• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 04:50
CET 10:50
KST 18:50
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
RSL Revival - 2025 Season Finals Preview0RSL Season 3 - Playoffs Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups C & D Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups A & B Preview2TL.net Map Contest #21: Winners12
Community News
Weekly Cups (Dec 1-7): Clem doubles, Solar gets over the hump1Weekly Cups (Nov 24-30): MaxPax, Clem, herO win2BGE Stara Zagora 2026 announced15[BSL21] Ro.16 Group Stage (C->B->A->D)4Weekly Cups (Nov 17-23): Solar, MaxPax, Clem win3
StarCraft 2
General
RSL Revival - 2025 Season Finals Preview Weekly Cups (Dec 1-7): Clem doubles, Solar gets over the hump Chinese SC2 server to reopen; live all-star event in Hangzhou Maestros of the Game: Live Finals Preview (RO4) BGE Stara Zagora 2026 announced
Tourneys
2025 RSL Offline Finals Dates + Ticket Sales! Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament Tenacious Turtle Tussle StarCraft2.fi 15th Anniversary Cup RSL Offline Finals Info - Dec 13 and 14!
Strategy
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 503 Fowl Play Mutation # 502 Negative Reinforcement Mutation # 501 Price of Progress Mutation # 500 Fright night
Brood War
General
[BSL21] RO8 Bracket & Prediction Contest BW General Discussion BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Let's talk about Metropolis Foreign Brood War
Tourneys
[ASL20] Grand Finals Small VOD Thread 2.0 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL21] RO16 Group D - Sunday 21:00 CET
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Fighting Spirit mining rates Current Meta Game Theory for Starcraft
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread EVE Corporation Nintendo Switch Thread Path of Exile ZeroSpace Megathread
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas Survivor II: The Amazon Sengoku Mafia TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine US Politics Mega-thread YouTube Thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
White-Ra Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece Movie Discussion!
Sports
Formula 1 Discussion 2024 - 2026 Football Thread
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
TL+ Announced Where to ask questions and add stream?
Blogs
How Sleep Deprivation Affect…
TrAiDoS
I decided to write a webnov…
DjKniteX
James Bond movies ranking - pa…
Topin
Thanks for the RSL
Hildegard
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1452 users

Stuck in Bronze

Blogs > Edeen
Post a Reply
Edeen
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United Kingdom18 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-26 22:05:58
October 08 2011 18:43 GMT
#1
Hey

This is my first post and blog post ^^

I don't normally write blogs but I don't think that this should go anywhere else.

So - Being a bronze player I watch a lot of VODs of tournaments and Day9 dailies.
While watching I take note of things - timings and just general good play ect.

I finally decided after playing all the races in Season 2 to pick Terran for Season 3.
This is working out great - going from rank 83 to rank 1 in a day!

Although while doing a lot of laddering, just doing 3rax Stim, I noticed something. While this is helping me learn a lot; Keeping money low, constant worker production, expanding and getting upgrades.
I feel like a lot of people expect heavy MM pressure and prepare for it, thus making most of the games;
"I killed his defense and he killed my force! but I've macro'd so I can just plow on in for a win!!."

But hey, I got to rank 1 - Considering how getting above rank 25 (last seasons finishing position) was my goal.
So that was last weekend. It was by all means great.

This weekend though - I've played against a lot more silver and gold players - beating them in a

less convincing manner and losing a lot more.
I've noticed during those games that the players take quicker expansions and are less aggressive - as in they will actually plan their attack - or it seems that way.

I guess my question is - How can I expand my play.

Instead of doing a 3rax push nearly every game, what other builds could I try/work on?
I've been doing 1rax 1fact 1port and I'm enjoying the build and general safety I feel with tanks and banshees.

Anyway - Thanks for reading this wall of text

- Edeen.

PS: I'll edit in how the rest of this weekend goes on Monday night.

Edit: replays;

A game where I think I macro'd 'ok' - TvT on Backwater Gulch
A ZvT where he tried to roach rush, not sure how helpful it is - ZvT Backwater Gulch


Season 4;
So I'm now in Silver and it's going good, just playing a lot of games against Zerg and trying out FE and mech builds. Thanks for everything ^^

Eatme
Profile Blog Joined June 2003
Switzerland3919 Posts
October 08 2011 18:56 GMT
#2
Maybe it is time for you to start doing matchup specific builds. Take your worst mu and steal some build from liquipedia or a pro replay and keep your 3rax build for the other two until you know the new one by heart.
Since you are now playing vs gold and silver players you wont stay in bronze for much longer.
Also your rank = nothing. You should look at points. You can be rank1 Masters with 1win if the league is brand new.
I have the best fucking lawyers in the country including the man they call the Malmis.
Edeen
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United Kingdom18 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-08 19:30:07
October 08 2011 18:59 GMT
#3
Ok thanks! :D

my worst match up by far is TvZ.
I have 1248 points atm.

