|
|
|
Nah, I wasn't clear. I knew it'd come bad too.
My mistake.
|
Yeah I mean..
I probably wouldn't have liked or fit into the social aspects of korean school system, or like the professional sphere...pretty similar to Japanese structure I guess.
But at the end of the day, I want a bottle of soju and kimbap or bean curd soup or korean bbq on a picnic blanket under a tree.
And the strongest emotions I've felt are either expressed or thought in my head in korean. If someone close to me speaks English and Korean I feel I can more accurately express myself through Korean..like I am waaaaaay more proficient in English yet I would prefer to use Korean anyway and listen to the other person speaking korean.
If you've read any of mightyatom's stuff he commonly attributes the seemingly arbitrary decisions he makes based off his korean-ness. I just nod my head at that shit because it happens all the time even though I didn't grow up specifically wanting to learn or admiring it.
|
On September 09 2011 15:06 thedeadhaji wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2011 14:56 ilovezil wrote:
I feel that the issue of identity in most asian-americans are somewhat distorted, or even lost. While I understand your views to some degree (I've never lived for a decent period of time in Korea), I don't know if you can say we're able to completely erase our native blood from who we are before American society, both literally of course, and figuratively. Don't get me wrong, I respect your viewpoint as simply an american, but I also think it's a bit...perhaps unhealthy, or detrimental to shun our ethnic roots. I don't know...it's just my thoughts growing up as an asian-american as well. I agree that it would be ridiculous to claim that I have zero Japanese influence in me. In fact, my American patriotism itself is heavily influenced by my most recent impressions and experiences in Japan. From this discussion in this thread, I now think that my aversion to calling myself Japanese American is because I used to call myself this back when I was far more "Japanese" in my mental processes. Now that I am "less" Japanese, and having seen first hand that I do not fit into "Japan" at all, I feel that "Japanese"-American is a misnomer for me.
I understand. Back in high school, I know how radically unhealthy my hatred was toward my roots. I suppose that in your case, you loathed the "hivemind" mindset of groups in general that is established in Japan. In mine, I absolutely hated how elitist and exclusive most koreans around me were as I experienced growing up. Going to virtually korean-only academic programs after school and such, I'd constantly hear how full of themselves my fellow second-generationers were, slandering people of other races and boosting the image of their own. If other ethnicities shopped at our korean-markets, I'd hear how pissed they'd get at how others would dare enter their territory...that kind of behavior.
By now, I've come to realize most of this comes from a combination of useless pride and confusion as to one's ethnic identity as a second generation non-white person living in America. I've since come to simply accept my roots. However, if I were to put a category on myself, I would probably be in the same boat as you - I have no real knowledge of my own culture; I just know that of America's if any. I also find this to be an interesting discussion since I rarely find these type of discussions personally done in detail.
|
thedeadhaji
39489 Posts
On September 09 2011 15:10 Kralic wrote:Nice read, to quote Russel Peters (Comedian). Show nested quote +All my life I've been identifying myself as an Indian man. I'm always like, I'm Indian. What are you? I'm Indian. Where you from? I'm Indian. What do you mean, where am I from? I'm Indian. And then I realised something. I was born and raised in Canada. There's nothing Indian about me! The only thing Indian about me are my parents and my skin tone. That's it! Culturally, I'm not Indian at all. I myself consider myself Canadian, but my roots are from Scotland, England, and the Ukraine, but I know nothing about those cultures other then reading about them(nothing I was raised with). So I just call myself a Canadian.
In my naivete, I would imagine that European heritage wouldn't have as harsh a contrast to American/Canadian culture, and hence such identity crises are less likely to occur (also, European immigration started well over 1 generation ago, while Asian immigration is largely just entering 2nd generation for most people).
I'm making sweeping assumptions of course, but it does make sense that you didn't experience as much internal friction as say, someone with first generation immigrant Chinese parents.
|
infinity21
Canada6683 Posts
On September 09 2011 15:14 thedeadhaji wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2011 15:10 infinity21 wrote:
I think we are on a similar boat.
