• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 15:22
CEST 21:22
KST 04:22
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Code S RO8 Preview: herO, Zoun, Bunny, Classic1Code S RO8 Preview: Rogue, GuMiho, Solar, Maru3BGE Stara Zagora 2025: Info & Preview27Code S RO12 Preview: GuMiho, Bunny, SHIN, ByuN3The Memories We Share - Facing the Final(?) GSL47
Community News
BGE Stara Zagora 2025 - Replay Pack2Weekly Cups (June 2-8): herO doubles down1[BSL20] ProLeague: Bracket Stage & Dates9GSL Ro4 and Finals moved to Sunday June 15th13Weekly Cups (May 27-June 1): ByuN goes back-to-back0
StarCraft 2
General
Code S RO8 Preview: herO, Zoun, Bunny, Classic The SCII GOAT: A statistical Evaluation Jim claims he and Firefly were involved in match-fixing DreamHack Dallas 2025 - Official Replay Pack BGE Stara Zagora 2025 - Replay Pack
Tourneys
[GSL 2025] Code S:Season 2 - RO8 - Group A RSL: Revival, a new crowdfunded tournament series SOOPer7s Showmatches 2025 Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond)
Strategy
[G] Darkgrid Layout Simple Questions Simple Answers [G] PvT Cheese: 13 Gate Proxy Robo
Custom Maps
[UMS] Zillion Zerglings
External Content
Mutation # 477 Slow and Steady Mutation # 476 Charnel House Mutation # 475 Hard Target Mutation # 474 Futile Resistance
Brood War
General
BGH auto balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ BW General Discussion FlaSh Witnesses SCV Pull Off the Impossible vs Shu StarCraft & BroodWar Campaign Speedrun Quest Will foreigners ever be able to challenge Koreans?
Tourneys
[ASL19] Grand Finals [BSL20] GosuLeague RO16 - Tue & Wed 20:00+CET NA Team League 6/8/2025 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues
Strategy
I am doing this better than progamers do. [G] How to get started on ladder as a new Z player
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Path of Exile What do you want from future RTS games? Armies of Exigo - YesYes?
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
LiquidLegends to reintegrate into TL.net
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine US Politics Mega-thread UK Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Vape Nation Thread
Fan Clubs
Maru Fan Club Serral Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Korean Music Discussion [Manga] One Piece
Sports
2024 - 2025 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion NHL Playoffs 2024
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
A Better Routine For Progame…
TrAiDoS
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Heero Yuy & the Tax…
KrillinFromwales
I was completely wrong ab…
jameswatts
Need Your Help/Advice
Glider
Trip to the Zoo
micronesia
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 28690 users

D+ Faggotry - Page 2

Blogs > michael.
Post a Reply
Prev 1 2 All
BrodiaQ
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
United States892 Posts
February 24 2010 23:11 GMT
#21
Thanks guys for all the responses. I guess I'll just keep to my standard builds and scout a little earlier for cheeses.

And these are most definitely not just "weaknesses of my build" when every TvT i get bbsed and proxy gated by every protoss. I played a Zerg three times who went 1 hatch muta twice (easy wins) and 4 pool once (should have been easy win but my marine died cause a scv decided to block him at the last possible second from entering the bunker-due to me being terrible )
"So come right up and let me squash your creativity with my iron fist of conservative play."--Nony
numLoCK
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
Canada1416 Posts
February 24 2010 23:14 GMT
#22
Ya, the iccup points system makes it much more preferable to play a whole bunch of really quick games to get points than to try to play standard and end up with 15-25 minute games. So people will either cheese, allin, or use a really aggressive build in hope that they can pull off a quick win. Things like 2 fact, BBS, 2 or 3 hatch hydra, 9 pool speed, proxy gates, dt rushes, etc. Not always cheese, but rarely the super standard macro builds.
Its the reason I don't ladder much, cause I don't really play to get better as much as I play because its fun, and I get much more satisfaction winning a 20 minute management game than stopping some kids cheese.
niteReloaded
Profile Blog Joined February 2007
Croatia5281 Posts
February 24 2010 23:18 GMT
#23
On February 25 2010 07:56 dekuschrub wrote:
C- cheeses like a mother fucker

you get all these protoss that are terrible and only know how to cheese its quite amusing

but then i lose to it anyway cuz im bad

lol +1
leejas
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
United States440 Posts
February 24 2010 23:35 GMT
#24
1) Iccup awards mass games more so than actual skill in a way. A four-minute game won is as much as a one hour game, while if I play on a MotW, win once out of three times against people better than or equal to my rank, I still come out with a point gain.