I'm currently talking to a friend on skype who is 'maining' Zerg. So i'll work on it now.

Thanks again! :D

- Edeen.

Edit: Resulted in playing a lot veruses Insane Zerg AI as he is to busy playing some SNES games xD
mizU
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States12125 Posts
October 08 2011 19:09 GMT
#4
Post some replays!~~
if happy ever afters did exist <3 @watamizu_
jdseemoreglass
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
United States3773 Posts
October 08 2011 19:33 GMT
#5
You can expand your play by expanding

No need for major changes, just try cutting a rax. 2rax into expand, then tech up to maybe reactor starport and keep adding rax. MMM is pretty solid all around. You might end up having to play a little more defensively, but it will improve your macro and help you learn to hold off pressure and cheese. Good luck!
"If you want this forum to be full of half-baked philosophy discussions between pompous faggots like yourself forever, stay the course captain vanilla" - FakeSteve[TPR], 2006
Edeen
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United Kingdom18 Posts
October 08 2011 19:45 GMT
#6
Thanks for all the suggestions and I'll try it all over the next week or so and do a bigger edit
Mithriel
Profile Joined November 2010
Netherlands2969 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-08 20:22:51
October 08 2011 20:22 GMT
#7
What i did was, check your favorite player (for me it was MMA) and specific builds you've seen VODs of that you liked.

Study these by watching some replays/VODS. Write down some timings, try them out a little bit on a testmap (not to long, because its better live, but to get general idea) and play them out.

I did this to get 1 build order for each matchup, and even though i'm terrible got into platinum with it (and i play to little, so no chance to get higher yet).

atm what i got is (and i have these buildorders in notepad open in my 2nd screen when i play):
TvZ:
- MMA dropstyle play
- reactor hellion into expand

TvP
-1rax expand
-3rax pressure

TvT
- clueless
There is no shame in defeat so long as the spirit is unconquered. | Cheering for Maru, Innovation and MMA!
Edeen
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United Kingdom18 Posts
October 08 2011 20:29 GMT
#8
Ok, that is a great idea! :D Really liking Alive's play from IPL today and ofc Boxer's play O_O
But they both require godly APM, but i'll give it ago.

Thanks again!!

- Edeen.
CoolSea
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States236 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-08 20:34:25
October 08 2011 20:32 GMT
#9
After having looked at your replay, I found a few errors that are common in lower league play: getting supply blocked, not producing from your structures/command center, constructing buildings and then not really using them, etc. Instead of first trying to expand your play I would first work on these main issues as they are what really is holding you back.

One of the biggest problems I see in lower league play, in addition to the problems listed above, is poor mechanics and bad macro. Mechanics are some of the most important skills your can have in this game and just by improving those I can guarantee that your macro will become better. If you don't really know what mechanics are, then you should take a look at Day[9] daily #252 (at least I think it's 252).

Also as posted above pick one build for every matchup and just grind it out again and again. This is exactly how the Koreans get good, they grind out the same exact build until they are in diamond or higher. Maybe since your in bronze focus on one base play until you can manage everything without getting supply blocked and such and then move on into fast expansion builds once you get good enough.

This is how I got out of bronze and now I am a top diamond zerg and terran player who regularly plays and beats mid masters level players.

Good luck!

P.S I can't stress enough how important it s to get good mechanics. There are grandmasters level players who have no creativity at all and just copy other pro players builds but are able to be top players just with sick mechanics.
WickedSkies
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
Netherlands81 Posts
October 08 2011 20:32 GMT
#10
On October 09 2011 03:56 Eatme wrote:
Maybe it is time for you to start doing matchup specific builds. Take your worst mu and steal some build from liquipedia or a pro replay and keep your 3rax build for the other two until you know the new one by heart.
Since you are now playing vs gold and silver players you wont stay in bronze for much longer.
Also your rank = nothing. You should look at points. You can be rank1 Masters with 1win if the league is brand new.

Your points also don't mean anything. The only thing that has slight meaning is your win/loss ratio. Another theing with even greater significance is to be in Grandmasters.

