[G]OverDose Zerg - Page 3

On October 26 2009 17:23 Camlito wrote:


TvZ has always been statistically in favor of terran, in alot of cases, moreso than ZvP.. it's just people don't complain like a bitch about it compared to PvZ.

On October 26 2009 17:35 Leg[end] wrote:


TvZ is not imbalanced >_<
I'm a zerg, but I can't bring myself to call TvZ imba.
Show me these statistics...

On October 26 2009 12:30 AzureEye wrote:


Welcome to TvZ. The most imba matchup in Starcraft

On October 26 2009 14:44 Misrah wrote:


ya..... im sorry that not everyone is an A+ player like you. I guess that C opponents are really that bad? What could i possibly be thinking trying to teck switch against someone who clearly would know the proper response to what ever i do just by flying a sair through my base.

Hmm going by your logic- any build is pointless! Because hey lets face it, every build has a weakness. but considering that you have never played against this build (i don't even think that you play z or p) nor have you watched any of the reps, you know what you are talking about. I like how i spend weeks testing this- and it takes you 5 min to write it off lol

Also my economy isn't injured that terribly- because if these were really all in attacks, why is the game going to the late game? 15-20 min games are not failed all in. But hey what am i talking about. even when i played this build against some one who read this thread- the game went into late game. so wait- does that mean, that no matter if you already know the build, you still have to react to it? and that just maybe its effective?

Clearly reading my guide didnt occur to you because it's posts like these that really just annoy me. Thanks so much all high and mighty A+ player! clearly i should never play starcraft against you because you will understand everything that i am doing and have the perfect counter. Sweet you countered my build on paper awesome.

my last question is: if you can create perfect counters to everything with limited scouting information-
your god! when are you winning your first OSL???



because i want the hydra range to be able to snipe cannons, forge and gate. HBR is a pretty easy map to cover your gate and forge with cannons. but on maps like desti, python, luna ext it gets much much harder to stop me from sniping those with out building tons of cannon.

edit: missed this



A 9 pool speedling build would put your economy and teck so far behind that i really don't know if it's viable. however i am willing to try this. i will see how this turns out at C level and hopefully can find some better success. my only worry would be- getting hydra out too late to fight that sair, because spire timing is going to be late but i have yet to try it. this is an idea that i can work with. thanks for this i appreciate it immensely (honestly i never would have thought of this lol) considering that this is the first suggestion- it's time to test it out

and about your previous post- i jumped on you. no doubt about that. Clearly that wasn't your intent. my poor reading skills are probably the culprit lol. Hope that you will forgive me

On October 29 2009 08:04 blackyosh1 wrote:
i dont know anything about zvp or the viability of this new build but just want to say i support starbrift. i feel like misrah really gets off on posting all these new builds and stuff and tbh it kind of annoys me. plus, i pwned him tvz once on python and he freaked out when i didnt gg like 2 seconds after he typed it. kinda made me lol.

On October 27 2009 06:27 StarBrift wrote:


In all honesty I thought this build was really bad and your attempt to start a new trend with it in the metagame pathetic but for the simple reason of you putting so much time into it I didn't mention that. Now that you insulted me personally though I don't feel the need to spare your feelings anymore.

In fact I do also play at C with both protoss and terran. My zerg off racing has so far let me get to C- high but I'm sure I could get C if I mass gamed. The opponents I play usually scout and adapt better but maybe that's because I usually play korean hours.

I watched 4 of the replays that you entitled to be the best of the bunch, showcasing the build if you will. In all those replays the protoss either died his probe scout (to two lings) or left the base before your hydras pop. They then followed up with either not even making a corsair or not using it to scout. The one who did scout your main didn't understand that a spire, larvae at every hatch, 2 gas and no drones means a muta all in. Neither one of the players anticipated your attacks even half as well as they would if they had scouted and read you properly.

As to why your build is really bad:
A build defined as strong because it has strong elements in it. Those elements usually consists of good economics, good timings, good transitions and an element of surprise. Your builds ONLY has the element of surprise. That's 1 out of 4. Let me elaborate.

The build obviously has horrible economics since you had about 3 drones at third, 5 at nat and 10 in main when his corsair popped. Doing such a low econ build means you have to deal damage to catch up. You deal no damage and he macroes well, you lose the game. Period.

The timings of this build are slower than any good builds counterparts. The only part of the build that has alot of units fast is the initial hydras but if he has a probe outside your base and spots them he WILL be safe because you don't have speed. The mutas are alot later than both 2 hatch (obviously) and 3 hatch mutas which means that protoss can have alot of corsairs and cannons if he just scouts well.

Which leads me to transitions. Once protoss defends this attack you will have to drone up heavily. This is the timing in the game where you'll want to produce units to counter his impending midgame attack which is of course delayed a bit but still as strong if not stronger. If the protoss is smart he will have made more corsairs and scouted whether you drones or kept producing units. He will have air superiority and a better economy. If you made units he will stay in his base until the blob of death is complete and then run you over. If you keep droning up he will be able to attack or feign attacks, forcing you to produce units. The 700-900 gas and mins you spent on mutas will be wasted in the midgame when he has mass corsairs with his army. At best you can transition into being slightly behind in economy and that's if alot of things work out like you want them to.

The element of surprise is obviously high in this build if the protoss assumes that you are committing to the hydras and isn't using his corsair to scout. He will most likely think you're transitioning into a lurker contain at his nat (which imo would be better). But the entire element of surprise is based on the assumption that he is a worse player than you.

Lets face it. You were the superior player in most of those replays. Your opponents froze up and stopped multitasking as soon as they saw something out of the norm which made you get a huge advantage. If you play a smart player with decent macro I'm sure you also would feel that this build isn't as strong as you make it out to be.

On October 29 2009 08:04 blackyosh1 wrote:
i dont know anything about zvp or the viability of this new build but just want to say i support starbrift. i feel like misrah really gets off on posting all these new builds and stuff and tbh it kind of annoys me. plus, i pwned him tvz once on python and he freaked out when i didnt gg like 2 seconds after he typed it. kinda made me lol.

Edit: MIsrah, im being a douchebag by calling you out so directly and from behind a keyboard but i do think you should be more humble when you post these builds and consider the possibility that these builds might not be as strong as you would think they are. Don't patronize people if they don't like your build or think of it as highly as you do - it annoys the fuck outta me and probably other people reading this thread.