EPTThe prob is not balance overall but the asyncronous nature of it
[Poll] Best/Worst race? - Page 11
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kar1181
United Kingdom515 Posts
The prob is not balance overall but the asyncronous nature of it | ||
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ninjakitteh
United States2 Posts
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Oddysay
Canada597 Posts
and weakest on the race they play . i can tell you 95 % of people here understand almost nothing about the game and they just shoot imba imba imba imba when they lose or follow what other people say , who care what tester think lol? pff they just follow the current good player build order . almost funny . | ||
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clickrush
Switzerland3257 Posts
On June 09 2010 01:39 nyshak wrote: I find it funny that people always say "expand more" to zerg players, as if expanding was something you could do any time for no cost. Lolz. Expanding takes resources and time and makes you very very vulnerable. Plus, as zerg your not done with just the expansion itself, you must construct your creep highway as well. Terrans simply build ther CC in base and fly out when ready, Protoss warp in Nexus, Gas and a Pylon at the same time. Maybe Pylon plus cannons first. While Terran and Protoss can do pretty much anything from one base early on, Zerg are almost forced to expand. Thats predictable beyond measure and a huge weakness. I hope Blizz will fix that or someone proves me wrong by creating more 1 base builds for zerg that last until the mid game and don't suck. I dont think you fully understand why people say that Zerg allways can expand more than T/P. first of all Z expands cheaper and faster than P/T. secondly: if T/P expands faster/more than Z then Z has the possibility to overrun them. for example if T/P fast expands against a one base Z then he will not be able to deal against nydus/muta without the help of static defenses. if they still decide to build static defenses then you can expand safely, faster and cheaper than P/T. all this means that Z determines the rythm of expanding and has allways a little more income. edit: I didnt vote either because the concept of the poll is flawed in my opininon. but I somewhat like this discussion nontheless. | ||
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danl9rm
United States3111 Posts
On April 23 2010 18:17 likeaboss wrote: Ok.... since this poll is pretty crazy voting going on right now.... please dont vote if your not in the beta or if you dont feel your skilled enough to understand the imbalances of ALL matchups. Dont vote for protoss being the strongest just because you think immortals are OP i find this hilarious considering ur first post, but ok | ||
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Dremic
66 Posts
On June 09 2010 01:57 Oddysay wrote: actualy that more : everyone is going to vote strongest on the race they lose all the time and weakest on the race they play . i can tell you 95 % of people here understand almost nothing about the game and they just shoot imba imba imba imba when they lose or follow what other people say , who care what tester think lol? pff they just follow the current good player build order . almost funny . What is the purpose of your post besides being ignorant? I use my own build order. And I think we all know the poll is biased | ||
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kajeus
United States679 Posts
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Gareth
United States39 Posts
I voted Terrans weakest race because most terran players (I've played) mostly use the 3M ball of lol.( marauders,reapers,marine). Hardly any terrans use the mech half of their build tree unless they are so far ahead, they cant think of anything else to use. | ||
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Konsume
Canada466 Posts
(will mostly play as zerg on the next restart since I enjoy them and I know that zergs problem will be gone sometime soon) but in the mean time: Strongest : Terran Simply put that I played the 3 races at diamond level. Terran felt the easiest to learn (tho I must admit that it was my 3rd... so I knew what I had to know before I even got to play the race), I also find that as terran I can control the openings like if I was playing white on a chess board. You have soo many openings you can do: 1. Fast reaper 2. Fast banshee 3. Fast hellions 4. Marines, Marauder timing push 5. Bunker harass.... 6. Fast expand 7. many many many more it just doesn't feel like that with the other 2 races. Protoss you either go straight 2 gate or go 1gate+cyber and than decide, but you're almost always forced to go robo. As zerg you either go fast lings or fast expand or roaches and you're the only race that can't block his ramp. In any case both Protoss and Zerg has less openings than Terran which means that you need to scout terran but since terran BLOCK you can't always scout what he's doing and you've have to take some guesses... which aren't always accurate. Weakest : Zerg Simply put that early zergs are actualy TERRIBLE. If you can't scout cause of the ramp block (aka every map can be ramp blocked by toss or terran) you don't know if you'll be facing air, or mass X units or what ever so you often need to sacrifice 1 overlord to know what you'll go up against. In order to survive.. you'll have to get 5 lings : 1 zealots 3 lings : 1 marine Also, 1st VALID air defense is spore colony which takes 10 sec to root (which is enough time to kill if focused) and queens (unless you mass them) aren't a valid air counter if I think that 1 void ray will kill 1queen ½ and 1 cloacked banshee will just rape everything. Something needs to be done regarding this... imo the solution of roaches switch with hydra is a good solution if you nerf a bit hydras and buff roaches. Late game a good terran can kill your expand 1 by 1, even if you out macroed him in the early stage. Everyone says: "use zerg mobility"... but eh! I find out that both terran and protoss have some kind of cliff jumping units to pressure while zerg has the SUPER SLOW exit and costy nydus worm or drops (which the 3 races have). Also Zergs spell....... are..... yah...... Fungal : 35 damage? the only usefulness of this spell is to stop a swarm of MMM and let your hydras hit them a bit before they move and kill. Neural Parasite: Well since its range 9 it's ok.... but.... cost alot of energy and since the infestors are soooo fragile.... it's almost not worth it (eventho we need to do 3-4 per game... and since it's a REQUIREMENT FOR HIVE....) Frenzy:... eh??? do I need to say more.... Infested terran : ?!? 