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Shinhan Bank Proleague 2007 @ OnGameNet
vs
Saint[z-zone] (Z) < Monty Hall > sAviOr[gm] (Z)
Bisu (P) < Tau Cross > Much[gm] (P)
Light[aLive] (T)/TheZerg[HyO] (Z) < Vampire > Sea.Jy (Z)/TheManiaMST (T)
HyuN(Z) < Nemesis > DarkElf (T)
Ace Match < Geometry >
[spoiler=results]
Saint < Savior
Bisu < Much (RAPE)
Light[alive]/TheZerg[HyO] > Sea.Jy / TheManiaMst One man stronghold.
Hyun < Darkelf(Sloppy plays and mistakes, but entertaining.)
3-1 CJ
Predictions: Wrong again 
+ Show Spoiler +1.) First real zvz on monty hall. Looking forward to possible ling slipping action or full on muta warfare. I expect a quick aggressive rush on rush or passive buildup. Saint[z-zone] is a great player and I expect him to give a good fight. 65-35 in favor of Savior.
2.) PvP, battle of the minds. I'll put my bets on Bisu, his PvP has thrashed nal_ra and even from his olden amateur replay days, he crushed his fellow protoss players within the 12 minute range. Much's epic series vs Terato was a nice show, but this isn't blitz or one of those extensively long paths from main to main. I predict both players get their nats running, and one of them goes for the neck thrust, a make or break attack. 55-45 in favor of Bisu.
3.) Light and themania are pretty on par with their TvZ micro. Sea.jy and thezerg are also eerily similar, with sea.jy having more emphasis on macro. But fuck that, this is 2v2, anything goes, and in a TZ vs TZ competition on this map, the terrans must hold the foundation to support their zerg partner. (In retrospect of the SKT1 vs MBC final] MBC for this, I think light is the stronger player, assuming both players on the other side don't try anything ballsy.
4.) Nemesis sucks for Z/P. Darkelf is a douche. I want the zergy to win, but I haven't seen a game where a zerg does. I haven't seen any games on this zerg yet, but I'm putting in some blind faith he kicks this fag's ass. 3-1 MBc gogo
Summaries:
+ Show Spoiler [Game 1] +Basically both players expanded to their horizontal naturals followed by another gas. saint opted to get some spore colonies to hold off any early mutalisk action. however, savior went straight up all out mutalisks and eventually got way more than saint
after one huge mutalisk battle, savior comes out on top by about 12 mutalisks. saint types out immediately thereafter. day[9]
+ Show Spoiler [Game 2] +Bisu was looking good, defending properly and keeping an eye on Much's shuttle/reaver. He had an early expansion too.
But Bisu, thinking that he wouldn't be able to save his expansion against a strong push or reaver drop, canceled his expansion. Then Much comes in with a large goon/zealot force and double reavers inside of a shuttle and rapes Bisu's army.
Two of Much's reavers then sit in front of Bisu's gateways along with a handful of dragoons, raping everything that pops out. GG WhatisProtoss
+ Show Spoiler [Game 3] +Light going 8rax(far out of main) and 9pool for thezerg... Looks like they really wanna win this one...ling/marine force making a move on ThemaniaMST. Bunkering behind his minerals, he has a bunker up though. it can only cut off a little of his mining and kill a depot. Sea.Jy countering/harassing TheZerg. Light[Alive] brings a vulture to Sea.jy, kills some lings and drones. thezerg kills jy''s defensive sunken. 2 goli and 1 vulture against about 14 infantry. TheZerg has bad muta vs infantry micro,that's ok though he brings 24 lings and rapes the small infantry army. CJ gets royally screwed and types out. Combo of LastRomantic + red.venomLight played a very nice 2v2.
That was all Light.
