get there and see hatch first nothing has influenced your decision, its just the logical thing to do, Id always cannon rush someone going hatch first. And its not like he build the forge just for that, the forge was part of his gameplan anyways.
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
No, he said in an interview that pulling the drones in the last game of mlg global invitational was stupid, and that some people had a better zvp than nestea.
Some people took it out of context and summed it "Nestea is stupid and he is bad"
On November 20 2011 23:37 Riyomori wrote: nice move by naniwa. people blowing this way out of proportions. nestea's decision makings were dodgy in the games and he deserved to lose
That's what they do best. Take shit out of context.
6, Game 3 has trouble, Naniwa thinks that they play on an other Shakaurast then they do, wants a break to go to the bathroom, comes back and they keep playing it 7, Internet explodes and accuses Naniwa of cheating?
I am pretty sure that I have missed something..
6.5 Nani looks at the replay of the game he left to use the bathroom. People think that its cheating because he can see Nestea's opening.
This is alleged by some random kid on reddit, there is no evidence of this, and the people at MLG are investigating it.
I know i don't think he was cheating i was just telling him what all the drama was about
That's a huge story for a "random kid" to just make up out of the blue. There is obvious truth to it.
On November 21 2011 00:08 Gevna wrote: You understand guys that all of this situation is a misunderstanding (a quiproquo in my language) between all parts (mlg's admins, naniwa, nestea and crowd) ?
People made naniwa's interview look as a big bm while it's only awkwardness and out of context. And then it keeps taking more and more importance for something wortheless. For exemple a tiny thumbdown is considered here as the biggest bm while it's only a usual ceremony.
Little issues are exaggerated because people love drama :-/
i have no problem with any of that.
calling MLG a joke tournament in all chat, while playing live on the big screen streamed to tens of thousands of people. no matter your emotions or how you're feeling, saying something like that is completely out of line. i personally think that's the worst thing by far anyone has done in sc2. if i was sundance, i would be raging and would've instantly disqualified naniwa, but i guess that's why sundance is the ceo of mlg.
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
He did not, people who say that haven't actually watched the interview! He called Nestea's decision to pull drones in game 3 a really bad move ("idiot move") and said there are better ZvPers out there. That's IT!
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
Yes, in an col interview, later apologized as you can see in his tweets
ASDLÖKMASDLKMASDLKMASDKLMNASD He did not!
But oh yes, he did, and he even apologized for it himself, so I don't know why you're trying to deny it
6, Game 3 has trouble, Naniwa thinks that they play on an other Shakaurast then they do, wants a break to go to the bathroom, comes back and they keep playing it 7, Internet explodes and accuses Naniwa of cheating?
I am pretty sure that I have missed something..
6.5 Nani looks at the replay of the game he left to use the bathroom. People think that its cheating because he can see Nestea's opening.
This is alleged by some random kid on reddit, there is no evidence of this, and the people at MLG are investigating it.
I know i don't think he was cheating i was just telling him what all the drama was about
That's a huge story for a "random kid" to just make up out of the blue. There is obvious truth to it.
Doesn't really matter weather he watched the rep or not though. At the end of the day he beat Nestea by being better.
Plus Nani has talked about his attitude and BM back in the day and what was going on in his life. He admits it was bad and he seems to have really improved based on interviews and his behaviour at tournaments. He has one of the most competitive attitudes of the whole scene, and he also gets extremely stressed under pressure (See TSL final) and he tends to speak out of turn when he's stressed. I understand this, and thus when he says stuff in the kind of situation he's in I understand what he's going through and don't judge too harsh.
Lets not try crucify someone when they've just achieved something great, you're looking worse than he does...
Internet making up sensationalist stories? No way!!! MUST BE TRUE!
I must have formulated myself badly in the interviews I did not mean to call nestea bad. Or. An idiot watch next col iview. . .
He said he would smash me before the game so that's why I wanted to do something funny. Also sry @MLG I felt very pressured .
@eneKeyHunt @compLexityLive no pressure people twist what I say to what they want tho. I mean no disrespect to nestea
There's a lot of drama around all this naniwa/nestea thing. Looks like naniwa isn't as bad as many people claim he is though. I lost some of my respect for him first but maybe it was just miscommunication. Discuss.
I don't believe this for one second. If he truly thought it was a miscommunication why didn't he clarify before the match to Nestea, who was already insulted? Why did he stack it with a BM thumbs down? Again, doesn't fly.
because EVERYONE! said on screddit, and even here on tl.net that his win against nestea wasn´t "legit" and he had it easy cause nestea was jetlagged and all that stuff. how´d you feel if you write your exams, you´d be the best of your school, but no one cares cause everyone says that you´ve got lucky/cheated and you´re a dumb asshole? he WON a major series against one of the best players in the entire world, he probably felt like a hero after,... mc does it all the friggin time! and they´re right! nothing wrong with expressing the emotions to have a little fun with the audience. JUST stop drama-whoring, its not like its so god damn wrong to have fun,...
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
He did not, people who say that haven't actually watched the interview! He called Nestea's decision to pull drones in game 3 a really bad move ("idiot move") and said there are better ZvPers out there. That's IT!
On November 21 2011 00:09 andis35 wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:08 [17]Purple wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:06 Kira__ wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:05 tnud wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:03 swordboy wrote:
On November 20 2011 23:55 andis35 wrote: can anybody please show me which point did Naniwa violated?
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
Yes, in an col interview, later apologized as you can see in his tweets
ASDLÖKMASDLKMASDLKMASDKLMNASD He did not!
But oh yes, he did, and he even apologized for it himself, so I don't know why you're trying to deny it
He called Nestea's decision to pull drones in game 3 a really bad move ("idiot move") and said there are better ZvPers out there. That's IT! Show me, video and timestamp. Calling a move dumb is not calling someone an idiot.
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
He did not, people who say that haven't actually watched the interview! He called Nestea's decision to pull drones in game 3 a really bad move ("idiot move") and said there are better ZvPers out there. That's IT!
some people are just totally misunderstanding the concept of taking things out of context. this defence doesnt actually work if naniwas quote word by word is exactly "i thought he was a genius but hes actually an idiot." even if he is referencing something nestea was doing it still means that he called nestea an idiot.
Another thing im not seeing mentioned by all the Naniwa dislikers here; Nestea said he would CRUSH Naniwa before the game.. So Naniwa did a "celebration" thumbs down at the end when he won the game, sort of like a "Thanks for the kind words"..
So you can say Naniwa should of just did nothing and walked away, but Nestea was the one to start the shit talking, and Naniwa finished it. Thats fair in my books. When someone like IdrA does something similar, everyone is applauding the balsy response.
On November 21 2011 00:08 Gevna wrote: You understand guys that all of this situation is a misunderstanding (a quiproquo in my language) between all parts (mlg's admins, naniwa, nestea and crowd) ?
People made naniwa's interview look as a big bm while it's only awkwardness and out of context. And then it keeps taking more and more importance for something wortheless. For exemple a tiny thumbdown is considered here as the biggest bm while it's only a usual ceremony.
Little issues are exaggerated because people love drama :-/
i have no problem with any of that.
calling MLG a joke tournament in all chat, while playing live on the big screen streamed to tens of thousands of people. no matter your emotions or how you're feeling, saying something like that is completely out of line. i personally think that's the worst thing by far anyone has done in sc2. if i was sundance, i would be raging and would've instantly disqualified naniwa, but i guess that's why sundance is the ceo of mlg.
Banning someone for an opinion, no matter how controversial, would not be a good PR move at all, especially since people not in the SC ESPORTS community don't understand how "manner" pro SC and probably wouldn't think what Nani said was a big deal at all.
Just because everyone loves nestea puts this entire argument to a certain degree of bias. It's quite annoying how people overreact. What if mkp won and did this? "amazing play!" and many other more loved players around would be the same. If NESTEA isn't accusing of him of cheating, who are WE to judge?
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
He did not, people who say that haven't actually watched the interview! He called Nestea's decision to pull drones in game 3 a really bad move ("idiot move") and said there are better ZvPers out there. That's IT!
some people are just totally misunderstanding the concept of taking things out of context. this defence doesnt actually work if naniwas quote word by word is exactly "i thought he was a genius but hes actually an idiot." even if he is referencing something nestea was doing it still means that he called nestea an idiot.
Yeah, I find it funny how he uses quotation marks without actually quoting naniwa :D
I must have formulated myself badly in the interviews I did not mean to call nestea bad. Or. An idiot watch next col iview. . .
He said he would smash me before the game so that's why I wanted to do something funny. Also sry @MLG I felt very pressured .
@eneKeyHunt @compLexityLive no pressure people twist what I say to what they want tho. I mean no disrespect to nestea
There's a lot of drama around all this naniwa/nestea thing. Looks like naniwa isn't as bad as many people claim he is though. I lost some of my respect for him first but maybe it was just miscommunication. Discuss.
I don't believe this for one second. If he truly thought it was a miscommunication why didn't he clarify before the match to Nestea, who was already insulted? Why did he stack it with a BM thumbs down? Again, doesn't fly.
because EVERYONE! said on screddit, and even here on tl.net that his win against nestea wasn´t "legit" and he had it easy cause nestea was jetlagged and all that stuff. how´d you feel if you write your exams, you´d be the best of your school, but no one cares cause everyone says that you´ve got lucky/cheated and you´re a dumb asshole? he WON a major series against one of the best players in the entire world, he probably felt like a hero after,... mc does it all the friggin time! and they´re right! nothing wrong with expressing the emotions to have a little fun with the audience. JUST stop drama-whoring, its not like its so god damn wrong to have fun,...
Everyone said it cause one guy said it, that's how the internet works. People have said incorrect things in LR before and then other people quote him as fact, then other people just state him as fact. Still doesn't make it true.
On November 21 2011 00:08 Gevna wrote: You understand guys that all of this situation is a misunderstanding (a quiproquo in my language) between all parts (mlg's admins, naniwa, nestea and crowd) ?
People made naniwa's interview look as a big bm while it's only awkwardness and out of context. And then it keeps taking more and more importance for something wortheless. For exemple a tiny thumbdown is considered here as the biggest bm while it's only a usual ceremony.
Little issues are exaggerated because people love drama :-/
i have no problem with any of that.
calling MLG a joke tournament in all chat, while playing live on the big screen streamed to tens of thousands of people. no matter your emotions or how you're feeling, saying something like that is completely out of line. i personally think that's the worst thing by far anyone has done in sc2. if i was sundance, i would be raging and would've instantly disqualified naniwa, but i guess that's why sundance is the ceo of mlg.
Obviously he doesn't really think it's a joke tournament...
He was under loads of pressure because a) he's playing against the best zerg in the world and b) there was loads of trashtalk prior to the match
You seriously think that's the worst thing anyone has done in SC2? Have you been here a week?
Well the casters and MLG purposefully created drama by twisting Naniwa's words, although to be honest the community should know better than to jump on a couple of words taken out of context instead of actually watching the interviews. All this drama has less basis in truth than some shitty tabloid paper article. I wish people would just forget about this.
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
He did not, people who say that haven't actually watched the interview! He called Nestea's decision to pull drones in game 3 a really bad move ("idiot move") and said there are better ZvPers out there. That's IT!
On November 21 2011 00:09 andis35 wrote:
He apologized for using the "wrong words" and he said that "he did not mean to disrespect" NesTea
On November 21 2011 00:08 [17]Purple wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:06 Kira__ wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:05 tnud wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:03 swordboy wrote:
On November 20 2011 23:55 andis35 wrote: can anybody please show me which point did Naniwa violated?
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
Yes, in an col interview, later apologized as you can see in his tweets
ASDLÖKMASDLKMASDLKMASDKLMNASD He did not!
But oh yes, he did, and he even apologized for it himself, so I don't know why you're trying to deny it
He apologised for using the "wrong words" and "did not mean to disrespect nestea"
On November 21 2011 00:13 Snowen wrote: Another thing im not seeing mentioned by all the Naniwa dislikers here; Nestea said he would CRUSH Naniwa before the game.. So Naniwa did a "celebration" thumbs down at the end when he won the game, sort of like a "Thanks for the kind words"..
So you can say Naniwa should of just did nothing and walked away, but Nestea was the one to start the shit talking, and Naniwa finished it. Thats fair in my books. When someone like IdrA does something similar, everyone is applauding the balsy response.
It's cause Naniwa doesn't have the reputation as a "badass", therefore when he does something similar everyone hates him. gotta have that rep first bro.
I don't particularly like any of the things he did, but for the most part I can sympathize and understand why he did them. hopefully he can get his act together in the future.
some people are just totally misunderstanding the concept of taking things out of context. this defence doesnt actually work if naniwas quote word by word is exactly "i thought he was a genius but hes actually an idiot."
On November 21 2011 00:14 Xavy wrote: Just because everyone loves nestea puts this entire argument to a certain degree of bias. It's quite annoying how people overreact. What if mkp won and did this? "amazing play!" and many other more loved players around would be the same. If NESTEA isn't accusing of him of cheating, who are WE to judge?
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
He did not, people who say that haven't actually watched the interview! He called Nestea's decision to pull drones in game 3 a really bad move ("idiot move") and said there are better ZvPers out there. That's IT!
On November 21 2011 00:09 andis35 wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:08 [17]Purple wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:06 Kira__ wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:05 tnud wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:03 swordboy wrote:
On November 20 2011 23:55 andis35 wrote: can anybody please show me which point did Naniwa violated?
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
Yes, in an col interview, later apologized as you can see in his tweets
ASDLÖKMASDLKMASDLKMASDKLMNASD He did not!
But oh yes, he did, and he even apologized for it himself, so I don't know why you're trying to deny it
he apologized for what he said was misleading.....
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
He did not, people who say that haven't actually watched the interview! He called Nestea's decision to pull drones in game 3 a really bad move ("idiot move") and said there are better ZvPers out there. That's IT!
some people are just totally misunderstanding the concept of taking things out of context. this defence doesnt actually work if naniwas quote word by word is exactly "i thought he was a genius but hes actually an idiot." even if he is referencing something nestea was doing it still means that he called nestea an idiot.
Yeah, I find it funny how he uses quotation marks without actually quoting naniwa :D
Context damn it!
-He sent drones and your probe saw it. I thought that those were from some smart shit, like building a hatchery far away, and then transfering it. I though he was a genious but apperantly he's an idiot. What he did made no sense.
That is straight up calling sending drones across the map for no reason an idiotic move/ something an idiot would do. He worded it poorly yes. It's not something people need to rage about.
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
He did not, people who say that haven't actually watched the interview! He called Nestea's decision to pull drones in game 3 a really bad move ("idiot move") and said there are better ZvPers out there. That's IT!
On November 21 2011 00:09 andis35 wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:08 [17]Purple wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:06 Kira__ wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:05 tnud wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:03 swordboy wrote:
On November 20 2011 23:55 andis35 wrote: can anybody please show me which point did Naniwa violated?
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
Yes, in an col interview, later apologized as you can see in his tweets
ASDLÖKMASDLKMASDLKMASDKLMNASD He did not!
But oh yes, he did, and he even apologized for it himself, so I don't know why you're trying to deny it
He never said "Nestea's decision to pull drones was idiotic." That's just the truth. What he said was: "I thought he was going to do some smart shit, like building a hatchery far away and then transferring it. I thought he was that genius, but apparently he's just a idiot."
So please, for the love of god, stop blindly defending him just because you think he is a good player and you look up to him. We all know he is obviously one of the best protoss players in the world right now but that does not excuse the kind of behaviour we saw from him.
Forgetting everything else, you never call the tournament you're playing in a "joke", especially live on the stream to potentially hundreds of thousands of people. Please try and convince me that this statement of his was justified. I don't care if he apologised, the point is he made a mistake and mistakes have consequences.
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
He did not, people who say that haven't actually watched the interview! He called Nestea's decision to pull drones in game 3 a really bad move ("idiot move") and said there are better ZvPers out there. That's IT!
On November 21 2011 00:09 andis35 wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:08 [17]Purple wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:06 Kira__ wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:05 tnud wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:03 swordboy wrote:
On November 20 2011 23:55 andis35 wrote: can anybody please show me which point did Naniwa violated?
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
Yes, in an col interview, later apologized as you can see in his tweets
ASDLÖKMASDLKMASDLKMASDKLMNASD He did not!
But oh yes, he did, and he even apologized for it himself, so I don't know why you're trying to deny it
He never said "Nestea's decision to pull drones was idiotic." That's just the truth. What he said was: "I thought he was going to do some smart shit, like a hidden hatchery but it turns out he's just an idiot."
So please, for the love of god, stop blindly defending him just because you think he is a good player and you look up to him. We all know he is obviously one of the best protoss players in the world right now but that does not excuse the kind of behaviour we saw from him.
Forgetting everything else, you never call the tournament you're playing in a "joke", especially live on the stream to potentially hundreds of thousands of people. Please try and convince me that this statement of his was justified. I don't care if he apologised, the point is he made a mistake and mistakes have consequences.
Of course calling the tournament a joke was completely unjustified and he was punished for it... wasn't he? I believe he got a technical foul or am I completely mistaken?
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
He did not, people who say that haven't actually watched the interview! He called Nestea's decision to pull drones in game 3 a really bad move ("idiot move") and said there are better ZvPers out there. That's IT!
On November 21 2011 00:09 andis35 wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:08 [17]Purple wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:06 Kira__ wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:05 tnud wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:03 swordboy wrote:
On November 20 2011 23:55 andis35 wrote: can anybody please show me which point did Naniwa violated?
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
Yes, in an col interview, later apologized as you can see in his tweets
ASDLÖKMASDLKMASDLKMASDKLMNASD He did not!
But oh yes, he did, and he even apologized for it himself, so I don't know why you're trying to deny it
He never said "Nestea's decision to pull drones was idiotic." That's just the truth. What he said was: "I thought he was going to do some smart shit, like a hidden hatchery but it turns out he's just an idiot."
So please, for the love of god, stop blindly defending him just because you think he is a good player and you look up to him. We all know he is obviously one of the best protoss players in the world right now but that does not excuse the kind of behaviour we saw from him.
Forgetting everything else, you never call the tournament you're playing in a "joke", especially live on the stream to potentially hundreds of thousands of people. Please try and convince me that this statement of his was justified. I don't care if he apologised, the point is he made a mistake and mistakes have consequences.
Again, Naniwa's first language is NOT ENGLISH.. Words can be misused easily. And I doubt he even said "hes just an idiot".. Find me the clip. He just said what it is, an idiotic move to send your drones in that situation. If he was speaking sweden, I bet it would be a non-issue, but since hes speaking a foreign language, its easy to use the wrong words..
His behavior is not any worse than someone like IdrA saying "fuck you" in the middle of a match at a prior MLG. I think thats significantly worse than someone who was not allowed to go use the washroom before a game being upset.. Try playing a huge match against the best zerg in the world without using the washroom because the admins wouldn't allow you to, not very fun. And then for them to host the wrong map.
And lets be honest, Nestea sending his drones in game 3 WAS an idiotic move. That lost him the game for sure. If it was anyone else besides Nestea or IdrA doing it, Artosis and etc would of called it a stupid move on the spot too.
On November 21 2011 00:21 Vinx wrote: Wait... this is the wrong thread.. can I read it and then restart and cannon rush?
User was temp banned for this post.
sure you can, like in SC2.
"you know you can read the BO the moment your game ends.... so when people regame they automatically can see what build their opponent went without even watching the replay!"
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
He did not, people who say that haven't actually watched the interview! He called Nestea's decision to pull drones in game 3 a really bad move ("idiot move") and said there are better ZvPers out there. That's IT!
On November 21 2011 00:09 andis35 wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:08 [17]Purple wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:06 Kira__ wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:05 tnud wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:03 swordboy wrote:
On November 20 2011 23:55 andis35 wrote: can anybody please show me which point did Naniwa violated?
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
Yes, in an col interview, later apologized as you can see in his tweets
ASDLÖKMASDLKMASDLKMASDKLMNASD He did not!
But oh yes, he did, and he even apologized for it himself, so I don't know why you're trying to deny it
He never said "Nestea's decision to pull drones was idiotic." That's just the truth. What he said was: "I thought he was going to do some smart shit, like a hidden hatchery but it turns out he's just an idiot."
So please, for the love of god, stop blindly defending him just because you think he is a good player and you look up to him. We all know he is obviously one of the best protoss players in the world right now but that does not excuse the kind of behaviour we saw from him.
Forgetting everything else, you never call the tournament you're playing in a "joke", especially live on the stream to potentially hundreds of thousands of people. Please try and convince me that this statement of his was justified. I don't care if he apologised, the point is he made a mistake and mistakes have consequences.
Of course calling the tournament a joke was completely unjustified and he was punished for it... wasn't he? I believe he got a technical foul or am I completely mistaken?
Slasher claimed he did yesterday, but quickly changed his mind on that point. Haven't heard anything new on that subject after Slashers tweet about being wrong.
On November 21 2011 00:01 SpurvL wrote: So let's see if I have missed anything.. 1, Nestea wins over Nani in Blizzcon 2, Naniwa wins in Global invitational over Nestea ->Calls Nestea an idiot and acts completely arrogant 3, Nestea Says he's gonna beat Naniwa the MLG-game 4, Naniwa says that MVP was harder to beat then Nestea and that Nesteas ZvP isnt as good as others 5, Naniwa wins game 1, loses game 2 6, Game 3 has trouble, Naniwa thinks that they play on an other Shakaurast then they do, wants a break to go to the bathroom, comes back and they keep playing it ->Naniwa fails to understand tourny rules, BM pauses to complain and cannon rush, then provides a stay classy thumbs down after providing two base all ins. someone's states he was watching Nestea's BO 7, Internet explodes and accuses Naniwa of cheating?
I can understand people arguing over the drama that happened because of the pause and all. That's a pretty serious situation really. But the people hating on Naniwa cause he boo-ed Nestea after the game are fucking ridiculous. There was a shit ton of more BM stuff in the GSTL and MC and Idra do it like all the time.
naniwa needs to grow up... simple as that, a lot of pro gamers, even koreans make that mistake. well... look at coca, he got disqualified or knock down from Code S because of his wrong doings in a tournament. if naniwa did that in korea.... oooooo he might not even be able to play in GSL
[–]Androide456 (_) 95 points 2 hours ago (110|17) you know you can read the BO the moment your game ends.... so when people regame they automatically can see what build their opponent went without even watching the replay!
[–]InternetIsHard (_) 30 points 1 hour ago (34|4)
Exactly. The real blunder here was allowing the coach into the booth after the game started. And it's not even Naniwa's fault in this case. People are also saying he got sent there with a message from an organizer.
[–]Kashii (_) [+1] 13 points 40 minutes ago (13|2)
The guy in the booth was giving Nani a message from Sundance about his unwarranted pause.
----
Top three posts on the reddit thread. If the manager was sent in by sundance, i dont really see what the problem is, since he can see the BO from the score screen 2.
He didnt call neaste an idiot, he called the move to pull drone idiotic (also remeber that english isnt his first langugage), he saw nothing more from the replay than he would have done from the score screen, and the manager was sent from Sundace.
On November 21 2011 00:01 SpurvL wrote: So let's see if I have missed anything.. 1, Nestea wins over Nani in Blizzcon 2, Naniwa wins in Global invitational over Nestea ->Calls Nestea an idiot and acts completely arrogant 3, Nestea Says he's gonna beat Naniwa the MLG-game 4, Naniwa says that MVP was harder to beat then Nestea and that Nesteas ZvP isnt as good as others 5, Naniwa wins game 1, loses game 2 6, Game 3 has trouble, Naniwa thinks that they play on an other Shakaurast then they do, wants a break to go to the bathroom, comes back and they keep playing it ->Naniwa fails to understand tourny rules, BM pauses to complain and cannon rush, then provides a stay classy thumbs down after providing two base all ins. someone's states he was watching Nestea's BO 7, Internet explodes and accuses Naniwa of cheating?
I am pretty sure that I have missed something..
FTFY
Thats funny to read considering in the first 2 games Nestea was pretty allin himself. And since when is drop-play a 2 base all-in?
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
He did not, people who say that haven't actually watched the interview! He called Nestea's decision to pull drones in game 3 a really bad move ("idiot move") and said there are better ZvPers out there. That's IT!
On November 21 2011 00:09 andis35 wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:08 [17]Purple wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:06 Kira__ wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:05 tnud wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:03 swordboy wrote:
On November 20 2011 23:55 andis35 wrote: can anybody please show me which point did Naniwa violated?
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
Yes, in an col interview, later apologized as you can see in his tweets
ASDLÖKMASDLKMASDLKMASDKLMNASD He did not!
But oh yes, he did, and he even apologized for it himself, so I don't know why you're trying to deny it
He never said "Nestea's decision to pull drones was idiotic." That's just the truth. What he said was: "I thought he was going to do some smart shit, like a hidden hatchery but it turns out he's just an idiot."
So please, for the love of god, stop blindly defending him just because you think he is a good player and you look up to him. We all know he is obviously one of the best protoss players in the world right now but that does not excuse the kind of behaviour we saw from him.
Forgetting everything else, you never call the tournament you're playing in a "joke", especially live on the stream to potentially hundreds of thousands of people. Please try and convince me that this statement of his was justified. I don't care if he apologised, the point is he made a mistake and mistakes have consequences.
Again, Naniwa's first language is NOT ENGLISH.. Words can be misused easily. And I doubt he even said "hes just an idiot".. Find me the clip. He just said what it is, an idiotic move to send your drones in that situation. If he was speaking sweden, I bet it would be a non-issue, but since hes speaking a foreign language, its easy to use the wrong words..
His behavior is not any worse than someone like IdrA saying "fuck you" in the middle of a match at a prior MLG. I think thats significantly worse than someone who was not allowed to go use the washroom before a game being upset.. Try playing a huge match against the best zerg in the world without using the washroom because the admins wouldn't allow you to, not very fun. And then for them to host the wrong map.
And lets be honest, Nestea sending his drones in game 3 WAS an idiotic move. That lost him the game for sure. If it was anyone else besides Nestea or IdrA doing it, Artosis and etc would of called it a stupid move on the spot too.
I don't have any insight into Naniwas mind so I have no idea what he actually meant to say or what his opinion of Nestea is, but I will say that in Swedish (atleast where I live) saying things along the lines of ''damn, you're dumb'' (I'm being extremely general with the translation) in the context of someone doing something stupid/clumsy etc.etc is pretty much the same as saying something along the lines of ''¨that was very dumb of you'' and isn't necesserily seen as a personal insult but more as a general poke at a dumb thing someone did.
Like I said, I can't claim any insight into his thinking, but I wouldn't be surprised if Naniwa simply didn't rephrase a Swedish expression properly and it came out wrong.
On November 21 2011 00:01 SpurvL wrote: So let's see if I have missed anything.. 1, Nestea wins over Nani in Blizzcon 2, Naniwa wins in Global invitational over Nestea ->Calls Nestea an idiot and acts completely arrogant 3, Nestea Says he's gonna beat Naniwa the MLG-game 4, Naniwa says that MVP was harder to beat then Nestea and that Nesteas ZvP isnt as good as others 5, Naniwa wins game 1, loses game 2 6, Game 3 has trouble, Naniwa thinks that they play on an other Shakaurast then they do, wants a break to go to the bathroom, comes back and they keep playing it ->Naniwa fails to understand tourny rules, BM pauses to complain and cannon rush, then provides a stay classy thumbs down after providing two base all ins. someone's states he was watching Nestea's BO 7, Internet explodes and accuses Naniwa of cheating?
