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On February 17 2009 22:55 ManBearPig wrote:
In Praise of Drug Use
I don't post a lot, but I like this particular subject. I'm a drug user. I smoke weed on a regular basis, and I have tried MDMA, LSD and shrooms. They were all to my liking. Obviously I have been drunk. I like this (alcohol) as well, but I don't like the hangover it can give you and I especially don't like how aggressive or retarded it can make you when you've had too much.
Psychoactive drugs are, I think, the most interesting. They are used in many cultures in certain rituals. The idea that is presented through this use and that I would like to defend is that in taking certain psychoactive drugs, preferably under the supervision of more experienced 'trippers', one may undergo a change in character, or rather worldview, that will often be beneficial to one's happiness and/or the pursuit thereof. For me, my first trip - shrooms - had quite an enormous effect on my outlook on life and lead me to certain insights that I am quite happy to have attained. One may argue here that it is not at all necessary to take certain psychoactive substances in order to attain such valuable insights; that one may, by reading certain books, for example, question one's outlook on life and possibly change it for the better. This argument may hold in certain cases, but in general, I think, there are but a few people who are so open-minded and critical that they will be able to subject their 'outlook on life' to scrutiny. The benefit that shrooms offer, for example (I think there are other drugs that may better serve the purpose that I have described), is that they will put the user in that place; that is, a state of perplexion, a state in which curiosity reigns, a state in which one may question one's ideals fully and perhaps search oneself for other ideals that are more fitting of a life you really want to lead. Even for very average people, psychoactive drugs may 'get the job done'. Furthermore, even for the critical intellectual that is able to subject oneself to such critical scrutiny by reading Nietzsche for example, the realization of certain ideas may not necessarily make him 'interiorize' these ideas. This is, I think, another advantage of psychoactive drugs: because the experience is so intense and because it alters one's consciousness, it is quite conducive to the interiorisation of certain ideas, certain epiphanies, if you will, that might occur during the trip. You will not only hold these things to be true and just go on living your life; you are more likely to think about these ideas in a different way and indeed to live accordingly.
I believe that having an experience such as this at least once, and preferably every couple of years, is healthy and will indeed increase the chances of your leading a satisfying life.
I don't like the 'if you haven't tried it you don't know wtf you're talking about' argument. In fact, scientific tests concerning the effects of drugs consists mostly of people watching people who took certain drugs and describing/analysing their behavior. You can have a good idea of what it does to you without having tried it. However, in the case of psychoactive drugs, the usefulness of this method is questionable. You will have to listen to the stories of this drug-user in order to get an idea about what exactly it will do to you.
Finally I would like to say that an anti-drug-attitude is created under social pressure and what one might call a weak form of indoctrination. Equally so, it is often peer pressure that would drive one to reject such an attitude and accept a more drug-loving-attitude. Just because peer pressure may drive you to do certain stuff doesn't necessarily mean this stuff is bad. You are formed for a large part by peer pressure (or 'social pressure' to include teachers and parents).
I could write more extensively about this stuff (MDMA for example is entirely different than LSD and shrooms. LSD again is quite different from shooms), but I think this post is already too long.
What happens when the drugs disappear though, and you go thru withdrawal? And maybe your brain can never produce naturally the chemicals these drugs were replacing for so long? That's what scary about drugs... Your brain starts to think it doesn't need to produce its own chemicals to function normally, and as such when you quit drugs, you can never function as well as if you'd never done them in the first place.
Of course drugs have their place in society, and they will always be useful... But the anti-drug attitude isn't what you say it is. There's not a single parent or teacher I know who doesn't drink alcohol, or hasn't advocated it if only a little. Most North Americans have caffeine on a daily basis. As an adult, there's an immense amount of pressure to drink at any occasion, and when you choose to live your life avoiding drug use as much as possible (that is, if you had surgery you'd accept pain killers, but you wouldn't take them for fun), you end up feeling very isolated and alone, especially when you have drank a lot before. I really wish I'd understood the subject when they were teaching neuro-science in highschool, but it just didn't make sense to me, and they only did a few days on it. In retrospect it isn't that terribly complicated, but it is abstract and hard to understand when you have a million misconceptions about how the body works. As soon as I'd only began to understand it I swore off the alcohol. Understanding it more today than I did the day I quit, I realise just what parts of myself I may never get back.
