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On March 06 2004 13:19 Excalibur_Z wrote:
I would never want to be a single parent. One person, man or woman, can't do the job of both. As an aside, I've noticed there is a lot of talk on college campuses and high schools where these students have sex with multiple partners then insist he/she can raise the child him/herself. I guess they say that because it's a personal challenge. That's fine for them but it's a selfish motive. How does that benefit the child, or have the child's needs in mind? If you want what's best for the child you need to have two parents =(
like i said, i would want the childs mother to, in fact, BE his mother. However, i'm not going to go pick up some random female and/or male and be like 'hey, come live with me and be my kids parent ok?', over raising the child myself.
I do not want to be a single parent for the challenge, its that i don't agree with most forms of parenting. They teach obedience instead of teaching the kid to think for himself. They believe in horrible forms of punishment such as physical harm, mental harm, or hurtful, unsuitable restrictions. Out of every single parent i have ever met, about 3 or 4 live up to my expectations. To think that i will find a person in life who can also live up to those expectations would be naive.
I believe that i am far more capabale to raise a child as a single parent than most couples. However, this may be due to arrogance (thought i do not perceive it as such) - im willing to consider/accept that. That is also why i want to wait a long time before i make any decision.
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United States12237 Posts
On March 06 2004 13:33 badteeth wrote: Show nested quote +On March 06 2004 11:06 ObsoleteLogic wrote:
Nice typing there chief. I'm sorry, I'm afraid I wasn't aware that the world is supposed to conform to the whims of popular society. Relativists. (Yes, that includes "mordern" terminology. If you change the meaning of a word... heh) Shut the fuck up you ignorant hypocrite. The only thing you want is other people to conform to your narrow-minded, slightly less whimsical views of how society should be. Modern day American christianity is nothing more than a bunch of puritanical people who are so afraid of their own sins that they need a scapegoat to surpress their feelings of doubt and guilt. You fucking go cloth some homeless people like jesus intended you to do, and shut the fuck up about people who are at heart probably ten times the christian you'll ever be.
You're in no position to judge his faith, and you aren't eligible to make claims as to what makes a "good" Christian.
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You're seriously telling me jesus promoted hatred? You're also seriously telling me obsolete logic is a good christian?
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United States12237 Posts
On March 06 2004 13:33 Teroru wrote: Show nested quote +On March 06 2004 13:19 Excalibur_Z wrote:
I would never want to be a single parent. One person, man or woman, can't do the job of both. As an aside, I've noticed there is a lot of talk on college campuses and high schools where these students have sex with multiple partners then insist he/she can raise the child him/herself. I guess they say that because it's a personal challenge. That's fine for them but it's a selfish motive. How does that benefit the child, or have the child's needs in mind? If you want what's best for the child you need to have two parents =( like i said, i would want the childs mother to, in fact, BE his mother. However, i'm not going to go pick up some random female and/or male and be like 'hey, come live with me and be my kids parent ok?', over raising the child myself. I do not want to be a single parent for the challenge, its that i don't agree with most forms of parenting. They teach obedience instead of teaching the kid to think for himself. They believe in horrible forms of punishment such as physical harm, mental harm, or hurtful, unsuitable restrictions. Out of every single parent i have ever met, about 3 or 4 live up to my expectations. To think that i will find a person in life who can also live up to those expectations would be naive. I believe that i am far more capabale to raise a child as a single parent than most couples. However, this may be due to arrogance (thought i do not perceive it as such) - im willing to consider/accept that. That is also why i want to wait a long time before i make any decision.
I should reveal a bit of a background story. I was lucky enough to be involved with a very mature girl (my ex-fiancee) for two years. As time passed and we got closer to the wedding date we talked seriously about having children. Her job was a respite care worker so that already gave her some experience, essentially has a part-time surrogate mother. However, even as she was doing this job in the summer after she was out of high school, it was very stressful. Despite her impressive maturity, organization, and demeanor, she would not be able to raise a child on her own. The most important thing is to keep the child's well-being as the #1 priority. That well-being is jeopardized when the parent gets as emotionally and mentally drained as my ex. It surely is arrogant to believe otherwise, or to think that drain won't happen to you, because it is inevitable.
As for disciplinary measures, those are mandatory too. Children love to test their limits. Parents just need to teach children not to do things, then explain why if possible. Many parents fall into the trap of wanting their children to like them, so they adopt a more lenient agenda, but that doesn't teach a child to respect or honor his parents because they have been placed at the same level. This also allows children to be more unruly and the parents become more submissive - it's a slippery slope.
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United States12237 Posts
On March 06 2004 13:40 badteeth wrote:
You're seriously telling me jesus promoted hatred? You're also seriously telling me obsolete logic is a good christian?