Value-wise, I may have some Korean beliefs but I'm much more accustomed to Canadian culture. I've always doubted that I would fit in very well in Korea. I'll never know for sure until I work there though! DONT DO IT 
Haha i know I would probably regret it but I think i will go if I get the chance.
|
thedeadhaji
39489 Posts
On September 09 2011 15:18 ilovezil wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2011 15:06 thedeadhaji wrote:On September 09 2011 14:56 ilovezil wrote:
I feel that the issue of identity in most asian-americans are somewhat distorted, or even lost. While I understand your views to some degree (I've never lived for a decent period of time in Korea), I don't know if you can say we're able to completely erase our native blood from who we are before American society, both literally of course, and figuratively. Don't get me wrong, I respect your viewpoint as simply an american, but I also think it's a bit...perhaps unhealthy, or detrimental to shun our ethnic roots. I don't know...it's just my thoughts growing up as an asian-american as well. I agree that it would be ridiculous to claim that I have zero Japanese influence in me. In fact, my American patriotism itself is heavily influenced by my most recent impressions and experiences in Japan. From this discussion in this thread, I now think that my aversion to calling myself Japanese American is because I used to call myself this back when I was far more "Japanese" in my mental processes. Now that I am "less" Japanese, and having seen first hand that I do not fit into "Japan" at all, I feel that "Japanese"-American is a misnomer for me. However, if I were to put a category on myself, I would probably be in the same boat as you - I have no real knowledge of my own culture; I just know that of America's if any. I also find this to be an interesting discussion since I rarely find these type of discussions personally done in detail.
I actually think I had an above average knowledge of Japan/Japanese/Japanese Culture growing up compared to the typical Asian American. The school I went to was meant to prepare kids when they went back to Japan, so it taught all core subjects in Japanese, and didn't just teach Japanese itself. 90% of my private reading was in Japanese.
So I thought I'd be prepared to go to Japan... damn was I wrong. lol
So the flow is this
I think I'm pretty Japanese -> Conundrum of not having lived there -> Okay I'm gonna go there -> Holy Shit I'm way out of place -> If I thought I was pretty Japanese, but had huge issues culturally there, then I'm clearly not Japanese at all b/c I can't agree with how they think at all -> Now that I can look at myself from a more Japanese perspective, I seem pretty damn American...
|
On September 09 2011 15:21 thedeadhaji wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2011 15:10 Kralic wrote:Nice read, to quote Russel Peters (Comedian). All my life I've been identifying myself as an Indian man. I'm always like, I'm Indian. What are you? I'm Indian. Where you from? I'm Indian. What do you mean, where am I from? I'm Indian. And then I realised something. I was born and raised in Canada. There's nothing Indian about me! The only thing Indian about me are my parents and my skin tone. That's it! Culturally, I'm not Indian at all. I myself consider myself Canadian, but my roots are from Scotland, England, and the Ukraine, but I know nothing about those cultures other then reading about them(nothing I was raised with). So I just call myself a Canadian. In my naivete, I would imagine that European heritage wouldn't have as harsh a contrast to American/Canadian culture, and hence such identity crises are less likely to occur (also, European immigration started well over 1 generation ago, while Asian immigration is largely just entering 2nd generation for most people). I'm making sweeping assumptions of course, but it does make sense that you didn't experience as much internal friction as say, someone with first generation immigrant Chinese parents.
It comes down to the Ukrainian side of things. My Mom's side of the family is 100% Ukrainian, All of my Aunts and Uncles married a Ukrainian spouse. My Mom was the x-factor and did not marry a Ukrainian man. All of my cousins on my Mom's side of the family can speak Ukrainian and celebrate every holiday that falls under the Ukrainian Calendar. I for one cannot speak any, and I do not celebrate any of the Ukrainian holidays.
My Dad's side of the family is a 50:50 split between Scottish and English, I guess that is where most of my influence comes from.
I guess it also comes down to how my parents raised me in the long run. It is not quite the same, but I cannot relate at all to my Ukrainian side other then never having a big hangover after a night of drinking(not that there is anything wrong with that).
On September 09 2011 15:26 thedeadhaji wrote:
I think I'm pretty Japanese -> Conundrum of not having lived there -> Okay I'm gonna go there -> Holy Shit I'm way out of place -> If I thought I was pretty Japanese, but had huge issues culturally there, then I'm clearly not Japanese at all b/c I can't agree with how they think at all -> Now that I can look at myself from a more Japanese perspective, I seem pretty damn American...
