EPTAnd so the dream ends...
[Final Ep] Nal_rA's Oldboy Series - Page 119
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flamewheel
FREEAGLELAND26782 Posts
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gillon
Sweden1578 Posts
On June 12 2010 02:39 Entaro[AoV] wrote: + Show Spoiler + retro you did you see that he was crying after the game right? + Show Spoiler + When were these games played? And is there anyway of getting vids of what was aired? | ||
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VerticalHorizon
United States415 Posts
On June 12 2010 01:36 MindRush wrote: i didn't know calling your brother by his 1st name is kind of an insult i don't mean to be intrusive or anything i just can't seem to understand how are you meant to call your brother ? i mean if your name is Jack Smith, then i guess family and friends call you Jack, while your office co-workers/employees call you mr. Smith. if I am missing something here or it's just a cultural difference, please tell me so i know is 1st name for koreans something they hate being called by ? In America, people consider themselves equal to everyone. Kids think they are deserving of equal respect with their parents. There is a lot of individual pride and it is a culture of self-worth. You call your boss by his first name because even though he is of superior rank, you still consider yourself his equal on a human level. Only in the face of overwhelming superiority (like you facing the President or a judge) would you use a more formal tone of address. I can see the merits of this and this is how I behave in a professional context. I call my boss by his first name, etc. But in terms of family life, I'm very much Korean. In Korea, it's very disrespectful to call a person of "higher" rank (like your elder, your boss, etc.) by his first name. This is because names have a whole different context there. For one thing, the name that comes first is your surname, followed by your personal name. Being able to use your personal name is a privilege that's granted only to people who are older than you/superior to you in rank OR your equals. This is because for other types of relationships, where you hold more seniority, there is formal TITLES to be used. My brother calls me "hyung" because that's the title for "older brother." It doesn't just mean that I was born first. To me, in my family, it has a whole extra context. It means that because I am older, I have a responsibility to look after him, to use my wider life experience to teach him, take care of him, and generally guide/protect him. For example, if we eat out (just the two of us) I am almost always picking up the check without question. He's my dongseng, younger brother - of course I'm older, I have a job, I will pay for his meal and make sure he's full/well-fed. In return, he respects me by not taking liberties like my dad or my friends would, calling me "Kevin" or "Kyunghoon." Think of it this way. To use someone's first name is to take a great deal of liberty with them. It denotes a measure of casual intimacy that isn't easily shared between people of different seniority. Would you call your father by his first name? I know some American families do this, but it boggles my mind. Anyway, don't most children call their father "Father" or at least "Dad" because to say "Hey Dave" to your parent is just plain disrespectful? Between siblings or friends of different ages, it's the same mentality except expanded to include many different kinds of relationships. I guess it's just that in Korea, age draws a very distinct line between people and generally it must be respected. It's not that we "hate" being called by our personal names, but it's ingrained into us that that is something that can only be done by your elders or by your equals (your friends who are the same age as you). Everything else has a proper title/rank and it's more civil to use those titles. | ||
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ReTr0[p.S]
Argentina1590 Posts
On June 12 2010 02:35 Sadistx wrote: + Show Spoiler + Him as a commentator would be the best to know that recalls in PvT haven't worked for ages, yet he tried and failed not once but at least 4 times on those two matches, suiciding his units on a minefield that he had seen with an observer seconds before. Dumbest thing in the thread. They work fine. + Show Spoiler + Since when is recalling into a minefield "fine"? | ||
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Roffles
Pitcairn19291 Posts
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andeh
United States904 Posts
any more info into these types of cultural things would be appreciated. its interesting | ||
Hot_Bid
Braavos36389 Posts
On June 12 2010 03:02 VerticalHorizon wrote: In America, people consider themselves equal to everyone. Kids think they are deserving of equal respect with their parents. There is a lot of individual pride and it is a culture of self-worth. You call your boss by his first name because even though he is of superior rank, you still consider yourself his equal on a human level. Only in the face of overwhelming superiority (like you facing the President or a judge) would you use a more formal tone of address. I can see the merits of this and this is how I behave in a professional context. I call my boss by his first name, etc. But in terms of family life, I'm very much Korean. In Korea, it's very disrespectful to call a person of "higher" rank (like your elder, your boss, etc.) by his first name. This is because names have a whole different context there. For one thing, the name that comes first is your surname, followed by your personal name. Being able to use your personal name is a privilege that's granted only to people who are older than you/superior to you in rank OR your equals. This is because for other types of relationships, where you hold more seniority, there is formal TITLES to be used. My brother calls me "hyung" because that's the title for "older brother." It doesn't just mean that I was born first. To me, in my family, it has a whole extra context. It means that because I am older, I have a responsibility to look after him, to use my wider life experience to teach him, take care of him, and generally guide/protect him. For example, if we eat out (just the two of us) I am almost always picking up the check without question. He's my dongseng, younger brother - of course I'm older, I have a job, I will pay for his meal and make sure he's full/well-fed. In return, he respects me by not taking liberties like my dad or my friends would, calling me "Kevin" or "Kyunghoon." Think of it this way. To use someone's first name is to take a great deal of liberty with them. It denotes a measure of casual intimacy that isn't easily shared between people of different seniority. Would you call your father by his first name? I know some American families do this, but it boggles my mind. Anyway, don't most children call their father "Father" or at least "Dad" because to say "Hey Dave" to your parent is just plain disrespectful? Between siblings or friends of different ages, it's the same mentality except expanded to include many different kinds of relationships. I guess it's just that in Korea, age draws a very distinct line between people and generally it must be respected. It's not that we "hate" being called by our personal names, but it's ingrained into us that that is something that can only be done by your elders or by your equals (your friends who are the same age as you). Everything else has a proper title/rank and it's more civil to use those titles. I knew about this already but your explanation is very informative anyway, nice post. | ||
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ccdnl
United States611 Posts
On June 12 2010 02:39 Entaro[AoV] wrote: + Show Spoiler + retro you did you see that he was crying after the game right? Oh my god... + Show Spoiler + Nooooooooooooooooooo..nal_ra ...i feel sad because he tried so hard. nal_ra...never give up! but he was drafted...ARGH.. nal_ra...oh nal_ra T_TT | ||
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jgad
Canada899 Posts
On June 11 2010 07:28 ccdnl wrote: A korean poster mentioned something about this already, I don't know about the validity of his statement but I'll like to open your eyes to a different viewpoint. The korean poster said this is how normal transactions between hyungs and juniors interact. Hyung meaning senior[m] in korean. So how about nobody was being an ass, and it was normal. Sure you might deem him to be an ass in their relationship but that doesn't matter because you are viewing them through your culture standards. And the matter of fact is they aren't living in your culture. If you are in S. Korea and living there atm and you can absolutely testify against this, then my apologies for my presumptuous attitude. But if not, stop pointing fingers. What I meant was that go.go seemed to be acting rudely exactly because he is Ra's junior. I wouldn't necessarily consider their interaction to be rude in western culture, but go.go seemed to be offering challenge to Ra at every opportunity - as though he was offended by having to show Ra his due respect. Half the time, with the things go.go was saying, you'd think he thought Ra should be the one calling HIM hyung. Ra's reactions seemed to me to be defensive - giving a bigger push back in response to a challenge, if you will. | ||
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LuDwig-
Italy1143 Posts
On June 12 2010 03:02 VerticalHorizon wrote: In America, people consider themselves equal to everyone. Kids think they are deserving of equal respect with their parents. There is a lot of individual pride and it is a culture of self-worth. You call your boss by his first name because even though he is of superior rank, you still consider yourself his equal on a human level. Only in the face of overwhelming superiority (like you facing the President or a judge) would you use a more formal tone of address. I can see the merits of this and this is how I behave in a professional context. I call my boss by his first name, etc. But in terms of family life, I'm very much Korean. In Korea, it's very disrespectful to call a person of "higher" rank (like your elder, your boss, etc.) by his first name. This is because names have a whole different context there. For one thing, the name that comes first is your surname, followed by your personal name. Being able to use your personal name is a privilege that's granted only to people who are older than you/superior to you in rank OR your equals. This is because for other types of relationships, where you hold more seniority, there is formal TITLES to be used. My brother calls me "hyung" because that's the title for "older brother." It doesn't just mean that I was born first. To me, in my family, it has a whole extra context. It means that because I am older, I have a responsibility to look after him, to use my wider life experience to teach him, take care of him, and generally guide/protect him. For example, if we eat out (just the two of us) I am almost always picking up the check without question. He's my dongseng, younger brother - of course I'm older, I have a job, I will pay for his meal and make sure he's full/well-fed. In return, he respects me by not taking liberties like my dad or my friends would, calling me "Kevin" or "Kyunghoon." Think of it this way. To use someone's first name is to take a great deal of liberty with them. It denotes a measure of casual intimacy that isn't easily shared between people of different seniority. Would you call your father by his first name? I know some American families do this, but it boggles my mind. Anyway, don't most children call their father "Father" or at least "Dad" because to say "Hey Dave" to your parent is just plain disrespectful? Between siblings or friends of different ages, it's the same mentality except expanded to include many different kinds of relationships. I guess it's just that in Korea, age draws a very distinct line between people and generally it must be respected. It's not that we "hate" being called by our personal names, but it's ingrained into us that that is something that can only be done by your elders or by your equals (your friends who are the same age as you). Everything else has a proper title/rank and it's more civil to use those titles. great post! Is always great to know deatil about other way of thinking. However, at least in italy, we don't call our boss with first name..it is really rude.. And if we want to use the first name of a person that we consider at our same level we have to ask:"can i use your first name?" otherwise it is real rude..And if we don't know the las name either we have to refer to him with "he" not with "you" (we talk to him as he is a third person) | ||
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reza
Canada213 Posts