For the guy that is matched with gold and silver and beating them, even if losing more than 50% of the games against them, he would be eventually put in gold/silver. As another advice as a fellow terran, don't move out with your 3 rax composition unless you scout a very fast expansion. Even then chances are you might be plowed by ling/zealot/sentry/hellion or even scv/probe/drone pull + army. I don't tell you not to be agressive, you should be plenty aggressive, especially vs zerg, but I am telling you to do informed aggression, knowing what you should expect and also teching/macroing behind your aggression.

But to be honest, for a bronze/silver/gold/diamond/masters player, it is actually recommended to work on mechanics and not on aggression. It is easier to defend and macro than to attack and macro at the same time. So maybe your aggressive style is one of the reasons holding you down. Next time you are playing don't be shy to expand aggressively and play a more defensive style. Expanding will automatically make you improve your macro, which is what is the difference between the leagues. Micro is also very important but somehow i feel it is easier to improve by playing some micro map or smth like that.
Drone chasing probe, Tasteless quietly watching (Artosis)
Edeen
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United Kingdom18 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-08 20:39:15
October 08 2011 20:34 GMT
#11
wow, thanks a lot CoolSea!

Im just looking through the Terran builds on Liquipedia - As your suggesting 1 base play. I guess I'll stick with 3rax stim for... TvP? it seems to work better in TvP for me.

Thanks for all your time and great advice! :D

Edit: Wow, so much information. I'll try to do informed aggression. I sort of just said to myself in that ZvT reply (in OP) He did a rush.. he can't have much? and lucky he didn't. I'm sure that is the wrong way to think as if he had early units in 'mass' to rush - surely he can have more??

So from now (21:30) until about midnight im going to practicing all match ups against a work mate - I'll post the replies tomorrow.

Again, Thanks so much!! xD

- Edeen.
SnetteL
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
Belgium473 Posts
October 08 2011 20:39 GMT
#12
It's great that being a part of the starcraft community means to have access to a lot of stuff about starcraft and particularly on how to get better at starcraft.

But if you're bronze please don't focus to hard on all that stuff. With all due respect being in bronze means that you are bad in so many ways. If you would just start with 10 supply depot / 12 barracks each game and go from there you will learn so many things on your own while getting mechanically more acquainted with the game.

Ofcourse you will make mistakes but you will learn more about the game than starting with a build like 3 rax stim and executing it over and over again until you get to a division where you don't belong because your build brought you there.

If you're in bronze you shouldn't be thinking about timings you should be thinking "Ooh i wanna make something that can fly".

That in my opinion a lot more fun and when you get completely thrashed you'll learn the hard way why you don't do x vs y.
Caps lock is cruise control for cool.
Edeen
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United Kingdom18 Posts
October 08 2011 20:44 GMT
#13
I know im terrible.

I'll try it - opening 10 depot 12 rax and just feel it out.

Thanks for your reply
JonnyLaw
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States3482 Posts
October 08 2011 21:01 GMT
#14
"Getting to a division you don't belong." Is utter horse shit.

Half of the difficulty advancing leagues is learning what your scouting information should queue as a response. Not dying to cloaked units, not dying to a timing push you should scout, not allowing a protoss player to place a pylon in your base, knowing when to NOT attack.

If you like 3rax vs toss, do it all day long if you want. You may want to feel out 2rax reactor after first marine though. As long as you're macroing well it'll spend nearly all of your money. Once you push out to pressure you'll be able to place a cc in your main and either defend the ramp or move it to your natural and continue your game plan.

Don't stress the details, try to learn what scouting information gives you. Try to multitask better. Try to position your army well before a battle occurs to give yourself a favorable engagement. Try to not be caught unaware. Try to not lose to cheese (good luck sir)!

Anyway this has grown quite long winded.
SnetteL
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
Belgium473 Posts
October 08 2011 21:02 GMT
#15
On October 09 2011 05:44 Edeen wrote:
I know im terrible.

I'll try it - opening 10 depot 12 rax and just feel it out.

Thanks for your reply


Well everyone without former RTS experience (like me too) was terrible at one point. I personally learned a lot by just playing a lot of games with a friend where we both always tried to do wacky stuff. Almost every game was pure craziness.

You'll think about your builds yourself and doing so you'll learn to understand why you would make a refinery before a barracks, why you would skip bunkers and be less safe etc, etc.
Caps lock is cruise control for cool.
SnetteL
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
Belgium473 Posts
October 08 2011 21:14 GMT
#16
On October 09 2011 06:01 JonnyLaw wrote:
"Getting to a division you don't belong." Is utter horse shit.