+ Show Spoiler [Game 4] +Hyun at 7 and Darkelf at 1. A pool up for Hyun with 6 zerglings hatching. Hatchery started in main for Hyun. Darkelf has his rax up.Darkelf trying a proxy fac at 5. Lings in Darkelf's base, but can't do anything thanks to marines protecting the mineral line. Hyun accidently cancelled his expansion hatch. While Darkelf expanded.. He only made 1 vult with his proxy fac, his attempt to lift it into hyuns base was denied. Vulture gets 7 kills, Hyun goes lurker instead of muta. hyun had a pretty decent center force again and tried to attack when DE started to move out.. Another battle with DE sitting on the top of his ramp happened, hyun had pretty big losses and ran back. Darkelf moves out with a minute MMF force and three vessels, promptly loses one of the vessels to scourges and runs back. Hyun presses the attack. Darkelf holds him off while losing another vessel. DEFILER OUT FOR HYUN! Now Darkelf moving out with two vessels, two tanks and a decent MMF force. Heading for Hyun's base... Darkelf being careless with his vessels though. Darkelf sets up at the foot of Hyun's ramp. Lings come from behind to attack tanks, but they're chased off by MM. Darkelf moves up the ramp for the kill and Hyun GGs. StoryTeller / red.venom
+ Show Spoiler [Game 5] +
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My prediction :
Saint[z-zone] (Z) < sAviOr[gm] (Z)
Bisu (P) > Much[gm] (P)
Light[aLive] (T)/TheZerg[HyO] (Z) > Sea.Jy (Z)/TheManiaMST (T)
HyuN(Z) > DarkElf (T)
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Im loving the Darkelf hate. :D
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United States20663 Posts
As opposed to "fake zvz"?
What was cool vs firefist?
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On May 12 2007 20:57 LastRomantic wrote:
As opposed to "fake zvz"?
What was cool vs firefist?
?? Don't recall that game, describe.
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United States20663 Posts
It was ZvZ on monty hall, for ace match. eStro sent cool, expecting NaDa, but got Firefist instead.
There was some ling glitching through walls, and some mutalisk action. It was pretty standard zvz fare though. Cool got owned by lings in the end.
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Didn't see that game :>. I'm just saying Savior's ZvZ is pretty nasty and nearly unpredictable. Saint beat him in WCG prelim last year didn't he? Its a real ZvZ, because I've seen these players play this mu very formidably and this is the first ZvZ on monty I will see. But I guess it wasn't first :>
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United States20663 Posts
Ah alright, fair enough.
If both players can survive the early stages, it will get to HUGE mutalisk numbers. I'm hoping for YellOw vs GGPlay style, though it probably won't happen.
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I'm not so sure about ling slipping action on Monty Hall, but I haven't seen a ZvZ on it.[edit: guess I'll go watch that earlier ZvZ on Monty Hall] What kind of builds do people use? I'm guessing FE is viable? The risk/reward for going fast pool seems pretty low to me without knowing anything, seeing as mining out those entrances takes a good 8 drone trips--guessing wrong would be pretty slow.
DarkElf's infamous last words and demise: + Show Spoiler +
plz die
/jumps off bandwagon
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United States20663 Posts
You don't actually need to mine ANY of them out.
Glitch through one drone
glitch through 2 lings
1/3 chance of finding his multi
if not, glitch lings again, and they'll be in his main.
Granted, I still think hatch first will be stronger, but it doesn't take THAT Long to hit him with zlings
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Corinthos
Canada1842 Posts
HMmm
Saint[z-zone] (Z) < sAviOr[gm] (Z)
Bisu (P) < Much[gm] (P)
Light[aLive] (T)/TheZerg[HyO] (Z) > Sea.Jy (Z)/TheManiaMST (T)
HyuN(Z) < DarkElf (T)
CJ!
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On May 12 2007 21:11 LastRomantic wrote:
You don't actually need to mine ANY of them out.
Glitch through one drone
glitch through 2 lings
1/3 chance of finding his multi
if not, glitch lings again, and they'll be in his main.