Don't put words in my mouth, I told you no such thing. I'm also not going to judge ObsoleteLogic's faith.
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On March 06 2004 13:53 Excalibur_Z wrote: Show nested quote +On March 06 2004 13:33 Teroru wrote: On March 06 2004 13:19 Excalibur_Z wrote:
I would never want to be a single parent. One person, man or woman, can't do the job of both. As an aside, I've noticed there is a lot of talk on college campuses and high schools where these students have sex with multiple partners then insist he/she can raise the child him/herself. I guess they say that because it's a personal challenge. That's fine for them but it's a selfish motive. How does that benefit the child, or have the child's needs in mind? If you want what's best for the child you need to have two parents =( like i said, i would want the childs mother to, in fact, BE his mother. However, i'm not going to go pick up some random female and/or male and be like 'hey, come live with me and be my kids parent ok?', over raising the child myself. I do not want to be a single parent for the challenge, its that i don't agree with most forms of parenting. They teach obedience instead of teaching the kid to think for himself. They believe in horrible forms of punishment such as physical harm, mental harm, or hurtful, unsuitable restrictions. Out of every single parent i have ever met, about 3 or 4 live up to my expectations. To think that i will find a person in life who can also live up to those expectations would be naive. I believe that i am far more capabale to raise a child as a single parent than most couples. However, this may be due to arrogance (thought i do not perceive it as such) - im willing to consider/accept that. That is also why i want to wait a long time before i make any decision. I should reveal a bit of a background story. I was lucky enough to be involved with a very mature girl (my ex-fiancee) for two years. As time passed and we got closer to the wedding date we talked seriously about having children. Her job was a respite care worker so that already gave her some experience, essentially has a part-time surrogate mother. However, even as she was doing this job in the summer after she was out of high school, it was very stressful. Despite her impressive maturity, organization, and demeanor, she would not be able to raise a child on her own. The most important thing is to keep the child's well-being as the #1 priority. That well-being is jeopardized when the parent gets as emotionally and mentally drained as my ex. It surely is arrogant to believe otherwise, or to think that drain won't happen to you, because it is inevitable. As for disciplinary measures, those are mandatory too. Children love to test their limits. Parents just need to teach children not to do things, then explain why if possible. Many parents fall into the trap of wanting their children to like them, so they adopt a more lenient agenda, but that doesn't teach a child to respect or honor his parents because they have been placed at the same level. This also allows children to be more unruly and the parents become more submissive - it's a slippery slope.
Wholly anecdotal evidence, all crap. And if its so horrible for children to grow up with one parent, they should make marriage last to the death. no mroe divorce.
You're arguement is crap.
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On March 06 2004 13:55 Excalibur_Z wrote: Show nested quote +On March 06 2004 13:40 badteeth wrote:
You're seriously telling me jesus promoted hatred? You're also seriously telling me obsolete logic is a good christian? Don't put words in my mouth, I told you no such thing. I'm also not going to judge ObsoleteLogic's faith.
I'm not questioning his obviously blind faith, i'm questioning his motives. Or you could say i'm qwuestioning the source of his blind faith.
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United States12237 Posts
I don't agree with divorce (I've covered this earlier). I like how you dismiss everything I said as anecdotal while providing no specific evidence. Funny guy!
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Anecdotal evidence is never ever considered compelling. Do you even know what anecdotal evidence is?
You rather have people living in a house filled with hate and contempt? You're priorities are seriously skewed.
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On March 06 2004 13:07 Teroru wrote: Show nested quote +On March 06 2004 07:32 Bill and Bill wrote:
You can't adopt a child if you are going to cause the child harm. Being teased, and turning out gay is harmful to a child, because even Terrou says it sucks to be gay, so why would he want to put someone else through that if he isn't selfish? Because my child most likely WOULDNT be gay. If he decided to disclose the information about me, that would be his choice. If it did somehow got out that i was a homosexual father, i still believe that im equipped with enough skills to get the child through it. It's not like im giving my child a disease or something. You guys make it sound like my childs life wouldnt be worth living because he might get *teased*. Ask anyone on this forum if they would have rather NOT lived because of teasing. Being that i am pretty high on that totem pole, i can tell you that my life is worth it. Sure the teasing sucked when i was young, but i don't regret living the life i have. I woulnd't trade who i am now so i could be a different straight person. The only issue is whether a homosexual can raise kids with equal parenting skills as a heterosexual. Any hypothetical situation can be improved on or avoided. This arguement is now at rest from my perception: no one is arguing whether a homosexual can have good parenting skills, but only what kind of life that child would lead. As for gay marriages (the original topic) it seems that most people are in agreement - except for the religious, in which case the celebration of our love they somehow find offensive. So this is also at rest. Is God really that petty? In all of his brilliance and forgiveness, and love, why would he condemn his children for something they cannot control? Why would he condemn at all? Why would he create a hell, so that man must burn in hell for all eternity, when god is about Love and Forgiveness. I don't get it. Other than being homosexual, in the Christian eyes, im a good person. But because i don't get an erection over a female, im gonna be sent to hell? I just don't fucking get it.
