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On April 14 2012 20:04 Surgical_Strike wrote:
The idea of mixing the two games seemed absolutely ridiculous to me at first... but if you really think about it they are most likely doing this for the players. For the ones who are not going to eventually switch over to sc2. As well as to show BW fans that sc2 isnt actually just 200/200 fights anymore, the skill level has gone up alot. If you guys that say you hate sc2 actually took the time to sit down and watch some high level games you just might find yourself enjoying it and realizing some similarities.
Like the GSTL finals and the SK PL finals that came afterwards right?
In terms of entertainment value SC2 doesn't even come close; it bores me...
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I think what Ribbon means is that there should not only be big stories like the Legend of the Fall or the rivalries between TBLS, but also small stories, small rivalries where a fan can also root for middle-class players. Remember the series of the "Unknown Rivalries"? Something like that.
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Geesh Ribbon, of course BW has tons of stories. And at every level, S-class, A-teamers, B-teamers etc. Just because you haven't heard of them doesn't mean they don't exist.
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On April 15 2012 01:31 ShadeR wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2012 01:23 sc14s wrote:On April 15 2012 01:03 ShadeR wrote:On April 15 2012 01:01 sc14s wrote:On April 15 2012 00:54 ImbaTosS wrote:On April 15 2012 00:39 Zergneedsfood wrote:On April 15 2012 00:23 TheButtonmen wrote:@Zergsfood: Except the context you normally see E-Sports invoked in involved the transfer of cold hard cash from the consumers to the players / leagues be in by purchasing merchandise (I can easily go buy jerseys, posters or hoodies for pretty much any SC2 team for instance but getting BW merchandise is much much harder), by purchasing subscriptions (GS(T)L, MLG, IPL and so forth all have subscriptions, why no BW league with them?), by organizing support for the companies who sponsor the events (through tools such as this which does have an actual effect.) or by direct donation drives for the players (see things like reddit paying for MKP's trip to MLG) Like I don't understand how you can be so bitter about BW fade away while simultaneously hating on the idea of an esports industry. Like it seems a matter of put your money where your mouth is, BW fans seem pretty fanatical from reading the forums so I'm not getting where the disdain for paying cash to support the scene. Hence my question about there being previous attempts which really failed. This is exactly what I'm talking about. You're just saying stuff off the top of your head without knowing what you're talking about. People do buy jerseys, posters, hoodies (that are discontinued now because teams have been disbanded by the way) and support in a variety of ways. Don't generalize the BW fanbase as a group of people who take shit for granted. That's downright not true. If anything, BW players know how valuable each game of BW is because we have so little these days to begin with. People have been generous in starting random foreign tournaments, watching the Kespa stream, etc. etc. There are plenty of examples of BW players pitching in support, even if it's not necessarily monetary related. Also, who the hell is ZergFood? Yeah, wow. Accusing us of being unwilling to put up money/actively support our scene is SO far beyond the truth, it's insulting. You know how much money I've personally put up since SC2 started, just to keep things going until people had faith in foreign BW again? If you don't, I strongly suggest you consider your own words ill-educated and rude. Want to know why we can't pay to watch Korean stuff? It's most likely because if we did, Blizzard would once again come in and shaft Korean BW so hard that we wouldn't have a scene any more. Not that anything's going to stop them trying anyway... I would put money (yes, money) on there being more BW fans willing to pay for the game, than those not. You just aren't in possession of the facts. Of course, I and all the rest of us pale in comparison to you, noble SC2 fans, who have obviously been sooooo instrumental in the growth of the game, and have all personally taken great pains to build a scene from the ground up. I hope sarcasm works on the internet. look not all sc2 fans are dickbags, just mostly the ones who post in BW ones for some reason. Also why the hell are you paying for sc2 thinking bw scene will come back? That does seem a bit silly since basically sc2 is BW's eventual killer. He means the money hes put up for BW since the advent of SC2. On April 15 2012 01:03 sc14s wrote:On April 15 2012 00:58 Xiphos wrote:On April 15 2012 00:54 sc14s wrote:On April 