Granted, I still think hatch first will be stronger, but it doesn't take THAT Long to hit him with zlings
I think its more 1/2, scouting overlord goes one of the expo paths early on. But then again, zerg may just run it through the center toward the enemy main, but even at that direction, he can check if he took the center expo right? :X The time required to get it running would be nearly be equal to the time the overload reaches there.
Unless your talking about a real fast ling production, then yeah fuck what I said.
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Why the antipathy toward DE? He's not a consistently great terran, but his gameplay is a hell of a lot more fun to watch than Bifrost-flavored turtle-macro.
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On May 12 2007 22:02 defenestrate wrote:
Why the antipathy toward DE? He's not a consistently great terran, but his gameplay is a hell of a lot more fun to watch than Bifrost-flavored turtle-macro.
I think it's because he switched over from WC3...
IIRC
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United States20663 Posts
DE also?
There are more besides Freedom? :O
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51596 Posts
On May 12 2007 22:04 Cambium wrote:Show nested quote +On May 12 2007 22:02 defenestrate wrote:
Why the antipathy toward DE? He's not a consistently great terran, but his gameplay is a hell of a lot more fun to watch than Bifrost-flavored turtle-macro. I think it's because he switched over from WC3... IIRC
He did?
I don't think he did, I remember in the XellOs documentary (which was filmed 2004-2005), that Kim Sung Ki (Darkelf) is a new player.... he practices alot.
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I only vaguely recall it from somewhere, don't spread the rumour yet 
edit:
Okay, I guess not.
I wasn't so sure in the first place. Although that would perfectly explain why people hate him other than his physical appearance.
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I don't remember DE coming over from w3. I think part of the DE hate is that he's like Child in that he's good enough to get into the major leagues, and knock fan favorites out, but not good enough to play for the league win.
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1.) HE UGLY.
2.) He beats my favorite players by gay homo-map related means.
3.) He is plain, he is just another goodfriend clone. He only appears slightly entertaining because his opponent is doing all the fancy work that gives the flash.
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haha wtf is with the little kiddies. Btw someone keep track of the OGN for me? I can't have two games on at once on this shitty comp
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mbc hero almost crushed their kid
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This game will probably be more interesting.
a) It has savior
b) The other one is TvT, which is arguably worse than ZvZ
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51596 Posts
haha i feel sorry for the kid just standing there clueless.
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United States20663 Posts
Light's hair is SO UGLY haha
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United States20663 Posts
Saint vs sAviOr. Does anyone else find the player names ironic?
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Savior sure does end up playing ZvZ as first match in proleague a lot.
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United States20663 Posts
I want Saint to win b/c I don't like sAviOr, but I really don't care much
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United States20663 Posts
red sAviOr bottom right
blue Saint top left
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ok seriously whats UP with the little kids they are bringing along lately? Coach kids? Lucky fan(Why would there be 6 year old fans aaaa)?
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They showed the ranking charts, a while ago, and I noticed ACE received a penalty point.
What was this for??
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United States20663 Posts
nothing truly interesting so far
sAviOr makes hatch at bottom multi, Saint makes at top. both follow with pool and gas
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United States20663 Posts
Wow Saint goes TRIPLE hatchery at top, taking three bases
so does sAviOr, except at bottom
macro game coming?
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chogoling! lmao why do they call them chogoling >_<
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United States20663 Posts
sAviOr sneaks four lings - two at each completed multi. Saint clears them without any drone losses
both players start their spires
very similar builds so far
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United States20663 Posts
Because no "Z" sound in Korean.
Both players three gas
about four or five mutas for sAviOr out
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United States20663 Posts
sAviOr kills two ovies
loses a scourge to spore colony, has about five left.
Saint has a spore at each multi. mutas coming for him too.
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United States20663 Posts
Saint is being fairly passive with his spores and all.
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United States20663 Posts
BIG FIGHT
savior has more mutal I think
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United States20663 Posts
lol
sAviOr is like 8 muta ahead now
Saint has five left
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United States20663 Posts
Saint gives up
sAviOr wins!
