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Hi this is my first blog entry!
I've one of those people whom sometimes artificially inflates stream numbers for the only reason that I think it might help the streamer/tournament. There are a couple of ways to inflate the numbers. First off is to mute and lower the resolution of the stream to minimize impact of my bandwidth to allow me to do something else.
Then there is, to use a traditional gaming term in a new way, ghosting which is leaving the stream open while you are off the computer minding your own business. As such the steam is only available for ghosts to see some action.
Am I the only one who does this consciously and regularly?
 
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Shame on you. This is illegal in 43 states in America, and I am calling the cops on you and I hope you brought your teletubby plushy doll because it's about to get soaking warm in here.
You will be arrested at the stroke of noon good sir, have a sincere day and I hope you are not numb from the blessings of our saviour.
wait what you inflate numbers? why lol, what will that even prove to your family. Get a grip son, they only love you for your money.
Just take it and run, to the Cayman Islands. Find peace young padawan. We will meet again soon
4/5 would not read again, and your blog was pretty good too
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In the short term and smal scale, this is indeed helpful. In the long term and large scale, any such activity (and having streams open in the bakcground in certainly not the first instance of this) is actually hurting the people you want to help.
Why? At first sight it seems that streams generate revenue depending on how many people see an advertisement. But the ultimate goal of the advertisers is not to show off their wonderfully produced ads. It is to sell stuff. If many people ignore the ads or don't see them at all, the percieved effectivenes of the ads gets lowered and thus also their value to the advertiser and consequently the price he is willing to pay for them.
In the end, when a medium is found to not generate sales even though much advertiesement is run there, the advertisers leave it, or at least it gets much less profitable to sell advertisements on it. It actually already happened to the whole internet a couple of years ago and the next wave is right behind the corner, as more and more publishers see that pure ad-supported business is not sustainable. That's why there are now more paywalls than ever, mainly in news media.
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On December 24 2012 01:08 opisska wrote:
In the short term and smal scale, this is indeed helpful. In the long term and large scale, any such activity (and having streams open in the bakcground in certainly not the first instance of this) is actually hurting the people you want to help.
Why? At first sight it seems that streams generate revenue depending on how many people see an advertisement. But the ultimate goal of the advertisers is not to show off their wonderfully produced ads. It is to sell stuff. If many people ignore the ads or don't see them at all, the percieved effectivenes of the ads gets lowered and thus also their value to the advertiser and consequently the price he is willing to pay for them.
In the end, when a medium is found to not generate sales even though much advertiesement is run there, the advertisers leave it, or at least it gets much less profitable to sell advertisements on it. It actually already happened to the whole internet a couple of years ago and the next wave is right behind the corner, as more and more publishers see that pure ad-supported business is not sustainable. That's why there are now more paywalls than ever, mainly in news media.
fprtunately majority of companys who pay for advertising are not omniscient so ahve no way of knowing which forms of ads is being effective
there is absolutely nothing harmful in ghosting a stream either in the short or long term mainly because right now the scene is still trying to grow so there is a long term
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On December 24 2012 10:33 Forikorder wrote:Show nested quote +On December 24 2012 01:08 opisska wrote:
In the short term and smal scale, this is indeed helpful. In the long term and large scale, any such activity (and having streams open in the bakcground in certainly not the first instance of this) is actually hurting the people you want to help.
Why? At first sight it seems that streams generate revenue depending on how many people see an advertisement. But the ultimate goal of the advertisers is not to show off their wonderfully produced ads. It is to sell stuff. If many people ignore the ads or don't see them at all, the percieved effectivenes of the ads gets lowered and thus also their value to the advertiser and consequently the price he is willing to pay for them.
In the end, when a medium is found to not generate sales even though much advertiesement is run there, the advertisers leave it, or at least it gets much less profitable to sell advertisements on it. It actually already happened to the whole internet a couple of years ago and the next wave is right behind the corner, as more and more publishers see that pure ad-supported business is not sustainable. That's why there are now more paywalls than ever, mainly in news media.
fprtunately majority of companys who pay for advertising are not omniscient so ahve no way of knowing which forms of ads is being effective there is absolutely nothing harmful in ghosting a stream either in the short or long term mainly because right now the scene is still trying to grow so there is a long term
All lies create bubbles that give you illusory benefit now and cost you later.
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On December 24 2012 11:53 Mstring wrote:Show nested quote +On December 24 2012 10:33 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 01:08 opisska wrote:
In the short term and smal scale, this is indeed helpful. In the long term and large scale, any such activity (and having streams open in the bakcground in certainly not the first instance of this) is actually hurting the people you want to help.
