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Trade: Poker coaching for Starcraft coaching

Blogs > BrTarolg
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BrTarolg
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
United Kingdom3574 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-02-01 22:02:36
February 01 2010 21:59 GMT
#1
I play a fair amount of poker. I started around last year when i first came into uni, knowing very little but just being smart (crushed a bunch of housegames). Never really knew what i was doing - scored big a few times live just using barebone basics but fundamentally i had a ton of leaks.
Nowadays im much better. By no means a pro, but its a good hobby. I never expect to do this as a job - for a variety of reasons, even if i grinded the 12-30 180 mans which i won't explain.
In terms of online, i made my first 500 playing cash, no bankroll management at all (my "BRM" was 10 buyins hahaha) and swang a ton, decided to cash out and quit after a while. Fundamentals were horrible, i was relying mostly on instinct

I started getting good when i met two kids at the casino, who i am now really good friends with, who basically opened up the world of real poker to me.
One of the most memorable hands i ever played with these guys was when i first met them -
I sat down at a 100NL (pounds) cash table and it was the very first hand for me. I see two very young kids (probably just turned 18), and i pick up AK first hand. One of them raises to 6 UTG, and gets 1 caller. I re-raise to 20, and then it folds to the UTG raiser. He sits there for a bit, and slowly pushes his stack for 110 pounds all in - and im just like "woah ok". The other limper fold, and i think about it and fold also.
The kid then flips his cards up and shows me AQ, and im just sitting there going "wow did you just shove 100BB 4bet with AQ??"

The instant impression i got was that they were terrible players, loose cannons who could barely look past their own cards, bad because they SHOWED their hand, and just all sorts of thoughts going through my mind.
This is the first time i really learned what it meant to get levelled.


A few things transpired, and after i became really good friends with them, and he explained to me his thought process during the hand - he knew that i had AK already, and why it was profitable to shove with AQ there, knowing he is absolutely dominated
So he said, firstly, when i sat down on the table, i was a student, younger than most of the people there, pretty calm, so i must have been an OK player, probably not a complete fish, probably not that good either (true)
When i raised to 20, he said that he put me on AK. This is pretty standard - if i had AA, KK or QQ, i wouldn't have raised so much. It is a very common mistake for newer players to try and extract maximum value out of their big pairs and change their raise sizes with premiums like that to be too small. Whereas with AK, you are happy to take it pre so you raise a big more.
Thirdly, he said it was my very first hand, and i am a student. As a result, this means i would be playing scared money - I got AK, which can very well call there, but nobody likes to stackoff on their first hand!
Fourth he said: "i know exactly whats going on in your mind, you must be thinking, why on earth did he raise so much? You were thinking that you were either flipping or worse, and so thats why i knew you would fold because you didnt want to stackoff to a flip"
Lastly he says, also i did it because it was a perfect spot to do it with AQ. I would usually just fold it there, but i thought if i showed you AQ, it would be much more likely to tilt you because id be showing a dominated hand instead of a flipping hand - this way im setting up a trap for the future because you think im a terrible player

Woah. So for those of you who think preflop poker is easy - think again. I got absolutely levelled by these guys, and in just the very first hand i was being crushed without even knowing it. I bet most people hardly even think about how much game you can put into just the preflop - think about how complicated the game gets postflop!

Nowadays i 15-20 table the 2.20 180's on stars, and you can see my stats here http://www.officialpokerrankings.com/pokerstars/BrTarolg/poker/results/542563F362104692A50FE27DFF26B7B6.html?t=2
Pretty much all of that profit comes from this month only
I am a very strong believer in proper BRM and high volume.
That hand i posted above pretty much opened my eyes up in poker - it makes you realise that tournaments arn't just knowing your shove ranges, theres a very complicated preflop metagame that should be played and a big edge to be had.
My overall profit since i started about a year ago is $5-6k (estimated)

So yea - on top of that, i play SC. I suck, im like D/D+ level. I ALWAYS wanted to get a C ranks, but never could. Mostly because of motivation, i dont have enough SC friends to play with.
Recently i did a deal with a B-ish level SC player that i would teach him poker (cause he really wanted to learn) and that he would teach me SC. In the end, not much really happened, but now we are good friends and it got me back into SC again.

So heres what im looking for - im looking for a starcraft coach, and in return i will be able to coach you in poker.
My main speciality is MTT SNG (45, 90, 180 mans) at the moment, but i have pretty strong fundamentals in cash and big field tournaments also.
What i can offer as a poker coach is that i am not expensive - this will mostly be a deal about making starcraft friends, making poker friends, having people to chat to about similar topics and getting better at both games at the same time!
I also have a VERY strong focus on whats required to be a player who can make MONEY out of poker, as opposed to just win. ATM, i grinded 800~ dollars just this month in MICROS, all within BRM. This is not run good (im 120 below EV ). Most people who want to get into poker, start at the micros, and find it impossible to roll up - this is where i can help. I see it every day, players who are good players, capable of winning at both SNG and cash, yet when they play the micros online they can never break their roll past 300 dollars even playing for months and months on end.
I also have a very level head of where i am at at poker, and what my skill level is. I am NOT a pro player, i simply play recreationally, i have no aspirations to be a pro player, nor am i good enough. People severely underestimate the many, MANY steps that pro's go through to get to a point where they can make MONEY, and not just be winning players.

