|
This is a heated issue, but please keep the debate civil.
Personal insult is not 'discussion' and will be moderated. -Pg 36 |
On August 16 2013 13:43 pbjsandwich wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2013 13:38 LuckoftheIrish wrote:On August 16 2013 13:33 pbjsandwich wrote:On August 16 2013 13:31 LuckoftheIrish wrote:On August 16 2013 13:30 pbjsandwich wrote:
I think it's fair to think Take came off as a dick in this situation
but he is completely fair in being this angry too. Look the whole blog post previous to this Genna only took very partial blame for this while posting many paragraphs and reasoning on why it is Take's teams fault
Not knowing the details of travel expenses is a HUGE oversight and creating a blog post, essentially, damage controlling it would be extremely angering if I was take
It's not all completely her fault but the fact that she mad e apost with private messages to damage control her huge mistake justifies Take's anger IMO She definitely took only partial blame. That's true. She shouldn't take complete blame because it wasn't solely her fault. I do agree with that but to not get complete confirmation for the travel? That is the most expensive part and if you haven't figured that out until a week before the event? What are you doing???? WCS timing matters here. The travel for that probably wouldn't have been figured into budgets created at the beginning of the year. So there are a lot of unplanned expenses that swallow the entire budget. And from the other side, what kind of tournament doesn't say: hey, our LAN final is at this time and this is what we're willing to do for travel arrangements? Literally every tournament provides some sort of travel accommodation as part of the package. Why wouldn't you be clear and up-front about what that was? So it was bad communication and planning from both sides, and Genna acknowledged that. yes she acknowledged that but a majority of her previous blog post blames the Take team... like I said before, that's a ridiculous oversight for a team
I think she did a tremendous job showing that TaKe and the ATC organizers did as much as they possibly could to help resolve the situation. She even specifically says TaKe puts on great events and that people should continue to follow and support them.
|
can someone post the original post that got her in trouble?
|
On August 16 2013 13:43 EnderCraft wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2013 13:41 theking1 wrote:On August 16 2013 13:39 EnderCraft wrote:On August 16 2013 13:36 theking1 wrote:
I do not think this is much of a surprise comming form the totalbiscuit-genna couple.They invested some money into sc2 but after failing to obtain big profits(and i am only quoting tb twitter right here) they sort of realize that esports is not exactly the thing that could bring in profits and they decide to slowly leave by throwing dirt at everyone that disagrees with them,This is happening in the context in which totalbiscuit is threatening to stop casting sc2 (like anyone forced him in the first place).
This entire paragraph. All of it is wrong. All of it. why?go look on totalbiscutis twitter now.See how many posts he has bashing the sc2 community,the sc2 scene and whining how ihe is gonna leave cause he ain't making money.Its the truth.The fact that now they are trying to find pretexts by bashing take(a guy here form day 0) because of a skype conversation(lol) is preety childish. LOL he's never whined that he hasn't made any money. He's always said that he never intended on making any money off SC2, and that it's a passion project of his. Get your shit right.
of course he has.he throws the 100k dollars on twitter all day long saying how we should be gratefull to him.get back at me when LiquidNazgul or any other team owners(korean included) start asking for good pr because of the money they invested.Esports aint a million dollar business.It is a hole in which you throw money and you are lucky if you recover you innitial investment.It has always been like this.
|
On August 16 2013 13:44 geokilla wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2013 13:32 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On August 16 2013 13:28 MountainDewJunkie wrote:On August 16 2013 13:17 TotalBiscuit wrote:On August 16 2013 13:15 geokilla wrote:On August 16 2013 13:11 TotalBiscuit wrote:On August 16 2013 13:10 Bagi wrote:
Feels like overreaction. The childish "fuck Take"-stuff isn't helping anyone either. Yeah man we should totally just hug it out after he threatened my wife and the team with legal action. Is this the first time you got threatened with legal action? My mom deals with that daily at her work with clients. Grow up. I got threatened with legal action and racism a couple days ago. You know what I did? I played it cool, stayed calm, and finished my transaction with the buyer. News just in, eSports is not the same as working at a supermarket. That was pretty rude And ignorant as well, considering geokilla works in a real estate law firm lol. But TB's in rant-mode x.x I just want to clarify. I myself don't work in a real estate law firm. Wish I did. I'm too young for that... still studying in university, finding my way. HOWEVER, I hear stories about my mom's clients, builders, etc., and she gets threatened with legal action a lot. Either towards her, or the firm. And I've worked in a customer service position where I got threatened with legal action at least once each week. I worked full time hours too. If we both acted like TB and how he does on the Internet, we'd be out of a job pretty quickly.