Why? At first sight it seems that streams generate revenue depending on how many people see an advertisement. But the ultimate goal of the advertisers is not to show off their wonderfully produced ads. It is to sell stuff. If many people ignore the ads or don't see them at all, the percieved effectivenes of the ads gets lowered and thus also their value to the advertiser and consequently the price he is willing to pay for them.
In the end, when a medium is found to not generate sales even though much advertiesement is run there, the advertisers leave it, or at least it gets much less profitable to sell advertisements on it. It actually already happened to the whole internet a couple of years ago and the next wave is right behind the corner, as more and more publishers see that pure ad-supported business is not sustainable. That's why there are now more paywalls than ever, mainly in news media.
fprtunately majority of companys who pay for advertising are not omniscient so ahve no way of knowing which forms of ads is being effective there is absolutely nothing harmful in ghosting a stream either in the short or long term mainly because right now the scene is still trying to grow so there is a long term All lies create bubbles that give you illusory benefit now and cost you later.
no it really doesnt i cant even begin to imagine how a company is going to go "hmm we only sold X% of this item we better take down the twitch ads" makes no sense at all plus the money goes to the streamer most pros need that revenue and anything we can do to bring them more is important
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On December 24 2012 11:55 Forikorder wrote:Show nested quote +On December 24 2012 11:53 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 10:33 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 01:08 opisska wrote:
In the short term and smal scale, this is indeed helpful. In the long term and large scale, any such activity (and having streams open in the bakcground in certainly not the first instance of this) is actually hurting the people you want to help.
Why? At first sight it seems that streams generate revenue depending on how many people see an advertisement. But the ultimate goal of the advertisers is not to show off their wonderfully produced ads. It is to sell stuff. If many people ignore the ads or don't see them at all, the percieved effectivenes of the ads gets lowered and thus also their value to the advertiser and consequently the price he is willing to pay for them.
In the end, when a medium is found to not generate sales even though much advertiesement is run there, the advertisers leave it, or at least it gets much less profitable to sell advertisements on it. It actually already happened to the whole internet a couple of years ago and the next wave is right behind the corner, as more and more publishers see that pure ad-supported business is not sustainable. That's why there are now more paywalls than ever, mainly in news media.
fprtunately majority of companys who pay for advertising are not omniscient so ahve no way of knowing which forms of ads is being effective there is absolutely nothing harmful in ghosting a stream either in the short or long term mainly because right now the scene is still trying to grow so there is a long term All lies create bubbles that give you illusory benefit now and cost you later. no it really doesnt i cant even begin to imagine how a company is going to go "hmm we only sold X% of this item we better take down the twitch ads" makes no sense at all plus the money goes to the streamer most pros need that revenue and anything we can do to bring them more is important
You're right, they can't know exactly where. Do you think this means they will just keep injecting the same money into advertising? I think not. The effect is going to be small of course, but we're talking about equally small benefit.
The best route is the honest route. If you want money to go to streamers, send them some of your money, or participate in whatever scheme they have setup (watching ads).
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On December 24 2012 12:00 Mstring wrote:Show nested quote +On December 24 2012 11:55 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 11:53 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 10:33 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 01:08 opisska wrote:
In the short term and smal scale, this is indeed helpful. In the long term and large scale, any such activity (and having streams open in the bakcground in certainly not the first instance of this) is actually hurting the people you want to help.
Why? At first sight it seems that streams generate revenue depending on how many people see an advertisement. But the ultimate goal of the advertisers is not to show off their wonderfully produced ads. It is to sell stuff. If many people ignore the ads or don't see them at all, the percieved effectivenes of the ads gets lowered and thus also their value to the advertiser and consequently the price he is willing to pay for them.
In the end, when a medium is found to not generate sales even though much advertiesement is run there, the advertisers leave it, or at least it gets much less profitable to sell advertisements on it. It actually already happened to the whole internet a couple of years ago and the next wave is right behind the corner, as more and more publishers see that pure ad-supported business is not sustainable. That's why there are now more paywalls than ever, mainly in news media.
fprtunately majority of companys who pay for advertising are not omniscient so ahve no way of knowing which forms of ads is being effective there is absolutely nothing harmful in ghosting a stream either in the short or long term mainly because right now the scene is still trying to grow so there is a long term All lies create bubbles that give you illusory benefit now and cost you later. no it really doesnt i cant even begin to imagine how a company is going to go "hmm we only sold X% of this item we better take down the twitch ads" makes no sense at all plus the money goes to the streamer most pros need that revenue and anything we can do to bring them more is important You're right, they can't know exactly where. Do you think this means they will just keep injecting the same money into advertising? I think not. The effect is going to be small of course, but we're talking about equally small benefit. The best route is the honest route. If you want money to go to streamers, send them some of your money, or participate in whatever scheme they have setup (watching ads).
ya and when you cant watch those adds have them playing anyway
then go support the people who made the ads so more people want to support e-sports
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On December 24 2012 12:02 Forikorder wrote:Show nested quote +On December 24 2012 12:00 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 11:55 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 11:53 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 10:33 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 01:08 opisska wrote:
In the short term and smal scale, this is indeed helpful. In the long term and large scale, any such activity (and having streams open in the bakcground in certainly not the first instance of this) is actually hurting the people you want to help.
