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Skilledblob
Germany3392 Posts
On September 25 2013 05:16 Spekulatius wrote: CDU/SPD coalition would make it possible to change the constitution without having to seek the consent of the opposition. This somehow scares me. dont worry dude, germany doesnt have a constitution | ||
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teddyoojo
Germany22369 Posts
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Spekulatius
Germany2413 Posts
On September 26 2013 06:46 Skilledblob wrote: dont worry dude, germany doesnt have a constitution Care to elaborate? | ||
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Poffel
471 Posts
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=deutsche verfassung | ||
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Spekulatius
Germany2413 Posts
You're not being helpful. | ||
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Nyxisto
Germany6287 Posts
On September 26 2013 06:46 Skilledblob wrote: dont worry dude, germany doesnt have a constitution Not only are you desperately trying to be a wise ass, you're also wrong, as the English term for 'Grundgesetz' also is constitution. People would like a left wing coalition if Die Linke would get rid of all communists, like the KPF and all the others, stop working with the DKP and stop supporting the "Junge Welt", and then properly handle their past. Then they people might accept a red red green coalition Well considering that 42% voted for the CDU, and far over 50% voted conservative, and given the fact that only 25% of people would like red-red-green, this coalition isn't really an option, even if they get rid of ex-communists and whatnot. Even if you personally like or dislike the CDU, with their nearly absolute majority it's quite clear that people want the CDU and Merkel in the government. | ||
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Skilledblob
Germany3392 Posts
On September 26 2013 08:14 Nyxisto wrote: Not only are you desperately trying to be a wise ass, you're also wrong, as the English term for 'Grundgesetz' also is constitution. Well considering that 42% voted for the CDU, and far over 50% voted conservative, and given the fact that only 25% of people would like red-red-green, this coalition isn't really an option, even if they get rid of ex-communists and whatnot. Even if you personally like or dislike the CDU, with their nearly absolute majority it's quite clear that people want the CDU and Merkel in the government. the grundgesetz was made shortly after the second world war as a basic set of laws that will enable the new german state to build upon that a constitution that has to be accepted through a refferendum by all people of voting age in germany. this still has not happened and that's why we dont have a constitution we have the grundgesetz. article 146 in the grundgesetz is the reference for that if you want to look it up and if you translate grundgesetz to constitution then you are just plain wrong. Verfassung = constitution, grundgesetz translates to basic law. | ||
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Ropid
Germany3557 Posts
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Spekulatius
Germany2413 Posts
On September 26 2013 08:24 Skilledblob wrote: the grundgesetz was made shortly after the second world war as a basic set of laws that will enable the new german state to build upon that a constitution that has to be accepted through a refferendum by all people of voting age in germany. this still has not happened and that's why we dont have a constitution we have the grundgesetz. article 146 in the grundgesetz is the reference for that if you want to look it up and if you translate grundgesetz to constitution then you are just plain wrong. Verfassung = constitution, grundgesetz translates to basic law. So you are just being a smart-ass. | ||
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LaNague
Germany9118 Posts
article 146 in the grundgesetz is the reference for that if you want to look it up This is highly offtopic, but you are reading it wrong. What it really says is that it ONLY loses its power when there is a new constitution that is voted for by the citizens. The intention here is that it can not simply be replaced. | ||
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SilentchiLL
Germany1405 Posts
He's not really being a smartass when he's wrong I think. On September 26 2013 08:54 LaNague wrote: This is highly offtopic, but you are reading it wrong. What it really says is that it ONLY loses its power when there is a new constitution that is voted for by the citizens. The intention here is that it can not simply be replaced. I would interpret it that way too, do we have a neutral lawyer here for a professional opinion? Especially since this site, http://www.iuscomp.org calls it: "Article 146 [Duration of validity of the Basic Law]" For the others in the thread Artikel 146 Dieses Grundgesetz, das nach Vollendung der Einheit und Freiheit Deutschlands für das gesamte deutsche Volk gilt, verliert seine Gültigkeit an dem Tage, an dem eine Verfassung in Kraft tritt, die von dem deutschen Volke in freier Entscheidung beschlossen worden ist. Article 146 [Duration of validity of the Basic Law] This Basic Law, which since the achievement of the unity and freedom of Germany applies to the entire German people, shall cease to apply on the day on which a constitution freely adopted by the German people takes effect. | ||
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Nyxisto
Germany6287 Posts