Are you going to talk to your kids about penises going down your esophagus? Or Brad Pitt and some other guys in a threesome? Or do you just keep that information between us Brood War buddies? Do you HONESTLY THINK every gay guy would keep that stuff private?
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United States12237 Posts
On March 06 2004 14:09 badteeth wrote:
Anecdotal evidence is never ever considered compelling. Do you even know what anecdotal evidence is?
You rather have people living in a house filled with hate and contempt? You're priorities are seriously skewed.
You sure do blow things way out of proportion - another logical fallacy. There is a difference between discipline and hate/contempt. When you hate someone you wish ill of them, but when you discipline you do so with the intent to protect them in a future situation.
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On March 06 2004 13:53 Excalibur_Z wrote: Show nested quote +On March 06 2004 13:33 Teroru wrote: On March 06 2004 13:19 Excalibur_Z wrote:
I would never want to be a single parent. One person, man or woman, can't do the job of both. As an aside, I've noticed there is a lot of talk on college campuses and high schools where these students have sex with multiple partners then insist he/she can raise the child him/herself. I guess they say that because it's a personal challenge. That's fine for them but it's a selfish motive. How does that benefit the child, or have the child's needs in mind? If you want what's best for the child you need to have two parents =( like i said, i would want the childs mother to, in fact, BE his mother. However, i'm not going to go pick up some random female and/or male and be like 'hey, come live with me and be my kids parent ok?', over raising the child myself. I do not want to be a single parent for the challenge, its that i don't agree with most forms of parenting. They teach obedience instead of teaching the kid to think for himself. They believe in horrible forms of punishment such as physical harm, mental harm, or hurtful, unsuitable restrictions. Out of every single parent i have ever met, about 3 or 4 live up to my expectations. To think that i will find a person in life who can also live up to those expectations would be naive. I believe that i am far more capabale to raise a child as a single parent than most couples. However, this may be due to arrogance (thought i do not perceive it as such) - im willing to consider/accept that. That is also why i want to wait a long time before i make any decision. I should reveal a bit of a background story. I was lucky enough to be involved with a very mature girl (my ex-fiancee) for two years. As time passed and we got closer to the wedding date we talked seriously about having children. Her job was a respite care worker so that already gave her some experience, essentially has a part-time surrogate mother. However, even as she was doing this job in the summer after she was out of high school, it was very stressful. Despite her impressive maturity, organization, and demeanor, she would not be able to raise a child on her own. The most important thing is to keep the child's well-being as the #1 priority. That well-being is jeopardized when the parent gets as emotionally and mentally drained as my ex. It surely is arrogant to believe otherwise, or to think that drain won't happen to you, because it is inevitable. As for disciplinary measures, those are mandatory too. Children love to test their limits. Parents just need to teach children not to do things, then explain why if possible. Many parents fall into the trap of wanting their children to like them, so they adopt a more lenient agenda, but that doesn't teach a child to respect or honor his parents because they have been placed at the same level. This also allows children to be more unruly and the parents become more submissive - it's a slippery slope.
i never gave consideration to the draining part. :X i was only considering the concepts of treating kids/raising them.
good point - however, that wasnt the arrogance i was referring to.
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You sure do blow things way out of proportion - another logical fallacy. There is a difference between discipline and hate/contempt. When you hate someone you wish ill of them, but when you discipline you do so with the intent to protect them in a future situation.
I was talking about forcing a married couple to stay together. You really think its healthy fopr a kid to live in an environment with that kind of tension?
And whats with the logical fallacy thing? Did i make one? Or are you trying to make me the subject of your intellectual masturbation?
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United States12237 Posts
On March 06 2004 14:21 badteeth wrote: Show nested quote +
You sure do blow things way out of proportion - another logical fallacy. There is a difference between discipline and hate/contempt. When you hate someone you wish ill of them, but when you discipline you do so with the intent to protect them in a future situation.
I was talking about forcing a married couple to stay together. You really think its healthy fopr a kid to live in an environment with that kind of tension? And whats with the logical fallacy thing? Did i make one? Or are you trying to make me the subject of your intellectual masturbation?
If a married couple doesn't stay together the child falls into the pitfall I described before. I grew up in one of those environments and I know the score.
Bravo, bravo. You never can admit when you're wrong can you?
