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![[image loading]](http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_doCF-bXM978/SIFLvVHe8cI/AAAAAAAAAF4/jsJgqnikl7c/s400/VulcanMindMeld.png)
Ok, everyone and their mom knows about Imbalords. Nuff said about that. It seems that blizzard has not discovered a solution to this end game tyrant yet.
We need to work together and figure out a possible nerf that works well without ruining the role of the unit, which is a massive heavy assault DPS/Range Sieger. Which I'm sure blizzard is struggling with. Let's help them out.
Broodlord Unit Stats:
275 HP Bio/massive
Armor: 2+1
Range: 9
Sight: 12
Speed : Normal 1.4
Dmg 20+3
(broodlord carries 2 broodling on his back, which are released upon attack. One will constantly refill for each consequential attack.)
Broodling Unit Stats:
30 HP Bio
Melee
Dmg: 4+1
Armor: 0+1
Speed: very fast (not sure #)
Self destructs after 8 seconds.
Problems/Concerns:
- DPS
- Range
- Broodling production rate
- Reduce the duration of a broodling
- Broodling interfering with the Attack AI
- HP of broodlings
- Unit type of broodlings
- Broodlings interfering with the movement of units
- Allow broodlings to be fired upon as they fly in the air (like interceptors)
- (if you have another please post)
Possible Solutions:
- Lower the damage output of broodlings heavily.
- Reduce the range of the broodlord slightly.
- Reduce the amount of broodlings fired and replenished.
- Allow units to clip through broodlings. (possibly make them burrow but not be cloaked and can give and receive damage)
- Give all armor types to broodlings
- Lower HP to 15 or 20
- Change the way broodlings work. Instead of creating a unit, make the unit stick to the head of the target (like in alien lol) but it can still be killed and dies after X time.
- Remove the bonuses from upgrades they receive (or at least just the armor).
- Lower attack priority of broodlings
- (if you have another please post)
Please feel free to voice opinions about my suggestions as well as give ideas for some of your own concerns or suggestions. Keep the bullshit to a minimum. Don't mean to be elitist but, please refrain from posting if you are in the lower ranks and/or don't have any real in game experience troubleshooting this unit.
PS- If by chance you disagree with them being imbalanced. Please post your strategies etc on dealing with them for others to test out for themselves.
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It would be much better to lay out a supported case for why you think that they are imbalanced rather than trying to figure out an appropriate nerf. It only results in silly unworkable proposals (e.g., to give broodlings all armor types)
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On April 19 2010 15:32 nodule wrote:
It would be much better to lay out a supported case for why you think that they are imbalanced rather than trying to figure out an appropriate nerf. It only results in silly unworkable proposals (e.g., to give broodlings all armor types)
Do I really have to do this? The main problem lies within the fact that broodlings screw with the AI and movement of the ground AA units.
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Just take broodling out and take hp down by 25 that would do it just fine
Nooo!!! I just losse my marine = (
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I think broodlords should have a base attack, and you can augment it by purchasing broodlords, similar to SC1's reavers.
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They should fire at the rate of a sieged siege tank, or only fire 1 broodling per shot so that way a good sized army should be able to take out the broodling and focus back on the broodlord. The fact of the matter is you can't kill the broodlings faster than they are thrown at you once 3-4 broodlords are out.
Overall its just a stupid unit though. They make BC's and Carrier's look like complete pussies.
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If memory serves correctly I believe that the consensus among top players (artosis, louder, LZ, Day9) was that the best way to fix the unit was to simply make it so that broodlings did no damage, and that just messing with the auto target was enough.
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Good thread. Might want to include some replays of broodlords causing a zerg to win when they arguably shouldn't have.
I'd say make it do splash air->ground rather than spawn ground units... like, imagine it tossing out a ton of explosive broodling creatures.
Another idea could be to make broodlings cost a small amount of energy so that it regenerates energy fast enough to operate at about half its normal attack speed... but of course if it had a reasonable amount of energy it would be able to last the whole fight. This would allow ghosts and HT to be a viable soft counter (slow down their attack rate) in combination with other units.