I am pretty sure that I have missed something..
FTFY
Oh god... you can see NesTea's build order from the score screen...
On November 21 2011 00:01 SpurvL wrote: So let's see if I have missed anything.. 1, Nestea wins over Nani in Blizzcon 2, Naniwa wins in Global invitational over Nestea ->Calls Nestea an idiot and acts completely arrogant 3, Nestea Says he's gonna beat Naniwa the MLG-game 4, Naniwa says that MVP was harder to beat then Nestea and that Nesteas ZvP isnt as good as others 5, Naniwa wins game 1, loses game 2 6, Game 3 has trouble, Naniwa thinks that they play on an other Shakaurast then they do, wants a break to go to the bathroom, comes back and they keep playing it ->Naniwa fails to understand tourny rules, BM pauses to complain and cannon rush, then provides a stay classy thumbs down after providing two base all ins. someone's states he was watching Nestea's BO 7, Internet explodes and accuses Naniwa of cheating?
I am pretty sure that I have missed something..
FTFY
You forget when the tourney advisor told him the wrong info, which is why he had bad info.
On November 21 2011 00:32 Haustka wrote: naniwa needs to grow up... simple as that, a lot of pro gamers, even koreans make that mistake. well... look at coca, he got disqualified or knock down from Code S because of his wrong doings in a tournament. if naniwa did that in korea.... oooooo he might not even be able to play in GSL
On November 21 2011 00:29 Jibba wrote: Summary of 95% of SC2 drama: reddit is full of idiots
Don't just blame reddit, Tastosis should get their share of blame in this. When you make a population of idiots believe someone is a God it stands to reason things will end badly.
This is beyond stupid. Naniwa was angry, he made a mistake. He apologized publicly and I am sure he apologized to Nestea. He apologized to MLG. What else do you want him to do? No one is a perfect human being.
On November 21 2011 00:32 aderum wrote: [–]Androide456 (_) 95 points 2 hours ago (110|17) you know you can read the BO the moment your game ends.... so when people regame they automatically can see what build their opponent went without even watching the replay!
[–]InternetIsHard (_) 30 points 1 hour ago (34|4)
Exactly. The real blunder here was allowing the coach into the booth after the game started. And it's not even Naniwa's fault in this case. People are also saying he got sent there with a message from an organizer.
[–]Kashii (_) [+1] 13 points 40 minutes ago (13|2)
The guy in the booth was giving Nani a message from Sundance about his unwarranted pause.
----
Top three posts on the reddit thread. If the manager was sent in by sundance, i dont really see what the problem is, since he can see the BO from the score screen 2.
He didnt call neaste an idiot, he called the move to pull drone idiotic (also remeber that english isnt his first langugage), he saw nothing more from the replay than he would have done from the score screen, and the manager was sent from Sundace.
What is the problem here?
It's like people for the first time have heard Nani speak, and are forgetting that he never have been a master at english. Perhaps MLG should get him a translator too.
On November 21 2011 00:32 Haustka wrote: naniwa needs to grow up... simple as that, a lot of pro gamers, even koreans make that mistake. well... look at coca, he got disqualified or knock down from Code S because of his wrong doings in a tournament. if naniwa did that in korea.... oooooo he might not even be able to play in GSL
well who knows
Throwing a game =/= thumbs down.
This tbh.
See how fucking hard coca got slammed for his thrown game, I wonder why the whole blizzcon debacle hasnt resulted in nestea getting booted from turneys.
I mean wtf shitting all over the community and blizzcon is ok, but calling an opponent an idiot gives total uproar? The only would where this makes sense is a world full of reddit nestea fanboys... ohhhh wait...
On November 21 2011 00:29 Jibba wrote: Summary of 95% of SC2 drama: reddit is full of idiots
Don't just blame reddit, Tastosis should get their share of blame in this. When you make a population of idiots believe someone is a God it stands to reason things will end badly.
And fuiling with the story before the game, even claiming not to have seen the interview themself.
On November 21 2011 00:38 turamn wrote: This is beyond stupid. Naniwa was angry, he made a mistake. He apologized publicly and I am sure he apologized to Nestea. He apologized to MLG. What else do you want him to do? No one is a perfect human being.
Apologizes are not enough in a serious and professionnal tournament imo. Of course we're all human, but hes a pro who is supposed to follow strictly the tournament rules, and if he dont he must have a punishement, it's as simple as that. ^^
On November 21 2011 00:25 Kimla wrote: Nestea played really bad and his fans are really angry kinda funny. Get over it.
No, I'm not a Nestea fan. I don't watch the GSL and I play as Terran, so don't even try to tell me I have some kind of "zerg bias". However, I like watching people who are respectful and talented at the same time and what Naniwa did yesterday was not respectful to Nestea. Period.
Why is it so hard for some people on this forum to understand that there are mature people in this community that don't want to see the kind of behaviour that Naniwa demonstrated yesterday? I think I am right when I say, we're the people that actually want ESPORTS to grow and become more recognised, and having one of the best players in the world (yes, I recognise that Naniwa is) saying that the tournament is a "joke" live on the stream does not benefit anyone.
Let me put this out there. How do you know that the people from ESPN that MLG have been in contact with, are not sitting at home watching the tournament to get a better understanding of everything. What do you think their reactions are when they see what happened yesterday? I can't imagine they look up to it like some people do on here.
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
He did not, people who say that haven't actually watched the interview! He called Nestea's decision to pull drones in game 3 a really bad move ("idiot move") and said there are better ZvPers out there. That's IT!
On November 21 2011 00:09 andis35 wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:08 [17]Purple wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:06 Kira__ wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:05 tnud wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:03 swordboy wrote: [quote]
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
Yes, in an col interview, later apologized as you can see in his tweets
ASDLÖKMASDLKMASDLKMASDKLMNASD He did not!
But oh yes, he did, and he even apologized for it himself, so I don't know why you're trying to deny it
He never said "Nestea's decision to pull drones was idiotic." That's just the truth. What he said was: "I thought he was going to do some smart shit, like a hidden hatchery but it turns out he's just an idiot."
So please, for the love of god, stop blindly defending him just because you think he is a good player and you look up to him. We all know he is obviously one of the best protoss players in the world right now but that does not excuse the kind of behaviour we saw from him.
Forgetting everything else, you never call the tournament you're playing in a "joke", especially live on the stream to potentially hundreds of thousands of people. Please try and convince me that this statement of his was justified. I don't care if he apologised, the point is he made a mistake and mistakes have consequences.
Again, Naniwa's first language is NOT ENGLISH.. Words can be misused easily. And I doubt he even said "hes just an idiot".. Find me the clip. He just said what it is, an idiotic move to send your drones in that situation. If he was speaking sweden, I bet it would be a non-issue, but since hes speaking a foreign language, its easy to use the wrong words..
His behavior is not any worse than someone like IdrA saying "fuck you" in the middle of a match at a prior MLG. I think thats significantly worse than someone who was not allowed to go use the washroom before a game being upset.. Try playing a huge match against the best zerg in the world without using the washroom because the admins wouldn't allow you to, not very fun. And then for them to host the wrong map.
And lets be honest, Nestea sending his drones in game 3 WAS an idiotic move. That lost him the game for sure. If it was anyone else besides Nestea or IdrA doing it, Artosis and etc would of called it a stupid move on the spot too.
I don't have any insight into Naniwas mind so I have no idea what he actually meant to say or what his opinion of Nestea is, but I will say that in Swedish (atleast where I live) saying things along the lines of ''damn, you're dumb'' (I'm being extremely general with the translation) in the context of someone doing something stupid/clumsy etc.etc is pretty much the same as saying something along the lines of ''¨that was very dumb of you'' and isn't necesserily seen as a personal insult but more as a general poke at a dumb thing someone did.
Like I said, I can't claim any insight into his thinking, but I wouldn't be surprised if Naniwa simply didn't rephrase a Swedish expression properly and it came out wrong.
Naniwa didn't say that Nestea sending his drones in game 3 was idiot, that's what he said he meant on twitter.
But seriously dude, if you say to someone you've never talked to "you're dumb" you think it means "that was dumb" ? Don't be a fool please ...
Nestea is not Naniwa's friend, saying Nestea is idiot has no other meanings, and when you say "he is an idiot", i don't see how Naniwa can say he didn't mean that, anyone with 50 english words knowledge would know that.
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
He did not, people who say that haven't actually watched the interview! He called Nestea's decision to pull drones in game 3 a really bad move ("idiot move") and said there are better ZvPers out there. That's IT!
On November 21 2011 00:09 andis35 wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:08 [17]Purple wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:06 Kira__ wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:05 tnud wrote: [quote] You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
Yes, in an col interview, later apologized as you can see in his tweets
ASDLÖKMASDLKMASDLKMASDKLMNASD He did not!
But oh yes, he did, and he even apologized for it himself, so I don't know why you're trying to deny it
He never said "Nestea's decision to pull drones was idiotic." That's just the truth. What he said was: "I thought he was going to do some smart shit, like a hidden hatchery but it turns out he's just an idiot."
So please, for the love of god, stop blindly defending him just because you think he is a good player and you look up to him. We all know he is obviously one of the best protoss players in the world right now but that does not excuse the kind of behaviour we saw from him.
Forgetting everything else, you never call the tournament you're playing in a "joke", especially live on the stream to potentially hundreds of thousands of people. Please try and convince me that this statement of his was justified. I don't care if he apologised, the point is he made a mistake and mistakes have consequences.
Again, Naniwa's first language is NOT ENGLISH.. Words can be misused easily. And I doubt he even said "hes just an idiot".. Find me the clip. He just said what it is, an idiotic move to send your drones in that situation. If he was speaking sweden, I bet it would be a non-issue, but since hes speaking a foreign language, its easy to use the wrong words..
His behavior is not any worse than someone like IdrA saying "fuck you" in the middle of a match at a prior MLG. I think thats significantly worse than someone who was not allowed to go use the washroom before a game being upset.. Try playing a huge match against the best zerg in the world without using the washroom because the admins wouldn't allow you to, not very fun. And then for them to host the wrong map.
And lets be honest, Nestea sending his drones in game 3 WAS an idiotic move. That lost him the game for sure. If it was anyone else besides Nestea or IdrA doing it, Artosis and etc would of called it a stupid move on the spot too.
I don't have any insight into Naniwas mind so I have no idea what he actually meant to say or what his opinion of Nestea is, but I will say that in Swedish (atleast where I live) saying things along the lines of ''damn, you're dumb'' (I'm being extremely general with the translation) in the context of someone doing something stupid/clumsy etc.etc is pretty much the same as saying something along the lines of ''¨that was very dumb of you'' and isn't necesserily seen as a personal insult but more as a general poke at a dumb thing someone did.
Like I said, I can't claim any insight into his thinking, but I wouldn't be surprised if Naniwa simply didn't rephrase a Swedish expression properly and it came out wrong.
... But seriously dude, if you say to someone you've never talked to "you're dumb" you think it means "that was dumb" ? Don't be a fool please ...
Nestea is not Naniwa's friend, saying Nestea is idiot has no other meanings, and when you say "he is an idiot", i don't see how Naniwa can say he didn't mean that, anyone with 50 english words knowledge would know that.
I'm also from Sweden and yes, in swedish that would not be a personal insult per se. Especially not in this context which it's questionable even in English.
On November 21 2011 00:38 turamn wrote: This is beyond stupid. Naniwa was angry, he made a mistake. He apologized publicly and I am sure he apologized to Nestea. He apologized to MLG. What else do you want him to do? No one is a perfect human being.
Apologizes are not enough in a serious and professionnal tournament imo. Of course we're all human, but hes a pro who is supposed to follow strictly the tournament rules, and if he dont he must have a punishement, it's as simple as that. ^^
What rules did he break? An admin told him incorrect information and he wanted clarification. You're telling me that if you don't know anything about Playstation 3, go to buy one and the Sales Clerk tells you it will play PS2 games and it doesn't, you won't be angry? I mean, he didn't cheat. At al. Could they have punished him for saying joke tournament, yeah, they could have, but they chose not to.
What else can he do other than apologize? Do you want him to wax Sundance's scrotum on stream? I just don't understand. .
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
He did not, people who say that haven't actually watched the interview! He called Nestea's decision to pull drones in game 3 a really bad move ("idiot move") and said there are better ZvPers out there. That's IT!
On November 21 2011 00:09 andis35 wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:08 [17]Purple wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:06 Kira__ wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:05 tnud wrote: [quote] You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
Yes, in an col interview, later apologized as you can see in his tweets
ASDLÖKMASDLKMASDLKMASDKLMNASD He did not!
But oh yes, he did, and he even apologized for it himself, so I don't know why you're trying to deny it
He never said "Nestea's decision to pull drones was idiotic." That's just the truth. What he said was: "I thought he was going to do some smart shit, like a hidden hatchery but it turns out he's just an idiot."
So please, for the love of god, stop blindly defending him just because you think he is a good player and you look up to him. We all know he is obviously one of the best protoss players in the world right now but that does not excuse the kind of behaviour we saw from him.
Forgetting everything else, you never call the tournament you're playing in a "joke", especially live on the stream to potentially hundreds of thousands of people. Please try and convince me that this statement of his was justified. I don't care if he apologised, the point is he made a mistake and mistakes have consequences.
Again, Naniwa's first language is NOT ENGLISH.. Words can be misused easily. And I doubt he even said "hes just an idiot".. Find me the clip. He just said what it is, an idiotic move to send your drones in that situation. If he was speaking sweden, I bet it would be a non-issue, but since hes speaking a foreign language, its easy to use the wrong words..
His behavior is not any worse than someone like IdrA saying "fuck you" in the middle of a match at a prior MLG. I think thats significantly worse than someone who was not allowed to go use the washroom before a game being upset.. Try playing a huge match against the best zerg in the world without using the washroom because the admins wouldn't allow you to, not very fun. And then for them to host the wrong map.
And lets be honest, Nestea sending his drones in game 3 WAS an idiotic move. That lost him the game for sure. If it was anyone else besides Nestea or IdrA doing it, Artosis and etc would of called it a stupid move on the spot too.
I don't have any insight into Naniwas mind so I have no idea what he actually meant to say or what his opinion of Nestea is, but I will say that in Swedish (atleast where I live) saying things along the lines of ''damn, you're dumb'' (I'm being extremely general with the translation) in the context of someone doing something stupid/clumsy etc.etc is pretty much the same as saying something along the lines of ''¨that was very dumb of you'' and isn't necesserily seen as a personal insult but more as a general poke at a dumb thing someone did.
Like I said, I can't claim any insight into his thinking, but I wouldn't be surprised if Naniwa simply didn't rephrase a Swedish expression properly and it came out wrong.
Naniwa didn't say that Nestea sending his drones in game 3 was idiot, that's what he said he meant on twitter.
But seriously dude, if you say to someone you've never talked to "you're dumb" you think it means "that was dumb" ? Don't be a fool please ...
Nestea is not Naniwa's friend, saying Nestea is idiot has no other meanings, and when you say "he is an idiot", i don't see how Naniwa can say he didn't mean that, anyone with 50 english words knowledge would know that.
Not really, speaking your non-native tongue is fairly difficult especially English considering the amount of words that basically mean the same thing.
On November 21 2011 00:25 Kimla wrote: Nestea played really bad and his fans are really angry kinda funny. Get over it.
No, I'm not a Nestea fan. I don't watch the GSL and I play as Terran, so don't even try to tell me I have some kind of "zerg bias". However, I like watching people who are respectful and talented at the same time and what Naniwa did yesterday was not respectful to Nestea. Period.
Why is it so hard for some people on this forum to understand that there are mature people in this community that don't want to see the kind of behaviour that Naniwa demonstrated yesterday? I think I am right when I say, we're the people that actually want ESPORTS to grow and become more recognised, and having one of the best players in the world (yes, I recognise that Naniwa is) saying that the tournament is a "joke" live on the stream does not benefit anyone.
Let me put this out there. How do you know that the people from ESPN that MLG have been in contact with, are not sitting at home watching the tournament to get a better understanding of everything. What do you think their reactions are when they see what happened yesterday? I can't imagine they look up to it like some people do on here.
NesTea said he would crush NaNiwa. That is not respectful. He shouldn't have called the tournament a joke, of course it is wrong, but IT IS NOT THE END OF THE WORLD.
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
He did not, people who say that haven't actually watched the interview! He called Nestea's decision to pull drones in game 3 a really bad move ("idiot move") and said there are better ZvPers out there. That's IT!
On November 21 2011 00:09 andis35 wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:08 [17]Purple wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:06 Kira__ wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:05 tnud wrote: [quote] You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
Yes, in an col interview, later apologized as you can see in his tweets
ASDLÖKMASDLKMASDLKMASDKLMNASD He did not!
But oh yes, he did, and he even apologized for it himself, so I don't know why you're trying to deny it
He never said "Nestea's decision to pull drones was idiotic." That's just the truth. What he said was: "I thought he was going to do some smart shit, like a hidden hatchery but it turns out he's just an idiot."
So please, for the love of god, stop blindly defending him just because you think he is a good player and you look up to him. We all know he is obviously one of the best protoss players in the world right now but that does not excuse the kind of behaviour we saw from him.
Forgetting everything else, you never call the tournament you're playing in a "joke", especially live on the stream to potentially hundreds of thousands of people. Please try and convince me that this statement of his was justified. I don't care if he apologised, the point is he made a mistake and mistakes have consequences.
Again, Naniwa's first language is NOT ENGLISH.. Words can be misused easily. And I doubt he even said "hes just an idiot".. Find me the clip. He just said what it is, an idiotic move to send your drones in that situation. If he was speaking sweden, I bet it would be a non-issue, but since hes speaking a foreign language, its easy to use the wrong words..
His behavior is not any worse than someone like IdrA saying "fuck you" in the middle of a match at a prior MLG. I think thats significantly worse than someone who was not allowed to go use the washroom before a game being upset.. Try playing a huge match against the best zerg in the world without using the washroom because the admins wouldn't allow you to, not very fun. And then for them to host the wrong map.
And lets be honest, Nestea sending his drones in game 3 WAS an idiotic move. That lost him the game for sure. If it was anyone else besides Nestea or IdrA doing it, Artosis and etc would of called it a stupid move on the spot too.
I don't have any insight into Naniwas mind so I have no idea what he actually meant to say or what his opinion of Nestea is, but I will say that in Swedish (atleast where I live) saying things along the lines of ''damn, you're dumb'' (I'm being extremely general with the translation) in the context of someone doing something stupid/clumsy etc.etc is pretty much the same as saying something along the lines of ''¨that was very dumb of you'' and isn't necesserily seen as a personal insult but more as a general poke at a dumb thing someone did.
Like I said, I can't claim any insight into his thinking, but I wouldn't be surprised if Naniwa simply didn't rephrase a Swedish expression properly and it came out wrong.
Naniwa didn't say that Nestea sending his drones in game 3 was idiot, that's what he said he meant on twitter.
But seriously dude, if you say to someone you've never talked to "you're dumb" you think it means "that was dumb" ? Don't be a fool please ...
Nestea is not Naniwa's friend, saying Nestea is idiot has no other meanings, and when you say "he is an idiot", i don't see how Naniwa can say he didn't mean that, anyone with 50 english words knowledge would know that.
You misread what he wrote; in SWEDEN, the phrase "You're dumb" is just like saying "that was dumb" in AMERICA.. You have to understand we have players from places OTHER than USA, and their terminology and meaning can get lost when translating outside of their native language.
He makes a great point how things get mistrued in translation; im sure it comes across often for Koreans too (remember "Koreans own white dudes"??)
On November 21 2011 00:25 Kimla wrote: Nestea played really bad and his fans are really angry kinda funny. Get over it.
No, I'm not a Nestea fan. I don't watch the GSL and I play as Terran, so don't even try to tell me I have some kind of "zerg bias". However, I like watching people who are respectful and talented at the same time and what Naniwa did yesterday was not respectful to Nestea. Period.
Why is it so hard for some people on this forum to understand that there are mature people in this community that don't want to see the kind of behaviour that Naniwa demonstrated yesterday? I think I am right when I say, we're the people that actually want ESPORTS to grow and become more recognised, and having one of the best players in the world (yes, I recognise that Naniwa is) saying that the tournament is a "joke" live on the stream does not benefit anyone.
Let me put this out there. How do you know that the people from ESPN that MLG have been in contact with, are not sitting at home watching the tournament to get a better understanding of everything. What do you think their reactions are when they see what happened yesterday? I can't imagine they look up to it like some people do on here.
NesTea said he would crush NaNiwa. That is not respectful. He shouldn't have called the tournament a joke, of course it is wrong, but IT IS NOT THE END OF THE WORLD.
Someone other than IdrA was sorta BM! ALERT THE NATIONAL GUARD!
On November 21 2011 00:26 SlimeBagly wrote: players having personalities is good for ESPORTS
Being a douchebag =/= having a personality
BMing works for IdrA, why not for Nani?
Well Naniwa attacked the player himself, IdrA usually attacks the race.
naniwa's comment wasn't even INGAME! It was just a joke, listen to the actual video.
"IdrA usually attacks the race." LOL Idra BMs people outright ingame. I think there may be some screenshots to back me up on this.
IdrA BM's players like Cruncher, Silver, and Drewbie
Not MC, NesTea, MVP.
Actually idra said Nestea was bad... of course he won't say it now anymore tho... but only cause he knows even his biggest fanboys would know that's utter bs.
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
He did not, people who say that haven't actually watched the interview! He called Nestea's decision to pull drones in game 3 a really bad move ("idiot move") and said there are better ZvPers out there. That's IT!
On November 21 2011 00:09 andis35 wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:08 [17]Purple wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:06 Kira__ wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:05 tnud wrote: [quote] You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
Yes, in an col interview, later apologized as you can see in his tweets
ASDLÖKMASDLKMASDLKMASDKLMNASD He did not!
But oh yes, he did, and he even apologized for it himself, so I don't know why you're trying to deny it
He never said "Nestea's decision to pull drones was idiotic." That's just the truth. What he said was: "I thought he was going to do some smart shit, like a hidden hatchery but it turns out he's just an idiot."
So please, for the love of god, stop blindly defending him just because you think he is a good player and you look up to him. We all know he is obviously one of the best protoss players in the world right now but that does not excuse the kind of behaviour we saw from him.
Forgetting everything else, you never call the tournament you're playing in a "joke", especially live on the stream to potentially hundreds of thousands of people. Please try and convince me that this statement of his was justified. I don't care if he apologised, the point is he made a mistake and mistakes have consequences.
Again, Naniwa's first language is NOT ENGLISH.. Words can be misused easily. And I doubt he even said "hes just an idiot".. Find me the clip. He just said what it is, an idiotic move to send your drones in that situation. If he was speaking sweden, I bet it would be a non-issue, but since hes speaking a foreign language, its easy to use the wrong words..
His behavior is not any worse than someone like IdrA saying "fuck you" in the middle of a match at a prior MLG. I think thats significantly worse than someone who was not allowed to go use the washroom before a game being upset.. Try playing a huge match against the best zerg in the world without using the washroom because the admins wouldn't allow you to, not very fun. And then for them to host the wrong map.
And lets be honest, Nestea sending his drones in game 3 WAS an idiotic move. That lost him the game for sure. If it was anyone else besides Nestea or IdrA doing it, Artosis and etc would of called it a stupid move on the spot too.
I don't have any insight into Naniwas mind so I have no idea what he actually meant to say or what his opinion of Nestea is, but I will say that in Swedish (atleast where I live) saying things along the lines of ''damn, you're dumb'' (I'm being extremely general with the translation) in the context of someone doing something stupid/clumsy etc.etc is pretty much the same as saying something along the lines of ''¨that was very dumb of you'' and isn't necesserily seen as a personal insult but more as a general poke at a dumb thing someone did.
Like I said, I can't claim any insight into his thinking, but I wouldn't be surprised if Naniwa simply didn't rephrase a Swedish expression properly and it came out wrong.
Naniwa didn't say that Nestea sending his drones in game 3 was idiot, that's what he said he meant on twitter.
But seriously dude, if you say to someone you've never talked to "you're dumb" you think it means "that was dumb" ? Don't be a fool please ...
Nestea is not Naniwa's friend, saying Nestea is idiot has no other meanings, and when you say "he is an idiot", i don't see how Naniwa can say he didn't mean that, anyone with 50 english words knowledge would know that.
He tried to colour the laguage with "I thought he was a genius, but...." He picked the wrong word, fool would have been better. But Nani is not a english author, so it went wrong. This is a bit like google translating a korean text.
People seem to love drama so much, they read what they want and make anything into cheating. Believe me I'm the last person to defend Naniwa but you guys are taking it too fucking far.
- Even IF Nani was watching the replay of that regame (which could only have gone on for 1-2 minutes max) he saw nothing that he couldn't see by simply click the match history and check it there. If it's against the rules to check the replay after a game (I haven't read the rules) then I think it warrants a warning but not because he "cheated" he simply just broke a tournament rule.
- Watching the interview, I don't see how anyone can think Naniwa is calling Nestea an idiot. He's simply stating that he thinks that there are better ZvP:ers out there and that Nestea pulling his drones was an idiot move. Not that Nestea is a "bad idiot" that some people seem to interprent it as.
- Nestea, due to getting wrongly informed about the contents of the interview, then goes ahead and says he'll crush Naniwa in the rematch, Naniwa finds out about this
- Naniwa wins the rematch 2-1, gives Nestea thumbs down, seeing how Nestea said he was going to "crush him".
I don't know how anyone would get it in their head that Naniwa cheated:
1) the mlg rules don't state anything about replay watching 2) the build order shows up on the score screen if you regame 3) mlg told the complexity guy to enter the booth, it wasn't naniwa's decision and there's no reason to assume he talked to him about what nestea was doing
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
He did not, people who say that haven't actually watched the interview! He called Nestea's decision to pull drones in game 3 a really bad move ("idiot move") and said there are better ZvPers out there. That's IT!
On November 21 2011 00:09 andis35 wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:08 [17]Purple wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:06 Kira__ wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:05 tnud wrote: [quote] You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
Yes, in an col interview, later apologized as you can see in his tweets
ASDLÖKMASDLKMASDLKMASDKLMNASD He did not!
But oh yes, he did, and he even apologized for it himself, so I don't know why you're trying to deny it
He never said "Nestea's decision to pull drones was idiotic." That's just the truth. What he said was: "I thought he was going to do some smart shit, like a hidden hatchery but it turns out he's just an idiot."
So please, for the love of god, stop blindly defending him just because you think he is a good player and you look up to him. We all know he is obviously one of the best protoss players in the world right now but that does not excuse the kind of behaviour we saw from him.
Forgetting everything else, you never call the tournament you're playing in a "joke", especially live on the stream to potentially hundreds of thousands of people. Please try and convince me that this statement of his was justified. I don't care if he apologised, the point is he made a mistake and mistakes have consequences.
Again, Naniwa's first language is NOT ENGLISH.. Words can be misused easily. And I doubt he even said "hes just an idiot".. Find me the clip. He just said what it is, an idiotic move to send your drones in that situation. If he was speaking sweden, I bet it would be a non-issue, but since hes speaking a foreign language, its easy to use the wrong words..