Why? At first sight it seems that streams generate revenue depending on how many people see an advertisement. But the ultimate goal of the advertisers is not to show off their wonderfully produced ads. It is to sell stuff. If many people ignore the ads or don't see them at all, the percieved effectivenes of the ads gets lowered and thus also their value to the advertiser and consequently the price he is willing to pay for them.
In the end, when a medium is found to not generate sales even though much advertiesement is run there, the advertisers leave it, or at least it gets much less profitable to sell advertisements on it. It actually already happened to the whole internet a couple of years ago and the next wave is right behind the corner, as more and more publishers see that pure ad-supported business is not sustainable. That's why there are now more paywalls than ever, mainly in news media.
fprtunately majority of companys who pay for advertising are not omniscient so ahve no way of knowing which forms of ads is being effective there is absolutely nothing harmful in ghosting a stream either in the short or long term mainly because right now the scene is still trying to grow so there is a long term All lies create bubbles that give you illusory benefit now and cost you later. no it really doesnt i cant even begin to imagine how a company is going to go "hmm we only sold X% of this item we better take down the twitch ads" makes no sense at all plus the money goes to the streamer most pros need that revenue and anything we can do to bring them more is important You're right, they can't know exactly where. Do you think this means they will just keep injecting the same money into advertising? I think not. The effect is going to be small of course, but we're talking about equally small benefit. The best route is the honest route. If you want money to go to streamers, send them some of your money, or participate in whatever scheme they have setup (watching ads). ya and when you cant watch those adds have them playing anyway then go support the people who made the ads so more people want to support e-sports
Good luck with your lying goals in 2013 
Here's a simple test: Would you want everyone to do what you do? If not, you probably shouldn't do it.
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On December 24 2012 12:03 Mstring wrote:Show nested quote +On December 24 2012 12:02 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 12:00 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 11:55 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 11:53 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 10:33 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 01:08 opisska wrote:
In the short term and smal scale, this is indeed helpful. In the long term and large scale, any such activity (and having streams open in the bakcground in certainly not the first instance of this) is actually hurting the people you want to help.
Why? At first sight it seems that streams generate revenue depending on how many people see an advertisement. But the ultimate goal of the advertisers is not to show off their wonderfully produced ads. It is to sell stuff. If many people ignore the ads or don't see them at all, the percieved effectivenes of the ads gets lowered and thus also their value to the advertiser and consequently the price he is willing to pay for them.
In the end, when a medium is found to not generate sales even though much advertiesement is run there, the advertisers leave it, or at least it gets much less profitable to sell advertisements on it. It actually already happened to the whole internet a couple of years ago and the next wave is right behind the corner, as more and more publishers see that pure ad-supported business is not sustainable. That's why there are now more paywalls than ever, mainly in news media.
fprtunately majority of companys who pay for advertising are not omniscient so ahve no way of knowing which forms of ads is being effective there is absolutely nothing harmful in ghosting a stream either in the short or long term mainly because right now the scene is still trying to grow so there is a long term All lies create bubbles that give you illusory benefit now and cost you later. no it really doesnt i cant even begin to imagine how a company is going to go "hmm we only sold X% of this item we better take down the twitch ads" makes no sense at all plus the money goes to the streamer most pros need that revenue and anything we can do to bring them more is important You're right, they can't know exactly where. Do you think this means they will just keep injecting the same money into advertising? I think not. The effect is going to be small of course, but we're talking about equally small benefit. The best route is the honest route. If you want money to go to streamers, send them some of your money, or participate in whatever scheme they have setup (watching ads). ya and when you cant watch those adds have them playing anyway then go support the people who made the ads so more people want to support e-sports Good luck with your lying goals in 2013 Here's a simple test: Would you want everyone to do what you do? If not, you probably shouldn't do it.
but i do want everyone to watch people streams, not adblock the adds and buy things from people who support esports
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On December 24 2012 12:08 Forikorder wrote:Show nested quote +On December 24 2012 12:03 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 12:02 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 12:00 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 11:55 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 11:53 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 10:33 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 01:08 opisska wrote:
In the short term and smal scale, this is indeed helpful. In the long term and large scale, any such activity (and having streams open in the bakcground in certainly not the first instance of this) is actually hurting the people you want to help.