It's a personal choice, and I don't say anyone who does drugs is stupid or evil. But just that people should respect that some want to utilize their bodies in different ways.
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On February 17 2009 23:52 Jibba wrote:Show nested quote +On February 17 2009 23:41 Phyre wrote:On February 17 2009 20:34 HamerD wrote:
you need to realise that you can change your outlook on drugs, and your position. Drugs are just escapism. So are video games. There's no difference. Repeatedly taking drugs and repeatedly playing games for long stretches of time are virtually identical as addictions, drugs just go a step further, but that's just what the person is doing to themselves.
Weed without excess really is just like snacking on a few crisps. Heroine addiction is like an obese person stuffing themselves with cake every day. Both are unfortunate. I don't take drugs btw or smoke. Which brings up another interesting point that I've thought about on many occasions. I've heard people bring up the comparison between drug use and playing video games, saying they aren't all that different. However, one obviously feels more "right" to me than the other. In theory, you could make the same comparison between reading books and using drugs. Perhaps I'm asking the wrong people, but is it a fair comparison to make? Pretty much any "escapist" hobby compared to drug use? Again, my gut says they aren't the same but I'm fairly biased I believe. It depends on the type of usage, for both drugs and video games. Some people do each for recreation and social activity, some people do each to escape what they hate about their lives and don't want to confront. Some people go from the former to the latter. My guess is your friends are in it for fun, but obviously I don't know.
They joke about not being able to deal with the daily grind without drugs/alcohol to escape it for awhile, but I think (and hope) it's more for the fun of it.
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On February 18 2009 00:26 Chef wrote:Show nested quote +On February 17 2009 22:55 ManBearPig wrote:
In Praise of Drug Use
I don't post a lot, but I like this particular subject. I'm a drug user. I smoke weed on a regular basis, and I have tried MDMA, LSD and shrooms. They were all to my liking. Obviously I have been drunk. I like this (alcohol) as well, but I don't like the hangover it can give you and I especially don't like how aggressive or retarded it can make you when you've had too much.
Psychoactive drugs are, I think, the most interesting. They are used in many cultures in certain rituals. The idea that is presented through this use and that I would like to defend is that in taking certain psychoactive drugs, preferably under the supervision of more experienced 'trippers', one may undergo a change in character, or rather worldview, that will often be beneficial to one's happiness and/or the pursuit thereof. For me, my first trip - shrooms - had quite an enormous effect on my outlook on life and lead me to certain insights that I am quite happy to have attained. One may argue here that it is not at all necessary to take certain psychoactive substances in order to attain such valuable insights; that one may, by reading certain books, for example, question one's outlook on life and possibly change it for the better. This argument may hold in certain cases, but in general, I think, there are but a few people who are so open-minded and critical that they will be able to subject their 'outlook on life' to scrutiny. The benefit that shrooms offer, for example (I think there are other drugs that may better serve the purpose that I have described), is that they will put the user in that place; that is, a state of perplexion, a state in which curiosity reigns, a state in which one may question one's ideals fully and perhaps search oneself for other ideals that are more fitting of a life you really want to lead. Even for very average people, psychoactive drugs may 'get the job done'. Furthermore, even for the critical intellectual that is able to subject oneself to such critical scrutiny by reading Nietzsche for example, the realization of certain ideas may not necessarily make him 'interiorize' these ideas. This is, I think, another advantage of psychoactive drugs: because the experience is so intense and because it alters one's consciousness, it is quite conducive to the interiorisation of certain ideas, certain epiphanies, if you will, that might occur during the trip. You will not only hold these things to be true and just go on living your life; you are more likely to think about these ideas in a different way and indeed to live accordingly.
