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At 45 mins he lost his drones intentionally as an example of drone micro. At 51 minutes he held, and it was close, but that's just his macro style kicking in. The point is to drone exceptionally hard, to the point of almost losing but having just enough to hold. Obviously losing the drones is less than ideal, but at that point it's still more effective that crushing the Protoss army and not having enough drones. Protoss is on 3 base at the point, so losing an army is not so big a deal as a 2 base protoss.
Also don't forget, that JD also sunk a lot of resources into not only drones but many upgrades. Taking upgrades is in a form "taking your advantage", much like droning or expanding.
When he denied the Protoss 4th, yes, that was some sick micro. Better just level up here 
Edit: I think the real point is to learn about ZvP in philosophical terms. What might look like an "almost loss" to you or I (and I will admit, I thought JD was close to losing, and felt pressure when P was expanding hard). But watch what JD says at these times. He comments with king-like energy that the game is "too easy", and we as players should "not be pressured in this case". At times JD says "denying this base is critical, as the Protoss just lost his army", so obviously it's critical. But at other times he's really calm and has a sense the game is going really well, even though for our less-skilled eyes the situation feels more dire.
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On June 05 2017 14:06 Ryzel wrote:
Hey, how should I micro drones to defend against 6 zerglings? I was under the impression that I should stack them on a mineral patch and just attack move, but when I did that they glitched out on themselves and spent the entire time trying to maneuver through each other like they were stuck in buildings and barely got any attacks out, lost all of them without killing a single zergling. I'm clearly missing something here, what is it?
Just gonna' quote myself because I'd really like to know what to do and I can't seem to find it looking online.
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If u have a sunken wont matter if the drones dont land attack
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I'm aware that a sunken would handle the problem. I distinctly remember playing against a terran where I attacked with 6 zerglings and denied his barracks, yet he was able to stack his SCVs (around 10-11 of them) and kill my zerglings while only losing 1 or 2 SCVs. I ended up killing him but I had to rally like 8-10 more zerglings to finish the job and even then lost half of them. His SCVs didn't bug out and seemed to distribute their attacks to multiple zerglings at once when I surrounded the stack, which implied that he attack moved. I really do apologize if this is some basic micro trick that I should be aware of/able to find on my own without asking in this thread, but as I've said I've really had trouble finding anything about this.
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On June 06 2017 12:52 Ryzel wrote:
I'm aware that a sunken would handle the problem. I distinctly remember playing against a terran where I attacked with 6 zerglings and denied his barracks, yet he was able to stack his SCVs (around 10-11 of them) and kill my zerglings while only losing 1 or 2 SCVs. I ended up killing him but I had to rally like 8-10 more zerglings to finish the job and even then lost half of them. His SCVs didn't bug out and seemed to distribute their attacks to multiple zerglings at once when I surrounded the stack, which implied that he attack moved. I really do apologize if this is some basic micro trick that I should be aware of/able to find on my own without asking in this thread, but as I've said I've really had trouble finding anything about this.
Did he go to the gas geyser? There's a glitch involving the gas geyser that allows workers to attack while stacked.
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On June 05 2017 14:06 Ryzel wrote:
Hey, how should I micro drones to defend against 6 zerglings? I was under the impression that I should stack them on a mineral patch and just attack move, but when I did that they glitched out on themselves and spent the entire time trying to maneuver through each other like they were stuck in buildings and barely got any attacks out, lost all of them without killing a single zergling. I'm clearly missing something here, what is it?
I don't play Zerg, a good Zerg should comment on this, but as none has showed up for a day, I give my 50cents on worker-control in this situation.
It's not as easy as stacking them once and a-moving them once - if that's what you did.
What you want to achive is that enough drones are so close to the lings that, if you spam a-move on the ground, the drones can get a shot/spit off instantly. Mineral-walking+stacking the drones can achieve this very well, as you can move many drones right on top of the lings. If you have enough drones stacked, and you mineral walk them over the lings, you can one-shot lings while it's hard for the lings to focus a drone.
Depending on how dangerous the situation is, you stack your drones in advance or at least clump them up in one half of the mineral line. When the ling attack, you mineral walk/stack the drones right on top/in range of the lings, so that there is this a short moment where you can spam a-move on the ground and all of them will spit once or twice. This way, 1-2 lings will die instantly if you used enough drones. When the lings don't retreat, you keep a-moving and microing (mineral walking drones that are being attacked to safety, focus firing lings that are surrounded by a few drones, stacking (parts of) your drones again if you have to).