Fair enough; thanks for the clarification 
And yeah, I'd imagine most people in most jobs can't get away with acting unprofessional towards anyone just because they have a different opinion.
|
On August 16 2013 13:48 partydude89 wrote:
can someone post the original post that got her in trouble?
http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?id=425572
I wouldn't say it got her in trouble with anyone. Maybe it made one guy upset, but most people were pretty understanding.
|
On August 16 2013 13:47 TheButtonmen wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2013 13:46 pbjsandwich wrote:
Look, I know I'm on Takes side in this situation
but I absolutely love Genna and what she's done for this community. It just really pisses me off that people want to talk shit about Take over this
Arguably, Take has done a lot more for this scene Him doing things for the scene doesn't make him threatening to take people to court because he doesn't like their blog post acceptable.
he runs a business on a thin margin of profit....
I think this is completely fair
|
On August 16 2013 13:43 teddyoojo wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2013 13:36 theking1 wrote:
I do not think this is much of a surprise comming form the totalbiscuit-genna couple.They invested some money into sc2 but after failing to obtain big profits(and i am only quoting tb twitter right here) they sort of realize that esports is not exactly the thing that could bring in profits and they decide to slowly leave by throwing dirt at everyone that disagrees with them,This is happening in the context in which totalbiscuit is threatening to stop casting sc2 (like anyone forced him in the first place).
I find quite obnoxious that they are insulting Take who has provided the community with one of the best and most entertaining tournament s there is HSC which ran for 7 editions and made sc2 players look more human.Also take has been with sc2 from the very beggining.In terms of what the sc2 community is concerned I would much rateher prefer to have take and see the next HSCups than hear about totalbiscuit whinning and moaning all day long.
And this is another thing I disliked form the very first day about the totalbiscuit jenna-couple:the constant whinning and moaning.Everybody knows that in the esports industry you have to deal with unpleasant situations.LiquidNAzgul knows about this,alex garfield,sir scoots,day9 and countless other team owners and people involved know about this yet none of them moan and complain as much as totalbiscuit and genna.I mean literally you would think they are the only ones having issues and everyone else doesn't.Totalbiscuit is probably the only teamowner who constantly throws the 100k $ number on twitter to remind the community how much he invested.I never hear Nazgul say on twitter:"Man I invested probably a million dollars since bw in the sc scene you all should not say anything bad about me".Get over it.You are not more entitled than any other team owners who put money into the scen.If esports,and especially sc2 does not make you a profit then for gods sake move one.
I would not be surprised that in a couple of months after tb and genna decide to leave sc2 permanently they will write an essay on reddit simmilar to what destiny did when he switched to lol saying how bad sc2 is and how much the community sucks.On the long run tb will hurt the sc2 proscene more than they will help.
And the excuse about bashing is absolutely pathetic.All people in esports get ot deal with anonymus trolls.So what?Noone has quoted them as the reason for baciing off esports.And bashing Take out of all people is absolutely disgenuite.Oh and by the way Take has not taken any legal action.He might have just been upset and trolled on skype.
In conclusion:I understand that people can not make large amounts of money of sc2.But if you really wana quit the scen do not do it destiny style by throwing trash at everyhting.instead be more humble about it.Nobody blames you. u romanian?
what difference does it make?
|
|
|
On August 16 2013 13:47 Irave wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2013 13:36 pbjsandwich wrote:On August 16 2013 13:34 NovemberstOrm wrote:On August 16 2013 13:33 skatblast wrote:
Dont make private conversations public, it cant be that hard to understand, sorry and goodbye. Goodluck She made the post to clear her teams name NO one except Take was hurt for whatever reason. He had no reason to be hurt. he most definitely does.... it's a private conversation. Imagine if you had a private conversation open for the public... it's really that simple Sure he was hurt, but part of that is probably due to embarrassment. He came out and made false claims making Axiom look bad. How to prove his statements untrue. You release the facts. Take should have felt bad with the information he was trying to provide to us to save face. Now he should feel more awkward for being proven a liar. Then wishing he would be able to take legal steps.
