NO SAVIOR DIDN'T BEAT IT. Savior beat a Fast Tanks/FE > gol/tank/valk build, that is nothing like the fantasy build except both intend on mech.

Whats with low level players acting like they know what there talking about. Its getting old.

Hypnosis

United States2061 Posts

October 25 2008 22:01 GMT

#63

http://www.yousendit.com/download/Y2orWmdtcWZFc0x2Wmc9PQ

http://www.yousendit.com/download/Y2orWmdtcWZuSlJjR0E9PQ

http://www.yousendit.com/download/Y2orWmdtcWY5eFUwTVE9PQ

here are a few games that i tried the fantasy build. i find it extremely versatile and powerful because you can see exactly what the zerg is doing. Plus mech is great vs ultra/lurker/muta.

I think fast lings into hydra is a good counter to this build.

d(O.o)a

Canada5066 Posts

October 25 2008 22:45 GMT

#64

This is the counter to fantasy build.

shuriken93

United States13 Posts

October 26 2008 00:28 GMT

#65

3 hatch speedling

kthnxbai

rei

United States3594 Posts

October 26 2008 01:04 GMT

#66

fantasy can defend the 3 hatch speedling if he saw it comming, it was great job by effort concealing his intention until it was too late for fantasy. This is not a counter that will beat the fantasy build everytime

Ideas

United States8171 Posts

October 26 2008 01:09 GMT

#67

On October 26 2008 10:04 rei wrote:
fantasy can defend the 3 hatch speedling if he saw it comming, it was great job by effort concealing his intention until it was too late for fantasy. This is not a counter that will beat the fantasy build everytime

Especially how he put his 3rd hatch in the back min-only instead of in his main or his nat, totally faked a macro build.

rei

United States3594 Posts

October 26 2008 01:12 GMT

#68

also the lair too, everything effort done was pointing to mutalisks, and he only use 1 zergling to chase the scouting scv, which tells fantasy that he's not even attempting to hide anything at all.

DarkSaieden

South Africa254 Posts

October 26 2008 16:57 GMT

#69

what about hydra -> hydra/muta/scourge -> hydra/guardian/scourge/(muta)? guardian+hydra > gols and hydra+scourge >>>> valks. if he overspends in either valks or gols just cos you going guardian, pumping hydras will exploit the lack of tanks. there will also be a severe lack of sci vessels (compared to SK) which slaughter guardians with irradiate.

say you scout the wall-in and spot the gas being built, you then lay down an extractor if you haven't, and a den straight after.
get lair soon after and start making a few hydras with speed then range.
build spire as lair finishes with overlord speed
use hydras and sunks in min lines to defend harass from vultures
build a few scourge when spire finishes.
start teching to guardian.

this is rough and obviously cant be done if you scout the build too late.

my idea of engaging the push would go something like this..
send in guardians to pick off a gol/tank, keeping hydras nearby, but out tanks range
when he responds, or just before, pull guardians a bit behind hold-hydra and scourge, then hold guards quickly.
the idea is to draw gols and valks away from tanks to pick them off with hydra/scourge.

if you have gosu multitask, you could keep a muta group aside to "backstab" tanks if valks/gols stray too far out of place.

arb

Noobville17922 Posts

October 26 2008 18:32 GMT

#70

Played my first game against this today..

fuck you fantasy is all i can say -_-;

MrHoon

10183 Posts

October 26 2008 19:46 GMT

#71

this thread is awefully similar to this thread:
[Closed Bisu Build Counter Thread]

Im gonna go with what chill said (i think); there is no definite counter considering everything matters.

evanthebouncy!

United States12796 Posts

October 26 2008 22:25 GMT

#72

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=81047

Red.Cloud

Canada235 Posts

October 26 2008 23:18 GMT

#73

uh saivor did fend of valks... and 2nd what is so special about it? the use of valks correct, then it normal mech build so.. get some scourge with first group of muta, just like muta vs corsiar in zvp

arb

Noobville17922 Posts

October 26 2008 23:36 GMT

#74

On October 27 2008 08:18 Red.Cloud wrote:
uh saivor did fend of valks... and 2nd what is so special about it? the use of valks correct, then it normal mech build so.. get some scourge with first group of muta, just like muta vs corsiar in zvp

Have you even looked at the build at all?

iNcontroL

USA29055 Posts

October 26 2008 23:49 GMT

#75

artosis and idra practiced this build quite a bit awhile ago. testie's response is really good actually and should be taken serious. A muta opening is the only viable counter along with the proper economic push/switch to well upgraded ground (doesn't HAVE to be hydra.. in fact once they get enough tanks/vult running hydra is really bad). Basically the main point of emphasis vs that style is economy. The valks make your air superiority moot the second they hit around 8 +1 valks.. even scourge while great at weakening the force of valks become pretty much pointless. It is by the time they get to 8 or so valks that you have needed to secure 5+ gas and a great mix of ground units with solid upgrades to be able to LIMIT the terran to its naturals and just simply dry them up. Attacking into a minefield with a mass of tanks is horrible so you just have to wait until they try and position an expo or get too aggressive and move out at you. If they turtle up like a real fag go drops and harrass the main/drop tank clusters.

knyttym

United States5797 Posts

October 27 2008 00:16 GMT

#76

On October 26 2008 09:28 shuriken93 wrote:
3 hatch speedling

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m3i9CDAD3Y0

kthnxbai

ya it worked but it was more than 3 hatch lings.

What was up with Fantasy scouting the area behind the min only? Maybe he was checking for a 4th hatch or something but he didn't keep the scv alive for very long. 3 hatch ling will even fuck a bio terran if he doesn't scout it.

2nd- Micro errors. Effort was doing some nice surrounds but Fantasy wasn't helping by running vults into ling piles.

3rd- When he saw the first set of lings and his vults were dying he should have Lifted nat, ran scvs, walled choke. Leave scvs to repair wall.

So ya 3 hatch lings killed it once, but is it the absolute counter? no

rei

United States3594 Posts

October 27 2008 00:51 GMT

#77

What savior did was a lot more convincing than what effort did. I would like to see an example of Iloveoov doing this build against a good zerg.

On the side note, after Savior ran his mouth on the entire SKT team the next time he come up against another SK terran he would have to expect them use mech against him.

JMave

Singapore1806 Posts

October 27 2008 03:47 GMT

#78

The Fantasy builds seem impressive but I doubt it would make a debut like how the Bisu build actually came in with a bang. Maybe facing all that corsair DTs made Savior more able to counter something like a Fantasy build.

RoieTRS

United States2569 Posts

October 27 2008 03:58 GMT

#79

TBH... looks like a new BO, and thats it. It won't become standard play.

2rax proxy? Nah.
FE? Nah.
Fantasy build? mmk.

Hypnosis

United States2061 Posts

October 27 2008 23:43 GMT

#80

I think it could become a standard opening because it really counters zerg efficiently. It could also be very deadly if you went MM after getting valks to counter 2 hatch muta. Its versatile and i dont see why it could not become standard. It is after all a modified FE.