His behavior is not any worse than someone like IdrA saying "fuck you" in the middle of a match at a prior MLG. I think thats significantly worse than someone who was not allowed to go use the washroom before a game being upset.. Try playing a huge match against the best zerg in the world without using the washroom because the admins wouldn't allow you to, not very fun. And then for them to host the wrong map.
And lets be honest, Nestea sending his drones in game 3 WAS an idiotic move. That lost him the game for sure. If it was anyone else besides Nestea or IdrA doing it, Artosis and etc would of called it a stupid move on the spot too.
I don't have any insight into Naniwas mind so I have no idea what he actually meant to say or what his opinion of Nestea is, but I will say that in Swedish (atleast where I live) saying things along the lines of ''damn, you're dumb'' (I'm being extremely general with the translation) in the context of someone doing something stupid/clumsy etc.etc is pretty much the same as saying something along the lines of ''¨that was very dumb of you'' and isn't necesserily seen as a personal insult but more as a general poke at a dumb thing someone did.
Like I said, I can't claim any insight into his thinking, but I wouldn't be surprised if Naniwa simply didn't rephrase a Swedish expression properly and it came out wrong.
Naniwa didn't say that Nestea sending his drones in game 3 was idiot, that's what he said he meant on twitter.
But seriously dude, if you say to someone you've never talked to "you're dumb" you think it means "that was dumb" ? Don't be a fool please ...
Nestea is not Naniwa's friend, saying Nestea is idiot has no other meanings, and when you say "he is an idiot", i don't see how Naniwa can say he didn't mean that, anyone with 50 english words knowledge would know that.
Read my post again, please. My entire point was that there are expressions used in some languages that when translated directly word for word hold a very different meaning in another language.
Yes, in Sweden I would be perfectly comfortable saying ''you're dumb'' (once again, very loosely translated) in the context of a person doing something dumb/weird/clumsy and I would expect them to take it as a light-hearted poke rather than a slight to their intelligence, just the same as I would take it if someone said it to me in that context.
2. No communication between Players and Spectators during a Match.
5. No excessive taunting or celebration by Coaches or Players. Excessive taunting or celebration includes, but is not limited to, post-Match taunting or celebration directed at or referencing an opposing Player(s) and/or Coach. Post-Match interactions between opposing Players and Coaches must be limited to acts of sportsmanship.
You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
He did not, people who say that haven't actually watched the interview! He called Nestea's decision to pull drones in game 3 a really bad move ("idiot move") and said there are better ZvPers out there. That's IT!
On November 21 2011 00:09 andis35 wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:08 [17]Purple wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:06 Kira__ wrote:
On November 21 2011 00:05 tnud wrote: [quote] You know very well that point 2 is very loosely enforced and that what MC did against MVP was far "worse" then a simple thumbs down. People are hating on naniwa for no reason :/
Spectators usually don't enter the booths during a paused game, also MC didnt call MVP an idiot after a match.
nAni called NesTea an idiot after the match?
Yes, in an col interview, later apologized as you can see in his tweets
ASDLÖKMASDLKMASDLKMASDKLMNASD He did not!
But oh yes, he did, and he even apologized for it himself, so I don't know why you're trying to deny it
He never said "Nestea's decision to pull drones was idiotic." That's just the truth. What he said was: "I thought he was going to do some smart shit, like a hidden hatchery but it turns out he's just an idiot."
So please, for the love of god, stop blindly defending him just because you think he is a good player and you look up to him. We all know he is obviously one of the best protoss players in the world right now but that does not excuse the kind of behaviour we saw from him.
Forgetting everything else, you never call the tournament you're playing in a "joke", especially live on the stream to potentially hundreds of thousands of people. Please try and convince me that this statement of his was justified. I don't care if he apologised, the point is he made a mistake and mistakes have consequences.
Again, Naniwa's first language is NOT ENGLISH.. Words can be misused easily. And I doubt he even said "hes just an idiot".. Find me the clip. He just said what it is, an idiotic move to send your drones in that situation. If he was speaking sweden, I bet it would be a non-issue, but since hes speaking a foreign language, its easy to use the wrong words..
His behavior is not any worse than someone like IdrA saying "fuck you" in the middle of a match at a prior MLG. I think thats significantly worse than someone who was not allowed to go use the washroom before a game being upset.. Try playing a huge match against the best zerg in the world without using the washroom because the admins wouldn't allow you to, not very fun. And then for them to host the wrong map.
And lets be honest, Nestea sending his drones in game 3 WAS an idiotic move. That lost him the game for sure. If it was anyone else besides Nestea or IdrA doing it, Artosis and etc would of called it a stupid move on the spot too.
I don't have any insight into Naniwas mind so I have no idea what he actually meant to say or what his opinion of Nestea is, but I will say that in Swedish (atleast where I live) saying things along the lines of ''damn, you're dumb'' (I'm being extremely general with the translation) in the context of someone doing something stupid/clumsy etc.etc is pretty much the same as saying something along the lines of ''¨that was very dumb of you'' and isn't necesserily seen as a personal insult but more as a general poke at a dumb thing someone did.
Like I said, I can't claim any insight into his thinking, but I wouldn't be surprised if Naniwa simply didn't rephrase a Swedish expression properly and it came out wrong.
Naniwa didn't say that Nestea sending his drones in game 3 was idiot, that's what he said he meant on twitter.
But seriously dude, if you say to someone you've never talked to "you're dumb" you think it means "that was dumb" ? Don't be a fool please ...
Nestea is not Naniwa's friend, saying Nestea is idiot has no other meanings, and when you say "he is an idiot", i don't see how Naniwa can say he didn't mean that, anyone with 50 english words knowledge would know that.
FFS, he DID say that sending the drones in game 3 of the Invitational was idiotic. please stop picking and choosing quotes. Look what i Can Do: OMG you said " Nestead is an idiot" See what i did there? i picked somthing from what you just said! omg you called nestea an idiot lololol. Please, people should 1) actually go watch the invterview he did, and 2) stop saying that he cheated based on 1, seriously biased reddit post, and actually look at that facts. Game 3 of there 2 game against each other, its comming down to the final game, tensions are going to be high, and we have seen before what Nani is like in these situations (CHILL GET OUT!). He went to the toilet after that since he was denied it before that game, and now there was some down time. The manage was sent to the booth to Tell him a message from Sundace (the CEO of MLG) about the un called for pause, based on bad info nani got from an admin. The Thumbs down after the game was in respose to NESTEA saying that he was going to "destory Naniwa in this re-match, since he could have won all the Games they played in the invitational, he just didnt"
you guys have no idea how hard it is to learn not only english but the way USA talks, it is not just word for word... you are giving an interview with using another language, so, picking bad words to express what you want happens a lot.
So I was sitting in the front row of the main stage while this whole thing went down. Let me try to give some context.
BEFORE the ordeal with the map happened, another ordeal happened. I caught in the chat one of the players saying that they needed to use the W.C. before the match started (I don't know which one it was), to which the admin responded "no, we have to start now". Then RedB said "ask your admin" to which the admin in the chat responded "we're going now" and they immediately cut to the ads on the player screens.
At that point Artosis and Tasteless are still on the screen, but the match had started. Then Tasteless says something about "NaNiWa says he's going to pause the match.... we have to sort this out" - at which point I realized that it was NaNiWa that had to use the bathroom, and after about a minute of play (which was never put on the screen), paused the match. That's when they cut to the paused game in which there was OVER a minute of play time played. At this point, nobody really did anything, until the admins on stage realized that it was a horrible situation and they had to let him go to the bathroom (I get that they were late to start with... but it seems unreasonable to start a match when one of your players isn't ready because of time issues). That's when they cut away, NaNiWa left the booth (presumably to go to the bathroom). NesTea looks pretty pissed at this point (as pissed as you can imagine NesTea looking). The coach comes over to the booth and tells him he can go to the bathroom, and he's like but dude I'm already settled (I could tell because of his body language), and then finally agrees to go anyway.
They both get back and they decide to restart the match.
EXCEPT.
NaNiWa got back before NesTea (I believe), but in any case, he quickly pulled up the replay from the match before anybody could stop him. As soon as the official on the stage realized, he went into the booth to tell him to stop, but it was too late, NaNiWa had already seen the starting position of NesTea. This went largely unnoticed.
So they restart the match, and as soon as NaNiWa's scouting probe gets to the cross base and sees nothing there, he paused the game and said "?" "wrong map?". At this point one of the admins approaches the booth, but then he posts "admin told me cross only\", which was, in my opinion, very smart on his part, so that the audience knew what was going on and they couldn't just shut him up.
At this point he talks to the admin, and the admin immediately looks defeated. The admin then walks over and talks to a couple of other people. This is when Sundance arrived, and joined the conversation. The admins then talked to all of the other officials on the stage, presumably asking if anyone had told NaNiWa that the map should be cross positions.
This is where the story diverges. I think that one of two things happened.
(1) Somebody actually told him this but nobody would cop up to it. In NaNiWa's mind, seeing the spawn in the replay reaffirmed the "fact" that the official had told him earlier. (2) Nobody actually told him this, but since he saw the replay, he assumed it would be cross position again and was pissed when he realized his cheese wouldn't be as effective.
I could see the lead admin guy ask and look at all of the other officials on the stage, to which people were shaking their heads, as if everyone was agreeing that nobody told him this. At that point, the official went back in the booth to break the bad news to NaNiWa. NaNiWa was PISSED, visually repeating "NO, NO, NO!". It was apparent that he felt cheated, which I believe that he actually was. If he was told cross spawns, and it wasn't, that could seriously mess up your entire game, and in my opinion, the game should have been replayed.
After the official left, he typed the rest of the text, "joke tournament" and "give me a minute to rethink".
Here is why I think that option (1) is more likely.
The officials allowed NaNiWa's coach INTO THE PLAYER BOOTH with 1:47 on the clock and the game paused. The coach talked to NaNiWa for a minute or two before he left and shut the door. Then a few minutes later, gameplay resumed. Why would the officials let the coach in to re-strategize IN THE MIDDLE OF A MATCH if they didn't believe they were at fault?
This entire time, NesTea is sitting in his booth, looking defeated. At this point, it's over half an hour since the first attempt at this game had started, and he must not be in his proper mindset.
I feel really bad for both players, and for MLG. I feel bad for NesTea because he was put through this horrible ordeal, and the disruption in the normal flow likely contributed to the loss. I feel bad for NaNiWa, because I feel that he was told one thing about the spawns, and that he knew that MLG knew that they were wrong, and played anyway (regardless of the outcome.) And I feel bad for MLG because they were put into a tight spot... But they honestly could have avoided this two-fold. (1) Let him go to the bathroom when he requested before the countdown timer, and (2) if they felt that they were at fault (which I think is undeniable by the allowing the coach into the booth during the game), then they should have replayed the match.
Just my $.02
Holy shit those are some pretty serious accusations.
I'm waiting for an official statement from MLG to see what truly happened. This is clearly cheating but...he beat nestea again.
On November 21 2011 00:50 dignitas.merz wrote: People seem to love drama so much, they read what they want and make anything into cheating. Believe me I'm the last person to defend Naniwa but you guys are taking it too fucking far.
- Even IF Nani was watching the replay of that regame (which could only have gone on for 1-2 minutes max) he saw nothing that he couldn't see by simply click the match history and check it there. If it's against the rules to check the replay after a game (I haven't read the rules) then I think it warrants a warning but not because he "cheated" he simply just broke a tournament rule.
- Watching the interview, I don't see how anyone can think Naniwa is calling Nestea an idiot. He's simply stating that he thinks that there are better ZvP:ers out there and that Nestea pulling his drones was an idiot move. Not that Nestea is a "bad idiot" that some people seem to interprent it as.
- Nestea, due to getting wrongly informed about the contents of the interview, then goes ahead and says he'll crush Naniwa in the rematch, Naniwa finds out about this
- Naniwa wins the rematch 2-1, gives Nestea thumbs down, seeing how Nestea said he was going to "crush him".
Talk about blowing things way out of proportion.
Thank you for bringing some reasoning to this thread!
I just hope that all this bullshit doesn't affect nani's gameplay. I think he really has a chance to win this, and imo he truly deserves it. His work ethics are amazing.
On November 21 2011 00:25 Kimla wrote: Nestea played really bad and his fans are really angry kinda funny. Get over it.
No, I'm not a Nestea fan. I don't watch the GSL and I play as Terran, so don't even try to tell me I have some kind of "zerg bias". However, I like watching people who are respectful and talented at the same time and what Naniwa did yesterday was not respectful to Nestea. Period.
Why is it so hard for some people on this forum to understand that there are mature people in this community that don't want to see the kind of behaviour that Naniwa demonstrated yesterday?
That's fine but this has been blown out of proportion. People are calling him a cheater, saying he should be banned from MLG, game should be forfeit, artosis is misquoting him as having called nestea an idiot etc.
English is my 4th language yet I'd never make that mistake
I must be a genius :D
Seriously guys just let Nestea and Naniwa settle it on their own (well, I hope they do). If they can patch things up about the misunderstanding then I don't see why everyone else needs to keep raging
Hopefully this is a lesson learned for Naniwa: don't try to say anything potentially dangerous unless you're sure about what it might mean :p
I didn't think there was a lot of drama circulating this event other than people making it seem to be more than it really is. You can mistake what he said in the interview sure, but that isn't solid evidence to start a fit about it. (Wasn't this Artosis who started this?) Perhaps he's just MAD that Naniwa beat his favorite player TWICE? I could believe that.
Wow Reddit really bungled up again. I'm not gonna trust anymore comments from that site.
As many people have mentioned, I don't see what the big fuss about it was about.
For people who are hating on Naniwa: 1) Calling Nestea an idiot. (pretty sure this was down to english being his second language. He already apologized and said that this was not what he meant)
2) Going to the toilet when the game started/attempted cheating?? (he actually wanted to go before the game but the admins refused cause they were running late. in the end they were forced to let him go after the game had started)
3) Cheating by watching the replay of the previous unfinished game (you can see the build orders for the game in the score screen anyway, so it's not like he got any unfair advantage. also, nothing in the rules that prevents this)
4) Pausing the game after it started because he was told by an admin that map was only cross spawns (from what i've been reading it seems that Naniwa was pretty adamant that he was told cross spawns only, and the fact that MLG let the coach in to the booth during the pause after the game had started shows that he might've been right / although people may argue that Naniwa chose the wrong map and was trying to cover his tracks which could also be a valid point)
5) Letting the coach into the booth after 1 minute of the match had passed (allowed by MLG, apparently Sundance went into the booth as well)
7) Calling MLG a joke tournament (probably a heat of the moment thing. but i can understand how he feels considering 1) wasn't allowed to go to the toilet before the game 2) given wrong information about a map (if what he said was true). anyway he apologized for this as well)
8) Thumbs down (banter after Nestea told him he would beat him easily, misconstrued by many here)
I bet if this all happened during a Naniwa vs Idra match people wouldn't have made anything of all this. This all mainly stems from people for some reason not liking Naniwa and Nestea being viewed as the almighty GOD of SC2 (which i don't believe to be true)
So I was sitting in the front row of the main stage while this whole thing went down. Let me try to give some context.
BEFORE the ordeal with the map happened, another ordeal happened. I caught in the chat one of the players saying that they needed to use the W.C. before the match started (I don't know which one it was), to which the admin responded "no, we have to start now". Then RedB said "ask your admin" to which the admin in the chat responded "we're going now" and they immediately cut to the ads on the player screens.
At that point Artosis and Tasteless are still on the screen, but the match had started. Then Tasteless says something about "NaNiWa says he's going to pause the match.... we have to sort this out" - at which point I realized that it was NaNiWa that had to use the bathroom, and after about a minute of play (which was never put on the screen), paused the match. That's when they cut to the paused game in which there was OVER a minute of play time played. At this point, nobody really did anything, until the admins on stage realized that it was a horrible situation and they had to let him go to the bathroom (I get that they were late to start with... but it seems unreasonable to start a match when one of your players isn't ready because of time issues). That's when they cut away, NaNiWa left the booth (presumably to go to the bathroom). NesTea looks pretty pissed at this point (as pissed as you can imagine NesTea looking). The coach comes over to the booth and tells him he can go to the bathroom, and he's like but dude I'm already settled (I could tell because of his body language), and then finally agrees to go anyway.
They both get back and they decide to restart the match.
EXCEPT.
NaNiWa got back before NesTea (I believe), but in any case, he quickly pulled up the replay from the match before anybody could stop him. As soon as the official on the stage realized, he went into the booth to tell him to stop, but it was too late, NaNiWa had already seen the starting position of NesTea. This went largely unnoticed.
So they restart the match, and as soon as NaNiWa's scouting probe gets to the cross base and sees nothing there, he paused the game and said "?" "wrong map?". At this point one of the admins approaches the booth, but then he posts "admin told me cross only\", which was, in my opinion, very smart on his part, so that the audience knew what was going on and they couldn't just shut him up.
At this point he talks to the admin, and the admin immediately looks defeated. The admin then walks over and talks to a couple of other people. This is when Sundance arrived, and joined the conversation. The admins then talked to all of the other officials on the stage, presumably asking if anyone had told NaNiWa that the map should be cross positions.
This is where the story diverges. I think that one of two things happened.
(1) Somebody actually told him this but nobody would cop up to it. In NaNiWa's mind, seeing the spawn in the replay reaffirmed the "fact" that the official had told him earlier. (2) Nobody actually told him this, but since he saw the replay, he assumed it would be cross position again and was pissed when he realized his cheese wouldn't be as effective.
I could see the lead admin guy ask and look at all of the other officials on the stage, to which people were shaking their heads, as if everyone was agreeing that nobody told him this. At that point, the official went back in the booth to break the bad news to NaNiWa. NaNiWa was PISSED, visually repeating "NO, NO, NO!". It was apparent that he felt cheated, which I believe that he actually was. If he was told cross spawns, and it wasn't, that could seriously mess up your entire game, and in my opinion, the game should have been replayed.
After the official left, he typed the rest of the text, "joke tournament" and "give me a minute to rethink".
Here is why I think that option (1) is more likely.
The officials allowed NaNiWa's coach INTO THE PLAYER BOOTH with 1:47 on the clock and the game paused. The coach talked to NaNiWa for a minute or two before he left and shut the door. Then a few minutes later, gameplay resumed. Why would the officials let the coach in to re-strategize IN THE MIDDLE OF A MATCH if they didn't believe they were at fault?
This entire time, NesTea is sitting in his booth, looking defeated. At this point, it's over half an hour since the first attempt at this game had started, and he must not be in his proper mindset.
I feel really bad for both players, and for MLG. I feel bad for NesTea because he was put through this horrible ordeal, and the disruption in the normal flow likely contributed to the loss. I feel bad for NaNiWa, because I feel that he was told one thing about the spawns, and that he knew that MLG knew that they were wrong, and played anyway (regardless of the outcome.) And I feel bad for MLG because they were put into a tight spot... But they honestly could have avoided this two-fold. (1) Let him go to the bathroom when he requested before the countdown timer, and (2) if they felt that they were at fault (which I think is undeniable by the allowing the coach into the booth during the game), then they should have replayed the match.
Just my $.02
Holy shit those are some pretty serious accusations.
I'm waiting for an official statement from MLG to see what truly happened. This is clearly cheating but...he beat nestea again.
Have you even read any of this thread? Geezus, you can see the damn BO from the score screen as told multiply times. So both him and Nestea could see their opponent's BO. I don't know why Naniwa launched the replay (maybe for starting locations?) but the BO could just be read from the score screen.
Well, people in this community surely just love to hype up drama. The reply's to Naniwa's twitter just makes me feel like this community is surely slowly just going down the shitters. And how was it even possible this much drama came up ?
Cheated ? He watched a replay in beetwen games, could've watched the score screen and got as much info. BM ? Mabey a bit, sure, but not like he pissed on his grave. And lot's of other people in the community have done much and far more BM stuff.
Just let this now die out and get back to watch some amazing games and hope a foreigner wins this tournament.
On November 21 2011 00:50 dignitas.merz wrote: People seem to love drama so much, they read what they want and make anything into cheating. Believe me I'm the last person to defend Naniwa but you guys are taking it too fucking far.
- Even IF Nani was watching the replay of that regame (which could only have gone on for 1-2 minutes max) he saw nothing that he couldn't see by simply click the match history and check it there. If it's against the rules to check the replay after a game (I haven't read the rules) then I think it warrants a warning but not because he "cheated" he simply just broke a tournament rule.
- Watching the interview, I don't see how anyone can think Naniwa is calling Nestea an idiot. He's simply stating that he thinks that there are better ZvP:ers out there and that Nestea pulling his drones was an idiot move. Not that Nestea is a "bad idiot" that some people seem to interprent it as.
- Nestea, due to getting wrongly informed about the contents of the interview, then goes ahead and says he'll crush Naniwa in the rematch, Naniwa finds out about this
- Naniwa wins the rematch 2-1, gives Nestea thumbs down, seeing how Nestea said he was going to "crush him".
This thread is ridiculous. NesTea played quite poorly throughout this series and Naniwa capitalized on that poor play. I don't understand why players like Naniwa (who are not necessarily as popular as, say, Idra/MC) when they "BM" (Thumbs down? really?? you people need to get a grip on life) who specifically said they would CRUSH them in the next game.
Guess what, didn't happen, NesTea fanboys (Tastosis fanboys? Are they the same now? I love Tastosis but SC2 players are not "gods" yet). Naniwa beat MVP and then NesTea twice, how about admitting he's a truly good player before shitting all over him in true overdramatized fashion?
I really think the original post on this thread should be updated with the FACTs rather than spreading lies to extend this witch hunt for Naniwa..
What we know: - Naniwa is Swedish; and in Sweden (confirmed by 3-4 swedes here) saying "You're dumb" MEANS "That was a dumb move" in English. THEREFOR, This whole interview thing is an issue of translation error for phrases. Hes not saying Nestea is an idiot, just that pulling his drones was an idiotic move (which if you disagree with.. well..) - Naniwa did the thumbs down celebration as a reflection of Nestea saying he would CRUSH naniwa.. Naniwa responded, and had the right to stick it back in Nesteas face for starting the shit-talking. - Naniwa may have "watched the replay to find out the buildorder" - but that can be seen on the END SCREEN of EVERY GAME.. Nestea saw it too. And for the context, do we even know if Naniwa watched for the buildorder specifically? He watched to see that the map was cross-spawns (as he was told by admins) and theres no proof he was watching for Nestea's buildorder.. Point remains though, Nestea saw Naniwa's buildorder too. - Naniwa was not allowed to go use the washroom before the game because the admins told him he couldn't go. How is that fair for Naniwa? Would you like to play a game vs the best zerg in the world without the privilege of preparing before the game?
Naniwa is a bit BM but people are overreacting. I think the problem is that when he BMs he looks angry and serious, while when someone like MC BMs it's so goofy looking that people don't take it seriously.
I don't get why people are so pissed about the cross position thing, seeing as Naniwa went warp prism which is obviously better in close air. He wasn't trying to force cross positions because it would help him, it was obviously going to work against him. The only reason he did it was because he was told it was cross.
As i said in the first thread of the person trying to bash Naniwa...calling a move idiotic vs calling a player and idiot is VERY different...too bad Nestea was in the mind state of "REVENGE" or those games would have been even more interesting
On November 21 2011 00:57 nufcrulz wrote: Wow Reddit really bungled up again. I'm not gonna trust anymore comments from that site.
As many people have mentioned, I don't see what the big fuss about it was about.
For people who are hating on Naniwa: 1) Calling Nestea an idiot. (pretty sure this was down to english being his second language. He already apologized and said that this was not what he meant)
2) Going to the toilet when the game started/attempted cheating?? (he actually wanted to go before the game but the admins refused cause they were running late. in the end they were forced to let him go after the game had started)
3) Cheating by watching the replay of the previous unfinished game (you can see the build orders for the game in the score screen anyway, so it's not like he got any unfair advantage. also, nothing in the rules that prevents this)
4) Pausing the game after it started because he was told by an admin that map was only cross spawns (from what i've been reading it seems that Naniwa was pretty adamant that he was told cross spawns only, and the fact that MLG let the coach in to the booth during the pause after the game had started shows that he might've been right / although people may argue that Naniwa chose the wrong map and was trying to cover his tracks which could also be a valid point)
5) Letting the coach into the booth after 1 minute of the match had passed (allowed by MLG, apparently Sundance went into the booth as well)
7) Calling MLG a joke tournament (probably a heat of the moment thing. but i can understand how he feels considering 1) wasn't allowed to go to the toilet before the game 2) given wrong information about a map (if what he said was true). anyway he apologized for this as well)
8) Thumbs down (banter after Nestea told him he would beat him easily, misconstrued by many here)
I bet if this all happened during a Naniwa vs Idra match people wouldn't have made anything of all this. This all mainly stems from people for some reason not liking Naniwa and Nestea being viewed as the almighty GOD of SC2 (which i don't believe to be true)
I think this post (besides the last paragraph) should be edited into the first post, so people can have an UNBIASED view of what really happened. Or at least someone make a new thread explaining this to the people who only hear what Reddit says.
People need to hear the truth instead of the lies of Nestea fans trying to justify the loss of their hero.
To be clear, players were given ample opportunity to use the bathroom prior to the series starting (bathroom breaks are covered in our written rules). The bathroom requests had zero to do with the pausing after the initial restart, it was Naniwa thinking that the map was wrong due to not having forced cross spawns.
There's a major "Mountain out of Molehill" thing going here. The games didn't run smoothly and the issue of cheating is just laughable. Naniwa was the stronger player on the day and on the hour, and won. I don't think anyone can reasonably dispute that.
He said something a little silly, but you're dealing with two people who aren't fluent in English. Add in the Swedes' tendancy to be very frank and blunt with language and the Koreans' pride/emphasis on respect and yeah, its perhaps a little tender. Nestea had every right to feel annoyed at Naniwa's comment and even responded saying he was going to crush him.
He didn't.
So Naniwa is then fairly justified in giving Nestea a thumbs-down after that boast. I mean, if we're going to get anal over word usage, to imply you're going to crush someone makes it sound like a one-sided stomp. Guess Nestea got a bit humbled there.
Honestly this whole thing will be resolved when the parties involve meet face to face with a moment to talk outside of a competitive environment. Understand this: this is an incredibly high stress environment they are in. They aren't chatting around a pub table being all relaxed or talking over an internet forum. They're competing for thousands of dollars infront of thousands of people and at the very least we know Naniwa is incredibly emotionally invested in his games.
I think we know enough of Naniwa's character to know he respects Nestea, MVP, and all the top players. People are just... hunting for things to complain about. What saddens me the most perhaps is that this post will be lost in a sea of people either saying this is outrageous and Nani should be punished, or Nani is a child, or similar posts about how people are overreacting. Sometimes get the feeling that posting on this forum or reading half the threads isnt worth the time, its a hundred people shouting their opinion and reading nothing to the one person reading threads and thinking.
I'll finish with this:
On November 21 2011 00:29 Jibba wrote: Summary of 95% of SC2 drama: reddit is full of idiots
On November 21 2011 01:05 MLG_Adam wrote: To be clear, players were given ample opportunity to use the bathroom prior to the series starting (bathroom breaks are covered in our written rules). The bathroom requests had zero to do with the pausing after the initial restart, it was Naniwa thinking that the map was wrong due to not having forced cross spawns.
actually your admin lied to cover up his mistake of telling naniwa that it was cross spawn.