Exactly. The only reason his precious private conversation got released in the first place was because of how he originally handled the situation.
|
Canada16217 Posts
Acer is not angry.
On August 16 2013 13:22 TotalBiscuit wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2013 13:19 Thrax wrote:On August 16 2013 13:00 TotalBiscuit wrote:On August 16 2013 12:58 Joedaddy wrote:
Pretty shitty move when you make what one presumed to be a private conversation public. Even if you didn't think it was a big deal, Dennis obviously did. Fuck Dennis. If he wasn't so concerned about saving face rather than being honest with everybody about his mismanaged tournament then some of this might not have happened. When you say "I hope there are legal consequences for what you've done" all bets are off, I lose any respect I've had for you. I hope Take enjoyed the free casting and the numbers, I'll never deal with him and his organisation ever again. I have to agree with that sentiment. Maybe that first blog post was not entirely thought through (directly quoting private conversations instead of paraphrasing or summarizing). It's a small mistake, Genna could have reached out to Acer directly if she felt the need to apologize after Take points out that some feathers are ruffled. I'm sure Axiom has a pretty decent relationship with Acer. Take is taking it over the top with the legal threats, I'm rather disgusted. Regardless, it sounds like if it wasn't this bullshit, the next one would have been the straw that broke the camel's back. All the best to Genna. Genna had already talked about all of this with Acer, we maintain a good relationship with them and they were not in fact pissed off that we posted that stuff at all. Acer would have no doubt done exactly the same thing if they had come under fire. The first duty of a team manager is to protect their team, not protect 3rd parties. We learned that when we tried to do what was right for Demuslim and Sasquatch in WCS after MLGs admin fucked up and were crucified for that as well.
|
On August 16 2013 13:47 LuckoftheIrish wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2013 13:43 pbjsandwich wrote:On August 16 2013 13:38 LuckoftheIrish wrote:On August 16 2013 13:33 pbjsandwich wrote:On August 16 2013 13:31 LuckoftheIrish wrote:On August 16 2013 13:30 pbjsandwich wrote:
I think it's fair to think Take came off as a dick in this situation
but he is completely fair in being this angry too. Look the whole blog post previous to this Genna only took very partial blame for this while posting many paragraphs and reasoning on why it is Take's teams fault
Not knowing the details of travel expenses is a HUGE oversight and creating a blog post, essentially, damage controlling it would be extremely angering if I was take
It's not all completely her fault but the fact that she mad e apost with private messages to damage control her huge mistake justifies Take's anger IMO She definitely took only partial blame. That's true. She shouldn't take complete blame because it wasn't solely her fault. I do agree with that but to not get complete confirmation for the travel? That is the most expensive part and if you haven't figured that out until a week before the event? What are you doing???? WCS timing matters here. The travel for that probably wouldn't have been figured into budgets created at the beginning of the year. So there are a lot of unplanned expenses that swallow the entire budget. And from the other side, what kind of tournament doesn't say: hey, our LAN final is at this time and this is what we're willing to do for travel arrangements? Literally every tournament provides some sort of travel accommodation as part of the package. Why wouldn't you be clear and up-front about what that was? So it was bad communication and planning from both sides, and Genna acknowledged that. yes she acknowledged that but a majority of her previous blog post blames the Take team... like I said before, that's a ridiculous oversight for a team I think she did a tremendous job showing that TaKe and the ATC organizers did as much as they possibly could to help resolve the situation. She even specifically says TaKe puts on great events and that people should continue to follow and support them.