CJ 1-0 MBC
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wow.... no way he could have came back?
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United States20663 Posts
sAviOr was getting fourth and fifth gas, and Saint couldn't even attack him. -_-;
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ok doens't look like anyone is reporting
i think i just missed the huge mutalisk battle because my internet crashed :[
basically both players expanded to their horizontal naturals followed by another gas. saint opted to get some spore colonies to hold off any early mutalisk action. however, savior went straight up all out mutalisks and eventually got way more than saint
after one huge mutalisk battle, savior comes out on top by about 12 mutalisks. saint types out immediately thereafter
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Saint neutered his econ with so many spore.
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<3 ma
I wish there had been more of a game though, that was just like savior macroing better for awhile and then a muta fight, no tension at all really But I guess watching savior zvz is always tense for me to an extent, because it's always possible that anyone, no matter how good, can lose in that matchup :O
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LOL Sen has no chance..
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On May 12 2007 22:34 joydivision wrote:LOL Sen has no chance..
Who?
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HonestTea
5007 Posts
Savior has owned HERO Zergs for pretty much ever.
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On May 12 2007 22:45 WhatisProtoss wrote:Who?
Sen is a Taiwanese(I think) Zerg player, many consider him the best non-kor Z. Or at least one of the best.
He is playing Savior in the WWI Blizzard event next weekend.
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51596 Posts
holy crap much just obliterated bisu
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Holy shit... Much just raped Bisu.
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United States10774 Posts
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you guys suck at live reporting
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LOL! Good call, MyCube.
Bisu was looking good, defending properly and keeping an eye on Much's shuttle/reaver. He had an early expansion too.
But Bisu, thinking that he wouldn't be able to save his expansion against a strong push or reaver drop, canceled his expansion. Then Much comes in with a large goon/zealot force and double reavers inside of a shuttle and rapes Bisu's army.
Two of Much's reavers then sit in front of Bisu's gateways along with a handful of dragoons, raping everything that pops out. GG
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On May 12 2007 22:50 fusionsdf wrote:you guys suck at live reporting
Shut the fuck up.
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WOW, my fucking stream died, then I see ppl exiting their booths - LAME
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connection died
I would report once it goes back on though.
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On May 12 2007 22:52 WhatisProtoss wrote:Shut the fuck up.
no u
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Im surprised anyone would care about the lack of live reports as pretty much everyone can watch or DL these games now(Unless you are on 56k I guess, but then why are you even wasting your time on the internet).
If you want a rundown.. Bisu opened standard and start to expand, Much put his goons in a tight line outside of his nat and "faked" expansion. I say this because its really standard play for that map and PvP in general. He pushed, bisu tried his best to adapt when he sent obs and saw what was up but really got his forces cut down easily and gg. Standard PvP.
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why is light playing?
910/thezerg is MBC's vampire 2v2 team now there bringing in light instead of 910. Doesnt rly make sense
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Hero going 8rax(far out of main) and 9pool.. Looks like they really wanna win this one; ]
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United States20663 Posts
I don't much like reporting 2v2s
they go so fast that you can't really look away from them
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ling/marine force making a move on CJ Terran. Bunkering behind his minerals, he has a bunker up though. it can only cut off a little of his mining and kill a depot.
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United States20663 Posts
I especially hate when the zergs have orange/yellow or any other similar colors. even harder T_T
hero zerg lost a drone or two
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United States1655 Posts
Did CJ Xerg just cancel his hatchery?
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On May 12 2007 23:08 LastRomantic wrote:
I don't much like reporting 2v2s
they go so fast that you can't really look away from them
Yeah its true. Its more in the small details and unit management really.
CJ Zerg countering/harassing OGN Zerg.
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United States20663 Posts
MBC brings a vulture to CJ zerg, kills some lings and drones. MBC zerg kills CJ zerg's defensive sunken
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United States20663 Posts
CJ Zerg got totally raped
How'd OGN zerg get in this?