15 2012 00:51 Xiphos wrote:On April 15 2012 00:23 TheButtonmen wrote:@Zergsfood: Except the context you normally see E-Sports invoked in involved the transfer of cold hard cash from the consumers to the players / leagues be in by purchasing merchandise (I can easily go buy jerseys, posters or hoodies for pretty much any SC2 team for instance but getting BW merchandise is much much harder), by purchasing subscriptions (GS(T)L, MLG, IPL and so forth all have subscriptions, why no BW league with them?), by organizing support for the companies who sponsor the events (through tools such as this which does have an actual effect.) or by direct donation drives for the players (see things like reddit paying for MKP's trip to MLG) Like I don't understand how you can be so bitter about BW fade away while simultaneously hating on the idea of an esports industry. Like it seems a matter of put your money where your mouth is, BW fans seem pretty fanatical from reading the forums so I'm not getting where the disdain for paying cash to support the scene. Hence my question about there being previous attempts which really failed. I would post something about how SC2 will eventually arrive at the identical position as BW with Koreans dominating the majority of the tournament but I guess that point is moot this is already happening. The point is that if you want this whole 'e-sports' thing to succeed, killing the oldest, most experiences forerunner is not the correct way to spread the industry. actually from a bussiness perspective it makes perfect sense for blizzard to want to sell more titles of their new game.. But for a culture perspective. This is to show that being a progamer is the least safest profession to devote your life into. All these years and blood of sweat for mastering one game will go into waste just because one company wants to make more money. to be fair you don't play video games as a profession to look at job security.. rofl And thats why the Korean BW model is so different you do have a salary there is job security! scene is 10 years old and is certainly having some big hiccups, thats some good long term stability for raising a family in! I'm not really getting your point? In order to raise a family you need to pick a career and stick to it your whole life?
my point is it isn't a "safe" profession
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On April 15 2012 03:00 Ryo wrote:
Geesh Ribbon, of course BW has tons of stories. And at every level, S-class, A-teamers, B-teamers etc. Just because you haven't heard of them doesn't mean they don't exist.
And to be honest, most of the best players in SC2 had their origins in BW, so that's where their stories are from.
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Canada11466 Posts
Sometimes I feel like this conversation get's unnecessarily heated.
But as for recent storylines... what about the last proleague of SKT1 vs KT? I think that's a pretty good story. Bisu has been knocked out of the OSL and they had to take down the Final Boss. SKT1 were up 2:0 with Fantasy taking out Flash and Bisu taking a win.. and they promptly lose their advantage to tie 3:3. And in the final match, Bisu takes down Flash- who lost not once, but twice. It's also rich because KT has won the last couple proleagues against SKT1.
But I suppose it's a fair point by Ribbon. As TL BW fans we make a great deal of gameplay, but perhaps we haven't communicated the people behind the gameplay as well.
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Stories:
Xellos beats yellow in osl final after taking out boxer. Everyone thought yellow was going to win and finally earn his gold after boxers loss, only to earn another silver.
Oov beating boxer in osl final: pupil beats master. Boxer cries, probably the most heartfelt moment in bw history.
Flash loses to Jaedong in one of the most controversial MSLs: power outage MSL
Too many to name and too hard to type on this damned thing
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On April 15 2012 03:53 Cambium wrote:
Stories:
Xellos beats yellow in osl final after taking out boxer. Everyone thought yellow was going to win and finally earn his gold after boxers loss, only to earn another silver.
Oov beating boxer in osl final: pupil beats master. Boxer cries, probably the most heartfelt moment in bw history.
Most heartfelt moment in BW history is Nada winning for his dad. Oov beating Boxer is a great moment, but I think TLers would almost unanimously agree on Nada's story. (If only because the poem made it so real).
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On April 15 2012 03:59 Chef wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2012 03:53 Cambium wrote:
Stories:
Xellos beats yellow in osl final after taking out boxer. Everyone thought yellow was going to win and finally earn his gold after boxers loss, only to earn another silver.