I don't really know what you will be able to offer as a SC coach, but i would like someone of reasonable skill (B- or better?), and someone who can learn fast, and throw everything they know about poker out of the window, and most importantly, someone who is friendly!

Phew, long post. Well, i don't really know what kind of response ill get out of this. I'm not the best poker player out there, but i'm OK and i have strong fundamentals. Worth a shot to throw this out there!
edit: also you need to be able to use skype/msn and come online regularly. I also live in the UK if tht helps with timezones

Cu(oCo)
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
Italy358 Posts
February 01 2010 22:04 GMT
#2
same nick?
Goons? just vulture toys 휴.휴
Divinek
Profile Blog Joined November 2006
Canada4045 Posts
February 01 2010 22:05 GMT
#3
If C is your only goal it's actually pretty easy to achieve that just by working on your mechanics and learning a few refined builds. If you really have that hard of a time identifying your own mistakes from games you could easily post a rep on the strat forum and plenty of people can point them out.

But an idea like yours would be great for doing what it takes to get beyond the C ranks. Though I guess learning straight from someone good might help you improve a bit faster than just on your own if you're not motivated enough to play on iccup? gl
Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.
Oh goodness me, FOX tv where do you get your sight? Can't you keep track, the puck is black. That's why the ice is white.
Rekrul
Profile Blog Joined November 2002
Korea (South)17174 Posts
February 01 2010 22:08 GMT
#4
uh lol
why so 진지해?
vRoOk
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
United States1024 Posts
February 01 2010 22:10 GMT
#5
*wishes he was B- or better*

iNcontroL might take you up man.. I'd pm him I'm sure you could get a deal with him.
Breaking Bad
iNcontroL *
Profile Blog Joined July 2004
USA29055 Posts
February 01 2010 22:15 GMT
#6
I'm not interested in being coaching in poker but if you want to exchange funds from poker websites (PS included) for time with in coaching sessions I am down
zulu_nation8
Profile Blog Joined May 2005
China26351 Posts
February 01 2010 22:16 GMT
#7
incontrol do you have any discounts for coaching? My PS fund is low
CaucasianAsian
Profile Blog Joined September 2005
Korea (South)11585 Posts
February 01 2010 22:18 GMT
#8
iNControl already stated that he enjoys poker as a gamble, and he's not too serious about it.

I'm a C/C+ player and I'll be happy to teach you a few things here and there about playing. Not really looking for poker coaching, but I'll be happy to become poker 'friends' and sweat eachother and stuff, if you want.
Calendar@ Fish Server: `iOps]..Stark
Soulforged
Profile Blog Joined February 2007
Latvia934 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-02-01 22:21:45
February 01 2010 22:19 GMT
#9
Cool, I'd be willing to do it .

Personally I'm a total noob at poker (played FL for two weeks, played NL for a week, know nothing of proper actions\reactions), so it wouldn't be hard to throw away everything I know about poker. Usually I'm a person who learns quickly, but you never know that for sure with a new field. I'm okay at memorizing stuff and reading people, though. Most of all, I'm fine with putting in a whole bunch of effort, consistantly.

As far as starcraft goes, around 3 seasons ago I was a C+ zerg, currently I am a B- protoss.
I'm a straight-up macro player and do risky/cheese strategies only when I'm focusing on practicing them and use them occasionally in tourney/clanwar BO3's. My mechanics are solid and so is my understanding.

PM me if this sounds like what you're looking for. My aka on iCCup currently is "imba.Soul".


EDIT: As far as learning about poker, I'm most interested in learning "how to learn as fast as possible"
vRoOk
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
United States1024 Posts
February 01 2010 22:19 GMT
#10
On February 02 2010 07:16 zulu_nation8 wrote:
incontrol do you have any discounts for coaching? My PS fund is low


http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?topic_id=109342
Breaking Bad
BrTarolg
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
United Kingdom3574 Posts
February 01 2010 22:21 GMT
#11
On February 02 2010 07:15 {88}iNcontroL wrote:
I'm not interested in being coaching in poker but if you want to exchange funds from poker websites (PS included) for time with in coaching sessions I am down


Ill transfer and then you can play me HU after?
Boundz(DarKo)
Profile Joined March 2009
5311 Posts
February 01 2010 22:30 GMT
#12
I am interested in this. I am a B- zerg (last season) and play in a clan, I really enjoy giving advice and coaching people starcraft theory. I have helped people in my clan as much as I've helped myself to become a decent player. I have been thinking about trying poker seriously but ended up just joining different sites and never really started to learn it propertly. If we can work out something I'd be great, if you're interested PM or msg on skype, I think you've got me there.
LF9
Profile Joined November 2009
United States537 Posts
February 01 2010 22:48 GMT
#13
Who would want to be coached in SC? That makes no sense to me.
inReacH
Profile Blog Joined August 2008
Sweden1612 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-02-01 22:56:30
February 01 2010 22:49 GMT
#14
His all in was fucking god awful for many reasons but the main one is..