Maybe he should 3 rax all in each game. I heard it's a pretty cheese-proof build.
Caps lock is cruise control for cool.
xsquared
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
Canada55 Posts
October 08 2011 23:48 GMT
#17
On October 09 2011 03:59 Edeen wrote:
Ok thanks! :D

my worst match up by far is TvZ.
I have 1248 points atm.

I'm currently talking to a friend on skype who is 'maining' Zerg. So i'll work on it now.

Thanks again! :D

- Edeen.

Edit: Resulted in playing a lot veruses Insane Zerg AI as he is to busy playing some SNES games xD


Holy cow poop. how did you get 1248 points??? :O
go toss :)
funtimeplayer
Profile Joined April 2009
United States15 Posts
October 08 2011 23:58 GMT
#18
As a terran, I found watching Trump's stream to be very helpful for learning builds beyond 3-rax. He's a high masters level player and commentates while playing. www.teamliquid.net/video/streams/Trump
Edeen
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United Kingdom18 Posts
October 09 2011 00:00 GMT
#19
On October 09 2011 08:48 xsquared wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 09 2011 03:59 Edeen wrote:
Ok thanks! :D

my worst match up by far is TvZ.
I have 1248 points atm.

I'm currently talking to a friend on skype who is 'maining' Zerg. So i'll work on it now.

Thanks again! :D

- Edeen.

Edit: Resulted in playing a lot veruses Insane Zerg AI as he is to busy playing some SNES games xD


Holy cow poop. how did you get 1248 points??? :O


Just did 3rax a lot - I didn't play for a month so I was basically bottom of Bronze... so a lot of wins gave me the points. The fact that I had 600 bonus pool helped ^_^
Edeen
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United Kingdom18 Posts
October 09 2011 00:01 GMT
#20
On October 09 2011 08:58 funtimeplayer wrote:
As a terran, I found watching Trump's stream to be very helpful for learning builds beyond 3-rax. He's a high masters level player and commentates while playing. www.teamliquid.net/video/streams/Trump


Thanks! I'll check it out :D
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 2h 10m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft: Brood War
Sea 4143
Bisu 1455
firebathero 542
JYJ 498
BeSt 377
actioN 357
Killer 337
Zeus 328
Mini 312
Larva 311
[ Show more ]
Soma 243
Sharp 243
Pusan 199
Leta 182
Aegong 117
910 84
sorry 72
Light 70
EffOrt 63
Dewaltoss 60
Mind 44
ajuk12(nOOB) 41
soO 30
Rush 29
ToSsGirL 24
Bale 22
Noble 18
NotJumperer 15
Mong 13
League of Legends
JimRising 436
C9.Mang0345
Counter-Strike
olofmeister1240
shoxiejesuss636
Super Smash Bros
Westballz13
Other Games
summit1g17606
singsing1540
Happy307
byalli212
XaKoH 180
RotterdaM58
Fuzer 40
Trikslyr26
Organizations
Other Games
BasetradeTV72
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH244
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• iopq 1
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Jankos2210
• Stunt345
Upcoming Events
WardiTV 2025
2h 10m
Classic vs MaxPax
Solar vs Classic
ByuN vs Classic
ByuN vs Solar
Solar vs MaxPax
ByuN vs MaxPax
Big Brain Bouts
7h 10m
RSL Revival
18h 40m
StarCraft2.fi
1d
IPSL
1d 7h
Sziky vs JDConan
OSC
1d 7h
Solar vs Percival
Gerald vs Nicoract
Creator vs ByuN
RSL Revival
1d 18h
Classic vs TBD
herO vs Zoun
WardiTV 2025
2 days
herO vs ShoWTimE
SHIN vs herO
Clem vs herO
SHIN vs Clem
SHIN vs ShoWTimE
Clem vs ShoWTimE
IPSL
2 days
Tarson vs DragOn
Wardi Open
3 days
[ Show More ]
Monday Night Weeklies
3 days
Replay Cast
3 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
4 days
The PondCast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Acropolis #4 - TS3
RSL Revival: Season 3
Kuram Kup

Ongoing

IPSL Winter 2025-26
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 4
YSL S2
BSL Season 21
Slon Tour Season 2
WardiTV 2025
META Madness #9
SL Budapest Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22

Upcoming

BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
Bellum Gens Elite Stara Zagora 2026
HSC XXVIII
Big Gabe Cup #3
RSL Offline Finals
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter Qual
eXTREMESLAND 2025
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.