Yes, that is what she tried to say with the commentary
but look at the conclusion of it...
look at the meat of the blog post
It's really like saying "no offense" after saying something hella offensive IMO
|
On August 16 2013 13:49 pbjsandwich wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2013 13:47 TheButtonmen wrote:On August 16 2013 13:46 pbjsandwich wrote:
Look, I know I'm on Takes side in this situation
but I absolutely love Genna and what she's done for this community. It just really pisses me off that people want to talk shit about Take over this
Arguably, Take has done a lot more for this scene Him doing things for the scene doesn't make him threatening to take people to court because he doesn't like their blog post acceptable. he runs a business on a thin margin of profit.... I think this is completely fair
How does his profitability change the fact that he decided to threaten legal action over her blog post?
|
Think of it this way. Can u imagine sundance revealing the private skype convos he had with blizzard officials regarding having sc2 events at mlg? Heck no, you would never see such a breach in professional courtesy. What Genna did is just wrong. She really needs to issue a mea culpa and apology to Dennis.
|
Canada16217 Posts
Oh another tweet by TB about Acer
Oh btw can I just say Team Acer have been nothing but awesome throughout this entire thing? They are straight up.
|
On August 16 2013 13:44 pbjsandwich wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2013 13:44 chaos021 wrote:On August 16 2013 13:36 theking1 wrote:+ Show Spoiler +
I do not think this is much of a surprise comming form the totalbiscuit-genna couple.They invested some money into sc2 but after failing to obtain big profits(and i am only quoting tb twitter right here) they sort of realize that esports is not exactly the thing that could bring in profits and they decide to slowly leave by throwing dirt at everyone that disagrees with them,This is happening in the context in which totalbiscuit is threatening to stop casting sc2 (like anyone forced him in the first place).
I find quite obnoxious that they are insulting Take who has provided the community with one of the best and most entertaining tournament s there is HSC which ran for 7 editions and made sc2 players look more human.Also take has been with sc2 from the very beggining.In terms of what the sc2 community is concerned I would much rateher prefer to have take and see the next HSCups than hear about totalbiscuit whinning and moaning all day long.
And this is another thing I disliked form the very first day about the totalbiscuit jenna-couple:the constant whinning and moaning.Everybody knows that in the esports industry you have to deal with unpleasant situations.LiquidNAzgul knows about this,alex garfield,sir scoots,day9 and countless other team owners and people involved know about this yet none of them moan and complain as much as totalbiscuit and genna.I mean literally you would think they are the only ones having issues and everyone else doesn't.Totalbiscuit is probably the only teamowner who constantly throws the 100k $ number on twitter to remind the community how much he invested.I never hear Nazgul say on twitter:"Man I invested probably a million dollars since bw in the sc scene you all should not say anything bad about me".Get over it.You are not more entitled than any other team owners who put money into the scen.If esports,and especially sc2 does not make you a profit then for gods sake move one.
I would not be surprised that in a couple of months after tb and genna decide to leave sc2 permanently they will write an essay on reddit simmilar to what destiny did when he switched to lol saying how bad sc2 is and how much the community sucks.On the long run tb will hurt the sc2 proscene more than they will help.
And the excuse about bashing is absolutely pathetic.All people in esports get ot deal with anonymus trolls.So what?Noone has quoted them as the reason for baciing off esports.And bashing Take out of all people is absolutely disgenuite
In conclusion:I understand that people can not make large amounts of money of sc2.But if you really wana quit the scen do not do it destiny style by throwing trash at everyhting.instead be more humble about it.Nobody blames you.
You are so full of shit that I can smell you halfway around the world. All they're trying to do is make the SC2 scene about good players instead of just names and brands. If you just want to run on about random bullshit, go find a bridge and stay under it. On August 16 2013 13:36 pbjsandwich wrote:On August 16 2013 13:34 NovemberstOrm wrote:On August 16 2013 13:33 skatblast wrote:
Dont make private conversations public, it cant be that hard to understand, sorry and goodbye. Goodluck She made the post to clear her teams name NO one except Take was hurt for whatever reason. He had no reason to be hurt. he most definitely does.... it's a private conversation. Imagine if you had a private conversation open for the public... it's really that simple A private conversation?? Why is everyone throwing this shit around like that matters? It's not as if they're signing non-disclosure agreements about any of this. They're talking about business over the internet and have no obligation to keep their mouths shut. Yea, it could be viewed as airing out some laundry. Even if in my opinion, said "laundry" was not dirty, they have their own right to do with it as they will so long as they haven't damaged other involved parties (as far as I know). As far as I can see, no one has been damaged. If he wants to be butthurt about it, that's his business. However, it being a private conversation means not a damn thing. i'm sorry you don't understand how a private conversation can be a sensitive issue....
