• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 07:32
CEST 13:32
KST 20:32
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Team TLMC #5 - Finalists & Open Tournaments0[ASL20] Ro16 Preview Pt2: Turbulence10Classic Games #3: Rogue vs Serral at BlizzCon9[ASL20] Ro16 Preview Pt1: Ascent10Maestros of the Game: Week 1/Play-in Preview12
Community News
StarCraft II 5.0.15 PTR Patch Notes90BSL 2025 Warsaw LAN + Legends Showmatch2Weekly Cups (Sept 8-14): herO & MaxPax split cups4WardiTV TL Team Map Contest #5 Tournaments1SC4ALL $6,000 Open LAN in Philadelphia8
StarCraft 2
General
StarCraft II 5.0.15 PTR Patch Notes Weekly Cups (Sept 1-7): MaxPax rebounds & Clem saga continues #1: Maru - Greatest Players of All Time Weekly Cups (Sept 8-14): herO & MaxPax split cups Team Liquid Map Contest #21 - Presented by Monster Energy
Tourneys
RSL: Revival, a new crowdfunded tournament series SC2's Safe House 2 - October 18 & 19 Maestros of The Game—$20k event w/ live finals in Paris Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament SC4ALL $6,000 Open LAN in Philadelphia
Strategy
Custom Maps
External Content
Mutation # 491 Night Drive Mutation # 490 Masters of Midnight Mutation # 489 Bannable Offense Mutation # 488 What Goes Around
Brood War
General
ASL20 General Discussion Soulkey on ASL S20 BW General Discussion ASL TICKET LIVE help! :D NaDa's Body
Tourneys
[ASL20] Ro16 Group D BSL 2025 Warsaw LAN + Legends Showmatch [ASL20] Ro16 Group C Small VOD Thread 2.0
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Muta micro map competition Fighting Spirit mining rates [G] Mineral Boosting
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Borderlands 3 Path of Exile Nintendo Switch Thread General RTS Discussion Thread
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion LiquidDota to reintegrate into TL.net
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine UK Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The Happy Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Linksys AE2500 USB WIFI keeps disconnecting Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread High temperatures on bridge(s)
TL Community
BarCraft in Tokyo Japan for ASL Season5 Final The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Too Many LANs? Tournament Ov…
TrAiDoS
i'm really bored guys
Peanutsc
I <=> 9
KrillinFromwales
A very expensive lesson on ma…
Garnet
hello world
radishsoup
Lemme tell you a thing o…
JoinTheRain
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 2441 users

wtf starcraft...

Blogs > JadeFist
Post a Reply
1 2 3 Next All
JadeFist
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
United States1225 Posts
January 08 2010 04:18 GMT
#1
No matter what I do, I cannot grasp starcraft.

I have been on and off for about 2.5 years (mostly off). I have played all 3 races. If I follow a build order, I lose anyway, I don't know what it is.

My APM is around 120, with average redundancy and null actions. But I still suck.

I cheesed my way up to D+ as zerg (4/5pool, 9pool speed, 1 base lurkers, 3hatch mass hydra). That's the best I can do.

Any legit strategy and I'm toast. If the game goes past 5 minutes I've probably lost. I'm so fucking frustrated.

Today, I was 12hatching versus protoss and he blocked my natural with a pylon. Alt+X+X. That's how pissed I was...

If a protoss 2gates I lose ever single time. I even read the topics on how to deal with it. The problem is, if I make sunkens he runs by them into my main.

I feel like what I am doing now is counterproductive. Is there any way for me to improve without so much frustration?

This rant is coming off this game,probably the most humiliating game I have ever played. (I am the zerg)

*
Motiva
Profile Joined November 2007
United States1774 Posts
January 08 2010 04:27 GMT
#2
You are too concerned w/ the results of your matches. You don't get a cookie for winning, and in fact if you just sat down and played 500 matches, it doesn't matter if your winning or losing, your still going to be a much better player at the end.