I believe that having an experience such as this at least once, and preferably every couple of years, is healthy and will indeed increase the chances of your leading a satisfying life.
I don't like the 'if you haven't tried it you don't know wtf you're talking about' argument. In fact, scientific tests concerning the effects of drugs consists mostly of people watching people who took certain drugs and describing/analysing their behavior. You can have a good idea of what it does to you without having tried it. However, in the case of psychoactive drugs, the usefulness of this method is questionable. You will have to listen to the stories of this drug-user in order to get an idea about what exactly it will do to you.
Finally I would like to say that an anti-drug-attitude is created under social pressure and what one might call a weak form of indoctrination. Equally so, it is often peer pressure that would drive one to reject such an attitude and accept a more drug-loving-attitude. Just because peer pressure may drive you to do certain stuff doesn't necessarily mean this stuff is bad. You are formed for a large part by peer pressure (or 'social pressure' to include teachers and parents).
I could write more extensively about this stuff (MDMA for example is entirely different than LSD and shrooms. LSD again is quite different from shooms), but I think this post is already too long. What happens when the drugs disappear though, and you go thru withdrawal? And maybe your brain can never produce naturally the chemicals these drugs were replacing for so long? That's what scary about drugs... Your brain starts to think it doesn't need to produce its own chemicals to function normally, and as such when you quit drugs, you can never function as well as if you'd never done them in the first place. Of course drugs have their place in society, and they will always be useful... But the anti-drug attitude isn't what you say it is. There's not a single parent or teacher I know who doesn't drink alcohol, or hasn't advocated it if only a little. Most North Americans have caffeine on a daily basis. As an adult, there's an immense amount of pressure to drink at any occasion, and when you choose to live your life avoiding drug use as much as possible (that is, if you had surgery you'd accept pain killers, but you wouldn't take them for fun), you end up feeling very isolated and alone, especially when you have drank a lot before. I really wish I'd understood the subject when they were teaching neuro-science in highschool, but it just didn't make sense to me, and they only did a few days on it. In retrospect it isn't that terribly complicated, but it is abstract and hard to understand when you have a million misconceptions about how the body works. As soon as I'd only began to understand it I swore off the alcohol. Understanding it more today than I did the day I quit, I realise just what parts of myself I may never get back. It's a personal choice, and I don't say anyone who does drugs is stupid or evil. But just that people should respect that some want to utilize their bodies in different ways.
In my post you quoted I was talking about a single trip, or multiple trips spread out over a lifetime (like once a year maybe). Your argument is valid, I think, in the case of serious addiction to certain drugs, like MDMA for instance. I don't really think of MDMA as a psychoactive drug, it's more of a party drug. If you only trip once or maybe twice a year, using a non-addictive psychoactive drug, this objection most likely does not hold.
To be clear, when I was talking about an anti-drug-attitude, I was actually referring to the OP. I didn't say anything about people who never drink a drop of alcohol ? I'm actually not sure what exactly it is you're saying in the second paragraph? You wish you had never drank alcohol because it causes brain damage?
I agree that it's a personal choice. However, I do think the benefits of certain psychoactive drugs are often underrated or denied.
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On February 17 2009 13:27 Sanity. wrote:
+3
I can't believe I hadn't seen this blog. There is some good points here and there. I myself am a user of weed and alcohol but began a weed user. Now I smoke like two-three days a month(weekends) but am drinking several times a week now. I have used almost every drug out in this world and even abused (meth) for several months which was the ugliest shit I would ever introduce to anybody. I have had my share of friends in the passed that would use either just alchy or either just be that stoner or even be the speed freak. I myself would rather be with the friends that just got high off weed or any other psychoactive drug then be with the friend that was totally drinking 24/7 even thou now I do both. Everyone has there own perspective in drugs and with people using drugs. Drugs I believe can effect everyone differently as stated previously. I wanna go on with this but mostly all the good points have been pointed out already.