2) It isn't a bad idea to play out these builds! I myself had trouble against Terran BBS, so for a few games I tried it and understood some key steps to block it. (if you think about it, practicing "cheese" in 6minute games means about 4-6 games an hour, versus time consuming standard games where it'll be 2-4 and far more taxing on your endurance.
ninazerg
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States7291 Posts
February 24 2010 23:35 GMT
#25
Counter the cheese with whine.
"If two pregnant women get into a fist fight, it's like a mecha-battle between two unborn babies." - Fyodor Dostoevsky
GreEny K
Profile Joined February 2008
Germany7312 Posts
February 24 2010 23:54 GMT
#26
On February 25 2010 07:26 Cr4zyH0r5e wrote:
D+ ICCUP Scenarios

A. 300 APM Korean who will rape you in a standard game
B. People who WILL cheese you

In all honesty though as much as it sucks you just have to learn how to deal with it... consider that at D+ people will have somewhat decent micro... and shitty macro so they'll try to win in 7 min. or less... It's just a phase of the game you'll learn and when you are able to defend that you move to C- and proceed to keep getting raped by standard play because your macro sucks


Lol, coming from someone who is peruvian I'm assuming you fall into the B range?

Op, depending on how all in his cheese is either continue to play standard and outplay him or counter with cheese play yourself. If he does 2 gate proxy either get 1 gate goon with 2 lots and a battery or counter with your own 2 gates.
Why would you ever choose failure, when success is an option.
BrodiaQ
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
United States892 Posts
February 24 2010 23:56 GMT
#27
I'm terran, so no shield batteries or goons for me
"So come right up and let me squash your creativity with my iron fist of conservative play."--Nony
GreEny K
Profile Joined February 2008
Germany7312 Posts
February 24 2010 23:57 GMT
#28
On February 25 2010 08:14 numLoCK wrote:
Ya, the iccup points system makes it much more preferable to play a whole bunch of really quick games to get points than to try to play standard and end up with 15-25 minute games. So people will either cheese, allin, or use a really aggressive build in hope that they can pull off a quick win. Things like 2 fact, BBS, 2 or 3 hatch hydra, 9 pool speed, proxy gates, dt rushes, etc. Not always cheese, but rarely the super standard macro builds.
Its the reason I don't ladder much, cause I don't really play to get better as much as I play because its fun, and I get much more satisfaction winning a 20 minute management game than stopping some kids cheese.


But cheese wont help you get better and any rank you achieve with it is kind of a fake rank. Playing standard will make you a better player mehanically. Also the longer your games are the more experience you will have in certain situations.
Why would you ever choose failure, when success is an option.
GreEny K
Profile Joined February 2008
Germany7312 Posts
February 24 2010 23:58 GMT
#29
On February 25 2010 08:56 michael. wrote:
I'm terran, so no shield batteries or goons for me


bunker with 4 scvs repairing will stop anything
Why would you ever choose failure, when success is an option.
huameng
Profile Blog Joined April 2007
United States1133 Posts
February 25 2010 00:10 GMT
#30
On February 25 2010 08:58 GreEny K wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 25 2010 08:56 michael. wrote:
I'm terran, so no shield batteries or goons for me


bunker with 4 scvs repairing will stop anything


except nony.

Anyway, you will be able to defend lots of cheeses if you are good with your SCVs. If you're having problems with ling allins tvz or 4gate allins tvp, just hotkey your natural SCVs and put them in front of your rines/tanks as soon as you see shit start to move toward you. If the cheese comes earlier than that, make sure your building placement gives your first rine a nice spot to hide vs zeals or a nice path to the minline/bunker vs lings

Also use your supply depots well, at worst they are an annoyance to micro around for your opponent and at best it'll totally ruin their day.

But most importantly, your opening should be nearly perfect. Much easier to cheese a terran who has 2 tanks when he should have 3 or 6 rines when he should have 10. Even Flash loses to BBS tvt so don't worry about that so much >_>
skating
ghostWriter
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
United States3302 Posts
February 25 2010 00:40 GMT
#31
On February 25 2010 07:50 kaisr wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 25 2010 07:26 Cr4zyH0r5e wrote:
D+ ICCUP Scenarios

A. 300 APM Korean who will rape you in a standard game
B. People who WILL cheese you

In all honesty though as much as it sucks you just have to learn how to deal with it... consider that at D+ people will have somewhat decent micro... and shitty macro so they'll try to win in 7 min. or less... It's just a phase of the game you'll learn and when you are able to defend that you move to C- and proceed to keep getting raped by standard play because your macro sucks


this is funny considering ur from peru


if only he talked about lag too haha
Sullifam
duckett
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
United States589 Posts
February 25 2010 00:56 GMT
#32
smurf more to get your game in line

and btw, all the practice should get you really good at dealing with proxy gates, bbs, 4pool etc. a lot of it is just micro and scouting the right places at the right times for instance, you need to scout your main at 10 or so tvp on desti or hbr. then you get a bit better and realize you suck =( at dealing with players who arent terrible cheesers. practicepracticepractice
funky squaredance funky squaredance funky squaredance
Sadistx
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
Zimbabwe5568 Posts
February 25 2010 01:03 GMT
#33
Anecdotal evidence blog is anecdotal.
faction123
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
Australia949 Posts
February 25 2010 01:20 GMT
#34
I'm d+ and I cheese 9/10 games, while being cheesed myself in at least half of them (luckily hiding pylons wins me most of those games) When every 2nd PvP you play you meet another players probe in the middle of the map 30 seconds into the game, things are pretty interesting.