The whole idea of analysing every word everyone says for being "appropriate" is absolutely stupid. You really want every player to only say "i will practice hard and i respect my opnonent"? Why would you have any interviews then? People are supposed to have opinions on other players - that is the whole point of the ESPORTS, to see who is better!
As English is not my mother tongue, I do not have the right words to express, how much stupidity I have seen since I started to read about this "issue" . For the love of God, let the players say what do they relaly think! And the paramount of stupidity is mixing this with the issue whether Naniwa was cheating. It is completely unrelated! Chetaing is not better, if you talk politely meanwhile.
I am very sad that I see more and more of this shit about what players can or cannot say. Even worse is when people argue that it is somehow neccessary, if we want to make SC2 a real sport. What the fuck? The only real sport you can ever imagine is played by living zombies with no personalities? Maybe you should all join the business of professional offence taking, I have heard it is on the rise now!
I am really considering to stop reading TL at all. Most of the fun is already gone, having been replaced with fake seriousness.
On November 21 2011 01:05 MLG_Adam wrote: To be clear, players were given ample opportunity to use the bathroom prior to the series starting (bathroom breaks are covered in our written rules). The bathroom requests had zero to do with the pausing after the initial restart, it was Naniwa thinking that the map was wrong due to not having forced cross spawns.
actually your admin lied to cover up his mistake of telling naniwa that it was cross spawn.
To be clear, players were given ample opportunity to use the bathroom prior to the series starting (bathroom breaks are covered in our written rules). The bathroom requests had zero to do with the pausing after the initial restart, it was Naniwa thinking that the map was wrong due to not having forced cross spawns.
In SC2 a couple of games can take 1 hour or more, not allowing players to go to the bathroom is a bit overkill. Even in tennis you can ask for a 3 minute brake to go to the bathroom. Yes having a timetable is important, but you must allow players to have time too, do not forget, they are the stars.
Frankly, i have stopped to care about this kind of stuff. If i would be interested in who doesnt like whom and who said this and that i would read a boulevard paper or watch some cheap boulevard TV format, where i am informed why "Brangelina" are adopting another cild and where Britney and Paris where out last night. But i do not care at all and i imagined the sc2 community would neither care for such kinds of sensationalism about absurd scandals and gossip.
This is supposed to be an (E)-Sports and sports commentary and discussion should focus on matters of sport and not on gossiping around. Extensive reading of the MLG day 2 thread made me pretty ashamed of where we are apparently.
Well, I'm glad that naniwa won at least, even though there was the whole map issue. If this drama was caused even after he won I would hate to see the drama had he lost.
On November 20 2011 23:40 Kira__ wrote: no response to the cheat accusations?
Obiously cheating, but also MLGs fault for letting the situation happen. And it might not be the deciding factor.
It's not obviously cheating.. He went to the bathroom after being refused to go before the games started, viewing the replay gave him nothing that he didn't know from the score screen (and isn't against the rules), an MLG admin told him it was cross only therefore the pause and the confusion. I see nothing wrong. The "BM" thumbs down is seriously not anything you can even discuss.. Players do this all the time and it's fun and laughs, why is it different now?
ok. i reckon he cheated purely not because of watching the replay but taking breaks in a middle of a match and talking to your coach is extreamly suspicious and should NEVER be allowed. its a bit of a fuck up on mlg's part aswell. there was no reason to talk to his coach and if there was he should have done what every other player does and do it it before the game.
Frankly, i have stopped to care about this kind of stuff. If i would be interested in who doesnt like whom and who said this and that i would read a boulevard paper or watch some cheap boulevard TV format, where i am informed why "Brangelina" are adopting another cild and where Britney and Paris where out last night. But i do not care at all and i imagined the sc2 community would neither care for such kinds of sensationalism about absurd scandals and gossip.
This is supposed to be an (E)-Sports and sports commentary and discussion should focus on matters of sport and not on gossiping around. Extensive reading of the MLG day 2 thread made me pretty ashamed of where we are apparently.
To my opinion there is still a lot to do on the "growing up" front for the whole scene, especially on aspects of absurdly overmeasured fanboyism, balance/racial whining and the overall attitude of Sportsmanship.
On November 21 2011 01:09 Zalithian wrote: So MLG_Adam and Sundance have refuted Naniwa's claims, yet the majority will continue to believe Naniwa, shocking.
MLG_Adam and Sundance have cleared Naniwa lol, how can you possibly misinterpret that too?
After extensive investigation, review of the video files and 2011 Pro Circuit rules, we have determined that the replay had no impact on the tournament flow or the match results. Build orders are displayed at the end of a match on the stats screen. So the replay that was viewed would have revealed nothing the match stats page would not have revealed otherwise.
Additionally, to clarify, the Complexity manager was allowed in the booth, accompanied by MLG staff, after the match had started in order to keep the game in motion after a discrepancy with his player that would have impacted the continuation of the game. Moving forward, we will look at rules outlawing any replay views on a tournament PC
MLG_Adam and Sundance have cleared Naniwa lol, how can you possibly misinterpret that too?
On November 21 2011 01:04 Fandango wrote: Where's the investigation into the admin who told Naniwa it was cross positions only then later denied it when it turned out it wasn't?
The admin didn't tell him that, I know because I was standing right there. Why wouldn't a player playing in a National Championship know where the spawns were? He chose the map, it is his responsibility to know the intricacies involved.
There is responsibility on the players to know the settings they are competing on. The maps were not published the day of the event. - MLG_Adam
On November 21 2011 01:09 Zalithian wrote: So MLG_Adam and Sundance have refuted Naniwa's claims, yet the majority will continue to believe Naniwa, shocking.
The problem is that if we assume that one side is lying, which is not necesserily the case since it's possible that Naniwa/the admin heard/said wrong and didn't realise it, then both sides have good reasons to stick to their guns and say that they didn't fuck up, the fact that there's two people one side is irrelevant since they both have the same interest.
On November 21 2011 01:09 Zalithian wrote: So MLG_Adam and Sundance have refuted Naniwa's claims, yet the majority will continue to believe Naniwa, shocking.
You run the largest Non-GSL tournament in the world.. Are you going to ADMIT that you REFUSED someone to use the washroom before a game?
Of course not. They will never admit treating their players like that. That would get major backlash.
Its really sad how people are grasping at ridiculous straws to claim extreme BM and even to go as far as imply cheating from Naniwa's side. He's clarified himself far more than what was actually necessary, if you cant see after all he has said that there was absolutely no malicious intent from his side.. you're just hating for entirely subjective reasons, and thats fine, but do it without trying to color him a cheat and fabricate ridiculous scenarios where Naniwa goes to the toilet to forge evil schemes with his teammates and spectators, I mean seriously? What the fuck?
Grats Naniwa for amazing performances beating MVP and Nestea back to back, I hope your future success wont be diminished by childish drama.
On November 21 2011 01:04 Fandango wrote: Where's the investigation into the admin who told Naniwa it was cross positions only then later denied it when it turned out it wasn't?
The admin didn't tell him that, I know because I was standing right there. Why wouldn't a player playing in a National Championship know where the spawns were? He chose the map, it is his responsibility to know the intricacies involved.
There is responsibility on the players to know the settings they are competing on. The maps were not published the day of the event.
On November 21 2011 01:04 Fandango wrote: Where's the investigation into the admin who told Naniwa it was cross positions only then later denied it when it turned out it wasn't?
The admin didn't tell him that, I know because I was standing right there. Why wouldn't a player playing in a National Championship know where the spawns were? He chose the map, it is his responsibility to know the intricacies involved.
There is responsibility on the players to know the settings they are competing on. The maps were not published the day of the event.
On November 21 2011 01:04 Fandango wrote: Where's the investigation into the admin who told Naniwa it was cross positions only then later denied it when it turned out it wasn't?
The admin didn't tell him that, I know because I was standing right there. Why wouldn't a player playing in a National Championship know where the spawns were? He chose the map, it is his responsibility to know the intricacies involved.
There is responsibility on the players to know the settings they are competing on. The maps were not published the day of the event.
You didn't quote where he said that it was a misunderstanding, or the post where someone said that it says crossposition only on MLG web?
MLG_Adam and Sundance have cleared Naniwa lol, how can you possibly misinterpret that too?
On November 21 2011 01:04 Fandango wrote: Where's the investigation into the admin who told Naniwa it was cross positions only then later denied it when it turned out it wasn't?
The admin didn't tell him that, I know because I was standing right there. Why wouldn't a player playing in a National Championship know where the spawns were? He chose the map, it is his responsibility to know the intricacies involved.
There is responsibility on the players to know the settings they are competing on. The maps were not published the day of the event.
On November 21 2011 01:04 Fandango wrote: Where's the investigation into the admin who told Naniwa it was cross positions only then later denied it when it turned out it wasn't?
The admin didn't tell him that, I know because I was standing right there. Why wouldn't a player playing in a National Championship know where the spawns were? He chose the map, it is his responsibility to know the intricacies involved.
There is responsibility on the players to know the settings they are competing on. The maps were not published the day of the event.
On November 21 2011 01:04 Fandango wrote: Where's the investigation into the admin who told Naniwa it was cross positions only then later denied it when it turned out it wasn't?
The admin didn't tell him that, I know because I was standing right there. Why wouldn't a player playing in a National Championship know where the spawns were? He chose the map, it is his responsibility to know the intricacies involved.
There is responsibility on the players to know the settings they are competing on. The maps were not published the day of the event.
You didn't quote where he said that it was a misunderstanding, or the post where someone said that it says crossposition only on MLG web?
You mean this one, where the person admitted they were wrong?
MLG_Adam and Sundance have cleared Naniwa lol, how can you possibly misinterpret that too?
On November 21 2011 01:04 Fandango wrote: Where's the investigation into the admin who told Naniwa it was cross positions only then later denied it when it turned out it wasn't?
The admin didn't tell him that, I know because I was standing right there. Why wouldn't a player playing in a National Championship know where the spawns were? He chose the map, it is his responsibility to know the intricacies involved.
There is responsibility on the players to know the settings they are competing on. The maps were not published the day of the event.
On November 21 2011 01:04 Fandango wrote: Where's the investigation into the admin who told Naniwa it was cross positions only then later denied it when it turned out it wasn't?
The admin didn't tell him that, I know because I was standing right there. Why wouldn't a player playing in a National Championship know where the spawns were? He chose the map, it is his responsibility to know the intricacies involved.
There is responsibility on the players to know the settings they are competing on. The maps were not published the day of the event.
On November 21 2011 01:04 Fandango wrote: Where's the investigation into the admin who told Naniwa it was cross positions only then later denied it when it turned out it wasn't?
The admin didn't tell him that, I know because I was standing right there. Why wouldn't a player playing in a National Championship know where the spawns were? He chose the map, it is his responsibility to know the intricacies involved.
There is responsibility on the players to know the settings they are competing on. The maps were not published the day of the event.
You didn't quote where he said that it was a misunderstanding, or the post where someone said that it says crossposition only on MLG web?
The guy that said that about the maps was referring to Shattered Temple...not Shakuras, which is listed correctly.
Oh look, it's one of those threads with no useful discussion, people going back and forth around rumors, gossiping for absolutely no reason and creating a huge shitstorm for the smallest piece of news. People can't stop to find things that make them unhappy. This whole 'drama' thing going on every week on a different subject makes me puke, I just wish TL News section made a single thread for informing the TL netizens about something (a piece of news or a statement by someone) with a locked thread, and that would be it, no useless, pages long discussion about who is right or wrong or who is good or bad. If this issue is fixed, I think TL will be a better place. I'm tired of people creating drama out of their asses.
Theres one major fault I have to mention, and please tell me why this doesnt make sense..
You have MLG, the 2nd biggest tournament in the world.. Probably the biggest non-korean gaming organization being run in the world.. This is their 8th or so MLG for SC2, so its not like its new to them..
WHY IS THE PLAYER HOSTING THE MAP??
Does this make sense to anyone else? I haven't done much in SC2 tournaments, but for WC3 I used to be a manager and for every WC3L or other tournament we ran, when the player lost and chose his next map, he wasn't allowed to host, the admin always hosted. Now I realize this is different as in BW/WC3 the server gave a lag edge to the host, but still.. A player should NEVER be the one hosting a map, that way if there IS an issue with the wrong map being host, it should always fall on the shoulders of the admins of the game.
That just didnt make sense to me. Artosis or whoever was casting/streaming should always be the one hosting.
All in all, it was a miscommunication. Remember, Naniwa is not sure a pure English speaker. You'd have to remember that even us, there are many times when we here "There is no cross spawns" as "There is cross spawns" because sometimes the no is said too fast, or etc.
Coupled with the English translation, stuff can go bad pretty often.
What we can count on is this: Naniwa and Nestea played a game. Nestea might not've been at his best, nor Naniwa. The only thing we can conclude was that there was a pause, and Naniwa went to the bathroom. Also, you may look at replays in downtime for MLG.
Given these three facts, no one should be saying anything right now. I hate it when the internet fails MATH LOGIC 301.
On November 21 2011 01:20 Snowen wrote: Theres one major fault I have to mention, and please tell me why this doesnt make sense..
You have MLG, the 2nd biggest tournament in the world.. Probably the biggest non-korean gaming organization being run in the world.. This is their 8th or so MLG for SC2, so its not like its new to them..
WHY IS THE PLAYER HOSTING THE MAP??
Does this make sense to anyone else? I haven't done much in SC2 tournaments, but for WC3 I used to be a manager and for every WC3L or other tournament we ran, when the player lost and chose his next map, he wasn't allowed to host, the admin always hosted. Now I realize this is different as in BW/WC3 the server gave a lag edge to the host, but still.. A player should NEVER be the one hosting a map, that way if there IS an issue with the wrong map being host, it should always fall on the shoulders of the admins of the game.
That just didnt make sense to me. Artosis or whoever was casting/streaming should always be the one hosting.
Honestly, I fail to see how people can equate the numbers for build orders in the post-game, to literally EVERYTHING going on. His overlord scout patterns, his building positioning, all the intricacies of his early game, that are vital to know during a cannon rush. And in any case, can you think of any other reasoning for watching it other than trying to get an unfair advantage?
On November 21 2011 01:22 ScythedBlade wrote: All in all, it was a miscommunication. Remember, Naniwa is not sure a pure English speaker. You'd have to remember that even us, there are many times when we here "There is no cross spawns" as "There is cross spawns" because sometimes the no is said too fast, or etc.
Coupled with the English translation, stuff can go bad pretty often.
What we can count on is this: Naniwa and Nestea played a game. Nestea might not've been at his best, nor Naniwa. The only thing we can conclude was that there was a pause, and Naniwa went to the bathroom. Also, you may look at replays in downtime for MLG.
Given these three facts, no one should be saying anything right now. I hate it when the internet fails MATH LOGIC 301.
Exactly. I don't think anyone 'lied' here, I think it was a complete miscommunication.
On November 21 2011 01:20 Bleak wrote: Oh look, it's one of those threads with no useful discussion, people going back and forth around rumors, gossiping for absolutely no reason and creating a huge shitstorm for the smallest piece of news. People can't stop to find things that make them unhappy. This whole 'drama' thing going on every week on a different subject makes me puke, I just wish TL News section made a single thread for informing the TL netizens about something (a piece of news or a statement by someone) with a locked thread, and that would be it, no useless, pages long discussion about who is right or wrong or who is good or bad. If this issue is fixed, I think TL will be a better place. I'm tired of people creating drama out of their asses.
Exactly this. This whole discussion is ridiculous. Can´t we, as a community, stop this kinda nonsense and continue beeing a esports community as a whole?
TL should create create another banner with this silly elephant, like: Stop launching shitstorms for nothing, you are hurting Elly, the Esports Elephant
In the interview nani said he scouted 10pool on the game that had to be restarted, the restarted match was 15 hatch right? I don't get what all the fuzz about him watching the replay is...
On November 21 2011 01:20 Bleak wrote: Oh look, it's one of those threads with no useful discussion, people going back and forth around rumors, gossiping for absolutely no reason and creating a huge shitstorm for the smallest piece of news. People can't stop to find things that make them unhappy. This whole 'drama' thing going on every week on a different subject makes me puke, I just wish TL News section made a single thread for informing the TL netizens about something (a piece of news or a statement by someone) with a locked thread, and that would be it, no useless, pages long discussion about who is right or wrong or who is good or bad. If this issue is fixed, I think TL will be a better place. I'm tired of people creating drama out of their asses.
Exactly this. This whole discussion is ridiculous. Can´t we, as a community, stop this kinda nonsense and continue beeing a esports community as a whole?
But if we're all rational and reasonable, some of the witches might escape!
I can see where Naniwa got the miscommunication, as "cross-map" spawns sounds a lot like cross-position, but obviously is not. To a non native English speaker the difference may be missed entirely. Everyone needs to calm down.
EDIT: Just saw the other change in the changelog, I'm not completely stupid promise -.-
Just thought I`d repost this here to see if Adam wants to correct stuff that is wrong.
EDIT: Claryfying MLG Statement:
"After extensive investigation, review of the video files and 2011 Pro Circuit rules, we have determined that the replay had no impact on the tournament flow or the match results. Build orders are displayed at the end of a match on the stats screen. So the replay that was viewed would have revealed nothing the match stats page would not have revealed otherwise.
Additionally, to clarify, the Complexity manager was allowed in the booth, accompanied by MLG staff, after the match had started in order to keep the game in motion after a discrepancy with his player that would have impacted the continuation of the game. Moving forward, we will look at rules outlawing any replay views on a tournament PC"
Okay let us try to put this thing to an end. Here is some information I`ve gathered about the whole Nestea vs Naniwa situation. 1. Naniwa calling Nestea an idiot http://youtu.be/CQww0HmeoeU Naniwa did call Nestea an idiot. But he did it referencing one particular episode. He was referencing the episode where Nestea decided to pull his drones for an attack, but was only feinting and withdrew his drones before reaching Naniwas base. So he did call him an idiot, but there is a strong case for him simply trying to communicate that he thought that particular tactical move was idiotic .
Naniwa apologized for this later: "I must have formulated myself badly in the interviews I did not mean to call nestea bad. Or. An idiot watch next col iview. . " https://twitter.com/#!/CoLNaniwa
2. The first attempt at playing game 3 This is what I`ve gathered: Naniwa needed to go to the toilet after game 2. He asked the admins to go. This is allowed in the rules but the decision is up to the admin. Apparently the admin said no, and the game was started.
But without the admin knowing the stream had in the meantime started showing an ad. So the start of the game was not shown. At some point the game was paused.
Then it was decided that the game would be restarted, and the players would get a chance to go to the toilet before starting the game over.
"Basically in game 3, the map was Shak. The game was begun before the stream was out of commercial which meant they had to stop and re-enter the game again."
Reddit witness account: "I caught in the chat one of the players saying that they needed to use the W.C. before the match started (I don't know which one it was), to which the admin responded "no, we have to start now". Then RedB said "ask your admin" to which the admin in the chat responded "we're going now" and they immediately cut to the ads on the player screens. At that point Artosis and Tasteless are still on the screen, but the match had started. Then Tasteless says something about "NaNiWa says he's going to pause the match.... we have to sort this out" - at which point I realized that it was NaNiWa that had to use the bathroom, and after about a minute of play (which was never put on the screen), paused the match. That's when they cut to the paused game in which there was OVER a minute of play time played. At this point, nobody really did anything, until the admins on stage realized that it was a horrible situation and they had to let him go to the bathroom (I get that they were late to start with... but it seems unreasonable to start a match when one of your players isn't ready because of time issues). That's when they cut away, NaNiWa left the booth (presumably to go to the bathroom). "
2. The replay incident After going to the toilet Naniwa is said to have loaded up the replay of the game that was aborted. (This is known because his screen apparently was shown on a large screen visible to the audience) This is not strictly against MLG rules and he could already see the build order on the game ending screen. An Admin went into his booth and told him to stop. At this point Naniwa had already seen Nestea`s build.
MLG statement "After extensive investigation, review of the video files and 2011 Pro Circuit rules, we have determined that the replay had no impact on the tournament flow or the match results. Build orders are displayed at the end of a match on the stats screen. So the replay that was viewed would have revealed nothing the match stats page would not have revealed otherwise.
Redditt witness: "NaNiWa got back before NesTea (I believe), but in any case, he quickly pulled up the replay from the match before anybody could stop him. As soon as the official on the stage realized, he went into the booth to tell him to stop, but it was too late, NaNiWa had already seen the starting position of NesTea."
3. The second attempt at playing game 3 After quite some time game 3 was remade and they started playing. Naniwa moved a probe across the map (thinking for some reason that the map was cross positions only) and when he got to where he assumed Nestea would be (but was not) he paused the game. Some background here: Earlier MLG events used to have this map be only cross positions. This has later been changed and now adheres to the Blizzard ladder versions rules to positions.
Then this happened: Naniwa reacted strongly and claimed that a admin had said to him that the map was cross positions only. According to Sundance this was not correct:
"He made a mistake then claimed it was the ref.Hhe picked before our admin even went into the booth. Some maps have crosses some do not. He chose one thinking that it was a cross position map when it wasn't. Not a big deal in the end but annoying none the less."
So here we have two different versions of what went down.
4. The "Coach" incident Apparently to calm the situation down and to make Naniwa ready to continue playing, MLG staff allowed the Player Manager (Not Coach) of Complexity gaming, Scott Ford to enter Naniwa`s booth. He was there to relay what MLG had decided. No regame and that it was his fault I can only assume. Then after a while the game was restarted.
MLG Statement about the incident: "Additionally, to clarify, the Complexity manager was allowed in the booth, accompanied by MLG staff, after the match had started in order to keep the game in motion after a discrepancy with his player that would have impacted the continuation of the game."
Reddit Eye witness: "I could see the lead admin guy ask and look at all of the other officials on the stage, to which people were shaking their heads, as if everyone was agreeing that nobody told him this. At that point, the official went back in the booth to break the bad news to NaNiWa. NaNiWa was PISSED, visually repeating "NO, NO, NO!". It was apparent that he felt cheated, which I believe that he actually was. If he was told cross spawns, and it wasn't, that could seriously mess up your entire game, and in my opinion, the game should have been replayed."
5. Naniwa being punished by MLG. MLG have two different rulesets that applies to these kind of situations. You have the event rules, and the conduct rules.
Naniwa did break the pause game rules. He paused the game without asking the referee. This gets you a WARNING. A WARNING is largely inconsequential. It only matters if you get more warnings and may lose you the game you are playing. They do not stay with the player throughout the event.
"Each subsequent Warning that a Player receives will result in a Forfeit of the Game"
Slasher at first said that Naniwa got a technical foul from his quotes. He later withdrew that statement. https://twitter.com/#!/SLASHER
At this point Naniwa has not gotten a technical foul but should at least by the rules have gotten a warning, that does not really matter for later matches. He may get a technical foul for calling MLG a joke tournament and for the thumbs down ceremony. It is worth noting that many other ceremonies and statements of similiar character has gone unpunished at earlier MLG events and in this one.
I really didn't like Nani before, but he's grown a lot and it would have saddened me if he'd reverted to.. you know, that. So I'm happy this got cleared up, for those of us who don't need drama everywhere anyways. For those of you who do.. srsly.. ><
Hope it doesn't affect the rest of his tournament.
On November 21 2011 01:20 Snowen wrote: Theres one major fault I have to mention, and please tell me why this doesnt make sense..
You have MLG, the 2nd biggest tournament in the world.. Probably the biggest non-korean gaming organization being run in the world.. This is their 8th or so MLG for SC2, so its not like its new to them..
WHY IS THE PLAYER HOSTING THE MAP??
Does this make sense to anyone else? I haven't done much in SC2 tournaments, but for WC3 I used to be a manager and for every WC3L or other tournament we ran, when the player lost and chose his next map, he wasn't allowed to host, the admin always hosted. Now I realize this is different as in BW/WC3 the server gave a lag edge to the host, but still.. A player should NEVER be the one hosting a map, that way if there IS an issue with the wrong map being host, it should always fall on the shoulders of the admins of the game.
That just didnt make sense to me. Artosis or whoever was casting/streaming should always be the one hosting.
Players select the map, not host.
You misunderstood what I meant.. Of course players choose what map they want to play on.. By why are they hosting??
In just about every tournament I have been involved with; after the game for example After Naniwa lost, he would msg the admin saying "Shakuras next" and the admin would make the game and invite the two players.
That way its fair for everyone. Who is to say some MLG someone will have a map with fixed spawn position cheats or something happening if he makes the game?
I just dont see the point in accusing a professional player as a cheater. Its the most disrespectful thing to say and also its unfunded.
Without at least very good supporting evidence, there isnt even a case here. Perhaps there where some mistakes, but I highly doubt that it has affected the games in such amazing big ways that it gave naniwa the clear edge. If anything, the situation probably shaked both players up a bit and threw them both off-game.
As someone else said before me: stop the shitstorm, there is no use in accusing players of anything where you have NO facts because you weren't there.
GL HF watching MLG, I do and still will! Ty for doing this for us, the community!
On November 21 2011 01:32 Grend wrote: Just thought I`d repost this here to see if Adam wants to correct stuff that is wrong.
EDIT: Claryfying MLG Statement:
"After extensive investigation, review of the video files and 2011 Pro Circuit rules, we have determined that the replay had no impact on the tournament flow or the match results. Build orders are displayed at the end of a match on the stats screen. So the replay that was viewed would have revealed nothing the match stats page would not have revealed otherwise.
Additionally, to clarify, the Complexity manager was allowed in the booth, accompanied by MLG staff, after the match had started in order to keep the game in motion after a discrepancy with his player that would have impacted the continuation of the game. Moving forward, we will look at rules outlawing any replay views on a tournament PC"
Okay let us try to put this thing to an end. Here is some information I`ve gathered about the whole Nestea vs Naniwa situation. 1. Naniwa calling Nestea an idiot http://youtu.be/CQww0HmeoeU Naniwa did call Nestea an idiot. But he did it referencing one particular episode. He was referencing the episode where Nestea decided to pull his drones for an attack, but was only feinting and withdrew his drones before reaching Naniwas base. So he did call him an idiot, but there is a strong case for him simply trying to communicate that he thought that particular tactical move was idiotic .
Naniwa apologized for this later: "I must have formulated myself badly in the interviews I did not mean to call nestea bad. Or. An idiot watch next col iview. . " https://twitter.com/#!/CoLNaniwa
2. The first attempt at playing game 3 This is what I`ve gathered: Naniwa needed to go to the toilet after game 2. He asked the admins to go. This is allowed in the rules but the decision is up to the admin. Apparently the admin said no, and the game was started.
But without the admin knowing the stream had in the meantime started showing an ad. So the start of the game was not shown. At some point the game was paused.
Then it was decided that the game would be restarted, and the players would get a chance to go to the toilet before starting the game over.
"Basically in game 3, the map was Shak. The game was begun before the stream was out of commercial which meant they had to stop and re-enter the game again."