If you don't enjoy being around users then find yourself a new set of friends. Although it sounds easier being said then done I am sure you can find non-users that like to play video games and having all nighters playing and/or w/e else you do for fun. Or even better yet find yourself a local AA/NA group with young adults. I am sure they will befriend you once you tell them your hate for drugs.
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On February 18 2009 00:28 Phyre wrote:
They joke about not being able to deal with the daily grind without drugs/alcohol to escape it for awhile, but I think (and hope) it's more for the fun of it.
I'm not sure there is a difference between doing something because it's fun and doing something because you want to escape the daily grind. The grind is, by definition, things that aren't fun. So when you do something that is fun, you're escaping the grind.
I like the fact that you can acknowledge that your judgment of others for their choices is irrational. Tolerance is one of the more important skills you can learn in life, and it seems like you're on that path. Judge not, lest ye be judged.
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On February 17 2009 16:04 Osmoses wrote:Show nested quote +On February 17 2009 15:17 NatsuTerran wrote:
I'm just like the OP. I pretty much hate drug usage for no apparent reason. I think a big part of it is the fact that I am a completely original person who doesn't follow the crowd. Oh just you wait until you get out of high school and realize you are neither original nor outside the crowd, it'll be wonderful ^^ Of course, when you're done crying you will be the first to start inhaling gaseous happy. Anyway, as far as weed goes, it's a pretty boring drug imo, it just makes you slow and stupid. I dunno why the rappers keep singing about it.
I'm 20... And FYI I will never do a drug in my life, not even alcohol.
And I really don't get why everyone is so defensive about them taking drugs. Every drug user just seems so insecure when the topic comes up. I did happen to be a person with a very safe upbringing. Not only that, but I am extremely closed off to any new experiences. I simply hate trying anything new. I live and breathe consistency.
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On February 18 2009 05:14 NatsuTerran wrote:Show nested quote +On February 17 2009 16:04 Osmoses wrote:On February 17 2009 15:17 NatsuTerran wrote:
I'm just like the OP. I pretty much hate drug usage for no apparent reason. I think a big part of it is the fact that I am a completely original person who doesn't follow the crowd. Oh just you wait until you get out of high school and realize you are neither original nor outside the crowd, it'll be wonderful ^^ Of course, when you're done crying you will be the first to start inhaling gaseous happy. Anyway, as far as weed goes, it's a pretty boring drug imo, it just makes you slow and stupid. I dunno why the rappers keep singing about it. Not only that, but I am extremely closed off to any new experiences. I simply hate trying anything new.
now this is stupid for SOO many reasons
you won't try new foods?
you won't try a new brand of clothes?
you won't date a different type of girl? or what if you haven't dated a girl yet, you won't date anyone?!
you won't try driving a new car?
you won't fly abroad to visit a new country?
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United States22883 Posts
On February 18 2009 05:02 Rho_ wrote:Show nested quote +On February 18 2009 00:28 Phyre wrote:
They joke about not being able to deal with the daily grind without drugs/alcohol to escape it for awhile, but I think (and hope) it's more for the fun of it. I'm not sure there is a difference between doing something because it's fun and doing something because you want to escape the daily grind. The grind is, by definition, things that aren't fun. So when you do something that is fun, you're escaping the grind. I like the fact that you can acknowledge that your judgment of others for their choices is irrational. Tolerance is one of the more important skills you can learn in life, and it seems like you're on that path. Judge not, lest ye be judged.
There's recreation time, and then there's just avoiding responsibilities. Hardcore gaming/drug use falls under #2.