It's fun man, try it yourself.
NA Legend - stream: http://twitch.tv/faction60
Mortality
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
United States4790 Posts
February 25 2010 03:44 GMT
#35
I have two thoughts.

1. There could be a bad luck factor. Let's say 10% of all ICCup games are cheese. That doesn't mean "if I play 10 games I will get cheesed once," it means on average you will only be cheesed once. But with a large enough sample size, the probability of a "cheese streak" occuring is actually very high.

2. A lot of inexperienced players tend to think there are things that are cheese that are not cheese. There's a difference between gimmicky play and cheesey play.
Even though this Proleague bullshit has been completely bogus, I really, really, really do not see how Khan can lose this. I swear I will kill myself if they do. - nesix before KHAN lost to eNature
haduken
Profile Blog Joined April 2003
Australia8267 Posts
February 25 2010 11:33 GMT
#36
On MoonGlaive. 70% of korean zergs will 4 pool... it gets really fucking annoying.
Rillanon.au
Nytefish
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
United Kingdom4282 Posts
February 25 2010 11:43 GMT
#37
On February 25 2010 20:33 haduken wrote:
On MoonGlaive. 70% of korean zergs will 4 pool... it gets really fucking annoying.


It's fun for someone like me who plays 1 base builds
No I'm never serious.
Prev 1 2 All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 4h 38m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
mouzHeroMarine 749
IndyStarCraft 247
UpATreeSC 132
BRAT_OK 74
ZombieGrub44
ForJumy 41
MindelVK 23
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 3047
Calm 2866
Rain 1494
Mini 356
Dewaltoss 94
Aegong 39
sSak 27
Movie 4
Dota 2
capcasts91
League of Legends
Dendi1825
Counter-Strike
pashabiceps913
flusha396
byalli198
Heroes of the Storm
Liquid`Hasu497
Khaldor188
Other Games
tarik_tv49488
gofns30423
Grubby2375
FrodaN1419
B2W.Neo565
shahzam395
markeloff137
Trikslyr78
Sick36
Organizations
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream3735
Other Games
BasetradeTV48
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 22 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Adnapsc2 15
• Reevou 2
• musti20045 2
• intothetv
• Kozan
• sooper7s
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• Migwel
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• IndyKCrew
StarCraft: Brood War
• blackmanpl 34
• FirePhoenix3
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• C_a_k_e 3733
• masondota21206
League of Legends
• Nemesis5869
• Jankos2243
• TFBlade1456
Other Games
• imaqtpie1221
• Shiphtur365
Upcoming Events
Online Event
4h 38m
Replay Cast
6h 38m
GSL Code S
14h 8m
herO vs Zoun
Classic vs Bunny
The PondCast
14h 38m
Replay Cast
1d 4h
WardiTV Invitational
1d 15h
OSC
1d 17h
Korean StarCraft League
2 days
SOOP
2 days
sOs vs Percival
CranKy Ducklings
2 days
[ Show More ]
WardiTV Invitational
2 days
Cheesadelphia
2 days
CSO Cup
2 days
GSL Code S
3 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
3 days
Replay Cast
4 days
Wardi Open
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
Replay Cast
5 days
RSL Revival
5 days
Cure vs Percival
ByuN vs Spirit
RSL Revival
6 days
herO vs sOs
Zoun vs Clem
Liquipedia Results

Completed

CSL Season 17: Qualifier 2
BGE Stara Zagora 2025
Heroes 10 EU

Ongoing

JPL Season 2
BSL 2v2 Season 3
BSL Season 20
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 2
NPSL S3
Rose Open S1
CSL 17: 2025 SUMMER
2025 GSL S2
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
PGL Astana 2025
Asian Champions League '25
BLAST Rivals Spring 2025
MESA Nomadic Masters
CCT Season 2 Global Finals
IEM Melbourne 2025
YaLLa Compass Qatar 2025
PGL Bucharest 2025
BLAST Open Spring 2025

Upcoming

Copa Latinoamericana 4
CSLPRO Last Chance 2025
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
K-Championship
SEL Season 2 Championship
Esports World Cup 2025
HSC XXVII
Championship of Russia 2025
Murky Cup #2
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.