The Russel Peters quote i did also goes longer and he touches on his first time in India and how he is nothing like their culture.
|
|
|
thedeadhaji
39489 Posts
On September 09 2011 15:26 Kralic wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2011 15:21 thedeadhaji wrote:On September 09 2011 15:10 Kralic wrote:Nice read, to quote Russel Peters (Comedian). All my life I've been identifying myself as an Indian man. I'm always like, I'm Indian. What are you? I'm Indian. Where you from? I'm Indian. What do you mean, where am I from? I'm Indian. And then I realised something. I was born and raised in Canada. There's nothing Indian about me! The only thing Indian about me are my parents and my skin tone. That's it! Culturally, I'm not Indian at all. I myself consider myself Canadian, but my roots are from Scotland, England, and the Ukraine, but I know nothing about those cultures other then reading about them(nothing I was raised with). So I just call myself a Canadian. In my naivete, I would imagine that European heritage wouldn't have as harsh a contrast to American/Canadian culture, and hence such identity crises are less likely to occur (also, European immigration started well over 1 generation ago, while Asian immigration is largely just entering 2nd generation for most people). I'm making sweeping assumptions of course, but it does make sense that you didn't experience as much internal friction as say, someone with first generation immigrant Chinese parents. It comes down to the Ukrainian side of things. My Mom's side of the family is 100% Ukrainian, All of my Aunts and Uncles married a Ukrainian spouse. My Mom was the x-factor and did not marry a Ukrainian man. All of my cousins on my Mom's side of the family can speak Ukrainian and celebrate every holiday that falls under the Ukrainian Calendar. I for one cannot speak any, and I do not celebrate any of the Ukrainian holidays. My Dad's side of the family is a 50:50 split between Scottish and English, I guess that is where most of my influence comes from. I guess it also comes down to how my parents raised me in the long run. It is not quite the same, but I cannot relate at all to my Ukrainian side other then never having a big hangover after a night of drinking(not that there is anything wrong with that).
haha 
Do you think having 4 cultural influences (Canada, England, Scotland, Ukraine) had a diluting effect and didn't sway you in one particular direction over another?
|
|
|
On September 09 2011 15:28 thedeadhaji wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2011 15:26 Kralic wrote:On September 09 2011 15:21 thedeadhaji wrote:On September 09 2011 15:10 Kralic wrote:Nice read, to quote Russel Peters (Comedian). All my life I've been identifying myself as an Indian man. I'm always like, I'm Indian. What are you? I'm Indian. Where you from? I'm Indian. What do you mean, where am I from? I'm Indian. And then I realised something. I was born and raised in Canada. There's nothing Indian about me! The only thing Indian about me are my parents and my skin tone. That's it! Culturally, I'm not Indian at all. I myself consider myself Canadian, but my roots are from Scotland, England, and the Ukraine, but I know nothing about those cultures other then reading about them(nothing I was raised with). So I just call myself a Canadian. In my naivete, I would imagine that European heritage wouldn't have as harsh a contrast to American/Canadian culture, and hence such identity crises are less likely to occur (also, European immigration started well over 1 generation ago, while Asian immigration is largely just entering 2nd generation for most people). I'm making sweeping assumptions of course, but it does make sense that you didn't experience as much internal friction as say, someone with first generation immigrant Chinese parents. It comes down to the Ukrainian side of things. My Mom's side of the family is 100% Ukrainian, All of my Aunts and Uncles married a Ukrainian spouse. My Mom was the x-factor and did not marry a Ukrainian man. All of my cousins on my Mom's side of the family can speak Ukrainian and celebrate every holiday that falls under the Ukrainian Calendar. I for one cannot speak any, and I do not celebrate any of the Ukrainian holidays. My Dad's side of the family is a 50:50 split between Scottish and English, I guess that is where most of my influence comes from. I guess it also comes down to how my parents raised me in the long run. It is not quite the same, but I cannot relate at all to my Ukrainian side other then never having a big hangover after a night of drinking(not that there is anything wrong with that). haha Do you think having 4 cultural influences (Canada, England, Scotland, Ukraine) had a diluting effect and didn't sway you in one particular direction over another?
It could have, but then again the Canadian part of the culture I grew up with was heavily influenced by England. Have to remember there is a huge difference in culture between Western Europe(England and Scotland) and Eastern Europe(Ukraine) so I think the Canadian in me balanced it out lol(It is hard to describe).
|
Yeah, interesting read.