Oov beating boxer in osl final: pupil beats master. Boxer cries, probably the most heartfelt moment in bw history.
Most heartfelt moment in BW history is Nada winning for his dad. Oov beating Boxer is a great moment, but I think TLers would almost unanimously agree on Nada's story.
It's up there (I actually did the translation of a letter to sky, or w.e it was called, to Chinese), but Oov vs boxer was still the most heartfelt moment for me, solely as a spectator, and a huge boxer fan.
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On April 15 2012 03:53 Cambium wrote:
Stories:
Xellos beats yellow in osl final after taking out boxer. Everyone thought yellow was going to win and finally earn his gold after boxers loss, only to earn another silver.
Oov beating boxer in osl final: pupil beats master. Boxer cries, probably the most heartfelt moment in bw history.
Flash loses to Jaedong in one of the most controversial MSLs: power outage MSL
Too many to name and too hard to type on this damned thing
Yellow beating Bisu on HBR was pretty epic too. Might not have an overarching story, but to see some oldie beat someone like Bisu at that time was pretty sweet.
Boxer and Oov was great though.
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And chrh beating bisu after a year or however long of inactivity, followed by boxer beating bisu
And boxer bunker rushing yellow three times in a row
Ugh, so so so many stories
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July's Golden Mouse was nothing short of a fairytale too  Bisu crippling a bonjwa was also more than just a revolution in PvZ.
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Effort beating flash after being down 0-2, followed by his retirement, then reenlisting under CJ
Junwi playing Terran on paradoxx against kingdom because how terrible the map is for zerg
The stupid 2v2 map in spl that causes terrains to scv rush every game,lol
Savior says to foreign fans in english that he's going to destroy everyone (destroys bw instead)
Typhoon spl final
Manifesto giving progamers "that was easy" gadgets and never see them used in action (lol) despite their promises
I'm going to stop now
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Team 8
Any time that Ace wins a match (and this season they did amazingly well).
Even just last week, SKT beating KT.
And just for the lolz, FBH vs Savior on Python lololololololol
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Yeah, Team 8 is just full of stories. Jaedong and Baby. Baby famously knocked JD out of the Korean Air OSL Ro36. The following Hana Daetoo MSL Group Selection Jaedong puts Baby into his Ro32 group, wanting revenge but again he loses to Baby even though Baby has never beaten him in Proleague. When they were initially put together in Team 8, there were doubts about whether they could become friends but instead Jaedong has completely taken Baby under his wing. Jaedong and Jaehoon. Great friends. Jaedong was once asked which progamer he would want to be on the same team as and he said MBC's Jaehoon. One would never have thought that 3 years on, they'd be put in the same team and under such circumstances. In fact Jaehoon was on the verge of retirement back in 2010.
Edit:
Urgh, I meant to just edit my post and add this paragraph in but instead I accidentally deleted what I'd posted about SKT. Oh well.
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Jaedong, PirateZerg, MustacheZerg and OzSucksBallsWithoutMe
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Guemchi going on a lone journey to India to regain his drive for BW. ^_____^
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i watch both bw and sc2, and i have to say sc2 is just more interesting. there's so many ways to win, bw is just kinda stale cause everyone practically plays standard.
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On April 15 2012 06:54 BlackGosu wrote:
i watch both bw and sc2, and i have to say sc2 is just more interesting. there's so many ways to win, bw is just kinda stale cause everyone practically plays standard.
I laugh in the face of those of the uninformed. Last season in PL, it was one with the highest cheese percentage in recent history. To exemplify this phenomenon, take a closer look at the way that ZvP have been played. Instead of the usual/standard Zerg and Protoss fighting for Air Superiority via Muta/Scourge vs Corsair battles, Zerg players have been doing awful abundant of hydraburst. Beside it is not really the strategic facet that I personally find it attractive, it is the player's adequacy in executing them.
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EPT