You don't want to stack your drones and then chase after the lings, that won't work, the drones will lose the stack and rather block each others way. If you need to chase, you rather bring the drones close together into a pack (not stack), manually move them close to the lings by right-clicking on the ground behind the lings, and then spam a-move as soon as they're in range.
I think this is also the way that moving-shot works with drones. You manually keep the drone running by clicking right behind the target and then quickly a-move, then immediatelly tell the drone to move on again manually.
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I do play zerg, but I wouldn't say i was any good at it. I think the key to drone vs ling micro is to stack the drones onto the lings, which bugs the lings out and prevents them from attacking. It does the same to the drones, but they get one hit off first, so if you stack - spit - repeat you can keep the lings glitched out while taking shots at them.
That's my understanding, anyways.
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Thanks so much, that explains a lot. So basically I need to continually re-stack/attack move to keep them stacked, and the zerglings have to be right on top of the stack in order for drones to get an attack off before they start unstacking. I gotta' practice that micro I guess.
Appreciate the help =)
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Two quick ones: the shift+tab trick to make enemy units red on the minimap, any way to have this on by default? Or must it be toggled every game?
And second: Any way to have 'fastest' speed on by default, so I don't have to adjust speed every time I practice vs. a computer? Cheers!
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On June 07 2017 01:53 ihcob wrote:
Two quick ones: the shift+tab trick to make enemy units red on the minimap, any way to have this on by default? Or must it be toggled every game?
At least the game remembers for the rest of the session if you did that once. (can't believe I'm not 100% sure about this lol)
On June 07 2017 01:53 ihcob wrote:
And second: Any way to have 'fastest' speed on by default, so I don't have to adjust speed every time I practice vs. a computer? Cheers!
Mca64Launcher.
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I guess there is an answer to my question somewhere, but I could´nt really find it: So I can only set one building to 1 hotkey in Broodwar and I need like 5-6 hotkeys anyway for army (playing Terran btw). So that means for production i set 1 camera hotkey over my main. But all in all I can only set 3 camera hotkeys (f2-f4)?. So if i got 5 rax and 2 facts and I wanna produce I have to hit my camera key and then click on every building seperatly? did i get that right? Also if I have more then 3 Bases i cant use any more camera keys and have to click on the minimap then on the CC to produce SCVs? Im just wondering if there are hidden gosu Macro tactics i´ve missed.
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On June 07 2017 19:22 Blackfish1 wrote:
I guess there is an answer to my question somewhere, but I could´nt really find it: So I can only set one building to 1 hotkey in Broodwar and I need like 5-6 hotkeys anyway for army (playing Terran btw). So that means for production i set 1 camera hotkey over my main. But all in all I can only set 3 camera hotkeys (f2-f4)?. So if i got 5 rax and 2 facts and I wanna produce I have to hit my camera key and then click on every building seperatly? did i get that right? Also if I have more then 3 Bases i cant use any more camera keys and have to click on the minimap then on the CC to produce SCVs? Im just wondering if there are hidden gosu Macro tactics i´ve missed.
You can change your hotkeys during game as needed but I think one camera hotkey for production and one for rally is standard. The other camera is usually for another base (natural/3rd). You can easily hotkey 7 buildings for production and still have enough hotkeys for army but it really depends on how you feel comfortable.
I tend to camera my main, natural, and rally point and usually hotkey one building in the middle and just double tap it to get to macro screen. If I need to mass re rally then I'll camera the macro screen.
After 3 bases you don't really need to be making workers as you should be pretty saturated. However, I've seen pros sometimes queue 5 workers at their new bases and that + transfer is enough.
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olabaz already summed it up pretty much, just adding some minor things:
On June 07 2017 19:22 Blackfish1 wrote:
I guess there is an answer to my question somewhere, but I could´nt really find it: So I can only set one building to 1 hotkey in Broodwar and I need like 5-6 hotkeys anyway for army (playing Terran btw).
Right, note though that you won't need more than 3 hotkeys until you have Bio+Tanks+Vessel. Before that's the case, when you only have 1, 2 or 3 groups of Marine/Medic, you can hotkey 4-5 barracks (or other buildings) individually (on Numbers 4,5,6,7,8 e.g.) and produce from no matter where your screen is at. 9 and 0 (later also 8) are usually reserved for your scans.
On June 07 2017 19:22 Blackfish1 wrote:
So that means for production i set 1 camera hotkey over my main.
As soon as you cannot use the individual hotkeying described above, you can either do that, or you just hotkey one building about in the middle of all your production-buildings. Then you double-tab that number to jump to your production site.