Why? At first sight it seems that streams generate revenue depending on how many people see an advertisement. But the ultimate goal of the advertisers is not to show off their wonderfully produced ads. It is to sell stuff. If many people ignore the ads or don't see them at all, the percieved effectivenes of the ads gets lowered and thus also their value to the advertiser and consequently the price he is willing to pay for them.
In the end, when a medium is found to not generate sales even though much advertiesement is run there, the advertisers leave it, or at least it gets much less profitable to sell advertisements on it. It actually already happened to the whole internet a couple of years ago and the next wave is right behind the corner, as more and more publishers see that pure ad-supported business is not sustainable. That's why there are now more paywalls than ever, mainly in news media.
fprtunately majority of companys who pay for advertising are not omniscient so ahve no way of knowing which forms of ads is being effective there is absolutely nothing harmful in ghosting a stream either in the short or long term mainly because right now the scene is still trying to grow so there is a long term All lies create bubbles that give you illusory benefit now and cost you later. no it really doesnt i cant even begin to imagine how a company is going to go "hmm we only sold X% of this item we better take down the twitch ads" makes no sense at all plus the money goes to the streamer most pros need that revenue and anything we can do to bring them more is important You're right, they can't know exactly where. Do you think this means they will just keep injecting the same money into advertising? I think not. The effect is going to be small of course, but we're talking about equally small benefit. The best route is the honest route. If you want money to go to streamers, send them some of your money, or participate in whatever scheme they have setup (watching ads). ya and when you cant watch those adds have them playing anyway then go support the people who made the ads so more people want to support e-sports Good luck with your lying goals in 2013 Here's a simple test: Would you want everyone to do what you do? If not, you probably shouldn't do it. but i do want everyone to watch people streams, not adblock the adds and buy things from people who support esports
That's not what the OP is about though. If everyone 'ghosted', no products would be purchased.
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On December 24 2012 12:13 Mstring wrote:Show nested quote +On December 24 2012 12:08 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 12:03 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 12:02 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 12:00 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 11:55 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 11:53 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 10:33 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 01:08 opisska wrote:
In the short term and smal scale, this is indeed helpful. In the long term and large scale, any such activity (and having streams open in the bakcground in certainly not the first instance of this) is actually hurting the people you want to help.
Why? At first sight it seems that streams generate revenue depending on how many people see an advertisement. But the ultimate goal of the advertisers is not to show off their wonderfully produced ads. It is to sell stuff. If many people ignore the ads or don't see them at all, the percieved effectivenes of the ads gets lowered and thus also their value to the advertiser and consequently the price he is willing to pay for them.
In the end, when a medium is found to not generate sales even though much advertiesement is run there, the advertisers leave it, or at least it gets much less profitable to sell advertisements on it. It actually already happened to the whole internet a couple of years ago and the next wave is right behind the corner, as more and more publishers see that pure ad-supported business is not sustainable. That's why there are now more paywalls than ever, mainly in news media.
fprtunately majority of companys who pay for advertising are not omniscient so ahve no way of knowing which forms of ads is being effective there is absolutely nothing harmful in ghosting a stream either in the short or long term mainly because right now the scene is still trying to grow so there is a long term All lies create bubbles that give you illusory benefit now and cost you later. no it really doesnt i cant even begin to imagine how a company is going to go "hmm we only sold X% of this item we better take down the twitch ads" makes no sense at all plus the money goes to the streamer most pros need that revenue and anything we can do to bring them more is important You're right, they can't know exactly where. Do you think this means they will just keep injecting the same money into advertising? I think not. The effect is going to be small of course, but we're talking about equally small benefit. The best route is the honest route. If you want money to go to streamers, send them some of your money, or participate in whatever scheme they have setup (watching ads). ya and when you cant watch those adds have them playing anyway then go support the people who made the ads so more people want to support e-sports Good luck with your lying goals in 2013 Here's a simple test: Would you want everyone to do what you do? If not, you probably shouldn't do it. but i do want everyone to watch people streams, not adblock the adds and buy things from people who support esports That's not what the OP is about though. If everyone 'ghosted', no products would be purchased.
ghosting is only for when you cant watch the adds for some reason of course not everyone would ghost all the time (though even if they did theres no way anyone would ever know)
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On December 24 2012 12:16 Forikorder wrote:Show nested quote +On December 24 2012 12:13 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 12:08 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 12:03 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 12:02 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 12:00 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 11:55 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 11:53 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 10:33 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 01:08 opisska wrote:
In the short term and smal scale, this is indeed helpful. In the long term and large scale, any such activity (and having streams open in the bakcground in certainly not the first instance of this) is actually hurting the people you want to help.
