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imallinson
United Kingdom3482 Posts
On September 12 2011 01:20 BlackJack wrote: Some of them were saying those things and some of them weren't. But they were all completely classless. I know it was a vocal minority saying this. My point is it is a stupid comparison to make in the first place. edit: I don't see anyone here doing stuff like this: + Show Spoiler + ![[image loading]](http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/files/2011/07/43.jpg) | ||
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Biff The Understudy
France7888 Posts
On September 12 2011 01:21 DeepElemBlues wrote: I think it's pretty disgusting from all sides, Allende wasn't some democratic innocent poor man. It can't be discussed because "American superiority complex" = "pointing out that there were two sides." Anything other than blanket, mindless condemnation of America = "American superiority complex." I know, it makes people pretty mad to be reminded that Allende was two-stepping towards a violent dictatorship of the proletariat. I prefer American "imperialism" to Soviet imperialism, oddly enough so do most of the people who experienced the latter... it's kind of weird how it's mostly only people who benefited from American "imperialism" who complain about it. Believe me, Argentinian didn't have a good time under Videla. I bet they didn't have a better time than Romanians under Ceausescu. Your imperialism has been just as shameful, devastating, disgusting and immoral than the Soviet one. Now, people who say "Oh we did horribly wrong, but some other people did horrible things too so let's not recognize it, let's not apologize and let's not admit anything at all" have suspicious moral values. If you justification for America's crimes is that Soviet Russia was wrong, I'm sorry to tell you that you won't go far. There will always be someone worse (and I don't think Soviet Russia was even worse in terms of international policy). But yeah, the good Americans vs evil x. Black and white. God save us. All that stuff. | ||
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Perseverance
Japan2800 Posts
RIP, poor victims. | ||
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KentHenry
United States260 Posts
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Holophonist
United States297 Posts
Also, 9/11 is a sad day in AMERICAN history. If TL has a Chilean-based forum, post this there. Let me put it this way... would I go to Chile and tell people to mourn for our 9/11? No, I wouldn't. THAT'S the difference. | ||
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Mr. Wiggles
Canada5894 Posts
Thanks for bringing it up again, I'm going to read into it more, refresh my memory, and probably deepen my knowledge of it as well. On September 12 2011 01:31 Holophonist wrote: I hate this thread. It's not an "american superiority complex" that causes people to disagree with this thread. It's the fact that the OP clearly has an agenda. Why else would he point out the "US involvement"? You have to know what you're getting into when posting a thread like this on a day like today, and I'd be surprised if that wasn't the whole point. Also, 9/11 is a sad day in AMERICAN history. If TL has a Chilean-based forum, post this there. Let me put it this way... would I go to Chile and tell people to mourn for our 9/11? No, I wouldn't. THAT'S the difference. 1. Because the US was involved. 2. TL is an International forum, not an American forum. Get over yourself. | ||
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Drorctopus
Netherlands135 Posts
On September 12 2011 01:31 Holophonist wrote: I hate this thread. It's not an "american superiority complex" that causes people to disagree with this thread. It's the fact that the OP clearly has an agenda. Why else would he point out the "US involvement"? You have to know what you're getting into when posting a thread like this on a day like today, and I'd be surprised if that wasn't the whole point. Also, 9/11 is a sad day in AMERICAN history. If TL has a Chilean-based forum, post this there. Let me put it this way... would I go to Chile and tell people to mourn for our 9/11? No, I wouldn't. THAT'S the difference. Dude TL isnt american-based. Its international. The people who made team liquid are dutch, so he has all right to post that here. | ||
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BlackJack
United States10495 Posts
On September 12 2011 01:26 imallinson wrote: I know it was a vocal minority saying this. My point is it is a stupid comparison to make in the first place. My point wasn't that it was a vocal minority. My point was that not everyone was so forward in saying "Japan deserved this." Some people were simply saying "let's commemorate those that died on Pearl Harbor." Then you realize that is also a passive-agressive douchebag thing to say even though there is nothing inherently wrong with the sentence "let's commemorate those that died on Pearl Harbor" | ||
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Biff The Understudy
France7888 Posts