If his analysis is spot on and you muck AK he only wins the 20 you bet + previous action but if he's wrong you stack him.

Also what if everything he thinks is 100% right but you were also aware of him possibly using such thought processes and made it the reason for your call?
Elite00fm
Profile Joined January 2008
United States548 Posts
February 01 2010 22:51 GMT
#15
On February 02 2010 07:08 Rekrul wrote:
uh lol

BrTarolg
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
United Kingdom3574 Posts
February 01 2010 23:01 GMT
#16
On February 02 2010 07:49 inReacH wrote:
Also what if everything he thinks is 100% right but you were also aware of him possibly using such thought processes and made it the reason for your call?


First hand i ever played with him, never seen him before. Another reason why he did it, because he is a complete unknown to me.

Saying if he calls then he loses his stack is like tilting yourself into folding because he "might" have the nuts
Jonoman92
Profile Blog Joined September 2006
United States9104 Posts
February 01 2010 23:11 GMT
#17
On February 02 2010 07:08 Rekrul wrote:
uh lol


Rekrul I know you want to be able to beat Artosis. I'll teach you how to play pro PvT if you teach me how to not make millions of $$$ playing poker.

B rank high on iccup! You know you want this deal. Just PM me when you are ready.
Jonoman92
Profile Blog Joined September 2006
United States9104 Posts
February 01 2010 23:14 GMT
#18
Oh wow I misunderstood the OP. I'm pretty bad at poker and B high on iccup. So I'd be glad to exchange sc services for some poker input and advice. I am protoss but my knowledge of Z/T is pretty good though my execution isn't since I concentrate on P.
Jonoman92
Profile Blog Joined September 2006
United States9104 Posts
February 01 2010 23:15 GMT
#19
On February 02 2010 07:48 LF9 wrote:
Who would want to be coached in SC? That makes no sense to me.


Probably someone who wants to improve their sc skills. Duh.
sassy
Profile Joined December 2009
240 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-02-01 23:31:20
February 01 2010 23:30 GMT
#20
how do i find you?

will b- high zerg do? i can help any matchup vs z too
BrTarolg
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
United Kingdom3574 Posts
February 01 2010 23:36 GMT
#21
Ok, ive had quite a few people respond to this so my plan is as follows:

add me on brtarolg@hotmail.com if you are interested. Ill start by helping out everyone (cause im a nice guy!) and hopefully we can all have a ton of playobs games together, as well as chat poker together

Chances are i will probably start with a bunch of concepts which are related to poker but don't have much to do with playing the game itself (BRM, game selection etc)
vRoOk
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
United States1024 Posts
February 01 2010 23:38 GMT
#22
On February 02 2010 08:11 Jonoman92 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 02 2010 07:08 Rekrul wrote:
uh lol


Rekrul I know you want to be able to beat Artosis. I'll teach you how to play pro PvT if you teach me how to not make millions of $$$ playing poker.

B rank high on iccup! You know you want this deal. Just PM me when you are ready.



lllllolllll

thats legit REk, id hit him up
Breaking Bad
BrTarolg
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
United Kingdom3574 Posts
February 02 2010 17:58 GMT
#23
Just shipped 200 dollars ggggggg

Btw yeah, everyone who wants to chat poker/SC (ill help out everyone i can in whatever way i can - if i were any better at poker id have to charge but because im C- skill level its free )

I think it would be best if we can get many people together, chat hands, rail deep tournies (v good way of learning is railing each other deep) and learn SC!
Also for those who are interested - try and brush up on your maths a bit. I think it is very important you are all able to calculate your EV, pot odds, equity etc.
sebu
Profile Blog Joined November 2006
United States37 Posts
February 05 2010 03:37 GMT
#24
I've never played poker in my life and I want to learn.
CoOl]1st[
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
United States243 Posts
February 06 2010 01:03 GMT
#25
wow everyone is B-!
Wizard]1st[ fighting :O
HeavOnEarth
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
United States7087 Posts
February 06 2010 05:50 GMT
#26
whats ur ID on iccup?
"come korea next time... FXO house... 10 korean, 10 korean"
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