Reddit witness account: "I caught in the chat one of the players saying that they needed to use the W.C. before the match started (I don't know which one it was), to which the admin responded "no, we have to start now". Then RedB said "ask your admin" to which the admin in the chat responded "we're going now" and they immediately cut to the ads on the player screens. At that point Artosis and Tasteless are still on the screen, but the match had started. Then Tasteless says something about "NaNiWa says he's going to pause the match.... we have to sort this out" - at which point I realized that it was NaNiWa that had to use the bathroom, and after about a minute of play (which was never put on the screen), paused the match. That's when they cut to the paused game in which there was OVER a minute of play time played. At this point, nobody really did anything, until the admins on stage realized that it was a horrible situation and they had to let him go to the bathroom (I get that they were late to start with... but it seems unreasonable to start a match when one of your players isn't ready because of time issues). That's when they cut away, NaNiWa left the booth (presumably to go to the bathroom). "
2. The replay incident After going to the toilet Naniwa is said to have loaded up the replay of the game that was aborted. (This is known because his screen apparently was shown on a large screen visible to the audience) This is not strictly against MLG rules and he could already see the build order on the game ending screen. An Admin went into his booth and told him to stop. At this point Naniwa had already seen Nestea`s build.
MLG statement "After extensive investigation, review of the video files and 2011 Pro Circuit rules, we have determined that the replay had no impact on the tournament flow or the match results. Build orders are displayed at the end of a match on the stats screen. So the replay that was viewed would have revealed nothing the match stats page would not have revealed otherwise.
Redditt witness: "NaNiWa got back before NesTea (I believe), but in any case, he quickly pulled up the replay from the match before anybody could stop him. As soon as the official on the stage realized, he went into the booth to tell him to stop, but it was too late, NaNiWa had already seen the starting position of NesTea."
3. The second attempt at playing game 3 After quite some time game 3 was remade and they started playing. Naniwa moved a probe across the map (thinking for some reason that the map was cross positions only) and when he got to where he assumed Nestea would be (but was not) he paused the game. Some background here: Earlier MLG events used to have this map be only cross positions. This has later been changed and now adheres to the Blizzard ladder versions rules to positions.
Then this happened: Naniwa reacted strongly and claimed that a admin had said to him that the map was cross positions only. According to Sundance this was not correct:
"He made a mistake then claimed it was the ref.Hhe picked before our admin even went into the booth. Some maps have crosses some do not. He chose one thinking that it was a cross position map when it wasn't. Not a big deal in the end but annoying none the less."
So here we have two different versions of what went down.
4. The "Coach" incident Apparently to calm the situation down and to make Naniwa ready to continue playing, MLG staff allowed the Player Manager (Not Coach) of Complexity gaming, Scott Ford to enter Naniwa`s booth. He was there to relay what MLG had decided. No regame and that it was his fault I can only assume. Then after a while the game was restarted.
MLG Statement about the incident: "Additionally, to clarify, the Complexity manager was allowed in the booth, accompanied by MLG staff, after the match had started in order to keep the game in motion after a discrepancy with his player that would have impacted the continuation of the game."
Reddit Eye witness: "I could see the lead admin guy ask and look at all of the other officials on the stage, to which people were shaking their heads, as if everyone was agreeing that nobody told him this. At that point, the official went back in the booth to break the bad news to NaNiWa. NaNiWa was PISSED, visually repeating "NO, NO, NO!". It was apparent that he felt cheated, which I believe that he actually was. If he was told cross spawns, and it wasn't, that could seriously mess up your entire game, and in my opinion, the game should have been replayed."
5. Naniwa being punished by MLG. MLG have two different rulesets that applies to these kind of situations. You have the event rules, and the conduct rules.
Naniwa did break the pause game rules. He paused the game without asking the referee. This gets you a WARNING. A WARNING is largely inconsequential. It only matters if you get more warnings and may lose you the game you are playing. They do not stay with the player throughout the event.
"Each subsequent Warning that a Player receives will result in a Forfeit of the Game"
Slasher at first said that Naniwa got a technical foul from his quotes. He later withdrew that statement. https://twitter.com/#!/SLASHER
At this point Naniwa has not gotten a technical foul but should at least by the rules have gotten a warning, that does not really matter for later matches. He may get a technical foul for calling MLG a joke tournament and for the thumbs down ceremony. It is worth noting that many other ceremonies and statements of similiar character has gone unpunished at earlier MLG events and in this one.
#2 The first attempt at playing game 3
The game was mistakenly started by the casters while the admin was still in the booth talking to players. Nestea was taken off guard, had to rush back to get his keyboard (etc) ready. It was a false start one could say and the commissioner decided to restart so both players had a fair and even start.
3. The second attempt at playing game 3
Naniwa misunderstood the admin (complete miscommunication that I personally attribute to the language barrier). The game was paused as Naniwa refused to play.
4. The "Coach" incident
I personally went to the crowd and got Scott and escorted him to the booth. Why? Naniwa was about to be DQ'd for refusing to play due to the miscommunication. I stood there as Scott told him he had to play.
5.
Naniwa did receive a technical for various infractions.
On November 21 2011 01:20 Snowen wrote: Theres one major fault I have to mention, and please tell me why this doesnt make sense..
You have MLG, the 2nd biggest tournament in the world.. Probably the biggest non-korean gaming organization being run in the world.. This is their 8th or so MLG for SC2, so its not like its new to them..
WHY IS THE PLAYER HOSTING THE MAP??
Does this make sense to anyone else? I haven't done much in SC2 tournaments, but for WC3 I used to be a manager and for every WC3L or other tournament we ran, when the player lost and chose his next map, he wasn't allowed to host, the admin always hosted. Now I realize this is different as in BW/WC3 the server gave a lag edge to the host, but still.. A player should NEVER be the one hosting a map, that way if there IS an issue with the wrong map being host, it should always fall on the shoulders of the admins of the game.
That just didnt make sense to me. Artosis or whoever was casting/streaming should always be the one hosting.
Players select the map, not host.
You misunderstood what I meant.. Of course players choose what map they want to play on.. By why are they hosting??
In just about every tournament I have been involved with; after the game for example After Naniwa lost, he would msg the admin saying "Shakuras next" and the admin would make the game and invite the two players.
That way its fair for everyone. Who is to say some MLG someone will have a map with fixed spawn position cheats or something happening if he makes the game?
Naniwa is playing good, even if he's BM. We can't defend Nestea just because he has 3 GSL titles and Tastosis calls him a God. Nestea lost 2 Bo3's and nothing in his playstyle suggested he was the better player...
It´s a shame that MLG has to send a guy ( thx adam for sorting this out) to stop this kind of shitstorm. It´s like in Kindergarten, when a Nanny has to come, coz you can´t decide who had the toy in the first place. -.-
On November 21 2011 01:20 Snowen wrote: Theres one major fault I have to mention, and please tell me why this doesnt make sense..
You have MLG, the 2nd biggest tournament in the world.. Probably the biggest non-korean gaming organization being run in the world.. This is their 8th or so MLG for SC2, so its not like its new to them..
WHY IS THE PLAYER HOSTING THE MAP??
Does this make sense to anyone else? I haven't done much in SC2 tournaments, but for WC3 I used to be a manager and for every WC3L or other tournament we ran, when the player lost and chose his next map, he wasn't allowed to host, the admin always hosted. Now I realize this is different as in BW/WC3 the server gave a lag edge to the host, but still.. A player should NEVER be the one hosting a map, that way if there IS an issue with the wrong map being host, it should always fall on the shoulders of the admins of the game.
That just didnt make sense to me. Artosis or whoever was casting/streaming should always be the one hosting.
Players select the map, not host.
You misunderstood what I meant.. Of course players choose what map they want to play on.. By why are they hosting??
In just about every tournament I have been involved with; after the game for example After Naniwa lost, he would msg the admin saying "Shakuras next" and the admin would make the game and invite the two players.
That way its fair for everyone. Who is to say some MLG someone will have a map with fixed spawn position cheats or something happening if he makes the game?
He didn't host it...
Then why is MLG trying to blame Naniwa when he was told the map was cross-position, and your admins host a map that doesn't have cross-position?
Im just trying to understand why Naniwa is blamed for this..
I thought this thread was initially going to be about all the drama he caused for not knowing that shakuras wasn't cross spawns only.
NVM reading all the comments it does actually seem to be what this is about. Honestly though, I believe this is sort of a global confustion. Everyone in the crowd was telling me that all maps were close spawns well before this series was underway. I thought they were wrong as it makes no sense for shak to be cross spawns only but a lot of fans seemed to be insistent on that. Maybe one of the MLG girls by the brackets was saying something different? Or mass idiocy, i dunno
On November 21 2011 01:45 Darkmatter799 wrote: Naniwa is the foreigner beast guys who cares lol
Naniwa cares, you can see it from his tweets, i just hope the hate will not influence his games today.
i think its more that complexity cares, wouldnt want to have negative pr ruin the image of ur star player and ur team now would we
I didn't know you live in Naniwa's heart to know how he feels...........
English isn't even his 1st language and he was obviously talking about a specific incident of the drone pulling. You've been shitting on Naniwa all day, maybe put your personal grudge aside or something dude.
On November 21 2011 01:45 Darkmatter799 wrote: Naniwa is the foreigner beast guys who cares lol
Naniwa cares, you can see it from his tweets, i just hope the hate will not influence his games today.
i think its more that complexity cares, wouldnt want to have negative pr ruin the image of ur star player and ur team now would we
I didn't know you live in Naniwa's heart to know how he feels...........
English isn't even his 1st language and he was obviously talking about a specific incident of the drone pulling. You've been shitting on Naniwa all day, maybe put your personal grudge aside or something dude.
i think i know naniwa better than u bro, if only i was low enought to tell u all the storys that ive heard about him
On November 21 2011 01:45 Darkmatter799 wrote: Naniwa is the foreigner beast guys who cares lol
Naniwa cares, you can see it from his tweets, i just hope the hate will not influence his games today.
i think its more that complexity cares, wouldnt want to have negative pr ruin the image of ur star player and ur team now would we
I didn't know you live in Naniwa's heart to know how he feels...........
English isn't even his 1st language and he was obviously talking about a specific incident of the drone pulling. You've been shitting on Naniwa all day, maybe put your personal grudge aside or something dude.
i think i know naniwa better than u bro
I never claimed to know Naniwa, so I don't assume stupid shit about him and give him the benefit of the doubt. You know, just like how I don't assume that TT1 is still a hacker and should be disqualified from tourneys because he hacked once in the past.
On November 21 2011 01:45 Darkmatter799 wrote: Naniwa is the foreigner beast guys who cares lol
Naniwa cares, you can see it from his tweets, i just hope the hate will not influence his games today.
i think its more that complexity cares, wouldnt want to have negative pr ruin the image of ur star player and ur team now would we
I didn't know you live in Naniwa's heart to know how he feels...........
English isn't even his 1st language and he was obviously talking about a specific incident of the drone pulling. You've been shitting on Naniwa all day, maybe put your personal grudge aside or something dude.
i think i know naniwa better than u bro, if only i was low enought to tell u all the storys that ive heard about him
Ok, so you don't know him, you have heard about him. The good old pro player gossip hotline is still operational I see.
But you are right, don't think Nani is very disturbed over all this drama over someones fantasy reddit post.
On November 21 2011 01:45 Darkmatter799 wrote: Naniwa is the foreigner beast guys who cares lol
Naniwa cares, you can see it from his tweets, i just hope the hate will not influence his games today.
i think its more that complexity cares, wouldnt want to have negative pr ruin the image of ur star player and ur team now would we
I didn't know you live in Naniwa's heart to know how he feels...........
English isn't even his 1st language and he was obviously talking about a specific incident of the drone pulling. You've been shitting on Naniwa all day, maybe put your personal grudge aside or something dude.
i think i know naniwa better than u bro
I never claimed to know Naniwa, so I don't assume stupid shit about him and give him the benefit of the doubt. You know, just like how I don't assume that TT1 is still a hacker and should be disqualified from tourneys because he hacked once in the past.
Dude, no reason for you to go there... Low blow, almost every SC1 player was caught doing stupid shit at some point, including myself, you cant use that as an argument for shit
On November 21 2011 01:45 Darkmatter799 wrote: Naniwa is the foreigner beast guys who cares lol
Naniwa cares, you can see it from his tweets, i just hope the hate will not influence his games today.
i think its more that complexity cares, wouldnt want to have negative pr ruin the image of ur star player and ur team now would we
I didn't know you live in Naniwa's heart to know how he feels...........
English isn't even his 1st language and he was obviously talking about a specific incident of the drone pulling. You've been shitting on Naniwa all day, maybe put your personal grudge aside or something dude.
i think i know naniwa better than u bro
I never claimed to know Naniwa, so I don't assume stupid shit about him and give him the benefit of the doubt. You know, just like how I don't assume that TT1 is still a hacker and should be disqualified from tourneys because he hacked once in the past.
Dude, no reason for you to go there... Low blow, almost every SC1 player was caught doing stupid shit at some point, including myself, you cant use that as an argument for shit
On November 21 2011 01:45 Darkmatter799 wrote: Naniwa is the foreigner beast guys who cares lol
Naniwa cares, you can see it from his tweets, i just hope the hate will not influence his games today.
i think its more that complexity cares, wouldnt want to have negative pr ruin the image of ur star player and ur team now would we
I didn't know you live in Naniwa's heart to know how he feels...........
English isn't even his 1st language and he was obviously talking about a specific incident of the drone pulling. You've been shitting on Naniwa all day, maybe put your personal grudge aside or something dude.
i think i know naniwa better than u bro, if only i was low enought to tell u all the storys that ive heard about him
now you're just making an idiot out of yourself, for the love of god lay off this thing
On November 21 2011 01:45 Darkmatter799 wrote: Naniwa is the foreigner beast guys who cares lol
Naniwa cares, you can see it from his tweets, i just hope the hate will not influence his games today.
i think its more that complexity cares, wouldnt want to have negative pr ruin the image of ur star player and ur team now would we
I didn't know you live in Naniwa's heart to know how he feels...........
English isn't even his 1st language and he was obviously talking about a specific incident of the drone pulling. You've been shitting on Naniwa all day, maybe put your personal grudge aside or something dude.
i think i know naniwa better than u bro, if only i was low enought to tell u all the storys that ive heard about him
Ok, so you don't know him, you have heard about him. The good old pro player gossip hotline is still operational I see.
But you are right, don't think Nani is very disturbed over all this drama over someones fantasy reddit post.
I'm sure he is affected by the massive backlash over his actions (the largest thread over there is railing against him), the technical he has received, the near disqualification for pausing against the rules, and the fact instead of his victory being celebrated he has to defend his BM. This should've been an epic weekend for him and he tossed it away.
On November 21 2011 01:45 Darkmatter799 wrote: Naniwa is the foreigner beast guys who cares lol
Naniwa cares, you can see it from his tweets, i just hope the hate will not influence his games today.
i think its more that complexity cares, wouldnt want to have negative pr ruin the image of ur star player and ur team now would we
I didn't know you live in Naniwa's heart to know how he feels...........
English isn't even his 1st language and he was obviously talking about a specific incident of the drone pulling. You've been shitting on Naniwa all day, maybe put your personal grudge aside or something dude.
i think i know naniwa better than u bro, if only i was low enought to tell u all the storys that ive heard about him
You claim to know him and then proceed to more or less say that your thoughts about naniwa are based on stories you've heard. Great things, to rely on hearsay
On November 21 2011 01:45 Darkmatter799 wrote: Naniwa is the foreigner beast guys who cares lol
Naniwa cares, you can see it from his tweets, i just hope the hate will not influence his games today.
i think its more that complexity cares, wouldnt want to have negative pr ruin the image of ur star player and ur team now would we
I didn't know you live in Naniwa's heart to know how he feels...........
English isn't even his 1st language and he was obviously talking about a specific incident of the drone pulling. You've been shitting on Naniwa all day, maybe put your personal grudge aside or something dude.
i think i know naniwa better than u bro, if only i was low enought to tell u all the storys that ive heard about him
now you're just making an idiot out of yourself, for the love of god lay off this thing
On November 21 2011 01:45 Darkmatter799 wrote: Naniwa is the foreigner beast guys who cares lol
Naniwa cares, you can see it from his tweets, i just hope the hate will not influence his games today.
i think its more that complexity cares, wouldnt want to have negative pr ruin the image of ur star player and ur team now would we
I didn't know you live in Naniwa's heart to know how he feels...........
English isn't even his 1st language and he was obviously talking about a specific incident of the drone pulling. You've been shitting on Naniwa all day, maybe put your personal grudge aside or something dude.
i think i know naniwa better than u bro, if only i was low enought to tell u all the storys that ive heard about him
You claim to know him and then proceed to more or less say that your thoughts about naniwa are based on stories you've heard. Great things, to rely on hearsay
If you read the Naniwa threads where he has left teams or even watch a lot of his interviews, you'd realize he is a very... aggressive person. That isn't really a bad thing, but I don't think he really cares about what happened with Nestea as much as his team does.
Edit: Both of you are from Sweden so I don't know if it is just blind fandom but Naniwa isn't the most polite or nice guy.
Even his original interview after the global invitational matches against MVP and Nestea, was completely fine. People clearly blew it out of proportion.
He didn't call nestea an idiot, he called the DECISION in g3 of GI match a dumb decision.
Stinks that Naniwa has to apologize for what he did.. BM happens in pro sports all the time, i think its time for people to get over it. He shouldnt have to apologize for doing a 'thumbs down'. MC does it all the time and hes not flamed for it, get over it little children.
On November 21 2011 02:16 wei2coolman wrote: Even his original interview after the global invitational matches against MVP and Nestea, was completely fine. People clearly blew it out of proportion.
He didn't call nestea an idiot, he called the DECISION in g3 of GI match a dumb decision.
Gosh, people are so fail sometimes.
"i though he was a genius but hes just an idiot", how can anyone misinterpret this line?
On November 21 2011 02:16 wei2coolman wrote: He didn't call nestea an idiot, he called the DECISION in g3 of GI match a dumb decision.
How is a idea an idiot? How is an action an idiot? Idiot refers to a person. You even had to change the words to fit your explanation. What's more is unless he was stating that drone pull is genius and not Nestea, then he indeed insulted Nestea.
On November 21 2011 02:16 wei2coolman wrote: Even his original interview after the global invitational matches against MVP and Nestea, was completely fine. People clearly blew it out of proportion.
He didn't call nestea an idiot, he called the DECISION in g3 of GI match a dumb decision.
Gosh, people are so fail sometimes.
"i though he was a genius but hes just an idiot", how can anyone misinterpret this line?
Are you swedish? You do realize that phrases in Sweden MAY be different than US? Three or Four swedish people came and posted in this thread that the saying "hes just an idiot" has a completely different meaning in Sweden.
USA isn't the center of the universe, believe it or not.
I'd love to hear you make a statement in Korean and then when a native Korean speaker says you misused a phrase, how you would defend yourself.
On November 21 2011 02:16 wei2coolman wrote: Even his original interview after the global invitational matches against MVP and Nestea, was completely fine. People clearly blew it out of proportion.
He didn't call nestea an idiot, he called the DECISION in g3 of GI match a dumb decision.
Gosh, people are so fail sometimes.
"i though he was a genius but hes just an idiot", how can anyone misinterpret this line?
Hyperbole. 99% of the world does it when calling people idiots.
On November 21 2011 02:16 wei2coolman wrote: Even his original interview after the global invitational matches against MVP and Nestea, was completely fine. People clearly blew it out of proportion.
He didn't call nestea an idiot, he called the DECISION in g3 of GI match a dumb decision.
Gosh, people are so fail sometimes.
"i though he was a genius but hes just an idiot", how can anyone misinterpret this line?
On November 21 2011 02:16 wei2coolman wrote: Even his original interview after the global invitational matches against MVP and Nestea, was completely fine. People clearly blew it out of proportion.
He didn't call nestea an idiot, he called the DECISION in g3 of GI match a dumb decision.
Gosh, people are so fail sometimes.
"i though he was a genius but hes just an idiot", how can anyone misinterpret this line?
By listening to the entire interview?
The same interview where he said MVP and Nestea were easy, and he didn't expect Nestea to advance far?
On November 21 2011 02:16 wei2coolman wrote: Even his original interview after the global invitational matches against MVP and Nestea, was completely fine. People clearly blew it out of proportion.
He didn't call nestea an idiot, he called the DECISION in g3 of GI match a dumb decision.
Gosh, people are so fail sometimes.
"i though he was a genius but hes just an idiot", how can anyone misinterpret this line?
By listening to the entire interview?
The same interview where he said MVP and Nestea were easy, and he didn't expect Nestea to advance far?
lulz.
Yes, that very one, what's the problem with him stating an opinion and prediction and being wrong about the prediction, Artosis dosen't get shit on for wrong predictions.
i guess we have different views about the situation, i dont wanna push the issue too much but i disagree with wat u guys are saying.. ill leave it at that
On November 21 2011 02:16 wei2coolman wrote: Even his original interview after the global invitational matches against MVP and Nestea, was completely fine. People clearly blew it out of proportion.
He didn't call nestea an idiot, he called the DECISION in g3 of GI match a dumb decision.
Gosh, people are so fail sometimes.
"i though he was a genius but hes just an idiot", how can anyone misinterpret this line?
By listening to the entire interview?
The same interview where he said MVP and Nestea were easy, and he didn't expect Nestea to advance far?
lulz.
So when Idra says that Cruncher would be easy and then loses, what is that? When he calls him fat in NASL what is that? It's rude, but it's not worth a witch hunt.
On November 21 2011 02:16 wei2coolman wrote: Even his original interview after the global invitational matches against MVP and Nestea, was completely fine. People clearly blew it out of proportion.
He didn't call nestea an idiot, he called the DECISION in g3 of GI match a dumb decision.
Gosh, people are so fail sometimes.
"i though he was a genius but hes just an idiot", how can anyone misinterpret this line?
Are you swedish? You do realize that phrases in Sweden MAY be different than US? Three or Four swedish people came and posted in this thread that the saying "hes just an idiot" has a completely different meaning in Sweden.
USA isn't the center of the universe, believe it or not.
I'd love to hear you make a statement in Korean and then when a native Korean speaker says you misused a phrase, how you would defend yourself.
Coming from a guy with a history of insulting people, words that translate into "I think you are lacking in mental capability" are pretty clear cut. But please, try to insinuate that saying someone is stupid totally wasn't insulting.
On November 21 2011 02:16 wei2coolman wrote: Even his original interview after the global invitational matches against MVP and Nestea, was completely fine. People clearly blew it out of proportion.
He didn't call nestea an idiot, he called the DECISION in g3 of GI match a dumb decision.
Gosh, people are so fail sometimes.
"i though he was a genius but hes just an idiot", how can anyone misinterpret this line?
By listening to the entire interview?
The same interview where he said MVP and Nestea were easy, and he didn't expect Nestea to advance far?
Coming from a guy with a history of insulting people, words that translate into "I think you are lacking in mental capability" are pretty clear cut. But please, try to insinuate that saying someone is stupid totally wasn't insulting.
He said that what he did was idiot! At least in portuguese we do differ actions between people. If I do an idiot thing it does not mean I am idiot. (besides idiot is a generic insult in portuguese that everyone accepts if you did a really stupid thing)
The same interview where he said MVP and Nestea were easy, and he didn't expect Nestea to advance far?
So he own against MVP and Nestea twice this week and he is not allowed to sate is opinion?
General consensus seems to be that it's okay because CrunCher isn't zerg.
On November 21 2011 02:16 wei2coolman wrote: Even his original interview after the global invitational matches against MVP and Nestea, was completely fine. People clearly blew it out of proportion.
He didn't call nestea an idiot, he called the DECISION in g3 of GI match a dumb decision.
Gosh, people are so fail sometimes.
"i though he was a genius but hes just an idiot", how can anyone misinterpret this line?
By listening to the entire interview?
The same interview where he said MVP and Nestea were easy, and he didn't expect Nestea to advance far?
lulz.
So when Idra says that Cruncher would be easy and then loses, what is that? When he calls him fat in NASL what is that? It's rude, but it's not worth a witch hunt.
General consensus seems to be that it's okay because CrunCher isn't zerg.
Naniwa misunderstood the admin (complete miscommunication that I personally attribute to the language barrier). The game was paused as Naniwa refused to play.
wow mlg trying to spin this. Im assuming you weren't there so you can't possibly know exactly who said what. It is clear that there was a misunderstanding but you don't know wether it was a misunderstanding from naniwas part or if it was the admin not being clear enough. MLG's version doesn't add up to what naniwa is saying.
At first you have sundance (who wasn't there either) saying: "Was his mistake. Not anyone else's. " and then, "He made a mistake then claimed it was the ref.Hhe picked before our admin even went into the booth.
Some maps have crosses some do not. He chose one thinking that it was a cross position map when it wasn't.
Not a big deal in the end but annoying none the less."
Notice how sundance does not claim that that naniwa wasn't told that there was only cross pos, he only comments on the timing. It is not relevant when naniwa picked the map, he went into the game thinking it was cross only and therefore planned for that. Naniwa didn't pick the map because he thought it was only cross (or atleast that's not what bothered him), the problem was that he went into the game (after picking map) thinking that it was cross only.
Now you say that he misunderstood the admin, and you think that it's because of language barrier. Naniwa has pretty good english and should be able to understand when and admin is telling him wether or not it cross spawns only ffs, unless admin is being vague in his statements. But by the attributing miscommunication to language barrier you're basically putting the mistake on naniwa and not on yourself.
Coming from a guy with a history of insulting people, words that translate into "I think you are lacking in mental capability" are pretty clear cut. But please, try to insinuate that saying someone is stupid totally wasn't insulting.
He said that what he did was idiot! At least in portuguese we do differ actions between people. If I do an idiot thing it does not mean I am idiot. (besides idiot is a generic insult in portuguese that everyone accepts if you did a really stupid thing)
Coming from a guy with a history of insulting people, words that translate into "I think you are lacking in mental capability" are pretty clear cut. But please, try to insinuate that saying someone is stupid totally wasn't insulting.
He said that what he did was idiot! At least in portuguese we do differ actions between people. If I do an idiot thing it does not mean I am idiot. (besides idiot is a generic insult in portuguese that everyone accepts if you did a really stupid thing)
The same interview where he said MVP and Nestea were easy, and he didn't expect Nestea to advance far?
So he own against MVP and Nestea twice this week and he is not allowed to sate is opinion?
General consensus seems to be that it's okay because CrunCher isn't zerg.
Or Korean.
He said the words "but he's just an idiot." He called Nestea as a person an idiot.
Just read what already been beaten to death, instead of restart the overdrama over poor skills in english.
Coming from a guy with a history of insulting people, words that translate into "I think you are lacking in mental capability" are pretty clear cut. But please, try to insinuate that saying someone is stupid totally wasn't insulting.
He said that what he did was idiot! At least in portuguese we do differ actions between people. If I do an idiot thing it does not mean I am idiot. (besides idiot is a generic insult in portuguese that everyone accepts if you did a really stupid thing)
The same interview where he said MVP and Nestea were easy, and he didn't expect Nestea to advance far?
So he own against MVP and Nestea twice this week and he is not allowed to sate is opinion?
General consensus seems to be that it's okay because CrunCher isn't zerg.
Or Korean.
He said the words "but he's just an idiot." He called Nestea as a person an idiot.
In Swedish the word does not hold the same weight. Especially in that context.