Why? At first sight it seems that streams generate revenue depending on how many people see an advertisement. But the ultimate goal of the advertisers is not to show off their wonderfully produced ads. It is to sell stuff. If many people ignore the ads or don't see them at all, the percieved effectivenes of the ads gets lowered and thus also their value to the advertiser and consequently the price he is willing to pay for them.
In the end, when a medium is found to not generate sales even though much advertiesement is run there, the advertisers leave it, or at least it gets much less profitable to sell advertisements on it. It actually already happened to the whole internet a couple of years ago and the next wave is right behind the corner, as more and more publishers see that pure ad-supported business is not sustainable. That's why there are now more paywalls than ever, mainly in news media.
fprtunately majority of companys who pay for advertising are not omniscient so ahve no way of knowing which forms of ads is being effective there is absolutely nothing harmful in ghosting a stream either in the short or long term mainly because right now the scene is still trying to grow so there is a long term All lies create bubbles that give you illusory benefit now and cost you later. no it really doesnt i cant even begin to imagine how a company is going to go "hmm we only sold X% of this item we better take down the twitch ads" makes no sense at all plus the money goes to the streamer most pros need that revenue and anything we can do to bring them more is important You're right, they can't know exactly where. Do you think this means they will just keep injecting the same money into advertising? I think not. The effect is going to be small of course, but we're talking about equally small benefit. The best route is the honest route. If you want money to go to streamers, send them some of your money, or participate in whatever scheme they have setup (watching ads). ya and when you cant watch those adds have them playing anyway then go support the people who made the ads so more people want to support e-sports Good luck with your lying goals in 2013 Here's a simple test: Would you want everyone to do what you do? If not, you probably shouldn't do it. but i do want everyone to watch people streams, not adblock the adds and buy things from people who support esports That's not what the OP is about though. If everyone 'ghosted', no products would be purchased. ghosting is only for when you cant watch the adds for some reason of course not everyone would ghost all the time (though even if they did theres no way anyone would ever know)
I'm sure you can figure out a way to steal money and have no one ever know. What's stopping you from doing that and donating the money to streamers?
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On December 24 2012 12:18 Mstring wrote:Show nested quote +On December 24 2012 12:16 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 12:13 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 12:08 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 12:03 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 12:02 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 12:00 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 11:55 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 11:53 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 10:33 Forikorder wrote:
[quote]
fprtunately majority of companys who pay for advertising are not omniscient so ahve no way of knowing which forms of ads is being effective
there is absolutely nothing harmful in ghosting a stream either in the short or long term mainly because right now the scene is still trying to grow so there is a long term All lies create bubbles that give you illusory benefit now and cost you later. no it really doesnt i cant even begin to imagine how a company is going to go "hmm we only sold X% of this item we better take down the twitch ads" makes no sense at all plus the money goes to the streamer most pros need that revenue and anything we can do to bring them more is important You're right, they can't know exactly where. Do you think this means they will just keep injecting the same money into advertising? I think not. The effect is going to be small of course, but we're talking about equally small benefit. The best route is the honest route. If you want money to go to streamers, send them some of your money, or participate in whatever scheme they have setup (watching ads). ya and when you cant watch those adds have them playing anyway then go support the people who made the ads so more people want to support e-sports Good luck with your lying goals in 2013 Here's a simple test: Would you want everyone to do what you do? If not, you probably shouldn't do it. but i do want everyone to watch people streams, not adblock the adds and buy things from people who support esports That's not what the OP is about though. If everyone 'ghosted', no products would be purchased. ghosting is only for when you cant watch the adds for some reason of course not everyone would ghost all the time (though even if they did theres no way anyone would ever know) I'm sure you can figure out a way to steal money and have no one ever know. What's stopping you from doing that and donating the money to streamers?
are you comparing ghosting to stealing....?
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On December 24 2012 12:30 Forikorder wrote:Show nested quote +On December 24 2012 12:18 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 12:16 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 12:13 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 12:08 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 12:03 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 12:02 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 12:00 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 11:55 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 11:53 Mstring wrote:
[quote]
All lies create bubbles that give you illusory benefit now and cost you later. no it really doesnt i cant even begin to imagine how a company is going to go "hmm we only sold X% of this item we better take down the twitch ads" makes no sense at all plus the money goes to the streamer most pros need that revenue and anything we can do to bring them more is important You're right, they can't know exactly where. Do you think this means they will just keep injecting the same money into advertising? I think not. The effect is going to be small of course, but we're talking about equally small benefit. The best route is the honest route. If you want money to go to streamers, send them some of your money, or participate in whatever scheme they have setup (watching ads). ya and when you cant watch those adds have them playing anyway then go support the people who made the ads so more people want to support e-sports Good luck with your lying goals in 2013 Here's a simple test: Would you want everyone to do what you do? If not, you probably shouldn't do it. but i do want everyone to watch people streams, not adblock the adds and buy things from people who support esports That's not what the OP is about though. If everyone 'ghosted', no products would be purchased. ghosting is only for when you cant watch the adds for some reason of course not everyone would ghost all the time (though even if they did theres no way anyone would ever know) I'm sure you can figure out a way to steal money and have no one ever know. What's stopping you from doing that and donating the money to streamers? are you comparing ghosting to stealing....?