On June 07 2017 19:22 Blackfish1 wrote:
But all in all I can only set 3 camera hotkeys (f2-f4)?.
Right. Like olabaz, I always use them like this: F2: main-mineral-line, F3: natural-mineral-line, F4: rally-point or another point of interest (e.g. 3rd base temporarily).
On June 07 2017 19:22 Blackfish1 wrote:
So if i got 5 rax and 2 facts and I wanna produce I have to hit my camera key and then click on every building seperatly? did i get that right?
You have to click every building individually, then each time the shortcut for the unit you want to produce, yes.
On June 07 2017 19:22 Blackfish1 wrote:
Also if I have more then 3 Bases i cant use any more camera keys and have to click on the minimap then on the CC to produce SCVs?
Right. You can also rearrange your camera-keys to where you need them most or hotkey the CCs individually + Show Spoiler +and if you're quick you can also jump to a location that is marked by an automatic signal on the minimap by pressing Space (this signal appears whenever a building/unit finishes or when you're getting attacked or when a worker is hindered from building something..
On June 07 2017 19:22 Blackfish1 wrote:
Im just wondering if there are hidden gosu Macro tactics i´ve missed.
Definitelly, but so did we all...+ Show Spoiler +edit: and I mean: do still...
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Just always ask when you see something and don't understand how it's done. There are also several good guides and video-tutorial, basic and advanced, on macro mechanics. Do you know how to use Ctrl and Shift?
Thanks for the reply, also thanks @olabaz 
Ye I played ScII so I know how to hotkey my stuff (I never used more then 6 hotkeys though xD) Good god producing stuff in BW is hard in comparison.
Other quick question: I´m playing the free 1.18 right now, but I guess a lot of you guys are still on Iccup? Where´s best to start out? Right now I´m only practicing production and army management against CPU, but I want fleshy opponents soon :D When I go on Fish every game has red latency so I guess it will be horrible from Europe? the whole split situation with different clients and even game versions is pretty confusing.
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1.18 is fine, no need for iCCup. It's a matter of preference. I don't use iCCup at all anymore. For Fish the trick is to host a game, then a Korean will join you with green bars. You can use this text to host a fighting spirit game: 1:1 투혼 초보, which translate to: 1v1 Fighting Spirit Beginner. Koreans with red bar latency won't join your game. Keep in mind Koreans generally all go to sleep and wake up together. Plan accordingly, as in the middle of the night in Korea you won't easily get games.
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Norway28788 Posts
On June 06 2017 15:32 EsX_Raptor wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2017 12:52 Ryzel wrote:
I'm aware that a sunken would handle the problem. I distinctly remember playing against a terran where I attacked with 6 zerglings and denied his barracks, yet he was able to stack his SCVs (around 10-11 of them) and kill my zerglings while only losing 1 or 2 SCVs. I ended up killing him but I had to rally like 8-10 more zerglings to finish the job and even then lost half of them. His SCVs didn't bug out and seemed to distribute their attacks to multiple zerglings at once when I surrounded the stack, which implied that he attack moved. I really do apologize if this is some basic micro trick that I should be aware of/able to find on my own without asking in this thread, but as I've said I've really had trouble finding anything about this. Did he go to the gas geyser? There's a glitch involving the gas geyser that allows workers to attack while stacked.
That's generally considered illegal. So don't do that.
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What happened to the TLPD it hasn't been updated in a while?
Like the last few Korean Tournaments.
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![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/AltCjEM.png)
I never noticed this "turn rate" setting before and couldn't find a good article explaining it. I get the impression that it is basically equivalent to setting latency or lag tolerance ranging from 2 (equivalent of LAN) to 16 (connections laggy as all hell). Is that about right and have you noticed a meaningful difference between settings? Should I leave it on the default of 8 when I make games?
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On June 10 2017 03:54 Chameleon wrote:I never noticed this "turn rate" setting before and couldn't find a good article explaining it. I get the impression that it is basically equivalent to setting latency or lag tolerance ranging from 2 (equivalent of LAN) to 16 (connections laggy as all hell). Is that about right and have you noticed a meaningful difference between settings? Should I leave it on the default of 8 when I make games?
As far as I understand, turn rate determines the frequency at which actions are sent. So, the higher the faster essentially - but with higher turn rate, more is demanded of your connection.
...Or do I have it all wrong?
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So has the Korean community and Fish moved on from 1.16? As I understand 1.18 was initially a disaster, I am hoping thats not the consensus anymore.
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EPT