CJ Terran moving out with decent infantry army
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United States20663 Posts
2 goli and 1 vulture against about 14 infantry
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United States20663 Posts
MBC's zerg has bad muta vs infantry micro
that's ok though he brings 24 lings and rapes the small infantry army
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On May 12 2007 23:11 SuperJongMan wrote:
Uh.. MBC - -;;
I get confused: [ yes mbc.
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United States20663 Posts
Alright, CJ realizes no hope, gg's.
2-1 for CJ now
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god, both sc2.org and gomtv have screwy connections
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Light played a very nice 2v2.
That was all Light.
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Thunderstorm in Korea? Connection is all out man~ T_T
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MBC seems to be streaming better than OGN on sc2.org, the 2v2 is about to start there
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Okay, started. MBC Zerg at 7 and CJ terran at 1. And my stream just hung.
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Okay, from brief glimpses in between freezes, I see a pool up for Hyun with 6 zerglings hatching. Hatchery started in main for Hyun. Darkelf has his rax up.
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Darkelf trying a proxy fac at 5. Lings in Darkelf's base, but can't do anything thanks to marines protecting the mineral line.
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Haha hyun accidently cancelled his expansion hatch: [
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Hyun starts morphing a creep colonby to protect his ramp, but the proxy fac is done and a vult is on its way!
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..... oo
Cancelling hatch t_T
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Ah, not gonna work. Lings seal off the ramp with sunk behind and the vult can do bugger all. Now Darkelf floats his fac over Hyun's base to scout.
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so many more people are watching this game than Samsung and Ongamenet game.
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Darkelf expanded and is probably making a dropship. He only made 1 vult with his proxy fac, his attempt to lift it into hyuns base was denied.
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oh it wasnt dropship, he expanded and went straight for vessel(Presumably anti muta im sure he has +1 coming too). Looks bad for Hyun: [
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Darkelf now forced to go MM + vessel as his fact starts to make the long trip home.
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oOoOo 7 kill vulture.. why are terrans so gay they never let anything just die. oooh hyun ended up going lurker and not muta. HMM the lurkers are enroute to darkelf but he already has a bunker up at the ramp.
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Hyun breaks ramp and now has about 8 lurkers in darkelfs base.. probably 3-4 were irradiated and he still has a decent mm force.
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nice!!! he blocked the rush!!
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mm vs lurker push happening... he got some scvs and killed all marines but the lurkers are wiped out. this could be a case of the T just playing possum and eventually defending enough to win.
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anyone gimem mbc stream link, not gom, not sc2, just plain old mbc link.
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the best game of the match so far i think. a lot of actions
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That failed proxy fac has cost Darkelf dearly, as he lacks tanks to hold off Hyun's lurker/ling attack. Even with irradiate, he's reduced to fighting lurkers with SCVs.
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hyun had a pretty decent center force again and tried to attack when DE started to move out.. Another battle with DE sitting on the top of his ramp happened, hyun had pretty big losses and ran back. not looking good for him at all.
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Darkelf moves out with a minute MMF force and three vessels, promptly loses one of the vessels to scourges and runs back. Hyun presses the attack. Darkelf holds him off while losing another vessel. DEFILER OUT FOR HYUN!
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SOMEONE LINK ME TO MBC STREAM!
nvm ~~
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hyun working with defilers to stop DEs push but i dont think its gonna happen, he will keep losing them to sv group.
oh gg.
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fucking Darkelf. Just hate that dude.
And I even want CJ to win, just not him.
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Now Darkelf moving out with two vessels, two tanks and a decent MMF force. Heading for Hyun's base... Darkelf being careless with his vessels though. Darkelf sets up at the foot of Hyun's ramp. Lings come from behind to attack tanks, but they're chased off by MM. Darkelf moves up the ramp for the kill and Hyun GGs.
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51596 Posts
how the hell did darkelf win that after losing most of his troops to that lurkling attack?
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On May 12 2007 23:39 MyCube wrote:
how the hell did darkelf win that after losing most of his troops to that lurkling attack?