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If people keep complaining, blizzard is going to nerf them. As it stand they only appear in maybe 1 out of 15 games. If you strip them of 100 hp, or remove broodlings, or make them even more expensive, they'll be used in 0 out of 15. And that would be a real shame.
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On April 19 2010 15:35 checo wrote:
Just take broodling out and take hp down by 25 that would do it just fine
Nooo!!! I just losse my marine = (
that is not a good solution imho. The broodlings shouldn't just be removed, there has to be a less drastic option.
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Aren't there some rules for topics like this ?
Anyway, they have weaknesses, mainly the thing that they can't attack top of the tree units like BC and Carriers, which is what they should be compared to. Also, don't forget that if you nerf them too much, there is simply no other go-to unit for zerg beyond mass of hydras/roaches spiced with some other stuff and people are getting sick of that already.
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Just slowing the attack speed of Broodlords would be enough to ease the massive broodling spam and general dmg output..
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On April 19 2010 15:38 CharlieMurphy wrote:Show nested quote +On April 19 2010 15:35 checo wrote:
Just take broodling out and take hp down by 25 that would do it just fine
Nooo!!! I just losse my marine = ( that is not a good solution imho. The broodlings shouldn't just be removed, there has to be a less drastic option.
So the main problem with this guys is that they make AI look more stupid that it really is, unless you want them to redo the pathing of units for the whole game best solucion is just to take them out or like some others said make just 1 of 5 atacks send a broodling or make them cost minerals or stuff like that(this way it won't be that much brodlings and less AI fuck)
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Even with storm/archon/collosus the broodlings still trouble the ground units by walling them.
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Broodlings are essential for zerg in lategame. If Broodlords only dealt damage without any other effects nobody would make them because they wouldn't help at all. Zerg has way less viable/effective splash options than the other races, so they rely on tanking a ton damage for their hydralisks. Pure lings/roaches isn't enough for that, you don't get enough HP per supply to compensate for the insane splash that protoss has in lategame.
So that rules a few of your possible fixes out.
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From what I've seen so far, the Broodlords' range is what's really bothering players. Before you even get a glimpse of them, you got a thick wall of Broodlings choking up your ground army. Kind of reminds me of the BW Vulture/Tank mix, except both roles have been conveniently thrown into one unit.
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On April 19 2010 15:41 checo wrote:Show nested quote +On April 19 2010 15:38 CharlieMurphy wrote:On April 19 2010 15:35 checo wrote:
Just take broodling out and take hp down by 25 that would do it just fine
Nooo!!! I just losse my marine = ( that is not a good solution imho. The broodlings shouldn't just be removed, there has to be a less drastic option. So the main problem with this guys is that they make AI look more stupid that it really is, unless you want them to redo the pathing of units for the whole game best solucion is just to take them out or like some others said make just 1 of 5 atacks send a broodling or make them cost minerals or stuff like that(this way it won't be that much brodlings and less AI fuck)
Even if broodlings had a cost like interceptors it wouldn't change the fact that they screw with the AI. Also, this is a dumb idea because they die after 8 seconds. What would they cost 1 mineral each or something?
On April 19 2010 15:41 zazen wrote:
Just slowing the attack speed of Broodlords would be enough to ease the massive broodling spam and general dmg output..
They will still drop 2 broodlings upon first attack and create that wall for 8~ seconds.
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@ Spinehealth Good point what about less rate of trowing broodlings, what are your thoughts??? Like lets say 1:2 atacks or even 1:3atacks
@Smokeeblade Nice suggestion but as colosi has 9 range les range for Broolords would mean they must be closser to the P ball and then get stormed or sniped by AA fire, but it would be nice to see how this will work
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Make them spawn banelings instead of broodlings. The banelings blow up right away, so no ai-screw-upage.
+ Show Spoiler +I don't think Broodlords need a nerf, they require a lot of time and resources to get, even motherships come out before them.
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i notice you totally neglect using cost/resources as a possible solution. if could be made more expensive or take longer to build
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EPT