Are you serious? That's all you have?
|
On August 16 2013 13:52 TotalBiscuit wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2013 13:51 AnachronisticAnarchy wrote:On August 16 2013 13:44 ptbl wrote:On August 16 2013 13:36 dcemuser wrote:On August 16 2013 13:35 ptbl wrote:
Take has the right to be angry. He is the "injured" party. It wasn't take who revealed the private conversations without the other parties consent nor notification. Irrelevant. She stepped on toes (while painting him as a good person), he stepped over the line. uhh, Genna exposed the fact that Liquid needed monetary support to send players to the ATC final. Take told Genna the information in confidence, but she revealed it without proper notification nor consent. So, what do you mean it made Take look good. Airing dirty laundry is never good. Take volunteered to pay thousands of dollars to help Axiom come to ATC. No he didn't.
Wow, even with a top-percentile memory I still messed that up. Very sorry, dunno how that happened.
|
On August 16 2013 13:48 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2013 13:44 geokilla wrote:On August 16 2013 13:32 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On August 16 2013 13:28 MountainDewJunkie wrote:On August 16 2013 13:17 TotalBiscuit wrote:On August 16 2013 13:15 geokilla wrote:On August 16 2013 13:11 TotalBiscuit wrote:On August 16 2013 13:10 Bagi wrote:
Feels like overreaction. The childish "fuck Take"-stuff isn't helping anyone either. Yeah man we should totally just hug it out after he threatened my wife and the team with legal action. Is this the first time you got threatened with legal action? My mom deals with that daily at her work with clients. Grow up. I got threatened with legal action and racism a couple days ago. You know what I did? I played it cool, stayed calm, and finished my transaction with the buyer. News just in, eSports is not the same as working at a supermarket. That was pretty rude And ignorant as well, considering geokilla works in a real estate law firm lol. But TB's in rant-mode x.x I just want to clarify. I myself don't work in a real estate law firm. Wish I did. I'm too young for that... still studying in university, finding my way. HOWEVER, I hear stories about my mom's clients, builders, etc., and she gets threatened with legal action a lot. Either towards her, or the firm. And I've worked in a customer service position where I got threatened with legal action at least once each week. I worked full time hours too. If we both acted like TB and how he does on the Internet, we'd be out of a job pretty quickly. Fair enough; thanks for the clarification And yeah, I'd imagine most people in most jobs can't get away with acting unprofessional towards anyone just because they have a different opinion.
Again this all started because of the original report coming out about Axiom's cancellation not explaining everything first. That report blamed them first, they rebutted in the exact same medium the original report was written in, on the internet.
|
Every single time I hear about the corporate side of SC2 I feel disturbed and slightly dirty by supporting it. Ugh.
The only exception I can remember to this rule is when Axiom announced how they were gonna run things, and the stories that come out of that team.
GLHF Genna. I hope you quickly find something more rewarding to devote your energies to.
|
I honestly didn't think anyone looked "bad" until Take made that comment about legal action. Both sides are to blame and Genna acknowledged that. The appropriate information should have been provided from the beginning by the management of the ATC and Genna should have made sure that all that information was received(tournament location, prize pool, travel stipends, etc..). The only thing that I could see as upsetting between the two parties is Genna posting a bunch of emails/chat logs. But, in my opinion, there wasn't anything controversial said/written/posted(except for the whole legal action thing).
|
A ) Axiom for not performing due diligence in being aware of all of the parameters for an event they were involved in.
B ) TakeTV for not communicating clearly with teams.
C ) Acer for not providing enough sponsorship to support travel for the offline portion of ATC.
Take your pick, but consider this.
A ) Fairweather fans are best known by their lack of support during hard times. We appreciate our loyal fans and when we do compete, we do it for them.
B ) Organizations that put together good quality events in our community should not be taken for granted. The ATC finals should be great and hopefully you tune in.
C ) Acer had a clear contract with TakeTV
You people who are agreeing with Genna Bain are agreeing with the sanctimonious manipulative ass that wrote the above.
I mean REALLY, you either support us or you're a fairweather fan, again you're WITH US or AGAINST US, there is no room for questioning our decisions or anything else because if you do you're AGAINST US remember, you fairweather fan you.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