Naniwa misunderstood the admin (complete miscommunication that I personally attribute to the language barrier). The game was paused as Naniwa refused to play.
wow mlg trying to spin this. Im assuming you weren't there so you can't possibly know exactly who said what. It is clear that there was a misunderstanding but you don't know wether it was a misunderstanding from naniwas part or if it was the admin not being clear enough. MLG's version doesn't add up to what naniwa is saying.
At first you have sundance (who wasn't there either) saying: "Was his mistake. Not anyone else's. " and then, "He made a mistake then claimed it was the ref.Hhe picked before our admin even went into the booth.
Some maps have crosses some do not. He chose one thinking that it was a cross position map when it wasn't.
Not a big deal in the end but annoying none the less."
Notice how sundance does not claim that that naniwa wasn't told that there was only cross pos, he only comments on the timing. It is not relevant when naniwa picked the map, he went into the game thinking it was cross only and therefore planned for that. Naniwa didn't pick the map because he thought it was only cross (or atleast that's not what bothered him), the problem was that he went into the game (after picking map) thinking that it was cross only.
Now you say that he misunderstood the admin, and you think that it's because of language barrier. Naniwa has pretty good english and should be able to understand when and admin is telling him wether or not it cross spawns only ffs, unless admin is being vague in his statements. But by the attributing miscommunication to language barrier you're basically putting the mistake on naniwa and not on yourself.
His other posts makes it clear that he was definitely there. He said Naniwa made a very ambiguous question about the positions which caused the misunderstanding.
Naniwa misunderstood the admin (complete miscommunication that I personally attribute to the language barrier). The game was paused as Naniwa refused to play.
Now you say that he misunderstood the admin, and you think that it's because of language barrier. Naniwa has pretty good english and should be able to understand when and admin is telling him wether or not it cross spawns only ffs, unless admin is being vague in his statements. But by the attributing miscommunication to language barrier you're basically putting the mistake on naniwa and not on yourself.
So he has good English, but calling someone an idiot was obviously just bad English. Great English when it suits him, bad when it suits him.
Coming from a guy with a history of insulting people, words that translate into "I think you are lacking in mental capability" are pretty clear cut. But please, try to insinuate that saying someone is stupid totally wasn't insulting.
He said that what he did was idiot! At least in portuguese we do differ actions between people. If I do an idiot thing it does not mean I am idiot. (besides idiot is a generic insult in portuguese that everyone accepts if you did a really stupid thing)
The same interview where he said MVP and Nestea were easy, and he didn't expect Nestea to advance far?
So he own against MVP and Nestea twice this week and he is not allowed to sate is opinion?
General consensus seems to be that it's okay because CrunCher isn't zerg.
Or Korean.
He said the words "but he's just an idiot." He called Nestea as a person an idiot.
He certainly did but that's not what he meant. He obviously meant the decision was stupid, not that Nestea's an idiot. Secondly, calling someone an idiot is not a very serious insult in swedish, it's quite common and even used on national television. But yes, he said nestea is an idiot, because that's how you would say it in swedish. It's just an english mistake on naniwa's part.
Coming from a guy with a history of insulting people, words that translate into "I think you are lacking in mental capability" are pretty clear cut. But please, try to insinuate that saying someone is stupid totally wasn't insulting.
He said that what he did was idiot! At least in portuguese we do differ actions between people. If I do an idiot thing it does not mean I am idiot. (besides idiot is a generic insult in portuguese that everyone accepts if you did a really stupid thing)
The same interview where he said MVP and Nestea were easy, and he didn't expect Nestea to advance far?
So he own against MVP and Nestea twice this week and he is not allowed to sate is opinion?
General consensus seems to be that it's okay because CrunCher isn't zerg.
Or Korean.
He said the words "but he's just an idiot." He called Nestea as a person an idiot.
In Swedish the word does not hold the same weight. Especially in that context.
So in Swedish, someone saying you have below average intelligence isn't that insulting. I'll keep that in mind while I call you stupid.
Naniwa misunderstood the admin (complete miscommunication that I personally attribute to the language barrier). The game was paused as Naniwa refused to play.
wow mlg trying to spin this. Im assuming you weren't there so you can't possibly know exactly who said what. It is clear that there was a misunderstanding but you don't know wether it was a misunderstanding from naniwas part or if it was the admin not being clear enough. MLG's version doesn't add up to what naniwa is saying.
At first you have sundance (who wasn't there either) saying: "Was his mistake. Not anyone else's. " and then, "He made a mistake then claimed it was the ref.Hhe picked before our admin even went into the booth.
Some maps have crosses some do not. He chose one thinking that it was a cross position map when it wasn't.
Not a big deal in the end but annoying none the less."
Notice how sundance does not claim that that naniwa wasn't told that there was only cross pos, he only comments on the timing. It is not relevant when naniwa picked the map, he went into the game thinking it was cross only and therefore planned for that. Naniwa didn't pick the map because he thought it was only cross (or atleast that's not what bothered him), the problem was that he went into the game (after picking map) thinking that it was cross only.
Now you say that he misunderstood the admin, and you think that it's because of language barrier. Naniwa has pretty good english and should be able to understand when and admin is telling him wether or not it cross spawns only ffs, unless admin is being vague in his statements. But by the attributing miscommunication to language barrier you're basically putting the mistake on naniwa and not on yourself.
I'm the 6'2 200 lb guy stalking around all the time at the main stage. Can't miss me. I was standing there on the stage the entire time as were already behind schedule and I was making sure things kept rolling.
Can we please stop the conspiracy stuff? I have no reason to lie about it. I just want to have a great conclusion to what has been a great tournament.
People should just... shut up about this.. imo NaNi fucked up and is now trying to fix the issue. Which counts as good intentions but that's about it. I just hope he loses soon.
About the map thing, it's not MLG's responsibility to have the players know the map pool. If he didn't study it well enough it's just his fault, even if the admin fucked up and told him otherwise. He also broke the pausing rules so he should be penalized for it.
Coming from a guy with a history of insulting people, words that translate into "I think you are lacking in mental capability" are pretty clear cut. But please, try to insinuate that saying someone is stupid totally wasn't insulting.
He said that what he did was idiot! At least in portuguese we do differ actions between people. If I do an idiot thing it does not mean I am idiot. (besides idiot is a generic insult in portuguese that everyone accepts if you did a really stupid thing)
The same interview where he said MVP and Nestea were easy, and he didn't expect Nestea to advance far?
So he own against MVP and Nestea twice this week and he is not allowed to sate is opinion?
General consensus seems to be that it's okay because CrunCher isn't zerg.
Or Korean.
He said the words "but he's just an idiot." He called Nestea as a person an idiot.
In Swedish the word does not hold the same weight. Especially in that context.
So in Swedish, someone saying you have below average intelligence isn't that insulting. I'll keep that in mind while I call you stupid.
In Swedish, what he said would've been interpreted as "NesTea's decision was idiotic." English is an annoying, tedious language to deal with if you didn't grow up speaking it.
Naniwa misunderstood the admin (complete miscommunication that I personally attribute to the language barrier). The game was paused as Naniwa refused to play.
wow mlg trying to spin this. Im assuming you weren't there so you can't possibly know exactly who said what. It is clear that there was a misunderstanding but you don't know wether it was a misunderstanding from naniwas part or if it was the admin not being clear enough. MLG's version doesn't add up to what naniwa is saying.
At first you have sundance (who wasn't there either) saying: "Was his mistake. Not anyone else's. " and then, "He made a mistake then claimed it was the ref.Hhe picked before our admin even went into the booth.
Some maps have crosses some do not. He chose one thinking that it was a cross position map when it wasn't.
Not a big deal in the end but annoying none the less."
Notice how sundance does not claim that that naniwa wasn't told that there was only cross pos, he only comments on the timing. It is not relevant when naniwa picked the map, he went into the game thinking it was cross only and therefore planned for that. Naniwa didn't pick the map because he thought it was only cross (or atleast that's not what bothered him), the problem was that he went into the game (after picking map) thinking that it was cross only.
Now you say that he misunderstood the admin, and you think that it's because of language barrier. Naniwa has pretty good english and should be able to understand when and admin is telling him wether or not it cross spawns only ffs, unless admin is being vague in his statements. But by the attributing miscommunication to language barrier you're basically putting the mistake on naniwa and not on yourself.
I'm the 6'2 200 lb guy stalking around all the time at the main stage. Can't miss me. I was standing there on the stage the entire time as were already behind schedule and I was making sure things kept rolling.
Can we please stop the conspiracy stuff? I have no reason to lie about it. I just want to have a great conclusion to what has been a great tournament.
Stop with drama and watch great starcraft? Well, I have never heard such a....
Coming from a guy with a history of insulting people, words that translate into "I think you are lacking in mental capability" are pretty clear cut. But please, try to insinuate that saying someone is stupid totally wasn't insulting.
He said that what he did was idiot! At least in portuguese we do differ actions between people. If I do an idiot thing it does not mean I am idiot. (besides idiot is a generic insult in portuguese that everyone accepts if you did a really stupid thing)
The same interview where he said MVP and Nestea were easy, and he didn't expect Nestea to advance far?
So he own against MVP and Nestea twice this week and he is not allowed to sate is opinion?
General consensus seems to be that it's okay because CrunCher isn't zerg.
Or Korean.
He said the words "but he's just an idiot." He called Nestea as a person an idiot.
In Swedish the word does not hold the same weight. Especially in that context.
So in Swedish, someone saying you have below average intelligence isn't that insulting. I'll keep that in mind while I call you stupid.
Coming from a guy with a history of insulting people, words that translate into "I think you are lacking in mental capability" are pretty clear cut. But please, try to insinuate that saying someone is stupid totally wasn't insulting.
He said that what he did was idiot! At least in portuguese we do differ actions between people. If I do an idiot thing it does not mean I am idiot. (besides idiot is a generic insult in portuguese that everyone accepts if you did a really stupid thing)
The same interview where he said MVP and Nestea were easy, and he didn't expect Nestea to advance far?
So he own against MVP and Nestea twice this week and he is not allowed to sate is opinion?
General consensus seems to be that it's okay because CrunCher isn't zerg.
Or Korean.
He said the words "but he's just an idiot." He called Nestea as a person an idiot.
In Swedish the word does not hold the same weight. Especially in that context.
So in Swedish, someone saying you have below average intelligence isn't that insulting. I'll keep that in mind while I call you stupid.
"Det där var jävligt dumt gjort" "That was a really fucking idiotic thing to do" (word by word translation)
Very common, no problem in sweden. Cursing is very common yes (not much religion here). Listen to Jinro talk if nothing else
"I thought he was doing something genius with the drones out on the map but it turned out he's an idiot" <- Totally fine if translated to swedish. I'm 100% sure Nani didn't mean to insult him as badly as you think.
@TT1 What do you have against Naniwa btw? Reading all your replies in this thread you clearly don't like him AT ALL yet "have heard stories" is the best you got?
Coming from a guy with a history of insulting people, words that translate into "I think you are lacking in mental capability" are pretty clear cut. But please, try to insinuate that saying someone is stupid totally wasn't insulting.
He said that what he did was idiot! At least in portuguese we do differ actions between people. If I do an idiot thing it does not mean I am idiot. (besides idiot is a generic insult in portuguese that everyone accepts if you did a really stupid thing)
The same interview where he said MVP and Nestea were easy, and he didn't expect Nestea to advance far?
So he own against MVP and Nestea twice this week and he is not allowed to sate is opinion?
General consensus seems to be that it's okay because CrunCher isn't zerg.
Or Korean.
He said the words "but he's just an idiot." He called Nestea as a person an idiot.
In Swedish the word does not hold the same weight. Especially in that context.
So in Swedish, someone saying you have below average intelligence isn't that insulting. I'll keep that in mind while I call you stupid.
In Swedish it implies that Nesteas decision was idiotic when said like that and it's basically like saying it was bad over here, stop being a drama queen.
Coming from a guy with a history of insulting people, words that translate into "I think you are lacking in mental capability" are pretty clear cut. But please, try to insinuate that saying someone is stupid totally wasn't insulting.
He said that what he did was idiot! At least in portuguese we do differ actions between people. If I do an idiot thing it does not mean I am idiot. (besides idiot is a generic insult in portuguese that everyone accepts if you did a really stupid thing)
The same interview where he said MVP and Nestea were easy, and he didn't expect Nestea to advance far?
So he own against MVP and Nestea twice this week and he is not allowed to sate is opinion?
General consensus seems to be that it's okay because CrunCher isn't zerg.
Or Korean.
He said the words "but he's just an idiot." He called Nestea as a person an idiot.
In Swedish the word does not hold the same weight. Especially in that context.
So in Swedish, someone saying you have below average intelligence isn't that insulting. I'll keep that in mind while I call you stupid.
If you went up to some random in the street and said he's an idiot then yeah, he might punch you in the face, most likely he wouldn't even react though but some would. In the context here I don't think anyone swedish would give a shit about being called an idiot. Language differs.
Naniwa misunderstood the admin (complete miscommunication that I personally attribute to the language barrier). The game was paused as Naniwa refused to play.
wow mlg trying to spin this. Im assuming you weren't there so you can't possibly know exactly who said what. It is clear that there was a misunderstanding but you don't know wether it was a misunderstanding from naniwas part or if it was the admin not being clear enough. MLG's version doesn't add up to what naniwa is saying.
Don't give a shit about that. Both parts don't get any shit with this, why is everybody looking for a scapegoat ?
Coming from a guy with a history of insulting people, words that translate into "I think you are lacking in mental capability" are pretty clear cut. But please, try to insinuate that saying someone is stupid totally wasn't insulting.
He said that what he did was idiot! At least in portuguese we do differ actions between people. If I do an idiot thing it does not mean I am idiot. (besides idiot is a generic insult in portuguese that everyone accepts if you did a really stupid thing)
The same interview where he said MVP and Nestea were easy, and he didn't expect Nestea to advance far?
So he own against MVP and Nestea twice this week and he is not allowed to sate is opinion?
General consensus seems to be that it's okay because CrunCher isn't zerg.
Or Korean.
He said the words "but he's just an idiot." He called Nestea as a person an idiot.
In Swedish the word does not hold the same weight. Especially in that context.
So in Swedish, someone saying you have below average intelligence isn't that insulting. I'll keep that in mind while I call you stupid.
Its funny how English-only speakers have such difficulty understanding that grammar and sentence structure is different in other languages. Listen to white-ra speak.Listen to MC. There is a reason Ukrainians talk a specific genre of english and Koreans have another.
Coming from a guy with a history of insulting people, words that translate into "I think you are lacking in mental capability" are pretty clear cut. But please, try to insinuate that saying someone is stupid totally wasn't insulting.
He said that what he did was idiot! At least in portuguese we do differ actions between people. If I do an idiot thing it does not mean I am idiot. (besides idiot is a generic insult in portuguese that everyone accepts if you did a really stupid thing)
The same interview where he said MVP and Nestea were easy, and he didn't expect Nestea to advance far?
So he own against MVP and Nestea twice this week and he is not allowed to sate is opinion?
General consensus seems to be that it's okay because CrunCher isn't zerg.
Or Korean.
He said the words "but he's just an idiot." He called Nestea as a person an idiot.
In Swedish the word does not hold the same weight. Especially in that context.
So in Swedish, someone saying you have below average intelligence isn't that insulting. I'll keep that in mind while I call you stupid.
In Swedish, what he said would've been interpreted as "NesTea's decision was idiotic." English is an annoying, tedious language to deal with if you didn't grow up speaking it.
Just to be clear on one point, it was his use of a phrase do descrbe the incident (the context people are talking about) that makes it very clear for swedes what he meant. The word idiot was not a good choice of wording, fool would have been better.
He sums up the whole situation with "I thought he was a genius, but...."
To say someone is an idot acually means that in swedish too I don't know how common it is to try to use colourful laungage in everyday situations in the us/australia etc. but I have no problems finding it in books, so some english speaking people should be able to understand the concept to some degree.
Perhaps an attempt to be a bit poetic, if it ended up in poetic justice only history will show.
Coming from a guy with a history of insulting people, words that translate into "I think you are lacking in mental capability" are pretty clear cut. But please, try to insinuate that saying someone is stupid totally wasn't insulting.
He said that what he did was idiot! At least in portuguese we do differ actions between people. If I do an idiot thing it does not mean I am idiot. (besides idiot is a generic insult in portuguese that everyone accepts if you did a really stupid thing)
The same interview where he said MVP and Nestea were easy, and he didn't expect Nestea to advance far?
So he own against MVP and Nestea twice this week and he is not allowed to sate is opinion?
General consensus seems to be that it's okay because CrunCher isn't zerg.
Or Korean.
He said the words "but he's just an idiot." He called Nestea as a person an idiot.
In Swedish the word does not hold the same weight. Especially in that context.
So in Swedish, someone saying you have below average intelligence isn't that insulting. I'll keep that in mind while I call you stupid.
In Swedish, what he said would've been interpreted as "NesTea's decision was idiotic." English is an annoying, tedious language to deal with if you didn't grow up speaking it.
Just to be clear on one point, it was his use of a phrase do descrbe the incident (the context people are talking about) that makes it very clear for swedes what he meant. The word idiot was not a good choice of wording, fool would have been better.
He sums up the whole situation with "I thought he was a genius, but...."
To say someone is an idot acually means that in swedish too I don't know how common it is to try to use colourful laungage in everyday situations in the us/australia etc. but I have no problems finding it in books, so some english speaking people should be able to understand the concept to some degree.
Perhaps an attempt to be a bit poetic, if it ended up in poetic justice only history will show.
I see the same thing in English sometimes, except we use "retarded" which is probably even worse, because it actually is insulting to an entire subset of people.
Coming from a guy with a history of insulting people, words that translate into "I think you are lacking in mental capability" are pretty clear cut. But please, try to insinuate that saying someone is stupid totally wasn't insulting.
He said that what he did was idiot! At least in portuguese we do differ actions between people. If I do an idiot thing it does not mean I am idiot. (besides idiot is a generic insult in portuguese that everyone accepts if you did a really stupid thing)
The same interview where he said MVP and Nestea were easy, and he didn't expect Nestea to advance far?
So he own against MVP and Nestea twice this week and he is not allowed to sate is opinion?
General consensus seems to be that it's okay because CrunCher isn't zerg.
Or Korean.
He said the words "but he's just an idiot." He called Nestea as a person an idiot.
In Swedish the word does not hold the same weight. Especially in that context.
So in Swedish, someone saying you have below average intelligence isn't that insulting. I'll keep that in mind while I call you stupid.
In Swedish, what he said would've been interpreted as "NesTea's decision was idiotic." English is an annoying, tedious language to deal with if you didn't grow up speaking it.
Just to be clear on one point, it was his use of a phrase do descrbe the incident (the context people are talking about) that makes it very clear for swedes what he meant. The word idiot was not a good choice of wording, fool would have been better.
He sums up the whole situation with "I thought he was a genius, but...."
To say someone is an idot acually means that in swedish too I don't know how common it is to try to use colourful laungage in everyday situations in the us/australia etc. but I have no problems finding it in books, so some english speaking people should be able to understand the concept to some degree.
Perhaps an attempt to be a bit poetic, if it ended up in poetic justice only history will show.
I see the same thing in English sometimes, except we use "retarded" which is probably even worse, because it actually is insulting to an entire subset of people.
It and "gay," though I think that's really just an American thing.
Idra calling everyone "stupid, idiot, retard, noob" and messaging straight up "FUCK YOUs" during tournament games: --> GOTTA love the GRACKEN!!
Naniwa stating that beating Nestea & MVP wasn't as hard as he would have thought and calling an idiotic move from Nestea "idiotic": --> KILL IT WITH FIRE!!
Please not more of this cheating bullshit... I don't understand why people are so keen on creating a shitstorm of drama out of nothing. No harm was done, and it made the games more interesting.
On November 21 2011 03:01 GreyMasta wrote: Idra calling everyone "stupid, idiot, retard, noob" and messaging straight up "FUCK YOUs" during tournament games: --> GOTTA love the GRACKEN!!
You forget him telling CrunCher to kill himself, and everyone jumping on the suicide bandwagon.
After watching the most recent naniwa interview - they forced a restart for a silly reason after naniwa early scouted nestea's 10 pool on shakuras. That is absolutely huge. I would be furious if I was naniwa. Especially if afterwards it turns out the map isn't cross position only despite what an admin told him. They totally fucked naniwa's chances of winning the game - after not letting him go to the bathroom.
On November 21 2011 03:02 SiguR wrote: After watching the most recent naniwa interview - they forced a restart for a silly reason after naniwa early scouted nestea's 10 pool on shakuras. That is absolutely huge. I would be furious if I was naniwa. Especially if afterwards it turns out the map isn't cross position only despite what an admin told him. They totally fucked naniwa's chances of winning the game - after not letting him go to the bathroom.
It doesn't matter if Naniwa apologizes. He's still not going to change his attitude. Until he actually becomes a nice, fun guy, apologies mean nothing.
On November 21 2011 03:05 ninjamyst wrote: It doesn't matter if Naniwa apologizes. He's still not going to change his attitude. Until he actually becomes a nice, fun guy, apologies mean nothing.
He is a nice and fun guy lol. He just got fucking pissed because of that miscommunication, which I'm sure a lot more people than naniwa would have been in the same situation. Some people also seem to have a really hard time to understand when he actually isn't serious at all about stuff he says .
Coming from a guy with a history of insulting people, words that translate into "I think you are lacking in mental capability" are pretty clear cut. But please, try to insinuate that saying someone is stupid totally wasn't insulting.
He said that what he did was idiot! At least in portuguese we do differ actions between people. If I do an idiot thing it does not mean I am idiot. (besides idiot is a generic insult in portuguese that everyone accepts if you did a really stupid thing)
The same interview where he said MVP and Nestea were easy, and he didn't expect Nestea to advance far?
So he own against MVP and Nestea twice this week and he is not allowed to sate is opinion?
General consensus seems to be that it's okay because CrunCher isn't zerg.
Or Korean.
He said the words "but he's just an idiot." He called Nestea as a person an idiot.
In Swedish the word does not hold the same weight. Especially in that context.
So in Swedish, someone saying you have below average intelligence isn't that insulting. I'll keep that in mind while I call you stupid.
"Det där var jävligt dumt gjort" "That was a really fucking idiotic thing to do" (word by word translation)
Very common, no problem in sweden. Cursing is very common yes (not much religion here). Listen to Jinro talk if nothing else
"I thought he was doing something genius with the drones out on the map but it turned out he's an idiot" <- Totally fine if translated to swedish. I'm 100% sure Nani didn't mean to insult him as badly as you think.
@TT1 What do you have against Naniwa btw? Reading all your replies in this thread you clearly don't like him AT ALL yet "have heard stories" is the best you got?
Idiot in Swedish is the exact same word and carries the exact same meaning as in English. Not that it matter, this thing is blown way out of proportion, but your post is just fanboy bullshit and not accurate at all.
Lol its embarassing when all the swedish people in here try to act like being called an idiot (same word) in swedish isnt an insult? wtf guys? Im having pride for naniwa too but he is fucking BM Id never deny that.
Naniwa misunderstood the admin (complete miscommunication that I personally attribute to the language barrier). The game was paused as Naniwa refused to play.
wow mlg trying to spin this. Im assuming you weren't there so you can't possibly know exactly who said what. It is clear that there was a misunderstanding but you don't know wether it was a misunderstanding from naniwas part or if it was the admin not being clear enough. MLG's version doesn't add up to what naniwa is saying.
At first you have sundance (who wasn't there either) saying: "Was his mistake. Not anyone else's. " and then, "He made a mistake then claimed it was the ref.Hhe picked before our admin even went into the booth.
Some maps have crosses some do not. He chose one thinking that it was a cross position map when it wasn't.
Not a big deal in the end but annoying none the less."
Notice how sundance does not claim that that naniwa wasn't told that there was only cross pos, he only comments on the timing. It is not relevant when naniwa picked the map, he went into the game thinking it was cross only and therefore planned for that. Naniwa didn't pick the map because he thought it was only cross (or atleast that's not what bothered him), the problem was that he went into the game (after picking map) thinking that it was cross only.
Now you say that he misunderstood the admin, and you think that it's because of language barrier. Naniwa has pretty good english and should be able to understand when and admin is telling him wether or not it cross spawns only ffs, unless admin is being vague in his statements. But by the attributing miscommunication to language barrier you're basically putting the mistake on naniwa and not on yourself.
I'm the 6'2 200 lb guy stalking around all the time at the main stage. Can't miss me. I was standing there on the stage the entire time as were already behind schedule and I was making sure things kept rolling.
Can we please stop the conspiracy stuff? I have no reason to lie about it. I just want to have a great conclusion to what has been a great tournament.
Im not saying anyone is telling lies, or that it's a conspiracy. I wans't there so i don't know exactly what happened, im just calling it as i see it. Im not upset about what happened. It is not the first time MLG admins have been critisized by players though.
It is weird to me that Naniwa seems to be sure that he was told that it was cross only. MLG claims he is clearly wrong and then backs it up with vague statements. Why not just tell us what was said, so we can make up our own minds, instead of just going "ok guys i was there and heard everything, just trust me we werent wrong!"
That seems like MLG is trying to cover their asses to me, or that everyone isn't entirely sure what happened. The reason im posting is because i'd like to see it cleared up, and i can't see why mlg wouldn't wanna do the same. Anyway i wont push this issue furthers, just wanna enjoy the rest of the games.
if Nani thinks Nestea is and idiot than he has the right to state his oppinion! He just meant to call nesteas actions iditoic which is even more okey even if he meant him personally its HIS FUCKING oppinion so he can state whatever he wants !
Coming from a guy with a history of insulting people, words that translate into "I think you are lacking in mental capability" are pretty clear cut. But please, try to insinuate that saying someone is stupid totally wasn't insulting.
He said that what he did was idiot! At least in portuguese we do differ actions between people. If I do an idiot thing it does not mean I am idiot. (besides idiot is a generic insult in portuguese that everyone accepts if you did a really stupid thing)
The same interview where he said MVP and Nestea were easy, and he didn't expect Nestea to advance far?
So he own against MVP and Nestea twice this week and he is not allowed to sate is opinion?
General consensus seems to be that it's okay because CrunCher isn't zerg.
Or Korean.
He said the words "but he's just an idiot." He called Nestea as a person an idiot.
In Swedish the word does not hold the same weight. Especially in that context.
So in Swedish, someone saying you have below average intelligence isn't that insulting. I'll keep that in mind while I call you stupid.
"Det där var jävligt dumt gjort" "That was a really fucking idiotic thing to do" (word by word translation)
Very common, no problem in sweden. Cursing is very common yes (not much religion here). Listen to Jinro talk if nothing else
"I thought he was doing something genius with the drones out on the map but it turned out he's an idiot" <- Totally fine if translated to swedish. I'm 100% sure Nani didn't mean to insult him as badly as you think.