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On February 18 2009 05:45 KOFgokuon wrote:Show nested quote +On February 18 2009 05:14 NatsuTerran wrote:On February 17 2009 16:04 Osmoses wrote:On February 17 2009 15:17 NatsuTerran wrote:
I'm just like the OP. I pretty much hate drug usage for no apparent reason. I think a big part of it is the fact that I am a completely original person who doesn't follow the crowd. Oh just you wait until you get out of high school and realize you are neither original nor outside the crowd, it'll be wonderful ^^ Of course, when you're done crying you will be the first to start inhaling gaseous happy. Anyway, as far as weed goes, it's a pretty boring drug imo, it just makes you slow and stupid. I dunno why the rappers keep singing about it. Not only that, but I am extremely closed off to any new experiences. I simply hate trying anything new. now this is stupid for SOO many reasons you won't try new foods? you won't try a new brand of clothes? you won't date a different type of girl? or what if you haven't dated a girl yet, you won't date anyone?! you won't try driving a new car? you won't fly abroad to visit a new country?
No, I try things when I know I'm going to like them. If I have any doubts I don't try something. Which is why I find drug use to be completely irrational. How can you not have doubts about trying something like that. I'm not stupid man, I enjoy my life a ton more than most of the people on this site seem to.
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On February 18 2009 06:03 NatsuTerran wrote:Show nested quote +On February 18 2009 05:45 KOFgokuon wrote:On February 18 2009 05:14 NatsuTerran wrote:On February 17 2009 16:04 Osmoses wrote:On February 17 2009 15:17 NatsuTerran wrote:
I'm just like the OP. I pretty much hate drug usage for no apparent reason. I think a big part of it is the fact that I am a completely original person who doesn't follow the crowd. Oh just you wait until you get out of high school and realize you are neither original nor outside the crowd, it'll be wonderful ^^ Of course, when you're done crying you will be the first to start inhaling gaseous happy. Anyway, as far as weed goes, it's a pretty boring drug imo, it just makes you slow and stupid. I dunno why the rappers keep singing about it. Not only that, but I am extremely closed off to any new experiences. I simply hate trying anything new. now this is stupid for SOO many reasons you won't try new foods? you won't try a new brand of clothes? you won't date a different type of girl? or what if you haven't dated a girl yet, you won't date anyone?! you won't try driving a new car? you won't fly abroad to visit a new country? No, I try things when I know I'm going to like them. If I have any doubts I don't try something. Which is why I find drug use to be completely irrational. How can you not have doubts about trying something like that. I'm not stupid man, I enjoy my life a ton more than most of the people on this site seem to. yawn
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On February 18 2009 06:03 NatsuTerran wrote:Show nested quote +On February 18 2009 05:45 KOFgokuon wrote:On February 18 2009 05:14 NatsuTerran wrote:On February 17 2009 16:04 Osmoses wrote:On February 17 2009 15:17 NatsuTerran wrote:
I'm just like the OP. I pretty much hate drug usage for no apparent reason. I think a big part of it is the fact that I am a completely original person who doesn't follow the crowd. Oh just you wait until you get out of high school and realize you are neither original nor outside the crowd, it'll be wonderful ^^ Of course, when you're done crying you will be the first to start inhaling gaseous happy. Anyway, as far as weed goes, it's a pretty boring drug imo, it just makes you slow and stupid. I dunno why the rappers keep singing about it. Not only that, but I am extremely closed off to any new experiences. I simply hate trying anything new. now this is stupid for SOO many reasons you won't try new foods? you won't try a new brand of clothes? you won't date a different type of girl? or what if you haven't dated a girl yet, you won't date anyone?! you won't try driving a new car? you won't fly abroad to visit a new country? No, I try things when I know I'm going to like them. If I have any doubts I don't try something. Which is why I find drug use to be completely irrational. How can you not have doubts about trying something like that. I'm not stupid man, I enjoy my life a ton more than most of the people on this site seem to.
What is irrational is avoiding new experiences just because there is a possibility you will not enjoy them.
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I completely disagree. I'm happy the way I am, let's keep it that way. I'm not as close-minded as my above post may have led you. I tried a food I've never heard of before the past couple weeks. I talk to different people, with different opinions. And pretty much anything Kofgokuon mentioned.