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I accept it because it is a reality. Do you seriously believe 7% of the population is faking? There is no problem.
1 in 14.28 people??? that sounds way too much
are white people most affected cause it sure seems that way. i don't know of any gay black people. i know of a few gay asian people. why is homosexuality more prevalent in males? are there instances in animal nature? what is something else i can relate to? how does gay men's brain functioning side along women's function support homosexuality?
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Norway28695 Posts
okay vietnam
being gay is less accepted in black communities. (same with hispanic ones. )that's why you know of less gay black people. the REASON why you think 1 in 14.28 people is a lot is because people are still ignorant thus gays often aren't honest about their sexuality out of fear of what people will think of them.
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On March 06 2004 13:19 Excalibur_Z wrote: Show nested quote +On March 06 2004 12:57 Teroru wrote: On March 06 2004 09:03 ObsoleteLogic wrote: On March 06 2004 02:43 Teroru wrote: On March 06 2004 00:16 ObsoleteLogic wrote:
Would it suit you, Rei, if I said he and his partner, as a couple, could never have a child? I have more than a few friends who would carry my child. I would even fuck them to do it. Although... i WOULD have to close my eyes, and i would be thinking of George Stults, Brad Pitt, and Matt Damon in a 3some :O Did you read what I said or did it just go in your eyes and out your ears? You and your homosexual buddy will never have a child together, capesh? I do not believe in monogamy. I do not plan on having a long-term homosexual partner. If one of my female friends got insemenated, it would be my intent for me and her to raise the child together. If she did not wish to have child, i would attempt to be a single parent. However, i am only 18, and my opinions might change by the time i decide to have a child. I really don't see that happening until im 35+ years old. I would never want to be a single parent. One person, man or woman, can't do the job of both. As an aside, I've noticed there is a lot of talk on college campuses and high schools where these students have sex with multiple partners then insist he/she can raise the child him/herself. I guess they say that because it's a personal challenge. That's fine for them but it's a selfish motive. How does that benefit the child, or have the child's needs in mind? If you want what's best for the child you need to have two parents =(
No one wants to be a single parent. But if your wife leaves you, what the fuck are you gonna do about it?
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Recent studies have found significantly lower numbers, usually ranging between 1-4%:
Here is a sampling of these newer studies:
A study of 5,514 Canadian college and university students under the age of 25 found 1% who were homosexual and 1% who were bisexual. (King et al., 1988).
A study of 8,337 British men found that 6.1% had had "any homosexual experience" and 3.6% had "1+ homosexual partner ever." (Johnson et al., 1992).
A French study of 20,055 people found that 4.1% of the men and 2.6% of the women had at least one occurrence of intercourse with person of the same sex during their lifetime. (ANRS, 1992).
A Danish random survey found that 2.7% of the 1,373 men who responded to their questionnaire had homosexual experience (intercourse). (Melbye, 1992).
The National Health Interview Survey does household interviews of the civilian non-institutionalized population. The results of three of these surveys, done in 1990-1991 and based on over 9,000 responses each time, found between 2-3% of the people responding said yes to a set of statements which included "You are a man who has had sex with another man at some time since 1977, even one time." (Dawson, Hardy, 1990-1992)
In a random survey of 6,300 Norwegians, 3.5% of the men and 3% of the women reported that they had had a homosexual experience sometime in their life. (Sundet et al., 1988).
http://www.newdirection.ca/a_10per.htm
that's considering "even one time" and experiences...
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On March 06 2004 14:42 Excalibur_Z wrote: Show nested quote +On March 06 2004 14:21 badteeth wrote:
You sure do blow things way out of proportion - another logical fallacy. There is a difference between discipline and hate/contempt. When you hate someone you wish ill of them, but when you discipline you do so with the intent to protect them in a future situation.
I was talking about forcing a married couple to stay together. You really think its healthy fopr a kid to live in an environment with that kind of tension? And whats with the logical fallacy thing? Did i make one? Or are you trying to make me the subject of your intellectual masturbation? If a married couple doesn't stay together the child falls into the pitfall I described before. I grew up in one of those environments and I know the score. Bravo, bravo. You never can admit when you're wrong can you?
I'm a product of a failed marriage as well. I rather live with my single mom than living with fights every day.
Anecdotal evidence means nothing, just like i told you before.
And I'll admit i'm wrong when i'm actually wrong.
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Norway28695 Posts
vietnam and there are countless people who are homosexual but never have any homosexual experiences because they are afraid how all the bigots and ignorant people will respond to them leaving the closet.
either way the numbers don't make a difference. discriminating 2% of the population is still far too much. might be true that 7% is more than the real amount, but it doesn't change anything. ;(
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EPT