Do you have a better word for siphoning money out of a company on your terms and not theirs? You didn't answer by the way.
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On December 24 2012 12:33 Mstring wrote:Show nested quote +On December 24 2012 12:30 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 12:18 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 12:16 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 12:13 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 12:08 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 12:03 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 12:02 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 12:00 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 11:55 Forikorder wrote:
[quote]
no it really doesnt i cant even begin to imagine how a company is going to go "hmm we only sold X% of this item we better take down the twitch ads" makes no sense at all plus the money goes to the streamer most pros need that revenue and anything we can do to bring them more is important You're right, they can't know exactly where. Do you think this means they will just keep injecting the same money into advertising? I think not. The effect is going to be small of course, but we're talking about equally small benefit. The best route is the honest route. If you want money to go to streamers, send them some of your money, or participate in whatever scheme they have setup (watching ads). ya and when you cant watch those adds have them playing anyway then go support the people who made the ads so more people want to support e-sports Good luck with your lying goals in 2013 Here's a simple test: Would you want everyone to do what you do? If not, you probably shouldn't do it. but i do want everyone to watch people streams, not adblock the adds and buy things from people who support esports That's not what the OP is about though. If everyone 'ghosted', no products would be purchased. ghosting is only for when you cant watch the adds for some reason of course not everyone would ghost all the time (though even if they did theres no way anyone would ever know) I'm sure you can figure out a way to steal money and have no one ever know. What's stopping you from doing that and donating the money to streamers? are you comparing ghosting to stealing....? Do you have a better word for siphoning money out of a company on your terms and not theirs? You didn't answer by the way.
no i wouldnt i dont take other peoples money without some sort of exchange
and its on there terms, for every viewer a stream generates they get X cents for every ad they play
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On December 24 2012 12:40 Forikorder wrote:Show nested quote +On December 24 2012 12:33 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 12:30 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 12:18 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 12:16 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 12:13 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 12:08 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 12:03 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 12:02 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 12:00 Mstring wrote:
[quote]
You're right, they can't know exactly where. Do you think this means they will just keep injecting the same money into advertising? I think not. The effect is going to be small of course, but we're talking about equally small benefit.
The best route is the honest route. If you want money to go to streamers, send them some of your money, or participate in whatever scheme they have setup (watching ads). ya and when you cant watch those adds have them playing anyway then go support the people who made the ads so more people want to support e-sports Good luck with your lying goals in 2013 Here's a simple test: Would you want everyone to do what you do? If not, you probably shouldn't do it. but i do want everyone to watch people streams, not adblock the adds and buy things from people who support esports That's not what the OP is about though. If everyone 'ghosted', no products would be purchased. ghosting is only for when you cant watch the adds for some reason of course not everyone would ghost all the time (though even if they did theres no way anyone would ever know) I'm sure you can figure out a way to steal money and have no one ever know. What's stopping you from doing that and donating the money to streamers? are you comparing ghosting to stealing....? Do you have a better word for siphoning money out of a company on your terms and not theirs? You didn't answer by the way. no i wouldnt i dont take other peoples money without some sort of exchange
By allowing ads to be run you cause money to be transferred from the company to the streamer. If you aren't watching the ads, where is the exchange? What is it that you are offering?
Look, I don't have a solution (aside from sending them your own money). I just know this isn't one.
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On December 24 2012 12:47 Mstring wrote:Show nested quote +On December 24 2012 12:40 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 12:33 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 12:30 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 12:18 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 12:16 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 12:13 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 12:08 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 12:03 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 12:02 Forikorder wrote:
[quote]
ya and when you cant watch those adds have them playing anyway
then go support the people who made the ads so more people want to support e-sports Good luck with your lying goals in 2013 Here's a simple test: Would you want everyone to do what you do? If not, you probably shouldn't do it. but i do want everyone to watch people streams, not adblock the adds and buy things from people who support esports That's not what the OP is about though. If everyone 'ghosted', no products would be purchased. ghosting is only for when you cant watch the adds for some reason of course not everyone would ghost all the time (though even if they did theres no way anyone would ever know) I'm sure you can figure out a way to steal money and have no one ever know. What's stopping you from doing that and donating the money to streamers? are you comparing ghosting to stealing....? Do you have a better word for siphoning money out of a company on your terms and not theirs? You didn't answer by the way. no i wouldnt i dont take other peoples money without some sort of exchange By allowing ads to be run you cause money to be transferred from the company to the streamer. If you aren't watching the ads, where is the exchange? What is it that you are offering? Look, I don't have a solution (aside from sending them your own money). I just know this isn't one.