HaruHaru
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
United States988 Posts
January 08 2010 04:29 GMT
#3
watch some more pro games and watch what the pro's do. then just try to copy it
Long live BroodWar!
2minutevictory
Profile Joined December 2009
United States89 Posts
January 08 2010 04:35 GMT
#4
lol. i took the time to watch the replay. if that's the most humiliating game you've ever played then you haven't played many humiliating games =/=

When i was improving my friends frequently raped me with mass broodling/mass queens/mass das/mass nukes just to laugh at me. Now that i'm awesome and better at sc i can beat them 95% of the time

as for advice against 2gate..

it's ok if he attacks your buildings, you don't engage zealots with drones XD

you need to make 1/2 sunks if you just did something like letting your hatch go down to half hp while you get a bunch of zerglings. Or when he's not anywhere close to your base instead of getting a bunch of lings get like 4 to 8 sunkens( depending on when he's attacking) and block your ramp with lings

Another thing, when you've clearly lost the game and have no chance of coming back to win you should just gg and leave don't be stubborn like i was and try to win 1 base against 10.
intrudor
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
Canada446 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-01-08 04:38:43
January 08 2010 04:38 GMT
#5
the fact that Starcraft is the most competitive video game ever created could be escaping your attention. You have been on and off for about 2.5 years (mostly off). Maybe D/D+ players just practice more than you. D/D+ players are NOT necessarily horrible.. some of them are actually quite good...its just that C- users themselves are kinda good. Practice more. Play more. Win more. Talk less.
USER MIGHT BE WARNED FOR THIS COMMENT
Poriyan1
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
United States54 Posts
January 08 2010 04:50 GMT
#6
"I've missed more than 9,000 shots in my career. I've lost almost 300 games. Twenty-six times, I've been trusted to take the game-winning shot and missed. I've failed over and over and over again in my life. And that is why I succeed." -- M. Jordan.
n.Die Jaedong himself is a spoiler alert. ㅎㅎ
Count9
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
China10928 Posts
January 08 2010 04:54 GMT
#7
Don't miss ovies, make that your number 1 priority. Figure out when you're supposed to make ovies beyond the 9/9 and 17/18 marks (in single player), try to have a number ready all the way up to the 60s. Build orders are completely useless if you miss more than one ovie. (e.g. 3 hatch muta against terran, if you miss 1 ovie your lings + sunken will be late and you might just die to 1 group of mnm, missing 2 basically means useless mutas that run head straight into turrets, late hydra den, and you get rolled by mid game push) Missing 1-2 ovie hurts, missing 3+ basically cripples your entire game and you'll get rolled like that replay and will never get past the win with cheese stage.

Oh, and don't 12 hatch on python.
banana
Profile Joined January 2009
Netherlands1189 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-01-08 05:06:02
January 08 2010 05:02 GMT
#8
This might sound stupid since you are playing for so long and I've only starting actually playing a month ago, but my mindset changed from win and be as competative, to more humble (d-/d atm);

- play to improve, not to win or get a certain rank
- follow the one map, one strategy rule
- chose a strategy that relies on a lategame
- watch day9, there you'll understand that you should focus on establishing a midgame plan. If you have to deviate from your normal plan duo to proxy pylon, 2 gates or anything, just think to adjust and continue with your gameplan. No need for perfect counters just now.

If you can play a decent macro game, you'll be getting all the way to D+ reliably (keep in mind you only need 28% winrate to get to C- playing motw)

funsies : a hero http://www.iccup.com/starcraft/gamingprofile/dpakrhrh.html

T.O.P. *
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Hong Kong4685 Posts
January 08 2010 05:17 GMT
#9
On January 08 2010 13:54 Count9 wrote:
Oh, and don't 12 hatch on python.

Don't listen to this guy. He has no idea what he's talking about.
Oracle comes in, Scvs go down, never a miscommunication.
BanZu
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
United States3329 Posts
January 08 2010 05:42 GMT
#10
Ok, first off, I'm going to tell you that one thread won't help enough. What you need is to have someone play with you, talk you through it, give you tips while you play, etc, etc. Talk to you about strategies. Just immerse yourself in the game, watch more games from the very start, play play/ob games on bnet (eh not that great but depending on your level, talking to people can help somewhat).

I'm not sure how much you know, how much effort you've put it, nor how you've tried to learn the game so I'm just going to say that you probably haven't done everything you could have done OR you haven't done it long enough.

