EPTAnd now I think I'll step out of this thread since I don't have the time to devote to some sort of mass argument that inevitably happens...
[SC2B] Drone and the Art of Defence - Page 5
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Mystlord
United States10264 Posts
And now I think I'll step out of this thread since I don't have the time to devote to some sort of mass argument that inevitably happens... | ||
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Tdelamay
Canada548 Posts
One of these essential aspects is that there has to be a decent amount of viable strategies to avoid staleness and award creativity, and just as important as viable strategies is that there are enough potential reconnaissance options to allow a player to counter the myriad of possible strategies. Forcing players to guess, and most likely to guess incorrectly, leads to players blindly countering each other in ways that make for a thoroughly unentertaining game. I concur with you. Great conclusion. Starcraft 2 needs to promote creativity while also allowing players to react to said creative strategy. WhiteRa and TLO match were perfect exemple. I hope this sort of play becomes standard. In the long run though, there's still two expansion to come, and the game won't really be finished till then. New units will probably change everything. An expansion also allows blizzard to add new strategies and improve other things. | ||
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CursOr
United States6335 Posts
man, this is a lot to think about. Really well written article, that more than anything gives me insight as to how hard balancing a game like this really is. Thank you very much. | ||
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jodogohoo
Canada2533 Posts
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LaughingTulkas
United States1107 Posts
On March 30 2010 09:18 beetlelisk wrote: OK. I've always understood metagame as overall builds, strategies and units you make more (or at all like Corsairs) in a mu. You are close. Meta literally means "beyond." So the metagame is the game "beyond" the game, which means the predictions and guesses about what your opponent is going to do. It relates to build orders because the players are trying to guess what their opponent is likely to do based on past experience, what other players of that race do on that map, the opponenets personality, and other information that exists outside of the particular game they are playing. So yes, the builds have something to do with it, but doing a build in a particular build is just a strategy. Trying to guess what build the opponent will do based on outside information is the metagame. So what you want is more diverse possible strategies, which allow for a more rich metagame. | ||
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FragKrag
United States11539 Posts
I barely played any SC2 and I feel like that defense seems a bit weak  . However, I do like that terran bunkers are more useful with the new marauder! | ||
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Iri
150 Posts
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Phlatline
Croatia176 Posts
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29 fps
United States5719 Posts
just wondering, why cant you use overlords in zvz? edit: oh overlords dont have the sight. its overseers that do. | ||
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omninmo
2349 Posts
its just that stargate builds haven't been "standardized" yet. | ||
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jackofclubs81
United States196 Posts
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vvSiegvv
United States364 Posts
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MutaDoom
Canada1163 Posts
On March 29 2010 22:23 Hot_Bid wrote: Nice article! Agree on a lot of points, especially ZvZ, that mu single handedly makes me not like playing Zerg. I also think static D needs to be buffed and high ground needs to be changed. I agree 100%. I'm a Zerg player, yet I hate ZvZ. It used to be my favorite matchup, too. | ||
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MutaDoom
Canada1163 Posts
On March 31 2010 01:12 jackofclubs81 wrote: give 25% high ground miss and the depots + 500 hp I am going to assume you meant 500hp, rather than the current +500(I believe making it 850?). We want to adjust defensive capabilities, not make depot walls invincible. | ||
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Kyuukyuu
Canada6263 Posts
On March 30 2010 16:35 29 fps wrote: great article. just wondering, why cant you use overlords in zvz? edit: oh overlords dont have the sight. its overseers that do. What? It's because a Queen can kill it | ||
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zomgzergrush
United States923 Posts
On March 30 2010 09:18 beetlelisk wrote: OK. I've always understood metagame as overall builds, strategies and units you make more (or at all like Corsairs) in a mu. Article says Instead of damage reduction, units on a higher ground (or ramps) can't be shot at all if there is no spotter around and they aren't standing too close to the edges. I'm not sure about those on ramps, I think I read they are flashing when they shoot but without a vision nothing can shoot back? This makes it harder to abuse for units with lower range and nearly impossible if there is anything to give a vision on the higher ground. My point is does it matter as much as in BW with all these new units giving new possibilities, with more stress on micro than macro? Aren't openings and unit mixes more important now? I'm asking that partly because to be honest, I'm not going to miss games where not much but threats happens for longer periods of time. I like fast paced games and I don't mean just rushes and all ins by that. Making "proper" counters (for example adding Banelings) to deflect attacks instead of relying on higher ground or few Sunkens is something I'm going to like more and I don't mean not making any defenses at all. Maybe there is just no need as big as in BW. I hope it makes sense this time. Have you read the earlier news post almost exclusively dedicated to the high ground topic at all? http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=116142 On March 31 2010 03:32 MutaDoom wrote: I agree 100%. I'm a Zerg player, yet I hate ZvZ. It used to be my favorite matchup, too. I think I'm like the only person in the world who enjoys zvz now...I honestly though BW zvz was incredibly boring. Maybe it's just the novelty of sc2 that's got me. I don't at all feel like it's all about roaches, I think it's very interesting how the timing of all the ups is now much more important, burrow micro, nydus hit/run backstabs, muta/hydra transitions, no 24/7 overlord spotter all early game, etc. Or maybe it's just because sc2 zvz is the only place I can beat players better than myself lol | ||
riptide
5673 Posts
o Missile Turret + The damage has been changed from 7+7 armored to 12. o Photon Cannon + Life and Shield values have been increased from 125/125 to 150/150. o Spine Crawler + Damage has been increased from 20+10 armored to 25+5 armored. + Attack period decreased from 2.2 to 1.6. o Spore Crawler + The cost has been decreased from 100 to 75. All of the above obviously make static defence more viable. Nice to see Blizzard listening to the community! | ||
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Sfydjklm
United States9218 Posts
 well put. | ||
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bendez
Canada283 Posts
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pachi
Melbourne5338 Posts
On March 31 2010 07:36 bendez wrote: People needs to stop saying that scanning COSTS minerals. By your logic, when I spend my spawn larva on units, I'm losing minerals since I could have used those larva for drones. When I chrono boost a building, I'm losing minerals since I could have used it on nexus. Scan gives you an instant scout on a huge radius, as well as revealing stealth units. You really need to stop bitching about scan. Other than that, good read. MULEs are pure minerals because they are not subject to worker saturation and thus are still worth minerals later in the game. While not building Probes/Drones is obviously costing some potential income, they don't have a quantifiable benefit and the benefit of extra mining workers is negligible (possibly even negative effect) after hitting 2+ workers per patch. | ||
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