@TT1 What do you have against Naniwa btw? Reading all your replies in this thread you clearly don't like him AT ALL yet "have heard stories" is the best you got?
havnt u seen a correlation between players who have a disrespectful attitude towards legends and me calling them out on it? i feel like theres a few players in the scene that nobody has a right to bm and when someone does ill speak out against him, its that simple.. and ill do it everytime regardless if ur a fan of the player and get seriously offended by wat i say
u always have to show respect to the icons that helped paved our path(especially to the ones that are a bit older ^^), cant disrespect ppl like boxer or nestea.. thats just standard starcraft etiquette
your always going to have problems when players are frustated or just lack more advanced words that they may come out worse then it actually was, people need to rememeber this isnt the native language.. this is second language etc
atend of day they know BASIC english and not the full blown enlgish we know soo somewords may be used which make thingks 10x worse
Coming from a guy with a history of insulting people, words that translate into "I think you are lacking in mental capability" are pretty clear cut. But please, try to insinuate that saying someone is stupid totally wasn't insulting.
He said that what he did was idiot! At least in portuguese we do differ actions between people. If I do an idiot thing it does not mean I am idiot. (besides idiot is a generic insult in portuguese that everyone accepts if you did a really stupid thing)
The same interview where he said MVP and Nestea were easy, and he didn't expect Nestea to advance far?
So he own against MVP and Nestea twice this week and he is not allowed to sate is opinion?
General consensus seems to be that it's okay because CrunCher isn't zerg.
Or Korean.
He said the words "but he's just an idiot." He called Nestea as a person an idiot.
In Swedish the word does not hold the same weight. Especially in that context.
So in Swedish, someone saying you have below average intelligence isn't that insulting. I'll keep that in mind while I call you stupid.
"Det där var jävligt dumt gjort" "That was a really fucking idiotic thing to do" (word by word translation)
Very common, no problem in sweden. Cursing is very common yes (not much religion here). Listen to Jinro talk if nothing else
"I thought he was doing something genius with the drones out on the map but it turned out he's an idiot" <- Totally fine if translated to swedish. I'm 100% sure Nani didn't mean to insult him as badly as you think.
@TT1 What do you have against Naniwa btw? Reading all your replies in this thread you clearly don't like him AT ALL yet "have heard stories" is the best you got?
havnt u seen a correlation between players who have a disrespectful attitude towards legends and me calling them out on it? i feel like theres a few players in the scene that nobody has a right to bm and when someone does ill speak out against him, its that simple.. and ill do it everytime regardless if ur a fan of the player and get seriously offended by wat i say
u always have to show respect to the icons that helped paved our path(especially to the ones that are a bit older ^^), cant disrespect ppl like boxer or nestea.. thats just standard starcraft etiquette
yeh fine for Nestea to say people such as Inca in gsl finals are not even worthy to be there(probably correct) but its not fine for others to be misinterperted speaking a second language. Also he said he would smash nan before the gamesi???? lol
people make me laugh how its fine for some people to talk trash but not others. lol just ebcuase of who they are. if this was MC everyone would be lapping it up.....
On November 21 2011 03:14 WaZuP wrote: if Nani thinks Nestea is and idiot than he has the right to state his oppinion! He just meant to call nesteas actions iditoic which is even more okey even if he meant him personally its HIS FUCKING oppinion so he can state whatever he wants !
This..
So when IdrA calls other players dumb, stupid, waste of lives it's ok?
But when NaNiwa calls someone an idiot for doing a dumb move, it's not?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WlgxPBTscf0 After watching this video my opinion changed drastically. It turns out naniwa has a lot more respect for his opponent and the way people were describing things made it seem like naniwa was the bad guy. Seems like naniwa did nothing wrong besides the thumbs down that was kinda dickish. But yeah, its all blame on the admins if anything, they should have told him the right info so naniwa wouldnt screw up his cheese.
On November 21 2011 03:05 ninjamyst wrote: It doesn't matter if Naniwa apologizes. He's still not going to change his attitude. Until he actually becomes a nice, fun guy, apologies mean nothing.
He is a nice and fun guy lol. He just got fucking pissed because of that miscommunication, which I'm sure a lot more people than naniwa would have been in the same situation. Some people also seem to have a really hard time to understand when he actually isn't serious at all about stuff he says .
NanIwa is one of the most BM players in Starcraft 2, in WC3 he was notorious for his terrible attitude and bad manners.
There is a line between acting BM in game and acting BM in real life - Naniwa seems to be treading that line, and his interview about NesTea annoyed people so much because it seemed to translate his in-game BM to real life. Maybe because I'm a bit older now, but complaining/insulting in interviews and stuff just seems immature.
Idra/MC being BM in a game setting is fun and part of the game. If Naniwa can be nice in interviews and contain his BM to the games themselves then I'm all for it. Just don't be a jerk in real life!
On November 21 2011 03:05 ninjamyst wrote: It doesn't matter if Naniwa apologizes. He's still not going to change his attitude. Until he actually becomes a nice, fun guy, apologies mean nothing.
He is a nice and fun guy lol. He just got fucking pissed because of that miscommunication, which I'm sure a lot more people than naniwa would have been in the same situation. Some people also seem to have a really hard time to understand when he actually isn't serious at all about stuff he says .
NanIwa is one of the most BM players in Starcraft 2, in WC3 he was notorious for his terrible attitude and bad manners.
Saying he's nice and fun isn't very accurate..
He's grown up a lot from WC3, actually. He's still a little BM(unintentionally or not) now and again, but so is everyone else.
On November 21 2011 03:05 ninjamyst wrote: It doesn't matter if Naniwa apologizes. He's still not going to change his attitude. Until he actually becomes a nice, fun guy, apologies mean nothing.
He is a nice and fun guy lol. He just got fucking pissed because of that miscommunication, which I'm sure a lot more people than naniwa would have been in the same situation. Some people also seem to have a really hard time to understand when he actually isn't serious at all about stuff he says .
NanIwa is one of the most BM players in Starcraft 2, in WC3 he was notorious for his terrible attitude and bad manners.
Saying he's nice and fun isn't very accurate..
He was one of the most BM starcraft 2 players for sure yeah, totally wouldn't say he is now. Don't think he's very bm at all. In wc3 he was extremely bm but that should be sort of understandable with his personal problems. Have you seen him in anything besides an actual competitive game? He is actually nice and funny.
On November 21 2011 03:31 pt wrote: Lol there is no drama. People are just making it a big deal.
nooo, really? you think a site like TL full of gossiping drama queen bitches would make a mountain out of a molehill just for dramas sake? thats crazy talk.
On November 21 2011 03:33 Dante_A_ wrote: There is a line between acting BM in game and acting BM in real life - Naniwa seems to be treading that line, and his interview about NesTea annoyed people so much because it seemed to translate his in-game BM to real life. Maybe because I'm a bit older now, but complaining/insulting in interviews and stuff just seems immature.
Idra/MC being BM in a game setting is fun and part of the game. If Naniwa can be nice in interviews and contain his BM to the games themselves then I'm all for it. Just don't be a jerk in real life!
yeah, it would suck if more people said what they actually think without sugarcoating it those kind of interviews are all over the place! I much prefer an interview where everyone is hugging, the world is full of rainbows and smiles, and noone ever heard of the word 'opinion'
Coming from a guy with a history of insulting people, words that translate into "I think you are lacking in mental capability" are pretty clear cut. But please, try to insinuate that saying someone is stupid totally wasn't insulting.
He said that what he did was idiot! At least in portuguese we do differ actions between people. If I do an idiot thing it does not mean I am idiot. (besides idiot is a generic insult in portuguese that everyone accepts if you did a really stupid thing)
The same interview where he said MVP and Nestea were easy, and he didn't expect Nestea to advance far?
So he own against MVP and Nestea twice this week and he is not allowed to sate is opinion?
General consensus seems to be that it's okay because CrunCher isn't zerg.
Or Korean.
He said the words "but he's just an idiot." He called Nestea as a person an idiot.
In Swedish the word does not hold the same weight. Especially in that context.
So in Swedish, someone saying you have below average intelligence isn't that insulting. I'll keep that in mind while I call you stupid.
"Det där var jävligt dumt gjort" "That was a really fucking idiotic thing to do" (word by word translation)
Very common, no problem in sweden. Cursing is very common yes (not much religion here). Listen to Jinro talk if nothing else
"I thought he was doing something genius with the drones out on the map but it turned out he's an idiot" <- Totally fine if translated to swedish. I'm 100% sure Nani didn't mean to insult him as badly as you think.
@TT1 What do you have against Naniwa btw? Reading all your replies in this thread you clearly don't like him AT ALL yet "have heard stories" is the best you got?
Idiot in Swedish is the exact same word and carries the exact same meaning as in English. Not that it matter, this thing is blown way out of proportion, but your post is just fanboy bullshit and not accurate at all.
Nah.
Word for word it's 'That was a damn fool thing to do". Which is no problem. 'Fucking' is a much stronger curse word than 'jävlig' and you wouldn't translate it that way if you were doing translations.
As people have said there wasn't that much drama. In his interview he didnt call Nestea an idiot. People probably just told NesTea that to get a reaction.
I see no issue here. Naniwa has been working hard to reestablish his image and for the most part i think he has done a great job. I don't think I've heard him "speak his mind" at all in recent months (tsl 3 interviews, mlg dallas interviews, etc)
And the one time he tries to have a little fun after Nestea said he'd crush him, dood gets murdered by the internet lol. Let's just back off its not like he told WBC to fuck himself after losing (major >_>)
On November 21 2011 03:33 Dante_A_ wrote: There is a line between acting BM in game and acting BM in real life - Naniwa seems to be treading that line, and his interview about NesTea annoyed people so much because it seemed to translate his in-game BM to real life. Maybe because I'm a bit older now, but complaining/insulting in interviews and stuff just seems immature.
Idra/MC being BM in a game setting is fun and part of the game. If Naniwa can be nice in interviews and contain his BM to the games themselves then I'm all for it. Just don't be a jerk in real life!
Except idra is not bm in a game setting only but has rutinely over his career called people idiot, fat, given them the finger, telling them to fuck off, that they are a waste of human life... he is the worst bmer by far.
NesTea has way way more fans than Naniwa, and most people would agree that zerg fans are the most ... vocal ... by far. Are you at all surprised that there would be backlash? Personally, I would have been surprised if there weren't SOMEONE whining if Naniwa had beat him and there was never any no interviews or thumbs downing. At this point there is no point in trying to 'protect' Naniwa in this thread, as the people who are attacking him on this page of the thread have made up their mind. If you feel the need to try and support him in the thread, just save your time and send him a supportive message on Twitter or something.
Considering BM, naniwa was actually worse then idra in sc2 beta/after release. But he got what he deserved back then and really became calmer. I actually like him for recovering from his past so to say. I wouldn't say he is good mannered, but wouldn't consider him BM anymore.
Being a Nestea-fan I am a little biased for sure but I think all the bad manner going on in Starcraft 2 is really stupid and hurting its image as a serious form of competition. You can't just go around call the event you're competing in a joke and BM a player in an interview. If you really think this is part of sports, you should really consider watching WWE or some shit. From the view of an outsider I think this looks like some nerds shitting at eachother all the time. It can be fun at times but Naniwa especially has a history of terrible behaviour and should really think about how he acts in public.
Also on a side note: Naniwa is from Sweden and most Swedes I got really good English. He meant it when he called Nestea an idiot and felt like rubbing his win into Nestea's face and nothing else...
I think the fact that Naniwa is still winning, and not letting this "controversy" get to him is a testament to his mental fortitude. I'm sure that most other people would be too rattled by something like this to keep on with their A game.
Yeah i still thought the thumbs down was a little unnecessary after all the trouble that was caused AND NesTea was mannered enough to shake everyones hands. Kinda rude but whatever, its not Elementary school.
Haters is going to hate. I don't know why this thread isn't closed. It leads to nothing but more hate and flame between the two parties. I feel MLGs statement and Naniwas is more than enough to close this all and for once. Well, I guess people like to shit talk the opposite side.
On November 21 2011 04:17 Lebzetu wrote: Yeah i still thought the thumbs down was a little unnecessary after all the trouble that was caused AND NesTea was mannered enough to shake everyones hands. Kinda rude but whatever, its not Elementary school.
Nani said he did it because nestea said he would crush naniwa I believe
But I can understand that people find it disresepectful to do it to a guy like nestea
That's great and all, but apologizing on twitter with a 1 liner isn't going to change the fact that he basicly cheated and possibly lied (about the admin telling him it was cross spawn only.) I used to have a tiny bit of respect for him, but whatever I may have had is now completely gone.
On November 21 2011 04:21 hunts wrote: That's great and all, but apologizing on twitter with a 1 liner isn't going to change the fact that he basicly cheated and possibly lied (about the admin telling him it was cross spawn only.) I used to have a tiny bit of respect for him, but whatever I may have had is now completely gone.
you lose your respect for him because he might have lied?.
On November 21 2011 04:21 hunts wrote: That's great and all, but apologizing on twitter with a 1 liner isn't going to change the fact that he basicly cheated and possibly lied (about the admin telling him it was cross spawn only.) I used to have a tiny bit of respect for him, but whatever I may have had is now completely gone.
you lose your respect for him because he might have lied?.
no, because he basicly cheated with the replay thing, the way he conducted himself with the pause and arguing with the admins, his BM towards other players, and his spoiled little kid attitude that he has never gotten over.
No problems whatsoever with what Naniwa did/said. Watching the replay is something that happens regularly in the vast majority of tournaments - I'm pretty sure players in the GSL do it all the time. Not to mention, so what if he saw the built Nestea used? Nestea doesn't use the same build on each map, if he did then Naniwa would've known what it was anyway.
The CoL manager that went up at 1:47 was NOT his coach, and moreover, there were MLG staff next to him to make sure he didn't confer any information he shouldn't have... the only reason people are hating on him is because he's not as charismatic as other players (say, IdrA or HuK) who similarly BM or do questionable things at MLGs but are loved for it.
On November 21 2011 04:12 Joseph123 wrote: Naniwa is a boss guys you are free to stop with the hate and show some deserved respect to such a great player winning with protoss.
Thought that was a nice post up until the moment you mentioned "with protoss".
On November 21 2011 04:21 hunts wrote: That's great and all, but apologizing on twitter with a 1 liner isn't going to change the fact that he basicly cheated and possibly lied (about the admin telling him it was cross spawn only.) I used to have a tiny bit of respect for him, but whatever I may have had is now completely gone.
you lose your respect for him because he might have lied?.
no, because he basicly cheated with the replay thing, the way he conducted himself with the pause and arguing with the admins, his BM towards other players, and his spoiled little kid attitude that he has never gotten over.
Stop lying. He didn't cheat. He could see the build order in the score screen. Are you blind? MLG has investigated it already, do you judge yourself superior to the MLG staff to do THEIR job?
On November 21 2011 04:21 hunts wrote: That's great and all, but apologizing on twitter with a 1 liner isn't going to change the fact that he basicly cheated and possibly lied (about the admin telling him it was cross spawn only.) I used to have a tiny bit of respect for him, but whatever I may have had is now completely gone.
you lose your respect for him because he might have lied?.
no, because he basicly cheated with the replay thing, the way he conducted himself with the pause and arguing with the admins, his BM towards other players, and his spoiled little kid attitude that he has never gotten over.
Stop lying. He didn't cheat. He could see the build order in the score screen. Are you blind? MLG has investigated it already, do you judge yourself superior to the MLG staff to do THEIR job?
Pretty sure he does, anyway anyone that is not mannered get antifans. I don't give a shit, MLG handled it well. If everyone was like sheth the scene would be a lot less interesting.
Can someone please explain to me what is wrong with watching a replay of a game that has already been played? They restarted the map as far as I know...
I don't understand why there is drama, they loaded the wrong map and naniwa was told there was only cross spawns. They both played quite well and showed some awesome games.
- Naniwa was not allowed to go use the washroom before the game because the admins told him he couldn't go. How is that fair for Naniwa?
it's Live TV....thinking that he would actually be allowed a break is retarded
.... i dont even know where to start. Im so baffled at people like you expecting players to play whilst needing to go to the bathroom. I guess players need to put diapers on. Nice idea man. Did you think about what you even posted?
Aren´t there clear rules, to when players can visit the bathroom? Seems to me the issue is not about player behavior than more about the officials handling the situation!
I dont understand why there's still drama? That edit to the op where mlg explains it should pretty much settle everything. MLG should have given him a bathroom break early. Naniwa shouldn't have been so stubborn later on. He was given a technical. Why are people still freaking out?
On November 21 2011 05:05 Goldmember wrote: Aren´t there clear rules, to when players can visit the bathroom? Seems to me the issue is not about player behavior than more about the officials handling the situation!
Apparently the rule is... you can go to the bathroom in-between breaks as long as an admin allows it. Naniwa asked for a bathroom break but was refused it because they were running late. I dont see how a player can play while needing to go to the bathroom..... not to mention bo3 can easily take 1-2hours+ to finish at times. Thats not a short period.
Good thread, naniwa was shat on pretty hard by speculation and people taking his words too far, hes a great guy with a passion to win best of luck to him.
On November 21 2011 04:21 hunts wrote: That's great and all, but apologizing on twitter with a 1 liner isn't going to change the fact that he basicly cheated and possibly lied (about the admin telling him it was cross spawn only.) I used to have a tiny bit of respect for him, but whatever I may have had is now completely gone.
you lose your respect for him because he might have lied?.
no, because he basicly cheated with the replay thing, the way he conducted himself with the pause and arguing with the admins, his BM towards other players, and his spoiled little kid attitude that he has never gotten over.
because players just do random stuff at the start of games right?
anyone could of told him any time during the weekend what his main opener was in all 3 match ups, its no secret.
On November 21 2011 05:09 Gevna wrote: So now, should the community apologize to naniwa for being way more bm than it deserves ?
It's the problem with internet, people can bash a player as hell, without a tiny clue, but this doesn't matter.
The community owes Naniwa nothing.
Naniwa is still a grown man responsible for his own behaviour. The guy might have had a justifiable reason to be upset but that doesn't mean he gets to act however he wants.
On November 21 2011 05:09 Gevna wrote: So now, should the community apologize to naniwa for being way more bm than it deserves ?
It's the problem with internet, people can bash a player as hell, without a tiny clue, but this doesn't matter.
The community owes Naniwa nothing.
Naniwa is still a grown man responsible for his own behaviour. The guy might have had a justifiable reason to be upset but that doesn't mean he gets to act however he wants.
On November 21 2011 05:09 Gevna wrote: So now, should the community apologize to naniwa for being way more bm than it deserves ?
It's the problem with internet, people can bash a player as hell, without a tiny clue, but this doesn't matter.
The community owes Naniwa nothing.
Naniwa is still a grown man responsible for his own behaviour. The guy might have had a justifiable reason to be upset but that doesn't mean he gets to act however he wants.
But community members are allowed?
Sure, this is how the internet works. You are free to pass judgement, act like a retarded 10-year-old and scream about everything. But god forbid that YOU have any obligations.
On November 21 2011 05:09 Gevna wrote: So now, should the community apologize to naniwa for being way more bm than it deserves ?
It's the problem with internet, people can bash a player as hell, without a tiny clue, but this doesn't matter.
The community owes Naniwa nothing.
Naniwa is still a grown man responsible for his own behaviour. The guy might have had a justifiable reason to be upset but that doesn't mean he gets to act however he wants.
But community members are allowed?
nice comment. Lots of people are hypocrites sadly.
Naniwa should never have even been put in the situation he was in. The casters messed up by starting early and then he didn't get the bathroom break before the first attempt at the game.
It's unfair to criticize people so harshly when they're dealing with a situation they shouldn't have been put in in the first place. From Naniwa's reactions I'm inclined to believe him when he says that a referee told him it was cross spawns only. And if that IS the case, then who WOULDN'T have paused the game at that point?
Honestly, it feels like Naniwa had to put up with a lot of shenanigans that he shouldn't have had to deal with. I think he handled the situation just like most people would, and I, for one, am glad he won the series after all that.
This is what happens when idiots with a sense of overdramatization are the ones bringing the news, NaNi's replay shenanigans broke no rules, case and point.
Also what's with the hilarious people talking about the BM thumbs down? If that's BM then MC should've been crucified by now.
On November 21 2011 06:02 Zolis wrote: Does MLG Providence give a code s spot? If so Naniwa already has it finishing it at least top3 so the rivalry continues!!
Perhaps, Nestea is Code A now so no rivalries there.
On November 21 2011 06:02 Zolis wrote: Does MLG Providence give a code s spot? If so Naniwa already has it finishing it at least top3 so the rivalry continues!!
It only gives 1spot tough so if someone else gets higher without a code S spot he doesn't get it. He probably needs at least a final spot, if not winning the whole thing.
On November 21 2011 06:02 Zolis wrote: Does MLG Providence give a code s spot? If so Naniwa already has it finishing it at least top3 so the rivalry continues!!
It only gives 1spot tough so if someone else gets higher without a code S spot he doesn't get it. He probably needs at least a final spot, if not winning the whole thing.
DRG is code S, Leenock is Code S, if MvP beats MC then NaNi gets it I believe.
I agree with some of the comments in this thread. It's now pretty clear that the community (especially reddit) is/was WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY more BM about this situation than naniwa ever was
On November 21 2011 06:02 Zolis wrote: Does MLG Providence give a code s spot? If so Naniwa already has it finishing it at least top3 so the rivalry continues!!
It only gives 1spot tough so if someone else gets higher without a code S spot he doesn't get it. He probably needs at least a final spot, if not winning the whole thing.
Leenock and Mvp have secured Code S spots for next season. MC and DRG will have to go through up and down. Not sure how they will do this if either MC or DRG win, if they will count as having Code S now, or if they will get the Code S spot and someone else will do their up-and-down.
On November 21 2011 06:02 Zolis wrote: Does MLG Providence give a code s spot? If so Naniwa already has it finishing it at least top3 so the rivalry continues!!
It only gives 1spot tough so if someone else gets higher without a code S spot he doesn't get it. He probably needs at least a final spot, if not winning the whole thing.
DRG is code S, Leenock is Code S, if MvP beats MC then NaNi gets it I believe.
Could be wrong tho don't qoute me on this
DRG is not code S anymore with the new format changes. Only the top 8 are.
On November 21 2011 06:02 Zolis wrote: Does MLG Providence give a code s spot? If so Naniwa already has it finishing it at least top3 so the rivalry continues!!
It only gives 1spot tough so if someone else gets higher without a code S spot he doesn't get it. He probably needs at least a final spot, if not winning the whole thing.
DRG is code S, Leenock is Code S, if MvP beats MC then NaNi gets it I believe.
Could be wrong tho don't qoute me on this
DRG is not code S anymore with the new format changes. Only the top 8 are.
Ah kk, both Nani and DRG most likely realize this so that should make for some good games.
On November 21 2011 06:02 Zolis wrote: Does MLG Providence give a code s spot? If so Naniwa already has it finishing it at least top3 so the rivalry continues!!
It only gives 1spot tough so if someone else gets higher without a code S spot he doesn't get it. He probably needs at least a final spot, if not winning the whole thing.
Leenock and Mvp have secured Code S spots for next season. MC and DRG will have to go through up and down. Not sure how they will do this if either MC or DRG win, if they will count as having Code S now, or if they will get the Code S spot and someone else will do their up-and-down.
MC and DRG can still secure code s if they win their games, drg must win 2 bo3 and mc 1.
On November 21 2011 06:02 Zolis wrote: Does MLG Providence give a code s spot? If so Naniwa already has it finishing it at least top3 so the rivalry continues!!
It only gives 1spot tough so if someone else gets higher without a code S spot he doesn't get it. He probably needs at least a final spot, if not winning the whole thing.
DRG is code S, Leenock is Code S, if MvP beats MC then NaNi gets it I believe.
Could be wrong tho don't qoute me on this
The whole format of the GSL has changed though... the only people guaranteed to retain Code S are the guys in the ro8, which means just Leenock and MVP. DRG and MC have a good chance at requalifying for Code S in the up and down matches though. Edit: Also, I forgot HuK will be in the up and down matches as well.
Also, there's TWO code S seeds. But I have no idea where they're coming from. But there's only two foreigner code A seeds where there used to be three. So maybe all four of the seeds are still coming from MLG. I'm not too sure about that.
Whoa this is disgusting. Even there is mis-communication between naniwa and mlg staff, he still shouldn't allow to look at build order or even the replay at all. Such info wouldn't even be available to him in the first place even the map is in cross position. He is just pissed that he can't do his build and trying to make his action justified, which it isn't.
On November 21 2011 07:08 furymonkey wrote: Whoa this is disgusting. Even there is mis-communication between naniwa and mlg staff, he still shouldn't allow to look at build order or even the replay at all. Such info wouldn't even be available to him in the first place even the map is in cross position. He is just pissed that he can't do his build and trying to make his action justified, which it isn't.
When is people gonna get the following: You can see the build order in the score screen. It doesn't matter if Naniwa watched the replay.
1. He made a mistake then claimed it was the ref.Hhe picked before our admin even went into the booth. Some maps have crosses some do not. He chose one thinking that it was a cross position map when it wasn't. Not a big deal in the end but annoying none the less. 2. Was his mistake. Not anyone else's. 3. He chose the wrong map then freaked. Delayed the broadcast and lashed out. It's not our job to make sure he knows which maps have crosses and which do not. He also chose before the admin went in to talk to him. Onward and upward...
On November 21 2011 07:08 furymonkey wrote: Whoa this is disgusting. Even there is mis-communication between naniwa and mlg staff, he still shouldn't allow to look at build order or even the replay at all. Such info wouldn't even be available to him in the first place even the map is in cross position. He is just pissed that he can't do his build and trying to make his action justified, which it isn't.
When is people gonna get the following: You can see the build order in the score screen. It doesn't matter if Naniwa watched the replay.
You don't get it, just because you could see the build order doesn't meant players should, and just because you can see it, doesn't meant you should go even further by checking replay. The match shouldn't even restarted in the first place, that means players wouldn't able to access these info under normal circumstance. This is essentially cheating meta game.
On November 21 2011 07:08 furymonkey wrote: Whoa this is disgusting. Even there is mis-communication between naniwa and mlg staff, he still shouldn't allow to look at build order or even the replay at all. Such info wouldn't even be available to him in the first place even the map is in cross position. He is just pissed that he can't do his build and trying to make his action justified, which it isn't.
When is people gonna get the following: You can see the build order in the score screen. It doesn't matter if Naniwa watched the replay.
You don't get it, just because you could see the build order doesn't meant players should, and just because you can see it, doesn't meant you should go even further by checking replay. The match shouldn't even restarted in the first place, that means players wouldn't able to access these info under normal circumstance. This is essentially cheating meta game.
On November 21 2011 07:08 furymonkey wrote: Whoa this is disgusting. Even there is mis-communication between naniwa and mlg staff, he still shouldn't allow to look at build order or even the replay at all. Such info wouldn't even be available to him in the first place even the map is in cross position. He is just pissed that he can't do his build and trying to make his action justified, which it isn't.
When is people gonna get the following: You can see the build order in the score screen. It doesn't matter if Naniwa watched the replay.
You don't get it, just because you could see the build order doesn't meant players should, and just because you can see it, doesn't meant you should go even further by checking replay. The match shouldn't even restarted in the first place, that means players wouldn't able to access these info under normal circumstance. This is essentially cheating meta game.
MLG ruled and said that seeing the build order was not a violation of the rules and that seeing the replay didn't convey any additional information.
They're going to revisit the rules and probably make some new ones but Naniwa did not cheat.
And people need to cut him some slack. He was incredibly ramped up and focused on his play. Honestly, I think the interviewer that took the statement is rather silly for cherry picking a time when he'd probably make the least sense.