i ahve the add running thats all they want when i go buy doctor pepper i dont have to tell them why im buying it, they dont know that i buy it becuase of MLG people who run adds are not required nor have the ability to tell if the person is paying attention ghosting a stream is no different then zoning out while watching TV
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On December 24 2012 12:53 Forikorder wrote:Show nested quote +On December 24 2012 12:47 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 12:40 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 12:33 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 12:30 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 12:18 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 12:16 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 12:13 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 12:08 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 12:03 Mstring wrote:[quote] Good luck with your lying goals in 2013 Here's a simple test: Would you want everyone to do what you do? If not, you probably shouldn't do it. but i do want everyone to watch people streams, not adblock the adds and buy things from people who support esports That's not what the OP is about though. If everyone 'ghosted', no products would be purchased. ghosting is only for when you cant watch the adds for some reason of course not everyone would ghost all the time (though even if they did theres no way anyone would ever know) I'm sure you can figure out a way to steal money and have no one ever know. What's stopping you from doing that and donating the money to streamers? are you comparing ghosting to stealing....? Do you have a better word for siphoning money out of a company on your terms and not theirs? You didn't answer by the way. no i wouldnt i dont take other peoples money without some sort of exchange By allowing ads to be run you cause money to be transferred from the company to the streamer. If you aren't watching the ads, where is the exchange? What is it that you are offering? Look, I don't have a solution (aside from sending them your own money). I just know this isn't one. i ahve the add running thats all they want when i go buy doctor pepper i dont have to tell them why im buying it, they dont know that i buy it becuase of MLG people who run adds are not required nor have the ability to tell if the person is paying attention ghosting a stream is no different then zoning out while watching TV
How do you know that the ad you ghosted wasn't an obscure company that you would never buy from without seeing the ad? You've caused them to pay (if only a few cents) for something you know they aren't benefiting from. I ask again, where is the exchange that you said you adhere to? How can you offer anything to a company that you don't even know exists because you didn't watch their ad?
Ghosting is markedly different to zoning out while watching TV. You can't turn on 100 TV sets in the house and cause more revenue for the TV station. With stream ads, you can.
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On December 24 2012 12:56 Mstring wrote:Show nested quote +On December 24 2012 12:53 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 12:47 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 12:40 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 12:33 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 12:30 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 12:18 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 12:16 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 12:13 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 12:08 Forikorder wrote:
[quote]
but i do want everyone to watch people streams, not adblock the adds and buy things from people who support esports That's not what the OP is about though. If everyone 'ghosted', no products would be purchased. ghosting is only for when you cant watch the adds for some reason of course not everyone would ghost all the time (though even if they did theres no way anyone would ever know) I'm sure you can figure out a way to steal money and have no one ever know. What's stopping you from doing that and donating the money to streamers? are you comparing ghosting to stealing....? Do you have a better word for siphoning money out of a company on your terms and not theirs? You didn't answer by the way. no i wouldnt i dont take other peoples money without some sort of exchange By allowing ads to be run you cause money to be transferred from the company to the streamer. If you aren't watching the ads, where is the exchange? What is it that you are offering? Look, I don't have a solution (aside from sending them your own money). I just know this isn't one. i ahve the add running thats all they want when i go buy doctor pepper i dont have to tell them why im buying it, they dont know that i buy it becuase of MLG people who run adds are not required nor have the ability to tell if the person is paying attention ghosting a stream is no different then zoning out while watching TV How do you know that the ad you ghosted wasn't an obscure company that you would never buy from without seeing the ad? You've caused them to pay (if only a few cents) for something you know they aren't benefiting from. I ask again, where is the exchange that you said you adhere to? How can you offer anything to a company that you don't even know exists because you didn't watch their ad?