Let's put it this way. A lot of people in this forum seem to have a lot of hate/disrespect for emo kids for w/e reason. The same answer you use to describe that can be said for my distaste for drug users.
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On February 18 2009 05:56 Jibba wrote:Show nested quote +On February 18 2009 05:02 Rho_ wrote:On February 18 2009 00:28 Phyre wrote:
They joke about not being able to deal with the daily grind without drugs/alcohol to escape it for awhile, but I think (and hope) it's more for the fun of it. I'm not sure there is a difference between doing something because it's fun and doing something because you want to escape the daily grind. The grind is, by definition, things that aren't fun. So when you do something that is fun, you're escaping the grind. I like the fact that you can acknowledge that your judgment of others for their choices is irrational. Tolerance is one of the more important skills you can learn in life, and it seems like you're on that path. Judge not, lest ye be judged. There's recreation time, and then there's just avoiding responsibilities. Hardcore gaming/drug use falls under #2.
You can do anything too much. Working is responsible, but there are people who work way too much.
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On February 18 2009 06:41 NatsuTerran wrote:
I completely disagree. I'm happy the way I am, let's keep it that way. I'm not as close-minded as my above post may have led you. I tried a food I've never heard of before the past couple weeks. I talk to different people, with different opinions. And pretty much anything Kofgokuon mentioned.
Let's put it this way. A lot of people in this forum seem to have a lot of hate/disrespect for emo kids for w/e reason. The same answer you use to describe that can be said for my distaste for drug users.
How do you feel about caffeine? Alcohol?
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I already mentioned I'll never touch alcohol. As for caffeine, I don't touch coffee and I'm trying to really cut soda out of my life. It's a bit harder with soda because it's apparently the only thing worth drinking at fast food places. So yea, the only thing I will ever take even remotely considered as a drug is soda 2-4 times a week and maybe some advil like once a blue moon.
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well you're just a regular boy scout aren't you?
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I'm not meaning to come off as being stuck up or better than anyone. Sorry if anyone is offended. I just have my own values which aren't really based off of anything concrete.
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On February 18 2009 07:09 NatsuTerran wrote:
I'm not meaning to come off as being stuck up or better than anyone. Sorry if anyone is offended. I just have my own values which aren't really based off of anything concrete.
What's the point in advertising the fact that you make arbitrary decisions lol? I mean, you could at least pretend it's not just because you listened when people said 'just say no to drugs."
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Guys.
Premarital sex is a sin.
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On February 18 2009 06:03 NatsuTerran wrote:Show nested quote +On February 18 2009 05:45 KOFgokuon wrote:On February 18 2009 05:14 NatsuTerran wrote:On February 17 2009 16:04 Osmoses wrote:On February 17 2009 15:17 NatsuTerran wrote:
I'm just like the OP. I pretty much hate drug usage for no apparent reason. I think a big part of it is the fact that I am a completely original person who doesn't follow the crowd. Oh just you wait until you get out of high school and realize you are neither original nor outside the crowd, it'll be wonderful ^^ Of course, when you're done crying you will be the first to start inhaling gaseous happy. Anyway, as far as weed goes, it's a pretty boring drug imo, it just makes you slow and stupid. I dunno why the rappers keep singing about it. Not only that, but I am extremely closed off to any new experiences. I simply hate trying anything new. now this is stupid for SOO many reasons you won't try new foods? you won't try a new brand of clothes? you won't date a different type of girl? or what if you haven't dated a girl yet, you won't date anyone?! you won't try driving a new car? you won't fly abroad to visit a new country? No, I try things when I know I'm going to like them. If I have any doubts I don't try something. Which is why I find drug use to be completely irrational. How can you not have doubts about trying something like that. I'm not stupid man, I enjoy my life a ton more than most of the people on this site seem to.
NO MAN NO MAN NO MAN NO MAN NO MAN blahblahlk
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EPT