Just keep trekking

Sun Tzu once said, "Defiler becomes useless at the presences of a vessel."
zer0das
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
United States8519 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-01-08 05:56:11
January 08 2010 05:49 GMT
#11
On January 08 2010 13:50 Poriyan1 wrote:
"I've missed more than 9,000 shots in my career. I've lost almost 300 games. Twenty-six times, I've been trusted to take the game-winning shot and missed. I've failed over and over and over again in my life. And that is why I succeed." -- M. Jordan.


The reason Michael Jordan succeeded was because in some random year he could tell you exactly how many game winning shots he had missed in his career. And I'm sure that it pissed him off and motivated him every time he thought about it (which was probably quite often).
RoieTRS
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
United States2569 Posts
January 08 2010 06:07 GMT
#12
Actually I've seen so many people get better at starcraft by not playing it for a while. At first I thought it was an absurd notion, but every time, when the person I know stops playing then comes back and practice a bit, they are much better than before.
konadora, in Racenilatr's blog: "you need to stop thinking about starcraft or anything computer-related for that matter. It's becoming a bad addiction imo"
writer22816
Profile Blog Joined September 2008
United States5775 Posts
January 08 2010 06:10 GMT
#13
Just chill and enjoy the game. Even D rank players are considered very good at RTS from a casual point of view and you can probably do pretty well on Bnet. That is assuming you're a solid D from playing standard.

Stop cheesing, play standard and have some fun.
8/4/12 never forget, never forgive.
Loser777
Profile Blog Joined January 2008
1931 Posts
January 08 2010 06:24 GMT
#14
I picked up the game in 2003... Barely can play low D TvZ.
6581
Glaucus
Profile Joined June 2009
479 Posts
January 08 2010 06:30 GMT
#15
If you 12 hatch on a 4 player map you know there's a 33% chance that your hatch will be pylon blocked in most ZvPs and there's nothing you can do about it? Why insta leave?
Cambium
Profile Blog Joined June 2004
United States16368 Posts
January 08 2010 06:32 GMT
#16
you are taking losses the wrong way, and don't cheese.
When you want something, all the universe conspires in helping you to achieve it.
Not_Computer
Profile Blog Joined January 2007
Canada2277 Posts
January 08 2010 06:32 GMT
#17
I see what you mean.

After watching the replay and reading your post, the main thing holding you back isn't in your hands but in your head - you nerves get to you when you're under pressure and you have trouble staying calm.
You're not alone though, this is a problem that a lot of players of all levels have to deal with (especially pros on televised games).

When you scouted the 2 gate (or even if you didn't, but if you felt early pressure was coming), you should have saved up 3 larvae instead of 2, so you would get 6 lings immediately instead of just 4.
Then as you go, pay attention to the number of zealots coming in and make just enough lings to hold them off until you can get your sunken up and block the ramp.

What you did instead was panic. You sent out all but one of your drones to fend off the initial 1 zealot + 2 probe rush/early pressure/harass and he simply outmicroed you and made you waste precious mining time. Then you made way too many creep colonies and attempted to morph them all into sunkens while they were being attacked. By the time they finished morphing they were dead.

Of course the downside was that he ran up your ramp into your main, but you didn't need to waste the 2 drone + 150 minerals to make those two creeps that died.

You could have spent the minerals making zerglings (you had 5 larvae unused, 150 minerals spent on creep colonies, and 98 minerals unused at that specific moment), and although yes they take time to hatch and your main is being prodded, stay calm and let it happen. Leave two to block the ramp and prevent reinforcements and take the rest and do a proper surround and get rid of the intruders.
You probably also noticed your own over-reaction when you made 3 creep colonies but realized you only needed to morph one.

The rest of the game was just your opponent being bm and messing with you. The game was over after the first 5 minutes, though maybe a slim chance of a comeback if he made a big mistake or you managed to miraculously prevent him from expanding all over the map.

Perhaps if he didn't tell you to leave by saying "re?" you would have left by yourself, but stayed behind because of his bm.

Another example of you panicking is when he sent a scout into your main to distract you. You fell for it, made two spore colonies (for just a single scout) meanwhile your front gets stormed and 1a2a3a-ed (though by now it didn't matter because the game was over anyway).