On September 12 2011 01:31 Holophonist wrote: I hate this thread. It's not an "american superiority complex" that causes people to disagree with this thread. It's the fact that the OP clearly has an agenda. Why else would he point out the "US involvement"? You have to know what you're getting into when posting a thread like this on a day like today, and I'd be surprised if that wasn't the whole point. Also, 9/11 is a sad day in AMERICAN history. If TL has a Chilean-based forum, post this there. Let me put it this way... would I go to Chile and tell people to mourn for our 9/11? No, I wouldn't. THAT'S the difference. Funny because if Chilean 9/11 should be in a Chilean forum, American 9/11 should be in an American forum. So what about the other thread? | ||
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drag_
England425 Posts
On September 12 2011 01:27 Biff The Understudy wrote: Believe me, Argentinian didn't have a good time under Videla. I bet they didn't have a better time than Romanians under Ceausescu. Your imperialism has been just as shameful, devastating, disgusting and immoral than the Soviet one. Now, people who say "Oh we did horribly wrong, but some other people did horrible things too so let's not recognize it, let's not apologize and let's not admit anything at all" have suspicious moral values. If you justification for America's crimes is that Soviet Russia was wrong, I'm sorry to tell you that you won't go far. There will always be someone worse (and I don't think Soviet Russia was even worse in terms of international policy). But yeah, the good Americans vs evil x. Black and white. God save us. All that stuff. Calm down man, between you French and us Brits I think we've caused a lot more damage mankind than the Americans. And just like we don't like to be constantly reminded from everywhere that we committed all these atrocities, neither do American people all the time, epsecially on this day, so just chill out. | ||
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Biff The Understudy
France7888 Posts
On September 12 2011 01:31 KentHenry wrote: I'm glad Pinochet overthrew the political leaders of a country heading in the direction of communism. Many people may dislike Pinochet and call him a mass murderer, but he really did bring back democracy to Chile in a time of need; but not in a civil way, which sometimes being civil gets you nowhere. That's the most disgusting and disturbing post I have seen on this forum. | ||
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redviper
Pakistan2333 Posts
Here is an interview with a Chilean-American. It was very touching personally, the horror he felt at both events. http://www.democracynow.org/2011/9/8/epitaph_for_another_9_11_reknown Also whoever thinks that Pakistan is not fucked up because of US involvement doesn't know Pakistani history. There is a reason why Pakistanis hate american foreign policy. Its not because we hate your freedom btw. | ||
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imallinson
United Kingdom3482 Posts
On September 12 2011 01:34 BlackJack wrote: My point wasn't that it was a vocal minority. My point was that not everyone was so forward in saying "Japan deserved this." Some people were simply saying "let's commemorate those that died on Pearl Harbor." Then you realize that is also a passive-agressive douchebag thing to say even though there is nothing inherently wrong with the sentence "let's commemorate those that died on Pearl Harbor" OK point taken, but I'm missing how the Pearl Harbour comparison is relevant. | ||
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DeepElemBlues
United States5079 Posts
Believe me, Argentinian didn't have a good time under Videla. I bet they didn't have a better time than Romanians under Ceausescu. Your imperialism has been just as shameful, devastating, disgusting and immoral than the Soviet one. No matter how hard you try to make the two equivalent, the Communist system was far more shameful, devastating, disgusting, and immoral. Now, people who say "Oh we did horribly wrong, but some other people did horrible things too so let's not recognize it, let's not apologize and let's not admit anything at all" have suspicious moral values. If you justification for America's crimes is that Soviet Russia was wrong, I'm sorry to tell you that you won't go far. There will always be someone worse (and I don't think Soviet Russia was even worse in terms of international policy). I don't recall any Americans saying we shouldn't recognize where we made mistakes or did things from the start that were wrong. The problem is that people like you present a double standard and demand that the US admit that it was actually worse (which is total nonsense) and anyone who objects is immediately subjected to your bad relativistic and childish arguments ("Saying someone else did it too doesn't make it right!" Is this fourth grade? We're talking about nations not people, the world is a little more complex). I would never say the USSR was brutal and evil just because of the revenge they took on Germany in 1945, the Germans attacked them and were brutal and evil towards them first and were literally trying to wipe them out. And consequently I'm not going to condemn the US for "propping up" right-wing dictatorships instead of allowing left-wing dictatorships to be propped up by the Soviet Union. It wasn't the US that lied at the end of WWII and occupied half of Europe, it wasn't the US that poured money and agents into Greece and Turkey first, it wasn't the US that caused Kim il Sung to invade South Korea in 1950, it wasn't the US that blockaded West Berlin in 1948, it wasn't the US that shelled Quemoy and Matsu, and it wasn't the US that killed ~100,000,000 people through deliberate starvation, mass shootings, labor to