Maybe cuz he's good? xD
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I thought Darkelf was a goner there. I wonder what happened.
And what's with the kids? Isn't it mother's day? Shouldn't they have mothers with the players instead?
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That expansion in the back is too advantageous for terran. Even though DE lost a lot of troops and scvs in his main, he had his expansion behind him fully running.
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On May 12 2007 23:39 MyCube wrote:
how the hell did darkelf win that after losing most of his troops to that lurkling attack?
Its an economic thing. Its like if Protoss 2gates a z and manages to eliminate all sunkens and lings but is barely pushed back. After that fight happened the T had lots of econ, rax and tech and the Z just didnt. Then he made it worse by losing all those units on his 2nd attempt at the ramp.. Especially considering he was trying to power the expansion and get defiler.
Its really shitty when you are in that position as Zerg. Its like you get so close but even though you reach the nucleous they end up just barely pushing you out and any further attempt on your part will be exploited.
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oh that was the last game, damn. Hopefully Samsung vs OGN is still going.
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On May 12 2007 23:41 WhatisProtoss wrote:
That expansion in the back is too advantageous for terran. Even though DE lost a lot of troops and scvs in his main, he had his expansion behind him fully running.
True... two expos is usually enough to hold a ramp for a while.
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On May 12 2007 23:34 evanthebouncy~ wrote:
anyone gimem mbc stream link, not gom, not sc2, just plain old mbc link.
mbc took their stream down (I think)
thats why cats encourages people to p2p mbc stream
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So what could the zerg have done differently to take the win?
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The zerg's build was horrible. He had no economy at all. Did he actually cancel his nat hatch? He had to kill Darkelf with that lurk/ling push and he came kinda close because Darkelf's build wasn't too convincing either.
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wtf is those kids doing in this kind of televised match? do they live with their teams?
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u gotta skate8152 Posts
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The summaries were great, keep it up! =).
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<3 darkelf !
I've voted for him since osl prelims
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On May 12 2007 23:49 The Storyteller wrote:
So what could the zerg have done differently to take the win?
Any number of things. Im not gonna dl and rewatch to double check but im PRETTY sure he cancelled his nat hatch, most likely a control miss due to nerves but he could have had a reason(Maybe thought he needed to throw up a bunch of sunks real quick to stop like 2 proxy rax).
Honestly Darkelfs opening was deceptive. Hyun saw he had gas but wasnt mining it, he had his rax in a weirdo spot and was putting his marines in min line. If Hyun had speed he coulda owned but its just one of those things where darkelf probably would have reacted differently if he did get it.
What I would have liked to see Hyun do is just attack the marines right away when DE only had 3. Worst case he gets a marine or two and has to pull back after losing about half the lings. But it would have pushed DE a little and once he saw the proxy fac and had a good idea DE was 2CC after vult harass I would have liked to see hyun go take an exp and just macro hard. Im guessing that after he accidently cancelled hat he just thought "Fuck its all or nothing now."
Other things to consider: Hyuns 9 pool(After lord I believe but I tuned in right as his lings hatched so I dunno) was completely ineffective. Map is much more suited to 3hat play, he could have even 2hatted at nat then 3rd hat above ramp and due to the common T openings on that map(Which I would assume are like 8rax->Exp, 2rax M&M->Exp and 1rax->Fast exp) would have been ok.
Its possible that if he didnt cancel his hat he would have just had the extra units needed to finish the game, haha. Poor guy, really.
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Yeah he basically lost when he canceled the hatch. It wasnt far from being done either so he lost alot of mining time in addition to the money he loses when he cancels. You cant afford to do mistakes that affect your economy that much if you are going to beat a solid macroterran like Darkelf.
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EPT![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/staff/KizZBG/proleaguebanner.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://teamliquid.net/images/liquibet/players/MBCGame%20Hero.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://teamliquid.net/images/liquibet/players/CJ%20Entus.jpg)