But ya, as the other posters have said before me, just relax and let a loss be a loss.
"Jaedong hyung better be ready. I'm going to order the most expensive dinner in Korea."
jello24
Profile Joined July 2009
Canada327 Posts
January 08 2010 06:35 GMT
#18
On January 08 2010 13:50 Poriyan1 wrote:
"I've missed more than 9,000 shots in my career. I've lost almost 300 games. Twenty-six times, I've been trusted to take the game-winning shot and missed. I've failed over and over and over again in my life. And that is why I succeed." -- M. Jordan.

The reason Michael Jordan succeeded was because he had Dennis Rodman with him. God people not giving credit where credit is due.
just lurking around...
Zoler
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
Sweden6339 Posts
January 08 2010 07:49 GMT
#19
On January 08 2010 13:18 JadeFist wrote:
I have been on and off for about 2.5 years (mostly off). I have played all 3 races. If I follow a build order, I lose anyway, I don't know what it is.


That's why you lose, 80% of improving is knowing why you lose.
Lim Yo Hwan forever!
ThunderGod
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
New Zealand897 Posts
January 08 2010 07:53 GMT
#20
Why do you want so badly to be better? It is certainly a difficult game to be "good" at.
Serious question though, have a proper think about this and you will either resolve to train more effectively - e.g. studying reps/practising more - or you will just start playing for fun (like a lot of people who get frustrated at laddering).
"Certain forms of popular music nowadays, namely rap and hip hop styles, are just irritating gangsters bragging about their illegal exploits and short-sighted lifestyles." - Shiverfish ~2009
1 2 3 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Map Test Tournament
11:00
$500 4v4 Open
WardiTV262
IndyStarCraft 181
Rex89
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Tasteless 317
OGKoka 208
IndyStarCraft 168
Rex 94
ProTech81
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 21215
Rain 4570
EffOrt 1543
Horang2 1278
actioN 716
Snow 480
Hyuk 474
BeSt 233
Larva 210
Leta 197
[ Show more ]
Pusan 174
Rush 166
Light 102
Barracks 93
Soulkey 92
Mind 84
Hyun 78
Nal_rA 68
ggaemo 56
Liquid`Ret 53
ZerO 50
sorry 38
Sharp 29
Movie 25
ivOry 25
Backho 18
Free 15
soO 11
Sacsri 10
ajuk12(nOOB) 10
JYJ9
Terrorterran 8
Shine 6
Noble 6
SilentControl 5
Dota 2
singsing2714
XcaliburYe169
boxi98133
Counter-Strike
shoxiejesuss378
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor101
Other Games
olofmeister710
B2W.Neo650
crisheroes420
Hui .191
Lowko79
Mew2King50
NeuroSwarm36
Trikslyr24
EmSc Tv 13
ZerO(Twitch)8
Organizations
StarCraft: Brood War
CasterMuse 14
Other Games
EmSc Tv 13
StarCraft 2
EmSc2Tv 13
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 13 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• LUISG 28
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Jankos1080
Other Games
• WagamamaTV165
Upcoming Events
Korean StarCraft League
15h 28m
BSL Open LAN 2025 - War…
20h 28m
RSL Revival
22h 28m
Reynor vs Cure
BSL Open LAN 2025 - War…
1d 20h
RSL Revival
1d 22h
Online Event
2 days
Wardi Open
2 days
Monday Night Weeklies
3 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
3 days
LiuLi Cup
5 days
[ Show More ]
The PondCast
5 days
CranKy Ducklings
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2025-09-10
Chzzk MurlocKing SC1 vs SC2 Cup #2
HCC Europe

Ongoing

BSL 20 Team Wars
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 3
BSL 21 Points
ASL Season 20
CSL 2025 AUTUMN (S18)
LASL Season 20
RSL Revival: Season 2
Maestros of the Game
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1

Upcoming

2025 Chongqing Offline CUP
BSL World Championship of Poland 2025
IPSL Winter 2025-26
BSL Season 21
SC4ALL: Brood War
BSL 21 Team A
Stellar Fest
SC4ALL: StarCraft II
EC S1
ESL Impact League Season 8
SL Budapest Major 2025
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.