Personally I have a different outlook. I would say 80% of my friends are asian/indian? Why? We are all in the same advanced track courses.
And I have to say that it is intimidating when you are one of the two white national merit semi-finalists, and the other ten are asian. It's hard to identify as anything. In one sense, I'm thoroughly white. But having been through a couple regular classes with the real "average white class of america" I can't say I identify with them.
Nothing life changing though.
|
thedeadhaji
39489 Posts
On September 09 2011 15:33 Froadac wrote:
Yeah, interesting read.
Personally I have a different outlook. I would say 80% of my friends are asian/indian? Why? We are all in the same advanced track courses.
And I have to say that it is intimidating when you are one of the two white national merit semi-finalists, and the other ten are asian. It's hard to identify as anything. In one sense, I'm thoroughly white. But having been through a couple regular classes with the real "average white class of america" I can't say I identify with them.
Nothing life changing though.
Ah I was probably shielded from the "average white class of america" my entire life, because I was at private school from... shit, age 4 through 23 -_____-
|
-_-
Yeah. When people confuse its and it's in senior year, and complain about being "discriminated against" for smoking, doing pot, and drinking prolifically (during lunch lol, open campus), and we are in a top 500 public school, it's painful
Almost went to a super expensive private school, I got in, but my parents decided against it. But that's really all super rich snobby white folk so...
|
I have a really similar background to yours. I too was born speaking Cantonese for the first few years of my life. Both my parents were immigrants who came to the US for college, I was the first person in my family to be born in the US. Raised in a town that was 50/50 white/asian at first and eventually became like 80% asian. Throughout high school (boarding prep school, so it was 80% upper class white people) I was known as the whitewashed asian so I just sorta identified myself as American, even some of my close teachers joked around about it.
Something hit me though psychologically I guess, I've now identified myself as a chinese-american and asian-american. I don't speak any asian languages, just English, I have no accent but a Californian accent. I've never been to Asia. Yet through it all I'm still proud of my culture and my background and heritage.
|
Another point I think should be made.
There aren't a whole lot of people who promote "white pride" per se. There is sure a difference between the two, but I don't really identify with either (white) side of my family. My mother's side is italian. Lower class italian drunks. And to be honest all very caring, but just meh, can't identify. My dad's side has sailors and the such. If you believe the convoluted family tree I"m like 4% asian of some sort, because i"m the great great grandson of a British captain's illegitimate child or something. Whatever. Also grandpa could grow an afro, so I'm probably part african american lol. But who cares at this point.
I just think it's hard for me to identify with either side of my family, or the underlying white culture. I've actually been struggling with it for the past couple months.
|
thedeadhaji
39489 Posts
On September 09 2011 15:42 Zlasher wrote:
I have a really similar background to yours. I too was born speaking Cantonese for the first few years of my life. Both my parents were immigrants who came to the US for college, I was the first person in my family to be born in the US. Raised in a town that was 50/50 white/asian at first and eventually became like 80% asian. Throughout high school (boarding prep school, so it was 80% upper class white people) I was known as the whitewashed asian so I just sorta identified myself as American, even some of my close teachers joked around about it.
Something hit me though psychologically I guess, I've now identified myself as a chinese-american and asian-american. I don't speak any asian languages, just English, I have no accent but a Californian accent. I've never been to Asia. Yet through it all I'm still proud of my culture and my background and heritage.
ummmmm, so I'm going to take a blind guess here.
Did you grow up in Sunnyvale/Cupertino?
It definitely sounds like we have fairly analogous backgrounds.
In order to shatter your pride, you should go work in China! (LOL)
|
thedeadhaji
39489 Posts
On September 09 2011 15:46 Froadac wrote:
Another point I think should be made.
There aren't a whole lot of people who promote "white pride" per se. There is sure a difference between the two, but I don't really identify with either (white) side of my family. My mother's side is italian. Lower class italian drunks. And to be honest all very caring, but just meh, can't identify. My dad's side has sailors and the such. If you believe the convoluted family tree I"m like 4% asian of some sort, because i"m the great great grandson of a British captain's illegitimate child or something. Whatever. Also grandpa could grow an afro, so I'm probably part african american lol. But who cares at this point.
I just think it's hard for me to identify with either side of my family, or the underlying white culture. I've actually been struggling with it for the past couple months.
Time to become huge and have pride in your lower back muscles!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