Back on topic: I personally would really like to see a black-green government. Not only wouldn't we have any kind of opposition otherwise, but i feel like civil rights and humanitarian topics will get under the wheels again if we have a black/red government. Also it might be a bit more interesting and refreshing. Sure tax policies are way different, but i don't think the greens will go with such a left-wing program in the future anyway. On energy-policies on the other hand there aren't even that many differences anymore. | ||
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Skilledblob
Germany3392 Posts
actually i was but I forgot that everything is dead serious here dont think CDU + Greens would work. I think it was Hamburg? where they tried that coalition and it did not work at all. | ||
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Spekulatius
Germany2413 Posts
For anyone interested, so that this completely unrelated discussion about art. 146 does not need to go on: Dissertation about this topic (among others) - starting on p74 (p86 of the pdf) And it really does not matter if it is a "Grundgesetz" or a "Verfassung". It has at least the same value than any other constitution in any other nation on this planet: it organizes the country, the administration, the judges, the legislation and the personal freedoms. Its laws rank highest in the hierarchy of national laws and are difficult (most) or impossible (some) to alter. A grand coalition would enable CDU/CSU/SPD to change it by themselves and considering recent evolutions (where the EU is headed, the NSA affair, etc.) I think I would have a reason to be worried. | ||
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SpikeStarcraft
Germany2095 Posts
I think we might need a German politics megathread just like the US and UK one on teamliquid. Since we're quite a lot of Germans discussing German politics on TL talking english with eachother :D Fun fact: England really doesnt have a written constitution. | ||
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Mataza
Germany5364 Posts
I'm kinda out of mainstream mediaand try to stay clear of useless drama, so I missed it. Was it about handling the former NPD and rechtsradikal members? | ||
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SilentchiLL
Germany1405 Posts
On September 26 2013 12:56 Mataza wrote: I am usually not that interested in our politics, but after successfully remembering to vote on the election sunday, I really want to know how exactly did the Pirates fuck up so hard? I'm kinda out of mainstream mediaand try to stay clear of useless drama, so I missed it. Was it about handling the former NPD and rechtsradikal members? Since they show up in every new party (I mean, they have to go somewhere as well when they want to stay in politics after leaving the npd, right?  ) -and old party, but people don't care as much there- that wasn't the issue, haven't really cared about the pirates in the last 1-2 years, but as far as I know they had a lot of internal conflicts.Since we're in a gamerforum there are probably guys who know a lot more about it, though. | ||
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Aiobhill
Germany283 Posts
On September 26 2013 12:56 Mataza wrote: I am usually not that interested in our politics, but after successfully remembering to vote on the election sunday, I really want to know how exactly did the Pirates fuck up so hard? I'm kinda out of mainstream mediaand try to stay clear of useless drama, so I missed it. Was it about handling the former NPD and rechtsradikal members? Main issues in this election cycle were economy and Europe. Contributions from Pirates on those topics were rare. Smart, realistic contributions were non-existent, but since I'm also 'kinda out of mainstream media', whoever feel free to correct me with links/quotes. Pirates do well on their main issues - net culture, privacy, civil rights. During a world-wide banking and economic crisis since Lehman, that's nice but not enough in the eyes of most grown-ups to justify voting for them. | ||
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REDBLUEGREEN
Germany1904 Posts
On September 26 2013 14:42 Aiobhill wrote: Main issues in this election cycle were economy and Europe. Contributions from Pirates on those topics were rare. Smart, realistic contributions were non-existent, but since I'm also 'kinda out of mainstream media', whoever feel free to correct me with links/quotes. Pirates do well on their main issues - net culture, privacy, civil rights. During a world-wide banking and economic crisis since Lehman, that's nice but not enough in the eyes of most grown-ups to justify voting for them. To be honest I think it is much more about image then actual ideas. Personally I think the Left's and Green's ideas about the Euro and financial crisis were better then those of the other established parties. Now I am no expert in the area but I know some people who know a lot about finance have the same opinion. It's a very complex problem and even experts don't agree what the right course of action would be, so of course the average voter has no fucking idea and most don't even know the different parties ideas to tackle the problem, they just go with public perception and public perception is the CDU and SPD know best how to handle financial things. So even if the Pirates had brilliant ideas about the Euro and financial crisis people would still not take them seriously because the party is too young and has a silly name... | ||
zatic
Zurich15365 Posts
On September 24 2013 21:26 Encdalf wrote: I don't think that there will be re-elections. Why should there? If CDU/CSU doesn't find a coalition partner, they have to govern as a minority government, since I don't see how a coalition of Linke, SPD and Greens would work. It is not up to them. If the Chancellor candidate doesn't manage to get an absolute majority in the Bundestag it is up to the President to decide whether the country is better served by a minority government or new elections. | ||
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