On June 12 2010 03:02 VerticalHorizon wrote: In America, people consider themselves equal to everyone. Kids think they are deserving of equal respect with their parents. There is a lot of individual pride and it is a culture of self-worth. You call your boss by his first name because even though he is of superior rank, you still consider yourself his equal on a human level. Only in the face of overwhelming superiority (like you facing the President or a judge) would you use a more formal tone of address. I can see the merits of this and this is how I behave in a professional context. I call my boss by his first name, etc. But in terms of family life, I'm very much Korean. In Korea, it's very disrespectful to call a person of "higher" rank (like your elder, your boss, etc.) by his first name. This is because names have a whole different context there. For one thing, the name that comes first is your surname, followed by your personal name. Being able to use your personal name is a privilege that's granted only to people who are older than you/superior to you in rank OR your equals. This is because for other types of relationships, where you hold more seniority, there is formal TITLES to be used. My brother calls me "hyung" because that's the title for "older brother." It doesn't just mean that I was born first. To me, in my family, it has a whole extra context. It means that because I am older, I have a responsibility to look after him, to use my wider life experience to teach him, take care of him, and generally guide/protect him. For example, if we eat out (just the two of us) I am almost always picking up the check without question. He's my dongseng, younger brother - of course I'm older, I have a job, I will pay for his meal and make sure he's full/well-fed. In return, he respects me by not taking liberties like my dad or my friends would, calling me "Kevin" or "Kyunghoon." Think of it this way. To use someone's first name is to take a great deal of liberty with them. It denotes a measure of casual intimacy that isn't easily shared between people of different seniority. Would you call your father by his first name? I know some American families do this, but it boggles my mind. Anyway, don't most children call their father "Father" or at least "Dad" because to say "Hey Dave" to your parent is just plain disrespectful? Between siblings or friends of different ages, it's the same mentality except expanded to include many different kinds of relationships. I guess it's just that in Korea, age draws a very distinct line between people and generally it must be respected. It's not that we "hate" being called by our personal names, but it's ingrained into us that that is something that can only be done by your elders or by your equals (your friends who are the same age as you). Everything else has a proper title/rank and it's more civil to use those titles. holy crap i didn't know this lol...I was reading this and the other guy said he would own his brother if his brother called him by his first name...I was like wait what??...hahaha but nicely put ..just goes to show how different cultures can be. | ||
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Nal_rAwr
United States2611 Posts
like on top of mines but too many protoss players blindly rush an arbiter in and try to recall so yeah you're kind of right about that part but recalls can potentially be very effective | ||
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DropTester
Australia608 Posts
On June 12 2010 15:42 reza wrote: holy crap i didn't know this lol...I was reading this and the other guy said he would own his brother if his brother called him by his first name...I was like wait what??...hahaha but nicely put ..just goes to show how different cultures can be. umm...they were the same person. Most asian cultures do follow the same kind of tradition, but I do want to mention that many of the modern families living in the western world slowly begin to lose this factor. I mean my siblings and myself call each other by our first name. I have seen some little kids call their parents by their first name and the parents don't really see it as disrespectful. It is really only the current older generation who sees this as a major thing. I have a nephew who calls me by my first name, and growing up in this society I obviously don't mind, I actually prefer it more, but his grandma would always tell them to call me uncle instead. As you can see this kind of tradition thing slowly wears out in the western world. If you take a look at western influence in most cultural traditions and the with the internet couldn't you imagine that the younger generation cares much less for these kind of things as opposed to the older generations. | ||
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cYaN
Norway3322 Posts
Hi this is kevin to an american? and then hi this is hyung to a korean? | ||
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Issor
United States870 Posts
On June 12 2010 18:09 cYaN wrote: VerticalHorizon, a question. Just for a laugh. How does your brother introduce you to someone? Hi this is kevin to an american? and then hi this is hyung to a korean? gonna wager a guess and say he introduces him as his brother and then VH says his own name. | ||
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charcute
Canada419 Posts
On June 12 2010 03:02 VerticalHorizon wrote: In America, people consider themselves equal to everyone. Kids think they are deserving of equal respect with their parents. There is a lot of individual pride and it is a culture of self-worth. You call your boss by his first name because even though he is of superior rank, you still consider yourself his equal on a human level. Only in the face of overwhelming superiority (like you facing the President or a judge) would you use a more formal tone of address. This idea is from Japan and not America for the job exemple | ||
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Buddhist
United States658 Posts
On June 13 2010 10:01 Issorlol wrote: gonna wager a guess and say he introduces him as his brother and then VH says his own name. "issor" was taken? edit: Also to stay relevant to the conversation, I find it laughably illogical to put so much value in the age of people. Ageism is just as bad as racism. | ||
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Roffles
Pitcairn19291 Posts
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kli6891
United States143 Posts
On June 13 2010 12:41 Roffles wrote: Hey guys, 14 hours till new NalrA Oldboy episodes! Hyped? Or sad? =( Definitely sad | ||
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ccdnl
United States611 Posts
Fix: Super, super, duper, pooper, extremely sad.  ^to the infinite power. I loved your effort nal_ra......goes to corner and weeps. | ||
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