i didnt recieve anything from them, they pay twitch to show there ad and twitch pays the streamer for bringing in viewers im not in that equation anywhere
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On December 24 2012 13:03 Forikorder wrote:Show nested quote +On December 24 2012 12:56 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 12:53 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 12:47 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 12:40 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 12:33 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 12:30 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 12:18 Mstring wrote:On December 24 2012 12:16 Forikorder wrote:On December 24 2012 12:13 Mstring wrote:
[quote]
That's not what the OP is about though. If everyone 'ghosted', no products would be purchased. ghosting is only for when you cant watch the adds for some reason of course not everyone would ghost all the time (though even if they did theres no way anyone would ever know) I'm sure you can figure out a way to steal money and have no one ever know. What's stopping you from doing that and donating the money to streamers? are you comparing ghosting to stealing....? Do you have a better word for siphoning money out of a company on your terms and not theirs? You didn't answer by the way. no i wouldnt i dont take other peoples money without some sort of exchange By allowing ads to be run you cause money to be transferred from the company to the streamer. If you aren't watching the ads, where is the exchange? What is it that you are offering? Look, I don't have a solution (aside from sending them your own money). I just know this isn't one. i ahve the add running thats all they want when i go buy doctor pepper i dont have to tell them why im buying it, they dont know that i buy it becuase of MLG people who run adds are not required nor have the ability to tell if the person is paying attention ghosting a stream is no different then zoning out while watching TV How do you know that the ad you ghosted wasn't an obscure company that you would never buy from without seeing the ad? You've caused them to pay (if only a few cents) for something you know they aren't benefiting from. I ask again, where is the exchange that you said you adhere to? How can you offer anything to a company that you don't even know exists because you didn't watch their ad? i didnt recieve anything from them, they pay twitch to show there ad and twitch pays the streamer for bringing in viewers im not in that equation anywhere
If you weren't in the equation, this whole thread couldn't exist because you couldn't do a damn thing (short term) to change anything. Have a nice day my friend, thanks for the discussion.
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On December 24 2012 10:33 Forikorder wrote:Show nested quote +On December 24 2012 01:08 opisska wrote:
In the short term and smal scale, this is indeed helpful. In the long term and large scale, any such activity (and having streams open in the bakcground in certainly not the first instance of this) is actually hurting the people you want to help.
Why? At first sight it seems that streams generate revenue depending on how many people see an advertisement. But the ultimate goal of the advertisers is not to show off their wonderfully produced ads. It is to sell stuff. If many people ignore the ads or don't see them at all, the percieved effectivenes of the ads gets lowered and thus also their value to the advertiser and consequently the price he is willing to pay for them.
In the end, when a medium is found to not generate sales even though much advertiesement is run there, the advertisers leave it, or at least it gets much less profitable to sell advertisements on it. It actually already happened to the whole internet a couple of years ago and the next wave is right behind the corner, as more and more publishers see that pure ad-supported business is not sustainable. That's why there are now more paywalls than ever, mainly in news media.
fprtunately majority of companys who pay for advertising are not omniscient so ahve no way of knowing which forms of ads is being effective there is absolutely nothing harmful in ghosting a stream either in the short or long term mainly because right now the scene is still trying to grow so there is a long term
They don't have to be omniscient. I am afraid that you are not in touch with present-day reality on the subject. Marketing has evolved very far from "hey guys, let's just show them some ad's about our amazing product" do a very deep field, using sofisticated methods on the border of actual science. There are at least thousands of people in the world working full time jobs on efficiency evaluation. And it's an up and coming business, with a great potential.
Sure as hell they have ways of knowing which form of ads is being effective.
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Katowice25012 Posts
On December 24 2012 10:33 Forikorder wrote:Show nested quote +On December 24 2012 01:08 opisska wrote:
In the short term and smal scale, this is indeed helpful. In the long term and large scale, any such activity (and having streams open in the bakcground in certainly not the first instance of this) is actually hurting the people you want to help.
Why? At first sight it seems that streams generate revenue depending on how many people see an advertisement. But the ultimate goal of the advertisers is not to show off their wonderfully produced ads. It is to sell stuff. If many people ignore the ads or don't see them at all, the percieved effectivenes of the ads gets lowered and thus also their value to the advertiser and consequently the price he is willing to pay for them.
In the end, when a medium is found to not generate sales even though much advertiesement is run there, the advertisers leave it, or at least it gets much less profitable to sell advertisements on it. It actually already happened to the whole internet a couple of years ago and the next wave is right behind the corner, as more and more publishers see that pure ad-supported business is not sustainable. That's why there are now more paywalls than ever, mainly in news media.
fprtunately majority of companys who pay for advertising are not omniscient so ahve no way of knowing which forms of ads is being effective there is absolutely nothing harmful in ghosting a stream either in the short or long term mainly because right now the scene is still trying to grow so there is a long term
Advertisers do research on the markets they want to target, if it becomes a thing that people regularly and openly leave streams on while being afk it hurts their interest in pursuing those channels because they know the numbers aren't meaningful.
So yes it is directly hurtful.
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Yeah, pretty sure you are. Why game the system? Waste of resources, and the difference one person one person could make is absolutely minimal.
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EPT