100 energy for 1 terran that will do no damage?! Corruption : that kinda usefull but then again compared to all other spells...... Also we must concider that zerg has the less units and also less upgrades. Finaly the zerg mobility is limited to the creep and creep can be killed with observers which is kinda easy to get in SC2 and.... I would need another 2 hours to state everything but I think it's enough. And ZvZ is the most terrible mirror match you can have. It can go either way even if you put a diamond against a copper. | ||
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nyshak
Germany132 Posts
I dont think you fully understand why people say that Zerg allways can expand more than T/P. first of all Z expands cheaper and faster than P/T. secondly: if T/P expands faster/more than Z then Z has the possibility to overrun them. for example if T/P fast expands against a one base Z then he will not be able to deal against nydus/muta without the help of static defenses. if they still decide to build static defenses then you can expand safely, faster and cheaper than P/T. all this means that Z determines the rythm of expanding and has allways a little more income. edit: I didnt vote either because the concept of the poll is flawed in my opininon. but I somewhat like this discussion nontheless. A Zerg hatch is 300 mins but you have to include 50 for the drone plus the drone's build time. Vs. a 400 min CC as terran that can be build without exposing it and a 400 Nexus that does not block your worker unit. My point is that expanding for zerg is not as easy as many Terrans and Protoss make it out to be. Plus its predictable and not flexible (boring?). As a matter of fact, a CC, a Nexus and a Hatchery all have build time of 100 (not including the drone you have to replace as zerg). So why can you say zerg can expand faster? Thats simply not true. | ||
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Grebliv
Iceland800 Posts
On June 09 2010 01:39 nyshak wrote: I find it funny that people always say "expand more" to zerg players, as if expanding was something you could do any time for no cost. Lolz. Expanding takes resources and time and makes you very very vulnerable. Plus, as zerg your not done with just the expansion itself, you must construct your creep highway as well. Terrans simply build ther CC in base and fly out when ready, Protoss warp in Nexus, Gas and a Pylon at the same time. Maybe Pylon plus cannons first. While Terran and Protoss can do pretty much anything from one base early on, Zerg are almost forced to expand. Thats predictable beyond measure and a huge weakness. I hope Blizz will fix that or someone proves me wrong by creating more 1 base builds for zerg that last until the mid game and don't suck. Why would you want 1base builds  , it's about as fun as playing vs the very easy comp, you make an army and attack (the opponents correct response is usually just to expo and get by or at least focus more on econ/tech).In bw you don't see 1base builds anymore aside from some very refined ones used for surprise or when the opponent is being a bit too greedy, usually ends up in a macro game anyways. Every race expands and then expands again or even starts out double expanding, It's not supposed to be predictable and easily countered. 1base > macro cheese > standard > 1base Also I find the expand more sentiment mostly be directed towards anti-mech strategy where it is somewhat justified by the fact that the terran is very immobile and cannot really punish expos easily aside from hellion harass. On June 09 2010 02:20 nyshak wrote: A Zerg hatch is 300 mins but you have to include 50 for the drone plus the drone's build time. Vs. a 400 min CC as terran that can be build without exposing it and a 400 Nexus that does not block your worker unit. My point is that expanding for zerg is not as easy as many Terrans and Protoss make it out to be. Plus its predictable and not flexible (boring?). As a matter of fact, a CC, a Nexus and a Hatchery all have build time of 100 (not including the drone you have to replace as zerg). So why can you say zerg can expand faster? Thats simply not true. They can make a ton more drones than anyone else if left relatively alone and the fact that their "late expo" comes about 10 food before other races early ones might be an indicator. | ||
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SkCom
Canada229 Posts
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nyshak
Germany132 Posts
I went into the cost of buildings only in reply to the poster above. The main point of my post still stands: Zerg are almost forced to expo early on (be it super early or more standard like 16 Hatch), while the other races must not. That may well be a design choice, so the zerg are supposed to expand. Fine. Still predictable and predictable in a game such as this means others are able to exploit it. | ||
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TLOBrian
United States453 Posts
On June 08 2010 13:16 Saechiis wrote: Ironic, because I'm willing to bet that you're a Zerg player. Q_Q Seriously, there hasn't been any time to claim racial imbalances with all the patches flying around. There's just biased people and polls claiming their race is weakest and the stuff they lose to the most is OP. I'm random, actually! No, they're right. You're just scared to get nerfed, you enjoy winning with imbalanced things : D | ||
Chill
Calgary25998 Posts
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