death in gulags, beatings from a Red Guard mob, etc. Bolded part essentially strips you of all credibility to speak on the subject. I'm sorry the blood-soaked animals you like so much lost and aren't able to kill tens of millions of people anymore. That's how I feel about your minimization of Communist atrocities and exaggeration of "American" ones. But yeah, the good american. Black and white. All that stuff. You're talking about yourself, you realize that right? The good Communist. Black and white. All that stuff. Also whoever thinks that Pakistan is not fucked up because of US involvement doesn't know Pakistani history. Yeah it was our fault we supported Haq after he started doing this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zia-ul-Haq's_Islamization Which is directly responsible for the low-grade civil war engulfing your country now. There is a reason why Pakistanis hate american foreign policy. Its not because we hate your freedom btw. Actually it is. It's partly because of anti-Semitism, and Islamic supremacism among Pakistanis. Basically if Pakistanis started joining the 20th century - not the 21st, the 20th - there'd be a lot less problems. Not the US' fault that at the least a significant minority of your countrymen support terrorist massacres and terrorist oppression. It wasn't the CIA that killed Benazhir Bhutto, it was your own intelligence agency-connected Islamist terrorists. | ||
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Biff The Understudy
France7888 Posts
On September 12 2011 01:36 drag_ wrote: Calm down man, between you French and us Brits I think we've caused a lot more damage mankind than the Americans. And just like we don't like to be constantly reminded from everywhere that we committed all these atrocities, neither do American people all the time, epsecially on this day, so just chill out. I know, and when Algerian or Africans remind us our history we don't start to justify ourselves saying we were right. I know the crimes France has committed, and they are pretty serious. And when I read about colonization and how we treated the populations, I feel pain in my whole body. We were the bad ones. But when I see people like DeepemBlue who justify, refuse to recognize the crimes that his country committed only 30 years ago (and never apologized for) because of some ideological blindness and typical manicheism, I find it really problematic. | ||
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Mecker
Sweden219 Posts
On September 12 2011 01:34 BlackJack wrote: My point wasn't that it was a vocal minority. My point was that not everyone was so forward in saying "Japan deserved this." Some people were simply saying "let's commemorate those that died on Pearl Harbor." Then you realize that is also a passive-agressive douchebag thing to say even though there is nothing inherently wrong with the sentence "let's commemorate those that died on Pearl Harbor" A lot of people completely disagree with the concept of memorial days for specific events and thus find it interesting to point out the obvious logical inconsistencies with honoring the deaths of 3000 people on a particular day whereas ignoring far more impacting events. | ||
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thoradycus
Malaysia3262 Posts
On September 12 2011 01:31 Holophonist wrote: I hate this thread. It's not an "american superiority complex" that causes people to disagree with this thread. It's the fact that the OP clearly has an agenda. Why else would he point out the "US involvement"? You have to know what you're getting into when posting a thread like this on a day like today, and I'd be surprised if that wasn't the whole point. Also, 9/11 is a sad day in AMERICAN history. If TL has a Chilean-based forum, post this there. Let me put it this way... would I go to Chile and tell people to mourn for our 9/11? No, I wouldn't. THAT'S the difference. By your definition TL is an american forum, which is clearly wrong. This is an international forum, and people can post topics of different countries whenever they feel like it. were in a freaking GENERAL forum after all. | ||
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muse5187
1125 Posts
On September 12 2011 01:39 imallinson wrote: OK point taken, but I'm missing how the Pearl Harbour comparison is relevant. Saying "Let's commemorate those that died on Pearl Harbor", right after the tsunami was a thinly veiled way of saying that they are happy the tsunami happened because of what the japanese did at pearl harbor. It's overt douchebaggery. | ||
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dogabutila
United States1437 Posts
I DO know a lot of people who do special things for dates like multiples of 5 or 10. Fuck off with your agenda. Pretend to be as self righteous as you want with your bullshit "oh noes I didn't mean to do anything" but we arn't buying it. So lastly, fuck you OP. | ||
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Drorctopus
Netherlands135 Posts
On September 12 2011 01:42 muse5187 wrote: Saying "Let's commemorate those that died on Pearl Harbor", right after the tsunami was a thinly veiled way of saying that they are happy the tsunami happened because of what the japanese did at pearl harbor. It's overt douchebaggery. So true. The people who died in japan because of the tsunami have nothing to do with what happened at pearl harbor. | ||
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