In the end, who is worse? Naniwa calling Nestea an "idiot", or the IM coach calling Naniwa a 'dirty asshole' 'fucker' etc.
Wow, that's so classy if true.
On November 21 2011 07:14 Keula wrote: Sundance response according to reddit:
1. He made a mistake then claimed it was the ref.Hhe picked before our admin even went into the booth. Some maps have crosses some do not. He chose one thinking that it was a cross position map when it wasn't. Not a big deal in the end but annoying none the less. 2. Was his mistake. Not anyone else's. 3. He chose the wrong map then freaked. Delayed the broadcast and lashed out. It's not our job to make sure he knows which maps have crosses and which do not. He also chose before the admin went in to talk to him. Onward and upward...
Hypothetically, if Naniwa is right we know MLG, or the admin rather, would never man up and admit it because of the shitstorm this created.
Now when both MLG and Naniwa had their damage control, I think this matter is solved.
On November 21 2011 07:08 furymonkey wrote: Whoa this is disgusting. Even there is mis-communication between naniwa and mlg staff, he still shouldn't allow to look at build order or even the replay at all. Such info wouldn't even be available to him in the first place even the map is in cross position. He is just pissed that he can't do his build and trying to make his action justified, which it isn't.
When is people gonna get the following: You can see the build order in the score screen. It doesn't matter if Naniwa watched the replay.
You don't get it, just because you could see the build order doesn't meant players should, and just because you can see it, doesn't meant you should go even further by checking replay. The match shouldn't even restarted in the first place, that means players wouldn't able to access these info under normal circumstance. This is essentially cheating meta game.
Wow you should run MLG man!
well, he is kinda right though. Restarting a game can totally change the outcome / course of the game even though the build orders remain the same
On November 21 2011 07:08 furymonkey wrote: Whoa this is disgusting. Even there is mis-communication between naniwa and mlg staff, he still shouldn't allow to look at build order or even the replay at all. Such info wouldn't even be available to him in the first place even the map is in cross position. He is just pissed that he can't do his build and trying to make his action justified, which it isn't.
When is people gonna get the following: You can see the build order in the score screen. It doesn't matter if Naniwa watched the replay.
You don't get it, just because you could see the build order doesn't meant players should, and just because you can see it, doesn't meant you should go even further by checking replay. The match shouldn't even restarted in the first place, that means players wouldn't able to access these info under normal circumstance. This is essentially cheating meta game.
Wow you should run MLG man!
MLG is still relatively new in this area, even though they are still more experienced than most of the tournaments out there. It's good thing that MLG and their staffs will learn heaps from this event.
The reaction of Tastosis was the thing made me thinking about the situation the most. Even they were confused / shocked of what was going on as you could clearly see =)
On November 21 2011 07:08 furymonkey wrote: Whoa this is disgusting. Even there is mis-communication between naniwa and mlg staff, he still shouldn't allow to look at build order or even the replay at all. Such info wouldn't even be available to him in the first place even the map is in cross position. He is just pissed that he can't do his build and trying to make his action justified, which it isn't.
When is people gonna get the following: You can see the build order in the score screen. It doesn't matter if Naniwa watched the replay.
The thing about this that bothers me primarily is that when they initially started the game naniwa didn't do anything until MLG admins stopped the game so he could go to the bathroom. When he came back he was able to see what Nestea had planned and was executing for that map. So yeah it doesn't really matter whether he got the info from the replay or the score screen, but the fact that he was able to force the game to restart and get some vital info on the mindset of his opponent at the same time is what matters in this situation. With hindsight, admins should have gone with a new map or they shouldn't have stopped the initial game in the first place. Why reward a player that is acting like a 10 year old if you want to create a professional environment?
On November 21 2011 07:08 furymonkey wrote: Whoa this is disgusting. Even there is mis-communication between naniwa and mlg staff, he still shouldn't allow to look at build order or even the replay at all. Such info wouldn't even be available to him in the first place even the map is in cross position. He is just pissed that he can't do his build and trying to make his action justified, which it isn't.
When is people gonna get the following: You can see the build order in the score screen. It doesn't matter if Naniwa watched the replay.
The thing about this that bothers me primarily is that when they initially started the game naniwa didn't do anything until MLG admins stopped the game so he could go to the bathroom. When he came back he was able to see what Nestea had planned and was executing for that map. So yeah it doesn't really matter whether he got the info from the replay or the score screen, but the fact that he was able to force the game to restart and get some vital info on the mindset of his opponent at the same time is what matters in this situation. With hindsight, admins should have gone with a new map or they shouldn't have stopped the initial game in the first place. Why reward a player that is acting like a 10 year old if you want to create a professional environment?
edit: I see Naniwa is left handed XD
Funny how people talk about 'creating a 'professional environment' and at the same time needlessly trash one of the best players in the game for doing something within the rules that happens all the time at the tournament, when he is really "SAVING ESPORTS(tm)" by showing foreigners can compete with the top Koreans like Nestea and MVP. People claim to want a "professional environment" then they act like complete drama queens over minor situation that didn't even affect the game. Why reward the watchers with high level play when they're going to act like 10 year olds pointing fingers and saying "you're cheating!" when he was fully within the rules, then going on to say "well it was unethical" for some completely arbitrary reasons.
On November 21 2011 07:08 furymonkey wrote: Whoa this is disgusting. Even there is mis-communication between naniwa and mlg staff, he still shouldn't allow to look at build order or even the replay at all. Such info wouldn't even be available to him in the first place even the map is in cross position. He is just pissed that he can't do his build and trying to make his action justified, which it isn't.
When is people gonna get the following: You can see the build order in the score screen. It doesn't matter if Naniwa watched the replay.
The thing about this that bothers me primarily is that when they initially started the game naniwa didn't do anything until MLG admins stopped the game so he could go to the bathroom. When he came back he was able to see what Nestea had planned and was executing for that map. So yeah it doesn't really matter whether he got the info from the replay or the score screen, but the fact that he was able to force the game to restart and get some vital info on the mindset of his opponent at the same time is what matters in this situation. With hindsight, admins should have gone with a new map or they shouldn't have stopped the initial game in the first place. Why reward a player that is acting like a 10 year old if you want to create a professional environment?
edit: I see Naniwa is left handed XD
Funny how people talk about 'creating a 'professional environment' and at the same time needlessly trash one of the best players in the game for doing something within the rules that happens all the time at the tournament, when he is really "SAVING ESPORTS(tm)" by showing foreigners can compete with the top Koreans like Nestea and MVP. People claim to want a "professional environment" then they act like complete drama queens over minor situation that didn't even affect the game. Why reward the watchers with high level play when they're going to act like 10 year olds pointing fingers and saying "you're cheating!" when he was fully within the rules.
I have never seen a player not participate in a game once it started, once they go into the booth they are focused on the game (and they don't need an admin asking them if they might need to go to the bathroom first). I haven't read the MLG rulebook myself but is there something in there about what protocol is once the game start countdown starts? How about a player pausing a game himself? In SC1 that was an autoloss I believe unless they had technical difficulties. In my initial post I did not pay any attention to the pausing thing although in the greater scheme of things with the previous incident of not even playing and getting the match restarted (and also letting your opponent and thousands of people wait for 30 minutes) it makes it really hard for me to say that I am glad with the way a foreigner is competing with a korean.
I'm also not sure why you reacted in such a manner to my post?
I think people are way too used to the Korean honour system where there is practically nothing interesting going on between players. As soon as there is anything remotely resembling drama going on, people jump on it because it's so rare in the Korean scene. I agree it's nice to have some personalities in eSports. When you see the Korean players in these foreign tournaments they actually let loose a little and talk a little bit of (respectful and joking) trash.
Look at MVP and Nestea at Blizzcon, joking around with some trash talk. You don't see that stuff at GSL.
Naniwa made a few mistakes but he apologised and it's over. Looking at his play vs all zergs right now you can clearly see he deserved to beat Nestea. He is just playing at another level right now (and Nestea is in somewhat of a slump right now).
Can't see Naniwa losing this tournament. Leenock vs Naniwa would be interesting to see since he just totally destroyed DRG.
On November 21 2011 08:25 bellyfrog wrote: I think people are way too used to the Korean honour system where there is practically nothing interesting going on between players. As soon as there is anything remotely resembling drama going on, people jump on it because it's so rare in the Korean scene. I agree it's nice to have some personalities in eSports. When you see the Korean players in these foreign tournaments they actually let loose a little and talk a little bit of (respectful and joking) trash.
Look at MVP and Nestea at Blizzcon, joking around with some trash talk. You don't see that stuff at GSL.
Naniwa made a few mistakes but he apologised and it's over. Looking at his play vs all zergs right now you can clearly see he deserved to beat Nestea. He is just playing at another level right now (and Nestea is in somewhat of a slump right now).
Can't see Naniwa losing this tournament. Leenock vs Naniwa would be interesting to see since he just totally destroyed DRG.
Who says they don't? You haven't been watching GSL finals?
And you bracketed yourself, respectful and joking. What Naniwa did doesn't looks respectful in many people's eye, especially after he pulled the restart game stunt, acting childish so admin had to restart. If he won straight up without those little hiccup, people wouldn't be worked up.
On November 21 2011 08:25 bellyfrog wrote: I think people are way too used to the Korean honour system where there is practically nothing interesting going on between players. As soon as there is anything remotely resembling drama going on, people jump on it because it's so rare in the Korean scene. I agree it's nice to have some personalities in eSports. When you see the Korean players in these foreign tournaments they actually let loose a little and talk a little bit of (respectful and joking) trash.
Look at MVP and Nestea at Blizzcon, joking around with some trash talk. You don't see that stuff at GSL.
Naniwa made a few mistakes but he apologised and it's over. Looking at his play vs all zergs right now you can clearly see he deserved to beat Nestea. He is just playing at another level right now (and Nestea is in somewhat of a slump right now).
Can't see Naniwa losing this tournament. Leenock vs Naniwa would be interesting to see since he just totally destroyed DRG.
Who says they don't? You haven't been watching GSL finals?
And you bracketed yourself, respectful and joking. What Naniwa did doesn't looks respectful in many people's eye, especially after he pulled the restart game stunt, acting childish so admin had to restart. If he won straight up without those little hiccup, people wouldn't be worked up.
I also hope leenock able to pull through.
I didn't say Naniwa's actions were respectful and joking though, I don't think it was particularly respectful but it was joking. The thumbs down was obviously a spur of the moment thing, he was pumped and since Nestea said he would destroy Naniwa it was a reaction to that.
Well I've never seen any trash talk in GSL to be honest although I don't watch all the interviews.
Although the situation is unusual it's really quite smart on Naniwas part to get into Nesteas head and unsettle him during the match, not saying I condone it but it was a good move, without breaking any rules.
On November 21 2011 08:25 bellyfrog wrote: I think people are way too used to the Korean honour system where there is practically nothing interesting going on between players. As soon as there is anything remotely resembling drama going on, people jump on it because it's so rare in the Korean scene. I agree it's nice to have some personalities in eSports. When you see the Korean players in these foreign tournaments they actually let loose a little and talk a little bit of (respectful and joking) trash.
Look at MVP and Nestea at Blizzcon, joking around with some trash talk. You don't see that stuff at GSL.
Naniwa made a few mistakes but he apologised and it's over. Looking at his play vs all zergs right now you can clearly see he deserved to beat Nestea. He is just playing at another level right now (and Nestea is in somewhat of a slump right now).
Can't see Naniwa losing this tournament. Leenock vs Naniwa would be interesting to see since he just totally destroyed DRG.
Who says they don't? You haven't been watching GSL finals?
And you bracketed yourself, respectful and joking. What Naniwa did doesn't looks respectful in many people's eye, especially after he pulled the restart game stunt, acting childish so admin had to restart. If he won straight up without those little hiccup, people wouldn't be worked up.
I also hope leenock able to pull through.
I didn't say Naniwa's actions were respectful and joking though, I don't think it was particularly respectful but it was joking. The thumbs down was obviously a spur of the moment thing, he was pumped and since Nestea said he would destroy Naniwa it was a reaction to that.
Well I've never seen any trash talk in GSL to be honest although I don't watch all the interviews.
Although the situation is unusual it's really quite smart on Naniwas part to get into Nesteas head and unsettle him during the match, not saying I condone it but it was a good move, without breaking any rules.
I do agree the thumbs down isn't harmful, but that isn't what Nestea and others are upset about.
The problem is the way he unsettle him during the match like you pointed out. Yes he didn't broke any rules, but since I heard people said MLG is planning to fix it, it means it's bad enough that they going to stop it.
Just because the current rules didn't cover it, doesn't meant his action is justified, he is just isn't held accountable. That is why many people spoke out.
Well if Leenock wins this then on the bright side, that gives Nani code S right then and there. On the not to bright side, Nani doesn't get a 2-0 advantage going into the series
On November 21 2011 08:25 bellyfrog wrote: I think people are way too used to the Korean honour system where there is practically nothing interesting going on between players. As soon as there is anything remotely resembling drama going on, people jump on it because it's so rare in the Korean scene. I agree it's nice to have some personalities in eSports. When you see the Korean players in these foreign tournaments they actually let loose a little and talk a little bit of (respectful and joking) trash.
Look at MVP and Nestea at Blizzcon, joking around with some trash talk. You don't see that stuff at GSL.
Naniwa made a few mistakes but he apologised and it's over. Looking at his play vs all zergs right now you can clearly see he deserved to beat Nestea. He is just playing at another level right now (and Nestea is in somewhat of a slump right now).
Can't see Naniwa losing this tournament. Leenock vs Naniwa would be interesting to see since he just totally destroyed DRG.
Who says they don't? You haven't been watching GSL finals?
And you bracketed yourself, respectful and joking. What Naniwa did doesn't looks respectful in many people's eye, especially after he pulled the restart game stunt, acting childish so admin had to restart. If he won straight up without those little hiccup, people wouldn't be worked up.
I also hope leenock able to pull through.
I didn't say Naniwa's actions were respectful and joking though, I don't think it was particularly respectful but it was joking. The thumbs down was obviously a spur of the moment thing, he was pumped and since Nestea said he would destroy Naniwa it was a reaction to that.
Well I've never seen any trash talk in GSL to be honest although I don't watch all the interviews.
Although the situation is unusual it's really quite smart on Naniwas part to get into Nesteas head and unsettle him during the match, not saying I condone it but it was a good move, without breaking any rules.
I do agree the thumbs down isn't harmful, but that isn't what Nestea and others are upset about.
The problem is the way he unsettle him during the match like you pointed out. Yes he didn't broke any rules, but since I heard people said MLG is planning to fix it, it means it's bad enough that they going to stop it.
Just because the current rules didn't cover it, doesn't meant his action is justified, he is just isn't held accountable. That is why many people spoke out.
You're right and I can understand why people get in a bit of an uproar over stuff like this but like I said I think it's a shame that people think this kind of behaviour ruins events. To me it enhances them and makes things a lot more interesting. In all professional sports there is an element of trash talk, getting in your opponents head and "metagaming". However as soon as that crosses the threshhold of "bad manners" in eSports people start to get their panties in a twist.
Bottom line IMO is Naniwa totally deserved his success here based purely off his spectacular play, I've not seen a toss dominate so hard for a long time and I really hope he gets his Code S spot and fingers crossed this level of play will carry over.
On November 21 2011 09:25 esaul17 wrote: vs Leenock is going to vs REALLY hard. If Naniwa can win this he gets major props, but I think Leenock is the favourite.
Nani gets code S though! Amazing!
I dunno Naniwa is just destroying zergs right now. I don't think anyone can beat him once he gets onto 2 bases and gets his army up, he just has such amazing control. I'd be really surprised if Leenock can take it to be honest but we'll see. I was hoping for Leenock since Nani already demolished every other zerg in the tournament.
It will be cool to see what Leenock has up his sleeve to deal with this FE play. I'm interested if Leenock will try some early roach pressure because there's not many other options for truly damaging the early expand of toss and once that expand is up it feels like the protoss deathball is just too good with Naniwa's incredible micro.
After reading both sides, I think 2 things: Regame or Naniwa should have received a loss.
Whether it was intentional or not, Naniwa gained an unfair advantage equivalent to a "MH" use for the first 2 minutes. If I had someone watch the game, I then said pause please... and had a spectator come up and say... no pool yet...
HUGE advantage for me.
Now whether this happened or not is not the point and you are missing the truth. I don't care if Naniwa is playing the best he has ever done, he received an unfair advantage during the game. Just like the Patriots and "spygate," the team was fined for basically "cheating" in a form or fashion. If he wins MLG Providence, some will remember this as the MLG where Naniwa cheated... others will remember it as the day Foreigners said we are here, and some will just remember the ZvZ's and no Terrans.
I will probably remember this as Naniwa cheated... and then 3 months when I look at all the MLG events I will probably have forgotten how Naniwa won other than how good he was. That being said, this is almost as bad as a missed call by a ref in a World Series game, World Cup game, or any other major event.
Everyone needs to remember These are not proffessional actors. They are gamers
They know very little about on stage conduct. They are regular guys like us who get caught up in the moment, wanting to show off. respect them for that.
On November 21 2011 09:36 catabowl wrote: After reading both sides, I think 2 things: Regame or Naniwa should have received a loss.
Whether it was intentional or not, Naniwa gained an unfair advantage equivalent to a "MH" use for the first 2 minutes. If I had someone watch the game, I then said pause please... and had a spectator come up and say... no pool yet...
HUGE advantage for me.
Now whether this happened or not is not the point and you are missing the truth. I don't care if Naniwa is playing the best he has ever done, he received an unfair advantage during the game. Just like the Patriots and "spygate," the team was fined for basically "cheating" in a form or fashion. If he wins MLG Providence, some will remember this as the MLG where Naniwa cheated... others will remember it as the day Foreigners said we are here, and some will just remember the ZvZ's and no Terrans.
I will probably remember this as Naniwa cheated... and then 3 months when I look at all the MLG events I will probably have forgotten how Naniwa won other than how good he was. That being said, this is almost as bad as a missed call by a ref in a World Series game, World Cup game, or any other major event.
Such a long post for nothing... He did not get any information from his coach because there was an mlg admin with the coach...
On November 21 2011 09:36 catabowl wrote: After reading both sides, I think 2 things: Regame or Naniwa should have received a loss.
Whether it was intentional or not, Naniwa gained an unfair advantage equivalent to a "MH" use for the first 2 minutes. If I had someone watch the game, I then said pause please... and had a spectator come up and say... no pool yet...
HUGE advantage for me.
Now whether this happened or not is not the point and you are missing the truth. I don't care if Naniwa is playing the best he has ever done, he received an unfair advantage during the game. Just like the Patriots and "spygate," the team was fined for basically "cheating" in a form or fashion. If he wins MLG Providence, some will remember this as the MLG where Naniwa cheated... others will remember it as the day Foreigners said we are here, and some will just remember the ZvZ's and no Terrans.
I will probably remember this as Naniwa cheated... and then 3 months when I look at all the MLG events I will probably have forgotten how Naniwa won other than how good he was. That being said, this is almost as bad as a missed call by a ref in a World Series game, World Cup game, or any other major event.
On November 21 2011 09:36 catabowl wrote: After reading both sides, I think 2 things: Regame or Naniwa should have received a loss.
Whether it was intentional or not, Naniwa gained an unfair advantage equivalent to a "MH" use for the first 2 minutes. If I had someone watch the game, I then said pause please... and had a spectator come up and say... no pool yet...
HUGE advantage for me.
Now whether this happened or not is not the point and you are missing the truth. I don't care if Naniwa is playing the best he has ever done, he received an unfair advantage during the game. Just like the Patriots and "spygate," the team was fined for basically "cheating" in a form or fashion. If he wins MLG Providence, some will remember this as the MLG where Naniwa cheated... others will remember it as the day Foreigners said we are here, and some will just remember the ZvZ's and no Terrans.
I will probably remember this as Naniwa cheated... and then 3 months when I look at all the MLG events I will probably have forgotten how Naniwa won other than how good he was. That being said, this is almost as bad as a missed call by a ref in a World Series game, World Cup game, or any other major event.
Such a long post for nothing... He did not get any information from his coach because there was an mlg admin with the coach...
but what language were nani and his coach using? Cause I don't think I'd purposely use a non-native language to communicate if i didn't have to. So who knows what was communicated for sure. Unless the admin know's nani's native lang.
On November 21 2011 09:36 catabowl wrote: After reading both sides, I think 2 things: Regame or Naniwa should have received a loss.
Whether it was intentional or not, Naniwa gained an unfair advantage equivalent to a "MH" use for the first 2 minutes. If I had someone watch the game, I then said pause please... and had a spectator come up and say... no pool yet...
HUGE advantage for me.
Now whether this happened or not is not the point and you are missing the truth. I don't care if Naniwa is playing the best he has ever done, he received an unfair advantage during the game. Just like the Patriots and "spygate," the team was fined for basically "cheating" in a form or fashion. If he wins MLG Providence, some will remember this as the MLG where Naniwa cheated... others will remember it as the day Foreigners said we are here, and some will just remember the ZvZ's and no Terrans.
I will probably remember this as Naniwa cheated... and then 3 months when I look at all the MLG events I will probably have forgotten how Naniwa won other than how good he was. That being said, this is almost as bad as a missed call by a ref in a World Series game, World Cup game, or any other major event.
Such a long post for nothing... He did not get any information from his coach because there was an mlg admin with the coach...
but what language were nani and his coach using? Cause I don't think I'd purposely use a non-native language to communicate if i didn't have to. So who knows what was communicated for sure. Unless the admin know's nani's native lang.
And this, ladies and gentlemen, has officially become a conspiracy theory.
On November 21 2011 09:36 catabowl wrote: After reading both sides, I think 2 things: Regame or Naniwa should have received a loss.
Whether it was intentional or not, Naniwa gained an unfair advantage equivalent to a "MH" use for the first 2 minutes. If I had someone watch the game, I then said pause please... and had a spectator come up and say... no pool yet...
HUGE advantage for me.
Now whether this happened or not is not the point and you are missing the truth. I don't care if Naniwa is playing the best he has ever done, he received an unfair advantage during the game. Just like the Patriots and "spygate," the team was fined for basically "cheating" in a form or fashion. If he wins MLG Providence, some will remember this as the MLG where Naniwa cheated... others will remember it as the day Foreigners said we are here, and some will just remember the ZvZ's and no Terrans.
I will probably remember this as Naniwa cheated... and then 3 months when I look at all the MLG events I will probably have forgotten how Naniwa won other than how good he was. That being said, this is almost as bad as a missed call by a ref in a World Series game, World Cup game, or any other major event.
Such a long post for nothing... He did not get any information from his coach bbecause there was an mlg admin with the coach...
but what language were nani and his coach using? Cause I don't think I'd purposely use a non-native language to communicate if i didn't have to. So who knows what was communicated for sure. Unless the admin know's nani's native lang.
Eh, col is not a Swedish team, why would he have a Swedish coach?...
Didn't really follow the whole story, but all I see is Naniwa apologized for something, so that should be the end of any 'drama.' Anyone who isn't satisfied with that needs to chill out. Naniwa made a mistake and apologized for it; he even admitted that he felt put on the spot. Not many people have the balls to admit they aren't the best public speakers.
players should always be allowed to use the bathroom between games, we are not robots.
I'm pretty sure naniwa didnt call nestea an idiot, but probably meant to say that the way he played a game was idiotic which is not a good thing, but not nearly as bad as a lot of ppl seem to say
Naniwa has always had problems with the way he communicates in public (too arrogant) but I'm almost sure he didn't mean to insult Nestea at all. Nestea is one of the most respected SC2 players in the world and it would make no sense for Naniwa to insult him. About the "cheating": the only persons responsible for that are the MLG admins. You can't blame the players if it is in fact the admins that have given them false information.
Anyway, feel free to believe what you based on the facts given in the OP.
EDIT: For the people that are wondering what Nani and his manager were taking about when he entered the booth: obviously not strategical points (manager != coach) + there were MLG admins standing next to them and I don't think they would have allowed any other language than english, that, to avoid revealing crucial information to Nani (and I don't think coL has a swedish manager anyway, but I could be wrong about that last part).
On November 21 2011 11:59 sunman1g wrote: why does the sc2 community have to create so much drama for every little thing
lol, any scene is like that. music scene, art scene. i know this from first hand experience. the drama in the sc2 scene is fairly tame compared to what i've experienced. i don't want to toss around the term "human nature" but modern society almost thrives on drama.
Who cares if Naniwa insulted Nestea, serious or playful. The games were simply that more exciting; brb quoting MC vs IdrA- but it's okay to insult IdrA because IdrA BM's sometimes too.
Let's just invite kespa over so every player has to have the exact same personality.
I just have to say that people are blowing this drama way out of proportion.
Really, not everyone is hating on Naniwa. Remember that on the internet its just too easy for a few vocal people to seem like a minority.
The booing was indeed lame, but oh well it was not something too bad. Just regular drama from reddit and Tl. Everybody will forget it in 1 week and go back to balance whinning about the FotM race/
E: And people really need to get over this drama. Naniwa even apologized about his comments. I guess the internet mob never is pleased.
i think what should be talked about is Sundance's recent tweets. Naniwa just said that Nestea's strategy was dumb not that nestea is dumb. Sundance is a figure head for the public opinion about esports as a whole and what he did actually was destroying the credibility of esports and mlg as a corporation
On November 21 2011 13:46 windsupernova wrote: The booing was indeed lame, but oh well it was not something too bad. Just regular drama from reddit and Tl. Everybody will forget it in 1 week and go back to balance whinning about the FotM race/
I was at the venue and booed when he was introduced for his last few matches.
I think if he wants to be an ass then he's got every right to do so, but as far as I'm concerned he can reap what he sows. He showed up Nestea, a legendary player who came thousands of miles to play, he put "this tournament is a joke" on the screens on stage, he stormed out of his booth and was refusing to play, and he generally acted like an ass during interviews. I would say about 75% of the people around me were rooting against him during the finals. Imagine that - a foreigner was playing a Korean in the finals of MLG and most of the crowd was cheering openly for the Korean!
I thought his play was brilliant, but that doesn't excuse the rest of it.
It began life as a young thread with lots of potential... but that potential was not that it was destined for good things. No. On the contrary; this thread had the makings of a colossal train-wreck. A wise man once said, "Live fast and die young."
If this is not proof of that maxim, I know not what is, dear gents.
This thread has died young.
In its short life it has done the following things:
1. Provided users a place for people to bash various players. 2. Provided users a place to levy, defend and analyze to death accusations of cheating 3. Provided users a place to blow out of proportion or gravely understate the happenings of the fine event this weekend. 4. Provided moderators with countless reports of idiocy and contemptible posts.
There's nothing to be said that hasn't been said. Let us commend this thread to the deep, and leave simply a lonely rose on its grave. It gave us an outlet, but that outlet is no longer necessary.
EPT![[image loading]](http://a.yfrog.com/img875/5148/gn3ij.jpg)
egggggssssactly.![[image loading]](http://farm7.staticflickr.com/6058/6367877635_2cb318a78e.jpg)
Who knows what actually happened. But if according to that thread, he got to watch the replay, and see Nestea going hatch first, so he knew he could cannon, and giving him an edge early game, thats HUGEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
